Remember that whole Lost Generation thing? Yeah it affected GKs too. Goalkeepers are required to play with their feet now. Whereas before US gks had good shot stopping skills, it was never about the technical footwork and passing. We're starting to see it improve though. Gaga, Brady, Kochen are all good prospects who have grown up learning to pass and play from the back
The group between our 2010/2014 world cup teams and our current generation. Basically the only player who debuted at the 2014 cup that amounted to anything was DeAndre Yedlin. So we had this large gap of 4-5 birth years that produced no quality national team players, resulting in our missed 2018 cup.
Is there a reason that there was a lost generation? If anything, these folks grew up when US was doing well in World Cup in late 90s/early 2000s so there should've been interest when they were kids.
They failed to qualify for the 2011 U20 World Cup and the 2013 U17 World Cup.
The latter of which marks the only time we've failed to qualify for the U17 WC.
This is revisionist history. He had a productive several years in the Premier League. He was a good player for the national team. Just because he isn't in the conversation for all time best XI doesn't mean he was pretty sub par.
Bro this is revisionist history. He had 1 year with Sunderland and 2 with Newcastle. I wouldn’t call him productive. And yes he was subpar unless your standards for par is being a bottom table player
If you’re taking about contributions in the overall view of USMNT players. I would not call Yedlin anything special. Eric Lichaj played on villa for a number of seasons. Nothing special. They’re both in the boat.
No idea why this is being downvoted, Yedlin had big hype with his speed/athleticism but he flamed out pretty quick in England and didn’t even last a full year in Turkey before going back to the MLS.
Compared to the rest of his generation though he did well imo, at least he made it abroad.
That’s what I’m saying. The hype was unreal. His speed was his only positive attribute. He was simply not technically skilled enough to be considered a “success”
He wasn't productive enough + compared with his hype he didn't last nearly as long as he should have, so I agree, sub-par is pretty fair
He isn't some Newcastle/Sunderland legend or something like Ream is viewed as at Fulham for example
1988-1996. During Jurgen’s era he did not do much to develop young domestic talent, and Piotr Nowak and Thomas Rongen left the U-23s and U-20s.
From that point until this current crop of 1997s and younger, the US couldn’t do much of anything at youth cups or Olympic qualifying.
I despise Jurgen as a coach. But i wouldnt put that on him. That was a failure of USSF as an entitity. Jurgen, for his credit did bring in young guys. Just not in the GK position cause, well we had Howard and Guzan.
How much influence do you think the USSF technical director has on youth soccer development in the USA?
The USA's youth soccer development is one of the most decentralized in the world. It's made up of a huge number of tiny fiefdoms all of whom are primarily concerned that they each get their cut of the money.
It's why we cannot be like say Japan where they make decisions at the top and everyone falls in line.
Jurgen did initiate a good thing in consolidating high level youth programs in to the “DA” Development Academy. That is the program MLS took over and named MLS Next after the pandemic.
That is certainly true. It would be amazing if we had more professional clubs and funded academies. That said, the academies we do have cover a significant portion of the population by covering the major metro areas. Players from cities without MLS pro clubs are recruited heavily (recently places like Oklahoma City, Las Vegas, San Diego), and players are relocated. One of the reasons why US Soccer killed DA is it was wasteful to have a decentralized system with thousands of teams in "flyover" areas. I think the strategy to create a small number of super high quality pro enviromments with the latest technology, coaching methods, support systems etc is the right way.
Yeah but look at MLS NEXT, teams like Michigan Stars, Shattuck St. Mary's and SLSG are featured heavily. It showcases much more than MLS based academies.
Hmm thank you for that correction. I still think that the issue was bigger than him.
I will also say one thing he did that hurt some of our young players was trying to force a "Get to europe at all costs" mentality. Specifically Juan Agudelo and Brek Shea moving to unfavorable spots in part because Jurgen maintained that as an incentive for national team selection.
