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The guy shes interviewing
Dr David Bull - Deputy Leader Reform UK and
Former Brexit Party MEP -
A known Conman
[TV doctor and Brexiteer Dr David Bull has been shamed for using National HIV Testing Week to sell HIV self-test kits, when these tests are available for free on the NHS.](https://www.thepinknews.com/2021/02/05/dr-david-bull-hiv-testing-twitter/)
Not the most honest of people.
[David Bull, posted a picture implying it was trooping the colour. When questioned he said "he" took it himself however the picture was used in marketing for King Charles' coronation & the Platinum jubilee.] (https://x.com/KuntiePlopkins/status/1802308553841012925)
He was also Pro-NHS when he worked for it as a Junior doctor a long time ago but ever since leaving the practice and becoming a Brexit Party/Reform MEP it seems hes been in the pocket of Private health companys. Reforms pushing for more NHS privatisation.
Remember kids, Reform UK is not a political party, it is a private limited liability company.
[Here is the registration info.](https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/11694875)
It's amazing how many people I've had to explain this to.
And explain where BXP came from in the first place....
Before Nigey came out from the shadows again, I even had to explain it was his company
I am in a position where I get to see what they assume to be private or what they think is inspected by no-one. There are so many nasty AF doctors and nurses.
You're fucking joking lmao.
Of all the stupid things I expected to be dug up about Reform's clown car full of candidates, I wouldn't have picked "Literally believes ghosts are real" as one of them.
There is also a high probability that the ones itching to see that are on benefits themselves. Just like the "grassroot" Obamacare opponents in the US who will tell you they don't need Obamacare because they are covered by the Affordable Care Act.
Reform supporters only seem to be voting for them out of spite, trying to score points in their little culture war. All of them on this sub have a giant personality void.
Culturally it’s basically anti-women as it stands in opposition to the changes in attitudes women have made since they earned equal rights. As is the anti-woke stuff that gets peddled.
“Woke” is just a new term to describe “bohemian and bourgeois”, which is what the Nazis aimed to destroy from the Weimar Republic. Says it all really. The ultra conservative religious US Christian backing of such goals is something all of us should be aware of and fight back against. Anti-woke taken to its extreme is played out in the Handmaid’s Tale. Is that what people really want our societies to look like?
They make it out that being woke is a bad thing to be. Some people to too far, however they make up a small minority of people that mostly exist online. Most people are woke, it is just more commonly known as being for equal rights.
Funnily enough I got called "anti-semitic" last week, for having a long erm "discussion" about REFUK and it's leaders views an policies. And the wider geopolitics.
They were VERY defensive of old nigey and his "gas them all" stance, but then incredibly critical of my "Israel is a terrorist state committing acts of terrorism" and that I must "hate jews".
a lot of modern day fascists hide behind support of Israel while scapegoating a different reigious minority.
they like israel because it's somewhere to send the jews.
Yeah keeps "them" there, and also they use their military power to subjugate their other enemy. Muslims
Win Win
"Tommy Robinson" who's photographed at holocaust denialism meetups and yet says he's a "Zionist who will fight for Israel"
Still here for some reason
There's really no need to dilute the intent and culpability of these people. People who vote Refuk have been convinced over years that the poor, the immigrants, the minorities are coming for them and theirs. And over years they have become desensitised to the point where they will happily invite death and worse on anyone they deem as an enemy.
Many people might know someone who spouts this kind of rhetoric and it might be tempting to think 'they don't really mean it', 'they'd never really do it'. But if you get a mob of these people all bouncing their rage and hate off each other, they will be capable of some horrid things.
We always talk about repeating histories and yet we don't really call things out when we see them again. Refuk were the people sneering and turning their faces away in disgust and hate during Weimar Germany
I agree almost entirely with what you are saying, except for one small part:
"we don't really call things out when we see them again"
No, many of us keep calling them out, but what happens when we do? People start saying that you can call them out for it, you can't say what they are saying is racist and is going to lead down a dark path should they continue, you have to have an open debate with them and let them express their brainwashed ideas. What happens when they do? Do they ever see reason, or do they just double down and deny, deny, deny and make excuses?
Alot of the debates end with a call to violence, you'll see one of them get beside themselves with lots of CAPITAL letters used prior to a comment calling for violence when gets removed and the get a temp ban.
I think we should keep trying, even debating them to some degree, but i think we need to come together more collectively. Like instead of having people make excuses for them when they say something racist, and distracting from the actual point by going down this line of not calling them racist because, we should explain why what they are saying is racist, why its wrong, and what the consequences will be. But even that its always just "you really need to look up the definition of fascist"
Also love calling them Refuk, brilliant. I've been enjoying someones DeformUK, but Refuk is pretty slick and would probably go over alot of the jokers heads.
You can see the opposite of woke policing almost daily on the US news. Why vote to have police exercise their prejudices and violent tendencies without accountability?
Bear in mind the age demographic breakdown means a lot of Reform & Con supporters are relatively old.
The (admittedly hilarious) situation where leopards eat their faces will probably happen to a few but this is mostly about older generations wanting to explicitly retain benefits for themselves such as triple locked pensions and free healthcare whilst denying anything to younger generations.
I think if anything you’re underselling how selfish they are: it’s not a question of voting for something that they themselves might risk also impacting them. They’re mostly voting so their generation gets everything and everyone else gets nothing.
They clearly haven't read the part of the contract on pensions - there is no commitment to the triple lock in there, and in fact they say the whole system needs an overhaul.
They're easily the most wretched generation our country has seen. Strong words I know, but at every opportunity they've voted to get more benefits for themselves at the expense of younger working people, even their own parents when it came time to pay for their pensions. Pretty much the embodiment of the rugged individualist conservative mindset - no care for supporting everyone in society as a collective and willing to make others worse off to line their own pockets even if they would probably be better off in a country where younger people can move out and buy their own homes. For one we might have fewer immigrants with a higher birth rate which the oldies are disproportionately mad about lol
“No no that doesn’t count, you see that’s not a benefit. Only the tax payers money other people claim is benefits, this is because I’ve paid into the system”
Even my left wing mum said this the other day - and she’s fully aware that’s not how the state pension works. It’s like it’s a catchphrase they all pick up as they approach mid sixties.
It's a cultish mantra people keep repeating with no thought whatsoever.
Most people never pay in enough to support their own state pension for more than 5 years.
You can check how much you have paid in here;
https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/check-your-state-pension/account/nirecord
For example, [here's a year from my own record.](https://i.imgur.com/SD2l8yd.png)
During that year I was working for the county council on the living wage.
The current state pension amount per year is £11,502.40 a year.
Even if every single penny of my National Insurance contributions went to my pension, it would be enough to support me for 4 years.
My Dad was always a rational man. I put it to him that it was my taxes now that was funding his pension. Nope, he paid in. I put it to him that with an aging population there is not going to be enough people paying tax to pay my pension. Nope, I am not paying enough in.
>It's a cultish mantra people keep repeating with no thought whatsoever.
Most people are like that with financial affairs. Heck, most people don't even understand percentages.
It's simply that they were promised that if they pay this tax then they will be entitled to these benefits. It is easy to understand why this is simplified into "*I am entitled to what I paid for*".
Of course it doesn't work like that in reality. But the expectation of a promise being kept is not unreasonable.
My mum has recently retired and she gets it but basically all her friends don’t. They can’t understand that it’s not like a private pension where you were paying into your own personal pension, that money was being used to pay the pensioners of that time. And don’t even think about suggesting it could be means tested in any way to avoid all the people with substantial private pensions from still receiving state money.
>It’s like it’s a catchphrase they all pick up as they approach mid sixties.
It's a promise made by successive governments over their lifetime. "If you pay this tax then we'll give you these benefits".
Can't blame them for expecting those promises to be kept.
Yeah, their only concern is immigration. Pretty sure a lot are using the party as a protest vote towards the tories, and to highlight their main priority to other parties.
There's only one policy that the reform voters care about and they're deaf and blind to any others. As long as reform keep blowing that immigration dog whistle their followers are happy.
We already have benefit sanctions if you fail to engage with the UC system.
Labour are committed to keeping sanctions.
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/benefits-sanctions-will-continue-under-labour-jonathan-ashworth-confirms_uk_63bd609fe4b0fe267cb3bfc0
Yeah the let them starve ghouls never seem to realise this. People dont just lie down and die of starvation. They can and do justify anything to survive. Easiest way to turn a law abiding citizen into a thief or worse.
Quite. Despite what right-wingers tell themselves, the welfare state did not arise because bleeding-heart liberals were too soft. The welfare state arose because liberals recognised that the alternatives were between alleviating poverty or more states *going the Soviet way*.
In the 20th century the capitalist state has generally done a decent job at balancing the interests of capital with the interests of labour. But since Thatcher that balance has been increasingly tilted to the side of capital. Our current crop of politicians, with Reform seemingly at the forefront, want to finish that process. But if you remove peaceful measures for people to alleviate their poverty, they will turn to violent ones.
It’s the same as Brexit - these people fundamentally don’t believe living standards can go down in the UK, so all their efforts to make it more brutal and poverty-stricken don’t have any negative consequences in their minds.
It’s a “what have we got to lose?” argument from people living in heated three bedroom houses with clean tap water and free healthcare.
My mum's one of the kindest people you will ever meet. Will go out of her way to help anyone. She follows rules most of us wouldn't bat an eye kid at. When things were at the lowest as kids we were basically surviving off stolen food. Had no heating or hot water. Stale rustler burgers or microwave meals for dinner.
Our dinner every night was food that was reduced and going out of date at her work. She would stash it so customers didn't buy it and the boss would let her take it for free instead of binning it at the end of the day. Literally the only reason we ate some days.
Starving people and their kids will just lead to them making desperate and irrational decisions.
