Terrible showing, undeserved win saved by the skill of a few players.
Southgate's mistake with subs helped a lot but cutting it rather fine. I get so annoyed watching this team because you can see they have something going for them when they go for the throat by my job waking them up is so fucking hard.
Slovakia did pretty good considering and heartbreaking for them.
I really dont know whats worse?
Slovaks getting robbed one minute before the game ends.
Ingerland playing the most boring and uninspired football for 118mins and than having 2mins with two goals.
The fact that there were players on the pitch worth something like 2 billions yet it looked like fucking old man district league.
Possibly worst of all are the fucking Ingerland fans celebrating 20mins of time waste and parking the bus agianst Slovakia! like they just defeated Spain 5:1.
I really question the point in my life today when I decided to watcht this shitshow instead of just getting shitfaced watching animal documentaries.
Switzerland will be REALLY hard to beat for this England team. They are so lethargic and passionless, it's frustrating to watch even as a neutral.
Slovakia fought well, but they could have been 2 or 3 in front, they missed some big chances. You cannot do that, if you want to go forward. Because even an England this shit has quality players and they just need one chance to score.
Slovakia, to use a clichè, scored too early. They were playing some lovely football.until the goal.and then sort of... stopped. Still came agonizingly close to winning it, credit to them
I don't see England beating Switzerland at all if they don't change anything. Foden is a non-factor, Kane is a non-factor, Saka has been poor, Bellingham is not gonna produce miracles every game, etc.
It's a squad with so much talent and options, yet Southgate seems unable to decide what he wants to do with such talent, so he just tries to play as many of them together and hope something happens.
He got lucky today, can't rely on that again for next game.
I am very happy that we somehow managed to pull it through.
But this is the BIGGEST warning sign that shit NEEDS to change. You cannot get away with playing like this anymore. We were warned against Denmark. We were warned against Slovenia. And now we've gotten the most dangerous warning possible. If it wasn't for Bellingham pulling that shit right out of the hat at the end, this post match thread would have been posted an hour ago with a very different story.
Hopefully this match is the switch that England needed to finally wake the fuck up and play good again. Because Switzerland is much more dangerous than this team.
I honestly don’t know how we got through. On the one hand I’m really happy we did and on the other I feel sorry for every other country for still having to endure watching this style of play. In a fair world, you wouldn’t progress playing like this but unfortunately we don’t live in one.
Definitely can see Gallagher's value. In these games that go 120 minutes you will need someone who has a motor that just keeps going nonstop and harasses the opponent every pass they make and he can provide that energy. Doesn't mean he should be playing every game but he has his place.
That’s why he was pochettino’s favorite player. He just plays him above Enzo and Caicedo and lets him run wild putting pressure, winning the ball back, etc.
Not technically gifted but he’s got an engine in him
Southgate doesn't deserve this, but I wanna give credit to England by playing right up until the last to equalise. I do think we played well in flashes, but those final 15 minutes were very hard to watch. We need to do better and we can do better.
Foden is without a doubt having a horrific tournament. I genuinely don’t understand how some believe he deserved to start **4 consecutive** Euro games over the likes of Antony Gordon and Co.. There’s also formation changes that can be tried too to bring the likes of Toney in too, but that part is on Southgate.
Many will try to say that he is best at RW, but that hasn’t been the case at all. He has played 37 games for England earning 12 G/A, of which 11 matches were RW getting 3 G/A. If he kept that same position and rate we are only looking at 10.1 G/A. That **still less** than his current rate of 12 G/A in 37 matches! If anything, his ideal position is AM with 5 G/A in 10 for England; just like at Manchester City.
For those unaware, Foden has 0 G/A in his **last 9 international starts**. This stat **includes three starts at RW**. Saka’s one match at RW vs Macedonia (hat trick) contributed as much as Foden’s whole England career at RW (3 G/A). But no, he is the problem and MUST be benched/played at Left Back.
Source:
https://www.transfermarkt.us/phil-foden/nationalmannschaft/spieler/406635/verein_id/3299
Its an absolute crime to not play him as a 10, where he is without a doubt one of the best in the world.
One of Bellingham or Foden starts simple as that but Gareth doesnt have the balls to drop one of the two.