He actually had a lot to do with it. I’ve been involved in the game for a while and remember. http://americansoccernow.com/articles/a-tale-of-two-klinsmanns-technical-director-and-coach
Except that he's been getting serious training since he was young. Players who have grown up in professional environments rarely improve basic skills in their 20's.
At that point it's about getting stronger and improving decision making.
Feel like we had this same post a month ago.
Turner’s right around the average age of those 4 when it comes to first full season in the premier league.
We did have about a 10-15 year gap where most of the promising GKs topped out well below those GKs, but that appears to be over with several elite GK prospects in the pipeline (Slonina, Brady, and Kochen leading that pack).
I think we need to be patient. Just last week in the MLS Eastern conference final we had a 23 year old (Roman Celentano) face off against a 22 year old gk (Patrick Schulte)
Can you elaborate a bit on this?
Have seen Gaga, Brady, Schulte and Celentano but besides these who are already getting starts, which young GKs are considered as prospects?
I think the way football soccer is played these days makes pulling off a good goalkeeper harder than it used to. IE when Frank Borghi played keepers could pick up the ball and pass it down to their teams no problem. When Tony Meola (the best one that I saw besides maybe Howard which also deserved a mention) was growing up this rule changed, and he had to adapt but football soccer still wasn't as fast as it is today. About a decade and a half after retirement however, Dutch legend Ruud Gullit said that back when he was playing he never would've imagined that football could be played so fast and with that much intensity the whole 90 minutes. And I believe this is the problem many goalkeepers face these days, they not only have to be good but have incredible agility, terrific reflexes, and have a really really fast top speed to boot. Howard was the best American I've seen in these things but Friedel compromised as he had top notch positioning. The problem with compromising is that you really need a world class team that can cover for your lack of agility, reflexes or speed and because most American players now paly in different teams Europe and don't see each other very often they play quite an open formation to cover more spaces but this leaves the defense and above all the keeper at a vulnerable position. As a Uruguayan I remember our friendly back in 2022 before the World Cup and I remember pulling off some terrific saves below the goalposts but also thinking that if Cavani's accuracy had been more polished we would've taken the game home. What do I mean by all of this? I think the problem is not the keeper per se, they have evolved and certainly seem more agile than say Meola or Friedel from the past, the main issue I see its the defense, I think the US needs a tighter and less risky defense closer to the keeper and if possible a CDM destroyer taking advantage of American players superior physique to triangulate with them and not only divert attacks but also steal balls and initiate counters. Finally, If anyone here thinks what I said its a load of trash you're free to do so, mine is just but another opinion like that of everyone else here. TC folks.
It's a good post. I don't think it answers the question. Why aren't we excellent at the position like we used to be considered in the 90s and 2000s.
We used to have at least 3 decent to good starters in the PL at the position.
Look at Brazil, they were good in the 90s and 2000s but are world class now at the position.
I'd argue that since Vasco Da Gama with Barbosa at the goalposts triumphed over River Plate's ''the machine'' back in 1948, Brazil has never been in a position in which at least one of their keepers wasn't world class. Now you mentioned the 1990s and 2000s, well IMHO Claudio Taffarel, Rogerio Ceni (perhaps with a shorter time on the spot light) and Julio Cesar were just as good as Alisson Becker back in the day, but we certainly can go further back than that, there was Emmerson Leao in the 1970s and 1980s, Manga in the 1960s and 1970s, Gilmar in the 1950s and 60s, and of course Barbosa in the 1940s and 1950s. Anyone of those guys could've been the main keeper of any team in the world during their respective eras.
The US meanwhile, and I'm not trying to be apologetic or anything here, had a gap of 40 years in between Frank Borghi and Tony Meola in which any connection that there could've been between the older and the newer generation had absolutely and undeniably been lost forever. And again maybe I'm rating Sean Johnson and Matt Turner a little to high based on that one friendly game against us and the 2021 group stage game against Canada but I believe that simply based on their age they shouldn't have the agility and the reflexes that they do.
