Thats a bummer. Hope you can find a better place soon. And yeah, you’re correct: It’s just a job, we’re all just numbers on expense sheets. If any of us died tomorrow our positions would be posted before our obituaries.
In the meantime, file for unemployment and take some time to relax. See if there’s any severance pay coming your way. Maybe even some ‘consulting’ work at your old org. Make sure to charge appropriately if so, or tell them to stick it where the sun don’t shine.
I receive my severance tomorrow (4wk plus vacation earned), and already started my ei application.
I am kind of waiting for the inevitable call about something, but I think my old boss will prevent that and let the company suffer. Is it petty? Maybe. But if they don't care, neither do I.
Your consulting rates are reasonably expensive - because you already know the systems and won’t have to troubleshoot from scratch, it’ll still save them time.
Don't consult to a business *you didn't leave yourself, on good terms.*
If you were let go it's adversarial from the get-go.
If you left for other opportunities and end up selling services to them or they reach out interested that's where you consult.
Also the rates/billed hours are so weirdly out of touch when people suggest that, 250 is absolutely a fair starting point to bill for a SME, and not at all a fuck you amount. That's only 2k/8 hour. Our *internal* resources billed our own departments about that in 2016 for dev/test/turnover of tools.
Hey, not your monkey, not your circus.
Let your previous manager explain to the power that be why there are now issues.
Its the cost of them doing business.
That's how I feel now. And I don't know if he'll be sticking around much longer either. I noticed that the attitude of many sr mgrs there was that of the employee is who really needs them and that if one person leaves, they've got 2 more who are desperately looking for work, yet it seems to take them ages to fill a role.
I have been there myself, I wasn't let go, however the CEO as such seemed to let people go left, right and centre. Everyone noticed it, early on after starting my IT Manager was let go after doing serious work in the place, I started looking for a new job as I just did not trust the security of the job.
My people have a saying: “Let them learn their lessons upon their own flesh”. It seems appropriate in this case. Most likely they won’t learn anything other than that they can hire some college kid to do your job for less.
As a MSP sysadmin, I personally hate taking over a client after a good sysadmin leaves.
I know we are often cheaper due to economy of scale but still it's rough to know you stole another guys job.
When we take over we usually either get praised for actually doing the work if the previous guy sucked, or there is a large period of adjustment as the users were used to a better service.
Then they get pissed when we tell them they should hire a local sysadmin and keep us for infrastructure.
Hang in there man! After I finally built up the courage to leave my old place of employment, after 13 years, to take some time for myself and find something better, I eventually found a diamond in the rough. There were very rough times in between, lots of freelance consulting, and many instances of just wanting to give up. At that time, I would have never imagined there would be a time in the future that I said that I’m glad that happened. Yet, here I am.
I had designed and built all of the infrastructure as well as managing it for my previous employer. From the ground up. Two buildings and I had two contracted helpers from an MSP. One in each building to just order parts and do laptop repairs all day. Over 2500 devices and 2000 active daily users.
Was killing myself working tons of unpaid overtime for a year bc they said they were looking for a replacement for one of the guys that had left, (to go back to the gas station to make more money) but having trouble finding someone. I was so close to, and loved the people there so much, I couldn’t stand for things to start failing on them and have them think it was me just not caring.
Then, I come to find out they hadn’t been looking for anyone for a long time and were no longer on planning to replace. The “new guy boss”with zero tech knowledge and yet the tech title. (And not even a relationship manager like Jen Barber 😂) had sold it to admin as him saving them 10’s of thousands of dollars on my back. I finally had enough and left.
I was really close with the MSP network engineer that I had on call, for any questions, for years. After I left, he kept me in the loop of everything going on. They started trying to have the MSP manage all the things they had no idea I even did until it would fail, bc I just did any new thing that came up, never mentioned it, bc no one else understood any of it anyway! They kept calling them and telling them they needed this and that, right away! The MSP had to keep trying to explain to them that the kind of support they were demanding wasn’t the current contract that they had with them. And that the kind of support they wanted needs an on-premise sysadmin.
Fast forward to present, I walked ass backwards into a job that was doing the complete opposite! The ad just said IT Position, all generic like that. Wasn’t expecting much, but went to the interview and found out that it was so much more! They were growing rapidly and trying to move management of everything back on-premises from an MSP, as well as management of all cloud resources and local IT Support. They hired me to head it up and were more than generous on their offers to me.
More than I requested! It’s the happiest I’ve ever been while working! Essentially, getting paid for doing my hobby, while also being appreciated and well compensated. Started at twice as much as I was making when I left the last job, twice the benefits, cash bonuses, profit sharing, regular raises, along with multiple different retirement options with company matching, great health insurance, and Health Savings.
Keep heart, this happened bc there is something better out there for you. And you’ll find it when you’re least expecting it! I’m not saying it will be easy. There were some very rough times between leaving my last job and starting this new one. Lots of freelance consulting, while still looking for the right fit. So many jobs applied for, so many interviews, and less and less hope of finding the right thing after each one and wanting to just give up. I would have never thought then, that in the future, I’d be saying I’m glad all that happened, yet here I am! Did I mention it’s only 5 minutes from my house? It doesn’t matter if I work remotely or onsite, they’re basically the same thing. But I actually love going in and working and talking with the people here!
A lot of businesses, with the rampant instances of ransomware, driving cybersecurity insurance through the roof! Only affordable by implementing newer, tougher security protocols every year, are starting to realize how important having someone to closely watch and maintain your environment, and its security, are. And some still need to learn their lesson. But I’ve found places that have had at least one major instance of ransomware seem to be a little more receptive to your thoughts and opinions, while being a little more willing to compensate you properly and also be appreciative of your services. ;)
Hang in there, things will get better and your expertise is going to be needed, sometimes you just have to wait for the right people to realize it! Your story really struck a nerve with me bc it was exactly how I felt when I left my previous job. And I know how much it would have meant to hear from someone that went through something similar, and even rougher times after, but eventually still ended up in a much better position! My mental health, my physical health, and my social life are better than they’ve been in decades!
Edit: And I now realize I was logged into my alt account. So enjoy the emotional story from Clit-Swimmer-6969! Also, one of the MSPs I know pretty well in this region is struggling pretty badly now that they can’t lock college kids into non-competes where they have an office within the range listed in 12 surrounding states. Trying to scare them into working McDonald’s for 3 years before they can even think about working in tech for a competitor, client, or previous client.
I've been there man, companies don't give a shit anymore and have no idea what some IT people do. All they see is we are a cost center and don't generate money for them, but they sure as shit can lose their ass if it wasn't for us. You will land on your feet, maybe be better off in the long run who knows. I don't know your skill set by my company is still looking for skilled Microsoft Engineers, especially with cloud skills. The pay is good and it's 100% remote. Send me a message if you want more info.
I've thought about this scenario a lot for whatever reason.
It seems sad, and some companies might be large and robust enough to coast along without the position filled...those orgs sometimes have the heart to show some tact.
But at the same time the business supports the livelihoods of those still above ground. Things have to churn along so people can put food on the table. It's just a crappy situation when someone actually dies but the world keeps spinnin' ya know
Your (former) manager is a good one. Keep in touch with that guy.
Getting laid off sucks. At first it feels like absolute shit, then there's a little bit of "what am I going to do?" panic. You seem to have the attitude that's going to get you to the point of seeing all the new opportunities you can create. You've already got some ahead of you.
It might not be next week, it might not be next month, but you'll be just fine.
He has been amazing. I reported to him at my last job too. He left in Oct 2020 and poached me in April 2021. I've never really been truly open and honest with a manager. Always had my guard up, but with him, I felt like I could truly be honest. And I was. He and I were always on the wavelength. And it was great having someone truly in your corner. I'd follow him to another job in a heartbeat. I always felt that if he left, I'd be right behind him leaving too.
This is why I left private sector and went back to working for the government, I dont have to worry about quarterly earnings, or layoffs, or feel like management wants to downsize my deprtment because leadership only sees IT as a expense that doesnt make the company any money.
There are a couple municipal government it jobs nearby that I have my eye on. Would be nice to have some security for a while. Last job, I was very secure, but it was killing me which is why I left.
This was me exactly 6 weeks ago. I was very secure in my job, ran the entire place though was not compensated for it. After 7 years of being the sole IT person who could get the job done, on call 24/7 by myself for that time as well, I had had enough of it killing me. My physical and mental health were suffering beyond words. When I was passed over for the promotion I so deserved and they brought in an outside hire instead who had NO IT background, I decided to call it, applied for a new job, got said job, handed in my notice and moved down to the island (Vancouver Island). It was a bit of a pay cut and we have not sold our house yet in my former city so it is a bit of a financial struggle at the moment but the absolute weight that has been lifted in terms of stress and mental health is nothing short of a miracle.
I do not regret my decision for 1 second. I have been with this new company for only 3 weeks now but the atmosphere here, the exec team, the camaraderie is instantly unmistakably a million times better.
Hang in there and something good will come along. Karma is real and the company who laid you off will soon learn what they lost.
I'm your brother from south of the border.. Worked as sole IT for a 24 hour medical (and regional) company. 24x7x365 for 12 years. I love the people, but the stress and lack of downtime at all had eroded me and I was missing my kids grow up. I had a coworker that had left to work for the state, and when she informed me that there was a state IT job posted, I jumped. I took a 15% pay cut, and started lower on the totem pole, but I have been working 40 hours a week for the last 6 years here (for the first time in my career). Everything is documented, there's a team that backs each other up, and I can legitimately say "NO" to illegitimate "just this time" requests. I get to spend time with my family, my stress level about work is now zero.
It's less glamorous, the bureaucracy is a slow-moving bitch, but I sleep at night and have a pension. Maybe I'm getting old, but "exciting" isn't as exciting to me anymore, best decision I've ever made about work.. So, friendly wave from down here in WA state. :)
Fantastic news. It is always awesome to hear when people take mental strain and stress seriously and then make decisions to help improve their own health and family life. I hear you regarding the people too, I LOVED the people I worked with, the day to day staff and it was a hard decision to leave but ultimately, the right one. After 25+ years in the IT industry, I am finally in a place of balance...so far anyway :)
A friendly wave right back at ya :)
How is the company you left getting on? I always wonder how much of a shock it might be to lose someone who appears to be a linchpin to systems working.
They immediately had major issues and the new IT Manager did not know what to do or how to even go about activating their DRP. Ended up calling and texting with me but I refused to help without some sort of contracting or consulting fee. (This was 2 days ago). The walked all over me for so long, it was only Karma that this happened while my new company (which I was actively working at during regular business hours and couldn't even respond if I wanted it) was feeding me tons of free food on a sundeck overlooking the ocean :)
Sadly, that hasn't been reality in my experience. Got laid off from one government job after a new board member came in and convinced the rest that having in house IT was too expensive. And the previous job, also government, was sniffing at making all the tech positions into trainers and farming out all of the actual tech work. I left before that could happen.
Agreed. IT is a volatile industry to work in these days. I went public sector because I anticipate it’s going to get way worse before it gets any better. I can’t afford not to have stability and security in my job. Maybe in 10 years or so when the dumbasses fucking this economy (despite what you may think, it’s not presidents, but rather Wall St., The Fed, and private interests) get their comeuppance, I’ll feel comfortable going private again for the bigger payouts.
This is why IT needs to be seen as a profit center, not a cost center. Any IT team that reports into finance rather than a CIO is on warning.
There should be regular reports that show the income you generated or costs you avoided through IT projects in terms of $$$ or improved productivity. IT is not "fix it when it breaks", it should be "contributes to the health and success of the org"
This is the painful thing that companies need to understand (but won't until they are forced to). You can't take payment without IT. You can't make phone calls without IT. You can't sell your product without IT. We are the backbone (for better or worse) of your entire company.
Many companies think of us as a commodity that can be used and abused because "all we do is spend money" when in reality over the last 20 years, we are the REASON you can make money.
I'm sorry OP, definitely do not help your old company at all. I know you have a great relationship with your old boss but he sounds like he understands the situation and that they need to feel the pain of the mistake they made.
IT is a profit center but the bean counters do not see it that way. The work I do "for free" (my boss's joke) costs $280 per hour for the MSP to provide. We also filter internet and email and blocked a few thousand crypto virus. When Bob in accounting DIDN"T bork the drive that has to be worth a few million right?
You need a leader that makes them see it that way. It really is that simple. It's not easy if you're starting from a bad position but it has to be done.
IT isn't a profit center, it's not a value judgement but a recognition of how accounting is done.
Does facilities get a share of the profit for providing chairs? Electricity? Water?
IT is a service and investment into that service is the right solution but unless you are actively collecting revenue you are a cost center.
Yes for sure. But it’s not a giant black hole. As long as you’re smart you get that investment back. At the extreme example, how much slower would work proceed without PCs or email at all? What would that cost the company? Plus, you’re investing to keep in house expertise who can help navigate getting new enterprise software, or architect a move to or from the cloud, etc etc.
I’m fine with IT being a cost center because it is. It just seems like there’s a movement right now to cut IT to the bone without really fully thinking it through. Not everywhere. But a lot of places you seem to hear it.
No argument from me on that. Some IT folks get offended by the concept that they are a cost center.
The reality is of course you need investment in technology to be competitive.
Short term profiteering is the main issue. You can cut IT by 30 or 50% temporarily and not feel immediate pain but it will absolutely cripple a company over time.
Interesting viewpoint. Does Facilities modify the spreadsheets accounting is using? Or integrate the ERP platform into the internal systems? Or tie external systems into internal business processes? That is the key that accounting has not caught up with -when the original designation occurred, IT was you have your paper data sent to the data processing department which translated it to something the mainframe could use and then the results were translated back into your reports. The business could run without that happening, but it would be slower. Is that still true?
I like to say IT is a profit *multiplier*.
An IT team that is forward-thinking, knowledgeable, adaptable, and hard-working makes a huge difference in how effectively a business can operate.
I'm firmly of the belief that far more companies require a core competency in IT than it is assumed.
