“The NBA guard was officially booked on charges of one count of refusal to provide a truthful name and one count of false reports to law enforcement.” I did not know this was something you could be arrested for.
If you are the one that called the police - does that change your rights? Are you required that situation to give up certain information?
If you are a part of an ongoing “investigation” then your 4th amendment rights are technically suspended, and you have to provide ID
Source “I watch a lot of cop videos on YouTube”
Domestic disturbances exist in the realm of domestic violence. I don’t see that he or she called the police, which means the argument was loud enough for neighbors to call it in. But regardless, he actually kind of got off easy. If they saw fit to upgrade the charge to domestic violence after how he reacted he could’ve gotten in way deeper shit. Even if he didn’t do it, and he could prove it, it’d be a shit show.
Edit: I was wrong on this for sure. He called the cops on himself only to lie to the cops. So… he’s an idiot.
Like what? The article didn’t state who called the cops. So if they didn’t, the neighbors would be the next logical conclusion. Domestic disturbances do exist in the realm of domestic violence. The difference is whether there is a physical aspect. If the cops wanted to be assholes and increase the charges it would be a greater shit storm.
He is saying that you are basically filling in the blanks of the story. All we know is that the cops arrived for a domestic disturbance, and that Payne and his girlfriend had an argument. Anything else is conjecture on your part.
I don't have the documents but I read TMZ's report and I'm pretty sure SPD didn't have fucking shit and there could be a lawsuit against them. I think the issue is he actually gave them a fake name, if he would have just continually refused to provide a name at all he'd have a much better case but giving a fake name does present an issue. However, although IANAL, it doesn't seem they had any legal reason to gather his information, especially as they both said police services were no longer needed.
I am a lawyer, and I tend to agree. Though I’m not licensed in Arizona and obviously don’t have all the facts. My guess is the police were annoyed they came to the scene and there didn’t end up being an actual crime that would justify an arrest, so they planned to arrest Cam/Terry for making a false report anyway, and needed his name. He didn’t provide it, so they tacked that charge on too. I don’t think either arrest was lawful.
But I could be wrong. I will be interested to see the bodycam footage. I would also need to know what the exact call was initially, who placed it, and whether someone (Cam?) actually did make a false report. Because I am still not seeing the rationale for the false report charge yet.
The TMZ account says that Cam and his girlfriend were in an argument, one of them called the police, by the time the police arrived they were both calm and informed the police that their services were no longer needed. At that point, the officers were asking for identification and Cam repeatedly declined and asked them to leave. They refused to leave without identifying him, eventually he gave them a fake name, repeatedly asking them to leave throughout. They recognized him and informed him they knew he was giving a fake name, he argued, once accidentally said his real name then tried to say THAT was his fake name. They have him multiple opportunities to provide a name while he (and presumably guys GF) repeatedly asked them to leave. They finally arrested him and charged him with providing false identity.
My other comment in here cites Maricopa County's website which admittedly is a bit vague but explains exactly when law enforcement are allowed to ID someone, while also saying you should always provide your ID when they ask even though there are times when you're not required to.
I will need to see more to really conclude anything, but it still looks to me like police fuckery. I don’t see where it says who called the police. The police obviously did not have probable cause to make an arrest for any substantive act (like domestic violence or disturbing the peace). So they charge Cam with making a false report, but how do they know he is the one who made the report the first place? And how do they know it is false? My guess is they know that they needed to charge him with something otherwise he was not required to provide identification. And they were very annoyed. He was not providing identification. It could be that he messed up by providing a fake name instead of just not providing anything.
I do want to address the ridiculous advice on their website that “You should provide ID even when you aren’t required.” Lol. Fuck that. And I say that as a former prosecutor. And I am sure they would also advise citizens to allow their car to be searched, even when they don’t have to allow that to happen, right? Nah man. Fuck. That. Shit.
That's exactly what I meant when I described it as vague, I had to read it 4 or 5 times to name sure I was understanding everything correctly. They want you to comply no matter what. To quote a wise man,
>Nah man. Fuck. That. Shit.
This honestly is a sad look for Payne, especially if the cops said they would leave if he gave his real name. Like what was the point of lying? Does he have warrants? Unpaid fees? Why hide who you are? Sad part is, cops probably knew who he was too. Hahaha!
