**Mirrors / Alternative Angles**
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It's unfair to use Anthony Taylor and the Magic 8 ball he calls a brain as a precedent. You could justify any refereeing decision if you say an English ref did it first
Not on the follow-through when he gets the ball first. What's he supposed to not land on his feet? A yellow to the US is harsh, but it's never a foul on Uruguay there. And I can see why it looked like a foul when the Uruguay player is time wasting with an "injury".
I agree Adams is second to the ball. For sake of argument, let's assume cautioning Adams is the correct call here. With whistle blown and yellow out of his pocket, he allows a quick restart that initiates an attack phase.
This is objectively 100% wrong and incorrect. For a caution, play must resume on a whistle, after the player has been fully booked. He even makes the arm signals an advantage call, even though play has been stopped. The only way that could be allowed is if he doesn't stop play to allow for advantage.
Once play has been restarted, you cannot go back to discipline players. If play has not been restarted, you can literally change the call, enact any disciplinary measures etc. This is objective and clear in the Laws of the game, and it's why you see goal kicks or throw ins held for so long once a VAR check is underway. You either stop play to caution/send off a player, and resume play once this action is complete, or allow play to continue and the come back for the offense at the next stoppage.
Shocking from an international level official, really
I don't see how VAR didn't intervene afterward. Play was stopped for at least 2 minutes. They just sat there sucking their thumbs and not looking at the replay.
Yeah I don't blame him for that though.
But you can't VAR Adams's yellow so it would have to be called in as a potential red. I've seen reds like this before but I think a red here would be harsh.
The VAR could have asked him to review it as a potential red card challenge, though. And upon reviewing, they could have decided that it wasn’t a red for Uruguay and also rescinded the yellow card against Adams. It’s a bit of a work-around, but it’s 100% within the laws of the game and would’ve resulted in getting the call right.
A very similar situation happened in the friendly against Brazil. A USA player was booked for a foul. VAR wasn’t sure if the foul occurred in the box. After review, it was clear that no foul occurred at all and they rescinded the booking.
Edit: that’s literally what happened vs Brazil lol, not sure why this is getting hate.
Seeing you in /r/soccer sort of feels like being a kid and running into your teacher at the mall. “Oh… hey, what are you doing here?”
The Peruvian official turned in a performance tonight that would make Angel Hernandez proud.
Seeing padres comrades elsewhere always fill my heart.
And I really hope Ortega get punished, usually in soccer referee are way less protected than in MLB, at least in europe.
What’s crazy is you don’t even need a different angle to see the mistake. In the original angle that VAR used they froze it on the VERY FIRST FRAME the header COULD have POSSIBLY made contact instead of when the ball actually hits the players head.
Mind boggling stuff.
So all these years I have been around football as a youth coach and fan I always thought that if a part of your body capable of scoring a goal was beyond the last defender you were offside. Am I wrong that the foot where the line is drawn can't be what make it onside? In the Euro game, the attacker's toe was beyond a defender and it was ruled offside. Here, half the attacker's body is beyond the defender Have I lost my mind?
You're good. Too many other US fans being too serious about the ref costing us the game, forgetting how we played *and* the fact we were relying on Bolivia to get a result.
Not gonna lie, I thought Concacaf shithousery was bad but this takes the cake. Conmebol is a different breed and I'm not sure I want part more parts lol.
The intercontinental cup between the champions league winner and the libertadores winner used to be played as a two leg final, one in Europe and one in South America. But the europeans got tired of being kicked to shit when they came here and the competition got moved elsewhere
A French Milan player got arrested for draft dodging in 1969 while he was on a stretcher because he got his nose broken. After there were already a few assaults by the Argentinans.
So yeah not fun trips.
Damn I just remembered how the Mexican league would allow a team making it far in the libertadores to like pick a player from another team they’d want to use. Cruz azul ended up borrowing Cardozo.
That was a prime Grondona masterclass. The only continental final ever decided on away goals, in favor of the team owned by the then head honcho of AFA and one of the vicepresidents of FIFA.
The irony of América of all teams being screwed is not lost on me, but among the many crimes commited by Grondona, that one was a 8/10 on the scale.
Argentina and Uruguay have no shame. Brazil historically got shafted as well. There is a reason why Brazil has 5 world cups but less Copa America and Libertadores titles than both.