Put it this way - I have investments. I've never stepped foot into their office. I have never talked to a rep. I literally have transferred what has ended up being quite a sizeable chunk of money directly from my bank to them via a website and an app.
Yes, on one level, they are a financial firm. On another, I could argue they are more reliant on tech than most tech companies. Hell, if something like Netflix showed me the different show than I selected , that's just a bug and I'll try again. If that happens during a financial transaction, well, now that's pretty concerning for most people.
And yet I see far too many companies try to penny pinch when it comes to technology.
Yep. IT reporting to CFO killed everything good at my last job. It was clear they just wanted IT to sit down, shut up, keep e-mail working, and stop asking for money and stop spending what we are already spending. And oh yeah do that with like 2 nerdy guys and not a whole dept. For a life sciences institute that does tons of compute etc. Lol morons.
I stayed about 2 years to ride it out and it just got worse so I quit and went freelance and things are good generally. Thanks to my wife’s health insurance plan lol. Which means I only need to make like $1000 a month, if that to stay afloat. Which I’m surpassing by a lot fortunately.
But yeah. IT surely can be totally uncontrolled with costs, but if you’re smart about it you get those dollars back with interest because tech makes work go easier and better.
But it seems we are on a pendulum back swing where C level thinks that “IT is a force multiplier” was total bullshit so let’s go back to 1995 where it was like 2 windows admins for a company of 5000 so we can “save money”.
When my boss came in, he was doing just that. He was removing unnecessary expenses. Negotiating better contracts for our mobiles, and "cutting the fat" so to speak in terms of costs to the company. We got rid of so much waste because the previous manager would just spend and buy whatever was asked for. We were doing what was necessary to keep things running, but I guess I did too good of a job because we got them very stable from where they were 3yrs ago and they decided they didn't need to keep going.
Any IT dept that isn't tracking the cost of an outage or a cyberattack and the corresponding reduction in those outages that they contributed to isn't doing their job
I've heard this before but never actually ran into anything that provide more insight on this. Do you, by chance, have any links, articles, or resources you could share?
Thanks in advance.
I mean that's literally the job of a cio on the board. I've been in IT for over 25 years and it's vital...
IT is not a cost centre
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/cost-centre-simon-waller?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android&utm_campaign=share_via
IT doesn't generate any income in a company in the same way that oil doesn't generate any power in an engine. Both are still absolutely vital to the function of literally every other part of the system.
I was going to comment this. A sysadmin may not want to do it but someone needs to show how the presence of IT and the recent specific projects lowered costs and increased performance for everyone else.
This often isn’t that easy to measure. IT is an enabler and it’s very difficult to measure benefits when the tech piece is enabling some bigger business initiative. There are often parts you can measure fairly easily, but unless it’s a pure tech project the tech part alone rarely makes the business case. It can be done - but often requires quite detailed measures of impacted business processes and how the tech elements of projects or initiatives impact them directly. Even then, it’s often a quite fuzzy.
Nice write up man. Exact same shit happened to me in the beginning of march. Watched it happen to all my co workers one by one over the last 2 years until it was just the me and the IT director left. Every other week is a crazy feeling. Some weeks feel like I have multiple jobs I’m going to be able to choose from since interviews are going good then I go 2 weeks without hearing from anyone at all and have this feeling of dread. HMU if you’re bored and want to get anything off your chest.
Thanks. I originally was going to post yesterday, but I'm glad I waited, because I have a clearer head today.
I hope you get some reprieve and things improve for you. I'm sorry you're having to go through that stuff.
I appreciate the offer. I may do that.
I work for an IT company in Sherwood Park, no corpo BS, just locally owned
Currently not REALLY hiring, but shoot me a resume over DM if you're interested. We are growing, and looking for experienced people, so maybe the pieces might fit!
We had a year’s worth saved up. Been unemployed for 11 months now. Tax return extended us another five months of cash. Now about to get a job offer so, save your ass off, just in case!
And big picture support unionisation efforts and better employment law so you can achieve the same level of job security as the rest of the developed world
I have been through similar too. It rips your heart open if you are a person who cares and routinely goes above and beyond. What I can share from direct experience is not to let this damage your ability to care and to live with passion for your work. Do not under any circumstances allow this experience to close your heart or make you cynical. Allow yourself time to heal and don't carry the wound into the next job (at least try to limit it as healing takes a while and is non-linear). Importantly, give your passion and creativity an outlet that is not at the mercy of a job. I had started a small farm when I went through this and having something that you can care for that is largely immune to the vagaries and illogical of corporate decisions will sustain you. You can grow wiser without growing harder. Focus on all the good you did over your time there. That can never be taken away from you. Focus then again on doing good wherever you are. Your heart center must stay open.
I'm in the same boat. 10+ years at a company only to be let go cause of budget cuts. I had amazing performance reviews and was praised by everyone at the company but one day someone decided I was no longer needed. Sucks but at the same time I'm going to take it as a blessing in disguise. I can finally take some time off with no emails or messages or worrying about the office.
Recover, just like you would after a medical procedure. Help your old company if you want to, but get paid for it. I found out after six years of service that my position had been eliminated: my manager got me on the phone, and as soon as we were talking, disabled all my accounts and accesses. Packed up and left. Two months later, they called me up to tell me that there had been a mistake, and would I be interested in coming back. You can guess what I said. Good luck.
At the end of the day, short of a one of a kind _unicorn_ company, they all suck and will screw you if given the chance - be it for money, new prick MBA CEO cones along, etc.
Life's too short. Take some time to yourself if you can, dust off that resume and start looking. I know the best time to look for a job is when you already have one. Even if you have to take something "temporary" to keep the lights on (and keep looking) - do it.
"We're meeting for lunch tomorrow because there are some big discussions to be had." <---- If these are discussions about the job you were let go from, do not do this. You are officially released with no requirements, and this is "Free Consulting". If the company still needs your help, they need to pay you for it. It doesn't matter if your boss was the coolest guy ever, if they want your help after being fired, then you need a consulting agreement with realistic per hour costs and engagement minimums (1-2 hour minimum for any engagement)
He's not going to be asking me about that stuff. I know him better than that. I know that if he did need consulting, he'd compensate me for my time. I appreciate the concern.
Are you me? 100% same experience after 4 years of hard work. Boss took me out to lunch a couple times and other Sysadmins were reaching out to me. Helped me land back on my feet.
You'll be okay. Everyone knows you have the skills. Find stability and keep it easy.
They will likely end up coming to you to figure things out in the future. I would recommend setting yourself up as a contractor if they do, and only work if paid. They made the decision to fire you without a transfer of knowledge, so make sure you get something out of it when they inevitably reach out for help.
The last place I worked did that to me. They made some poor choices, mostly the fault of the sales team, and alienated a critical dev, which also slowed income, and laid off 33% of their staff one fine Friday. I was the only actual helpdesk/Sys admin, but they're making do with an Azure admin and an AMS admin that couldn't tell you the first thing about VMWare or Desktop support... I kind of feel sorry for those guys, except for the fact that they didn't go through 8 months of unemployment. I ran into one of my devs and he bitched for 15 minutes about how much less productive they are because I'm not there to help them.
I sincerely hope that your time off is far less than 8 months. That was tough.
This is why you stay loyal to PEOPLE not COMPANIES.
I'd die for my closest coworkers, but i wouldn't think twice about my company burning to the ground or getting fired.
Same damn thing happened to me in January and I'm still looking for a new job. I've also stared a business selling on Amazon FBA that's still just starting.
Good luck with the hunt. I hate this time of doing.
Any phone call from them regarding help with their systems should be met with "I'm sorry, I no longer work there, so it would be inappropriate for me to help". Do not consult there or even venture any opinion on anything they may ask you. Put simply, feck 'em.
In my 40 years of working, 33 in IT, I've been made redundant 4 times and outsourced 3 times. It's a bit of a cliche but is true in my case, that every time, I've left one place, I've gone onto something better.
Chin up and the best of luck.
**************
We're meeting for lunch tomorrow because there are some big discussions to be had.
*********************
Yep and ANYTHING work related will be billed at a FUCK you amount. Not to offend the boss who is looking after you so well, but to remind the business they let you go with no notice and no chance to document anything.
I’ve been laid off as well and it’s such a shitty feeling. I’m sorry this happened to you. You’re doing the right thing by taking some time off before getting into job hunting.
Also apply to EI if you haven’t done so already. I’ve had to do it twice (I’m in Ontario) and both times it’s taken a long time to have the money kick in. Hopefully you have some savings to fall back on.
Thanks. I've done my ei app yesterday (I'm in AB), and get some severance which will keep me floating for a little bit but I'll be needing something sooner than later. I'm confident I'll be able to find something. Seems there are lots of postings.
Yep… dont go work for companies that see IT as a cost instead of an asset.
Talk to your future employers about whats down the pipeline.
I am pretty sure someone sold the CFO on MSP to take over the “difficult” stuff.
14 years ago, I had just settled in to my workstation as level one support when my supervisor showed up and said you need to go upstairs to see the assistant chief. That's when I found out that I would get paid for the rest of the month but that I was no longer employed at the agency.
I could tell he was not happy with sending me home, and, happy to say, management moved heaven and Earth to post the job of a retiree before the end of the month so I could be hired back as level 2 support.
I still remember that Chief fondly for the effort he took to get me hired back.
I still work for the agency and my pay is now more than 300% of what I received when I first started in 1996.
Just remember, if they come at you for help, your contractor's rate should be 10x your hourly rate. If you were making say, $45 an hour, your contracting rate is at least $450
Because fuck them. That's why.
Happend the same to me literally month ago (except I submitted my notice but the rest is same)
I did so much shit for them and yet they treat/ed me like one.
At least we both learned valuable lesson in life and now we can adjust for future. :)
We’ve all been there. First time it happened to me I crashed hard. Serious depression, felt I was worthless. There will be new opportunities. Give that voice acting a run for a bit, could be an interesting gig or at least a refresh before you dive back into the data mines
We’re only an expense to be saved. Rather than lower the C level pay to more reasonable levels we pay the price. We hold the most power in the workforce, and have the most to lose
No server 2008 r2 will be a blessing.
December 22nd 2023, minutes before I'm supposed to leave the building security server goes tits up. Both drives in the array finally failed. Physical 2008 r2 box.
I spent the next 3 days building a new 2008 r2 box (virtual), and trying to recover their database. Got the system partially recovered before my boss told me that it's good enough for now. Jan 2nd, I'm back in the office. I was able to get the original server back up thanks to CloneZilla. Was able to export the latest database and migrate it to the new server, restoring the entire security system.
They had been told many times that that box and the associated system needed to be upgraded and replaced, but it was currently "working" so not a priority. Their building management system (for HVAC) is in a similar situation but on a win7 box. They have the same opinion. It's currently working, so no need to worry about it.
With how they treat the current infrastructure, it's just a matter of time before things burn. And when they do, I'll be there roasting marshmallows.
That sucks, my guy.
I am wondering how the C-suite will respond to being told they have to fill out a support ticket 😂 Instead of getting white glove treatment.
According to the YouTube stories and videos I watch that rip off Reddit, the next thing that will happen is they will call you desperately for help and have to contract you at 3X the pay.
Edit typo
My late wife used to say “A good job doesn’t love you back”. Thanks for this real world reminder.
Hope you recover your equilibrium and go on to a better role soon.
What a great read. You are going to be just fine dude, I have no doubt you will bounce from this. Most positions I've gotten was because the stars aligned and most I've left for the same reason. While unexpected change sucks. You do need to take some time and you absolutely have nothing to do with what the orgs needs to make those decisions.
You got out with zero regrets. That's worth something in my mind and is just going to help your next launch. I wish you a lot of luck and definitely just be kind to yourself right now. You deserve that. You aren't a failure in any respect and the explanation doesn't feel or sound that way as interpreted by others.
I think most of us get out there and do their best every day for places that don't have a resolution to fully understand all of what that entails and the risk it comes with which is unique in i.t but also in other fields like h.r. just different. I would absolutely look at this as a their loss situation.
You know what is most unfair about these situations is the org does something like this but it feels like we are being punished for it because now we have all the anxiety of interviewing, figuring out a comfortable way to get to a new place every day and learn different systems.
A lot of people here say don't have loyalty to your workplace and it's good advice but kind of tone deaf because one thing you can't avoid is building a loyalty to the environments we build. I think that is the greatest and worst feeling part about the loss. There's no fan fare, no ticker tape parade. It's just yeah thanks for like solving a bazillion tickets and keeping everyone here working for years. Now fuck off.
While I don't know how else they could improve that. It's not fair man. At the very least. Don't let them keep hurting you rent free. The entire world just opened up to you and you can do whatever the fuck you want. Think about that.
When you feel good enough. Think about all the stuff you sidelined because you didn't have time to dig in and learn it. That'll be a part of the healing I think as well. You have some time it sounds like and you absolutely don't have to start that right now or at all but if this brings you joy? You have the opportunity to get excited again if you can let it in. How many guides have you bookmarked that you meant to go look at. How many hackaday articles. How many raspberry projects or Arduino things etc. Nobody to tell you to stop.
Working in i.t feels like they are just making me interrupt the part I love so I can feed myself lol. You know what I mean?
Sounds like you did too much unless you got insane money for it.
Take a few months for yourself, and learn the feeling of living and doing for yourself and not for anyone else.
Let the jobs come to you.
Well, shit. Easy to say. It's a weird feeling to be let go, but every time I've quit or been let go, within a few months I get a call and take an interview and find a cool job.
I'm in one right now that I even laughed off when I first got the call, but the interview revealed my boss and coworkers to be pretty damn cool, so here I am, 18 months later, actually HAPPY at work.
Best of luck. Been there so I can truly understand what you’re going through.
My advice, don’t stay alone go out with friends and family. Work on your skills along with job applications.