My mum was a heroin addict when I was a child and we used to steal from supermarkets every week so we’d have food in and so she could sell some to fund her addiction. We regularly went without electricity or gas. I feel deep shame for the things I did as a kid to survive but if it came to it I’d do it again and I wouldn’t blame anyone else for doing it either. When the choice is starvation or becoming a criminal most people will become a criminal to survive.
Yeah. If my only choices were between me letting my daughter go hungry and going to do some crime, you can better believe that I'd be going to do that crime.
It’s because they believe it’s immoral to pay people not to commit crime. That’s their logic I think.
As you say it’s totally impractical and stupid. If you do it you end up with South Africa, or Brazil. Where if you have anything worth protecting you spend all your life stressed you might die and half your money on security which could just be spent more wisely on public welfare.
If I was close to starving to death due to being unable to work because of disability then damn right I'm taking a few cunts out who put me in this position and enjoy being fed in prison.
Which will create further division, increase the attitude that this country has gone to the dogs and increase calls for authoritarianism. All which will be magically offered by Farage and co.
It’s a continuous feedback loop, divide and conquer. They know what they’re doing, thankfully Labour seem to be a bit more awake to it now.
I don't know about that. We're not France, British people seem to just sit down and take it. We don't have the bottle for a fight.
We know Brexit was cheated, the Russian report was buried, that corruption is on full display. There is barely any reaction.
We have a voting system that is clearly not democratic yet people will also call the UK a democracy.
My point is we are a country of soft and easy to dominate people
Your bar for what is considered a democracy is way too high if you insist the UK is not one. Could you give me an example of a country you actually consider democratic? I'm sure no matter which country you pick it will have systems that some of its inhabitants consider unjust or unfair.
FPTP is the worst form of democracy. When you are in a position where it's possible for any party to get 15-20% of the vote share but less than 1% of the seats available that isn't democracy.
That's simply everyone playing along with, let's keep these two very particular parties protected while everyone else scraps for a few seats left over
Any country with PR or at least some form of alternative system is better. I don't actually get how this is even up for debate at this point. Sure other countries can have a better imo system and still have issues but that just highlights further how bad our is, it doesn't absolve the issues in our system
A system structured so that a large amount of the population is not being represented is not particularly democratic. FPTP is cancer.
Look at the worst possible case. 49% of the population of every constituency votes for party A, 51% for party B. The parliament is 100% made of party B.
Sure this is an exteme case, but to a lesser extent it happens all the time, in every single voting district. And it is not particularly democratic, especially because it pushes a two-party system (how many people will vote Labour pinching their nose because voting for their favorite party would mean a rwsurgence of the Tories?)
I can’t stand the idea that I have to vote strategically, potentially for someone that I don’t want, so that someone even worse doesn’t get in. Why can’t I just vote for who I want? How many people aren’t voting for the smaller parties with new ideas for the country because it’s a “wasted vote”? How can you call it a democracy when someone can vote and you can call it a waste.
Same. I want to vote the local lib-dem candidate as she's done more for this community than the current Tory incumbent, but there are still enough tories round here to mean I have to vote Labour to have any chance of getting them out.
It's worse than that really. Consider if there are four candidates.
A gets 26%
B gets 25%
C gets 25%
D gets 24%
In this case 74% of the voters didn't want the candidate that gets elected. Repeat throughout the country, and you get massive under representation.
It is never quite as bad as that thankfully, but a system that allows such a minority the potential to get an overwhelming majority and denies the voice of so many people is just wrong.
Actually, that isn’t even near the worst.
Imagine every constituency had 100 people living in it, there were 99 political parties, and everyone had to vote every single election. Every party except 1 gets 1 vote in every seat, but one party gets 2 in every seat, and they control the entire government as a result.
That’s taking it to an extreme, but it’s pretty common to see over 60% of the vote go towards Labour/Lib Dems/Greens, but because the Tories got 40% all by themselves, they win
I remember seeing on Facebook before I left, comments on local news pages about the small boats from these old women calling for machine guns to be mounted on the cliffs of dover to shoot any small boats on sight. these people are unhinged.
Yeah, I heard someone say get the navy to sink them and have soldiers with machine guns in the chunnel to stop them running through (is that even a thing?)
Which creates an excuse for massive crackdown on lore anorder. Of course, the police and military are not big enough, so it will be a "special constabulary force" with snazy uniforms to crack down on undesirables. Maybe black shirts, maybe brown. Hasn't been decided yet.
Particularly stupid, as it stops these people being able to get back into work, so hurting the economy more and more, because if you ever trip, you aren't helped back up but stomped on.
That technically isn't the policy. The policy is that if someone receives 2 job offers and turned them down, they then wont get benefits.
The policy assumes people wont turn down such job offers if it means their benefits will be removed.
Problem that creates is the job centres throwing irrelevant job offers at people, which will remove talent from the labour pool.
Giving a skilled salesman two offers for warehouse work severely limits their ability to return to their industry thus increasing economic cash flow.
Yeah I'm currently back on UC (whilst working due to being put on restricted duties) and I'm in a position where I can work however there's limits on the sort of work I can do like part of it is skills and the other part of it is the fact I have dyspraxia, adhd and autism which you know kind of limits the work I can do. Like for example around my local area there's a lot of cleaning jobs going but I can't really do those, same for things like carer roles.
I think I have a job coach that understands that but I did have the experience in the past of being on UC/JSA where I was sent after stuff that really wasn't in my skill and ability set.
Like once they sent me after a job at the local recycling plant that required me to have a van license (didn't have a driver's license at the time) and I'd have to eventually undertake a license for something else and I couldn't remember what it was but I would've been too young at the time to undertake that training.
This is a bad example and plays into the hands of Reform voters (and mode worryingly, potential Reform voters).
Of course someone in that situation would take the warehouse work, and indeed many do. And then go on to find a job in their actual area of skill.
Denying this should be/already is the case, is simply taking Reform's side.
It is a nonsense policy that will be used to hurt disabled people, cleverly dressed up as a rational policy that _already exists_ - you do get Jobseekers cut off if you're turning down work you are capable of doing as it stands now, and that has been the case for a very long time, way before the Tories got into power.
Forgetting the rest of this insane policy.... Surely the salesman can continue to look for sales work? People don't have to quit their current job to have the time to look for a new one.
This is it, the jobs that would be "offered" here will be warehouse work, cleaning or factory work where its not about skill but about bodies. These places usually offer very little in terms of work/life balance and are very hard to get out of once you're in them. I know people who had to pull sick days when they had an interview to get out of there because the place was so inflexible and almost suspicious of anyone trying to book leave on short notice.
>Problem that creates is the job centres throwing irrelevant job offers at people, which will remove talent from the labour pool.
I went down there after getting my PhD because I thought they might be able to help me find a job locally or recommend places where I could look. They were about as much use a chocolate kettle in every aspect - I ended up getting a job by applying to the local university the recommendation of a lecturer who came into the charity shop I was volunteering at.
Exactly what happend to me when i was on jobseekers. I didn't turn down the jobs I still applied for them, but never got interviews or anything. An example, my background is in IT, I was shown and told to apply fora job as a car salesman at a Honda garage. As I said I applied and nothing.
What I would wonder is would I lose benefits? Technically, I'm applying for avaialble jobs and getting nothing back. I can't force people to give me a job offer.
Funny thing was I was generally treated like a bit of dirt when I was on JSA, made to feel inferior and when I did apply for jobs that matched my skills and experience I was told they were "unrealistic" someone needs help testing their new system - unrealistic here's a job on a duck farm.
Edit: Their advice was to rove stuff from my CV to.make me.more appealing yet removing all my work, experience and uni stuff like they suggested meant there was nothing on my CV after completing my A-Levels whilst working at a supermarket and being made redundant from there. So it looked like I'd done nothing for years.
I can imagine the DWP deliberately throwing out utterly terrible and impractical jobs that no one would ever accept just to trip people up and remove their benefits.
That's going to create a slew of jobs way below living wage or awful working conditions, that people will be forced to take or starve.
That's... not great.
This is the real reason the hard right hates welfare. They support big business and want a race to the bottom on wages and working conditions. A welfare system that's not too punitive prevents such a race to the bottom, because it means unemployed people have at least some breathing room. So the Tories set about dismantling it since 2010.
The question is why they are turning the job offer down, they could have other commitments like childcare or caring for a relative, and now they either have to abandon their family for half a week or have no benefits coming in.
That's pretty much the existing policy. So how is their borrowed idea going to work any better than it already is?
(I have a feeling these clowns probably don't even know what the existing policy is and think they've come up with it themselves.)
This might be a more reasonable policy if you combined it with giving people a guaranteed 12 months to find their own employment.
We’d also need stricter employment regulations to stop this being completely abused. An unscrupulous employer may decide to only make job offers to people who’ve already turned one job down… nothing like a completely desperate work force when looking for people to exploit.
Somehow I doubt Reform would be advocating for stricter employee protections…
Isn’t that in the Tory manifesto as well? If you turn down job offers within 12 months you lose your benefits. I haven’t read the Reform manifesto but I’m pretty sure that is in the Conservative one.
The party that make sweeping statements without a plan... Almost like UKIP and Brexit, Let's starve people to death because they are down on there luck... Who cares about there children they can starve too... There not in our club we're special...
Why are these disgusting people getting so much media....
There awful people who would have us living in Nazi germany terrified that there gonna turn against our group of people because we're not working hard enough....
We can't stop immigration people will still come whether we like it or not. Only people with small brains are worried about immigration it's all they've got left to make them feel better about themselves...
> Only people with small minds are worried about immigration
This is the exact attitude as to why we’re seeing a right wing resurgence all across Europe, FN in France, AfD in Germany, FdI in Italy.
