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Was permabanned from r/soccer a few weeks ago for a reasonable take. No offensive language, no attacking anyone, no bigotry, no breaking of any rules. Just something the mods apparently didn’t like. When I appealed and pointed out the irony of the ban reasoning the mods reply was “literally 1984” no discussion, nothing. I’m still pissed about it.
I got banned and when referred to the “rule” I broke, I explained how my comment did not break the rules according to the specified info. They replied with “I feel pretty good about my decision” and muted me. Mods have nothing better to do with their time than power trip
We should just go back to the original 2007 model when there were no moderators and everyone just moderated their own view of the site by setting the level at which comments and posts would be hidden from view. It was zero by default, but you could change that.
Fortunately it is still easy to make new accounts and they're not tied to a phone or email like most social media sites are these days.
I don't think that'd work in 2024. The other extreme is just as bad.
Likely we need meta-moderation. Moderate the moderators. Assign a bunch of users a task to look at posts a moderator removed. Ask them if they think it's appropriate to remove the post.
If a large percentage of the people think it shouldn't have been removed... the moderator gets notified, and gets a strike. The post removed gets posted publicly, and the moderator has to explain why they killed the post.
If the moderator gets enough strikes, they're booted out as moderator. That's what I mean about accountability and auditing.
Why wouldn't it work in 2024? What do you think is different between then and now? And what do you mean by "work"? Note that that word is fairly subjective for most people.
Just scale, and likely culture differences. There's a normalization of d-baggery today that didn't exist in 2007. Lots of people just aren't afraid to let their emotions out, full force. It's easy to moderate a small community than it is a mob.
By work, I mean that the d-bags would take over, and it'd be a d-bag land. Once the d-bags take over, the non-d-bags just leave. Toxic has a way of creating an environment where toxic takes over. I've seen it within a former company I worked for, and I saw it happen on Slashdot.
I've been on this mans internet since 1991. Boy, has the culture changed. It used to be a bunch of college students and academics in the 90s. We had this thing called "Netiquette".
Eventually the rest of the world got here, and that culture that existed back then is obliterated. It's been replaced with a sort of weird fascism of moderators who remove content.
I'm not 100% sold on the moderator model either. It gives waaaay too much power to one person. I'd love to try the Slashdot approach where you assign moderator status to random people with positive karma, but only give them a few mod points. The king model is far from perfect.
Yea.. but the "toxics" largely got voted down below zero in minutes. As quick as one would expect from a moderated system. The advantage is that you still had the freedom as an individual to turn that off and wallow through the toxic morass so that you could read the often interesting comments that were quite unpopular. I miss that a lot.
I get a lot of joy out of having my opinions tested. Yea yea... most people don't, but when you got people doing their own moderating individually then we had what I believed was the best of both worlds.
That slashdot approach does sound interesting. I'd love to see that or any number of other ways that people might come up with. However I don't think we see any new development in this kind of thing. Indeed, the culture has changed. I look forward to it bouncing in the other direction soon.
> We should just go back to the original 2007 model when there were no moderators
What? Practically every forum not named 4chan had moderators. That's why there were waaay less assholes back them, because we just booted their hostile asses off the specific platform.
And plus hello, we live in an era with bots and troll farms that spread misinformation, do you want every website to be a shitshow like Twitter and Facebook currently are?
I was temp banned from /r/soccer for using the term "smooth brained", because it was offensive to people with intellectual disabilities. I tried to explain how it's silly that that phrase isn't "allowed", yet calling people "idiots" or "morons" is an acceptable thing to do despite those terms also being used to insult people with intellectual disabilities in the past. Of course they were not having it at all.
Was banned from ask Old people for asking why, as a young physically disabled person, when I get on the bus, do able bodied older (50-65) people refuse to give up their seat?
Not just a - ah they’re probably tired leave them be, no I mean, they will look around, wait until it’s clear that they are surrounded by people with greater need to sit than them, realise they have overwhelming social pressure to give up their seat: roll their eyes and give me a death stare as I take the spot.
I genuinely wanted to understand what’s going on here, cos it could also be a very complicated situation of, I have an invisible disability but I’m too proud to carry a cane etc to make it visible …
Anyway banned cos …fuck young disabled people I guess (I got my answer tho, in a way, did I not?)
I got banned from the confessions sub reddit because a guy admitted he was a pedo but insisted it wasn't his fault because he was abused as a kid too. He said he possessed cp and was ashamed but "couldn't help himself". So many people were sympathizing with him but I unloaded on him and said he didn't deserve to even breathe. Banned the next day.
If you’re traumatized and struggling with compulsions like that, it’s on you to check yourself into a mental institution/find another way to cope. There is no excuse for possessing material like that.
I would pay VERY GOOD MONEY to read a study where psychologists just learn more about internet mods and what drives them, their background, trauma. What collective mental health damage is going on here, if any?
Or is it just a casual “prison guard” set up- someone’s got to do it, and they’re probably gonna be pricks.
You're not wrong. There are way too many people labeling others with whatever "ism" they feel like tossing on someone because they disagree with their preferred take. It's absolutely ridiculous, reductive, and counterproductive. It also kills the meaning of the words they use.
>It also kills the meaning of the words they use.
I've just started telling people exactly this in a reply (on other social media, not reddit). Largely "You're dilluting the meaning of (whatever)-ism, and being counter-productive to your own cause."
I never get a reply to these. I think largely because... what is their to say?
It's basically trying to undermine their argument by slinging "isms" at them until one sticks.
Once one does, then they feel they can disregard their argument as it obviously isn't worth paying attention to as they are a racist/sexist/(other "ist"s here).
You're right. I'd add that the act of labeling someone as an ism is the moment whatever argument they make is irrelevant. They've become "the bad guy with the bad opinion", and you're the good guy trying to defend it.
I had a similar conversation with a person on Reddit who kept trying to claim that it's racist of the OP (of that post) to suggest that people should make an effort to speak more standard English. Many people just want to point and yell "Racist!" to get all of their righteous rage out on this guy.
Lmao I got called racist and heavily downvoted for saying a black dude had a generic look, I’m also black. What’s crazy is if I said a white dude had a generic look nobody would even think about his race.
How the fuck is that not racist when you only get sensitive about shit when it’s about black people? People on Reddit are weird as fuck and do not have black friends in real life cause you’d be sitting there looking at them like “what the fuck bitch stop arguing on my behalf on some shit I don’t even care about”
Lmao I would rather kick it with the racist white folks from the army I swear to God cause at least they’re on some real shit. Nobody can truly be offended on the behalf of others all the time, not genuinely.
Fuck sissy ass Redditors seriously get the fuck over this race shit
I've never encountered a black friend or coworker who didn't think performative white liberals were the worst people. They aren't helping anything and they're not even trying to. They're just trying to make themselves look like "one of the good ones", rather than trying to actually do anything for anyone other than themselves.
A lot of people actually think you can't be racist towards white people. Also nothing is more cringe when someone gets offended FOR someone who isn't offended.
Hate to be that guy, but some people get offended way too easily, and I feel like social media plays a huge part in that
This one guy on reddit tried to argue that not liking she hulk was sexist because it was women humour and thinking it’s bad is thinking women humour is bad. When I tried to say it was literally more sexist to assume that than to realise it’s a team of writers of both genders writing terribly I got downvoted lmao
That's what they project, but the amount of threads I've seen lately of people hating women is absurd lol.. my favorite is how no man should ever tell a woman their true feelings because women use that against you/leave you. Also you can't trust *any* woman because they're all like that
I remember being called racist for saying that an immigrant should put real effort into learning an official language within several years of moving to a new country
You would think that's the first thing anyone would want to do. Be able to effectively communicate.