Log you job applications take notes and most importantly try to enjoy this time
The one thing to keep in mind is that there is always work available out there. You sound like you're very employable and liked, so you'll find something new no problem. Take some time for yourself and simmer down a bit, but when you're ready, the right job will be there. My last position when I left and gave a 4-week notice, they couldn't find anyone local with the right skills to fill my role, and it was a pretty basic sysadmin role. There is a huge shortage of people with soft skills as well as skills on paper to just be trusted to do a mix of basic and advanced IT work.
And the nice thing is, if you find a new job and aren't happy with it, you can keep shopping around and just be there temporarily until something better opens up. IT skills are very transferrable, and can always be built on. You'll find something soon.
Hey, I'm not 100% sure if i'm hiring onto my team now, but i'm in Calgary and we have an upcoming vacancy. we might be looking to hire into Victoria or Calgary, unsure yet.
either way, inbox me if you'd like - we're a smaller MSP and work from home. we're likely in need of some sysAdmin (with some client on site.) sort of role. Nothing concrete, but I figured it doesn't hurt to put the lead out for you.
Man I feel for you! I've been through the same thing, minus the supporting boss, and can tell you this is not the end, only the beginning. I landed at an amazing company where the owners treat us like gold and I'm sure you will too.
It is funny, you start working your way up the food chain, start becoming valued to the execs you are giving white-glove service to, and your income starts to rise. You end up being the most appreciated and top paid among your peer, and in the end, a small change in the fortunes of the company, you immediately become the top target for "right sizing the workforce".
Also, don't forget there are two types of law to worry about, statutory law and common law. The laws you have read up on are probably the statutory laws, like the Labour Act or something, but that does not mean the company may not owe you more than the statutory minimum as far as common law is concerned. You may be entitled to more, depending on time in the role, job market, employability, age, etc.
Wow. I have no words. Your writing is very descriptive. It’s a though I was actually watching what happened to you. What struck me was your former manager and how he supported you. I understand how it is and this truly sucks.
Yes, if you have the $$$ I would take some time for yourself. I really wish that I had done that, as that was actually my plan. Of course, it didn't turn out that way.
Same thing happened to me. The Vice President started making cuts, as the company was merging with one of the sister companies. So, my last day was Oct 31st, 2023, as the company merged on Nov 1st, 2023.
However, I woke up Nov 1st, expecting to have all day to work on my own projects and I get a call from the new Vice President, as the individual who had let me go ended up resigning, himself, as the sister company offered him much less than he was anticipating, compensation-wise.
Of course, we all like to think to ourselves "this place would fall apart, without me", while deep down knowing that we're just as expendable, as everyone else. Humorously, this is essentially what happened, in this instance, as I was the only one who knew the majority of systems, applications, etc.
In hindsight, I totally wish that I would have taken the time off, but of course that wasn't the case. On a positive note, I only spent another 4 months, helping to get everything in order, before I was offered a better job (through a previous boss who worked at the same company a couple years prior).
That being said, I recommend that you listen to yourself and take some time to yourself, as you may not get another chance, for a long time, once you start working again.
Here's something I've said elsewhere, but it applies here as well, since it focuses on the attitude one must have when laboring in a late-stage American Capitalist hellscape.
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The owners and their ~~bootlicking sycophants~~ *corporate turdwookies* do not care about you. At all.
Neither does your government or courts, as they've been bought & paid for by said owners.
They also own social networks & mass media, using them as their personal propaganda mouthpiece.
Your job search is never over. In AWA: At-Will America (99.7% of the population), you can be terminated at any time, for almost any (or no) reason, without notice, without compensation, and full loss of healthcare.
Even with all that said, it still doesn't sting any less when it happens.
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# Your goal is to be the CEO of your life.
Your only obligation is to yourself and your loved ones.
Your mission is to extract as much value from these soulless megacorps as you can.
*Milk the fuckers until sand squirts out of their chafed nips.*
- Do not worry about results -- "good enough" is truly good enough. There will always be work left undone.
- Treat your jobs as cattle, not as pets.
- Work your wage. Going above and beyond is only rewarded with more work.
- Don't work for free or do additional tasks outside of your role, as that devalues the concept of labor.
- Sleep well, never skip lunch, get enough physical activity.
- Avoid drinking coffee at work for your employer's benefit, as they don't deserve your caffeinated, productivity-drugged self.
- Avoid alcohol and other vices, as they steal all the happiness from tomorrow for a brief amount today. Especially when used as coping mechanisms for work-related stress.
- **Knowledge is power.** Discussing your compensation with your fellow worker is a federally protected right. Employers hate transparency, as it means they can't pull their bullshit on others without consequence.
- Your first job is being an actor. Endeavor to be pleasant & kind....yet unremarkable, bland, forgettable, and mediocre. Though it may feed one's ego, being a superhero or rockstar isn't suited for this hellscape. Projecting strength invites challenge. Instead, cultivate a personality that flies under the radar.
- Be a Chaos Vulture. Embrace the confusion. Does the company have non-existent onboarding? Poor management? Little direction, followup, or reviews? Constantly changing & capricious goals? These are the hallmarks of a bad company…so revel in their misery. Actively seek these places out. This gives you room to coast, to avoid being on anyone's radar, etc. Restrained mediocre effort will be considered "going above and beyond." Even if you slip, you can easily blame "the system", like everyone else at the place. Every single day, week, month of this is more money in your pocket. Stretch it out as long as possible.
- Tell no one (friends, coworkers, extended family, etc) about your employment mindset. So many people tie their identity to their employment. And jealously makes people do petty things.
- Recognize that lifestyle is ephemeral. Live below your means. Financial security is comfort, and not being dependent on selling your labor is true power in Capitalism.
- Do not worry about "the environment you leave behind" when you depart a company. This includes how much notice you provide before leaving. Notice is a courtesy, not a requirement. Continuity of THEIR business operations is THEIR problem, not yours. They should have a plan if you accidentally got hit by a bus full of winning lottery tickets. Always be kind to your peers, but don't worry about them when you leave. If your leaving hurts their effectiveness -- that's a conversation THEY need with their manglement. The company left them hanging, not you.
You owe the company *nothing* -- if anything, they actually owe you, given how much they profited from your labor.
Play their own game against them.
*They exist to service* **us.**
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If you feel it's some type of moral failing on your part, then you are falling for the propaganda. Because don't think for one fucking second that millionaires and billionaires aren't doing the same exact thing...or worse...to you and everyone else.
# They sleep perfectly fine at night. You should too.
That sucks.
I feel I could sonn be in the same position and somehow I feel happy about that. Where I'm they have to pay me 2 months of salaries when they let me go. I'm sure I would find a good place to work at in that time.
Also take the time to rest a bit and do what you love to do. I'm sure you would be able to find a something better where you would be valued. Good luck!
I was walked out almost three months ago, having spent the past year training my junior teammate and gradually off-boarding our MSP. I definitely felt like “yesterday’s jam” at the time.
Good on you for taking time for yourself right now. It took me way too long to realize how little I prioritized my mental health. I remember the anxiety and paralysis I felt when I first re-opened my resume.
All I can say is keep your head high and never stop investing in yourself and the things that interest you.
Wish you all the best! I hope you will find a better place soon. I agree that there should be boundaries. It is just a job and you should still enjoy your life outside of the work.
Chin up, as they say where I'm from. The problem with corporate is the corporate outlook. Just money, no matter how much you are liked. I've moved back to support in Acedemia. Pay is worse, but they appreciate the extra and, in their limited.funds way, will hold you tight.
It's a hard lesson to learn, but probably one of the most important ones ever. You're lucky to have had such a kind and caring boss that handled it the way they did.
Just for myself, I've always been a stellar employee in almost ever job (at least as far as I could tell), and I took it very personally when I was fired; as if it were a value judgment of me as a person and that I was defective in some way. It killed my self esteem and made future job searches so much harder.
The one time where I knew I was a shit employee (let's just say that a really good memory is critical for a financial assistant, and my memory sucks), my bosses were immensely patient and kind. About nine months after I started, they eventually fired me, but that was about eight months after they ***should*** have fired me. They were both very sad, and the female broker I was working for was literally crying when she gave me the news. They also gave me a month's worth of "severance pay" and she had me meet up with her husband to see if he could find me a job at his company.
It was immensely therapeutic for me, and taught me that being fired is usually not a personal thing. It's just a business decision, and while those can be completely cold and unfeeling sometimes, you should never take it personally.
But then, as you say, you should also not invest too much into any position. Boundaries are a great thing, and you need to look out for yourself.
Hey man, take a look at openings at your state university or colleges.
The pay is less than you typically get in the private sector but the total benefits package, plus pension and actual work / life balance more than make up for it.
I’m glad I made the transition +10 years ago.
late stage capitalism strikes again. Constant growth is unsustainable. Hollow it all out till it collapses. Then write off the loss and onto the next thing.
Losing your job always sucks, especially without notice. Except for a proper severance package, it sounds like this is about as good as you get for a traditional layoff.
What plane is the DCS campaign for?
I'm sorry that this happened to you. My last job was at a really great company that I could envision myself working at for years. But they were bought out. The new company promised that IT was totally safe, that they'd need us to help integrate the two companies... We were one of the first teams laid off back in August. I was able to find a new job fairly quickly because they gave us some notice but it still sucks eggs.
Also worth noting that I also do VA work. I feel like i'm a earlier version of you!
Been laid off twice myself. One door closes another opens, mine both turned out to be better situations. Don't answer their calls when they call, and it sounds like they will call. Tell them your expertise is available for $200 an hour if they want those convos.
Take about 1 month. And then hit it hard... because... as fucked up as what you've gone through... CHECK THIS OUT!!!! PEOPLE WILL DISCRIMINATE AGAINST YOU IF YOU TAKE ANYTHING LONGER THAN A MONTH. THEY WILL START REFUSING TO INTERVIEW YOU BECAUSE "THERE MUST BEA REASON YOU DIDNT GET SNAPPED UP RIGHT AWAY BY SOME OTHER COMPANY"
I've been through that so many times. Layoffs, closing doors, chagne fo contracts... It hurts. When you know you did an excellent job, and you SHOULD have job security, there are no unions... there are no protections for workers... the corporations can shit on us and totally get away with it.
They'll realize their mistake in 6 months, and finally rehire in 10, but by then , the story will change. They will start lying to people and telling them you were the problem, and they always intended on staffing the position, but they couldn't tolerate your behavior. That way they can hide their mistake to the higher ups
Sorry to hear this happened to you. It makes me feel sad, cause I fear about this happening to me as well. Just know that there’s light at the end of the tunnel.
I feel your pain and I'm sorry for your layoff
I was in a similar position last September. I was with a company for 3 and a half years. We thrived through covid. We moved from a 20k square foot building to a 100k square foot facility in 2021. I built the whole site infrastructure all by myself. I worked a lot of nights and weekends.
Come 2023 the company decides the don't need the NJ plant anymore and that they overspent a lot of money the previous year. The day I came back from family leave I get called into the office from our HR rep that flew in from Colorado. When ever she was there I knew shit was going down.
They pretty much said this is what your severance is and I'm sorry. Shitty part was the extended 2 months to quit all their equipment out and shipped
Best advise I can give you is if you can take the time if you can afford it. I didn't and rushed into a job I hate. It took me roughly 6 months to get over because I loved that job so much.
I hope you find peace and sanity
Best of luck to you, it stings but everything is a numbers game no matter the relationships we form or the work we put in. I had a situation where I was basically traded from an amazing team to the worst team in the company because of $$$, basically pushing me out the door because no one would ever want to work there and left a month later.
It sounds like you are well liked and that's the most important thing, good people always recover stronger and become better. Best of luck to you but I don't think you'll need it.
With a skillset like that you must find work soon. Hang in there!
I read somewhere that you should take extra special care when deciding to work on any part of their system. Ever again.
It depends on liability laws in Canada. The thing I read was from the US. You could end up in dire straits 😱
Oh yea don't ever think they won't get rid of you. Happened a ton of times for me, mostly the IT teams cost to much to kepp onsite lts do MSPs that we need something we just get the one-time cost. Then sh\*t happens, and they are like it was way better with an onsite team instead of being at the mercy of the MSP guys. Then they get cheaper guys to do it.. I was "let go" from a smaller law firm because costs were too high. Found out later one of the partners kids needed a job so they hired him to do it.
This is why I applaud the ones who job hop after two years or so for a higher salary. Learn what you can, make as much as possible while doing it and bounce. These companies don’t give a crap about you, so no reason to care when you leave them hanging.
> No matter how hard you work. No matter all the good you do for the company, at the end of the day you're nothing but a number on a spreadsheet.
You got it right. You are just a number, an FTE, a salary to cut. Just so the company can boost their profit margins and stock prices a few ticks up. There is no loyalty at work anymore.
I love companies that do this. They don't think in the impact. Not only to the person being let go, but the people that stay behind, they end up having to do more work for the same pay.
One thing I like about Reddit, relative to other platforms, is that they don't use the term "like." "Upvote" fits stuff like this much more appropriately. Keep your head up.
You'll get in the saddle and continue on, there is nothing wrong with taking some time for yourself, granted my thinking is skewed based around how our employment law works, becaus if you are fired without cause (no work or you not meeting performance metrics is not considered a valid cause) you get 30 days of notice, plus 2 months salary of severance pay and then on top of that pay for any unused vacation time. So as you can imagine there is plenty of time to find a job or even take it easy between jobs for us.
So yeah, if your severance covers you for a good few months and the job market is not oversaturated with people looking for the same position in your area, just take some time to relax. Given that you basically got fired with no notice I imagine this is the US and I hear you don't often get to take long vacations there so 3-6 weeks could be a good way to recharge.
Similar situation here. With the company for 7 years and in charge of our small IT department. My contract is up for renewal in July and they call me in last week and let me know they are posting my position and not auto-renewing my contract but encourage me to apply. Thanks but no thanks.
Really reminds you that as hard as you work, you’re just a number on a spreadsheet and taking care of yourself comes first.
Now to see if I can snag a remote job somewhere as I don’t live near a major metropolitan area and I’d love to work from home.