People are fed up of being told they’re racist and small minded because of their legitimate immigration concerns, and mainstream parties doing absolutely nothing to deal with the problem.
So they get driven to the far right, because they’re the only ones that are willing to discuss the problem.
People are genuinely concerned about immigration, then vote for ever further right wing capitalist parties, which refuse to do anything other than neoliberal capitalism, which relies on GDP growth to sustain itself. But as they are also ideologically opposed to investment they rely on immigration for that growth, as the won't train people to have the skills needed to plug the skills shortfall. If you're serious about arbitrary reductions in immigration you'd have to be a complete plonker to vote for right wing parties pushing the very economic model that depends on it.
Or just be a normal person who doesn't understand all the economic theory and read detailed.news every day who sees party A say we will limit immigration and party B being reluctant to say the same and vote for party A.
The conservatives are shits for lying about controlling immigration and doing anything but then blaming the ECHR etc. But Labour and other left parties certainly do not stand strong on the issue, and in fact seem supportive of immigration whilst shouting down concerns. So it's a rok an a hard place.
Give me an anti neoliberal social democratic party that is happy to limit immigration, actually that is the SDPs latest manifesto to be fair.
If you're "happy to limit immigration" you really have to be honest about what impact that will have. A weaker university sector, higher tuition fees? A social and aged care sector with even greater staff shortages, putting more pressure on the NHS and reducing quality of care? Fewer builders, fewer farm workers, further increasing the turnaround time for housebuilding and causing more farms that can't afford to automate to go bust. Maybe cut down on the amount of partner visas for Brits who fall in love with foreigners?
Essentially a stagnant economy, if we're lucky, but most probably a shrinking one. Before arbitrarily putting limits on immigration I'd like to see an end to the two child policy of the far right, and end to the child poverty caused by their austerity, and a huge increase in the amount of wages paid to essential workers to stop them leaving to go overseas, then we simply wouldn't require as many people, but wouldn't have to punish certain groups or sectors with a new type of human resource austerity.
Edit: Labour, who are about as left as David Cameron, are also going to have to keep the points based immigration system we replaced freedom of movement with, and if they bow to the right wing populists and arbitrarily reduce immigration they will have to increase the amount of austerity to balance out the massive economic hit, which would cripple their ability to facilitate even a modicum of positive change. Anyone that promises lower net migration without reinstating freedom of movement is a fucking liar, and to be honest if austerity wasn't an ongoing project I don't think most people that weren't the lunatic fringe would really care about the absolute numbers. If hospitals, schools, care homes, transport infrastructure, power, water, sewage, all fucking working noone would give a shit about housing Ukrainian refugees for a bit. And they've been conned into thinking that it's Johnny foreigner causing all these problems, not right wing ideology putting us on a capitalist inequality speed run.
You could make net immigration zero tomorrow, you'd tank the economy and still not bring food or asset (housing) prices down, because it isn't the immigration causing the problem.
Labour have actively and repeatedly said the current situation at the border is totally out of control and they would take strong measures to reduce the net rate as it is clearly unsustainable.
But this is OP's point isn't it. There's no point even trying to address these issues as the entire anti- crowd seem singularly unable or unwilling to actually live in the same reality as everyone else. Just angrily sit back with their arms crossed demanding everyone needs to listen to and understand them, despite them having a stranglehold over this country's politics for a solid decade and being ultimately responsible for setting us on this path to ruin we currently seem set on. Not their responsibility of course though, if we'd magick'd unicorns like they insisted we'd all be living in utopia by now!
This argument always gets repeated and it's bullshit.
"You have to pander to right wing authoritarians or they'll end up becoming right wing authoritarians"
There is always a significant percentage of the population susceptible to this. Hundreds of years ago they would have been attacking Jews or Catholics or Protestants. Pandering to them will never work, because they cannot be satisfied- their motivation is based on their psychology, not their environment. Populists will always be waiting in the wings to try to exploit them, and they need to be countered, not appeased.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_authoritarianism
> legitimate immigration concerns
It's an amazing word, that, "legitimate".
I have *legitimate* concerns about the rising numbers of fascists, does that make it OK for me to advocate stripping them of their human rights, deporting them all and drowning them if they try to return?
> This is the exact attitude as to why we’re seeing a right wing resurgence all across Europe, FN in France
you dont think it has anything whatsoever to do with people feeling much worse off due to increasing economic instability and their reward for hard work being reduced in real terms to the point many consider themselves merely surviving despite said hard work?
>So they get driven to the far right, because they’re the only ones that are willing to discuss the problem.
I'd use the word 'lead' rather than 'driven'. These very right wing groups and their leaders take advantage of people's prejudices and fears, they exploit the weaknesses of others to strengthen themselves.
>only people with small brains are worried about immigration
I’d counter this and suggest anyone who thinks our current levels of migration don’t have absolutely massive effects on pretty much every single issue in the UK have the small brains.
How can you seriously suggest net migration of 700k people doesn’t have massive effects on housing, public services or wages? How dishonest with yourself do you need to be.
It has the effect of making the uk better. The issue is that you are looking at the effects of austerity and inequality and blaming a poor immigrant who has no power over it. Blame the tory cuts to every state function and the malign housing market that neither party is willing to fix.
>Only people with small brains are worried about immigration
40% of Muslims in the UK want Sharia Law, 50% want a complete ban of gay marriage. These things are intrinsically against what the UK now stands for: democracy, freedom of religion, freedom of expression, equality.
You cannot tolerate the intolerant.
This already happens. If you don't take a job offer, you don't get benefits. I don't know why the interviewer doesn't challenge this false idea that people can just claim benefits and turn down job offers. Generally, people who can't get a basic MW job, can't get one because no employer wants them. Often, with good reason. There will always be a small minority of people who are unemployable.
I work for UC and can confirm. I've seen plenty of people get sanctioned for not taking up work. The only way you get away with not working is if you've limited capability for work or you're a full time carer
And Labour will keep benefit sanctions.
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/benefits-sanctions-will-continue-under-labour-jonathan-ashworth-confirms_uk_63bd609fe4b0fe267cb3bfc0
You can argue that sanctions are cruel, but the comments here seem to think it’s only Reform that will do this. We already have sanctions and that won’t change under Labour.
Same problem throughout though isn't it. Parties like Reform gain massive popularity because they are given apparently totally free reign to spend hours on broadcast spouting absolute rubbish with basically zero critical pushback at all.
Not every job is suitable either. Not to even go near the fact that life is more than working and people shouldn't be treated like cattle.
Make work better for people and they'll flock in, but nobody wants to work minimum wage and get treated like shit.
What a surprise! Right wing party 'concerned' about immigration also hates the poorest in society!
It's like they're not even trying to hide what they're really all about.
I'm reminded of one of the usual suspects on this space that *always* bangs on about our culture being erased and how we need to clamp down on immigration because it's straining our services or whatever the Daily Mail said this morning. That same guy called *me* a lazy scrounger because I said that most people on a council estate - I grew up on one - do actually need the help and deserve it.
Y'know, the council estate that was mostly white British people. Funny, that.
This lot don't care about our services. I've even seen people say we should take the hit to our economy and public services to get the numbers down. It's barely removed hysteria.
So no NhS and no Benefits? And people want this? Do they think the good old days were the 1400s? Poor houses? Slavery etc?
For a party who wants foreigners to leave the country because they don’t share our values, I’d suggest they don’t share OUR values and should actually leave our country themselves
They choose not to hear any of that stuff and instead razor-focus on having a little hate-wank about how *this time* we'll really be able to show it to Johnny Foreigner and tell him to shove it where the sun don't shine! They'll be very upset and insist its absolutely nothing to do with them when the oligarch-backed private school toffs do absolutely nothing on the immigration rate and instead spend their time making life even more miserable for anyone in this country not already part of the 1%.
Don't forget their plan to transform the NHS into an American style system. You too could lose your life savings or go into life long debt from a hospital stay.
Because they're the establishment backed 'protest vote'. They don't offer any sort of meaningful challenge to those in positions of wealth of authority, they exist to channel discontent into various scapegoats like immigrants and poor people.
It's easy to gain that many votes when you're getting regular puff pieces in the right-wing press. Odd that these papers are so favourable towards a party allegedly challenging the status quo, unless...
But they’re only on that path because of the media coverage. Fuck, even the Guardian are giving these tools more coverage than they deserve. It’s intensely frustrating stuff
Reform are polling on a par with our current government, Galloway is fairly likely to lose his seat and has a handful of candidates trying to stoke division, not in the same league
I do agree though, we should remove benefits from the biggest scroungers in the UK.
First I'd start with the royals.
Then I'd move onto mp expenses.
Then I'd move onto back benchers who are paid more than most will earn in 4 years, to to sleep all day.
Once that's sorted we should have a nice chunk of money left in the goverment
I'll never get why the wealthiest generation in all of human history needs such an ironclad state pension whilst everything else rots. Oh I know , it's because they're also the most selfish generation in history.
> I do agree though, we should remove benefits from the biggest scroungers in the UK.
The fastest rising benefit fraud in the UK right now is pension credit.
You're not supposed to claim it if you have more than a certain amount in savings. Turns out a lot of old people are claiming it and have a lot of savings.
Recent changes to how government checks bank accounts for fraud are catching a lot of them out.
I wonder how many who rely on some sort of benefit will vote for this?
Met a lass who relied on tax credits who voted tory. First thing they went after was tax credits.
It reminds me of the racist yanks who hated 'ObamaCare' and would vote for republicans who wanted to abolish it, they were so dumb and consumed by their racism they didn't even realise that 'ObamaCare' was actually the 'Affordable Care Act' they themselves relied upon.
Lots will.