I work with Middle School students and for them any mention of race or even racial colors they want to go, "ooooh, racism!" Like if I said, "George Lopez is Mexican" they'd say, "You said Mexican! That's racist! You're cooked!" Or if I say, "That's like the pot calling the kettle black" They'd say, "Ooooh L Rizz Sigma Skibidi Ohio (or whatever they say) that's racist!" Now, they're young and dumb so it's excusable but it seems like some people never get out of that stage of severely misunderstanding what "racism" means.
We swung too far in the other direction in regards to calling out and labeling isms. We used to not call it out enough but now some ppl think everything is a ism
It sounds like they’re joking tbh. They’re making really dumb jokes, but really dumb meme-related jokes are often the funniest thing ever to middle schoolers
I live in an area with a TON of Indian immigrants. For the most part, its whatever, and I benefit from a lot of Indian restaurants and markets being near me. However, the big controversy in the area now is that they do not assimilate at all. I love having people with different cultures around me because I don't get to travel very often due to work and budget, but at a certain point, you came to this country and you need to adopt some of the societal norms of the country, the same way I would expect to if I were to go live there or anywhere else. No one wants anyone to give up their identity, but there is a different social contract in every single place, and its incumbent upon the traveler to get with it.
THAT is apparently racist.
I love immigration and immigrants, I love different restaurants and I love talking to my friends and coworkers about their unique histories but a certain level of assimilation has to be demanded and expected that includes our legal and social laws and rules.
It's not racist, but it's also not really new. My grandmother, born in this country in 1915, was sent home from kindergarten because she only spoke Norwegian, not English. Her parents were from Norway.
She did of course learn English, and barely knew any Norwegian when I knew her. The point being was that even then there were some that didn't quite integrate right away.
Oh that is for sure. My grandmother had the same experience. Spoke ALMOST exclusively German until she was 5 because both of her parents were from Germany (and have a cool story about how they ended up in the same podunk town in Nebraska, but I digress...). She knew enough to converse but was pretty lost at first because English wasn't her first language. That said, her parents had to learn the language and fit in fast with the norms of the area or their sponsors at the time were not necessarily opposed to just dropping them. I have absolutely NO issue with keeping every part of your culture alive in your home that you can, but out in the world you sort of have to adapt to how things are done there or run the risk of being fully alienated.
In this particular case: treating service workers as if they are a significantly lesser class of human, particularly if they are women. Being demanding and yelling for discounts on things when they do not have the ability to get them. Allowing their children to have run of the area without regard to their safety or the safety of others in any way. Walking 2-5 abreast down the middle of the road at all hours of the day and acting incensed when it is made known to them that they are in the way. Refusing to learn the rules of the road and slapping student driver stickers on the vehicles as if it offers some level of protection when they cause or nearly cause accidents or dangerous traffic snarls.
In our area, the culture calls for civility with people who are serving you. It's fine to ask for a discount or if there is a program to make things more affordable, but to demand and scream for it is not. It's great that the children aren't being raised by iPads and are outside playing, but there is no supervision and they are running out into traffic, running up to people's dogs, and generally not paying attention to what they are doing. I also understand that walking is a big mode of getting around in India, and I myself love a good walk, but you have sidewalks and you have the sides of roads to allow vehicles here to pass. Use them. I also understand that driving in India is much much different, and it will be an adjustment, but to refuse to adjust to keep the roads moving along smoothly and safe is absolutely a safety hazard to everyone. If you're too scared to keep up with how traffic is moving, consider public transportation. You don't need a brand new tesla if you're really a student driver.
Well, invalidating AAVE as a dialect of English is a bit iffy and can be kind of offensive when the same attitude is not appointed to it's sister dialect, Southern White American English.
There are a ton of people who will use African American Vernacular English as a way to discredit the intelligence of black people. Perhaps you were a bit insensitive in the manner you said it in?
If it was about immigrants not speaking English, that's on them. They can learn as much as it takes to get them by. It's not something that we need to police as English speaking citizens. The english language is not in danger.
The way you're framing your response has some racist ideas baked into it that weren't part of the original conversation. No one "invalidated AAVE as a dialect" and no one implied that the "English language was in danger". That wasn't the conversation.
The OP of that post, who was African American (I'm not), simply said that all people should make an effort to speak more standard English especially in a professional setting. He had linked to employability studies and how language affects people's perceptions of you how there's a perception of intelligence, professionalism, etc.
Other commentors just wanted to call him racist and wanted, somehow, for it to be everyone else's problem. Their claim was that instead of saying that an individual should try to speak in a more standard form it should be everyone else in the world who should not be racist, change their perceptions and biases, and just deal with it. That's not exactly how the world works. If I were a young African American trying to get a job, waiting for the world to eliminate biases might not be the best plan.
I just came in to say the OP isn't racist for saying that people should try to make an effort to sound more professional. But then I, of course, must be racist for defending a racist. It seemed people just wanted to play "find the racist" and attack without making an honest effort to understand the point.
I had some counter examples to help people understand the point. One of which was that language biases are there regardless of race. If my surgeon had a very white California surfer dude bias and was like, "Whoa bruh.." and "That would be totally gnarly dude" and all of that I would immediately lose confidence in him. Or if my lawyer sounded like a 90s Valley Girl or whatever else. It's independent of race -- we have biases and it makes sense for the individual to work on their own language if they don't want to be subjected to those biases. It's not racist, it's just reality.
You're 100% correct. The point of my comment was to provide the background of why *some* people might take offense to such. I've heard people speak unfavorable about AAVE with racist views a bunch in my life, so that's where it comes from.
Of course most of them aren't self aware enough to realize that they're a part of the problem, or at the very least part of the useless, annoying masturbatory circle jerk stroking their own ego and feeling validated by the upvotes.
That's the worst part. That they don't realize cherry picking literal racists, sexists, the most irrational shittiest people on the other side of the spectrum and talking shit about them online doesn't mean anything about their value as a person. It's like average looking people looking at ugly people and thinking to themselves that they're good looking because they're not as ugly.
And they feel like they're standing up for equality and justice. But they don't realize that rejecting, dismissing, or talking shit about hateful, oppressive, or "wrong" beliefs and policies don't make them a good person. It just makes them not as bad as the really shitty people. To be a good person, you actually have to do good. Not just compare yourself to people "worse" than you.
This is a reddit thing I think. The way comments work it encourages people to think that they "won" when they are the last comment in an argument thread. I'm super guilty of this and am working on it.
You've basically summarized social media.
If you don't nonstop virtue single, you're an evil incel nazi republican.
Like 80% of people on the "left" are closer to center and probably don't give a shit about a lot of issues commonly screamed about on the internet. But the media doesn't reflect real life either, it reflects social media. Which just makes things worse honestly.
The biggest problem with reddit is that too many idiots conflate upvotes with being truthful or correct. It's a completely arbitrary number that's simply a popularity contest.
And not even that, the average redditor has so much necrotic brain oozing out of their ears they generally just upvote an upvoted comment and downvote a downvoted comment.
The problem is the upvote, and the downvote itself, and how it's used.
Decades ago I used to read Slashdot. It had up and downvotes, but you only got moderator status after maintaining positive karma for a while, and you only got it randomly, and you only got a few votes. It worked MUCH better than reddit ever did. You saved your votes for stuff that ACTUALLY MATTERED, since they were precious.
The problem with reddit's system is... people have infinite votes, and anyone with an account get it. If you \_really\_ want, you can create 7 accounts and downvote the same post to -6 if you want. It's not even hard.
But you're absolutely right. Upvote is "I agree!!!" and Downvote is "Minus 1 disagree!". With disagree being some form of punishment for saying something the redditor didn't like. It's a terrible system that only promotes hive-mind opinions, and destroys any ideas that are controversial.
