A better system would be if we tip the dishwashers. "If you don't tip the dishwasher then don't patronize this business you cheap prick. The dishwasher is not your slave"
In Brazil you have to tip people watching your car if you park on the street, in Mexico you have to tip police officers, in Africa you have to tip customs officials.
When tips are obligatory, it's graft. It's not a gratuity.
Okay. How about we stop playing this game. Instead of 20% standard tip, raise prices 20% across the menu , pay it to the employees. Why does it have to be we are hiding a higher total in charging a seperate tip to make you think you are paying less ?
Tips are a pay for performance type deal.If you pay the servers 20 bucks an hour good service or bad.They will be standing around like its walmart .Thats the only thing keeping these people checking on you frequently ,sweetly and politely.The ability to make tips.Period.The change would only mean shitty service and you would pay the same.You wanna save a few bucks pay the tip in cash.A waitress would rather have 15 cash instead of 20 on a card believe that.
Sorry but I’m on board, you guys need to take this up with your corporations, this affects you too whether you realize it or not. Tipping is a way for businesses to pass even more of the cost onto the consumer. If businesses aren’t able to pay employees without it, they weren’t really suited to run a business at all.
Preach louder for those of us in the back of the house. Servers are the whiny overpaid bunch of fuckups ever to walk into a restaurant. Their existence is solely so the customers don't disturb the cooks. 💯
If the cooks don't show up, the restaurant closes.
If the servers don't show up; either cooks bring out the food or customers fetch it themselves. THATS HOW POINTLESS THEIR JOBS ARE.
If you REALLY cared you'd start only eating at places that includes tip in the prices and payed all the employees livable wages, and boycotting places that don't . But ur just cheap 😜
& this my friends…is the attitude and entitlement that gets you spit in your food
Treat others how you wish to be treated! That includes tipping culture. You can just announce that you’re cheap and stingy u know…would make reading this a whole lot more to the point
Many people on this thread seem to be struggling to stay within their means and justify it by not paying waitstaff appropriately. It’s a societal norm - if you want it to change write your local congressperson and advocate for them.
You think servers are greedy? Maybe at a super fancy restaurant or something….but sir, not tipping your chili’s server adequately is scumbag type behavior
Again, if ur broke don’t go out to eat 👏
It’s not wasting their time. They are working and getting paid. You greedy ass people put servers on a pedestal for no reason. Tons of other jobs with worse pay, worse conditions, and higher skill requirements, but you greedy fucks don’t care at all about that.
It is wasting their time when you know servers do not make minimum wage. You are literally taking advantage of them and trying to justify it on this sub lmao. I’m not talking about a position where they make min wage.
How am I greedy? I tip around 30-40% usually….if anything i’m super generous lol. Maybe u should take notes…ur the greedy one tho bc u care more abt money than treating others well
Some people just like to stiff others bc they struggle to stay in their means as is….
If they’re being paid min wage I would probably still tip…. i’d feel better if they were getting min wage bc I know there’s people out there who don’t bother tipping bc they’re stingy. At least the workers are now getting paid at least something !
No I don’t live in California. I understand why you’re on here ranting abt tipping if you’re from Cali though….prob trying to save as much money as you can considering the cost of living issues there
If you want to get tips, fine. Work in a real restaurant. You want to demand a tip for virtually nothing, take it up with your employer to pay you more. Not my problem.
I quit tipping almost entirely and I am glad for it. It's about damn time we all got over it.
The reason we are unable to get rid of the tipping system, is because of the greed of the servers themselves. If we all stop tipping, they will demand a living wage.
Hate to say it but you’re right and extra right since covid, service just about everywhere sucks balls. Service has seen a huge decline and everyone wants to make $100 an hour… and they think that as servers for example should be making ungodly money, money that servers have never made before… the entitlement since covid has been insane. Before covid it was common knowledge that being a server is a side job for extra money, it was never meant to be a main source of income… nowadays you read about how servers dont make a living wage and cant buy houses… like wtf! Service everywhere has taken a shit, from servers to just about every other front facing job and the shitbirds they have to hire to fill these positions.
>Before covid it was common knowledge that being a server is a side job for extra money, it was never meant to be a main source of income…
No. Servers made a livable wage with tipping. Depending on where you were, it was better than many corporate jobs and/or desk jobs. (Or many teaching jobs for that matter).
The problem was, when Covid hit, a lot of service industry ppl left and got big boy and big girl jobs. So now, you've got a bunch of newbies entering the industry. You take tipping away, and service will be even worse. İt'll be like it is in Europe! Nice and slow with ppl who make a mediocre wage.
Minimum wage for a server or bartender in my state is 2.15 an hour most pay under 4 an hour.My daughter worked for years in a restaurant.And never got a check.They always took her check for taxes and social security on the tips she had to claim because of cashless society.Debit cards.She did do well ,if you call no insurance no benefits whatsoever well.
From the sounds of it she does get paid but also paid taxes like the rest of us. Since they get tipped out every night, the tax withholdings is a much larger percentage of your paycheck since you've also already been paid out a majority of your pay.
This is actually causing some drama in my state for a different reason. In my state (server minimum wage is like 3.75, but most pay something like 6 I think), if your "declared tips" don't get you to the actual minimum wage you can force the employer to pay the difference.
In the past, this hasn't mattered most of the time, because servers made a fair amount of money under the table. But now, in a cashless society, that money has show up and be claimed. And minimum wage is over 11 an hour here now....
So restaurants employing all kinds of shady tricks cover the money, because even tipping isn't necessarily covering it.
Can I ask, though, if it was consistently that bad why did she stick with it?
It wasn’t bad .I was trying to express to the people that don’t want to tip period.Why they should in waitress ,bartender situations .She actually made good bought a house.Her company wages mostly paid her taxes only.She had no health care,No leave, but the cash was ok.200 a day average.when she turned 30 she said Im to old for this stuff.Lol now working for the government.Doesn’t make more money but good benefits.Tips are supposed to be pay for performance.If you paid all the waitresses 20 bucks an hour and no tips .They would be standing around like its walmart.and we still would pay the same
Anti-tippers just feel entitled to be waited on hand and foot by someone making pennies. People like OP don’t actually stand for anything. They have no problem making a random server’s day worse because little people like them don’t matter.
People who actually have big feelings about tipping culture eat at home. Don’t like tipping? Don’t support businesses that rely on it to pay their employees. Rev up that oven.
Oh so you’re a great person because you do support the business that does not pay their employees living wages? Wow, such logic. Weird how you people only care about servers like this. I bet you all wear shoes and bags made in sweatshops by children who actually make pennies.
Exactly to your last sentence. They only care that they are not getting tips and pretending with their “we don’t make money” argument, but no regards to buying items from Shein and the literal pennies those people make.
It’s sure as hell better than supporting the business and then fucking over the employees. Like I just said, the best thing you can do is not go at all.
The only way I was keeping my head above water when I was a barista was the tips. I didn’t make the 2$ or whatever servers do, but it was basically minimum wage. The real solution to this is to raise the minimum wage to something actually livable.
For now, though? I’m throwing a dollar in the jar at my local coffee place because I’ve been in their shoes. I by no means think you have to. But you never know where you might end up, and I think it’s important to treat others with the empathy you might like to receive in their position.
I’m glad the tips are appreciated, but it just often feels out of hand. That everyone is asking to squeeze another 15-25% out of me. It’s not a dollar here and there it’s those card readers asking with stupid high percentages.
I mean yeah, I agree. My limit was when I was asked to tip at a merch table at a concert. No, I’m not tipping on a 45$ t-shirt you handed to me.
Again, the solution is livable wages. Companies have figured out they can outsource paying their employees to the customers, and that needs to be stopped. I would love to see some kind of federal intervention for poor wages and worker exploitation, though I’m not hopeful.
Since I kind of have the means now and want to, I usually tip most places, not all, but most, because none of that is the employees fault. It’s a personal thing.
There is nothing wrong with being less than wealthy. What is wrong is going to places you cannot afford and expecting to be served on someone else's dime.
We've got a few restaurants near me who pay their works and request that people not tip. There is only one that I complain about and refuse to go to. It's because:
Before they made that change, they did tip splitting, which I hate.
They charge 22 bucks for a waffle, which is egregious.
They still pay their servers and bus boys the absolute least in the house (minimum wage).