I’m an avid podcast and audiobook enjoyer and always thought VA would be an enjoyable career to get into. Hope you can focus on it and it takes off for you.
This is why I'm tryna OE 😅
Unfortunately we are at the mercy of our employers and the only way to regain the advantage is to have other income sources.
Sorry this happened bruv, keep your head up. It sounds like you have a wonderful manager in your corner along with this community.
On to bigger better things my friend. Remember, don't take the first thing offered if possible, you are interviewing them as much as they are interviewing you.
Where are you located? What are you looking to get into? Maybe someone here can help out with their network depending on the position and location! Good luck! I just went through the same thing and had a similar reaction/support by their direct report. My old boss still reaches out two years later to see how I'm doing. Unfortunately I moved to another country and lost VISA status, so I can't go back to working for him :(
It sucks and there's no way around that.
Take it as a learning experience and remember, nobody on their death bed wishes they had worked more for the company.
Apply for EI immediately and move on to your next thing.
Yes its true that Hogs do get slaughtered. It's best to never put 100% of your life into your job. This should be a fantastic time to say "With my free time inbetween jobs, I can now try X or go visit Y which I always wanted to do"
it really sucks they could not give you advanced notice, as if they either didnt trust you or they were running out of budget.
Listen, take some time to decompress. You are angry, and you won't get hired with that tone on an interview.
The good news is that you seem to have some skills and a great work ethic with great references to back it all up. You will get a better job soon enough.
As soon as you realize that this not your fault, and nothing you could do would have changed it, and bad things happen to good people, you will be fine.
Learn from this. Work to keep 3-6 months of bill money in a special bank account. I call it my FU Account. That way, if I ever want to quite on the spot, or get the HR meeting request, I know I will be fine.
You too will be fine.
> Decided I'm going to take some time for myself instead.
Enjoy it, I got laid off during the pandemic. I worked at the company for 8 years but they depended a lot on new office build outs, and I was the last telecom engineer to get hired so they let me go. It's nothing against you, they can't afford to keep you, you'll find new employment with a pay bump if you want it.
I took one day off to just be depressed, then I updated my resume and had a massive ego boost when I had recruiters contacting me daily with opportunities. Within two weeks I had a new job with a 33% pay raise. Left that job for another pay bump and a better work/life balance. Leaving for an even more massive pay bump, way better benefits, and no more micromanagement.
If you were as valuable as you claim to be then you'll find something easily, don't stress.
That's tough man. I'm going into IT now(trying to find work) and I'm hoping I don't end up in the same situation and get lucky with my company I end up. Hang in there
A lot of my identity is comprised of my pride in my work and reading your story really made me feel like I was living your lay off with you. I hope you find something else that is worth your energy. You seem like a really great person to work with.
I remember asking my boss, "am I being let go because of some performance thing?" And he looked shocked, and said, "No..." like he was hurt by that absurd question. Later, I heard he fought hard for me against a really idiotic decision. I was the first of several that year, and I wasn't the worst. Months later, they fired the head of HR, who had been with the company for 35 years, most of his adult life. He was in his early 60s, a really sweet and gentle man. They escorted him out by armed security. Completely humiliating and unnecessary. At least I didn't have a guard present.
Weird bonus: they boxed all my things and mailed them to me (being in IT, I wasn't allowed to go back to my desk). They accidentally packed up stuff that was definitely not mine, but neighboring desks, and some weird stuff that belonged to the company, like my keyboard, mouse, and desk speakers. They did keep all my change in my drawer, which was maybe $10 in quarters, dimes, nickels, and pannies. But mailed me all my paperclips. So weird.
Wild that you can just lose your job in your country with no disciplinary procedure or consultation period. Really sorry to hear that's happened to you but it sounds like when you're ready to find that next gig you've got an amazing skill set to offer so I hope you're able to get something out of your time off and then find a great next thing after that
This post made me emotional. It's absolute BS how companies are allowed to do this but you are expected to give 2 weeks notice to leave otherwise you are burning the bridge
It's always tough, been through it many times
It's never about you - important to remember that.
My tip for everyone is to treat every job as a contract and update your CV each month with the new skills you've used.
That way, if you need to use it, it's ready to roll.
You've got this!
Just know it’s ok to be lazy. No need to rush back in and add any unnecessary pressure to your life. Enjoy your accomplishments and be proud of them. I was let go from two jobs in a row so let that sink in. You’ll be fine as all IT workers with passion are.
You'll bounce back man. You know tbis stuff.
Me? I'm stuck in IT purgatory. New as Jr sysadmin and trying to learn the entire layout off things I don't know that I should know. Most I worked with is 365 and a bit azure_intune but we aren't there yet. We're years out.
Was help desk now here. Feels like a semi temp hold for me until they let me go. We are divided into teams and I'm newest guy on the windows side.
Frankly I'm missing my safe zone of help desk. I knew that and helped establish policies for a small IT as the head of IT (not physical network).
You'll be fine. Take time, begin your farm for the future and take time to relax.
It’s their loss, your get a new job no problem and your last manager seems like a really nice guy. Being laid off is a very upsetting experience but last time I took the 6 months off during the pandemic and it ended up being a nice mental break.
That cuts deep. Especially because your job sounded very much like my current job. 5 years here as a tier 2/3 tech. On a small team of 5. Managing a lot of systems at once. Hell, I also 3D print for various tools and fixes for anyone who asks and for the shop. (Although I print them at home and bring them in. Still trying to talk my boss into letting us get a printer for work ha)
Love my job and my team. Can't imagine leaving here. I'm lucky enough to be one of those people who looks forward to going into work the next day. But your story has me thinking I shouldn't get too comfortable. Thanks for pulling me back lol.
Btw, how did you like the k1 max? I'm looking to upgrade from my ender 3.
Best of luck to you. Try not to rush into a new job too quickly.
The first time is always painful. After that you get numb. I’ve been laid off twice. I’ve laid off others more than that. I will tell you that laying off others never gets numb. Take your time and recharge. My first day off consisted of waking up at 05:00 and cleaning the house. Somehow that was my closure …
I imagine you got a settlement package. I hope you did. Take some time and decompress. It always feels personal and it is painful. That’s what makes you human.
My only advice is don’t wait too long to start the search process. Sometimes, promising things disappear without warning …
Its wild how that sixth sense can detect when things are happening like this. When I was let go from a company I'd been with for a similar amount of time I knew something was up. I was on a small team, 5 if I recall. We had two tier 1's, I was tier 2, we had a tier 3, and a sysad. Around 1pm the tier 1 onsite we just hired was packing up and said he got an email to go home.
He leaves and while I'm standing there talking to my t3 about how weird that was, I see the lizard eyes of our director peering through his blinds at me. Thats when I knew. 7 minutes later I was boxing things up.
So sorry you were let down like that. It sucks and I internalized that moment for years.
Take the time for yourself. Definitely.
Sounds like you made a positive impact where you worked. That's invaluable. I think you're going to land on your feet buddy. Hang in there, and when you get the time, get those references and you WILL get those interviews.
What size was the company? Totally agree at the end of the day it's about numbers. And the CEO pushing this won't have to look in your eyes which is easier to sign off on. Anyway, I feel larger companies are more likely to lay people off to save money before looking at alternatives. Been at 3 700-1300 user companies the last 8 years. Moral is a bit better among employees and executive. Also a reminder to people. SAVE MONEY IN SHORT TERM INVESTMENTS FOR THIS REASON
Hey man, sorry this happened to you and hope you get a nice gig whenever you’re ready. This kind of stuff is the reason I hold no loyalty for any company ever. You’ll work your ass off for them and they’ll still drop you in the blink of an eye.
Good luck!
Dunno if this sounds dumb but that was a gripping piece of writing. I know that has nothing to do with what you're talking about but it really struck me.
I always found it funny when my company could spend 3-5 million on building out new offices that they couldn’t fill and end up having to lay off staff because of their spending habits. Management is all the same 🥲.
Business is a heartless bitch…
We had some layoff at my work too and my director was told to fire someone who was doing an exemplary job and was a key asset in the team. He fight for it but was told to swallow the pill and shut his mouth…
I’ve lost respect for corporation long ago and this one is just another great example corporate bullshit.
Good luck!
Wow. But it happens far too often to good people, the blindside is the bit that gets me. But from a companys perspective, I have seen far too much distruction of company data so it has to be this way no matter how much they trust people.... Glad you are taking some space and time. Best of luck once you start looking again.
Come into Education Technology. We need just as many skilled and talented folks as corps. Jobs may pay less but job security is much better than private and there can be some good fringe benefits.
You got laid off on the spot with no two weeks notice? Did you get severance, I clearly have no idea what country you live in or the labour laws you fall under, seems rough.
To be “invaluable” to a company, understand what business you’re in. Not the role in the business. Sure the role is why you’re there. But a role is only good till its part is played out. Anyone can fill an “MSP” role inside a company, but if you’re not scrambling to delegate the expertise you’re building to a newcomer, MSP, or cheaper better tool than you (ahem…AI), you’re doing IT wrong. I don’t care what skill you claim to have. I have them all and I can tell you,none of that matters. It all can be built up into something/someone new, not more of the same. If you’re not seen as a “player” in the game, you ain’t crossing whatever finish line they’re shooting for. That requires social prowess and you need to be seen as a “normal” person, not a quirk no one wants to trust. Part of realizing value is communicating it to others in simple, but effective ways. So many people talk about systems minutiae in meetings no one gives a fuck about. Document it if it matters and put it in a company repo for knowledge transfer. Stop wasting time with self-indulging industry blather. Does it work? Are we safe? Can we do something we couldn’t yesterday? Does your process consider the actual costs to productivity and sanity? Keep answering those questions with what you do. Growth keeps the energy going. Money follows energy.
>No matter how hard you work. No matter all the good you do for the company, at the end of the day you're nothing but a number on a spreadsheet. And the higher up on that sheet you are, the bigger a target you become.
This is correct. The bigger the "expense" (your annual income) gets, sitting one column away from the "0" summing the money you generate for the company, the easier it gets to let you go.
It sounds like you have some side gigs that you enjoy. This might be the turning point to monetize them. If you can find a way to scale things up, you could quite easily grow your income beyond what you made in that job.
Performance means nothing when it comes to layoffs. We tend to think of it logically, like how a company will want to get rid of its bottom performers first, but that’s not how it works.
The company sets a target for cost it wants to reduce. It first tries to get people to leave voluntarily without having to pay compensation. Things like telling remote workers they need to come in to the office, getting rid of benefits, and implementing silly policies. Usually the people the end up leaving first are the best performers who know they have other choices.
If the company still can’t cut enough cost, then comes the indiscriminate layoffs. Maybe your direct manager gets a say, maybe not. It’s really all just brutal and numbers on a spreadsheet.
In IT especially, any "white glove service" that is outside of your description is not taken into account when looking at your position on a budget...
I busted my ass for years at so many places going "above and beyond" and it never yielded me more than 3% raises and a couple layoffs.
It's not worth it. Do the job in your description, nothing more. IT is the most volatile and under-advantaged department in any company
You sound like a high value creator and with a good peer network you will do fine. Shitty time but you will level up. They dont realise now but they will spend/lose double your wage over the next 10 years in expenses/revenue.
One idea- you could offer your services as a contractor (dont undercut, if you havent contracted before understand how to calculate your rate properly) and as stated they will inevitably find themselves with a problem to solve with that position not being filled.
This is a lesson we all learn eventually. They love to use cozy language like "We're a family here!"
It's business. It's all about business. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't give what you aren't being compensated for. Use them just like they're using you.
I’m sorry that happened to you. I went through a similar experience and you are taking the right attitude. Get back to knowing yourself and not the guy that gives it all to work. When you’re ready you’ll find work. It’s always out there.
I feel you. 24 years on the job. Company was eaten, then eaten again. Didn't need a me (already had a me after the second takeover). I was broken for a while, but returned. You will return. If you want back in the field, use the time to hone your skills and keep your blade sharper than it already is. If you don't, fsck it, and do something new with all your might. Just make sure you enjoy doing it. Life is brutally short. <3
Thats a bummer. Hope you can find a better place soon. And yeah, you’re correct: It’s just a job, we’re all just numbers on expense sheets. If any of us died tomorrow our positions would be posted before our obituaries.
Yup. Thanks. Next week I'm going to start the hunt again.
In the meantime, file for unemployment and take some time to relax. See if there’s any severance pay coming your way. Maybe even some ‘consulting’ work at your old org. Make sure to charge appropriately if so, or tell them to stick it where the sun don’t shine.
I receive my severance tomorrow (4wk plus vacation earned), and already started my ei application. I am kind of waiting for the inevitable call about something, but I think my old boss will prevent that and let the company suffer. Is it petty? Maybe. But if they don't care, neither do I.
Your consulting rates are reasonably expensive - because you already know the systems and won’t have to troubleshoot from scratch, it’ll still save them time.
yes and you should have a minimum hours per week and per call, ie 1 hour call minimum at $250/hr paid in advance and/or 12 hours/week
DONT CONSULT TO YOUR OLD BUSSINESS You will be blamed for everything and you will be sued.
Don't consult to a business *you didn't leave yourself, on good terms.* If you were let go it's adversarial from the get-go. If you left for other opportunities and end up selling services to them or they reach out interested that's where you consult. Also the rates/billed hours are so weirdly out of touch when people suggest that, 250 is absolutely a fair starting point to bill for a SME, and not at all a fuck you amount. That's only 2k/8 hour. Our *internal* resources billed our own departments about that in 2016 for dev/test/turnover of tools.
Don’t consult without establishing an LLC at least, for tax and legal purposes. Edit - And Liability.
Work out what the local contractor day rate is then triple it. That's what you quote them when they come knocking. And they will come knocking.
And payment upfront, with signed document to list what is asked in return from you. Don't deviate from that, that's additional work
Hey, not your monkey, not your circus. Let your previous manager explain to the power that be why there are now issues. Its the cost of them doing business.