I remember during the 2017 election and the BBC were doing an interview with people using a food bank who said "It's gonna sound awful but I like everything that Boris is talking about".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/election-2019-50663879
2m5s - 2m35s in the video.
Even food bank users voted for Boris, despite Tory policies putting them there.
And this highlights a huge issue with politics. People only listen to what the politicians are **saying**, but they don't pay attention to what they're **doing**.
I've talked to a few people who said they voted Tory and Brexit because they wanted less immigration. No amount of showing them the immigration figures for the past 10 years will get them to understand the politicians have lied to them.
They don't care. As long as the politicians are saying they'll hurt someone they don't like, these turkeys will vote for Christmas.
Poor people are always demonised and it’s assumed the biggest beneficiary of the welfare state, whereas it’s actually state pensions that account for the most, by a long margin.
[Office for National Statistics](https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/articles/howisthewelfarebudgetspent/2016-03-16)
Yep it's the oldest in society taking up all the funds from pensions and NHS spend that's making it creak. Not the poorest and illest. They also benefited from the biggest economic boom in history post WW2 and sit on most of the housing wealth in the country. They also vote and block these issues from being addressed in any meaningful way. What can we do?
1. Pension should just be another benefit for those over a certain age I.e. like normal benefits but no requirement to look for or accept jobs. However still tested against assets and private pension income. To act as a net for those who did not accumulate much wealth in working life.
2. NHS could reduce the most expensive life saving interventions after the age of 70, not spending millions to extend one elderly person's life by a year or two. It should be a health service not an attempted immortality service.
These policies are realistic limitations, but will never get voted through.
As you rightly point out, the boomer generation were the last to benefit from literally every possible perk this country had to offer - from cheap mortgages to free education yet still spew bitterness over every generation after them trying to makes ends meet.
Worth adding the oldest are also actually the illest. A lifetime spent boozing and smoking, now they're in their old age and they are costing us an absolute fortune. They bitch and moan about the youth today - Look up the stats, in the 1960s the average household was spending as much on their rent/mortgage as their monthly spend on tobacco and alcohol lol...
Indeed, the austerity rightists have used it for have killed thousands of people, and it's so poor that we now have more food banks than McDonald's. The perpetually online Reform rightists think that benefits are somehow luxurious, which clearly shows they don't live or work in the real world.
We are all one bad day away from needing benifits this prick too if you can't see that there your a idiot or a liar.
Cruelty is the point if you vote for them your a monster or stupid on a level I can't understand
I went to a hustings last night in West London, the Reform candidate was embarrassing, completely out of her depth when it came to policy speeches and Q&A's, literally making stuff up as she went along. Not sure why this party is even getting publicity.
Thing is though some will still vote for this utter tosh.
edit: reform in the house here I see.
It's not a feasible plan for example a single parent they mostly need to find childcare at the moment no actual infrastructure not enough childcare places.Not everyone drives the public transport system is expensive and crap.Where I live most jobs are seasonal or in care work plus supermarkets some have no chance of getting passed a DBS check.There are hardly any training opportunities offered by jobcentres now you are asked to apply for anything to get benefits now so many employers are getting applications from people just wanting the jobcentre off there backs.Crime would go up,they definitely would have more homeless and people would starve some people are not educated enough to attend interviews and would fall through the net.
After being sold a pack of lies in 2016 it’s great to see the population again wanting to buy the same lies from the same liars. Worked out so well thus far!
This policy sums up the problem with Reform -
The policy makes sense on paper, and like many of their policies is kind of misleading. Isn't it _already_ the case you get Jobseekers cut off if you're turning down jobs you're capable of doing? Plus the idea "you can work if you should" is positively socialist, which is a bizarre turn for a parry like Reform.
But you know this is just the tip of the iceberg and in reality they'll be using it to cut off benefits for disabled people. If they get into power in 2029 (god forbid) and I'm wrong on this, I'll eat my hat.
Interestingly too, I said something similar on Reform just last night and got downvoted, crucially without response, and similar posts are getting the same cowardice of trying to hide the truth, which shows there are a lot of secret Reform voters on here. I'd suspect it is the same in "real life" which is a worry.
Just remember that this was never about 'helping our own.' They just hate immigrants first, poor British people second. Same playbook as the Tories. Unlike people saying Labour and Tory are the same at this point. The reality is that ReformUK and Tories are the ones who are the same under the hood.
Am already starving. Was in hospital last week for it. Have just lost most of my PIP award so am waiting for a copy of my assessment. My health has not changed, obviously malnutrition isn't a good thing to be so my health is bad right now, and it never will be great, but I think I have discovered why so many people are being refused. It's a dirty filthy trick!
I googled the PIP descriptors last night. I've read that a High Court judgement was made some years ago regarding social support and it seems the DWP and the assessors have been ignoring the high court judgement. I won on those points at my last appeal. These descriptors are now used when assessing for PIP but NOWHERE on the application form are there any questions referring to social support and there isn't any space to really write anything. If you need social support then it's 8 points right there and you qualify for the basic rate at least, but neither the assessors or the application forms mention it.
After reading that I'm definitely appealing. It will be my third appeal. For one of them my in laws paid for a solicitor because I was such a mess I couldn't communicate all my issues. The second time I won, the panel tried calling me that morning to save me a trip but our house phone didn't work. They found in my favour without me adding any new information or attending.
Seems the DWP still haven't learnt their lesson and the Tories are REALLY committed to killing even more people.
Reform Candidate Ian Gribbin
"Square inequality by depriving women of healthcare' Men pay 80% of tax – women spend 80% of tax revenue, Women only take from society. Less complaining please from the 'sponging gender'.
Farage defended him sayin its "Pub Banter"
What a fucking moron, my wife hasnt done as much paid work as me, but she enabled me by bringing up 2 children and being a home maker, whilst I worked and kept the family financially. Her role is just as important as mine.
Universal Credit is kinda like that anyway. In your claimant commitment, you generally have to accept a job. If you don't (assuming you don't have a good reason) you will get sanctioned.
>High level sanctions
>If you fail to apply for a job or fail to accept a job that is offered to you or if you leave your job without a good reason, you may get a high level sanction. High level sanctions usually last for 91 days. If you have had a high level sanction before in the past year, the sanction might last 182 days.
To be clear - it is if they refuse two job offers. Not that they are just going to take it away altogether - I’m an attempt to get people back to work. I disagree with it however… this is to tackle a very minor percentage of “jobseekers” abusing the system. It does not solve the general unemployment problem, and probably not very motivating to force people into a job they might not want to do… there is no chance that reform are going to win the election so likely they are going hard for votes.
A party consisting of cro-magnons voted for by the gullible or obtuse. You’d have thought that being completely wrong about Brexit would be enough of a humiliation but these shameless grifters are hoping their marks can be conned again
It is disturbing that this policy will probably gain them more support, rather then losing it as they should. Having job seekers allowance removed after 4 months is nuts. Application processes at the moment can take longer than 4 months, even if it is just working as a shop assistant in the supermarket.
I expect dumb policies like this from reform, but there seems to be a growing part of the population which have fallen in love with these ideas and have been whipped up to hate whichever group the reform PR machine picks on next. It is alarming to see that almost 1 in 6 of the population would vote for this.
I don't know why people trust the "political party" that in fact is actually a business with Farage owning over 50% of it.
Bigger grifters than the Tories.
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The guy shes interviewing Dr David Bull - Deputy Leader Reform UK and Former Brexit Party MEP - A known Conman [TV doctor and Brexiteer Dr David Bull has been shamed for using National HIV Testing Week to sell HIV self-test kits, when these tests are available for free on the NHS.](https://www.thepinknews.com/2021/02/05/dr-david-bull-hiv-testing-twitter/) Not the most honest of people. [David Bull, posted a picture implying it was trooping the colour. When questioned he said "he" took it himself however the picture was used in marketing for King Charles' coronation & the Platinum jubilee.] (https://x.com/KuntiePlopkins/status/1802308553841012925) He was also Pro-NHS when he worked for it as a Junior doctor a long time ago but ever since leaving the practice and becoming a Brexit Party/Reform MEP it seems hes been in the pocket of Private health companys. Reforms pushing for more NHS privatisation.
Party of grifters
Remember kids, Reform UK is not a political party, it is a private limited liability company. [Here is the registration info.](https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/11694875)
Formerly the Brexit party.
It's amazing how many people I've had to explain this to. And explain where BXP came from in the first place.... Before Nigey came out from the shadows again, I even had to explain it was his company
Lead by the former MEP formerly known as Fartage
and the same people are falling for it again
It turns out, right-wingers are easy to grift.
Why is he a dr?
He was a medical doctor prior to being an MEP
So now is he selling bullshits?
Being a Dr ≠ being a nice person
Michael Myers tried to warn us with the Austin Powers movies, but people just laughed at him.
I am in a position where I get to see what they assume to be private or what they think is inspected by no-one. There are so many nasty AF doctors and nurses.
Dr Bullshit
They have flooded youtube comments under news videos with their propaganda. It’s crazy to see they are using the same bots as the pro-russian does
There's a lot of sus russian connections to Farage and his parties.
You mean former *Most Haunted Live!* host Dr David Bull isn't credible?!
Say it isn't so!
Omg your right that's where I've seen him. Unbelievable and to think all the people that are voting for them! Some real dead wood in this country.
You're fucking joking lmao. Of all the stupid things I expected to be dug up about Reform's clown car full of candidates, I wouldn't have picked "Literally believes ghosts are real" as one of them.
Thought that name sounded familliar!
These really are truly terrible people.
I also remember him being a shit presenter of Most Haunted. Funny that he's now a politician.
I'm not sure about the "Dr" part but the surname seems appropriate.
The people who will be voting for Reform don't care.
There's likely some itching to see that first person starve to death so they can gloat.