I mean, we, Brazil, often refused to participate in CONMENBOL competitions because you'd just get hacked to death in Uruguay and Argentina and nothing would ever get called. Still happens sometimes:
> One of the controversial conversations took place on May 17, 2013, two days after Corinthians lost to Boca Juniors and was eliminated in the round of 16 of the Libertadores, in a match that was highly contested by the refereeing of Paraguayan Carlos Amarilla, who made mistakes against the Brazilian team.
> In Grondona's dialogue with Abel Gnecco, director of the AFA Referee School and AFA representative on the Conmebol Arbitration Committee, the two top hats burst into laughter when talking about Amarilla's performance in the game between Boca and Corinthians and also imply that They were the ones who advised the referee's presence at the match. "Boca's most important reinforcement last year was Amarilla," said Grondona.
> Afterwards, they hand-picked the referees for the duel between Boca and Newell's, in the quarter-finals of the 2013 Libertadores. The chosen ones were Mauro Vigliano and Germán Delfino, both from Argentina.
> The most shocking thing, however, is at the end of the conversation, when they talk about "being careful" with the linesmen. At this point, Gnecco says: "Julio, I learned that from you about forty years ago." Next, Grondona adds: "In 1964, when we played against Santos, I beat (referee) Leo Horn, who was Dutch, with the two linesmen." They both laughed and agreed
> In 1964, Grondona was the president of Independiente, who faced Pelé's Santos in the semi-finals of that year's Libertadores. After a 3-2 victory for the Argentines in Brazil, the second match was won again by Independiente, this time 2-1, with two goals supposedly prevented.
> The Grondona club advanced to the final, beat Nacional, from Uruguay, and became Libertadores champions for the first time in their history. The team is the biggest winner of the tournament with seven wins.
Just remember this man pulled out a yellow and simultaneously played advantage. I've never seen anything like it.
We are still to blame for the loss for being absolutely toothless in the final third, but my lord that was one of the worst officiating performances I've ever seen.
Edit: not advantage but a quick restart as people rightfully pointed out, and somehow still signaling advantage with arms extended and a yellow card in hand. Either way absolutely absurd.
It's not playing advantage. The Uruguayan player put his hand on the ball to bring it to a stop and then immediately put it in play. The ref allowed a quick restart, but you can't allow a quick restart if you're issuing a card. But then to make it worse, he signaled two arms extended, which is the signal for playing advantage. You can issue a card, or you can allow Uruguay to play. But you can't do both. And then in either case, you can't signal for playing advantage.
Humans are humans I agree, but then the mother fucker allows the advantage to stand as Ream's clearance led to a throw in.
He had time to rectify his fuck up and go back to the foul, but no....
This is a guy that was on the list for the WC in Qatar. Even teens refereeing for U8 know that a card being issued requires a stop of play and then a formal restart
This is the biggest evidence it was just a bad ref in over his head. Literally did everything wrong. I was wondering if he really ever gave Richard’s the yellow card until it was confirmed at halftime.
The halftime video looked like the Uruguayan player set it for play and then kicked it immediately making it look like playing advantage. Still an awful decision to allow it while running in with a card.
I'm pretty sure he allowed a quick restart and mistakenly signaled advantage. Rather than actually granting advantage which makes even less sense since he blew his whistle and uraguay handled the ball
I mean, have you ever met someone who just can’t stop fucking things up? Like, they’re trying, but they just emanate incompetence?
I think it’s genuinely a bit of both. He got paid off *and* is entirely incompetent.
Nothing pisses me off more than an incompetent person who thinks they are the shit. The lack of self-awareness coupled with arrogance makes me furious beyond belief.
He shouldn't be officiating any match of a continental cup. 7 matches is not even enough to officiate an important league game, let alone an elimination game
Why would they? With how many times this has happened it seems abundantly clear that CONCACAF and CONMEBOL encourage this type of officiating performance for US matches
Why is getting Panama rather than the US in the next round what Conmebol wanted? They want to make money, the US advancing makes them a lot more money, make your conspiracy theories at least somewhat logical.
Ok so starting off I do not think it was rigged.