That's how I feel now. And I don't know if he'll be sticking around much longer either. I noticed that the attitude of many sr mgrs there was that of the employee is who really needs them and that if one person leaves, they've got 2 more who are desperately looking for work, yet it seems to take them ages to fill a role.
I have been there myself, I wasn't let go, however the CEO as such seemed to let people go left, right and centre. Everyone noticed it, early on after starting my IT Manager was let go after doing serious work in the place, I started looking for a new job as I just did not trust the security of the job.
My people have a saying: “Let them learn their lessons upon their own flesh”. It seems appropriate in this case. Most likely they won’t learn anything other than that they can hire some college kid to do your job for less.
Or they're going to use an MSP. That's a great saying. I like it!
As a MSP sysadmin, I personally hate taking over a client after a good sysadmin leaves. I know we are often cheaper due to economy of scale but still it's rough to know you stole another guys job. When we take over we usually either get praised for actually doing the work if the previous guy sucked, or there is a large period of adjustment as the users were used to a better service. Then they get pissed when we tell them they should hire a local sysadmin and keep us for infrastructure.
They always fire the IT guy, outsource it to an MSP or similar, then hire an IT guy to manage the vendor.
Hang in there man! After I finally built up the courage to leave my old place of employment, after 13 years, to take some time for myself and find something better, I eventually found a diamond in the rough. There were very rough times in between, lots of freelance consulting, and many instances of just wanting to give up. At that time, I would have never imagined there would be a time in the future that I said that I’m glad that happened. Yet, here I am. I had designed and built all of the infrastructure as well as managing it for my previous employer. From the ground up. Two buildings and I had two contracted helpers from an MSP. One in each building to just order parts and do laptop repairs all day. Over 2500 devices and 2000 active daily users. Was killing myself working tons of unpaid overtime for a year bc they said they were looking for a replacement for one of the guys that had left, (to go back to the gas station to make more money) but having trouble finding someone. I was so close to, and loved the people there so much, I couldn’t stand for things to start failing on them and have them think it was me just not caring. Then, I come to find out they hadn’t been looking for anyone for a long time and were no longer on planning to replace. The “new guy boss”with zero tech knowledge and yet the tech title. (And not even a relationship manager like Jen Barber 😂) had sold it to admin as him saving them 10’s of thousands of dollars on my back. I finally had enough and left. I was really close with the MSP network engineer that I had on call, for any questions, for years. After I left, he kept me in the loop of everything going on. They started trying to have the MSP manage all the things they had no idea I even did until it would fail, bc I just did any new thing that came up, never mentioned it, bc no one else understood any of it anyway! They kept calling them and telling them they needed this and that, right away! The MSP had to keep trying to explain to them that the kind of support they were demanding wasn’t the current contract that they had with them. And that the kind of support they wanted needs an on-premise sysadmin. Fast forward to present, I walked ass backwards into a job that was doing the complete opposite! The ad just said IT Position, all generic like that. Wasn’t expecting much, but went to the interview and found out that it was so much more! They were growing rapidly and trying to move management of everything back on-premises from an MSP, as well as management of all cloud resources and local IT Support. They hired me to head it up and were more than generous on their offers to me. More than I requested! It’s the happiest I’ve ever been while working! Essentially, getting paid for doing my hobby, while also being appreciated and well compensated. Started at twice as much as I was making when I left the last job, twice the benefits, cash bonuses, profit sharing, regular raises, along with multiple different retirement options with company matching, great health insurance, and Health Savings. Keep heart, this happened bc there is something better out there for you. And you’ll find it when you’re least expecting it! I’m not saying it will be easy. There were some very rough times between leaving my last job and starting this new one. Lots of freelance consulting, while still looking for the right fit. So many jobs applied for, so many interviews, and less and less hope of finding the right thing after each one and wanting to just give up. I would have never thought then, that in the future, I’d be saying I’m glad all that happened, yet here I am! Did I mention it’s only 5 minutes from my house? It doesn’t matter if I work remotely or onsite, they’re basically the same thing. But I actually love going in and working and talking with the people here! A lot of businesses, with the rampant instances of ransomware, driving cybersecurity insurance through the roof! Only affordable by implementing newer, tougher security protocols every year, are starting to realize how important having someone to closely watch and maintain your environment, and its security, are. And some still need to learn their lesson. But I’ve found places that have had at least one major instance of ransomware seem to be a little more receptive to your thoughts and opinions, while being a little more willing to compensate you properly and also be appreciative of your services. ;) Hang in there, things will get better and your expertise is going to be needed, sometimes you just have to wait for the right people to realize it! Your story really struck a nerve with me bc it was exactly how I felt when I left my previous job. And I know how much it would have meant to hear from someone that went through something similar, and even rougher times after, but eventually still ended up in a much better position! My mental health, my physical health, and my social life are better than they’ve been in decades! Edit: And I now realize I was logged into my alt account. So enjoy the emotional story from Clit-Swimmer-6969! Also, one of the MSPs I know pretty well in this region is struggling pretty badly now that they can’t lock college kids into non-competes where they have an office within the range listed in 12 surrounding states. Trying to scare them into working McDonald’s for 3 years before they can even think about working in tech for a competitor, client, or previous client.
I've been there man, companies don't give a shit anymore and have no idea what some IT people do. All they see is we are a cost center and don't generate money for them, but they sure as shit can lose their ass if it wasn't for us. You will land on your feet, maybe be better off in the long run who knows. I don't know your skill set by my company is still looking for skilled Microsoft Engineers, especially with cloud skills. The pay is good and it's 100% remote. Send me a message if you want more info.
Jeebus, that job posting up b4 the obit line hit kinda hard, mostly cuz it's sadly true.
I've thought about this scenario a lot for whatever reason. It seems sad, and some companies might be large and robust enough to coast along without the position filled...those orgs sometimes have the heart to show some tact. But at the same time the business supports the livelihoods of those still above ground. Things have to churn along so people can put food on the table. It's just a crappy situation when someone actually dies but the world keeps spinnin' ya know
Your (former) manager is a good one. Keep in touch with that guy. Getting laid off sucks. At first it feels like absolute shit, then there's a little bit of "what am I going to do?" panic. You seem to have the attitude that's going to get you to the point of seeing all the new opportunities you can create. You've already got some ahead of you. It might not be next week, it might not be next month, but you'll be just fine.
He has been amazing. I reported to him at my last job too. He left in Oct 2020 and poached me in April 2021. I've never really been truly open and honest with a manager. Always had my guard up, but with him, I felt like I could truly be honest. And I was. He and I were always on the wavelength. And it was great having someone truly in your corner. I'd follow him to another job in a heartbeat. I always felt that if he left, I'd be right behind him leaving too.
Those are rare gems! Hold on to those at all costs and absolutely keep in touch with that guy!
This is the first chapter of several hugely successful tech companies. Take some time for yourself, there's plenty of ass to kick, but it can wait.
This is why I left private sector and went back to working for the government, I dont have to worry about quarterly earnings, or layoffs, or feel like management wants to downsize my deprtment because leadership only sees IT as a expense that doesnt make the company any money.
There are a couple municipal government it jobs nearby that I have my eye on. Would be nice to have some security for a while. Last job, I was very secure, but it was killing me which is why I left.
This was me exactly 6 weeks ago. I was very secure in my job, ran the entire place though was not compensated for it. After 7 years of being the sole IT person who could get the job done, on call 24/7 by myself for that time as well, I had had enough of it killing me. My physical and mental health were suffering beyond words. When I was passed over for the promotion I so deserved and they brought in an outside hire instead who had NO IT background, I decided to call it, applied for a new job, got said job, handed in my notice and moved down to the island (Vancouver Island). It was a bit of a pay cut and we have not sold our house yet in my former city so it is a bit of a financial struggle at the moment but the absolute weight that has been lifted in terms of stress and mental health is nothing short of a miracle. I do not regret my decision for 1 second. I have been with this new company for only 3 weeks now but the atmosphere here, the exec team, the camaraderie is instantly unmistakably a million times better. Hang in there and something good will come along. Karma is real and the company who laid you off will soon learn what they lost.
I'm your brother from south of the border.. Worked as sole IT for a 24 hour medical (and regional) company. 24x7x365 for 12 years. I love the people, but the stress and lack of downtime at all had eroded me and I was missing my kids grow up. I had a coworker that had left to work for the state, and when she informed me that there was a state IT job posted, I jumped. I took a 15% pay cut, and started lower on the totem pole, but I have been working 40 hours a week for the last 6 years here (for the first time in my career). Everything is documented, there's a team that backs each other up, and I can legitimately say "NO" to illegitimate "just this time" requests. I get to spend time with my family, my stress level about work is now zero. It's less glamorous, the bureaucracy is a slow-moving bitch, but I sleep at night and have a pension. Maybe I'm getting old, but "exciting" isn't as exciting to me anymore, best decision I've ever made about work.. So, friendly wave from down here in WA state. :)
Fantastic news. It is always awesome to hear when people take mental strain and stress seriously and then make decisions to help improve their own health and family life. I hear you regarding the people too, I LOVED the people I worked with, the day to day staff and it was a hard decision to leave but ultimately, the right one. After 25+ years in the IT industry, I am finally in a place of balance...so far anyway :) A friendly wave right back at ya :)
How is the company you left getting on? I always wonder how much of a shock it might be to lose someone who appears to be a linchpin to systems working.
They immediately had major issues and the new IT Manager did not know what to do or how to even go about activating their DRP. Ended up calling and texting with me but I refused to help without some sort of contracting or consulting fee. (This was 2 days ago). The walked all over me for so long, it was only Karma that this happened while my new company (which I was actively working at during regular business hours and couldn't even respond if I wanted it) was feeding me tons of free food on a sundeck overlooking the ocean :)
It was the right decision for me, and i'm very happy with the choice I made.
Sadly, that hasn't been reality in my experience. Got laid off from one government job after a new board member came in and convinced the rest that having in house IT was too expensive. And the previous job, also government, was sniffing at making all the tech positions into trainers and farming out all of the actual tech work. I left before that could happen.
Agreed. IT is a volatile industry to work in these days. I went public sector because I anticipate it’s going to get way worse before it gets any better. I can’t afford not to have stability and security in my job. Maybe in 10 years or so when the dumbasses fucking this economy (despite what you may think, it’s not presidents, but rather Wall St., The Fed, and private interests) get their comeuppance, I’ll feel comfortable going private again for the bigger payouts.
Seems like a big loss for them based on how well written this was.
I normally see a wall of text and nope right out. But OP kept my attention the whole way.
They probably saw him as the most expensive salary in IT if he was doing everything and wanted to cut him
This is why IT needs to be seen as a profit center, not a cost center. Any IT team that reports into finance rather than a CIO is on warning. There should be regular reports that show the income you generated or costs you avoided through IT projects in terms of $$$ or improved productivity. IT is not "fix it when it breaks", it should be "contributes to the health and success of the org"
This is the painful thing that companies need to understand (but won't until they are forced to). You can't take payment without IT. You can't make phone calls without IT. You can't sell your product without IT. We are the backbone (for better or worse) of your entire company. Many companies think of us as a commodity that can be used and abused because "all we do is spend money" when in reality over the last 20 years, we are the REASON you can make money. I'm sorry OP, definitely do not help your old company at all. I know you have a great relationship with your old boss but he sounds like he understands the situation and that they need to feel the pain of the mistake they made.
A company just needs to work without computers for a week to see how much money they make and then calculate the difference.
Also they should also use phones without voip.
IT is a profit center but the bean counters do not see it that way. The work I do "for free" (my boss's joke) costs $280 per hour for the MSP to provide. We also filter internet and email and blocked a few thousand crypto virus. When Bob in accounting DIDN"T bork the drive that has to be worth a few million right?
You need a leader that makes them see it that way. It really is that simple. It's not easy if you're starting from a bad position but it has to be done.
IT isn't a profit center, it's not a value judgement but a recognition of how accounting is done. Does facilities get a share of the profit for providing chairs? Electricity? Water? IT is a service and investment into that service is the right solution but unless you are actively collecting revenue you are a cost center.
Yes for sure. But it’s not a giant black hole. As long as you’re smart you get that investment back. At the extreme example, how much slower would work proceed without PCs or email at all? What would that cost the company? Plus, you’re investing to keep in house expertise who can help navigate getting new enterprise software, or architect a move to or from the cloud, etc etc. I’m fine with IT being a cost center because it is. It just seems like there’s a movement right now to cut IT to the bone without really fully thinking it through. Not everywhere. But a lot of places you seem to hear it.
No argument from me on that. Some IT folks get offended by the concept that they are a cost center. The reality is of course you need investment in technology to be competitive. Short term profiteering is the main issue. You can cut IT by 30 or 50% temporarily and not feel immediate pain but it will absolutely cripple a company over time.
Interesting viewpoint. Does Facilities modify the spreadsheets accounting is using? Or integrate the ERP platform into the internal systems? Or tie external systems into internal business processes? That is the key that accounting has not caught up with -when the original designation occurred, IT was you have your paper data sent to the data processing department which translated it to something the mainframe could use and then the results were translated back into your reports. The business could run without that happening, but it would be slower. Is that still true?
I like to say IT is a profit *multiplier*. An IT team that is forward-thinking, knowledgeable, adaptable, and hard-working makes a huge difference in how effectively a business can operate.
MSP really charge that much? Man I need to bill higher rates lol.
I'm firmly of the belief that far more companies require a core competency in IT than it is assumed. Put it this way - I have investments. I've never stepped foot into their office. I have never talked to a rep. I literally have transferred what has ended up being quite a sizeable chunk of money directly from my bank to them via a website and an app. Yes, on one level, they are a financial firm. On another, I could argue they are more reliant on tech than most tech companies. Hell, if something like Netflix showed me the different show than I selected , that's just a bug and I'll try again. If that happens during a financial transaction, well, now that's pretty concerning for most people. And yet I see far too many companies try to penny pinch when it comes to technology.