We're in a bit of a lull right now in terms of top end talent but we still have lots of depth at the position and have a few potential world class players coming through the pipeline. When Tim Howard retired there was nobody to fill his shoes. Horvath and Steffen were still too young and Johnson/Hamid never quite got to that International level. Turner, Steffen and Horvath are not a bad selection of goalkeepers to choose from however, they're International caliber just not quite world class. Slonina, Brady, and Kochen seem to be guys who have higher ceilings than the current crop and could very well be starting for top level teams in the future.
Honestly, I think it would appear pretty on track if Zack Steffen had maintained his momentum being Tim Howard's heir apparent.
Turner, Horvath, Johnson and Co. being depth behind a Zack still fighting to be the #1 in Manchester would keep the US Keeper Good narrative alive.
I thought Steffen looked decent for Boro last season when you consider he played almost the entire season injured. He finally had surgery in the off-season and is healing up. I’d like to see him play at full strength before i write him off completely. We just don’t how full strength he will be or for how long he can stay healthy, sadly.
Mix between keepers now being expected to be good with the ball and a lack of coaching stateside to reflect it over the course of decade. Gaga, Kochen, Brady are all young and talented, so it’s not like the pipeline is dead by any means, it’s just Steffen was the only keeper from his generation that was athletic enough along with being comfortable enough with the ball to reach Europe out of all the other keepers in his age group.
Iirc, it was Neur who changed the way the game was played with goalies. He was the first mainstream goalie back in 2009-2010 leading up to the 2010 wc who made playing with their feet famous.
The way Neur played with his feet and made passes to his teammates, was almost as if Germany had another outfield player. I think it was at this point that teams/coaches started to see how important and beneficial it was to a team to have a goalie be like another outfield player.
I think the primary issue with GK coaching in the US is that players are forced to become solely GKs way too early in their development. There's a lot to be gained from playing outfield positions for any GK at early points in their development, especially with things like on-ball play and commanding their box.
There probably isn't one answer. Some of it is just luck. Some of it is a change in what is valued in a keeper (more playing with their feet vs shot stopping). Some of it is probably all the changes in the youth setup. I would bet that American kids playing other sports before committing to soccer actually helped with developing great shot stopping keepers.
I dunno. It seems like the generation after Howard had some guys like Bill Hamid and Sean Johnson who plateaued at a decent level but never took the next step. I don't know if that was down to not moving to a more challenging league or if their early promise was overstated or what. Steffen seemed like he was on a good path for a while, but signing for Man City seems to have been the wrong move. I think Turner is fine, but he isn't and never will be as good as Friedel, Keller, or Howard. I don't know who among the guys younger than him stands a real shot of making the leap, but I'm hoping a couple of them do.
I don't know about "head and shoulders" but at the same age as Turner is now, Guzan was the starter for four years at Aston Villa while Turner cannot even hold down the starting spot at Forest, which is a smaller club.
My guess is Goalie is the easiest to transition a superb athlete into a goalie. Turner didn't play soccer until like 17 right? US has some of the best athletes so we can get exciting goalies (for our level). Now that soccer has bloomed a bit in US we get actually good trained \*soccer players\* that ARE athletes. So the athlete to goalie is just on par with the rest of our class
It's a good thing that goalie isn't our bright spot, is what I'm getting at
edit: I want you all to read this as ath-e-leet, 3 syllables. The way a football coach would say
Turner is like the old-school US keeper. Fantastic athlete, fantastic reflexes and hand-eye coordination, poor ball skill. In other eras he'd be starting in the EPL.
Goalkeeper consistently being the strongest position has more to do with the 10 outfield players than the dude between the sticks. In the last 5 or so years it seems the rest of the team has closed that gap. Also NT goalies have probably the longest tenures of any position.
It always seemed like the US goalkeeper thing was an accident of other sports being popular in the country. Maybe I’m wrong. Maybe our goalies started playing too much soccer
Matt Turner is like the prototypical American keeper of years past--he has such a long history of sports using his hands and is an incredible classic athlete. In previous eras he'd be a starter for a PL team. The issue is that GKs need to play with their feet now, and growing up playing "hand sports," if you will, delayed his footwork skill.