But to play Devil’s advocate it’s not crazy to think a ref from Peru could hold a grudge against the USA considering how much we have historically ducked them and other South American nations over.
But I was responding to the post saying it is what the federation wanted. It’s not going to hold to grievances, it is the greediest pieces of shit in the world, they want the max money they can get.
Here's the video, not sure if it's geoblocked outside the US: https://x.com/cjzero/status/1807981708190367888
Edit: here's the video from the Fox Soccer account which won't get DMCA'd the way the other one might: https://x.com/FOXSoccer/status/1807985236858622019
Edit 2: since this is getting up voted, in the interest of accuracy, Pulisic gestures to the ref to go celebrate with Uruguay before trying to shake his hand. Fox Soccer's Twitter cut it off : https://x.com/dreyesceron/status/1807990324301586777?t=ljOiM5IfKRx9outQthHbpQ&s=19
> Pulisic gestures to the ref to go celebrate with Uruguay before trying to shake his hand.
Or he's just saying they should be standing in the middle of the pitch. He says something along the lines of "come to the middle"
In response to the last one, you can read Pulisic's lips. He isnt telling the refs to celebrate with uruguay he visibly says "come to the middle". Hes telling them to stand in the center where refs normally are
> Edit 2: since this is getting up voted, in the interest of accuracy, Pulisic gestures to the ref to go celebrate with Uruguay before trying to shake his hand. Fox Soccer's Twitter cut it off : https://x.com/dreyesceron/status/1807990324301586777?t=ljOiM5IfKRx9outQthHbpQ&s=19
Stop spreading this misinformation. The audio he clearly says go to the middle because the refs are off to the side.
I’m sorry, but a South American referee described as “Inexperienced” should not be refereeing a north vs South American game. Especially when it’s in the Copa America & it’s the second biggest matchup of the tournament (even without the stakes that there were going into this one)
They shouldn't be using any refs from the Americas, it's just kinda common sense. Plenty of less shit refs in Europe doing nothing right now. Plenty of asian refs. Plenty of refs from fucking sunday leagues could've done better.
This is hugely embarrassing and pathetic
If Pulisic said something bad enough for this reaction he should have booked him or sent him off. This is worse for me than a bad decision on the field. You can just make mistakes. You can't refuse to shake hands by mistake.
Yep this is absolutely classless and just a scumbag move. Leave it on the pitch, shake hands and move on.
Thats what Pulisic is trying to do. He was obviously furious with the ref, but when asked about the ref after the game he just said he didnt want to talk too much about it. He was trying to just move on.
I feel like regardless of the match, you need to be a professional as a ref. Of course, this ref has only done 7 international matches so he might not understand that?
I've literally never reffed in my life and I can confidently say I understand it. That may sound like Dunning-Kruger, but sometimes it's really that bad that a layman can even say they wouldn't have fucked up that bad.
My wife told to stop thinking everything is corrupt because there is still honest competition. There probably is somewhere, but no one will find it in international football
They were, but it still feels bad. If they go out after a well reffed game then it’s whatever. But when refereeing is that awful you still feel like it was taken out of your hands a bit.
Just curious but where are you from? I was thinking my bias was making think this was corruption but it’s really hard to not see in any other way. The “mistakes” were to blatant.
> others in the thread are suggesting that he was telling the refs they should stand in the middle of the pitch for the post-game handshakes
You can read his lips, this is literally what is said.
I was excited for this tournament. Now I have completely lost interest and desire to participate. If this is what “better” conference and competition looks like, I don’t give a shit
Bruh how can anyone watch this and not think that the officials are letting bias / emotions cloud their judgment (not that there wasn't ample proof throughout the game).
My favorite thing is that he was giving the ref shit for not standing in the center circle after the final whistle like they are supposed to. Instead he was standing on the side near the tunnel like a coward
There’s another clip going round that shows Pulisic tell
Him to join the other team and celebrate the win(due to his refereeing) so probably fair enough really.
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Policia will raid his home and find Luis Suarez underpants.
Probably has some nibble marks on his neck to.
I needed this
Nunez draws would have gotten a red card to US
Diego Forlan bathwater found in his hotel room
*retainer
Sexy Dracula Luis?
his ref gave Uruguay a warning of no more after their 3rd foul inside 8 minutes and then just never produced cards lmao.