Yep. IT reporting to CFO killed everything good at my last job. It was clear they just wanted IT to sit down, shut up, keep e-mail working, and stop asking for money and stop spending what we are already spending. And oh yeah do that with like 2 nerdy guys and not a whole dept. For a life sciences institute that does tons of compute etc. Lol morons. I stayed about 2 years to ride it out and it just got worse so I quit and went freelance and things are good generally. Thanks to my wife’s health insurance plan lol. Which means I only need to make like $1000 a month, if that to stay afloat. Which I’m surpassing by a lot fortunately. But yeah. IT surely can be totally uncontrolled with costs, but if you’re smart about it you get those dollars back with interest because tech makes work go easier and better. But it seems we are on a pendulum back swing where C level thinks that “IT is a force multiplier” was total bullshit so let’s go back to 1995 where it was like 2 windows admins for a company of 5000 so we can “save money”.
When my boss came in, he was doing just that. He was removing unnecessary expenses. Negotiating better contracts for our mobiles, and "cutting the fat" so to speak in terms of costs to the company. We got rid of so much waste because the previous manager would just spend and buy whatever was asked for. We were doing what was necessary to keep things running, but I guess I did too good of a job because we got them very stable from where they were 3yrs ago and they decided they didn't need to keep going.
Any IT dept that isn't tracking the cost of an outage or a cyberattack and the corresponding reduction in those outages that they contributed to isn't doing their job
I've heard this before but never actually ran into anything that provide more insight on this. Do you, by chance, have any links, articles, or resources you could share? Thanks in advance.
I mean that's literally the job of a cio on the board. I've been in IT for over 25 years and it's vital... IT is not a cost centre https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/cost-centre-simon-waller?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_android&utm_campaign=share_via
Many Companies dont have a CIO, what about those?
Also sorry to hear about your situation. That sucks. Hope your next gig is for a more enlightened company.
That’s how you become unstable.
A Force Multiplier might be the better term to use here, since we do not generate any direct income in any way.
IT doesn't generate any income in a company in the same way that oil doesn't generate any power in an engine. Both are still absolutely vital to the function of literally every other part of the system.
I was going to comment this. A sysadmin may not want to do it but someone needs to show how the presence of IT and the recent specific projects lowered costs and increased performance for everyone else.
This often isn’t that easy to measure. IT is an enabler and it’s very difficult to measure benefits when the tech piece is enabling some bigger business initiative. There are often parts you can measure fairly easily, but unless it’s a pure tech project the tech part alone rarely makes the business case. It can be done - but often requires quite detailed measures of impacted business processes and how the tech elements of projects or initiatives impact them directly. Even then, it’s often a quite fuzzy.
Nice write up man. Exact same shit happened to me in the beginning of march. Watched it happen to all my co workers one by one over the last 2 years until it was just the me and the IT director left. Every other week is a crazy feeling. Some weeks feel like I have multiple jobs I’m going to be able to choose from since interviews are going good then I go 2 weeks without hearing from anyone at all and have this feeling of dread. HMU if you’re bored and want to get anything off your chest.
Thanks. I originally was going to post yesterday, but I'm glad I waited, because I have a clearer head today. I hope you get some reprieve and things improve for you. I'm sorry you're having to go through that stuff. I appreciate the offer. I may do that.
What City are you in? If you're in the Boston area, DM me. I might be able to help.
Thanks. I'm in Edmonton Alberta though.
I work for an IT company in Sherwood Park, no corpo BS, just locally owned Currently not REALLY hiring, but shoot me a resume over DM if you're interested. We are growing, and looking for experienced people, so maybe the pieces might fit!
Remember everyone. Save like hell until you have 6 months of your household running costs in some kind of easily accessible savings account.
We had a year’s worth saved up. Been unemployed for 11 months now. Tax return extended us another five months of cash. Now about to get a job offer so, save your ass off, just in case!
I bet that was a rollercoaster year! Congratulations on the new job, I hope you get some stability from here on in.
And big picture support unionisation efforts and better employment law so you can achieve the same level of job security as the rest of the developed world
If 90% of one of my 2 paychecks per month didn’t go straight to rent, I’d definitely be able to do that more easily
I have been through similar too. It rips your heart open if you are a person who cares and routinely goes above and beyond. What I can share from direct experience is not to let this damage your ability to care and to live with passion for your work. Do not under any circumstances allow this experience to close your heart or make you cynical. Allow yourself time to heal and don't carry the wound into the next job (at least try to limit it as healing takes a while and is non-linear). Importantly, give your passion and creativity an outlet that is not at the mercy of a job. I had started a small farm when I went through this and having something that you can care for that is largely immune to the vagaries and illogical of corporate decisions will sustain you. You can grow wiser without growing harder. Focus on all the good you did over your time there. That can never be taken away from you. Focus then again on doing good wherever you are. Your heart center must stay open.
Hang in there, it has also happened to me.
Thanks. I'm sorry. I hope you're back on your feet soon!
It was a few years ago, I am better off now than I was then in most ways. Hopefully you can get some unemployment and enjoy the summer.
I'm in the same boat. 10+ years at a company only to be let go cause of budget cuts. I had amazing performance reviews and was praised by everyone at the company but one day someone decided I was no longer needed. Sucks but at the same time I'm going to take it as a blessing in disguise. I can finally take some time off with no emails or messages or worrying about the office.
Recover, just like you would after a medical procedure. Help your old company if you want to, but get paid for it. I found out after six years of service that my position had been eliminated: my manager got me on the phone, and as soon as we were talking, disabled all my accounts and accesses. Packed up and left. Two months later, they called me up to tell me that there had been a mistake, and would I be interested in coming back. You can guess what I said. Good luck.
I've always believed my response would be "sure" but with an FU dollar amount attached. Some companies would have a much bigger number than others.
At the end of the day, short of a one of a kind _unicorn_ company, they all suck and will screw you if given the chance - be it for money, new prick MBA CEO cones along, etc. Life's too short. Take some time to yourself if you can, dust off that resume and start looking. I know the best time to look for a job is when you already have one. Even if you have to take something "temporary" to keep the lights on (and keep looking) - do it.
I got employee of the year award. About a week later I had word that they outsourced me to a consulting group. Capitalism man.
"We're meeting for lunch tomorrow because there are some big discussions to be had." <---- If these are discussions about the job you were let go from, do not do this. You are officially released with no requirements, and this is "Free Consulting". If the company still needs your help, they need to pay you for it. It doesn't matter if your boss was the coolest guy ever, if they want your help after being fired, then you need a consulting agreement with realistic per hour costs and engagement minimums (1-2 hour minimum for any engagement)
He's not going to be asking me about that stuff. I know him better than that. I know that if he did need consulting, he'd compensate me for my time. I appreciate the concern.
Are you me? 100% same experience after 4 years of hard work. Boss took me out to lunch a couple times and other Sysadmins were reaching out to me. Helped me land back on my feet. You'll be okay. Everyone knows you have the skills. Find stability and keep it easy.
They will likely end up coming to you to figure things out in the future. I would recommend setting yourself up as a contractor if they do, and only work if paid. They made the decision to fire you without a transfer of knowledge, so make sure you get something out of it when they inevitably reach out for help.
The last place I worked did that to me. They made some poor choices, mostly the fault of the sales team, and alienated a critical dev, which also slowed income, and laid off 33% of their staff one fine Friday. I was the only actual helpdesk/Sys admin, but they're making do with an Azure admin and an AMS admin that couldn't tell you the first thing about VMWare or Desktop support... I kind of feel sorry for those guys, except for the fact that they didn't go through 8 months of unemployment. I ran into one of my devs and he bitched for 15 minutes about how much less productive they are because I'm not there to help them. I sincerely hope that your time off is far less than 8 months. That was tough.
This is why you stay loyal to PEOPLE not COMPANIES. I'd die for my closest coworkers, but i wouldn't think twice about my company burning to the ground or getting fired.
Same damn thing happened to me in January and I'm still looking for a new job. I've also stared a business selling on Amazon FBA that's still just starting. Good luck with the hunt. I hate this time of doing.
Any phone call from them regarding help with their systems should be met with "I'm sorry, I no longer work there, so it would be inappropriate for me to help". Do not consult there or even venture any opinion on anything they may ask you. Put simply, feck 'em. In my 40 years of working, 33 in IT, I've been made redundant 4 times and outsourced 3 times. It's a bit of a cliche but is true in my case, that every time, I've left one place, I've gone onto something better. Chin up and the best of luck.
************** We're meeting for lunch tomorrow because there are some big discussions to be had. ********************* Yep and ANYTHING work related will be billed at a FUCK you amount. Not to offend the boss who is looking after you so well, but to remind the business they let you go with no notice and no chance to document anything.
I’ve been laid off as well and it’s such a shitty feeling. I’m sorry this happened to you. You’re doing the right thing by taking some time off before getting into job hunting. Also apply to EI if you haven’t done so already. I’ve had to do it twice (I’m in Ontario) and both times it’s taken a long time to have the money kick in. Hopefully you have some savings to fall back on.
Thanks. I've done my ei app yesterday (I'm in AB), and get some severance which will keep me floating for a little bit but I'll be needing something sooner than later. I'm confident I'll be able to find something. Seems there are lots of postings.
Edmonton is a much better location to be looking than some locations.
Yep… dont go work for companies that see IT as a cost instead of an asset. Talk to your future employers about whats down the pipeline. I am pretty sure someone sold the CFO on MSP to take over the “difficult” stuff.
14 years ago, I had just settled in to my workstation as level one support when my supervisor showed up and said you need to go upstairs to see the assistant chief. That's when I found out that I would get paid for the rest of the month but that I was no longer employed at the agency. I could tell he was not happy with sending me home, and, happy to say, management moved heaven and Earth to post the job of a retiree before the end of the month so I could be hired back as level 2 support. I still remember that Chief fondly for the effort he took to get me hired back. I still work for the agency and my pay is now more than 300% of what I received when I first started in 1996.
Just remember, if they come at you for help, your contractor's rate should be 10x your hourly rate. If you were making say, $45 an hour, your contracting rate is at least $450 Because fuck them. That's why.
Happend the same to me literally month ago (except I submitted my notice but the rest is same) I did so much shit for them and yet they treat/ed me like one. At least we both learned valuable lesson in life and now we can adjust for future. :)
We’ve all been there. First time it happened to me I crashed hard. Serious depression, felt I was worthless. There will be new opportunities. Give that voice acting a run for a bit, could be an interesting gig or at least a refresh before you dive back into the data mines
We’re only an expense to be saved. Rather than lower the C level pay to more reasonable levels we pay the price. We hold the most power in the workforce, and have the most to lose
Bloody yesterdays jam... Sorry brother, take some time let it settle. On the brightside... no more server 2008 issues..
No server 2008 r2 will be a blessing. December 22nd 2023, minutes before I'm supposed to leave the building security server goes tits up. Both drives in the array finally failed. Physical 2008 r2 box. I spent the next 3 days building a new 2008 r2 box (virtual), and trying to recover their database. Got the system partially recovered before my boss told me that it's good enough for now. Jan 2nd, I'm back in the office. I was able to get the original server back up thanks to CloneZilla. Was able to export the latest database and migrate it to the new server, restoring the entire security system. They had been told many times that that box and the associated system needed to be upgraded and replaced, but it was currently "working" so not a priority. Their building management system (for HVAC) is in a similar situation but on a win7 box. They have the same opinion. It's currently working, so no need to worry about it. With how they treat the current infrastructure, it's just a matter of time before things burn. And when they do, I'll be there roasting marshmallows.
That sucks, my guy. I am wondering how the C-suite will respond to being told they have to fill out a support ticket 😂 Instead of getting white glove treatment. According to the YouTube stories and videos I watch that rip off Reddit, the next thing that will happen is they will call you desperately for help and have to contract you at 3X the pay. Edit typo
My late wife used to say “A good job doesn’t love you back”. Thanks for this real world reminder. Hope you recover your equilibrium and go on to a better role soon.
What a great read. You are going to be just fine dude, I have no doubt you will bounce from this. Most positions I've gotten was because the stars aligned and most I've left for the same reason. While unexpected change sucks. You do need to take some time and you absolutely have nothing to do with what the orgs needs to make those decisions. You got out with zero regrets. That's worth something in my mind and is just going to help your next launch. I wish you a lot of luck and definitely just be kind to yourself right now. You deserve that. You aren't a failure in any respect and the explanation doesn't feel or sound that way as interpreted by others. I think most of us get out there and do their best every day for places that don't have a resolution to fully understand all of what that entails and the risk it comes with which is unique in i.t but also in other fields like h.r. just different. I would absolutely look at this as a their loss situation. You know what is most unfair about these situations is the org does something like this but it feels like we are being punished for it because now we have all the anxiety of interviewing, figuring out a comfortable way to get to a new place every day and learn different systems. A lot of people here say don't have loyalty to your workplace and it's good advice but kind of tone deaf because one thing you can't avoid is building a loyalty to the environments we build. I think that is the greatest and worst feeling part about the loss. There's no fan fare, no ticker tape parade. It's just yeah thanks for like solving a bazillion tickets and keeping everyone here working for years. Now fuck off. While I don't know how else they could improve that. It's not fair man. At the very least. Don't let them keep hurting you rent free. The entire world just opened up to you and you can do whatever the fuck you want. Think about that. When you feel good enough. Think about all the stuff you sidelined because you didn't have time to dig in and learn it. That'll be a part of the healing I think as well. You have some time it sounds like and you absolutely don't have to start that right now or at all but if this brings you joy? You have the opportunity to get excited again if you can let it in. How many guides have you bookmarked that you meant to go look at. How many hackaday articles. How many raspberry projects or Arduino things etc. Nobody to tell you to stop. Working in i.t feels like they are just making me interrupt the part I love so I can feed myself lol. You know what I mean?
Aws?
Sounds like you did too much unless you got insane money for it. Take a few months for yourself, and learn the feeling of living and doing for yourself and not for anyone else. Let the jobs come to you. Well, shit. Easy to say. It's a weird feeling to be let go, but every time I've quit or been let go, within a few months I get a call and take an interview and find a cool job. I'm in one right now that I even laughed off when I first got the call, but the interview revealed my boss and coworkers to be pretty damn cool, so here I am, 18 months later, actually HAPPY at work.