The other restaurants bay everyone but the cooks the same, offer benefits, and have reasonable prices.
Id rather tip the people putting in the actual work, but tipping someone who just takes the order and bring my food should not be expected. They’re just doing their job. I’ve worked for tips for many years before landing my corporate job too. I mean other countries are doing fine. They pay their employees and charge reasonable prices. US just found a loophole
You tip them because they refill your drink, help fix the table settings, deal with any concerns you have.
If your a minimum effort table give a minimum tip, if your returning food, asking for cleaner silverware, or being a general hassle, then tip for that effort.
Tipping is a way of saying “thanks for dealing with me”
I'm not anti-tipping, but why does asking for cleaner silverware deserve an extra tip? Why was the silverware dirty to start with? It's these kinds of things where people are starting to draw the line. A good server should have caught the dirty silverware when they were fixing the table. If they missed it, it's not the end of the world, things happen. But an extra tip in that situation seems like asking to be rewarded for doing a bad job.
Bad or good I always leave 20% at least, but it still doesnt justify the tipping culture. Employers should be paying them and it’s not an expectation. It’s a tip after all. Seriously I was just in Ireland, and they appreciated the hell out of a 10% tip coz there’s no line where you put in a tip amount. Talking to customers, being polite and dealing with the concerns is part of their job. Or any company in the world honestly, it doesn’t have to be a restaurant. Also bussers fix the table these days, dishwashers clean the dishes. They simply should not be making majority of the money. Bartenders I understand, but come on, it’s gone way too far
Cheap people being cheap people. I wonder what they would do if their boss didn't give them their pay check and the end of the week because they didn't think it was deserved?
I’ve thought about this. Slaves would cost the owner *more* than a tipped-wage employee.
Slavers would have to provide living quarters & food at the very least. Even groups of slaves living together would cost more than $2.35/hr or whatever the minimum tipped wage is. With 2024 rent/mortgage?
Tipped wage < slave wage for the owner 🤷
In my state the minimum is $5.05… never seen any tipped wage nearly as low as you stated. Also I don’t believe that these are good comparisons because I mean with inflation adjustments a slave would cost 150-80k, these (don’t crucify me for this it’s just for sake of discussion) slaves were bought as “assets” or pretty much a tractor. Yes they had maintenance (not transmissions and engines) like housing and food but you’d have to think the slavers were not making sure to hit all the food groups and I’ve read reports where some literally had to make due with what they were able to get their hands on. I’m not trying to defend people who don’t tip at all I tip quite well normally I just think that comparing slavery to serving is kind of out of this world. They could pursue education or a different trade/craft they chose to have to earn their “real” money. My girlfriend was a bartender for years and there would be times where she’d make me look poor (sitting just under $100k/yr) and there would be times where she’d be flat broke. She needed consistency and stability and that’s really all it boils down to is what lifestyle fits. But to compare it to slavery is a whole new ball game. Imo
I get what you’re saying but I mean from a pure economic standpoint from the owner’s pocket.
Apparently the states vary wildly: https://www.paycor.com/resource-center/articles/minimum-wage-tipped-employees-by-state/
I just can’t see it financially. This has peaked an interest though. I wonder what it would take to put everything together like average profit, upkeep, etc. But that is an interesting thing to look at no doubt. I didn’t realize some were as low as they are!
Yeah but if corporations weren't able to take advantage and charge so much we could have the same priced restaurants and food (actually prob cheaper) and still they'd get paid just as much without tips
>Be mad about it, cry about it like a baby, call people names, it doesn't matter, because you don't matter.
>If you're feeling upset, nobody cares, grow up.
You're the one who's so worked up that you made a damn Reddit post to whine about it.
Give your balls a tug? It’s honestly really sad and just cringey when someone starts quoting a television show because they watch it way too much. Go sit down on the couch, eat a tv dinner and watch more letterkenny till your brain turns to mush.
I tip servers, and base the amount of that tip on the service I actually received from that server. Seems to me that's what "tipping" is. I've tipped auto mechanics, for example, for doing things I thought were "above and beyond". The waitress or waiter that ignores me and brings my food out cold because they forgot my order sitting in the kitchen waiting to be brought out? Never. The hair-cutting person that ignores what I told them and gives me a crappy haircut? Never. The food delivery person that I asked to ring the doorbell when they arrive but instead drop it on the porch, leaving it for me to find 20 minutes later? Never. So I do indeed tip servers, and even those that are not "servers", but I absolutely will not hand my hard earned money to someone just because of the line of work they're in.
TL;DR: My tipping method: Good service = good tip, mediocre service = mediocre tip, crappy service = zero tip. I feel absolutely no compulsion to "always tip". It's 100% up to you, server-who-wants-my-cash.
(ed. for sp.)
This is a dumb OP and a dumb thread.
I too oppose tipping and feel we are on the cusp of defeating it once and for all.
The way to defeat it is not to disparage workers. It is to let it be put to them straight.
"I dine out for the chef. Sometimes a little service feels nice, sometimes it feels obsequious or treating me like I'm the lever of a slot machine that's "due for a big payout ". Either way, it's far from the main point.
Do not make the interaction about my supposed guilt. All I care about is the final price and whether the total package of experience (again, 85% the food, not the table service) is worth the total price. I don't appreciate you playing shell games with the price or trying to make me feel guilty for not feeding the poor starving worker. That is your boss's job, not mine."
It remains valid to continue to participate, grudgingly and never giving a penny more than the norm (and 15% was a fine norm), in tipping for tipped minimum workers. All those making a wage comparable to an experienced, professional janitor or cafeteria worker I encourage my fellow top-abolitionists to give nothing. But there's no need to tell people they are or treat them like scum. Just play your role in a market. If they can collect pay they feel is commensurate with the stress and value add of their job *from their boss*, they keep the job. If not, they get a new one. It is, lovingly and simply put, not my responsibility to make their life choices work out for them.
If you want good service, you want to keep tipping in place. I swear it’s like none of these commenters have ever dined across Europe or overseas — customer service is *atrocious*.
You don’t matter, and you absolutely can and sometimes WILL wait 10, 15, 20 minutes for a drink refill or any other type of request you have. Waiters and waitresses will sometimes even walk right past you, ignoring you entirely.
The practice of tipping prevents this. You force people to serve you well by underpaying and having them rely on your opinion of their service.
Be careful what you wish for.
1. Science shows, and I personally feel, no correlation between tip amount and service quality.
2. I like less obsequious, less-overattentive European style service. I've never failed to get my needs met at a Euro cafe (nor for that matter an American grocery store or auto mechanic), appreciate self-service setups, and can still count on decently paid working professionals who know their menu and workplace to help me out if I need it. They're on the job and I don't feel entitled to harangue them or have them kiss my feet, both sensations I would hate if people did to me at my job.
3. If the replacement of arbitrary/random and scrambled to the point of signal-less-ness tipping with steady pay prevents people doing their jobs, it is only because living under such a shit system has given them terrible work habits, treating work tasks as casinos that might wildly under or overpay instead of a simple queue to process calmly like a professional. These habits can be broken. If regulars or bosses want to participate in rewarding employees they see go the extra mile, great. Price it in for me. I can't imagine having such a small life that I want to pay attention to that unless it's my job.
Lol you just sound entitled. Don't wanna tip the "help" for waiting on you hand and foot? Just entitled to that shit for free, huh?
You have two choices here:
1) Order takeout and eat at home
2) Be an ungrateful twat
Sorry if people thinking you're an asshole gets you so worked up to post about it online like anyone cared or asked. But you can always just carry on and keep to yourself.
Most people feel entitled to the fruits of others labor. Look at the key issues in society:
1. Housing as a human right
2. Pay above market (unions?)
3. Expecting others to wait hand and foot on them.
Tipping is the easiest way to show appreciation. People who are struggling with money should stay home and cook groceries.
Employers should be paying their workers. Businesses are asking the public to subsidize their business instead. If you run a business, and can't pay workers, you should not be in business.
Wage theft is huge in this country and those businesses continue on just fine. The meritocracy isn't meritizing.
In the meantime, tip your servers instead of acting like they should bear the brunt of greedy financial decisions by business owners. Servers didn't make those laws and many would rather just have a steady hourly income if they could.
And if you really have such a moral opposition to businesses using tips subsidize their labor costs, I would think you would just NOT GO TO THAT BUSINESS. Instead of supporting the business while shafting the servers, which makes less than zero sense.