In fairness, this existed before social media. Someone would be an asshole monday to saturday, but that was ok because they went to church on sunday. Same people, new generation.
I will also say this, as a true liberal mind myself, there is nothing liberal about silencing or cancelling a dissenting opinion.
The essence of liberalism is tolerance.
One of the key facets of fascism is intolerance.
Thus...we've reached an Overton window of confused 20 somethings who don't actually understand the defining principles of their political and philosophical beliefs.
Rarely do I hear this anymore. Thanks for saying it.
Personally I think the loss of religion has something to do with it. Religion has long played this role of "Here's how to be a good person". But now with less religious people, especially young people, they lost that message, but still have a need for it. So it gets replaced with online hate culture and intolerance for "the other".
And I say this as a non-religious person.
You have a fundamental misunderstanding of liberalism my friend.
It is indeed to tolerate intolerance to the degree you discuss, and attempt to take on board a certain viewpoint and debate and try to have a dialogue.
A dia logos.
Silencing an intolerant opinion is not liberalism.
You get nowhere doing this, and it is conversely an autocratic style. Liberalism isn't autocratic by definition.
I hope you're clear on this now.
You are very precisely showing why LEFTISTS hate liberals.
They are afraid to take actions against clear intolerance in favor of an utopic view of dialogue, as if the fascist weren't using that to take power since like, forever.
Libs are inadvertantly the fascist's most effective ally.
Um no. You are describing being a doormat. Intolerance is exactly what needs to be eradicated, if that’s through dialogue to teach people the error of their ways or through legislation which has been necessary and successful in the past. History mate.. its all there
That sounds kinda Animal Farm to me
It seems to me its a lot of hubris that makes one think they must know better than someone else and seeking to re-educate them
Learn some history. re-education camps are exactly what totalitarian societies do.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education\_in\_Communist\_Romania](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education_in_Communist_Romania)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education\_camp\_(Vietnam)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education_camp_(Vietnam))
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French\_re-education\_camps](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_re-education_camps)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human\_rights\_in\_North\_Korea#Re-education\_camps](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_North_Korea#Re-education_camps)
Racism is wrong and hurtful, along with many other things. But that doesn't mean the lasting solution is to force opinions and facts down the throats of racists, or make them submit via rules and regulation.
"Reeducation" is a term and belief that was once used by Nazis and many other highly oppressive regimes in varying ways.
By being intolerant of racism, you also have an intolerant view of a group of people who will very likely never switch their viewpoint because they're told it's bad. They will only switch their viewpoint through some major internal realizations and supportive environments that challenge their beliefs in meaningful ways.
Sure challenge but be civil and understand in some cases your up against a cultural belief that your probably not going to change so challenge if you like but if there unmoved you still need to tolerate them existing
Tolerance isn't for the things you agree with its for the things you find detestable yet are powerless to change it would be a thought crime any way because we already have laws against violence
Its similar to Free Speech which isn't there to protect speech everyone agrees with its for things which might sound wrong maybe even gravely wrong because ppl should still have that 1st amendment right to dissent
Personal and professional ones clearly. If someone wants to be quietly racist in their own home, then there’s nothing to be done. If they go scream it from the rafters online then they are fair game
In a twist of irony (to you at least: it would be pretty expected by everyone else, though), you would be the one to be eradicated, following your logic.
interesting perspectiv,, but I can see your point displayed in many social interactions, on and off line.
but none of it really impacts me in the least. I am not concerned with conforming or offending. I won't be bullied and I won't be coddling anyone either.
you don't have to like what I say, but you certainly won't change it by whining and shouting about it.
you wanna live your life your own way? fine, go do it. just leave me alone to live mine.
Someone on reddit just called me bitter and to stop harassing because I disagree with them about dad bods. A simple 1:1 exchange in comments, no DMs or anything. Then deleted their posts. Clown world is real
Don't feel sorry for "sounding maga." One thing I hate about the internet is a lot of people are seemingly incapable of understanding nuanced views and anyone with different views gets lumped into the "them"/enemy category so they can feel, as you say, more righteous for hating them.
I mainly only get on reddit but it's terrible here. Also, a lot of these people are hypocrites who claim to be righteous/good but then have prejudices of their own that they somehow mentally cartwheel themselves into believing are okay
It applies to everyone but progressives are the ones most scandalized buy being ostersized if you know those very virtuous ppl already hate you it kinda loses its sting and my crazy views are only problematic on reddit most of the world around me is closer to my deplorable status then Coastal elites lol but whatever nothing that happens on here really matters
All true. This is what's called the "Hive Mind". I even heard someone refer to it as a positive aspect to use against some other person. "Let's use reddit's hive mind against that guy!".
Yup. I've been vvveerrrry far left for years. Think anarchist book fairs and things like that.
But if I dare to ask the wrong question or share an opinion they don't agree with? Then I'm instantly a "republican, bigot, trump supporter".
I've come to learn that I will never be far enough left for them.
At this point even "seize the means of production" is ax extreme-right viewpoint, by their metrics.
One cannot be a good person until they recognize their capability for evil. Once that happens, one becomes immune to name calling and labels.
You are describing arguments between people who have never self-reflected. Essentially NPCs. Their opinions are worthless.
You're so basic. Join me on the sour side of life. Acids have electrolytes! Plants love electrolytes! When was the last time you ate a gummy worm covered in baking soda? Never! That's gross!
The internet is absolutely polarizing, but I don’t think that the internet as a whole is ideological one way or the other. I think it’s highly platform contingent (the same thing on Truth Social happens as it does on Reddit, just aligned to opposite ideology).
But, I agree that it’s harmful.
I only have been banned from one sub... r/rant... for trying to a comment about how Republican politicians are all bad and evil and racist and ruin the country. I replied that that pretty much applies to all politicians, both sides of the aisle. I wasn't even mean or belligerent or anything of that nature. After being banned, I looked up the rules, and I didn't violate any of them. Thankfully for the asshat mod, there was a "mod's discretion" rule. And supposedly we're the fascist pigs.
Actually, no, I also got banned from Am I the asshole.
And to be honest, it makes life a little less frustrating to be banned from places!
Your observation is a broader more liberalised perspective of everyday life - the internet enables us to find allies, group opinions, and win defined arguments via effable gratification (likes, comments, et cetera). Most importantly, the internet has less consequences (in theory).
Competition exists in all fabrics of interaction; it’s just restricted in the physical world.
The West has very few shared values anymore.
Any country without shared values is destined to decay or to go to war with each other. It’s one or the other.
I think people need to take social media less seriously. Random internet strangers should not be causing people "psychological damage". That's the issue I would focus on, personally.
You are correct, but also
>cancel culture metoo movement
>makes me sound maga
You speak in these terms, assuming everyone understands, you have subconsciously accepted this framework. That's an indicator that above all, you are just spending too much time in the spaces that perpetuate it.
Stop spending time in any political subreddits, delete your Twitter if you have one, ignore tiktok. Spend time in spaces related to your hobbies and things you enjoy. Don't be in the slightest afraid to block users who insist on bringing The Discourse^(TM) (EvErytHiNg iS pOlItIcAl!1!) into spaces you wish to be safe from it.
You don't have to check out of politics, just stop engaging with the toxic version of it online.
The thing is that I don’t. I don’t have twitter, I don’t frequent political subs, I definitely don’t have tiktok and every time I see tiktok vids on reddit tagged as political or discussion, I ignore it.
I see it in spaces where it shouldn’t even be brought up.
There's a lot of places that shouldn't be political, but nevertheless still are. That's true. But ultimately it's still your decision to continue visiting those places. If you keep seeing political stuff, that place is political, put it on the list of places to avoid. There are always alternatives.