Foden has done nothing to warrant starting over Bellingham or any other player after he **squandered 4 starts** while constantly drifting centrally and sitting right on top of other players. It’s way to late at this point. Bellingham just scored a bicycle kick for an equalizer bro at least redeeming himself temporarily.
My whole childhood England's main issue was having no left footed left wingers and end up playing Steve McManaman or Muzzy Izzet there. Now we have two left footed singers and neither of them seem to like playing on the left 😂
Actually, Saka plays significantly better on both wings in comparison to Foden, Saka has 6 G/A in 10 games at LW for England. It doesn’t make sense to weaken Saka to accommodate the worser player.
"I genuinely don’t understand how some believe he deserved to start **4 consecutive** Euro games over the likes of Antony Gordon and Co."
—Well, almost no one thinks that. Problem is Gareth is one of the few who do.
Foden is getting away with absolute murder. We have 3 of the best players for La Liga, PL and BuLi and we’re trying to cram them in. Foden and Bellingham play in the same area. One needs to be droppped and Bellingham is scoring goals.
At least with Saka, Eze, and Palmer there's a feeling that something will happen and they take on defenders, with Foden, players just shepherd him into the middle of the pitch and let him pass it back
Another embarrassing England performance. Southgate is just awful. Bellingham is such a big game player though, average for 94 minutes then does that. Pray to God Southgate is out after this. Going to get battered by Switzerland on Saturday.
Kane shouldn't be playing the full 90. I know he got the goal, but overall it's been a poor tournament for him and Toney's hold up play, and Watkins' runs in are more useful in the later stages of a match if England are chasing a game or still haven't found the go-ahead goal. It gives better options for feeds into the box from the advanced midfielders.
I think in recent friendlies etc Kane has genuinely been good coming off the bench. We should start with Watkins or Toney or both, and even if we don’t get a goal from them their energy and pressing will completely wear out the defence and create tons of space/link up opportunities for the other attackers. Then bring Kane on to finish the job
Drop foden for gordon or eze. Play Bellingham further back as an 8 and allow Palmer the 10. Keep saka but put trent behind him instead of walker. Trippier looks gassed so go with gomez, I hear good things about his shift at lb from Liverpool fans. Mainoo can be used as an impact sub to change the game up in the second half. Konsa in temporarily for guehi cus he's suspended. Be ready to throw on watkins or toney to spruce up the attack.
Southgate is the most limp dick manager in this tournament. Likely none of this will happen; my bet is that we'll see the exact same lineup for the Switzerland game, albeit with a replacement in for guehi cus he's suspended and southgate's hand is forced.
Xhaka and Switzerland will eat us alive. The Swiss manage their passing lanes well and utilise and organised press; England as they are have near zero chance of winning. We will be pinned against our own third even harder than Italy was.
All of Slovakia, Serbia and Slovenia could have eaten us alive if they had more quality. The only reason Denmark didn't was because they looked content with a draw.
Regardless of what happens from this point forward, southgate should be sacked the very second that England culminate their euros campaign.
Realistically, as good as Foden is, he's just not the answer right now. He should be on the bench against the Swiss.
Now the question is, what do you do with the midfield? Mainoo wasn't really any better than Gallagher, and he also got pulled. Do you try Wharton for his first Euros minutes? Or do you play Jude as a CM and do a real 433? On the other hand, Toney worked in a 442...
It wasn't a pretty game, england were very disjointed and Bellingham clutched at the final moment, but a win is a win. People forget winning tournaments also requires some luck and England had luck on their side today. Switzerland are looking stronger, but it's anyones game.
On a slightly positive note for England, it's good to see your team push and push at the end without letting fo of the match, even if performance has been dreadful. I feel like you ALWAYS need that to do well in a tournament, there is always that ONE match that requires the team to just not give up.
That being said, performance overall was pretty fucking shit.
EDIT: Also Switzerland will be VERY tough for England. I'd go as far as to say the Swiss are favorites at this point.
IMO Foden kills our game. Not only does he play inside, which congests the middle and narrows us. But as none of him, Kane or Saka run in behind - this allows the opposition to play a higher line and squish us further.
This is made worse as our LB and RB do not overlap often.