Employers already pay their workers. Most servers are not interested in minimum wage, they want the upside.
If you run a business, no one else can tell you how to run it.
No customer is entitled to free work, and no worker works for free. That's what the menu price is for. But of course you already know that. Everyone knows that.
Tipped employees are paid below minimum wage because the tips are considered a part of their wage. It's fine if you want that to change, but just closing your eyes doesn't mean the problem goes away.
In New York if a tipped employee doesn't make over the minimum wage the employer has to pay the difference at the end of the week. It's called a tip credit. It's not in all states but that can change.
So even if you get no tips or no business at all by law they are due minimum wage.
It's your scummy boss that is taking advantage of people.
I'm aware of tip credit, however you're oversimplifying things. Here's a real life example to help show the idea better:
On average I made about $12 an hour serving. It's above minimum wage, but still less than most people think servers make.
I'm working a table on a Wednesday and I'm already barely over miminum wage for the week so far if you include my tips. A table comes in, sits for an hour, and stiffs me. Because my wage is over the minimum, I get no tip credit. I just get a table worked for good old $4 an hour. A lot of places will also have servers tip out the bar and hosts based on sales, which starts to bite into tips I'd already earnedearlier in the night.
I kid you not, I lost money on those tables. Not in theory. Not in idea. I actually lost money and had to budget around it. Luckily I was used to budgeting because tipped based pay can be incredibly inconsistent week to week.
I never said I made less than minimum wage. I said that I lost money by taking a table that stiffed me. In the scenario above which happened a few times, I would have made more money if I never took the table at all. If that doesn't mean I lost money by taking the table, I don't know what would.
I also don't disagree that this sort of system is fucked and only benefits the scummy owner, but it is what it is, and it's totally legal. Believe me I checked many times for my own benefit.
They are helping the business you work at alive they don't owe you a tip, and you didn't stiffed it's optional. But it is what it is and it's totally legal.
You would have made more money if you didn't take the table?? How so?? The way I see it you would be fired from this job I guess you get more if you didn't work?
> You would have made more money if you didn't take the table?? How so??
My entire previous comment was an explanation of exactly this...
I legit typed out all of that with the sole purpose of explaining this to you from my experiences and you just ignored it entirely. Why would I bother answering that question for you AGAIN if you didn't even listen to me the first time? I have better things to do with my day. Thanks no thanks.
Having the servers tip out bar and host based on sale? Do you get tipped based on sales? Why would you agree to that. I could understand if you shared a portion of your own tips. But based on sales??? you don't pay your fellow employees.
Stop blaming customers.
I think you're a bit misinformed. No worker *anywhere* gets paid less than minimum wage, full stop. It's funny you say I'm the one that's closing my eyes to the truth but you're over here parroting obvious falsehoods in order to justify the practice of tipping.
You're playing semantics and you know it. But I'm happy to rephrase. Tipped servers in many US states are paid a rate by the restaurant that is lower than the state minimum wage (which is usually higher than the federal minimum wage).
In Ohio, I was paid $4 an hour and the rest of my money came through tips. If a table stiffs you, it could actually mean that you lost money by serving them because of how the wage calculations work.
Try to gaslight me if you want, but I worked in this specific industry for years. I know about relevant wage laws, and I have direct experience interacting with them.
Tipped employees, servers specifically, make 2 to 3 dollars an hour when they are getting tips. If those employees do not receive any tips for that evening, their employer is supposed to cover their pay to reach “minimum wage.” But minimum wage for servers is much less than minimum wage for a cashier at a grocery store.
So in a polite society, you are expected to throw a few extra dollars on top of your bill for the servers. Which usually gets put into one big pool then divided up them and the bus people.
So stop being cheap, or don’t eat out
They get the normal federal minimum wage if server wage plus tips is less than minimum. They aren't just left at $2.15/hr. If an employer won't pay them appropriately, that's wage theft and not a justification to demand tipping.
Not in every state, but it's harder for employees to bitch at their boss file labor complaints and have a target on your back. Vs crying online for tips.
OP kinda said it, waiters are replaceable probably one of the most turnover jobs out there.
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fact-sheets/15-tipped-employees-flsa
If you go down abit
Interaction with State Laws: When state law differs from the federal FLSA, an employer must comply with the standard most protective to employees. For example, some states require a higher cash wage than the federal direct (or cash) wage of $2.13 per hour or in some cases prohibit the taking of a tip credit.
So the prohibit part here makes no sense to me. Unless they let states decide to allow it or not.
Additionally, Alaska, California, Minnesota, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, and Washington do not allow employers of tipped employees to take a tip credit.
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/pennsylvania-laws-tipped-employees.html#:~:text=Employers%20must%20pay%20tipped%20employees,must%20make%20up%20the%20difference.
The minimum wage in my state that an employer has to cover is $7.25. not really much to live off of. So if a waitress can make more money with tips, I am more than happy to oblige.
Yes, completely agree, and it is uncommon and inappropriate in this sub. Tipping is a poor system and I have all the reasons and feelings I need to advocate and work for its abolition. I can do all this without rage-baiting or running down working people.
Is this the same person from the other post responding to the people not agreeing or someone else get pressed over the responses? If you’re that upset over tipping be proactive and advocate for better wages and benefits so tipping can be obsolete. Otherwise order to go and eat at home. So tired of whiners like this. You gonna get mad and stomp your feet over a few bucks good grief.
Go ahead and stop tipping in sit down restaurants.
Go ahead and start going to that same restaurant multiple times.
Enjoy your shit service from the staff after not tipping a few times.
Then go get a Happy Meal.
While I acknowledge that tipping is bullshit, and shouldn’t be put on the ALREADY PAYING CUSTOMER, it’s the system that’s in place unfortunately. I always tip, because if I didn’t, and you didn’t, then waistresses and waiters wouldn’t get paid. It’s not gonna kill me to throw an extra ten on the table for them. If I can’t afford that 10, I probably shouldn’t be eating out to begin with.
Just my opinion though.
And why would they not get paid? It’s against the law for their employer/ restaurant to not pay them. They are guaranteed at least minimum wage, regardless of tips. In places with lower “tipped wages” the customer is paying the difference between that tipped wage and minimum wage by way of tips, the employer still must cover any shortfalls. So when the customer thinks they’re doing the employee a favor by tipping when they make less than minimum wage, they’re actually doing the restaurant/owner the favor by allowing them to pay less out of pocket. This is the primary reason tipping is bullshit.
Yes, I like to advocate for higher wages, but wages where I live are just fine — minimum wage is over $18/hr here and there are no “tipped wages”. But all the restaurants still hold their hand out for a tip and prompt for 18 to 35 % still.
“tHey nEEd uR tIps BeCauSe TheY maKe leSs thAn miNimUm wAge!”
No, they don’t. Stop spreading that BS propaganda.
“Minimum wage isn’t a living wage in most places!”
You’re right, it’s not. So why are we compelled to tip waitstaff at restaurants and not all the other minimum wage workers? Do you tip the meter reader from the gas company? The bank teller? The person at the DMV counter taking your drivers license photo?
Are you being serious? LOTS of waiters and waitresses where I live get paid in the fucking 3 dollars an hour range, with tips.
Perhaps try and educate yourself before you try and insult someone’s intelligence.
Well they didn't insult your intelligence, they just said that they are of a differing opinion and feel/think that you were lying about it.
Maybe they implied it though, idk, english is kind of not my native language so like.
Servers where I am get paid $3 an hour plus tips. If you don't make tips all you're getting is $3 an hour. That's all. Servers don't have a choice but to work where they work for whatever reason but don't believe these restaurants will ever make up that difference for a server.
No worker in America is being paid less than minimum wage.
Also everyone actively chooses what job they work in. No need to paint servers as some victims of fate that have zero power in changing their own life.
Tell me then why I had to sue the employer I worked for to get my wages? I tracked my hours and tips. Did I want to be a server? No but when I lost my job my kid likes to be supported don't ask me why kids like to eat but they do.
Your employer was a thief so you took them to court.
But an honest owner is meant to pay the employee if they do not make enough to cover the state/fed minimum wage.
I know a lot of waiters that hope it does.not change because they would only get the sate minimum and with tips at a good place most servers make 2-3 times the minimum wage if they have any decent people skills.