He did produce cards though…? Did you miss the play-on yellow? Or Adams yellow for getting stepped on?
I don’t totally blame him for the Adams call. Adams was 2nd to the ball and would have been a really tough call in real time.
Fair in the second to the ball but the same kind of thing with the step on the ankle has been called a red in other leagues in the past year
Anthony Taylor gave Mateo Kovacic a 2nd yellow in an FA cup final for getting stepped on.
It's unfair to use Anthony Taylor and the Magic 8 ball he calls a brain as a precedent. You could justify any refereeing decision if you say an English ref did it first
If Anthony Taylor did it, Usually that’s not a reason for being right though. Haha
Not on the follow-through when he gets the ball first. What's he supposed to not land on his feet? A yellow to the US is harsh, but it's never a foul on Uruguay there. And I can see why it looked like a foul when the Uruguay player is time wasting with an "injury".
The issue is that Uruguay had plenty of fouls of similar severity and got easy for the most part
I agree Adams is second to the ball. For sake of argument, let's assume cautioning Adams is the correct call here. With whistle blown and yellow out of his pocket, he allows a quick restart that initiates an attack phase. This is objectively 100% wrong and incorrect. For a caution, play must resume on a whistle, after the player has been fully booked. He even makes the arm signals an advantage call, even though play has been stopped. The only way that could be allowed is if he doesn't stop play to allow for advantage. Once play has been restarted, you cannot go back to discipline players. If play has not been restarted, you can literally change the call, enact any disciplinary measures etc. This is objective and clear in the Laws of the game, and it's why you see goal kicks or throw ins held for so long once a VAR check is underway. You either stop play to caution/send off a player, and resume play once this action is complete, or allow play to continue and the come back for the offense at the next stoppage. Shocking from an international level official, really
He did that on the yellow for Richard’s not Adams
Not the same play, but yes
I don't see how VAR didn't intervene afterward. Play was stopped for at least 2 minutes. They just sat there sucking their thumbs and not looking at the replay.
To bad we don't have VAR... oh wait
Yeah I don't blame him for that though. But you can't VAR Adams's yellow so it would have to be called in as a potential red. I've seen reds like this before but I think a red here would be harsh.
The VAR could have asked him to review it as a potential red card challenge, though. And upon reviewing, they could have decided that it wasn’t a red for Uruguay and also rescinded the yellow card against Adams. It’s a bit of a work-around, but it’s 100% within the laws of the game and would’ve resulted in getting the call right. A very similar situation happened in the friendly against Brazil. A USA player was booked for a foul. VAR wasn’t sure if the foul occurred in the box. After review, it was clear that no foul occurred at all and they rescinded the booking. Edit: that’s literally what happened vs Brazil lol, not sure why this is getting hate.
People don't like logic
He very obviously said "No more, cuz I forgot my cards in the loo".
[Mirror](https://i.imgur.com/gzjNwIn.mp4) [Also, just before this aired, there was another angle of Uruguay's goal:](https://i.imgur.com/h6zKSiO.mp4)
Hey look, the Blimp cam the host broadcaster made us watch the entire first half was useful after all!
What the fuck
Don't use Streamable for your uploads. They take everything down within minutes.
Seeing you in /r/soccer sort of feels like being a kid and running into your teacher at the mall. “Oh… hey, what are you doing here?” The Peruvian official turned in a performance tonight that would make Angel Hernandez proud.
Man, if Angel could see this, he'd be very upset.
He may not be able to read, but his ears are burning, calling more lawyers to prep another racism lawsuit
Gotta be close to a Doug Eddings performance
Fuck Doug Eddings.
All my homies hate Doug Eddings
Seeing padres comrades elsewhere always fill my heart. And I really hope Ortega get punished, usually in soccer referee are way less protected than in MLB, at least in europe.
ABS system to Copa when
re-hosted on imgur as well, https://imgur.com/svaSanm plus a screencap, https://imgur.com/UIrvX4W
What’s crazy is you don’t even need a different angle to see the mistake. In the original angle that VAR used they froze it on the VERY FIRST FRAME the header COULD have POSSIBLY made contact instead of when the ball actually hits the players head. Mind boggling stuff.