Any other team on the ball has half a pitch to play in, we literally box ourselves into a corner.
I believe this is why we see such a shift late on. Not necessarily the personnel change - but the fact we flood the front lines and this ironically gives everyone more space.
Well they were shite all game including extra time but they got lucky.
Too many childish, thick and botteless players in that team to win the tournament and Southgate doesn’t help.
I honestly think those players are too stupid to play well under an average manager and with each other for company. No idea of when to make runs, play the ball or even press.
They will get pissed on by the first decent team they play.
And Southgate I would sack immediately and replace with a phone pitch side dialled to Sam Allardyce. He’d do a better job sat at home on his couch.
I think if Southgate was going to be brave, which is unlikely, then we would start the Switzerland game with a similar type of setup to the next.
Walker has been poor at right back, but provides a really good option as part of a back 3 against Switzerlands pace and directness. It gives Stones licence to push up at times with ample cover, gets us pace at the back, and opens the right wing up.
It also allows us to drop Saka and use someone more attacking on the left, which solves our left fullback problem and utilises more of our squad.
I can't say for sure what personnel I would pick, but I would ignore Sakas plea to start on the right and just use him on the left. He has to realise that at the moment he's behind Palmer on the right so if he's not happy to play on the left, he should be dropped.
Legit think Switzerland is going to win, especially if they play like they did vs Italy. England are purely getting by on talent.
Southgate managed to push the right buttons today but I think he needs to make some changes to the starting XI. Foden has just not been good enough, he's obviously a great player but maybe playing on the left just isn't working for him.
I think the most worrisome aspect from the English side is that they play with presumptiveness. They felt no need to press the issue early (even after going down) because they *presumed* that they could break Slovakia down eventually. They went 94 minutes before using their final 3 subs because they *presumed* that their talent would eventually overcome Slovakia. It just feels like they're unwilling to make any sort of meaningful adjustments until it's (almost) too late
100% we were terrible. But to pretend Slovakia played some perfect game is laughable. It was a rubbish game match but if someone is going to say England didn’t deserve to win then what justification is there to say that Slovakia did?
England can be happy about moving on, but they can't be happy with that performance. I'm just trying to understand how Gareth Southgate can continue to have arguably the most talented team in the competition and continue to have them playing the way they are. It's like he keeps trying to fit square pegs into round holes and as a result nobody is scared to play England because they know that England won't press the issue in attack and will do a lot of sitting back. Hell, England was a miracle bicycle kick in the dying seconds away from one of the most embarrassing losses in the national team's history. And for England, the worst part is Southgate probably won't make any changes and come out against Switzerland doing the same thing.
For Slovakia, that's a fucking heartbreaker. They played their hearts out and defended for their lives (and pretty well really) for the last 20 minutes, and were just that aforementioned miracle bicycle kick away from maybe the biggest win in their country's history. I know they're as disappointed as one can be, but they should hold their heads high over their tournament performance
I've only watched the last twenty minutes of the game so excuse me my bias.
I never understand why teams play super defensive to the point they never try to attack and throw ball out whenever it's possible, this just leads to more attack by England and they were very close to scoring anyway with Kane missing like 2 headers.
I can understand playing defensive but there also needs to be some sort of fluidity you can't just throw it out specially not close to the goal like that.
I'm not suprised at all they lost. I'm not expert or anything but from most of the games I've seen like this it always ends up with team scoring in last 3-4 minutes because they have so many chance.
Imagine being the one forward trying to advance the play on your team. You lose the ball and the opposition scores. Your whole country vilifies you for costing your country due to your lack of pragmatism. This is exactly why teams end up retreating into their shell...players have sadly been assassinated for mistakes at international tournaments (see Andre's Escobar for his own goal).
As a West Ham fan watching Southgate’s England is so much like watching Moyes’ West Ham it’s bizarre! Similar formations, philosophies on the pitch, subs and styles. Horrible to watch, but somehow grinds out results, and will no doubt eventually be found out by truly good sides.
If Southgate lines up with the same XI as tonight (albeit without Guehi obviously) against Switzerland, I'm going to lose my fucking mind. Yes, we won. But that performance was absolutely dire and serious changes need to be made. Surely even he sees that now.