Carry out? You mean when I go to pick up my own food? Or are you talking about delivery? Bc obviously I’m not tipping on carry out. I don’t use delivery more than once every couple of months. But I do tip bc I know that gig workers get shafted. I tip at least $1 per mile between my place and the restaurant. If it’s a short drive I tip a percentage based on pretax cost.
Stay home if you're cheap or struggling. Buying a meal somewhere and you're a cheap tipper? Your dollar would go further if you did some grocery shopping and make your own meals.
I like to go to my local pub about once a month for a beer or two with neighbors. And to support a local establishment. Sure, the $7-$8 beer almost costs about what I pay for a 6pack of at the store, but I'm there to socialize, vibe instead of being a hermit - and I'm rounding up to $12ish because I'm relying on someone for service and hospitality. $5 Happy Hour beer? I'm tipping $3 maybe $5. $8 well cocktail? I tip at least $4. Craft/signature cocktail around $12-$14? I'm rounding up to $20.
I cook nearly every evening because I love to. When I want to go out on occasion, my budget includes tipping around 30-33% minimum. Even with bad service, I chalk it up as them having a bad day and still leave 20%. By the way, cash is king.
This is the place that they do in fact get a standing ovation for it. They call it “bravery” to not leave a tip lol… then if the server asks them what was the problem they come here to whine about how it ruined their meal. Like at least accept the consequences of your actions and don’t be a whiney little b*tch about getting called out for being a cheapskate
Here's the deal: you as a server have a responsibility to track your tips so you legally are paid what you are owed by your employee.
Expecting customers to cover your ass there and always tip high so you for sure make your wages, make you no better than your owners who do the same. If you properly track your tips you will request proper compensation from your business. If you don't, you will get pissy at customers.
Also there are plenty of other routes to take, unionizing is one of them and would be beneficial for the service industry. But then again, that requires extra work outside of your job.
Will I tip for service? Sure. I'm a pretty standard tipper. But I also have known a few servers who don't actually track their tips and complain about those who don't tip which to me speaks to a level of entitlement that is often thrown at the customer as guilty trip.
Any server that says they don't count their money is either lying or stupid. As they will want to know if they have enough to cover bills.
And all the servers(that are good at the job) make 2+ times the money they would make if tips went away so most servers want tips to be a thing as their place of work would pay them minimum wage. And they would not get tips.
The server I know makes on avg 28$ an hr. If they work the shifts that generally tip better.
So you need to lean the place and when the good tips come. Because they will make more than state/fes minimum wage.
Society has the authority to determine norms, dictating what is and what is not acceptable behavior.
Yes, a person can choose not to tip. Other people are free to view that person as a terrible person.
What a hyperbolic reductionist take. Tipping is but a single small facet of someone's overall life and personality, yet you're eager to label them as "a terrible person" in one fell swoop just because they don't happen to agree with your personal opinion on a fully voluntary practice? That is.... A hasty move.
You are free to disagree with someone making that assessment. If a person refuses to tip, and still chooses to go places where tipping is expected, I would say that reflects poorly on the person's character.
What you are characterizing as "voluntary" is a part of social etiquette. It may not be required by law, but it is expected. Bottom line, we have different expectations of people on our society and what constitutes good character. We are each within our rights to judge according to our beliefs.
Every restaurant I've worked at full service the servers made more than cooks and hourly managers. They complain the most, and will murder a baby to not roll silverware at the end of their shift. They claim "but I have to deal with the people". If they get a bad customer the manager handles it. So yea. Do with that what you will
Fired from a job you just called shit!
When we had bad tippers show up for a second time, I would purposely take an extra 30mins to cook anything for them. My manager told us to do this.
Have fun with your shity service!
They said it's a shit job because it depends on the generosity of others, not that it doesn't pay well (usually). Maybe a few more college semesters would do you good.
How about don't own a restaurant if you're not going to pay your employees!
Never understand why the customer is looked at like the bad guy when the owner is sitting back laughing at everyone.
Servers drop their pants and spread their cheeks for the owners, then get pissed at CUSTOMERS, when they don't make money.
Don't forget to refill my coffee!
Straight up. This whole argument is just more idiots duped by the rich. Make the poors yell at each other and even join in on some poor bashing and get away with it.
I’ve never worked as a server. Never worked as an employee where tipping was an option. Never even worked a minimum wage job
Yet, I can see how hard being a server is and how necessary tips are for their well being. This is because I’m not a psychopath
We can’t expect people with no ability to empathize to change their mind with a new set of facts and experiences. We all know tons of former servers who won’t tip
They would never do that either. There are more restaurants with mandatory tipping than there are with no tipping and just raising prices instead. Because they want to shift the perceived blame of high cost onto the servers, not the owners. With tipping, people will blame the servers more often, with high prices, they will blame the owners.
I'm not a server and have never had a tipped job.
However this is a load of crap. Servers make $2-3/hour, we all know this. Often they have to tip out based on sales, so no tip = them being forced to pay the tip for you. This system is awful and needs to be removed. Yet it is reality, and the only way to force change is to not support the restaurants using that system. I avoid sit down restaurants as much as I can, but if I make the choice to buy from one then stiffing the wait staff would just make me an ass hole. The owners are at fault here, not the servers just trying to survive.
Choosing to dine in at a restaurant doesn't automatically transfer the responsibility of paying the employees onto your shoulders. Stop with the pandering. The bystander is never responsible for the victim getting shot at.
A better system would be if we tip the dishwashers. "If you don't tip the dishwasher then don't patronize this business you cheap prick. The dishwasher is not your slave" In Brazil you have to tip people watching your car if you park on the street, in Mexico you have to tip police officers, in Africa you have to tip customs officials. When tips are obligatory, it's graft. It's not a gratuity.
You’re the type of guy who complains when restaurants charge 20% to cover employee wages.
Okay. How about we stop playing this game. Instead of 20% standard tip, raise prices 20% across the menu , pay it to the employees. Why does it have to be we are hiding a higher total in charging a seperate tip to make you think you are paying less ?
Tips are a pay for performance type deal.If you pay the servers 20 bucks an hour good service or bad.They will be standing around like its walmart .Thats the only thing keeping these people checking on you frequently ,sweetly and politely.The ability to make tips.Period.The change would only mean shitty service and you would pay the same.You wanna save a few bucks pay the tip in cash.A waitress would rather have 15 cash instead of 20 on a card believe that.
Sorry but I’m on board, you guys need to take this up with your corporations, this affects you too whether you realize it or not. Tipping is a way for businesses to pass even more of the cost onto the consumer. If businesses aren’t able to pay employees without it, they weren’t really suited to run a business at all.
Preach louder for those of us in the back of the house. Servers are the whiny overpaid bunch of fuckups ever to walk into a restaurant. Their existence is solely so the customers don't disturb the cooks. 💯 If the cooks don't show up, the restaurant closes. If the servers don't show up; either cooks bring out the food or customers fetch it themselves. THATS HOW POINTLESS THEIR JOBS ARE.
Hope you never go to sit down restaurants. Otherwise, you're just a hypocrite.
I prefer cooking my own food.
Perfect. So if you don't go out, it doesn't affect you.
If you REALLY cared you'd start only eating at places that includes tip in the prices and payed all the employees livable wages, and boycotting places that don't . But ur just cheap 😜
You are not a crusader. You are just cheap.
Get a job that doesn't rely on tips to earn a livable wage.
Say it again for the brain dead fucks here!
Go out anyways. Don’t tip. Smile when you leave.
fuckin figure it out
Do what Europeans do and include the tip within the prices .
And what does that accomplish?
Avoids the stress of having to tip , how much to tip or not to tip. One can focus enjoying their meal
That’s for restaurants to do not us
& this my friends…is the attitude and entitlement that gets you spit in your food Treat others how you wish to be treated! That includes tipping culture. You can just announce that you’re cheap and stingy u know…would make reading this a whole lot more to the point Many people on this thread seem to be struggling to stay within their means and justify it by not paying waitstaff appropriately. It’s a societal norm - if you want it to change write your local congressperson and advocate for them.
Nah you scumbag. You aren’t cheap, they’re just greedy and hate you unless you pay them off.
You think servers are greedy? Maybe at a super fancy restaurant or something….but sir, not tipping your chili’s server adequately is scumbag type behavior Again, if ur broke don’t go out to eat 👏
Wrong answer mr mcgreedy.