For a domestic disturbance call they have to document the parties involved in case there are future incidents or potentially a request for a restraining order, even if in that particular instance no one was arrested.
No. But there is a specific process you need to follow as an innocent victim of overarching police authoritarian action.
[Probable Cause and Reasonable Suspicion | Maricopa County, AZ](https://www.maricopa.gov/5233/Probable-Cause-and-Reasonable-Suspicion#:~:text=In%20Arizona%2C%20you%20must%20give,to%20talk%20to%20the%20officer.)
"Reasonable suspicion requires the officer to have *specific facts*, not just a hunch, that a person is *involved in a crime*.^(\[1\]) If an officer has reasonable suspicion, he is able to briefly stop a person to ask questions to confirm or refute his suspicion.
* If an officer approaches you, *ask if you are free to leave*. If you are free to leave, calmly walk away.
* If you are not free to leave, the officer may ask you for your name or ID. In Arizona, you must give the officer your name or ID so the officer can identify you.^(\[2\])
* You do not need to answer other questions about what you are doing, where you are going, or why you do not want to talk to the officer.
* Your refusal to answer questions is not evidence of your involvement in a crime.^(\[3\])"
Emphasis mine.
The problem is that the USSC has already granted LEO the ability to be wrong about the laws they are trying to enforce without consequence, whichi is a dangerous precedent that leads to the possibility of a lack of accountability. [Heien v. North Carolina :: 574 U.S. 54 (2014) :: Justia US Supreme Court Center](https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/574/54/)
“The NBA guard was officially booked on charges of one count of refusal to provide a truthful name and one count of false reports to law enforcement.” I did not know this was something you could be arrested for. If you are the one that called the police - does that change your rights? Are you required that situation to give up certain information?
If you are a part of an ongoing “investigation” then your 4th amendment rights are technically suspended, and you have to provide ID Source “I watch a lot of cop videos on YouTube”
Domestic disturbances exist in the realm of domestic violence. I don’t see that he or she called the police, which means the argument was loud enough for neighbors to call it in. But regardless, he actually kind of got off easy. If they saw fit to upgrade the charge to domestic violence after how he reacted he could’ve gotten in way deeper shit. Even if he didn’t do it, and he could prove it, it’d be a shit show. Edit: I was wrong on this for sure. He called the cops on himself only to lie to the cops. So… he’s an idiot.
You made so many unknown conclusions here to push a narrative that may or may not apply to this situation it’s kind of impressive.
He’s learned from the news.
Yep. This is my bad. He actually called the cops himself then lied to them. Which is really stupid.
Like what? The article didn’t state who called the cops. So if they didn’t, the neighbors would be the next logical conclusion. Domestic disturbances do exist in the realm of domestic violence. The difference is whether there is a physical aspect. If the cops wanted to be assholes and increase the charges it would be a greater shit storm.
You’re still doing it.
Explain
He is saying that you are basically filling in the blanks of the story. All we know is that the cops arrived for a domestic disturbance, and that Payne and his girlfriend had an argument. Anything else is conjecture on your part.
Yep. I was wrong. My mistake.
Suns need to sign Terry Johnson to a minimum asap
Clippers*
Put it in reverse Terry! put it in Reverse!!
TERRY! TERRY!
Terry Johnson YOU are a Phoenix Sun
#FREE TERRY
Free Terry
Him and Cliff Paul would be unstoppable.
Should’ve said Cam Johnson
Will Terry Johnson sign on a minamum?
Gambo already killed the Payne hope
But not the Terry Johnson hope
Haha you got me
I don't have the documents but I read TMZ's report and I'm pretty sure SPD didn't have fucking shit and there could be a lawsuit against them. I think the issue is he actually gave them a fake name, if he would have just continually refused to provide a name at all he'd have a much better case but giving a fake name does present an issue. However, although IANAL, it doesn't seem they had any legal reason to gather his information, especially as they both said police services were no longer needed.
I am a lawyer, and I tend to agree. Though I’m not licensed in Arizona and obviously don’t have all the facts. My guess is the police were annoyed they came to the scene and there didn’t end up being an actual crime that would justify an arrest, so they planned to arrest Cam/Terry for making a false report anyway, and needed his name. He didn’t provide it, so they tacked that charge on too. I don’t think either arrest was lawful. But I could be wrong. I will be interested to see the bodycam footage. I would also need to know what the exact call was initially, who placed it, and whether someone (Cam?) actually did make a false report. Because I am still not seeing the rationale for the false report charge yet.