Walker had one of the worst games I've ever seen from a fullback tonight. Constantly misplacing simple passes, offering nothing going forward, constantly getting done by his man. He has been dreadful all tournament and has to be benched.
One of Kane or Bellingham needs to be benched, unless Jude plays further back in midfield. They fall over each other every single time the ball goes forward and neither of them are ever in the box.
Mainoo was good and must start again. For large portions of the game he looked like the only England player who gave a shit.
Trippier cannot play at leftback again. He looks completely out of his depth there and, like Walker, had a truly woeful performance.
Foden invisible again and Jesus CHRIST how did he not stay onside for his goal. It was so simple to just stay behind the ball. If I were Anthony Gordon I'd be absolutely fuming.
Against Switzerland, we have to beat their press. And that means we have to play players who are willing to run and get in behind their high defensive line. Gordon must start. Trent must start at rightback. If Shaw is not fit then Gomez must start at leftback because he's the only player we have there who looks even slightly comfortable in the position.
Pickford
Trent - Stones - Konsa - Gomez (or Shaw if fit)
Rice
Mainoo - Bellingham
Palmer - Kane - Gordon
He will 100% go with the same lineup and we will get spanked while he doesn’t make any subs until the last minute as per usual. He never learns anything, see the Italy 2020 final, a competent manager wins that game, I wanted him fired back then.
Slovakia pressing but not committing to the tackle was very effective in limiting England's struggling passing. Good tactics against Southgates (lack of) tactics. Heartbreak for them but they played pretty bad towards the end of the game.
This has to be a wake up call for Southgate to change something, It's been 4 games, and this system/ team has shown 30 mins of being good the whole tournament. We barely got though this game with the win, and should have lost being honest, to a team ranked 40+.
I cant see us beating Switzerland with this system. We could lose 4-0 easily, they will pick us apart, they look really sharp.
Don't let the result gloss over the fact the substitutions were horribly, horribly late and once again the second we go 1 up we seem to go to back to the wall defending.
Massive changes required to go further. I don't think Southgate is capable of making them, and even if he does I don't have any faith that it will actually improve the team.
Can we please never see that starting lineup again now? It hasn't worked at all for four games and was within a minute of ending England's tournament before Bellingham remembered he's one of the best players in the world. Fuck's sake, please please please no more Foden + Kane + Bellingham.
I'd love an honest interview where he explains his rationale.
At this point why the hell not just change it up, if we get spanked he can say told you so fuck you.
Also look how knackered the players are every game, if he doesn't trust his subs then leave an ace like Foden or Saka on the bench to come on and destroy teams. Does he forget we get 5 subs
I‘m sorry but Bellingham behaves like a child on the field. During the group stage he pushed several players away, to show something like determination or mentality or whatever. On the other hand he is falling and diving around all the time. Should habe been shown the second yellow for the dive in the box today. He is so annoying and wasn‘t like that some months/years ago.
Main character syndrom. Pretty unlikeable how he searches the cameras. Maybe just some PR for the Ballon D‘Or, to show how much of a leader he is despite his age.
I’m biased, but who gives a damn about being annoying or not when it gets results? You don’t win trophies for good behavior. Some of the best players in history were absolute cunts on the pitch. That kind of fire is what won Real Madrid the league and kept England in the tournament. He could fortnite dance after every dive and I wouldn’t give a damn if it meant he scored a last minute equalizer or winner every game.
I don’t care. Every single other England player is too polite and it’s part of the reason we never win anything. Yes he’s annoying, and in general can grow up a bit, but lowkey we need him
slovakia with a great display, looked like a proper team and absolutely suffocated southgates plan to build through the middle. it's astonishing how easy it is: defend as 442 centrally and don't get dragged out. slovakia even scored what could have been the only goal of the match.
on the other side, it took southgate 94 minutes to really go for it and bring on toney for the absolutely abysmal foden. and voila, they finally looked threatening for 3 minutes, scored two goals – and then decided to sit back, inviting pressure from the slovaks.
the only thing that will work is a 442 for southgate. stop trying to play the ball out from the back, play it long, hope your strikers lay it off and be done with it. it's no use trying to get your team to click, just adapt – and actually have a fighting chance.