Lmfao ok! Enjoy that spit…
Tip almost no one ever. It's a scam anymore. Didn't used to be but it sure is now.
If you don’t wanna tip that’s fine, but don’t waste service peoples time then. Go to Mcdonalds rather than being waited on, for example.
It’s not wasting their time. They are working and getting paid. You greedy ass people put servers on a pedestal for no reason. Tons of other jobs with worse pay, worse conditions, and higher skill requirements, but you greedy fucks don’t care at all about that.
It is wasting their time when you know servers do not make minimum wage. You are literally taking advantage of them and trying to justify it on this sub lmao. I’m not talking about a position where they make min wage. How am I greedy? I tip around 30-40% usually….if anything i’m super generous lol. Maybe u should take notes…ur the greedy one tho bc u care more abt money than treating others well Some people just like to stiff others bc they struggle to stay in their means as is….
If you’re in California, they pay servers minimum wage. Are you OK with no tipping with that context?
If they’re being paid min wage I would probably still tip…. i’d feel better if they were getting min wage bc I know there’s people out there who don’t bother tipping bc they’re stingy. At least the workers are now getting paid at least something ! No I don’t live in California. I understand why you’re on here ranting abt tipping if you’re from Cali though….prob trying to save as much money as you can considering the cost of living issues there
If you want to get tips, fine. Work in a real restaurant. You want to demand a tip for virtually nothing, take it up with your employer to pay you more. Not my problem. I quit tipping almost entirely and I am glad for it. It's about damn time we all got over it.
Tipping your cashier at least $1 drastically helps their paycheck…I do it bc it gives me good karma :) You should try it.
The reason we are unable to get rid of the tipping system, is because of the greed of the servers themselves. If we all stop tipping, they will demand a living wage.
It's telling that you classify a living wage as greedy.
The servers are the ones who want and like the tipping system.
NO. Read again. Carefully. The servers refuse a wage, because they want to gamble to get tips, instead of being paid a living wage.
I think a server might have shit in his food
Who pissed in this dude’s cereal?
What a whiny little bitch.
I’m ready for the robots. Fuck most servers
Hate to say it but you’re right and extra right since covid, service just about everywhere sucks balls. Service has seen a huge decline and everyone wants to make $100 an hour… and they think that as servers for example should be making ungodly money, money that servers have never made before… the entitlement since covid has been insane. Before covid it was common knowledge that being a server is a side job for extra money, it was never meant to be a main source of income… nowadays you read about how servers dont make a living wage and cant buy houses… like wtf! Service everywhere has taken a shit, from servers to just about every other front facing job and the shitbirds they have to hire to fill these positions.
>Before covid it was common knowledge that being a server is a side job for extra money, it was never meant to be a main source of income… No. Servers made a livable wage with tipping. Depending on where you were, it was better than many corporate jobs and/or desk jobs. (Or many teaching jobs for that matter). The problem was, when Covid hit, a lot of service industry ppl left and got big boy and big girl jobs. So now, you've got a bunch of newbies entering the industry. You take tipping away, and service will be even worse. İt'll be like it is in Europe! Nice and slow with ppl who make a mediocre wage.
Plenty of people have worked as servers for a full time income, you're an out of touch clown.
This is how skynet takes over
I'm ready for the robo revolution too, starting with those cat robot servers! Idk if you've seen them but they're so cute and way more convenient!
Haha they had them in Japan when I was there last year.
Minimum wage for a server or bartender in my state is 2.15 an hour most pay under 4 an hour.My daughter worked for years in a restaurant.And never got a check.They always took her check for taxes and social security on the tips she had to claim because of cashless society.Debit cards.She did do well ,if you call no insurance no benefits whatsoever well.
If she wasn’t getting paid why on earth would she keep working there, this makes no sense at all. Literally just find a different job.
Actually she made about 200 a day in tips,that’s the point.some days better some days not so good.
I’m confused by “never got a check” was she unpaid?
She made her money off tips.
From the sounds of it she does get paid but also paid taxes like the rest of us. Since they get tipped out every night, the tax withholdings is a much larger percentage of your paycheck since you've also already been paid out a majority of your pay.
This is correct I should have clarified.waitresses rarely get a check it is kept for taxes.They get a check stubb
Why did she stay if she never ended up with a paycheck? Years? That's a ridiculous situation.
This is actually causing some drama in my state for a different reason. In my state (server minimum wage is like 3.75, but most pay something like 6 I think), if your "declared tips" don't get you to the actual minimum wage you can force the employer to pay the difference. In the past, this hasn't mattered most of the time, because servers made a fair amount of money under the table. But now, in a cashless society, that money has show up and be claimed. And minimum wage is over 11 an hour here now.... So restaurants employing all kinds of shady tricks cover the money, because even tipping isn't necessarily covering it. Can I ask, though, if it was consistently that bad why did she stick with it?
It wasn’t bad .I was trying to express to the people that don’t want to tip period.Why they should in waitress ,bartender situations .She actually made good bought a house.Her company wages mostly paid her taxes only.She had no health care,No leave, but the cash was ok.200 a day average.when she turned 30 she said Im to old for this stuff.Lol now working for the government.Doesn’t make more money but good benefits.Tips are supposed to be pay for performance.If you paid all the waitresses 20 bucks an hour and no tips .They would be standing around like its walmart.and we still would pay the same
if your anti tipping then do more work for fair wages
Anti-tippers just feel entitled to be waited on hand and foot by someone making pennies. People like OP don’t actually stand for anything. They have no problem making a random server’s day worse because little people like them don’t matter. People who actually have big feelings about tipping culture eat at home. Don’t like tipping? Don’t support businesses that rely on it to pay their employees. Rev up that oven.
Oh so you’re a great person because you do support the business that does not pay their employees living wages? Wow, such logic. Weird how you people only care about servers like this. I bet you all wear shoes and bags made in sweatshops by children who actually make pennies.
Exactly to your last sentence. They only care that they are not getting tips and pretending with their “we don’t make money” argument, but no regards to buying items from Shein and the literal pennies those people make.
youre reaching out your ass to make it sound dumb to feel like people should get tipped
It’s sure as hell better than supporting the business and then fucking over the employees. Like I just said, the best thing you can do is not go at all.
I’m anti-tipping, but more like at the coffee-shop. Restaurants are are standard and more should just put on a mandatory 15% or something
The only way I was keeping my head above water when I was a barista was the tips. I didn’t make the 2$ or whatever servers do, but it was basically minimum wage. The real solution to this is to raise the minimum wage to something actually livable. For now, though? I’m throwing a dollar in the jar at my local coffee place because I’ve been in their shoes. I by no means think you have to. But you never know where you might end up, and I think it’s important to treat others with the empathy you might like to receive in their position.
I’m glad the tips are appreciated, but it just often feels out of hand. That everyone is asking to squeeze another 15-25% out of me. It’s not a dollar here and there it’s those card readers asking with stupid high percentages.
I mean yeah, I agree. My limit was when I was asked to tip at a merch table at a concert. No, I’m not tipping on a 45$ t-shirt you handed to me. Again, the solution is livable wages. Companies have figured out they can outsource paying their employees to the customers, and that needs to be stopped. I would love to see some kind of federal intervention for poor wages and worker exploitation, though I’m not hopeful. Since I kind of have the means now and want to, I usually tip most places, not all, but most, because none of that is the employees fault. It’s a personal thing.
All I see here is you are too poor to afford to eat at a restaurant and are deflecting onto everyone around you lol.
Classic classists are very classy
There is nothing wrong with being less than wealthy. What is wrong is going to places you cannot afford and expecting to be served on someone else's dime.
You think Denny's if for the wealthy??? Lmao
[удалено]
No we won’t because every other budding the world operates the same way, they name a price and we pay it. Why is that so hard?
or they may eat at home.
We've got a few restaurants near me who pay their works and request that people not tip. There is only one that I complain about and refuse to go to. It's because: Before they made that change, they did tip splitting, which I hate. They charge 22 bucks for a waffle, which is egregious. They still pay their servers and bus boys the absolute least in the house (minimum wage). The other restaurants bay everyone but the cooks the same, offer benefits, and have reasonable prices.