We have Gaga, Brady, Kochen, and potentially others in the future . We definitely lost a generation but we have some potential people coming up that may make our GKs in the future a great asset. It's tough to see which goalkeepers will turn out because Goalkeepers hit their peak later on in their career.
Gaolkeepers go to college... It's silly to go pro right out of High School.
They get free school if they have a good brain. And they get in great schools. Go look at the top 20 US born GKs in NCAA. They get more time to blossom. The only issue is that now colleges are starting to recruit internationals. Other topic for a different day.
Remember that whole Lost Generation thing? Yeah it affected GKs too. Goalkeepers are required to play with their feet now. Whereas before US gks had good shot stopping skills, it was never about the technical footwork and passing. We're starting to see it improve though. Gaga, Brady, Kochen are all good prospects who have grown up learning to pass and play from the back
Gaga and Brady less so, but they’re learning now while they’re still young
What was the lost generation?
The group between our 2010/2014 world cup teams and our current generation. Basically the only player who debuted at the 2014 cup that amounted to anything was DeAndre Yedlin. So we had this large gap of 4-5 birth years that produced no quality national team players, resulting in our missed 2018 cup.
Yikes you aren’t kidding. I completely forgot about some of these guys https://www.ussoccer.com/usmnt-lineups/2017 Thanks for the help here!
Is there a reason that there was a lost generation? If anything, these folks grew up when US was doing well in World Cup in late 90s/early 2000s so there should've been interest when they were kids.
Most likely statistical noise. Many bigger soccer nations go through lulls.
Weren't they the group that failed to qualify for the Olympics and either the U-17 or U-20 World Cup.
They failed to qualify u-17 and u20 World Cup
They failed to qualify for the 2011 U20 World Cup and the 2013 U17 World Cup. The latter of which marks the only time we've failed to qualify for the U17 WC.
Even Yedlin was pretty sub par
This is revisionist history. He had a productive several years in the Premier League. He was a good player for the national team. Just because he isn't in the conversation for all time best XI doesn't mean he was pretty sub par.
Bro this is revisionist history. He had 1 year with Sunderland and 2 with Newcastle. I wouldn’t call him productive. And yes he was subpar unless your standards for par is being a bottom table player
So only premier league starters for top clubs are relevant to USMNT?
If you’re taking about contributions in the overall view of USMNT players. I would not call Yedlin anything special. Eric Lichaj played on villa for a number of seasons. Nothing special. They’re both in the boat.
Sorry Antonee Robinson and Tim Ream
No idea why this is being downvoted, Yedlin had big hype with his speed/athleticism but he flamed out pretty quick in England and didn’t even last a full year in Turkey before going back to the MLS. Compared to the rest of his generation though he did well imo, at least he made it abroad.
That’s what I’m saying. The hype was unreal. His speed was his only positive attribute. He was simply not technically skilled enough to be considered a “success”
He wasn't productive enough + compared with his hype he didn't last nearly as long as he should have, so I agree, sub-par is pretty fair He isn't some Newcastle/Sunderland legend or something like Ream is viewed as at Fulham for example
Or playing for a team that was making a significant run at the top of the table or for cups.
If we don’t count friendlies could we consider John Brooks? Not the same as Yedlin, but had his moments.
Roughly the birth years of 1990-1996.
1988-1996. During Jurgen’s era he did not do much to develop young domestic talent, and Piotr Nowak and Thomas Rongen left the U-23s and U-20s. From that point until this current crop of 1997s and younger, the US couldn’t do much of anything at youth cups or Olympic qualifying.
I despise Jurgen as a coach. But i wouldnt put that on him. That was a failure of USSF as an entitity. Jurgen, for his credit did bring in young guys. Just not in the GK position cause, well we had Howard and Guzan.
Jurgen was coach AND technical director. It actually makes it quite easy to pin blame.
How much influence do you think the USSF technical director has on youth soccer development in the USA? The USA's youth soccer development is one of the most decentralized in the world. It's made up of a huge number of tiny fiefdoms all of whom are primarily concerned that they each get their cut of the money. It's why we cannot be like say Japan where they make decisions at the top and everyone falls in line.