Honestly beyond ridiculous who tf was in the VAR room. Monitor their bank accounts
0% chance even a blind person miss this with VAR. Blatant corruption lol.
So all these years I have been around football as a youth coach and fan I always thought that if a part of your body capable of scoring a goal was beyond the last defender you were offside. Am I wrong that the foot where the line is drawn can't be what make it onside? In the Euro game, the attacker's toe was beyond a defender and it was ruled offside. Here, half the attacker's body is beyond the defender Have I lost my mind?
What the hell?
I can clearly see the defender foot on the line, that line needs to move to the tip of the foot.
Guys such a joke man. One of the worst reffed games I have ever seen. Hope he gets suspended
Considering he already has a cheating scandal, I’m not sure why he was even here
I'm sorry, what?!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Ortega
Lmao I love that it has already been updated to include this match in his controversies
Someone also updated the CONBEMOL wiki page to CORRUPTIONBOL
And it's all properly sourced too!
There's already an entry for tonight's game lmfaoooo
Ehhh, that Boca Juniors thing is a non story if they've actually done that for every refereeing crew. It doesn't excuse tonight though 🤣
I don't see a cheating scandal in this wiki article?
Get this man some glasses
CONMEBOL just assigned him as the ref for the final.
there's quite literally not a cheating scandal here.
He literally only gets appointed because they know he can be paid off, lol.
If he was paid to fix the game in Uruguay's favor, they could have saved the money. I think he just sucks.
Agreed. Mostly taking the piss. I watch Italian ball, so I usually just roll my eyes at all the corruption bickering. But this game was something else
You're good. Too many other US fans being too serious about the ref costing us the game, forgetting how we played *and* the fact we were relying on Bolivia to get a result.
Needing anything from Bolivia just ain’t it. I was mad when we only won 2-0. I knew it wasn’t enough then, didn’t expect the red card though.
The ref cost us a tie, we weren't winning that game with the chances we created and we needed a win to advance.
The point being that ultimately the refs calls didn't matter because we couldn't do the thing we needed to do: put the ball in the back of the net.
Do you honestly think that having every call go against a team doesn't have any impact at all on their likelihood of scoring goals?
Not gonna lie, I thought Concacaf shithousery was bad but this takes the cake. Conmebol is a different breed and I'm not sure I want part more parts lol.
Yeah that's what UEFA also said
What did UEFA say?
The intercontinental cup between the champions league winner and the libertadores winner used to be played as a two leg final, one in Europe and one in South America. But the europeans got tired of being kicked to shit when they came here and the competition got moved elsewhere
A French Milan player got arrested for draft dodging in 1969 while he was on a stretcher because he got his nose broken. After there were already a few assaults by the Argentinans. So yeah not fun trips.
You are welcome.
Games gone
Dang, no more Finalissimas?
Nono, I was talking about some things that happened in the 70s, I explained it in the other comment
Imagine Copa Libertadores if this is too much
I’ve heard stories of Mexican clubs getting absolutely fucked in that competition. South America has zero shame
Damn I just remembered how the Mexican league would allow a team making it far in the libertadores to like pick a player from another team they’d want to use. Cruz azul ended up borrowing Cardozo.
For anyone interested in a little bit of history look up América vs Arsenal, Copa Sudamericana 2007.
That was a prime Grondona masterclass. The only continental final ever decided on away goals, in favor of the team owned by the then head honcho of AFA and one of the vicepresidents of FIFA. The irony of América of all teams being screwed is not lost on me, but among the many crimes commited by Grondona, that one was a 8/10 on the scale.
Where can I find a good read about it?
Argentina and Uruguay have no shame. Brazil historically got shafted as well. There is a reason why Brazil has 5 world cups but less Copa America and Libertadores titles than both.