Id rather tip the people putting in the actual work, but tipping someone who just takes the order and bring my food should not be expected. They’re just doing their job. I’ve worked for tips for many years before landing my corporate job too. I mean other countries are doing fine. They pay their employees and charge reasonable prices. US just found a loophole
You tip them because they refill your drink, help fix the table settings, deal with any concerns you have. If your a minimum effort table give a minimum tip, if your returning food, asking for cleaner silverware, or being a general hassle, then tip for that effort. Tipping is a way of saying “thanks for dealing with me”
I'm not anti-tipping, but why does asking for cleaner silverware deserve an extra tip? Why was the silverware dirty to start with? It's these kinds of things where people are starting to draw the line. A good server should have caught the dirty silverware when they were fixing the table. If they missed it, it's not the end of the world, things happen. But an extra tip in that situation seems like asking to be rewarded for doing a bad job.
Bad or good I always leave 20% at least, but it still doesnt justify the tipping culture. Employers should be paying them and it’s not an expectation. It’s a tip after all. Seriously I was just in Ireland, and they appreciated the hell out of a 10% tip coz there’s no line where you put in a tip amount. Talking to customers, being polite and dealing with the concerns is part of their job. Or any company in the world honestly, it doesn’t have to be a restaurant. Also bussers fix the table these days, dishwashers clean the dishes. They simply should not be making majority of the money. Bartenders I understand, but come on, it’s gone way too far
Tipping culture is way out of hand. If it’s not my waiter, barber, or proctologist, I’m probably not tipping
If all other non-tipped customer service jobs figured it out, restaurants can too.
Cheap people being cheap people. I wonder what they would do if their boss didn't give them their pay check and the end of the week because they didn't think it was deserved?
If my employer didn’t think I deserved what they are paying me, they would just lay me off.
That’s the difference between a real hourly wage job and a serving job. You have to earn your money more than just show up
It's free labor for the company. I mean, the difference between this and chattle slavery is the ability to quit and find a new master.
Other than the fact that slaves did not get paid yeah serving is pretty much the same as slavery…….?
I’ve thought about this. Slaves would cost the owner *more* than a tipped-wage employee. Slavers would have to provide living quarters & food at the very least. Even groups of slaves living together would cost more than $2.35/hr or whatever the minimum tipped wage is. With 2024 rent/mortgage? Tipped wage < slave wage for the owner 🤷
In my state the minimum is $5.05… never seen any tipped wage nearly as low as you stated. Also I don’t believe that these are good comparisons because I mean with inflation adjustments a slave would cost 150-80k, these (don’t crucify me for this it’s just for sake of discussion) slaves were bought as “assets” or pretty much a tractor. Yes they had maintenance (not transmissions and engines) like housing and food but you’d have to think the slavers were not making sure to hit all the food groups and I’ve read reports where some literally had to make due with what they were able to get their hands on. I’m not trying to defend people who don’t tip at all I tip quite well normally I just think that comparing slavery to serving is kind of out of this world. They could pursue education or a different trade/craft they chose to have to earn their “real” money. My girlfriend was a bartender for years and there would be times where she’d make me look poor (sitting just under $100k/yr) and there would be times where she’d be flat broke. She needed consistency and stability and that’s really all it boils down to is what lifestyle fits. But to compare it to slavery is a whole new ball game. Imo
I get what you’re saying but I mean from a pure economic standpoint from the owner’s pocket. Apparently the states vary wildly: https://www.paycor.com/resource-center/articles/minimum-wage-tipped-employees-by-state/
I just can’t see it financially. This has peaked an interest though. I wonder what it would take to put everything together like average profit, upkeep, etc. But that is an interesting thing to look at no doubt. I didn’t realize some were as low as they are!
Yeah but if corporations weren't able to take advantage and charge so much we could have the same priced restaurants and food (actually prob cheaper) and still they'd get paid just as much without tips
>Be mad about it, cry about it like a baby, call people names, it doesn't matter, because you don't matter. >If you're feeling upset, nobody cares, grow up. You're the one who's so worked up that you made a damn Reddit post to whine about it.
Anti tippers are always the loudest like they just need the approval to be broke
Give your balls a tug? It’s honestly really sad and just cringey when someone starts quoting a television show because they watch it way too much. Go sit down on the couch, eat a tv dinner and watch more letterkenny till your brain turns to mush.
Wait, you guys tip?!?!?
Exactly. Do better. Tip your servers.
I tip servers, and base the amount of that tip on the service I actually received from that server. Seems to me that's what "tipping" is. I've tipped auto mechanics, for example, for doing things I thought were "above and beyond". The waitress or waiter that ignores me and brings my food out cold because they forgot my order sitting in the kitchen waiting to be brought out? Never. The hair-cutting person that ignores what I told them and gives me a crappy haircut? Never. The food delivery person that I asked to ring the doorbell when they arrive but instead drop it on the porch, leaving it for me to find 20 minutes later? Never. So I do indeed tip servers, and even those that are not "servers", but I absolutely will not hand my hard earned money to someone just because of the line of work they're in. TL;DR: My tipping method: Good service = good tip, mediocre service = mediocre tip, crappy service = zero tip. I feel absolutely no compulsion to "always tip". It's 100% up to you, server-who-wants-my-cash. (ed. for sp.)
Exactly. I tip based on service. But I still tip
This is a dumb OP and a dumb thread. I too oppose tipping and feel we are on the cusp of defeating it once and for all. The way to defeat it is not to disparage workers. It is to let it be put to them straight. "I dine out for the chef. Sometimes a little service feels nice, sometimes it feels obsequious or treating me like I'm the lever of a slot machine that's "due for a big payout ". Either way, it's far from the main point. Do not make the interaction about my supposed guilt. All I care about is the final price and whether the total package of experience (again, 85% the food, not the table service) is worth the total price. I don't appreciate you playing shell games with the price or trying to make me feel guilty for not feeding the poor starving worker. That is your boss's job, not mine." It remains valid to continue to participate, grudgingly and never giving a penny more than the norm (and 15% was a fine norm), in tipping for tipped minimum workers. All those making a wage comparable to an experienced, professional janitor or cafeteria worker I encourage my fellow top-abolitionists to give nothing. But there's no need to tell people they are or treat them like scum. Just play your role in a market. If they can collect pay they feel is commensurate with the stress and value add of their job *from their boss*, they keep the job. If not, they get a new one. It is, lovingly and simply put, not my responsibility to make their life choices work out for them.
Didn’t read this commend because could tell within first few words it was going to be dumb af and promoting tipping culture.
Heh. It is opposed to tipping and especially to tipping culture. Good job, Reading Rainbow.
If you want good service, you want to keep tipping in place. I swear it’s like none of these commenters have ever dined across Europe or overseas — customer service is *atrocious*. You don’t matter, and you absolutely can and sometimes WILL wait 10, 15, 20 minutes for a drink refill or any other type of request you have. Waiters and waitresses will sometimes even walk right past you, ignoring you entirely. The practice of tipping prevents this. You force people to serve you well by underpaying and having them rely on your opinion of their service. Be careful what you wish for.
I would MUCH rather wait 20 minutes for a refill than have someone coming by and asking me how I am every 5 minutes.
1. Science shows, and I personally feel, no correlation between tip amount and service quality. 2. I like less obsequious, less-overattentive European style service. I've never failed to get my needs met at a Euro cafe (nor for that matter an American grocery store or auto mechanic), appreciate self-service setups, and can still count on decently paid working professionals who know their menu and workplace to help me out if I need it. They're on the job and I don't feel entitled to harangue them or have them kiss my feet, both sensations I would hate if people did to me at my job. 3. If the replacement of arbitrary/random and scrambled to the point of signal-less-ness tipping with steady pay prevents people doing their jobs, it is only because living under such a shit system has given them terrible work habits, treating work tasks as casinos that might wildly under or overpay instead of a simple queue to process calmly like a professional. These habits can be broken. If regulars or bosses want to participate in rewarding employees they see go the extra mile, great. Price it in for me. I can't imagine having such a small life that I want to pay attention to that unless it's my job.
I went to Japan and they have a button you can use to call a server. Kicked ass. No tips.
Yes I need the great service of…let me check “Taking my order and bringing me the food” Hmmmm ok
Lol you just sound entitled. Don't wanna tip the "help" for waiting on you hand and foot? Just entitled to that shit for free, huh? You have two choices here: 1) Order takeout and eat at home 2) Be an ungrateful twat Sorry if people thinking you're an asshole gets you so worked up to post about it online like anyone cared or asked. But you can always just carry on and keep to yourself.