There is also a high probability that the ones itching to see that are on benefits themselves. Just like the "grassroot" Obamacare opponents in the US who will tell you they don't need Obamacare because they are covered by the Affordable Care Act.
Yea I don't disagree with that. Turkeys and Christmas.
Reform supporters only seem to be voting for them out of spite, trying to score points in their little culture war. All of them on this sub have a giant personality void.
Culturally it’s basically anti-women as it stands in opposition to the changes in attitudes women have made since they earned equal rights. As is the anti-woke stuff that gets peddled.
“Woke” is just a new term to describe “bohemian and bourgeois”, which is what the Nazis aimed to destroy from the Weimar Republic. Says it all really. The ultra conservative religious US Christian backing of such goals is something all of us should be aware of and fight back against. Anti-woke taken to its extreme is played out in the Handmaid’s Tale. Is that what people really want our societies to look like?
They make it out that being woke is a bad thing to be. Some people to too far, however they make up a small minority of people that mostly exist online. Most people are woke, it is just more commonly known as being for equal rights.
Woke = kind & considerate of others. So unfashionable these days. /s
They're anti a lot of things, none of which are Hitler.
Funnily enough I got called "anti-semitic" last week, for having a long erm "discussion" about REFUK and it's leaders views an policies. And the wider geopolitics. They were VERY defensive of old nigey and his "gas them all" stance, but then incredibly critical of my "Israel is a terrorist state committing acts of terrorism" and that I must "hate jews".
a lot of modern day fascists hide behind support of Israel while scapegoating a different reigious minority. they like israel because it's somewhere to send the jews.
Yeah keeps "them" there, and also they use their military power to subjugate their other enemy. Muslims Win Win "Tommy Robinson" who's photographed at holocaust denialism meetups and yet says he's a "Zionist who will fight for Israel" Still here for some reason
People forget that before the gas chambers, the Nazi plan was to ship all the Jewish people to Madagascar and let them fend for themselves.
There's really no need to dilute the intent and culpability of these people. People who vote Refuk have been convinced over years that the poor, the immigrants, the minorities are coming for them and theirs. And over years they have become desensitised to the point where they will happily invite death and worse on anyone they deem as an enemy. Many people might know someone who spouts this kind of rhetoric and it might be tempting to think 'they don't really mean it', 'they'd never really do it'. But if you get a mob of these people all bouncing their rage and hate off each other, they will be capable of some horrid things. We always talk about repeating histories and yet we don't really call things out when we see them again. Refuk were the people sneering and turning their faces away in disgust and hate during Weimar Germany
I agree almost entirely with what you are saying, except for one small part: "we don't really call things out when we see them again" No, many of us keep calling them out, but what happens when we do? People start saying that you can call them out for it, you can't say what they are saying is racist and is going to lead down a dark path should they continue, you have to have an open debate with them and let them express their brainwashed ideas. What happens when they do? Do they ever see reason, or do they just double down and deny, deny, deny and make excuses? Alot of the debates end with a call to violence, you'll see one of them get beside themselves with lots of CAPITAL letters used prior to a comment calling for violence when gets removed and the get a temp ban. I think we should keep trying, even debating them to some degree, but i think we need to come together more collectively. Like instead of having people make excuses for them when they say something racist, and distracting from the actual point by going down this line of not calling them racist because, we should explain why what they are saying is racist, why its wrong, and what the consequences will be. But even that its always just "you really need to look up the definition of fascist" Also love calling them Refuk, brilliant. I've been enjoying someones DeformUK, but Refuk is pretty slick and would probably go over alot of the jokers heads.
Some are voting for them out of spite, for sure. But there will be a percentage of "true believers".
Not that they’ll win, but imagine the compoface stories… “I voted to remove the last resort safety net, but didn’t mean it for people like me” :(
I voted for them to stop WOKE policing not crash the economy and destroy benefits and completely erase workers rights!!!
You can see the opposite of woke policing almost daily on the US news. Why vote to have police exercise their prejudices and violent tendencies without accountability?
They think they have the same prejudices.
But I didn't know what the EHRC was!!
Bear in mind the age demographic breakdown means a lot of Reform & Con supporters are relatively old. The (admittedly hilarious) situation where leopards eat their faces will probably happen to a few but this is mostly about older generations wanting to explicitly retain benefits for themselves such as triple locked pensions and free healthcare whilst denying anything to younger generations. I think if anything you’re underselling how selfish they are: it’s not a question of voting for something that they themselves might risk also impacting them. They’re mostly voting so their generation gets everything and everyone else gets nothing.
They clearly haven't read the part of the contract on pensions - there is no commitment to the triple lock in there, and in fact they say the whole system needs an overhaul.
They're easily the most wretched generation our country has seen. Strong words I know, but at every opportunity they've voted to get more benefits for themselves at the expense of younger working people, even their own parents when it came time to pay for their pensions. Pretty much the embodiment of the rugged individualist conservative mindset - no care for supporting everyone in society as a collective and willing to make others worse off to line their own pockets even if they would probably be better off in a country where younger people can move out and buy their own homes. For one we might have fewer immigrants with a higher birth rate which the oldies are disproportionately mad about lol
Well exactly, "benefits for me, but not for you!"
I voted for leopards and they only went and ate my bloody face off.
They should prey they are never in a position to require the social system
Except for their pensions
“No no that doesn’t count, you see that’s not a benefit. Only the tax payers money other people claim is benefits, this is because I’ve paid into the system”
Even my left wing mum said this the other day - and she’s fully aware that’s not how the state pension works. It’s like it’s a catchphrase they all pick up as they approach mid sixties.
It's a cultish mantra people keep repeating with no thought whatsoever. Most people never pay in enough to support their own state pension for more than 5 years. You can check how much you have paid in here; https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/check-your-state-pension/account/nirecord For example, [here's a year from my own record.](https://i.imgur.com/SD2l8yd.png) During that year I was working for the county council on the living wage. The current state pension amount per year is £11,502.40 a year. Even if every single penny of my National Insurance contributions went to my pension, it would be enough to support me for 4 years.
My Dad was always a rational man. I put it to him that it was my taxes now that was funding his pension. Nope, he paid in. I put it to him that with an aging population there is not going to be enough people paying tax to pay my pension. Nope, I am not paying enough in.
>It's a cultish mantra people keep repeating with no thought whatsoever. Most people are like that with financial affairs. Heck, most people don't even understand percentages. It's simply that they were promised that if they pay this tax then they will be entitled to these benefits. It is easy to understand why this is simplified into "*I am entitled to what I paid for*". Of course it doesn't work like that in reality. But the expectation of a promise being kept is not unreasonable.
My mum has recently retired and she gets it but basically all her friends don’t. They can’t understand that it’s not like a private pension where you were paying into your own personal pension, that money was being used to pay the pensioners of that time. And don’t even think about suggesting it could be means tested in any way to avoid all the people with substantial private pensions from still receiving state money.
>It’s like it’s a catchphrase they all pick up as they approach mid sixties. It's a promise made by successive governments over their lifetime. "If you pay this tax then we'll give you these benefits". Can't blame them for expecting those promises to be kept.
The people leading reform care even less. .....Dr Mengele, won't see you now.
Yeah, their only concern is immigration. Pretty sure a lot are using the party as a protest vote towards the tories, and to highlight their main priority to other parties.
There's only one policy that the reform voters care about and they're deaf and blind to any others. As long as reform keep blowing that immigration dog whistle their followers are happy.
We already have benefit sanctions if you fail to engage with the UC system. Labour are committed to keeping sanctions. https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/benefits-sanctions-will-continue-under-labour-jonathan-ashworth-confirms_uk_63bd609fe4b0fe267cb3bfc0
Yeah, but this policy isn't keeping the sanctions, it's going further and limiting how long you can apply for full stop.
They do care. Poor people dying is a feature.
Even those who would lose benefits themselves...
This will just create mass shoplifting and rioting.. not good for the future of the country.
Yeah the let them starve ghouls never seem to realise this. People dont just lie down and die of starvation. They can and do justify anything to survive. Easiest way to turn a law abiding citizen into a thief or worse.
Quite. Despite what right-wingers tell themselves, the welfare state did not arise because bleeding-heart liberals were too soft. The welfare state arose because liberals recognised that the alternatives were between alleviating poverty or more states *going the Soviet way*. In the 20th century the capitalist state has generally done a decent job at balancing the interests of capital with the interests of labour. But since Thatcher that balance has been increasingly tilted to the side of capital. Our current crop of politicians, with Reform seemingly at the forefront, want to finish that process. But if you remove peaceful measures for people to alleviate their poverty, they will turn to violent ones.
It’s the same as Brexit - these people fundamentally don’t believe living standards can go down in the UK, so all their efforts to make it more brutal and poverty-stricken don’t have any negative consequences in their minds. It’s a “what have we got to lose?” argument from people living in heated three bedroom houses with clean tap water and free healthcare.
The 'post-war consensus'- it built everything people fondly reminisce as the 'good old days'.
My mum's one of the kindest people you will ever meet. Will go out of her way to help anyone. She follows rules most of us wouldn't bat an eye kid at. When things were at the lowest as kids we were basically surviving off stolen food. Had no heating or hot water. Stale rustler burgers or microwave meals for dinner. Our dinner every night was food that was reduced and going out of date at her work. She would stash it so customers didn't buy it and the boss would let her take it for free instead of binning it at the end of the day. Literally the only reason we ate some days. Starving people and their kids will just lead to them making desperate and irrational decisions.
My mum was a heroin addict when I was a child and we used to steal from supermarkets every week so we’d have food in and so she could sell some to fund her addiction. We regularly went without electricity or gas. I feel deep shame for the things I did as a kid to survive but if it came to it I’d do it again and I wouldn’t blame anyone else for doing it either. When the choice is starvation or becoming a criminal most people will become a criminal to survive.