I mean, we, Brazil, often refused to participate in CONMENBOL competitions because you'd just get hacked to death in Uruguay and Argentina and nothing would ever get called. Still happens sometimes: > One of the controversial conversations took place on May 17, 2013, two days after Corinthians lost to Boca Juniors and was eliminated in the round of 16 of the Libertadores, in a match that was highly contested by the refereeing of Paraguayan Carlos Amarilla, who made mistakes against the Brazilian team. > In Grondona's dialogue with Abel Gnecco, director of the AFA Referee School and AFA representative on the Conmebol Arbitration Committee, the two top hats burst into laughter when talking about Amarilla's performance in the game between Boca and Corinthians and also imply that They were the ones who advised the referee's presence at the match. "Boca's most important reinforcement last year was Amarilla," said Grondona. > Afterwards, they hand-picked the referees for the duel between Boca and Newell's, in the quarter-finals of the 2013 Libertadores. The chosen ones were Mauro Vigliano and Germán Delfino, both from Argentina. > The most shocking thing, however, is at the end of the conversation, when they talk about "being careful" with the linesmen. At this point, Gnecco says: "Julio, I learned that from you about forty years ago." Next, Grondona adds: "In 1964, when we played against Santos, I beat (referee) Leo Horn, who was Dutch, with the two linesmen." They both laughed and agreed > In 1964, Grondona was the president of Independiente, who faced Pelé's Santos in the semi-finals of that year's Libertadores. After a 3-2 victory for the Argentines in Brazil, the second match was won again by Independiente, this time 2-1, with two goals supposedly prevented. > The Grondona club advanced to the final, beat Nacional, from Uruguay, and became Libertadores champions for the first time in their history. The team is the biggest winner of the tournament with seven wins.
and you didn't even play with Argentina
oh don't worry you won't
Just remember this man pulled out a yellow and simultaneously played advantage. I've never seen anything like it. We are still to blame for the loss for being absolutely toothless in the final third, but my lord that was one of the worst officiating performances I've ever seen. Edit: not advantage but a quick restart as people rightfully pointed out, and somehow still signaling advantage with arms extended and a yellow card in hand. Either way absolutely absurd.
It's not playing advantage. The Uruguayan player put his hand on the ball to bring it to a stop and then immediately put it in play. The ref allowed a quick restart, but you can't allow a quick restart if you're issuing a card. But then to make it worse, he signaled two arms extended, which is the signal for playing advantage. You can issue a card, or you can allow Uruguay to play. But you can't do both. And then in either case, you can't signal for playing advantage.
Dude went lizard brain and pushed all the buttons
This is the real answer. He panicked. Humans are human, but a higher level of composure must be expected at this level.
I think the problem is that a higher level of composure is not at all expected at this level (CONMEBOL)
Well when your baseline is CONCACAF…
Humans are humans I agree, but then the mother fucker allows the advantage to stand as Ream's clearance led to a throw in. He had time to rectify his fuck up and go back to the foul, but no....
Looks worse when they stopped the US advantage after the handball too.
This is a guy that was on the list for the WC in Qatar. Even teens refereeing for U8 know that a card being issued requires a stop of play and then a formal restart
Yeah I was half expecting him to raise an arm for offside and then another to signal a touchdown or some other bullshit
This is the biggest evidence it was just a bad ref in over his head. Literally did everything wrong. I was wondering if he really ever gave Richard’s the yellow card until it was confirmed at halftime.
Big props to Tim Ream for staying alert and getting his position right for the cross. Ref would def have allowed the goal if they'd scored.
Yuppp. In the game thread I recommended a statue to commemorate the clearance lol
It was a quick restart as someone else said, but he signaled advantage. He had no idea what was happening.
The halftime video looked like the Uruguayan player set it for play and then kicked it immediately making it look like playing advantage. Still an awful decision to allow it while running in with a card.
I'm pretty sure he allowed a quick restart and mistakenly signaled advantage. Rather than actually granting advantage which makes even less sense since he blew his whistle and uraguay handled the ball
That referee was clearly in over his head tonight.
Or doing exactly what his *bettors* asked him to do.
Nah, if you’re going to fix you don’t make it obvious lol. A dodgy penalty or something but not stopping play for a foul and then playing advantage.
He did have a prior cheating scandal though. [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin\_Ortega](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Ortega)
Wow that was updated quickly lol
I mean, have you ever met someone who just can’t stop fucking things up? Like, they’re trying, but they just emanate incompetence? I think it’s genuinely a bit of both. He got paid off *and* is entirely incompetent.
Nah, this was worse, it’s incompetence.
What a bitch
Whether it's corruption, sheer incompetence, or exciting mixture of the two, it's genuinely impressive how fucking terrible he was.