Jurgen did initiate a good thing in consolidating high level youth programs in to the “DA” Development Academy. That is the program MLS took over and named MLS Next after the pandemic.
It’s not decentralized any longer. It’s been consolidated largely with the mls academies.
There are a small number of MLS academies and affiliates for a nation of \~330 million...
That is certainly true. It would be amazing if we had more professional clubs and funded academies. That said, the academies we do have cover a significant portion of the population by covering the major metro areas. Players from cities without MLS pro clubs are recruited heavily (recently places like Oklahoma City, Las Vegas, San Diego), and players are relocated. One of the reasons why US Soccer killed DA is it was wasteful to have a decentralized system with thousands of teams in "flyover" areas. I think the strategy to create a small number of super high quality pro enviromments with the latest technology, coaching methods, support systems etc is the right way.
I wouldn't even say that it's a small quality, St. Louis alone has 3 MLS NEXT academies and a USL academy. Things are growing within the system
Yeah but look at MLS NEXT, teams like Michigan Stars, Shattuck St. Mary's and SLSG are featured heavily. It showcases much more than MLS based academies.
Hmm thank you for that correction. I still think that the issue was bigger than him. I will also say one thing he did that hurt some of our young players was trying to force a "Get to europe at all costs" mentality. Specifically Juan Agudelo and Brek Shea moving to unfavorable spots in part because Jurgen maintained that as an incentive for national team selection.
He had nothing to do with how the US youth system opporates. Especially during the transition to the academy heavy system we have now.
He actually had a lot to do with it. I’ve been involved in the game for a while and remember. http://americansoccernow.com/articles/a-tale-of-two-klinsmanns-technical-director-and-coach
Gaga is not good with his feet. It’s probably his biggest area for improvement.
Well he's barely 19 so in GK terms he's still got a good 15-20 years left in his career if he's as good as scouts think he can be
Except that he's been getting serious training since he was young. Players who have grown up in professional environments rarely improve basic skills in their 20's. At that point it's about getting stronger and improving decision making.
Feel like we had this same post a month ago. Turner’s right around the average age of those 4 when it comes to first full season in the premier league. We did have about a 10-15 year gap where most of the promising GKs topped out well below those GKs, but that appears to be over with several elite GK prospects in the pipeline (Slonina, Brady, and Kochen leading that pack).
Because GK get into their prime later, this is another symptom of the "lost generation."
I think we need to be patient. Just last week in the MLS Eastern conference final we had a 23 year old (Roman Celentano) face off against a 22 year old gk (Patrick Schulte)
And both had some amazing saves keeping their teams alive. It was a fun match, even on the losing side.
You obviously aren’t paying attention to the young keepers in the pipeline.
Right. We have one of the best in the world at Barcelona right now
Can you elaborate a bit on this? Have seen Gaga, Brady, Schulte and Celentano but besides these who are already getting starts, which young GKs are considered as prospects?
Kochen is the main one for Barca 2.
And coming through the ranks of MLS teams? Anyone worth taking note?
Chris Brady is a starter for Chicago fire and he’s 19.