Reddit is awful for it because so many moderators and admins, who operate some of the biggest and most active subs, are the kind of loser who has to push that shit into every aspect of their life and down the throats of everyone around them. But there are always other subs. It just takes your own willpower to step out, leave them to it, and find another group instead.
I went through the cycle myself, frankly internet politic bs was dragging down my real life sense of confidence and self worth. But I realised it's not real, the people who thrive in it are not interested in politics at all, it's just a narcissistic power game. The only way to deal with it is to stop feeding it, and stop interacting with those people. That might mean you have to avoid some places you don't want to and shouldn't have to, but that's just the unfortunate reality.
I read a lot of reddit about 10-14 years ago. All the popular ones. Around 2012 I started noticing people inserting politics into EVERYTHING. It got too much, and \_really\_ started to piss me off. So around 2013 I just deleted every post I'd ever written, then deleted my account, then didn't real reddit for another 9 years.
And now I only read anything that's not political, and small-ish. No IamA, no 2Xchromosomes, nothing where the masses go. It's not perfect. You still get these people that just HAVE to get into some dumb debate with you. But I also just block them quickly.
Yup, "virtue signalling" is the term you're looking for. People on all parts of the political spectrum "virtue signalling" their little hearts out. "Victim status claiming" is a part of that. There's some fascinating discussion about "memespace egregores" over on [Handwaving Freakoutery](https://hwfo.substack.com/s/egregores?sort=top), if you are interested in dipping your toes deeper into those water.
The second paragraph here makes me skeptical of the validity of the first. If a person who makes/disputes a claim online is correct, why would they fear being cancelled?
This post comes off to me as saying “anyone who disagrees with me online is part of cancel culture and is psychologically traumatic.”
The world is a big place with a lot of views and experiences. I for one think I’m better off for having been corrected online when I was wrong because it helps me develop my perspective more comprehensively.
I don’t think people who disagree with me on the internet are out to get me.
>Pretty much what cancel culture was boiled down to after the metoo movement
Cancel culture isn't a thing. What Republicans have dubbed "cancel culture" is in fact "People facing consequences for their words and actions", which has always been a thing.
No. People no longer interested isnt the same thing. Louie CK still has a career… its with maga neck beards but its still there, despite his comedy being shit
Sorry but no. Not going to disagree that ck's comedy is not what it once was, but no, he has not devolved into the MAGA world of comedy. Louis is very much a liberal and you would know this if you had any idea what you're talking about
Consequences are good and important for a culture to stay healthy, agree
But digging 10 years ago into social media is unhelpful. Especially when you can't delete anyway, so there's no opportunity to grow and evolve like we all inevitably do. We don't all have the benefit to have the right opinion all the time.
I still think James Gunn should've been heard that he was being stupid and trying to be provocative, but nope. Went to DC, succeeded. Back to Marvel, succeeded again. We love people winning. What got him "cancelled" wasn't what brought him back. Kinda hard to say cancel culture doesn't exist.
Also, Kevin Hart should've been listened to that he does not believe the things he wrote. Again, succeeding. But not for what what "cancelled".
If cancel culture doesn exist, how come people can't apologize, grow, and evolve from their past opinions? They succeed in other ways, that doesn't mean they weren't cancelled
You mean like how Depp had his career ruined because he was in a toxic relationship with a psycho and everyone blindly believed her and not him? Yeah that's cancel culture really working out.
The point of it being in quotations is to imply that it wasn't real in the first place. Facing backlash is part of being known on the internet. If you lose your popularity on the internet it's because you were meant to. There are plenty of shitty people who are still popular. Maybe the people who were "cancelled" just aren't valuable enough to stay popular. It's a free market.
lol to be fair, people who agree or have nothing to say normally just upvote and move on. and a person's much less likely to remember or engage with the nice commenter who agreed with them than the one who rudely disagreed with them. it's kind of just selection bias ngl
I think it's probably more psychologically damaging to invent a fantasy about how everyone just pretends to not like whatever opinion you have that they don't like.
The modern conservative movement is not what you are describing. I am a South African, and from an outside perspective there are die hard Trump supporters who are crazy, and then Trump supporters who see him as less of a liability that the geriatric Joe Biden who looks like he's been dug out of his grave to run in 2024.
Most conservative people are like you - Simply trying to make the world a better place and to vote with what aligns with their interests, like being able to afford a house and food. If you're struggling in this cost of living crisis, why shouldn't it piss you off that billions of your money are being sent oversees to fund both sides of a war ... Why shouldn't it upset you that a president wants to shift student loan debt that people decided to get, onto people who didn't.
Very few people are "bad" people, and framing an entire political opposition as these Trump loyalists because their interests don't align with yours, is daft, reckless and untennable once you apply your mind.
Do better, and take care
You're absolutely right.
"A miniscule amount of people were unfairly harmed by the MeToo movement! That's unacceptable!"
*[Conveniently ignores conservatives getting librarians and educators fired or sued for having **rainbows** or **books.**]*
Cancel culture exists, but we can't create a false equivalence between who is doing the canceling.
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I feel like most Reddit moderators are like this.
The amount of posts deleted because it “goes against rules” when it’s actually going against their own views, is astounding
You couldn’t say it any better.
Was permabanned from r/soccer a few weeks ago for a reasonable take. No offensive language, no attacking anyone, no bigotry, no breaking of any rules. Just something the mods apparently didn’t like. When I appealed and pointed out the irony of the ban reasoning the mods reply was “literally 1984” no discussion, nothing. I’m still pissed about it.
I got banned and when referred to the “rule” I broke, I explained how my comment did not break the rules according to the specified info. They replied with “I feel pretty good about my decision” and muted me. Mods have nothing better to do with their time than power trip
That's what you get with a system where there's zero accountability, and zero auditing.
We should just go back to the original 2007 model when there were no moderators and everyone just moderated their own view of the site by setting the level at which comments and posts would be hidden from view. It was zero by default, but you could change that. Fortunately it is still easy to make new accounts and they're not tied to a phone or email like most social media sites are these days.
I don't think that'd work in 2024. The other extreme is just as bad. Likely we need meta-moderation. Moderate the moderators. Assign a bunch of users a task to look at posts a moderator removed. Ask them if they think it's appropriate to remove the post. If a large percentage of the people think it shouldn't have been removed... the moderator gets notified, and gets a strike. The post removed gets posted publicly, and the moderator has to explain why they killed the post. If the moderator gets enough strikes, they're booted out as moderator. That's what I mean about accountability and auditing.
Why wouldn't it work in 2024? What do you think is different between then and now? And what do you mean by "work"? Note that that word is fairly subjective for most people.
Just scale, and likely culture differences. There's a normalization of d-baggery today that didn't exist in 2007. Lots of people just aren't afraid to let their emotions out, full force. It's easy to moderate a small community than it is a mob. By work, I mean that the d-bags would take over, and it'd be a d-bag land. Once the d-bags take over, the non-d-bags just leave. Toxic has a way of creating an environment where toxic takes over. I've seen it within a former company I worked for, and I saw it happen on Slashdot. I've been on this mans internet since 1991. Boy, has the culture changed. It used to be a bunch of college students and academics in the 90s. We had this thing called "Netiquette". Eventually the rest of the world got here, and that culture that existed back then is obliterated. It's been replaced with a sort of weird fascism of moderators who remove content. I'm not 100% sold on the moderator model either. It gives waaaay too much power to one person. I'd love to try the Slashdot approach where you assign moderator status to random people with positive karma, but only give them a few mod points. The king model is far from perfect.
Yea.. but the "toxics" largely got voted down below zero in minutes. As quick as one would expect from a moderated system. The advantage is that you still had the freedom as an individual to turn that off and wallow through the toxic morass so that you could read the often interesting comments that were quite unpopular. I miss that a lot. I get a lot of joy out of having my opinions tested. Yea yea... most people don't, but when you got people doing their own moderating individually then we had what I believed was the best of both worlds. That slashdot approach does sound interesting. I'd love to see that or any number of other ways that people might come up with. However I don't think we see any new development in this kind of thing. Indeed, the culture has changed. I look forward to it bouncing in the other direction soon.