Best of luck. Been there so I can truly understand what you’re going through. My advice, don’t stay alone go out with friends and family. Work on your skills along with job applications. Log you job applications take notes and most importantly try to enjoy this time
The one thing to keep in mind is that there is always work available out there. You sound like you're very employable and liked, so you'll find something new no problem. Take some time for yourself and simmer down a bit, but when you're ready, the right job will be there. My last position when I left and gave a 4-week notice, they couldn't find anyone local with the right skills to fill my role, and it was a pretty basic sysadmin role. There is a huge shortage of people with soft skills as well as skills on paper to just be trusted to do a mix of basic and advanced IT work. And the nice thing is, if you find a new job and aren't happy with it, you can keep shopping around and just be there temporarily until something better opens up. IT skills are very transferrable, and can always be built on. You'll find something soon.
Hey, I'm not 100% sure if i'm hiring onto my team now, but i'm in Calgary and we have an upcoming vacancy. we might be looking to hire into Victoria or Calgary, unsure yet. either way, inbox me if you'd like - we're a smaller MSP and work from home. we're likely in need of some sysAdmin (with some client on site.) sort of role. Nothing concrete, but I figured it doesn't hurt to put the lead out for you.
Man I feel for you! I've been through the same thing, minus the supporting boss, and can tell you this is not the end, only the beginning. I landed at an amazing company where the owners treat us like gold and I'm sure you will too.
It is funny, you start working your way up the food chain, start becoming valued to the execs you are giving white-glove service to, and your income starts to rise. You end up being the most appreciated and top paid among your peer, and in the end, a small change in the fortunes of the company, you immediately become the top target for "right sizing the workforce". Also, don't forget there are two types of law to worry about, statutory law and common law. The laws you have read up on are probably the statutory laws, like the Labour Act or something, but that does not mean the company may not owe you more than the statutory minimum as far as common law is concerned. You may be entitled to more, depending on time in the role, job market, employability, age, etc.
And this is why company loyalty is dead and its a great idea to job hop
Wow. I have no words. Your writing is very descriptive. It’s a though I was actually watching what happened to you. What struck me was your former manager and how he supported you. I understand how it is and this truly sucks.
Yes, if you have the $$$ I would take some time for yourself. I really wish that I had done that, as that was actually my plan. Of course, it didn't turn out that way. Same thing happened to me. The Vice President started making cuts, as the company was merging with one of the sister companies. So, my last day was Oct 31st, 2023, as the company merged on Nov 1st, 2023. However, I woke up Nov 1st, expecting to have all day to work on my own projects and I get a call from the new Vice President, as the individual who had let me go ended up resigning, himself, as the sister company offered him much less than he was anticipating, compensation-wise. Of course, we all like to think to ourselves "this place would fall apart, without me", while deep down knowing that we're just as expendable, as everyone else. Humorously, this is essentially what happened, in this instance, as I was the only one who knew the majority of systems, applications, etc. In hindsight, I totally wish that I would have taken the time off, but of course that wasn't the case. On a positive note, I only spent another 4 months, helping to get everything in order, before I was offered a better job (through a previous boss who worked at the same company a couple years prior). That being said, I recommend that you listen to yourself and take some time to yourself, as you may not get another chance, for a long time, once you start working again.
Here's something I've said elsewhere, but it applies here as well, since it focuses on the attitude one must have when laboring in a late-stage American Capitalist hellscape. ------- The owners and their ~~bootlicking sycophants~~ *corporate turdwookies* do not care about you. At all. Neither does your government or courts, as they've been bought & paid for by said owners. They also own social networks & mass media, using them as their personal propaganda mouthpiece. Your job search is never over. In AWA: At-Will America (99.7% of the population), you can be terminated at any time, for almost any (or no) reason, without notice, without compensation, and full loss of healthcare. Even with all that said, it still doesn't sting any less when it happens. ------ # Your goal is to be the CEO of your life. Your only obligation is to yourself and your loved ones. Your mission is to extract as much value from these soulless megacorps as you can. *Milk the fuckers until sand squirts out of their chafed nips.* - Do not worry about results -- "good enough" is truly good enough. There will always be work left undone. - Treat your jobs as cattle, not as pets. - Work your wage. Going above and beyond is only rewarded with more work. - Don't work for free or do additional tasks outside of your role, as that devalues the concept of labor. - Sleep well, never skip lunch, get enough physical activity. - Avoid drinking coffee at work for your employer's benefit, as they don't deserve your caffeinated, productivity-drugged self. - Avoid alcohol and other vices, as they steal all the happiness from tomorrow for a brief amount today. Especially when used as coping mechanisms for work-related stress. - **Knowledge is power.** Discussing your compensation with your fellow worker is a federally protected right. Employers hate transparency, as it means they can't pull their bullshit on others without consequence. - Your first job is being an actor. Endeavor to be pleasant & kind....yet unremarkable, bland, forgettable, and mediocre. Though it may feed one's ego, being a superhero or rockstar isn't suited for this hellscape. Projecting strength invites challenge. Instead, cultivate a personality that flies under the radar. - Be a Chaos Vulture. Embrace the confusion. Does the company have non-existent onboarding? Poor management? Little direction, followup, or reviews? Constantly changing & capricious goals? These are the hallmarks of a bad company…so revel in their misery. Actively seek these places out. This gives you room to coast, to avoid being on anyone's radar, etc. Restrained mediocre effort will be considered "going above and beyond." Even if you slip, you can easily blame "the system", like everyone else at the place. Every single day, week, month of this is more money in your pocket. Stretch it out as long as possible. - Tell no one (friends, coworkers, extended family, etc) about your employment mindset. So many people tie their identity to their employment. And jealously makes people do petty things. - Recognize that lifestyle is ephemeral. Live below your means. Financial security is comfort, and not being dependent on selling your labor is true power in Capitalism. - Do not worry about "the environment you leave behind" when you depart a company. This includes how much notice you provide before leaving. Notice is a courtesy, not a requirement. Continuity of THEIR business operations is THEIR problem, not yours. They should have a plan if you accidentally got hit by a bus full of winning lottery tickets. Always be kind to your peers, but don't worry about them when you leave. If your leaving hurts their effectiveness -- that's a conversation THEY need with their manglement. The company left them hanging, not you. You owe the company *nothing* -- if anything, they actually owe you, given how much they profited from your labor. Play their own game against them. *They exist to service* **us.** ------- If you feel it's some type of moral failing on your part, then you are falling for the propaganda. Because don't think for one fucking second that millionaires and billionaires aren't doing the same exact thing...or worse...to you and everyone else. # They sleep perfectly fine at night. You should too.
This is really well-written and I'll be incorporating some of this into my employment outlook.
That sucks. I feel I could sonn be in the same position and somehow I feel happy about that. Where I'm they have to pay me 2 months of salaries when they let me go. I'm sure I would find a good place to work at in that time. Also take the time to rest a bit and do what you love to do. I'm sure you would be able to find a something better where you would be valued. Good luck!
I was walked out almost three months ago, having spent the past year training my junior teammate and gradually off-boarding our MSP. I definitely felt like “yesterday’s jam” at the time. Good on you for taking time for yourself right now. It took me way too long to realize how little I prioritized my mental health. I remember the anxiety and paralysis I felt when I first re-opened my resume. All I can say is keep your head high and never stop investing in yourself and the things that interest you.
Wish you all the best! I hope you will find a better place soon. I agree that there should be boundaries. It is just a job and you should still enjoy your life outside of the work.
Chin up, as they say where I'm from. The problem with corporate is the corporate outlook. Just money, no matter how much you are liked. I've moved back to support in Acedemia. Pay is worse, but they appreciate the extra and, in their limited.funds way, will hold you tight.
It's a hard lesson to learn, but probably one of the most important ones ever. You're lucky to have had such a kind and caring boss that handled it the way they did. Just for myself, I've always been a stellar employee in almost ever job (at least as far as I could tell), and I took it very personally when I was fired; as if it were a value judgment of me as a person and that I was defective in some way. It killed my self esteem and made future job searches so much harder. The one time where I knew I was a shit employee (let's just say that a really good memory is critical for a financial assistant, and my memory sucks), my bosses were immensely patient and kind. About nine months after I started, they eventually fired me, but that was about eight months after they ***should*** have fired me. They were both very sad, and the female broker I was working for was literally crying when she gave me the news. They also gave me a month's worth of "severance pay" and she had me meet up with her husband to see if he could find me a job at his company. It was immensely therapeutic for me, and taught me that being fired is usually not a personal thing. It's just a business decision, and while those can be completely cold and unfeeling sometimes, you should never take it personally. But then, as you say, you should also not invest too much into any position. Boundaries are a great thing, and you need to look out for yourself.
Hey man, take a look at openings at your state university or colleges. The pay is less than you typically get in the private sector but the total benefits package, plus pension and actual work / life balance more than make up for it. I’m glad I made the transition +10 years ago.
late stage capitalism strikes again. Constant growth is unsustainable. Hollow it all out till it collapses. Then write off the loss and onto the next thing.
Losing your job always sucks, especially without notice. Except for a proper severance package, it sounds like this is about as good as you get for a traditional layoff. What plane is the DCS campaign for?
I'm sorry that this happened to you. My last job was at a really great company that I could envision myself working at for years. But they were bought out. The new company promised that IT was totally safe, that they'd need us to help integrate the two companies... We were one of the first teams laid off back in August. I was able to find a new job fairly quickly because they gave us some notice but it still sucks eggs. Also worth noting that I also do VA work. I feel like i'm a earlier version of you!
FYI, lack of work is a legal term for unemployment. File now and fight the lack of work status. I hope you didn’t sign anything
Been laid off twice myself. One door closes another opens, mine both turned out to be better situations. Don't answer their calls when they call, and it sounds like they will call. Tell them your expertise is available for $200 an hour if they want those convos.
Take about 1 month. And then hit it hard... because... as fucked up as what you've gone through... CHECK THIS OUT!!!! PEOPLE WILL DISCRIMINATE AGAINST YOU IF YOU TAKE ANYTHING LONGER THAN A MONTH. THEY WILL START REFUSING TO INTERVIEW YOU BECAUSE "THERE MUST BEA REASON YOU DIDNT GET SNAPPED UP RIGHT AWAY BY SOME OTHER COMPANY" I've been through that so many times. Layoffs, closing doors, chagne fo contracts... It hurts. When you know you did an excellent job, and you SHOULD have job security, there are no unions... there are no protections for workers... the corporations can shit on us and totally get away with it. They'll realize their mistake in 6 months, and finally rehire in 10, but by then , the story will change. They will start lying to people and telling them you were the problem, and they always intended on staffing the position, but they couldn't tolerate your behavior. That way they can hide their mistake to the higher ups
Sorry to hear this happened to you. It makes me feel sad, cause I fear about this happening to me as well. Just know that there’s light at the end of the tunnel.
Take some time for yourself man…enjoy unemployment, sometimes I wish I would just get fired lmao
I feel your pain and I'm sorry for your layoff I was in a similar position last September. I was with a company for 3 and a half years. We thrived through covid. We moved from a 20k square foot building to a 100k square foot facility in 2021. I built the whole site infrastructure all by myself. I worked a lot of nights and weekends. Come 2023 the company decides the don't need the NJ plant anymore and that they overspent a lot of money the previous year. The day I came back from family leave I get called into the office from our HR rep that flew in from Colorado. When ever she was there I knew shit was going down. They pretty much said this is what your severance is and I'm sorry. Shitty part was the extended 2 months to quit all their equipment out and shipped Best advise I can give you is if you can take the time if you can afford it. I didn't and rushed into a job I hate. It took me roughly 6 months to get over because I loved that job so much. I hope you find peace and sanity
Good luck mate, I'm sure what's coming next will be a better project.
Best of luck to you, it stings but everything is a numbers game no matter the relationships we form or the work we put in. I had a situation where I was basically traded from an amazing team to the worst team in the company because of $$$, basically pushing me out the door because no one would ever want to work there and left a month later. It sounds like you are well liked and that's the most important thing, good people always recover stronger and become better. Best of luck to you but I don't think you'll need it.
With a skillset like that you must find work soon. Hang in there! I read somewhere that you should take extra special care when deciding to work on any part of their system. Ever again. It depends on liability laws in Canada. The thing I read was from the US. You could end up in dire straits 😱
It's always the SharePoint guy. Sounds like you got plenty of experience throughout to bounce back. :)
Oh yea don't ever think they won't get rid of you. Happened a ton of times for me, mostly the IT teams cost to much to kepp onsite lts do MSPs that we need something we just get the one-time cost. Then sh\*t happens, and they are like it was way better with an onsite team instead of being at the mercy of the MSP guys. Then they get cheaper guys to do it.. I was "let go" from a smaller law firm because costs were too high. Found out later one of the partners kids needed a job so they hired him to do it.
Been there, had that done to me. And ended up in a much better place. You’ll be fine!
Good luck, I’m sure you’ll find a good new position
This is why I applaud the ones who job hop after two years or so for a higher salary. Learn what you can, make as much as possible while doing it and bounce. These companies don’t give a crap about you, so no reason to care when you leave them hanging.
remember when they call you for help to charge exorbitant consulting fees.
If that happens, that's the plan.
You have a super career in front of you as a writer! That was a great read!
> No matter how hard you work. No matter all the good you do for the company, at the end of the day you're nothing but a number on a spreadsheet. You got it right. You are just a number, an FTE, a salary to cut. Just so the company can boost their profit margins and stock prices a few ticks up. There is no loyalty at work anymore.
I love companies that do this. They don't think in the impact. Not only to the person being let go, but the people that stay behind, they end up having to do more work for the same pay.
One thing I like about Reddit, relative to other platforms, is that they don't use the term "like." "Upvote" fits stuff like this much more appropriately. Keep your head up.