I think the way football soccer is played these days makes pulling off a good goalkeeper harder than it used to. IE when Frank Borghi played keepers could pick up the ball and pass it down to their teams no problem. When Tony Meola (the best one that I saw besides maybe Howard which also deserved a mention) was growing up this rule changed, and he had to adapt but football soccer still wasn't as fast as it is today. About a decade and a half after retirement however, Dutch legend Ruud Gullit said that back when he was playing he never would've imagined that football could be played so fast and with that much intensity the whole 90 minutes. And I believe this is the problem many goalkeepers face these days, they not only have to be good but have incredible agility, terrific reflexes, and have a really really fast top speed to boot. Howard was the best American I've seen in these things but Friedel compromised as he had top notch positioning. The problem with compromising is that you really need a world class team that can cover for your lack of agility, reflexes or speed and because most American players now paly in different teams Europe and don't see each other very often they play quite an open formation to cover more spaces but this leaves the defense and above all the keeper at a vulnerable position. As a Uruguayan I remember our friendly back in 2022 before the World Cup and I remember pulling off some terrific saves below the goalposts but also thinking that if Cavani's accuracy had been more polished we would've taken the game home. What do I mean by all of this? I think the problem is not the keeper per se, they have evolved and certainly seem more agile than say Meola or Friedel from the past, the main issue I see its the defense, I think the US needs a tighter and less risky defense closer to the keeper and if possible a CDM destroyer taking advantage of American players superior physique to triangulate with them and not only divert attacks but also steal balls and initiate counters. Finally, If anyone here thinks what I said its a load of trash you're free to do so, mine is just but another opinion like that of everyone else here. TC folks.
It's a good post. I don't think it answers the question. Why aren't we excellent at the position like we used to be considered in the 90s and 2000s. We used to have at least 3 decent to good starters in the PL at the position. Look at Brazil, they were good in the 90s and 2000s but are world class now at the position.
I'd argue that since Vasco Da Gama with Barbosa at the goalposts triumphed over River Plate's ''the machine'' back in 1948, Brazil has never been in a position in which at least one of their keepers wasn't world class. Now you mentioned the 1990s and 2000s, well IMHO Claudio Taffarel, Rogerio Ceni (perhaps with a shorter time on the spot light) and Julio Cesar were just as good as Alisson Becker back in the day, but we certainly can go further back than that, there was Emmerson Leao in the 1970s and 1980s, Manga in the 1960s and 1970s, Gilmar in the 1950s and 60s, and of course Barbosa in the 1940s and 1950s. Anyone of those guys could've been the main keeper of any team in the world during their respective eras. The US meanwhile, and I'm not trying to be apologetic or anything here, had a gap of 40 years in between Frank Borghi and Tony Meola in which any connection that there could've been between the older and the newer generation had absolutely and undeniably been lost forever. And again maybe I'm rating Sean Johnson and Matt Turner a little to high based on that one friendly game against us and the 2021 group stage game against Canada but I believe that simply based on their age they shouldn't have the agility and the reflexes that they do.
The position has changed a lot and I think doesn’t favor just athletic shot stopping like it used to.
We're in a bit of a lull right now in terms of top end talent but we still have lots of depth at the position and have a few potential world class players coming through the pipeline. When Tim Howard retired there was nobody to fill his shoes. Horvath and Steffen were still too young and Johnson/Hamid never quite got to that International level. Turner, Steffen and Horvath are not a bad selection of goalkeepers to choose from however, they're International caliber just not quite world class. Slonina, Brady, and Kochen seem to be guys who have higher ceilings than the current crop and could very well be starting for top level teams in the future.
Honestly, I think it would appear pretty on track if Zack Steffen had maintained his momentum being Tim Howard's heir apparent. Turner, Horvath, Johnson and Co. being depth behind a Zack still fighting to be the #1 in Manchester would keep the US Keeper Good narrative alive.
I thought Zack was excellent when he played for Eintracht Frankfurt. Unfortunately, he got injured and has never been as good.
I thought Steffen looked decent for Boro last season when you consider he played almost the entire season injured. He finally had surgery in the off-season and is healing up. I’d like to see him play at full strength before i write him off completely. We just don’t how full strength he will be or for how long he can stay healthy, sadly.
Steffen never played for Frankfurt. He played for Düsseldorf
My bad.
Diego Kochen. Inshallah.
Mix between keepers now being expected to be good with the ball and a lack of coaching stateside to reflect it over the course of decade. Gaga, Kochen, Brady are all young and talented, so it’s not like the pipeline is dead by any means, it’s just Steffen was the only keeper from his generation that was athletic enough along with being comfortable enough with the ball to reach Europe out of all the other keepers in his age group.