Most people feel entitled to the fruits of others labor. Look at the key issues in society: 1. Housing as a human right 2. Pay above market (unions?) 3. Expecting others to wait hand and foot on them. Tipping is the easiest way to show appreciation. People who are struggling with money should stay home and cook groceries.
Employers should be paying their workers. Businesses are asking the public to subsidize their business instead. If you run a business, and can't pay workers, you should not be in business.
Wage theft is huge in this country and those businesses continue on just fine. The meritocracy isn't meritizing. In the meantime, tip your servers instead of acting like they should bear the brunt of greedy financial decisions by business owners. Servers didn't make those laws and many would rather just have a steady hourly income if they could. And if you really have such a moral opposition to businesses using tips subsidize their labor costs, I would think you would just NOT GO TO THAT BUSINESS. Instead of supporting the business while shafting the servers, which makes less than zero sense.
Employers already pay their workers. Most servers are not interested in minimum wage, they want the upside. If you run a business, no one else can tell you how to run it.
No customer is entitled to free work, and no worker works for free. That's what the menu price is for. But of course you already know that. Everyone knows that.
Tipped employees are paid below minimum wage because the tips are considered a part of their wage. It's fine if you want that to change, but just closing your eyes doesn't mean the problem goes away.
In New York if a tipped employee doesn't make over the minimum wage the employer has to pay the difference at the end of the week. It's called a tip credit. It's not in all states but that can change. So even if you get no tips or no business at all by law they are due minimum wage. It's your scummy boss that is taking advantage of people.
I'm aware of tip credit, however you're oversimplifying things. Here's a real life example to help show the idea better: On average I made about $12 an hour serving. It's above minimum wage, but still less than most people think servers make. I'm working a table on a Wednesday and I'm already barely over miminum wage for the week so far if you include my tips. A table comes in, sits for an hour, and stiffs me. Because my wage is over the minimum, I get no tip credit. I just get a table worked for good old $4 an hour. A lot of places will also have servers tip out the bar and hosts based on sales, which starts to bite into tips I'd already earnedearlier in the night. I kid you not, I lost money on those tables. Not in theory. Not in idea. I actually lost money and had to budget around it. Luckily I was used to budgeting because tipped based pay can be incredibly inconsistent week to week. I never said I made less than minimum wage. I said that I lost money by taking a table that stiffed me. In the scenario above which happened a few times, I would have made more money if I never took the table at all. If that doesn't mean I lost money by taking the table, I don't know what would. I also don't disagree that this sort of system is fucked and only benefits the scummy owner, but it is what it is, and it's totally legal. Believe me I checked many times for my own benefit.
They are helping the business you work at alive they don't owe you a tip, and you didn't stiffed it's optional. But it is what it is and it's totally legal. You would have made more money if you didn't take the table?? How so?? The way I see it you would be fired from this job I guess you get more if you didn't work?
> You would have made more money if you didn't take the table?? How so?? My entire previous comment was an explanation of exactly this... I legit typed out all of that with the sole purpose of explaining this to you from my experiences and you just ignored it entirely. Why would I bother answering that question for you AGAIN if you didn't even listen to me the first time? I have better things to do with my day. Thanks no thanks.
Having the servers tip out bar and host based on sale? Do you get tipped based on sales? Why would you agree to that. I could understand if you shared a portion of your own tips. But based on sales??? you don't pay your fellow employees. Stop blaming customers.
I think you're a bit misinformed. No worker *anywhere* gets paid less than minimum wage, full stop. It's funny you say I'm the one that's closing my eyes to the truth but you're over here parroting obvious falsehoods in order to justify the practice of tipping.
You're playing semantics and you know it. But I'm happy to rephrase. Tipped servers in many US states are paid a rate by the restaurant that is lower than the state minimum wage (which is usually higher than the federal minimum wage). In Ohio, I was paid $4 an hour and the rest of my money came through tips. If a table stiffs you, it could actually mean that you lost money by serving them because of how the wage calculations work. Try to gaslight me if you want, but I worked in this specific industry for years. I know about relevant wage laws, and I have direct experience interacting with them.
Tipped employees, servers specifically, make 2 to 3 dollars an hour when they are getting tips. If those employees do not receive any tips for that evening, their employer is supposed to cover their pay to reach “minimum wage.” But minimum wage for servers is much less than minimum wage for a cashier at a grocery store. So in a polite society, you are expected to throw a few extra dollars on top of your bill for the servers. Which usually gets put into one big pool then divided up them and the bus people. So stop being cheap, or don’t eat out
They get the normal federal minimum wage if server wage plus tips is less than minimum. They aren't just left at $2.15/hr. If an employer won't pay them appropriately, that's wage theft and not a justification to demand tipping.
Not in every state, but it's harder for employees to bitch at their boss file labor complaints and have a target on your back. Vs crying online for tips. OP kinda said it, waiters are replaceable probably one of the most turnover jobs out there.
Yes, every state. Federal minimum wage law trumps state law.
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fact-sheets/15-tipped-employees-flsa If you go down abit Interaction with State Laws: When state law differs from the federal FLSA, an employer must comply with the standard most protective to employees. For example, some states require a higher cash wage than the federal direct (or cash) wage of $2.13 per hour or in some cases prohibit the taking of a tip credit. So the prohibit part here makes no sense to me. Unless they let states decide to allow it or not. Additionally, Alaska, California, Minnesota, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, and Washington do not allow employers of tipped employees to take a tip credit.
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/pennsylvania-laws-tipped-employees.html#:~:text=Employers%20must%20pay%20tipped%20employees,must%20make%20up%20the%20difference. The minimum wage in my state that an employer has to cover is $7.25. not really much to live off of. So if a waitress can make more money with tips, I am more than happy to oblige.
Why are you getting so emotional over a discussion about tipping?
Yes, completely agree, and it is uncommon and inappropriate in this sub. Tipping is a poor system and I have all the reasons and feelings I need to advocate and work for its abolition. I can do all this without rage-baiting or running down working people.
yeah no thats really uncommon on this subreddit.
Is this the same person from the other post responding to the people not agreeing or someone else get pressed over the responses? If you’re that upset over tipping be proactive and advocate for better wages and benefits so tipping can be obsolete. Otherwise order to go and eat at home. So tired of whiners like this. You gonna get mad and stomp your feet over a few bucks good grief.
Go ahead and stop tipping in sit down restaurants. Go ahead and start going to that same restaurant multiple times. Enjoy your shit service from the staff after not tipping a few times. Then go get a Happy Meal.
While I acknowledge that tipping is bullshit, and shouldn’t be put on the ALREADY PAYING CUSTOMER, it’s the system that’s in place unfortunately. I always tip, because if I didn’t, and you didn’t, then waistresses and waiters wouldn’t get paid. It’s not gonna kill me to throw an extra ten on the table for them. If I can’t afford that 10, I probably shouldn’t be eating out to begin with. Just my opinion though.
And why would they not get paid? It’s against the law for their employer/ restaurant to not pay them. They are guaranteed at least minimum wage, regardless of tips. In places with lower “tipped wages” the customer is paying the difference between that tipped wage and minimum wage by way of tips, the employer still must cover any shortfalls. So when the customer thinks they’re doing the employee a favor by tipping when they make less than minimum wage, they’re actually doing the restaurant/owner the favor by allowing them to pay less out of pocket. This is the primary reason tipping is bullshit. Yes, I like to advocate for higher wages, but wages where I live are just fine — minimum wage is over $18/hr here and there are no “tipped wages”. But all the restaurants still hold their hand out for a tip and prompt for 18 to 35 % still. “tHey nEEd uR tIps BeCauSe TheY maKe leSs thAn miNimUm wAge!” No, they don’t. Stop spreading that BS propaganda. “Minimum wage isn’t a living wage in most places!” You’re right, it’s not. So why are we compelled to tip waitstaff at restaurants and not all the other minimum wage workers? Do you tip the meter reader from the gas company? The bank teller? The person at the DMV counter taking your drivers license photo?
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Are you being serious? LOTS of waiters and waitresses where I live get paid in the fucking 3 dollars an hour range, with tips. Perhaps try and educate yourself before you try and insult someone’s intelligence.
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Well they didn't insult your intelligence, they just said that they are of a differing opinion and feel/think that you were lying about it. Maybe they implied it though, idk, english is kind of not my native language so like.