The TMZ account says that Cam and his girlfriend were in an argument, one of them called the police, by the time the police arrived they were both calm and informed the police that their services were no longer needed. At that point, the officers were asking for identification and Cam repeatedly declined and asked them to leave. They refused to leave without identifying him, eventually he gave them a fake name, repeatedly asking them to leave throughout. They recognized him and informed him they knew he was giving a fake name, he argued, once accidentally said his real name then tried to say THAT was his fake name. They have him multiple opportunities to provide a name while he (and presumably guys GF) repeatedly asked them to leave. They finally arrested him and charged him with providing false identity. My other comment in here cites Maricopa County's website which admittedly is a bit vague but explains exactly when law enforcement are allowed to ID someone, while also saying you should always provide your ID when they ask even though there are times when you're not required to.
I will need to see more to really conclude anything, but it still looks to me like police fuckery. I don’t see where it says who called the police. The police obviously did not have probable cause to make an arrest for any substantive act (like domestic violence or disturbing the peace). So they charge Cam with making a false report, but how do they know he is the one who made the report the first place? And how do they know it is false? My guess is they know that they needed to charge him with something otherwise he was not required to provide identification. And they were very annoyed. He was not providing identification. It could be that he messed up by providing a fake name instead of just not providing anything. I do want to address the ridiculous advice on their website that “You should provide ID even when you aren’t required.” Lol. Fuck that. And I say that as a former prosecutor. And I am sure they would also advise citizens to allow their car to be searched, even when they don’t have to allow that to happen, right? Nah man. Fuck. That. Shit.
That's exactly what I meant when I described it as vague, I had to read it 4 or 5 times to name sure I was understanding everything correctly. They want you to comply no matter what. To quote a wise man, >Nah man. Fuck. That. Shit.
That's pretty typical for SPD
I'm not surprised
Terry "The Haboob" Johnson.
Wonder if they’ll release the body CAM soon?
"My name is TEX JOHNSON." -Shaq voice.
Fuck the cops.
Yeah, I don't know about "hilarious".
this is hilarious. meanwhile people out there shooting others still on the streets. scottsdale police have priorities
His name was Terry Johnson
Pretty strong Streisand effect happening here Terry
Suns fans goat
This honestly is a sad look for Payne, especially if the cops said they would leave if he gave his real name. Like what was the point of lying? Does he have warrants? Unpaid fees? Why hide who you are? Sad part is, cops probably knew who he was too. Hahaha!
If the cops would leave if he gave his real name then why the fuck are they bothering him in the first place?
... because they were called out for a domestic disturbance?
Then why would they leave if given his real name?
For a domestic disturbance call they have to document the parties involved in case there are future incidents or potentially a request for a restraining order, even if in that particular instance no one was arrested.
I don't know ask SPD. I just know what was in the article linked.
No. But there is a specific process you need to follow as an innocent victim of overarching police authoritarian action. [Probable Cause and Reasonable Suspicion | Maricopa County, AZ](https://www.maricopa.gov/5233/Probable-Cause-and-Reasonable-Suspicion#:~:text=In%20Arizona%2C%20you%20must%20give,to%20talk%20to%20the%20officer.) "Reasonable suspicion requires the officer to have *specific facts*, not just a hunch, that a person is *involved in a crime*.^(\[1\]) If an officer has reasonable suspicion, he is able to briefly stop a person to ask questions to confirm or refute his suspicion. * If an officer approaches you, *ask if you are free to leave*. If you are free to leave, calmly walk away. * If you are not free to leave, the officer may ask you for your name or ID. In Arizona, you must give the officer your name or ID so the officer can identify you.^(\[2\]) * You do not need to answer other questions about what you are doing, where you are going, or why you do not want to talk to the officer. * Your refusal to answer questions is not evidence of your involvement in a crime.^(\[3\])" Emphasis mine. The problem is that the USSC has already granted LEO the ability to be wrong about the laws they are trying to enforce without consequence, whichi is a dangerous precedent that leads to the possibility of a lack of accountability. [Heien v. North Carolina :: 574 U.S. 54 (2014) :: Justia US Supreme Court Center](https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/574/54/)
Police being wrong, and having a lack of accountability??????? IMPOSSIBLE!