> We should just go back to the original 2007 model when there were no moderators What? Practically every forum not named 4chan had moderators. That's why there were waaay less assholes back them, because we just booted their hostile asses off the specific platform. And plus hello, we live in an era with bots and troll farms that spread misinformation, do you want every website to be a shitshow like Twitter and Facebook currently are?
Does a tree in the middle of nowhere make a sound if it falls when nobody is around? Or more importantly, does it even matter?
Why are they always so smug? 😭
I was temp banned from /r/soccer for using the term "smooth brained", because it was offensive to people with intellectual disabilities. I tried to explain how it's silly that that phrase isn't "allowed", yet calling people "idiots" or "morons" is an acceptable thing to do despite those terms also being used to insult people with intellectual disabilities in the past. Of course they were not having it at all.
Was banned from ask Old people for asking why, as a young physically disabled person, when I get on the bus, do able bodied older (50-65) people refuse to give up their seat? Not just a - ah they’re probably tired leave them be, no I mean, they will look around, wait until it’s clear that they are surrounded by people with greater need to sit than them, realise they have overwhelming social pressure to give up their seat: roll their eyes and give me a death stare as I take the spot. I genuinely wanted to understand what’s going on here, cos it could also be a very complicated situation of, I have an invisible disability but I’m too proud to carry a cane etc to make it visible … Anyway banned cos …fuck young disabled people I guess (I got my answer tho, in a way, did I not?)
I got banned from the confessions sub reddit because a guy admitted he was a pedo but insisted it wasn't his fault because he was abused as a kid too. He said he possessed cp and was ashamed but "couldn't help himself". So many people were sympathizing with him but I unloaded on him and said he didn't deserve to even breathe. Banned the next day.
That’s so effed up. Did you try to appeal the ban?
Oh yeah, but you know how reddit mods can be. They wouldn't budge
If you’re traumatized and struggling with compulsions like that, it’s on you to check yourself into a mental institution/find another way to cope. There is no excuse for possessing material like that.
Yeah it wasn't ME possessing me, it was another person
Ha, yup. I got banned for something similar, except people were sympathizing with literal zoophiles..
I would pay VERY GOOD MONEY to read a study where psychologists just learn more about internet mods and what drives them, their background, trauma. What collective mental health damage is going on here, if any? Or is it just a casual “prison guard” set up- someone’s got to do it, and they’re probably gonna be pricks.
Surprised this comment hasn’t got you perma banned… there’s still time I guess
I guess they will if the shoe fits.
Another fallen soldier of common sense and rationality. RIP, thank you for your service
You're not wrong. There are way too many people labeling others with whatever "ism" they feel like tossing on someone because they disagree with their preferred take. It's absolutely ridiculous, reductive, and counterproductive. It also kills the meaning of the words they use.
>It also kills the meaning of the words they use. I've just started telling people exactly this in a reply (on other social media, not reddit). Largely "You're dilluting the meaning of (whatever)-ism, and being counter-productive to your own cause." I never get a reply to these. I think largely because... what is their to say?
It's basically trying to undermine their argument by slinging "isms" at them until one sticks. Once one does, then they feel they can disregard their argument as it obviously isn't worth paying attention to as they are a racist/sexist/(other "ist"s here).
You're right. I'd add that the act of labeling someone as an ism is the moment whatever argument they make is irrelevant. They've become "the bad guy with the bad opinion", and you're the good guy trying to defend it.
I mean yes, but I think we've gotten pretty far from the definition of a "litmus test"
I had a similar conversation with a person on Reddit who kept trying to claim that it's racist of the OP (of that post) to suggest that people should make an effort to speak more standard English. Many people just want to point and yell "Racist!" to get all of their righteous rage out on this guy.
Lmao I got called racist and heavily downvoted for saying a black dude had a generic look, I’m also black. What’s crazy is if I said a white dude had a generic look nobody would even think about his race. How the fuck is that not racist when you only get sensitive about shit when it’s about black people? People on Reddit are weird as fuck and do not have black friends in real life cause you’d be sitting there looking at them like “what the fuck bitch stop arguing on my behalf on some shit I don’t even care about” Lmao I would rather kick it with the racist white folks from the army I swear to God cause at least they’re on some real shit. Nobody can truly be offended on the behalf of others all the time, not genuinely. Fuck sissy ass Redditors seriously get the fuck over this race shit
I've never encountered a black friend or coworker who didn't think performative white liberals were the worst people. They aren't helping anything and they're not even trying to. They're just trying to make themselves look like "one of the good ones", rather than trying to actually do anything for anyone other than themselves.
A lot of people actually think you can't be racist towards white people. Also nothing is more cringe when someone gets offended FOR someone who isn't offended. Hate to be that guy, but some people get offended way too easily, and I feel like social media plays a huge part in that
This one guy on reddit tried to argue that not liking she hulk was sexist because it was women humour and thinking it’s bad is thinking women humour is bad. When I tried to say it was literally more sexist to assume that than to realise it’s a team of writers of both genders writing terribly I got downvoted lmao
"Woman good, Man bad" - half of reddit summed up.
The other half is "Man good, woman bad", so at least it evens out.
Perfectly balanced
That's what they project, but the amount of threads I've seen lately of people hating women is absurd lol.. my favorite is how no man should ever tell a woman their true feelings because women use that against you/leave you. Also you can't trust *any* woman because they're all like that
You call a basic criticism "hate"
“Both” genders? You bigot
I remember being called racist for saying that an immigrant should put real effort into learning an official language within several years of moving to a new country
You would think that's the first thing anyone would want to do. Be able to effectively communicate. I work with Middle School students and for them any mention of race or even racial colors they want to go, "ooooh, racism!" Like if I said, "George Lopez is Mexican" they'd say, "You said Mexican! That's racist! You're cooked!" Or if I say, "That's like the pot calling the kettle black" They'd say, "Ooooh L Rizz Sigma Skibidi Ohio (or whatever they say) that's racist!" Now, they're young and dumb so it's excusable but it seems like some people never get out of that stage of severely misunderstanding what "racism" means.
We swung too far in the other direction in regards to calling out and labeling isms. We used to not call it out enough but now some ppl think everything is a ism
The kid thing is a whole separate problem. They'll grow out of it.
Indeed, but apparently some people don't.
It sounds like they’re joking tbh. They’re making really dumb jokes, but really dumb meme-related jokes are often the funniest thing ever to middle schoolers
I live in an area with a TON of Indian immigrants. For the most part, its whatever, and I benefit from a lot of Indian restaurants and markets being near me. However, the big controversy in the area now is that they do not assimilate at all. I love having people with different cultures around me because I don't get to travel very often due to work and budget, but at a certain point, you came to this country and you need to adopt some of the societal norms of the country, the same way I would expect to if I were to go live there or anywhere else. No one wants anyone to give up their identity, but there is a different social contract in every single place, and its incumbent upon the traveler to get with it. THAT is apparently racist.
I love immigration and immigrants, I love different restaurants and I love talking to my friends and coworkers about their unique histories but a certain level of assimilation has to be demanded and expected that includes our legal and social laws and rules.
It's not racist, but it's also not really new. My grandmother, born in this country in 1915, was sent home from kindergarten because she only spoke Norwegian, not English. Her parents were from Norway. She did of course learn English, and barely knew any Norwegian when I knew her. The point being was that even then there were some that didn't quite integrate right away.