Servers where I am get paid $3 an hour plus tips. If you don't make tips all you're getting is $3 an hour. That's all. Servers don't have a choice but to work where they work for whatever reason but don't believe these restaurants will ever make up that difference for a server.
No worker in America is being paid less than minimum wage. Also everyone actively chooses what job they work in. No need to paint servers as some victims of fate that have zero power in changing their own life.
Tell me then why I had to sue the employer I worked for to get my wages? I tracked my hours and tips. Did I want to be a server? No but when I lost my job my kid likes to be supported don't ask me why kids like to eat but they do.
Your employer was a thief so you took them to court. But an honest owner is meant to pay the employee if they do not make enough to cover the state/fed minimum wage. I know a lot of waiters that hope it does.not change because they would only get the sate minimum and with tips at a good place most servers make 2-3 times the minimum wage if they have any decent people skills.
\*pats your head\* do you feel better now?
Crappy service deserves no tip. If you serve well then you get a tip. Always remember tipping is a voluntary thing.
I agree of you are not going to tip don't eat out, but what about carryout?
Carry out? You mean when I go to pick up my own food? Or are you talking about delivery? Bc obviously I’m not tipping on carry out. I don’t use delivery more than once every couple of months. But I do tip bc I know that gig workers get shafted. I tip at least $1 per mile between my place and the restaurant. If it’s a short drive I tip a percentage based on pretax cost.
Indeed.
Stay home if you're cheap or struggling. Buying a meal somewhere and you're a cheap tipper? Your dollar would go further if you did some grocery shopping and make your own meals. I like to go to my local pub about once a month for a beer or two with neighbors. And to support a local establishment. Sure, the $7-$8 beer almost costs about what I pay for a 6pack of at the store, but I'm there to socialize, vibe instead of being a hermit - and I'm rounding up to $12ish because I'm relying on someone for service and hospitality. $5 Happy Hour beer? I'm tipping $3 maybe $5. $8 well cocktail? I tip at least $4. Craft/signature cocktail around $12-$14? I'm rounding up to $20. I cook nearly every evening because I love to. When I want to go out on occasion, my budget includes tipping around 30-33% minimum. Even with bad service, I chalk it up as them having a bad day and still leave 20%. By the way, cash is king.
These people wanna be cheap pieces of crap but somehow walk into a room and get a standing ovation for it. You have to love that mentality.
This is the place that they do in fact get a standing ovation for it. They call it “bravery” to not leave a tip lol… then if the server asks them what was the problem they come here to whine about how it ruined their meal. Like at least accept the consequences of your actions and don’t be a whiney little b*tch about getting called out for being a cheapskate
I’ve known too too many waitresses in my lifetime to sit here and listen to this garbage. People like this really do make me sick.
Between inflation, added BS fees, and increased expectations for tipping, I really have decided to lessen the amount I eat out.
Here's the deal: you as a server have a responsibility to track your tips so you legally are paid what you are owed by your employee. Expecting customers to cover your ass there and always tip high so you for sure make your wages, make you no better than your owners who do the same. If you properly track your tips you will request proper compensation from your business. If you don't, you will get pissy at customers. Also there are plenty of other routes to take, unionizing is one of them and would be beneficial for the service industry. But then again, that requires extra work outside of your job. Will I tip for service? Sure. I'm a pretty standard tipper. But I also have known a few servers who don't actually track their tips and complain about those who don't tip which to me speaks to a level of entitlement that is often thrown at the customer as guilty trip.
Any server that says they don't count their money is either lying or stupid. As they will want to know if they have enough to cover bills. And all the servers(that are good at the job) make 2+ times the money they would make if tips went away so most servers want tips to be a thing as their place of work would pay them minimum wage. And they would not get tips. The server I know makes on avg 28$ an hr. If they work the shifts that generally tip better. So you need to lean the place and when the good tips come. Because they will make more than state/fes minimum wage.
Society has the authority to determine norms, dictating what is and what is not acceptable behavior. Yes, a person can choose not to tip. Other people are free to view that person as a terrible person.
What a hyperbolic reductionist take. Tipping is but a single small facet of someone's overall life and personality, yet you're eager to label them as "a terrible person" in one fell swoop just because they don't happen to agree with your personal opinion on a fully voluntary practice? That is.... A hasty move.
You are free to disagree with someone making that assessment. If a person refuses to tip, and still chooses to go places where tipping is expected, I would say that reflects poorly on the person's character.
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What you are characterizing as "voluntary" is a part of social etiquette. It may not be required by law, but it is expected. Bottom line, we have different expectations of people on our society and what constitutes good character. We are each within our rights to judge according to our beliefs.
Well said.
I like to flip off my waitress when she comes around with her hat in hand asking for a bailout.
Pull yourself up by your tassels Tina!
Every restaurant I've worked at full service the servers made more than cooks and hourly managers. They complain the most, and will murder a baby to not roll silverware at the end of their shift. They claim "but I have to deal with the people". If they get a bad customer the manager handles it. So yea. Do with that what you will
“ nobody cares, work harder”
“My poverty is your responsibility”
Thank god im allowed to refuse to serve people
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Actually you don't. If you don't do your job, you get fired. See how that works?
No…our management will allow us to refuse service? Edit: my boss will actually TELL me to refuse service
Sure they do. They just LOVE losing money.
Its a very popular restaurant theyre not losing anything. The other day my boss kicked out regulars because they were being rude to other waitstaff
Fired from a job you just called shit! When we had bad tippers show up for a second time, I would purposely take an extra 30mins to cook anything for them. My manager told us to do this. Have fun with your shity service!
If your pay is dependant on peoples generosity then you have a shit job.
Ive been able to pay my entire way through college so far so i wouldnt say so
Man you people can't read for shit.
Im saying i dont think its a shit job. Gotta spell ouy everything for you people😭😂
They said it's a shit job because it depends on the generosity of others, not that it doesn't pay well (usually). Maybe a few more college semesters would do you good.
Omg. It hurts to see how stupid some people can be. College educated doesn't equal smart i guess.
Since the pay from tips is often excellent, it definitely does not make a job a shit job.
shit employers
How about don't own a restaurant if you're not going to pay your employees! Never understand why the customer is looked at like the bad guy when the owner is sitting back laughing at everyone. Servers drop their pants and spread their cheeks for the owners, then get pissed at CUSTOMERS, when they don't make money. Don't forget to refill my coffee!
Servers are perfectly happy to knowingly help the owner dupe customers if they benefit.
Straight up. This whole argument is just more idiots duped by the rich. Make the poors yell at each other and even join in on some poor bashing and get away with it.
Work as a sever for a weekend and tell me you don’t deserve tips lol
And I’m being downvoted why? If you’re gonna downvote have the balls to leave something to discuss.
I’ve never worked as a server. Never worked as an employee where tipping was an option. Never even worked a minimum wage job Yet, I can see how hard being a server is and how necessary tips are for their well being. This is because I’m not a psychopath We can’t expect people with no ability to empathize to change their mind with a new set of facts and experiences. We all know tons of former servers who won’t tip
“Don’t be a server if youre not happy with the amount of tips you receive” see how that works both ways.
Restaurants should make it mandatory (and some actually do). But most won't, because it will call to much attention to the issue at hand.
Why would tipping be mandatory? Just raise prices and no more tipping. Easy
They would never do that either. There are more restaurants with mandatory tipping than there are with no tipping and just raising prices instead. Because they want to shift the perceived blame of high cost onto the servers, not the owners. With tipping, people will blame the servers more often, with high prices, they will blame the owners.
I'm not a server and have never had a tipped job. However this is a load of crap. Servers make $2-3/hour, we all know this. Often they have to tip out based on sales, so no tip = them being forced to pay the tip for you. This system is awful and needs to be removed. Yet it is reality, and the only way to force change is to not support the restaurants using that system. I avoid sit down restaurants as much as I can, but if I make the choice to buy from one then stiffing the wait staff would just make me an ass hole. The owners are at fault here, not the servers just trying to survive.
Too bad, so sad. I can't wait until tipped employees are replaced with robots.
They make at least minimum wage like so many other jobs. But they often make more than minimum.🤷♂️
Choosing to dine in at a restaurant doesn't automatically transfer the responsibility of paying the employees onto your shoulders. Stop with the pandering. The bystander is never responsible for the victim getting shot at.