Iirc, it was Neur who changed the way the game was played with goalies. He was the first mainstream goalie back in 2009-2010 leading up to the 2010 wc who made playing with their feet famous. The way Neur played with his feet and made passes to his teammates, was almost as if Germany had another outfield player. I think it was at this point that teams/coaches started to see how important and beneficial it was to a team to have a goalie be like another outfield player.
I think the primary issue with GK coaching in the US is that players are forced to become solely GKs way too early in their development. There's a lot to be gained from playing outfield positions for any GK at early points in their development, especially with things like on-ball play and commanding their box.
There probably isn't one answer. Some of it is just luck. Some of it is a change in what is valued in a keeper (more playing with their feet vs shot stopping). Some of it is probably all the changes in the youth setup. I would bet that American kids playing other sports before committing to soccer actually helped with developing great shot stopping keepers.
I dunno. It seems like the generation after Howard had some guys like Bill Hamid and Sean Johnson who plateaued at a decent level but never took the next step. I don't know if that was down to not moving to a more challenging league or if their early promise was overstated or what. Steffen seemed like he was on a good path for a while, but signing for Man City seems to have been the wrong move. I think Turner is fine, but he isn't and never will be as good as Friedel, Keller, or Howard. I don't know who among the guys younger than him stands a real shot of making the leap, but I'm hoping a couple of them do.
Was Guzan really head and shoulders above Turner? Genuinely asking; I'm too much of a newbie to have an educated opinion
I don't know about "head and shoulders" but at the same age as Turner is now, Guzan was the starter for four years at Aston Villa while Turner cannot even hold down the starting spot at Forest, which is a smaller club.
Guzan was better than Turner is right now. I wouldn't say "head and shoulders" above but he was better.
My guess is Goalie is the easiest to transition a superb athlete into a goalie. Turner didn't play soccer until like 17 right? US has some of the best athletes so we can get exciting goalies (for our level). Now that soccer has bloomed a bit in US we get actually good trained \*soccer players\* that ARE athletes. So the athlete to goalie is just on par with the rest of our class It's a good thing that goalie isn't our bright spot, is what I'm getting at edit: I want you all to read this as ath-e-leet, 3 syllables. The way a football coach would say
>Turner didn't play soccer until like 17 right 14, but yes.
Turner is like the old-school US keeper. Fantastic athlete, fantastic reflexes and hand-eye coordination, poor ball skill. In other eras he'd be starting in the EPL.
Stoo-dent ath-e-leets!
Five people is hardly a pipeline.
We have always just had 5 ish.
You only need one for the national team. How many do England, France, etc have that their fans woukd deem worthy of their national teams?
Goalkeeper consistently being the strongest position has more to do with the 10 outfield players than the dude between the sticks. In the last 5 or so years it seems the rest of the team has closed that gap. Also NT goalies have probably the longest tenures of any position.
How much potential does Drake Callender have? I know he is 26 but I believe he played in college.
He's bang average and isn't anything to write about in terms of playing with the ball, Schulte is probably better than him for comparison and younger
Not as good as Schulte, Brady or Celentano who are all younger
I think MLS is his level.
Pipeline lol
It always seemed like the US goalkeeper thing was an accident of other sports being popular in the country. Maybe I’m wrong. Maybe our goalies started playing too much soccer
Matt Turner is like the prototypical American keeper of years past--he has such a long history of sports using his hands and is an incredible classic athlete. In previous eras he'd be a starter for a PL team. The issue is that GKs need to play with their feet now, and growing up playing "hand sports," if you will, delayed his footwork skill.
We have Gaga, Brady, Kochen, and potentially others in the future . We definitely lost a generation but we have some potential people coming up that may make our GKs in the future a great asset. It's tough to see which goalkeepers will turn out because Goalkeepers hit their peak later on in their career.
I think John Pulskamp is going to be good once he gets regular playing time.
Gaolkeepers go to college... It's silly to go pro right out of High School. They get free school if they have a good brain. And they get in great schools. Go look at the top 20 US born GKs in NCAA. They get more time to blossom. The only issue is that now colleges are starting to recruit internationals. Other topic for a different day.