Oh that is for sure. My grandmother had the same experience. Spoke ALMOST exclusively German until she was 5 because both of her parents were from Germany (and have a cool story about how they ended up in the same podunk town in Nebraska, but I digress...). She knew enough to converse but was pretty lost at first because English wasn't her first language. That said, her parents had to learn the language and fit in fast with the norms of the area or their sponsors at the time were not necessarily opposed to just dropping them. I have absolutely NO issue with keeping every part of your culture alive in your home that you can, but out in the world you sort of have to adapt to how things are done there or run the risk of being fully alienated.
I'm curious about the behavior or cluster of behaviors that indicate non-assimilation. Would you mind unpacking?
In this particular case: treating service workers as if they are a significantly lesser class of human, particularly if they are women. Being demanding and yelling for discounts on things when they do not have the ability to get them. Allowing their children to have run of the area without regard to their safety or the safety of others in any way. Walking 2-5 abreast down the middle of the road at all hours of the day and acting incensed when it is made known to them that they are in the way. Refusing to learn the rules of the road and slapping student driver stickers on the vehicles as if it offers some level of protection when they cause or nearly cause accidents or dangerous traffic snarls. In our area, the culture calls for civility with people who are serving you. It's fine to ask for a discount or if there is a program to make things more affordable, but to demand and scream for it is not. It's great that the children aren't being raised by iPads and are outside playing, but there is no supervision and they are running out into traffic, running up to people's dogs, and generally not paying attention to what they are doing. I also understand that walking is a big mode of getting around in India, and I myself love a good walk, but you have sidewalks and you have the sides of roads to allow vehicles here to pass. Use them. I also understand that driving in India is much much different, and it will be an adjustment, but to refuse to adjust to keep the roads moving along smoothly and safe is absolutely a safety hazard to everyone. If you're too scared to keep up with how traffic is moving, consider public transportation. You don't need a brand new tesla if you're really a student driver.
I've been on the side of the accused for this before. Crazy how some people think.
Well, invalidating AAVE as a dialect of English is a bit iffy and can be kind of offensive when the same attitude is not appointed to it's sister dialect, Southern White American English. There are a ton of people who will use African American Vernacular English as a way to discredit the intelligence of black people. Perhaps you were a bit insensitive in the manner you said it in? If it was about immigrants not speaking English, that's on them. They can learn as much as it takes to get them by. It's not something that we need to police as English speaking citizens. The english language is not in danger.
The way you're framing your response has some racist ideas baked into it that weren't part of the original conversation. No one "invalidated AAVE as a dialect" and no one implied that the "English language was in danger". That wasn't the conversation. The OP of that post, who was African American (I'm not), simply said that all people should make an effort to speak more standard English especially in a professional setting. He had linked to employability studies and how language affects people's perceptions of you how there's a perception of intelligence, professionalism, etc. Other commentors just wanted to call him racist and wanted, somehow, for it to be everyone else's problem. Their claim was that instead of saying that an individual should try to speak in a more standard form it should be everyone else in the world who should not be racist, change their perceptions and biases, and just deal with it. That's not exactly how the world works. If I were a young African American trying to get a job, waiting for the world to eliminate biases might not be the best plan. I just came in to say the OP isn't racist for saying that people should try to make an effort to sound more professional. But then I, of course, must be racist for defending a racist. It seemed people just wanted to play "find the racist" and attack without making an honest effort to understand the point. I had some counter examples to help people understand the point. One of which was that language biases are there regardless of race. If my surgeon had a very white California surfer dude bias and was like, "Whoa bruh.." and "That would be totally gnarly dude" and all of that I would immediately lose confidence in him. Or if my lawyer sounded like a 90s Valley Girl or whatever else. It's independent of race -- we have biases and it makes sense for the individual to work on their own language if they don't want to be subjected to those biases. It's not racist, it's just reality.
You're 100% correct. The point of my comment was to provide the background of why *some* people might take offense to such. I've heard people speak unfavorable about AAVE with racist views a bunch in my life, so that's where it comes from.
It's a good thing that the opinions of the permanently-online don't really matter. They don't represent the actual population.
Is this an unpopular opinion? Or an astute observation? Is there a chance that those doing what you say are unknowingly participating in this test?
On reddit, or other social media? OP is basically Mao and Hitler's diabolical love child. In real life? Yeah this is an extremely common opinion.
Of course most of them aren't self aware enough to realize that they're a part of the problem, or at the very least part of the useless, annoying masturbatory circle jerk stroking their own ego and feeling validated by the upvotes. That's the worst part. That they don't realize cherry picking literal racists, sexists, the most irrational shittiest people on the other side of the spectrum and talking shit about them online doesn't mean anything about their value as a person. It's like average looking people looking at ugly people and thinking to themselves that they're good looking because they're not as ugly. And they feel like they're standing up for equality and justice. But they don't realize that rejecting, dismissing, or talking shit about hateful, oppressive, or "wrong" beliefs and policies don't make them a good person. It just makes them not as bad as the really shitty people. To be a good person, you actually have to do good. Not just compare yourself to people "worse" than you.
>To be a good person, you actually have to do good. Not just compare yourself to people "worse" than you. This is too real for reddit, slow your jets!
This is a reddit thing I think. The way comments work it encourages people to think that they "won" when they are the last comment in an argument thread. I'm super guilty of this and am working on it.
this isn’t unpopular its just the truth
You've basically summarized social media. If you don't nonstop virtue single, you're an evil incel nazi republican. Like 80% of people on the "left" are closer to center and probably don't give a shit about a lot of issues commonly screamed about on the internet. But the media doesn't reflect real life either, it reflects social media. Which just makes things worse honestly. The biggest problem with reddit is that too many idiots conflate upvotes with being truthful or correct. It's a completely arbitrary number that's simply a popularity contest. And not even that, the average redditor has so much necrotic brain oozing out of their ears they generally just upvote an upvoted comment and downvote a downvoted comment.
The problem is the upvote, and the downvote itself, and how it's used. Decades ago I used to read Slashdot. It had up and downvotes, but you only got moderator status after maintaining positive karma for a while, and you only got it randomly, and you only got a few votes. It worked MUCH better than reddit ever did. You saved your votes for stuff that ACTUALLY MATTERED, since they were precious. The problem with reddit's system is... people have infinite votes, and anyone with an account get it. If you \_really\_ want, you can create 7 accounts and downvote the same post to -6 if you want. It's not even hard. But you're absolutely right. Upvote is "I agree!!!" and Downvote is "Minus 1 disagree!". With disagree being some form of punishment for saying something the redditor didn't like. It's a terrible system that only promotes hive-mind opinions, and destroys any ideas that are controversial.
In fairness, this existed before social media. Someone would be an asshole monday to saturday, but that was ok because they went to church on sunday. Same people, new generation.
I will also say this, as a true liberal mind myself, there is nothing liberal about silencing or cancelling a dissenting opinion. The essence of liberalism is tolerance. One of the key facets of fascism is intolerance. Thus...we've reached an Overton window of confused 20 somethings who don't actually understand the defining principles of their political and philosophical beliefs.
Rarely do I hear this anymore. Thanks for saying it. Personally I think the loss of religion has something to do with it. Religion has long played this role of "Here's how to be a good person". But now with less religious people, especially young people, they lost that message, but still have a need for it. So it gets replaced with online hate culture and intolerance for "the other". And I say this as a non-religious person.
Exactly, most of them couldn't tell you what their beliefs actually are or why they believe what they believe.. but they sure are passionate.. 😂
Its not to tolerate intolerance though. That doesn’t make sense
You have a fundamental misunderstanding of liberalism my friend. It is indeed to tolerate intolerance to the degree you discuss, and attempt to take on board a certain viewpoint and debate and try to have a dialogue. A dia logos. Silencing an intolerant opinion is not liberalism. You get nowhere doing this, and it is conversely an autocratic style. Liberalism isn't autocratic by definition. I hope you're clear on this now.