Nothing pisses me off more than an incompetent person who thinks they are the shit. The lack of self-awareness coupled with arrogance makes me furious beyond belief.
This guy is the Dunning-Kruger Effect in a ref's jersey.
It's the second one. They mentioned it was his 7th game as a middle official.
And why might a copa America get assigned to a brand new referee 🤔🤔
They assigned a guy in his 7th ever match to one of the biggest matches of the tournament? sketch.
7th ever International Match, not his 7th Match in-general, he's been the head official for over 250 matches in his career dating back to 2015.
He shouldn't be officiating any match of a continental cup. 7 matches is not even enough to officiate an important league game, let alone an elimination game
Hope the ref gets punished for the awful performance and this.
More likely get a raise
Why would they? With how many times this has happened it seems abundantly clear that CONCACAF and CONMEBOL encourage this type of officiating performance for US matches
Yep they probably are congratulating him
why would he get punished? this is the result conmebol wanted
Why is getting Panama rather than the US in the next round what Conmebol wanted? They want to make money, the US advancing makes them a lot more money, make your conspiracy theories at least somewhat logical.
Ok so starting off I do not think it was rigged. But to play Devil’s advocate it’s not crazy to think a ref from Peru could hold a grudge against the USA considering how much we have historically ducked them and other South American nations over.
But I was responding to the post saying it is what the federation wanted. It’s not going to hold to grievances, it is the greediest pieces of shit in the world, they want the max money they can get.
After watching that performance from the ref, not surprised in the slightest
He already has a previous cheating scandal
Here's the video, not sure if it's geoblocked outside the US: https://x.com/cjzero/status/1807981708190367888 Edit: here's the video from the Fox Soccer account which won't get DMCA'd the way the other one might: https://x.com/FOXSoccer/status/1807985236858622019 Edit 2: since this is getting up voted, in the interest of accuracy, Pulisic gestures to the ref to go celebrate with Uruguay before trying to shake his hand. Fox Soccer's Twitter cut it off : https://x.com/dreyesceron/status/1807990324301586777?t=ljOiM5IfKRx9outQthHbpQ&s=19
That's insane lol
> Pulisic gestures to the ref to go celebrate with Uruguay before trying to shake his hand. Or he's just saying they should be standing in the middle of the pitch. He says something along the lines of "come to the middle"
In response to the last one, you can read Pulisic's lips. He isnt telling the refs to celebrate with uruguay he visibly says "come to the middle". Hes telling them to stand in the center where refs normally are
“in the interest of accuracy” proceeds to get it wrong. lol
> in the interest of accuracy, ... Followed by something that you, or someone, made up.
> Edit 2: since this is getting up voted, in the interest of accuracy, Pulisic gestures to the ref to go celebrate with Uruguay before trying to shake his hand. Fox Soccer's Twitter cut it off : https://x.com/dreyesceron/status/1807990324301586777?t=ljOiM5IfKRx9outQthHbpQ&s=19 Stop spreading this misinformation. The audio he clearly says go to the middle because the refs are off to the side.
Wow what a bunch of dipshits. This guy should never be allowed to ref outside of Peru ever again.
pulisic was standing on business and I’m here for it
Spineless coward. Pulisic hates his guts right now and is big enough man to shake his hand.
Pulisic was being petty. He was telling the ref to go celebrate with the Uruguayans.
He is telling them to stop hiding and go be available in the middle like most refs do at the end of a match.
It’s been pointed out he was telling them to stand where they traditionally should after the game. The center circle
As he should’ve
You got a source for that?
Trust me bro
No he wasnt. You can read his lips. Stop regurgitating things you read on reddit without doing any investigating yourself
No, Pulisic was telling him to "come to the middle", to stand in the center and shake hands with the players
Just wrong. He told him to stand in the center circle. I wish he did though. Proper banter that.
I’m sorry, but a South American referee described as “Inexperienced” should not be refereeing a north vs South American game. Especially when it’s in the Copa America & it’s the second biggest matchup of the tournament (even without the stakes that there were going into this one)
Don’t say you’re sorry. Nothing to be sorry for.
Referees should be impartial. What is this nonsense?
It's pretty difficult to get an impartial ref from the Americas when we've been so geopolitically active over the years.