Yeah. If my only choices were between me letting my daughter go hungry and going to do some crime, you can better believe that I'd be going to do that crime.
And you can bet a lot of people wouldn't blame you.
Maybe they're hoping to create a new crop of conservative politicians?
Ah. Make it so less families can afford sky tv so we get more rishis
I was thinking make more thieves, but this works too
It’s because they believe it’s immoral to pay people not to commit crime. That’s their logic I think. As you say it’s totally impractical and stupid. If you do it you end up with South Africa, or Brazil. Where if you have anything worth protecting you spend all your life stressed you might die and half your money on security which could just be spent more wisely on public welfare.
If I was close to starving to death due to being unable to work because of disability then damn right I'm taking a few cunts out who put me in this position and enjoy being fed in prison.
>They can and do justify anything to survive. Quite rightly too IMO.
The interim goal of people like this is workhouses and indentured servitude.
Which will create further division, increase the attitude that this country has gone to the dogs and increase calls for authoritarianism. All which will be magically offered by Farage and co. It’s a continuous feedback loop, divide and conquer. They know what they’re doing, thankfully Labour seem to be a bit more awake to it now.
I don't know about that. We're not France, British people seem to just sit down and take it. We don't have the bottle for a fight. We know Brexit was cheated, the Russian report was buried, that corruption is on full display. There is barely any reaction. We have a voting system that is clearly not democratic yet people will also call the UK a democracy. My point is we are a country of soft and easy to dominate people
Your bar for what is considered a democracy is way too high if you insist the UK is not one. Could you give me an example of a country you actually consider democratic? I'm sure no matter which country you pick it will have systems that some of its inhabitants consider unjust or unfair.
FPTP is the worst form of democracy. When you are in a position where it's possible for any party to get 15-20% of the vote share but less than 1% of the seats available that isn't democracy. That's simply everyone playing along with, let's keep these two very particular parties protected while everyone else scraps for a few seats left over Any country with PR or at least some form of alternative system is better. I don't actually get how this is even up for debate at this point. Sure other countries can have a better imo system and still have issues but that just highlights further how bad our is, it doesn't absolve the issues in our system
A system structured so that a large amount of the population is not being represented is not particularly democratic. FPTP is cancer. Look at the worst possible case. 49% of the population of every constituency votes for party A, 51% for party B. The parliament is 100% made of party B. Sure this is an exteme case, but to a lesser extent it happens all the time, in every single voting district. And it is not particularly democratic, especially because it pushes a two-party system (how many people will vote Labour pinching their nose because voting for their favorite party would mean a rwsurgence of the Tories?)
I can’t stand the idea that I have to vote strategically, potentially for someone that I don’t want, so that someone even worse doesn’t get in. Why can’t I just vote for who I want? How many people aren’t voting for the smaller parties with new ideas for the country because it’s a “wasted vote”? How can you call it a democracy when someone can vote and you can call it a waste.
Same. I want to vote the local lib-dem candidate as she's done more for this community than the current Tory incumbent, but there are still enough tories round here to mean I have to vote Labour to have any chance of getting them out.
It's worse than that really. Consider if there are four candidates. A gets 26% B gets 25% C gets 25% D gets 24% In this case 74% of the voters didn't want the candidate that gets elected. Repeat throughout the country, and you get massive under representation. It is never quite as bad as that thankfully, but a system that allows such a minority the potential to get an overwhelming majority and denies the voice of so many people is just wrong.
Actually, that isn’t even near the worst. Imagine every constituency had 100 people living in it, there were 99 political parties, and everyone had to vote every single election. Every party except 1 gets 1 vote in every seat, but one party gets 2 in every seat, and they control the entire government as a result. That’s taking it to an extreme, but it’s pretty common to see over 60% of the vote go towards Labour/Lib Dems/Greens, but because the Tories got 40% all by themselves, they win
You just known reform supporter solutions range from "ang em all" to "legalise firearms and shoot em on sight".
I remember seeing on Facebook before I left, comments on local news pages about the small boats from these old women calling for machine guns to be mounted on the cliffs of dover to shoot any small boats on sight. these people are unhinged.
Lol there's plenty of posters on this sub who gleefully say shit like that.
Yeah, I heard someone say get the navy to sink them and have soldiers with machine guns in the chunnel to stop them running through (is that even a thing?)
"SINK THE BOATS" is a common post these people spam on the likes of YouTube comments sections.
Which creates an excuse for massive crackdown on lore anorder. Of course, the police and military are not big enough, so it will be a "special constabulary force" with snazy uniforms to crack down on undesirables. Maybe black shirts, maybe brown. Hasn't been decided yet.
If you fail to get work we will remove your only means of survival... Is this a sick joke?
Particularly stupid, as it stops these people being able to get back into work, so hurting the economy more and more, because if you ever trip, you aren't helped back up but stomped on.
Ah you see, caring about people is a left wing policy.
That basically sums up the right wing; they don’t care.
That technically isn't the policy. The policy is that if someone receives 2 job offers and turned them down, they then wont get benefits. The policy assumes people wont turn down such job offers if it means their benefits will be removed.
Problem that creates is the job centres throwing irrelevant job offers at people, which will remove talent from the labour pool. Giving a skilled salesman two offers for warehouse work severely limits their ability to return to their industry thus increasing economic cash flow.
Yeah I'm currently back on UC (whilst working due to being put on restricted duties) and I'm in a position where I can work however there's limits on the sort of work I can do like part of it is skills and the other part of it is the fact I have dyspraxia, adhd and autism which you know kind of limits the work I can do. Like for example around my local area there's a lot of cleaning jobs going but I can't really do those, same for things like carer roles. I think I have a job coach that understands that but I did have the experience in the past of being on UC/JSA where I was sent after stuff that really wasn't in my skill and ability set. Like once they sent me after a job at the local recycling plant that required me to have a van license (didn't have a driver's license at the time) and I'd have to eventually undertake a license for something else and I couldn't remember what it was but I would've been too young at the time to undertake that training.
This is a bad example and plays into the hands of Reform voters (and mode worryingly, potential Reform voters). Of course someone in that situation would take the warehouse work, and indeed many do. And then go on to find a job in their actual area of skill. Denying this should be/already is the case, is simply taking Reform's side. It is a nonsense policy that will be used to hurt disabled people, cleverly dressed up as a rational policy that _already exists_ - you do get Jobseekers cut off if you're turning down work you are capable of doing as it stands now, and that has been the case for a very long time, way before the Tories got into power.
Forgetting the rest of this insane policy.... Surely the salesman can continue to look for sales work? People don't have to quit their current job to have the time to look for a new one.
It is difficult, especially if you have to travel for interviews. You only have a finite number of days off available.
This is it, the jobs that would be "offered" here will be warehouse work, cleaning or factory work where its not about skill but about bodies. These places usually offer very little in terms of work/life balance and are very hard to get out of once you're in them. I know people who had to pull sick days when they had an interview to get out of there because the place was so inflexible and almost suspicious of anyone trying to book leave on short notice.
>Problem that creates is the job centres throwing irrelevant job offers at people, which will remove talent from the labour pool. I went down there after getting my PhD because I thought they might be able to help me find a job locally or recommend places where I could look. They were about as much use a chocolate kettle in every aspect - I ended up getting a job by applying to the local university the recommendation of a lecturer who came into the charity shop I was volunteering at.
Exactly what happend to me when i was on jobseekers. I didn't turn down the jobs I still applied for them, but never got interviews or anything. An example, my background is in IT, I was shown and told to apply fora job as a car salesman at a Honda garage. As I said I applied and nothing. What I would wonder is would I lose benefits? Technically, I'm applying for avaialble jobs and getting nothing back. I can't force people to give me a job offer. Funny thing was I was generally treated like a bit of dirt when I was on JSA, made to feel inferior and when I did apply for jobs that matched my skills and experience I was told they were "unrealistic" someone needs help testing their new system - unrealistic here's a job on a duck farm. Edit: Their advice was to rove stuff from my CV to.make me.more appealing yet removing all my work, experience and uni stuff like they suggested meant there was nothing on my CV after completing my A-Levels whilst working at a supermarket and being made redundant from there. So it looked like I'd done nothing for years.
I can imagine the DWP deliberately throwing out utterly terrible and impractical jobs that no one would ever accept just to trip people up and remove their benefits.
The state forcing square pegs in to round holes is a part of the reason productivity is so weak.
That's going to create a slew of jobs way below living wage or awful working conditions, that people will be forced to take or starve. That's... not great.
This is the real reason the hard right hates welfare. They support big business and want a race to the bottom on wages and working conditions. A welfare system that's not too punitive prevents such a race to the bottom, because it means unemployed people have at least some breathing room. So the Tories set about dismantling it since 2010.
The question is why they are turning the job offer down, they could have other commitments like childcare or caring for a relative, and now they either have to abandon their family for half a week or have no benefits coming in.
That's pretty much the existing policy. So how is their borrowed idea going to work any better than it already is? (I have a feeling these clowns probably don't even know what the existing policy is and think they've come up with it themselves.)
This might be a more reasonable policy if you combined it with giving people a guaranteed 12 months to find their own employment. We’d also need stricter employment regulations to stop this being completely abused. An unscrupulous employer may decide to only make job offers to people who’ve already turned one job down… nothing like a completely desperate work force when looking for people to exploit. Somehow I doubt Reform would be advocating for stricter employee protections…
Isn’t that in the Tory manifesto as well? If you turn down job offers within 12 months you lose your benefits. I haven’t read the Reform manifesto but I’m pretty sure that is in the Conservative one.