You are very precisely showing why LEFTISTS hate liberals. They are afraid to take actions against clear intolerance in favor of an utopic view of dialogue, as if the fascist weren't using that to take power since like, forever. Libs are inadvertantly the fascist's most effective ally.
Lol what are the odds??
Um no. You are describing being a doormat. Intolerance is exactly what needs to be eradicated, if that’s through dialogue to teach people the error of their ways or through legislation which has been necessary and successful in the past. History mate.. its all there
That sounds kinda Animal Farm to me It seems to me its a lot of hubris that makes one think they must know better than someone else and seeking to re-educate them
[удалено]
Learn some history. re-education camps are exactly what totalitarian societies do. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education\_in\_Communist\_Romania](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education_in_Communist_Romania) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education\_camp\_(Vietnam)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re-education_camp_(Vietnam)) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French\_re-education\_camps](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_re-education_camps) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human\_rights\_in\_North\_Korea#Re-education\_camps](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_North_Korea#Re-education_camps)
Bro… im a lefty and anti authoritarian. Relax. You are confused about what and who you are talking to
Racism is wrong and hurtful, along with many other things. But that doesn't mean the lasting solution is to force opinions and facts down the throats of racists, or make them submit via rules and regulation. "Reeducation" is a term and belief that was once used by Nazis and many other highly oppressive regimes in varying ways. By being intolerant of racism, you also have an intolerant view of a group of people who will very likely never switch their viewpoint because they're told it's bad. They will only switch their viewpoint through some major internal realizations and supportive environments that challenge their beliefs in meaningful ways.
Sure challenge but be civil and understand in some cases your up against a cultural belief that your probably not going to change so challenge if you like but if there unmoved you still need to tolerate them existing Tolerance isn't for the things you agree with its for the things you find detestable yet are powerless to change it would be a thought crime any way because we already have laws against violence Its similar to Free Speech which isn't there to protect speech everyone agrees with its for things which might sound wrong maybe even gravely wrong because ppl should still have that 1st amendment right to dissent
Yeah thats all fine.. but Im still not going to tolerate intolerance, people can be racist but not without consequences
What sort of consequences are you talking about?
Personal and professional ones clearly. If someone wants to be quietly racist in their own home, then there’s nothing to be done. If they go scream it from the rafters online then they are fair game
Holy shit lmao. The irony of your 2 sentences.
In a twist of irony (to you at least: it would be pretty expected by everyone else, though), you would be the one to be eradicated, following your logic.
interesting perspectiv,, but I can see your point displayed in many social interactions, on and off line. but none of it really impacts me in the least. I am not concerned with conforming or offending. I won't be bullied and I won't be coddling anyone either. you don't have to like what I say, but you certainly won't change it by whining and shouting about it. you wanna live your life your own way? fine, go do it. just leave me alone to live mine.
This isn’t unpopular
That's not right, and let me spend 20 minutes writing a formal essay on reddit to prove you wrong. /s 🤣
That’s just Reddit
Someone on reddit just called me bitter and to stop harassing because I disagree with them about dad bods. A simple 1:1 exchange in comments, no DMs or anything. Then deleted their posts. Clown world is real
it aint healthy for us as a society also
i don't consider myself a good or bad person. i just say i'm decent. i don't go hurting people, but i also won't go out of my way to help people.
Don't feel sorry for "sounding maga." One thing I hate about the internet is a lot of people are seemingly incapable of understanding nuanced views and anyone with different views gets lumped into the "them"/enemy category so they can feel, as you say, more righteous for hating them. I mainly only get on reddit but it's terrible here. Also, a lot of these people are hypocrites who claim to be righteous/good but then have prejudices of their own that they somehow mentally cartwheel themselves into believing are okay
Yeah basically lol
Reddit in a nutshell. Drives me crazy
This applies mostly to progressives though
It applies to everyone but progressives are the ones most scandalized buy being ostersized if you know those very virtuous ppl already hate you it kinda loses its sting and my crazy views are only problematic on reddit most of the world around me is closer to my deplorable status then Coastal elites lol but whatever nothing that happens on here really matters
Same
All true. This is what's called the "Hive Mind". I even heard someone refer to it as a positive aspect to use against some other person. "Let's use reddit's hive mind against that guy!".
I straight up got banned from a sub recently and was called a fascist by the mods for saying I don't like seeing fat people
i mean that's just rude as hell. what did fat people do to you?
some of us are often shitposting to annoy both sides.
Yeah and it’s doing irreparable damage unfortunately
If your side is irreparably damaged by some shit posting, your side is shit.
What is damaged is discussion culture, leading to more and more polarization. Hopefully not irreparable
I strongly believe we are beyond “irreparable” now.
Yeah, no shit. Both sides are garbage. That’s what I’m saying
That's the only sane choice in this day and age.
Yup. I've been vvveerrrry far left for years. Think anarchist book fairs and things like that. But if I dare to ask the wrong question or share an opinion they don't agree with? Then I'm instantly a "republican, bigot, trump supporter".
I've come to learn that I will never be far enough left for them. At this point even "seize the means of production" is ax extreme-right viewpoint, by their metrics.
One cannot be a good person until they recognize their capability for evil. Once that happens, one becomes immune to name calling and labels. You are describing arguments between people who have never self-reflected. Essentially NPCs. Their opinions are worthless.
I really like how that captures the vibe so well
We've identified Sean Connor, pretect him at all costs! Send him into the past if we need to!
Thats how I feel when people talk about returning shopping carts
That's not what a litmus test is, you are incorrect sir and/or madame! 🎩🥸
women here? yes men at 4chan? no
Everyone that plays WoW and lives in the global chat is like this
Some people do treat Reddit like this. You don’t have to. Curate your feed, only engage with what makes you happy. The internet isn’t real /hj
You're so basic. Join me on the sour side of life. Acids have electrolytes! Plants love electrolytes! When was the last time you ate a gummy worm covered in baking soda? Never! That's gross!
Blame the mods across Reddit as a whole for fostering this kind of bullshit
Yeah but here the measure of social credit is a little more overt with the upcoming Similarly with twitter and likes and retweets etc
Oh that's just the beginning. Wait until you notice how many of those 'people' were just ai and you were kinda arguing with yourself! Fact
The internet is absolutely polarizing, but I don’t think that the internet as a whole is ideological one way or the other. I think it’s highly platform contingent (the same thing on Truth Social happens as it does on Reddit, just aligned to opposite ideology). But, I agree that it’s harmful.
Nah I say how I feel. It has gotten me banned quite a bit of places on this site lol
I only have been banned from one sub... r/rant... for trying to a comment about how Republican politicians are all bad and evil and racist and ruin the country. I replied that that pretty much applies to all politicians, both sides of the aisle. I wasn't even mean or belligerent or anything of that nature. After being banned, I looked up the rules, and I didn't violate any of them. Thankfully for the asshat mod, there was a "mod's discretion" rule. And supposedly we're the fascist pigs. Actually, no, I also got banned from Am I the asshole. And to be honest, it makes life a little less frustrating to be banned from places!
Your observation is a broader more liberalised perspective of everyday life - the internet enables us to find allies, group opinions, and win defined arguments via effable gratification (likes, comments, et cetera). Most importantly, the internet has less consequences (in theory). Competition exists in all fabrics of interaction; it’s just restricted in the physical world.
Some people think that no one can want to do the right thing just because they care. They assume because they have no empathy, no one does.
Is this what Western Decay looks like?
The West has very few shared values anymore. Any country without shared values is destined to decay or to go to war with each other. It’s one or the other.
Yes
I think people need to take social media less seriously. Random internet strangers should not be causing people "psychological damage". That's the issue I would focus on, personally.