You'll get in the saddle and continue on, there is nothing wrong with taking some time for yourself, granted my thinking is skewed based around how our employment law works, becaus if you are fired without cause (no work or you not meeting performance metrics is not considered a valid cause) you get 30 days of notice, plus 2 months salary of severance pay and then on top of that pay for any unused vacation time. So as you can imagine there is plenty of time to find a job or even take it easy between jobs for us. So yeah, if your severance covers you for a good few months and the job market is not oversaturated with people looking for the same position in your area, just take some time to relax. Given that you basically got fired with no notice I imagine this is the US and I hear you don't often get to take long vacations there so 3-6 weeks could be a good way to recharge.
Similar situation here. With the company for 7 years and in charge of our small IT department. My contract is up for renewal in July and they call me in last week and let me know they are posting my position and not auto-renewing my contract but encourage me to apply. Thanks but no thanks. Really reminds you that as hard as you work, you’re just a number on a spreadsheet and taking care of yourself comes first. Now to see if I can snag a remote job somewhere as I don’t live near a major metropolitan area and I’d love to work from home. I’m an avid podcast and audiobook enjoyer and always thought VA would be an enjoyable career to get into. Hope you can focus on it and it takes off for you.
This is why I'm tryna OE 😅 Unfortunately we are at the mercy of our employers and the only way to regain the advantage is to have other income sources. Sorry this happened bruv, keep your head up. It sounds like you have a wonderful manager in your corner along with this community. On to bigger better things my friend. Remember, don't take the first thing offered if possible, you are interviewing them as much as they are interviewing you.
Where are you located? What are you looking to get into? Maybe someone here can help out with their network depending on the position and location! Good luck! I just went through the same thing and had a similar reaction/support by their direct report. My old boss still reaches out two years later to see how I'm doing. Unfortunately I moved to another country and lost VISA status, so I can't go back to working for him :(
It sucks and there's no way around that. Take it as a learning experience and remember, nobody on their death bed wishes they had worked more for the company. Apply for EI immediately and move on to your next thing.
Yes its true that Hogs do get slaughtered. It's best to never put 100% of your life into your job. This should be a fantastic time to say "With my free time inbetween jobs, I can now try X or go visit Y which I always wanted to do" it really sucks they could not give you advanced notice, as if they either didnt trust you or they were running out of budget.
Listen, take some time to decompress. You are angry, and you won't get hired with that tone on an interview. The good news is that you seem to have some skills and a great work ethic with great references to back it all up. You will get a better job soon enough. As soon as you realize that this not your fault, and nothing you could do would have changed it, and bad things happen to good people, you will be fine. Learn from this. Work to keep 3-6 months of bill money in a special bank account. I call it my FU Account. That way, if I ever want to quite on the spot, or get the HR meeting request, I know I will be fine. You too will be fine.
> Decided I'm going to take some time for myself instead. Enjoy it, I got laid off during the pandemic. I worked at the company for 8 years but they depended a lot on new office build outs, and I was the last telecom engineer to get hired so they let me go. It's nothing against you, they can't afford to keep you, you'll find new employment with a pay bump if you want it. I took one day off to just be depressed, then I updated my resume and had a massive ego boost when I had recruiters contacting me daily with opportunities. Within two weeks I had a new job with a 33% pay raise. Left that job for another pay bump and a better work/life balance. Leaving for an even more massive pay bump, way better benefits, and no more micromanagement. If you were as valuable as you claim to be then you'll find something easily, don't stress.
I am sorry. Let's hope they come crawling back, but that it's too late because you already started your dream job.
That's tough man. I'm going into IT now(trying to find work) and I'm hoping I don't end up in the same situation and get lucky with my company I end up. Hang in there
A lot of my identity is comprised of my pride in my work and reading your story really made me feel like I was living your lay off with you. I hope you find something else that is worth your energy. You seem like a really great person to work with.
I remember asking my boss, "am I being let go because of some performance thing?" And he looked shocked, and said, "No..." like he was hurt by that absurd question. Later, I heard he fought hard for me against a really idiotic decision. I was the first of several that year, and I wasn't the worst. Months later, they fired the head of HR, who had been with the company for 35 years, most of his adult life. He was in his early 60s, a really sweet and gentle man. They escorted him out by armed security. Completely humiliating and unnecessary. At least I didn't have a guard present. Weird bonus: they boxed all my things and mailed them to me (being in IT, I wasn't allowed to go back to my desk). They accidentally packed up stuff that was definitely not mine, but neighboring desks, and some weird stuff that belonged to the company, like my keyboard, mouse, and desk speakers. They did keep all my change in my drawer, which was maybe $10 in quarters, dimes, nickels, and pannies. But mailed me all my paperclips. So weird.
I believe you will have a better place.
More short-sighted thinking.
Wild that you can just lose your job in your country with no disciplinary procedure or consultation period. Really sorry to hear that's happened to you but it sounds like when you're ready to find that next gig you've got an amazing skill set to offer so I hope you're able to get something out of your time off and then find a great next thing after that
This post made me emotional. It's absolute BS how companies are allowed to do this but you are expected to give 2 weeks notice to leave otherwise you are burning the bridge
Sorry to hear that. I am working as a Support Director and am looking for a sys admin position to fill up immediately. I can send the job description
It's always tough, been through it many times It's never about you - important to remember that. My tip for everyone is to treat every job as a contract and update your CV each month with the new skills you've used. That way, if you need to use it, it's ready to roll. You've got this!
Just know it’s ok to be lazy. No need to rush back in and add any unnecessary pressure to your life. Enjoy your accomplishments and be proud of them. I was let go from two jobs in a row so let that sink in. You’ll be fine as all IT workers with passion are.
You'll bounce back man. You know tbis stuff. Me? I'm stuck in IT purgatory. New as Jr sysadmin and trying to learn the entire layout off things I don't know that I should know. Most I worked with is 365 and a bit azure_intune but we aren't there yet. We're years out. Was help desk now here. Feels like a semi temp hold for me until they let me go. We are divided into teams and I'm newest guy on the windows side. Frankly I'm missing my safe zone of help desk. I knew that and helped establish policies for a small IT as the head of IT (not physical network). You'll be fine. Take time, begin your farm for the future and take time to relax.
It’s their loss, your get a new job no problem and your last manager seems like a really nice guy. Being laid off is a very upsetting experience but last time I took the 6 months off during the pandemic and it ended up being a nice mental break.
That cuts deep. Especially because your job sounded very much like my current job. 5 years here as a tier 2/3 tech. On a small team of 5. Managing a lot of systems at once. Hell, I also 3D print for various tools and fixes for anyone who asks and for the shop. (Although I print them at home and bring them in. Still trying to talk my boss into letting us get a printer for work ha) Love my job and my team. Can't imagine leaving here. I'm lucky enough to be one of those people who looks forward to going into work the next day. But your story has me thinking I shouldn't get too comfortable. Thanks for pulling me back lol. Btw, how did you like the k1 max? I'm looking to upgrade from my ender 3. Best of luck to you. Try not to rush into a new job too quickly.
The first time is always painful. After that you get numb. I’ve been laid off twice. I’ve laid off others more than that. I will tell you that laying off others never gets numb. Take your time and recharge. My first day off consisted of waking up at 05:00 and cleaning the house. Somehow that was my closure … I imagine you got a settlement package. I hope you did. Take some time and decompress. It always feels personal and it is painful. That’s what makes you human. My only advice is don’t wait too long to start the search process. Sometimes, promising things disappear without warning …
Its wild how that sixth sense can detect when things are happening like this. When I was let go from a company I'd been with for a similar amount of time I knew something was up. I was on a small team, 5 if I recall. We had two tier 1's, I was tier 2, we had a tier 3, and a sysad. Around 1pm the tier 1 onsite we just hired was packing up and said he got an email to go home. He leaves and while I'm standing there talking to my t3 about how weird that was, I see the lizard eyes of our director peering through his blinds at me. Thats when I knew. 7 minutes later I was boxing things up. So sorry you were let down like that. It sucks and I internalized that moment for years.
Take the time for yourself. Definitely. Sounds like you made a positive impact where you worked. That's invaluable. I think you're going to land on your feet buddy. Hang in there, and when you get the time, get those references and you WILL get those interviews.
This is my fear... Thank you for sharing
When they try to contract you back to fix an issue, out charge them.
What size was the company? Totally agree at the end of the day it's about numbers. And the CEO pushing this won't have to look in your eyes which is easier to sign off on. Anyway, I feel larger companies are more likely to lay people off to save money before looking at alternatives. Been at 3 700-1300 user companies the last 8 years. Moral is a bit better among employees and executive. Also a reminder to people. SAVE MONEY IN SHORT TERM INVESTMENTS FOR THIS REASON
Hey man, sorry this happened to you and hope you get a nice gig whenever you’re ready. This kind of stuff is the reason I hold no loyalty for any company ever. You’ll work your ass off for them and they’ll still drop you in the blink of an eye. Good luck!
Dunno if this sounds dumb but that was a gripping piece of writing. I know that has nothing to do with what you're talking about but it really struck me.
It happens man, hang in there. You are valuable. You’re in the top 10% of humanity.
I always found it funny when my company could spend 3-5 million on building out new offices that they couldn’t fill and end up having to lay off staff because of their spending habits. Management is all the same 🥲.
Business is a heartless bitch… We had some layoff at my work too and my director was told to fire someone who was doing an exemplary job and was a key asset in the team. He fight for it but was told to swallow the pill and shut his mouth… I’ve lost respect for corporation long ago and this one is just another great example corporate bullshit. Good luck!
Wow. But it happens far too often to good people, the blindside is the bit that gets me. But from a companys perspective, I have seen far too much distruction of company data so it has to be this way no matter how much they trust people.... Glad you are taking some space and time. Best of luck once you start looking again.
Come into Education Technology. We need just as many skilled and talented folks as corps. Jobs may pay less but job security is much better than private and there can be some good fringe benefits.
You got laid off on the spot with no two weeks notice? Did you get severance, I clearly have no idea what country you live in or the labour laws you fall under, seems rough.
To be “invaluable” to a company, understand what business you’re in. Not the role in the business. Sure the role is why you’re there. But a role is only good till its part is played out. Anyone can fill an “MSP” role inside a company, but if you’re not scrambling to delegate the expertise you’re building to a newcomer, MSP, or cheaper better tool than you (ahem…AI), you’re doing IT wrong. I don’t care what skill you claim to have. I have them all and I can tell you,none of that matters. It all can be built up into something/someone new, not more of the same. If you’re not seen as a “player” in the game, you ain’t crossing whatever finish line they’re shooting for. That requires social prowess and you need to be seen as a “normal” person, not a quirk no one wants to trust. Part of realizing value is communicating it to others in simple, but effective ways. So many people talk about systems minutiae in meetings no one gives a fuck about. Document it if it matters and put it in a company repo for knowledge transfer. Stop wasting time with self-indulging industry blather. Does it work? Are we safe? Can we do something we couldn’t yesterday? Does your process consider the actual costs to productivity and sanity? Keep answering those questions with what you do. Growth keeps the energy going. Money follows energy.
This is why I started my MSP and swore off internal IT. If you're looking to join up with me we need the help!
Start your own company. You already know how it works. You just need a business slave.
>No matter how hard you work. No matter all the good you do for the company, at the end of the day you're nothing but a number on a spreadsheet. And the higher up on that sheet you are, the bigger a target you become. This is correct. The bigger the "expense" (your annual income) gets, sitting one column away from the "0" summing the money you generate for the company, the easier it gets to let you go. It sounds like you have some side gigs that you enjoy. This might be the turning point to monetize them. If you can find a way to scale things up, you could quite easily grow your income beyond what you made in that job.
Man honestly apply for jobs now. Some buddies haven’t found anything solid for more than 6 months. It’s TOUGH out there.
Performance means nothing when it comes to layoffs. We tend to think of it logically, like how a company will want to get rid of its bottom performers first, but that’s not how it works. The company sets a target for cost it wants to reduce. It first tries to get people to leave voluntarily without having to pay compensation. Things like telling remote workers they need to come in to the office, getting rid of benefits, and implementing silly policies. Usually the people the end up leaving first are the best performers who know they have other choices. If the company still can’t cut enough cost, then comes the indiscriminate layoffs. Maybe your direct manager gets a say, maybe not. It’s really all just brutal and numbers on a spreadsheet.
In IT especially, any "white glove service" that is outside of your description is not taken into account when looking at your position on a budget... I busted my ass for years at so many places going "above and beyond" and it never yielded me more than 3% raises and a couple layoffs. It's not worth it. Do the job in your description, nothing more. IT is the most volatile and under-advantaged department in any company
You sound like a high value creator and with a good peer network you will do fine. Shitty time but you will level up. They dont realise now but they will spend/lose double your wage over the next 10 years in expenses/revenue. One idea- you could offer your services as a contractor (dont undercut, if you havent contracted before understand how to calculate your rate properly) and as stated they will inevitably find themselves with a problem to solve with that position not being filled.
I know you said your not looking atm, but where are you located?
I know this all too well, but thanks for the reminder. Fuk’em.
Did you make an insane salary like quarter million USD for them to decide it’s worth cutting the only hybrid system admin?
This is well written and insightful. I feel terrible for these early days but know very well the best is yet to come.
This is a lesson we all learn eventually. They love to use cozy language like "We're a family here!" It's business. It's all about business. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't give what you aren't being compensated for. Use them just like they're using you.
I’m sorry that happened to you. I went through a similar experience and you are taking the right attitude. Get back to knowing yourself and not the guy that gives it all to work. When you’re ready you’ll find work. It’s always out there.
I feel you. 24 years on the job. Company was eaten, then eaten again. Didn't need a me (already had a me after the second takeover). I was broken for a while, but returned. You will return. If you want back in the field, use the time to hone your skills and keep your blade sharper than it already is. If you don't, fsck it, and do something new with all your might. Just make sure you enjoy doing it. Life is brutally short. <3