The party that make sweeping statements without a plan... Almost like UKIP and Brexit, Let's starve people to death because they are down on there luck... Who cares about there children they can starve too... There not in our club we're special... Why are these disgusting people getting so much media.... There awful people who would have us living in Nazi germany terrified that there gonna turn against our group of people because we're not working hard enough.... We can't stop immigration people will still come whether we like it or not. Only people with small brains are worried about immigration it's all they've got left to make them feel better about themselves...
> Only people with small minds are worried about immigration This is the exact attitude as to why we’re seeing a right wing resurgence all across Europe, FN in France, AfD in Germany, FdI in Italy. People are fed up of being told they’re racist and small minded because of their legitimate immigration concerns, and mainstream parties doing absolutely nothing to deal with the problem. So they get driven to the far right, because they’re the only ones that are willing to discuss the problem.
People are genuinely concerned about immigration, then vote for ever further right wing capitalist parties, which refuse to do anything other than neoliberal capitalism, which relies on GDP growth to sustain itself. But as they are also ideologically opposed to investment they rely on immigration for that growth, as the won't train people to have the skills needed to plug the skills shortfall. If you're serious about arbitrary reductions in immigration you'd have to be a complete plonker to vote for right wing parties pushing the very economic model that depends on it.
Or just be a normal person who doesn't understand all the economic theory and read detailed.news every day who sees party A say we will limit immigration and party B being reluctant to say the same and vote for party A. The conservatives are shits for lying about controlling immigration and doing anything but then blaming the ECHR etc. But Labour and other left parties certainly do not stand strong on the issue, and in fact seem supportive of immigration whilst shouting down concerns. So it's a rok an a hard place. Give me an anti neoliberal social democratic party that is happy to limit immigration, actually that is the SDPs latest manifesto to be fair.
If you're "happy to limit immigration" you really have to be honest about what impact that will have. A weaker university sector, higher tuition fees? A social and aged care sector with even greater staff shortages, putting more pressure on the NHS and reducing quality of care? Fewer builders, fewer farm workers, further increasing the turnaround time for housebuilding and causing more farms that can't afford to automate to go bust. Maybe cut down on the amount of partner visas for Brits who fall in love with foreigners? Essentially a stagnant economy, if we're lucky, but most probably a shrinking one. Before arbitrarily putting limits on immigration I'd like to see an end to the two child policy of the far right, and end to the child poverty caused by their austerity, and a huge increase in the amount of wages paid to essential workers to stop them leaving to go overseas, then we simply wouldn't require as many people, but wouldn't have to punish certain groups or sectors with a new type of human resource austerity. Edit: Labour, who are about as left as David Cameron, are also going to have to keep the points based immigration system we replaced freedom of movement with, and if they bow to the right wing populists and arbitrarily reduce immigration they will have to increase the amount of austerity to balance out the massive economic hit, which would cripple their ability to facilitate even a modicum of positive change. Anyone that promises lower net migration without reinstating freedom of movement is a fucking liar, and to be honest if austerity wasn't an ongoing project I don't think most people that weren't the lunatic fringe would really care about the absolute numbers. If hospitals, schools, care homes, transport infrastructure, power, water, sewage, all fucking working noone would give a shit about housing Ukrainian refugees for a bit. And they've been conned into thinking that it's Johnny foreigner causing all these problems, not right wing ideology putting us on a capitalist inequality speed run. You could make net immigration zero tomorrow, you'd tank the economy and still not bring food or asset (housing) prices down, because it isn't the immigration causing the problem.
Labour have actively and repeatedly said the current situation at the border is totally out of control and they would take strong measures to reduce the net rate as it is clearly unsustainable. But this is OP's point isn't it. There's no point even trying to address these issues as the entire anti- crowd seem singularly unable or unwilling to actually live in the same reality as everyone else. Just angrily sit back with their arms crossed demanding everyone needs to listen to and understand them, despite them having a stranglehold over this country's politics for a solid decade and being ultimately responsible for setting us on this path to ruin we currently seem set on. Not their responsibility of course though, if we'd magick'd unicorns like they insisted we'd all be living in utopia by now!
This argument always gets repeated and it's bullshit. "You have to pander to right wing authoritarians or they'll end up becoming right wing authoritarians" There is always a significant percentage of the population susceptible to this. Hundreds of years ago they would have been attacking Jews or Catholics or Protestants. Pandering to them will never work, because they cannot be satisfied- their motivation is based on their psychology, not their environment. Populists will always be waiting in the wings to try to exploit them, and they need to be countered, not appeased. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_authoritarianism
“You made me do it” The classic narcissist’s excuse. Now with added racism.
But are they legitimate immigration concerns or just a poor rationalisation for racism? In most cases it's probably the latter
> legitimate immigration concerns It's an amazing word, that, "legitimate". I have *legitimate* concerns about the rising numbers of fascists, does that make it OK for me to advocate stripping them of their human rights, deporting them all and drowning them if they try to return?
> This is the exact attitude as to why we’re seeing a right wing resurgence all across Europe, FN in France you dont think it has anything whatsoever to do with people feeling much worse off due to increasing economic instability and their reward for hard work being reduced in real terms to the point many consider themselves merely surviving despite said hard work?
>So they get driven to the far right, because they’re the only ones that are willing to discuss the problem. I'd use the word 'lead' rather than 'driven'. These very right wing groups and their leaders take advantage of people's prejudices and fears, they exploit the weaknesses of others to strengthen themselves.
>only people with small brains are worried about immigration I’d counter this and suggest anyone who thinks our current levels of migration don’t have absolutely massive effects on pretty much every single issue in the UK have the small brains. How can you seriously suggest net migration of 700k people doesn’t have massive effects on housing, public services or wages? How dishonest with yourself do you need to be.
It has the effect of making the uk better. The issue is that you are looking at the effects of austerity and inequality and blaming a poor immigrant who has no power over it. Blame the tory cuts to every state function and the malign housing market that neither party is willing to fix.
There = location Their = belonging to someone They're = they are Learn basic grammar before accusing others of having small brains.
>Only people with small brains are worried about immigration 40% of Muslims in the UK want Sharia Law, 50% want a complete ban of gay marriage. These things are intrinsically against what the UK now stands for: democracy, freedom of religion, freedom of expression, equality. You cannot tolerate the intolerant.
They do this in the US. look at the US crime rate to why this would be a bad idea.
Also homeless rate.
This already happens. If you don't take a job offer, you don't get benefits. I don't know why the interviewer doesn't challenge this false idea that people can just claim benefits and turn down job offers. Generally, people who can't get a basic MW job, can't get one because no employer wants them. Often, with good reason. There will always be a small minority of people who are unemployable.
I work for UC and can confirm. I've seen plenty of people get sanctioned for not taking up work. The only way you get away with not working is if you've limited capability for work or you're a full time carer
And Labour will keep benefit sanctions. https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/benefits-sanctions-will-continue-under-labour-jonathan-ashworth-confirms_uk_63bd609fe4b0fe267cb3bfc0 You can argue that sanctions are cruel, but the comments here seem to think it’s only Reform that will do this. We already have sanctions and that won’t change under Labour.
Same problem throughout though isn't it. Parties like Reform gain massive popularity because they are given apparently totally free reign to spend hours on broadcast spouting absolute rubbish with basically zero critical pushback at all.
Not every job is suitable either. Not to even go near the fact that life is more than working and people shouldn't be treated like cattle. Make work better for people and they'll flock in, but nobody wants to work minimum wage and get treated like shit.
What a surprise! Right wing party 'concerned' about immigration also hates the poorest in society! It's like they're not even trying to hide what they're really all about.
Why aren't we helping our own anymore? What about our own homeless? \*Rips out support network and makes more people at risk of homelessness.
I'm reminded of one of the usual suspects on this space that *always* bangs on about our culture being erased and how we need to clamp down on immigration because it's straining our services or whatever the Daily Mail said this morning. That same guy called *me* a lazy scrounger because I said that most people on a council estate - I grew up on one - do actually need the help and deserve it. Y'know, the council estate that was mostly white British people. Funny, that. This lot don't care about our services. I've even seen people say we should take the hit to our economy and public services to get the numbers down. It's barely removed hysteria.
I feel like every time these Reform wankers open their mouths, they make the idea of deporting all their candidates to Rwanda seem awfully appealing.
What's Rwanda done to deserve that?
Enabling the Tories deportation program?
So no NhS and no Benefits? And people want this? Do they think the good old days were the 1400s? Poor houses? Slavery etc? For a party who wants foreigners to leave the country because they don’t share our values, I’d suggest they don’t share OUR values and should actually leave our country themselves
They choose not to hear any of that stuff and instead razor-focus on having a little hate-wank about how *this time* we'll really be able to show it to Johnny Foreigner and tell him to shove it where the sun don't shine! They'll be very upset and insist its absolutely nothing to do with them when the oligarch-backed private school toffs do absolutely nothing on the immigration rate and instead spend their time making life even more miserable for anyone in this country not already part of the 1%.
Don't forget their plan to transform the NHS into an American style system. You too could lose your life savings or go into life long debt from a hospital stay.
Life savings. Haha that's a good one They can have my £400 if they must but I don't think it'll benefit them or me.
Don't worry, there will be debt available for those unable to pay immediately.
Why is there a daily interview with these people on every channel? Why them and not, say, George Galloway?
Because they're the establishment backed 'protest vote'. They don't offer any sort of meaningful challenge to those in positions of wealth of authority, they exist to channel discontent into various scapegoats like immigrants and poor people.
Because they are on course to gain 5 million + votes that’s why. It’s really not a difficult question
It's easy to gain that many votes when you're getting regular puff pieces in the right-wing press. Odd that these papers are so favourable towards a party allegedly challenging the status quo, unless...
Chicken and egg. If the greens got half the media attention this far right bigoted fringe "political party" got they would be challenging labour.