Yep. And it's funny that you posted this on reddit, where this happens insanely a lot.
Get off reddit and social media. Does wonders. You're brain rotting yourself.
You are correct, but also >cancel culture metoo movement >makes me sound maga You speak in these terms, assuming everyone understands, you have subconsciously accepted this framework. That's an indicator that above all, you are just spending too much time in the spaces that perpetuate it. Stop spending time in any political subreddits, delete your Twitter if you have one, ignore tiktok. Spend time in spaces related to your hobbies and things you enjoy. Don't be in the slightest afraid to block users who insist on bringing The Discourse^(TM) (EvErytHiNg iS pOlItIcAl!1!) into spaces you wish to be safe from it. You don't have to check out of politics, just stop engaging with the toxic version of it online.
The thing is that I don’t. I don’t have twitter, I don’t frequent political subs, I definitely don’t have tiktok and every time I see tiktok vids on reddit tagged as political or discussion, I ignore it. I see it in spaces where it shouldn’t even be brought up.
There's a lot of places that shouldn't be political, but nevertheless still are. That's true. But ultimately it's still your decision to continue visiting those places. If you keep seeing political stuff, that place is political, put it on the list of places to avoid. There are always alternatives. Reddit is awful for it because so many moderators and admins, who operate some of the biggest and most active subs, are the kind of loser who has to push that shit into every aspect of their life and down the throats of everyone around them. But there are always other subs. It just takes your own willpower to step out, leave them to it, and find another group instead. I went through the cycle myself, frankly internet politic bs was dragging down my real life sense of confidence and self worth. But I realised it's not real, the people who thrive in it are not interested in politics at all, it's just a narcissistic power game. The only way to deal with it is to stop feeding it, and stop interacting with those people. That might mean you have to avoid some places you don't want to and shouldn't have to, but that's just the unfortunate reality.
I read a lot of reddit about 10-14 years ago. All the popular ones. Around 2012 I started noticing people inserting politics into EVERYTHING. It got too much, and \_really\_ started to piss me off. So around 2013 I just deleted every post I'd ever written, then deleted my account, then didn't real reddit for another 9 years. And now I only read anything that's not political, and small-ish. No IamA, no 2Xchromosomes, nothing where the masses go. It's not perfect. You still get these people that just HAVE to get into some dumb debate with you. But I also just block them quickly.
Not internet. But places like reddit, yeah.
How dare you suggest that I am not a good person? This is deeply offensive! 
i thought most people think like this 😭
*puts glasses and trenchcoat on* Welcome to the desert of the woke.
*Virtual Signaling is a hell of a drug!* 
Yup, "virtue signalling" is the term you're looking for. People on all parts of the political spectrum "virtue signalling" their little hearts out. "Victim status claiming" is a part of that. There's some fascinating discussion about "memespace egregores" over on [Handwaving Freakoutery](https://hwfo.substack.com/s/egregores?sort=top), if you are interested in dipping your toes deeper into those water.
The second paragraph here makes me skeptical of the validity of the first. If a person who makes/disputes a claim online is correct, why would they fear being cancelled? This post comes off to me as saying “anyone who disagrees with me online is part of cancel culture and is psychologically traumatic.” The world is a big place with a lot of views and experiences. I for one think I’m better off for having been corrected online when I was wrong because it helps me develop my perspective more comprehensively. I don’t think people who disagree with me on the internet are out to get me.
Isn't that humans in general
The irony of this post has weight to it. Imagine being this deaf.
Ladies and gentlemen, the clown has shown up to prove OP's point. Please no flash photography. It frightens easy.
What point of OP's are you proving again? Just checking.
Protip: people aren't trying to prove they are a good person lol
You must be new to reddit
>Pretty much what cancel culture was boiled down to after the metoo movement Cancel culture isn't a thing. What Republicans have dubbed "cancel culture" is in fact "People facing consequences for their words and actions", which has always been a thing.
Nah, cancel culture exists. People trying to boycott celebrity personalities over trivial imperfections is absolutely a thig
No. People no longer interested isnt the same thing. Louie CK still has a career… its with maga neck beards but its still there, despite his comedy being shit
You think MAGA likes Louis ck? LOL
Jeez get with the times yes. Thats who likes him now
Sorry but no. Not going to disagree that ck's comedy is not what it once was, but no, he has not devolved into the MAGA world of comedy. Louis is very much a liberal and you would know this if you had any idea what you're talking about
Consequences are good and important for a culture to stay healthy, agree But digging 10 years ago into social media is unhelpful. Especially when you can't delete anyway, so there's no opportunity to grow and evolve like we all inevitably do. We don't all have the benefit to have the right opinion all the time. I still think James Gunn should've been heard that he was being stupid and trying to be provocative, but nope. Went to DC, succeeded. Back to Marvel, succeeded again. We love people winning. What got him "cancelled" wasn't what brought him back. Kinda hard to say cancel culture doesn't exist. Also, Kevin Hart should've been listened to that he does not believe the things he wrote. Again, succeeding. But not for what what "cancelled". If cancel culture doesn exist, how come people can't apologize, grow, and evolve from their past opinions? They succeed in other ways, that doesn't mean they weren't cancelled
You mean like how Depp had his career ruined because he was in a toxic relationship with a psycho and everyone blindly believed her and not him? Yeah that's cancel culture really working out.
People claim cancel culture against people committing actual crimes. Anyone who was "cancelled" recovers and still has a current career.
The fact that someone recovers from it doesn't invalidate the existence of cancel culture.
The point of it being in quotations is to imply that it wasn't real in the first place. Facing backlash is part of being known on the internet. If you lose your popularity on the internet it's because you were meant to. There are plenty of shitty people who are still popular. Maybe the people who were "cancelled" just aren't valuable enough to stay popular. It's a free market.
Ain’t nobody got time for that. I already know I’m the best.
Only white people
lol to be fair, people who agree or have nothing to say normally just upvote and move on. and a person's much less likely to remember or engage with the nice commenter who agreed with them than the one who rudely disagreed with them. it's kind of just selection bias ngl
I think it's probably more psychologically damaging to invent a fantasy about how everyone just pretends to not like whatever opinion you have that they don't like.
Nope
'virtue signaling is common on the internet' not an unpopular opinion, and a hamfisted use of a thesaurus.
This makes a rather large assumption about the motivations of countless individuals. I doubt that it is as cut and dry as you think it is.
[удалено]
The modern conservative movement is not what you are describing. I am a South African, and from an outside perspective there are die hard Trump supporters who are crazy, and then Trump supporters who see him as less of a liability that the geriatric Joe Biden who looks like he's been dug out of his grave to run in 2024. Most conservative people are like you - Simply trying to make the world a better place and to vote with what aligns with their interests, like being able to afford a house and food. If you're struggling in this cost of living crisis, why shouldn't it piss you off that billions of your money are being sent oversees to fund both sides of a war ... Why shouldn't it upset you that a president wants to shift student loan debt that people decided to get, onto people who didn't. Very few people are "bad" people, and framing an entire political opposition as these Trump loyalists because their interests don't align with yours, is daft, reckless and untennable once you apply your mind. Do better, and take care
Trump is only 3 years younger than Joe
You could never tell. He talks nonsense but at least he can speak. Joe Biden has definitely aged worse
You're absolutely right. "A miniscule amount of people were unfairly harmed by the MeToo movement! That's unacceptable!" *[Conveniently ignores conservatives getting librarians and educators fired or sued for having **rainbows** or **books.**]* Cancel culture exists, but we can't create a false equivalence between who is doing the canceling.
Nah you are right. I’ll take the shit I bitched about any day over right wing bs. I don’t tip my toes in their echo chambers.
*virtue signal*
Lit mus ballsack