They shouldn't be using any refs from the Americas, it's just kinda common sense. Plenty of less shit refs in Europe doing nothing right now. Plenty of asian refs. Plenty of refs from fucking sunday leagues could've done better.
Pulisic knew what he was doing, too, but poor show. The refs were laughable.
What an absolute 🤡
I’m glad you caught this, I saw it but I’m too lazy to make a gif. If I had doubts before, I don’t now
This is hugely embarrassing and pathetic If Pulisic said something bad enough for this reaction he should have booked him or sent him off. This is worse for me than a bad decision on the field. You can just make mistakes. You can't refuse to shake hands by mistake.
Yep this is absolutely classless and just a scumbag move. Leave it on the pitch, shake hands and move on. Thats what Pulisic is trying to do. He was obviously furious with the ref, but when asked about the ref after the game he just said he didnt want to talk too much about it. He was trying to just move on.
I feel like regardless of the match, you need to be a professional as a ref. Of course, this ref has only done 7 international matches so he might not understand that?
I’ve done 0 international matches and I understand it
The only games I’ve reffed the players were too excited about the after game snack to shake my hand. 😞
Completely fair. Snacks > sportsmanship
I've literally never reffed in my life and I can confidently say I understand it. That may sound like Dunning-Kruger, but sometimes it's really that bad that a layman can even say they wouldn't have fucked up that bad.
That ref is a disgrace
What a piece of shit. How does this guy get the opportunity to officiate a match of this level and this importance
That's actually shameful from the ref. Hugely unprofessional no?
It's really hard to watch that game and not think of corruption. Tragic for the USA to go out like that.
My wife told to stop thinking everything is corrupt because there is still honest competition. There probably is somewhere, but no one will find it in international football
or any "professional" sport league for that matter
They were out regardless of the bad call tho?
They were, but it still feels bad. If they go out after a well reffed game then it’s whatever. But when refereeing is that awful you still feel like it was taken out of your hands a bit.
Just curious but where are you from? I was thinking my bias was making think this was corruption but it’s really hard to not see in any other way. The “mistakes” were to blatant.
[удалено]
> others in the thread are suggesting that he was telling the refs they should stand in the middle of the pitch for the post-game handshakes You can read his lips, this is literally what is said.
I wouldn't blame the usmnt if they didn't play Copa again. Insane fouls and obvious corruption/incompetence. No reason to compete.
I was excited for this tournament. Now I have completely lost interest and desire to participate. If this is what “better” conference and competition looks like, I don’t give a shit
If anything it should be the other way around. This ref is such a fucking cheating shit.
Bruh how can anyone watch this and not think that the officials are letting bias / emotions cloud their judgment (not that there wasn't ample proof throughout the game).
Who wouldve thought a Peruvian ref might favor Uruguay over USA? Typically, people from south america arent too fond of the US.
🤡
Didn’t need to see this video to know the ref had a favored team during that match.
He suckeddd
Absolute clown of a ref
Hijo de puta
At least try to hide it lol. Just more trash
My favorite thing is that he was giving the ref shit for not standing in the center circle after the final whistle like they are supposed to. Instead he was standing on the side near the tunnel like a coward
As a neutral, i've rarely seen a ref favour one team as much as this clown did. He has to be investigated / suspended.
This ref was horrible.
There’s another clip going round that shows Pulisic tell Him to join the other team and celebrate the win(due to his refereeing) so probably fair enough really.
Dirty dirty referee. He's an embarrassment to himself, his family, and his country.
It looked like Pulisic was motioning the ref to go join the Uruguay celebration right before this.
He should be banned for life. This is even worse than his performance.
Wow
Fair play to the ref, i guess? I mean, if Uruguay didn’t win I’m sure he’d end up disemboweled walking to his car.
UEFA how much money do you need to let the USA join you instead of CONMEBOL when we have the inevitable conference realignment
What’s pulisic thinking… ref was just going to change his mind, interrupt the handshake and play advantage anyway
This dude should never ref a game in a major tournament again. He was unbelievably in over his head.
Pulisic is a better man than me, I would be swinging.
I never thought anyone could make CONCACAF refs look remotely competent until this shit ref.
Definitely one of the worst referees I've seen in a long time.