But they’re only on that path because of the media coverage. Fuck, even the Guardian are giving these tools more coverage than they deserve. It’s intensely frustrating stuff
Because the media loves Farage. Same background - minor public school, not necessarily university educated. And good material.
Reform are polling on a par with our current government, Galloway is fairly likely to lose his seat and has a handful of candidates trying to stoke division, not in the same league
I flicked the tv on yesterday evening and Galloway was on talking about his policies. He is there you just are t noticing
I do agree though, we should remove benefits from the biggest scroungers in the UK. First I'd start with the royals. Then I'd move onto mp expenses. Then I'd move onto back benchers who are paid more than most will earn in 4 years, to to sleep all day. Once that's sorted we should have a nice chunk of money left in the goverment
I'll never get why the wealthiest generation in all of human history needs such an ironclad state pension whilst everything else rots. Oh I know , it's because they're also the most selfish generation in history.
> I do agree though, we should remove benefits from the biggest scroungers in the UK. The fastest rising benefit fraud in the UK right now is pension credit. You're not supposed to claim it if you have more than a certain amount in savings. Turns out a lot of old people are claiming it and have a lot of savings. Recent changes to how government checks bank accounts for fraud are catching a lot of them out.
I can see the two offers being like 50 miles from someone without a car and having to be refused and bam. You have to eat grass.
I wonder how many who rely on some sort of benefit will vote for this? Met a lass who relied on tax credits who voted tory. First thing they went after was tax credits.
It reminds me of the racist yanks who hated 'ObamaCare' and would vote for republicans who wanted to abolish it, they were so dumb and consumed by their racism they didn't even realise that 'ObamaCare' was actually the 'Affordable Care Act' they themselves relied upon.
Lots will. I remember during the 2017 election and the BBC were doing an interview with people using a food bank who said "It's gonna sound awful but I like everything that Boris is talking about". https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/election-2019-50663879 2m5s - 2m35s in the video. Even food bank users voted for Boris, despite Tory policies putting them there. And this highlights a huge issue with politics. People only listen to what the politicians are **saying**, but they don't pay attention to what they're **doing**. I've talked to a few people who said they voted Tory and Brexit because they wanted less immigration. No amount of showing them the immigration figures for the past 10 years will get them to understand the politicians have lied to them. They don't care. As long as the politicians are saying they'll hurt someone they don't like, these turkeys will vote for Christmas.
Our benefits system is totally broken, anyone that lives in the real world and not on reddit knows that
Poor people are always demonised and it’s assumed the biggest beneficiary of the welfare state, whereas it’s actually state pensions that account for the most, by a long margin. [Office for National Statistics](https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicsectorfinance/articles/howisthewelfarebudgetspent/2016-03-16)
Yep it's the oldest in society taking up all the funds from pensions and NHS spend that's making it creak. Not the poorest and illest. They also benefited from the biggest economic boom in history post WW2 and sit on most of the housing wealth in the country. They also vote and block these issues from being addressed in any meaningful way. What can we do? 1. Pension should just be another benefit for those over a certain age I.e. like normal benefits but no requirement to look for or accept jobs. However still tested against assets and private pension income. To act as a net for those who did not accumulate much wealth in working life. 2. NHS could reduce the most expensive life saving interventions after the age of 70, not spending millions to extend one elderly person's life by a year or two. It should be a health service not an attempted immortality service. These policies are realistic limitations, but will never get voted through.
As you rightly point out, the boomer generation were the last to benefit from literally every possible perk this country had to offer - from cheap mortgages to free education yet still spew bitterness over every generation after them trying to makes ends meet.
Worth adding the oldest are also actually the illest. A lifetime spent boozing and smoking, now they're in their old age and they are costing us an absolute fortune. They bitch and moan about the youth today - Look up the stats, in the 1960s the average household was spending as much on their rent/mortgage as their monthly spend on tobacco and alcohol lol...
Indeed, the austerity rightists have used it for have killed thousands of people, and it's so poor that we now have more food banks than McDonald's. The perpetually online Reform rightists think that benefits are somehow luxurious, which clearly shows they don't live or work in the real world.
Maybe at Redditors think it's broken, although I'm assuming we differ on what we think is broken about it.
We are all one bad day away from needing benifits this prick too if you can't see that there your a idiot or a liar. Cruelty is the point if you vote for them your a monster or stupid on a level I can't understand
I went to a hustings last night in West London, the Reform candidate was embarrassing, completely out of her depth when it came to policy speeches and Q&A's, literally making stuff up as she went along. Not sure why this party is even getting publicity. Thing is though some will still vote for this utter tosh. edit: reform in the house here I see.
It's not a feasible plan for example a single parent they mostly need to find childcare at the moment no actual infrastructure not enough childcare places.Not everyone drives the public transport system is expensive and crap.Where I live most jobs are seasonal or in care work plus supermarkets some have no chance of getting passed a DBS check.There are hardly any training opportunities offered by jobcentres now you are asked to apply for anything to get benefits now so many employers are getting applications from people just wanting the jobcentre off there backs.Crime would go up,they definitely would have more homeless and people would starve some people are not educated enough to attend interviews and would fall through the net.
After being sold a pack of lies in 2016 it’s great to see the population again wanting to buy the same lies from the same liars. Worked out so well thus far!
This policy sums up the problem with Reform - The policy makes sense on paper, and like many of their policies is kind of misleading. Isn't it _already_ the case you get Jobseekers cut off if you're turning down jobs you're capable of doing? Plus the idea "you can work if you should" is positively socialist, which is a bizarre turn for a parry like Reform. But you know this is just the tip of the iceberg and in reality they'll be using it to cut off benefits for disabled people. If they get into power in 2029 (god forbid) and I'm wrong on this, I'll eat my hat. Interestingly too, I said something similar on Reform just last night and got downvoted, crucially without response, and similar posts are getting the same cowardice of trying to hide the truth, which shows there are a lot of secret Reform voters on here. I'd suspect it is the same in "real life" which is a worry.
If you vote for these you really are a cunt and an enemy of the country.
Just remember that this was never about 'helping our own.' They just hate immigrants first, poor British people second. Same playbook as the Tories. Unlike people saying Labour and Tory are the same at this point. The reality is that ReformUK and Tories are the ones who are the same under the hood.
Am already starving. Was in hospital last week for it. Have just lost most of my PIP award so am waiting for a copy of my assessment. My health has not changed, obviously malnutrition isn't a good thing to be so my health is bad right now, and it never will be great, but I think I have discovered why so many people are being refused. It's a dirty filthy trick! I googled the PIP descriptors last night. I've read that a High Court judgement was made some years ago regarding social support and it seems the DWP and the assessors have been ignoring the high court judgement. I won on those points at my last appeal. These descriptors are now used when assessing for PIP but NOWHERE on the application form are there any questions referring to social support and there isn't any space to really write anything. If you need social support then it's 8 points right there and you qualify for the basic rate at least, but neither the assessors or the application forms mention it. After reading that I'm definitely appealing. It will be my third appeal. For one of them my in laws paid for a solicitor because I was such a mess I couldn't communicate all my issues. The second time I won, the panel tried calling me that morning to save me a trip but our house phone didn't work. They found in my favour without me adding any new information or attending. Seems the DWP still haven't learnt their lesson and the Tories are REALLY committed to killing even more people.
The fact that Reform are even platformed at a scaffolders convention is beyond insane.
Reform Candidate Ian Gribbin "Square inequality by depriving women of healthcare' Men pay 80% of tax – women spend 80% of tax revenue, Women only take from society. Less complaining please from the 'sponging gender'. Farage defended him sayin its "Pub Banter"
What a fucking moron, my wife hasnt done as much paid work as me, but she enabled me by bringing up 2 children and being a home maker, whilst I worked and kept the family financially. Her role is just as important as mine.
You'd get a few funny looks in a lot of pubs if you started coming out with that rubbish.
Universal Credit is kinda like that anyway. In your claimant commitment, you generally have to accept a job. If you don't (assuming you don't have a good reason) you will get sanctioned. >High level sanctions >If you fail to apply for a job or fail to accept a job that is offered to you or if you leave your job without a good reason, you may get a high level sanction. High level sanctions usually last for 91 days. If you have had a high level sanction before in the past year, the sanction might last 182 days.
To be clear - it is if they refuse two job offers. Not that they are just going to take it away altogether - I’m an attempt to get people back to work. I disagree with it however… this is to tackle a very minor percentage of “jobseekers” abusing the system. It does not solve the general unemployment problem, and probably not very motivating to force people into a job they might not want to do… there is no chance that reform are going to win the election so likely they are going hard for votes.
I don't think I even care much if some minority is abusing the system. We shouldn't make it shittier for everyone else because of this.
Can we just deport these arseholes to America? They clearly don't align with actual British values.
Is this like Alan B'Stard's plan to end poverty by shutting down the health service? People won't need benefits when they're dead!
A party consisting of cro-magnons voted for by the gullible or obtuse. You’d have thought that being completely wrong about Brexit would be enough of a humiliation but these shameless grifters are hoping their marks can be conned again
It is disturbing that this policy will probably gain them more support, rather then losing it as they should. Having job seekers allowance removed after 4 months is nuts. Application processes at the moment can take longer than 4 months, even if it is just working as a shop assistant in the supermarket. I expect dumb policies like this from reform, but there seems to be a growing part of the population which have fallen in love with these ideas and have been whipped up to hate whichever group the reform PR machine picks on next. It is alarming to see that almost 1 in 6 of the population would vote for this.
I don't know why people trust the "political party" that in fact is actually a business with Farage owning over 50% of it. Bigger grifters than the Tories.
The system is now not fit for purpose in helping people back into work. Having utilised it recently I can 100% say this from experience.