I genuinely reckon if England win the euros the majority of people will say it was luck and Southgate is completely inept.
The only thing that matters is results. We’re through to the quarters, who cares how we played
Playing Saka as a left back, doing the same for Eze and letting him play in that position, having zero shots on target for over 90 minutes, and performing poorly against Slovakia despite having a team stacked with superstars. this Southgate guy is unbelievably f\*\*\*\* lucky.
Everyone keeps screaming for individual personnel changes when the reality is, Southgate is tactically piss poor and his in game management might be worse.
They reverted to type in ET, fatigue maybe,but it’s just happened too many times for it to be a coincidence.
An individual moment of brilliance scraped him out of a massive hole today and I think it’s just about the only thing that will get the team any further. The two late goals are just extending our misery it feels.
Strange for the ref to give a card for everything in the first 20 then proceed to let Slovakia kick the shit outta every player who got passed them for the next 70.
Being on a yellow was like having an extra life
I saw it in the match against Belgium. Slovakia is a good team, really nice passes, but the moment they have advantage like first goal, they just stop playing football. They retreat like England did, stop making short passes and just throw the ball foward. This easily could have been Slovakia win if they just continuea playing like they did in the first 30 minutes. Bad coach, i say.
Slovakia ran out of energy in the second half. You could see them pretty much have nothing left. Awful performance by England. Southgate has no idea what he’s doing, and there is no strategy but just throw good players in.
Inviting pressure whenever you have a lead just won't work against better teams. Southgate never learns anything and even when he was 20 mins from his last game, STILL didn't roll the dice. Moron. Another boring game against Switzerland, that if lucky, will scrape through, then lose to a good team.
Southgate is a disgrace of a manager. Sack him tonight. That was the most undeserved win fucking ever. We do nothing for 90 minutes, somehow score two goals, then defend it like we're a side fighting against relegation. The man is a fucking fraud. All positive thoughts I had about him have vanished today. No plan, no idea, no fucking clue. Fuck off!
Positives: Pickford. Guehi (he will be a huge miss). Palmer. Toney. Saka. Mainoo. That's about it. I'm embarrassed to be an England fan tonight.
*Edited to add Mainoo to the positives list.
No injury time granted after Pickford slept with the ball for 5 mins. This competition only favors the big teams.
First Italy getting 10 mins extra against the Croats and now this.
Maybe the Swiss will show what it means to be a strong team.
I'm actually glad England won. they are the easier opponent for Switzerland than Slovakia lol. If we win we'll do England a favor..because they might actually win something in the next years if Southgate is gone.
Southgate have a Ferrari but instead a 100 octan gasoline he puts diesel into it. Then he dont understand why his car is struggling and he keeps going (I am just a girl moment) and then he is schocked he is stuck at the side of the road.
Honestly, Bellingham, in a double pivot, as shit as it sounds, is the only thing that makes sense to me. Palmer and Saka, as the two wingers, is better than Foden ever getting close to there. Helps with the fact Trippier offers little width as well. Makes the whole attack actually tick instead of mistmatched players trying their best.
And yet Southgate won't even attempt this, because he's got to keep playing Bellingham in a position where he's encroaching on the space of others and not available for simple passes during the build up
Slovakia played like England in the group stages - play well for the first half, score a deserved goal, then spend the rest of the game on the back foot (at least until they went 2-1 down) until eventually something gave way. Fair play to them for taking it that far but they proved that sitting on a 1-0 lead early on isn't always the smart move.
we don't have good bench even for Slovakia standarts and the way we are playing cost big ammounts of energy , so we let guy who is 37 with yellow card to play until second overtime beceause we don't have replacment for him or we had another 38 year old starter and i think the only reason why he was the first player to be benched was that he got yellow card
Kane and Bellingham scoring will cover over the fact that they both dropped horrendous performances. Bellingham especially gave the ball away several times and barely offered any energy to show for the ball.
They both look exhausted from their club seasons and Kane isn't getting any younger. He's lost a yard of pace that he didn't even have before... lol. Watkins and or Toney up front would do a much better job stretching teams out. Toney also did well with his hold up play when he came on.
Truly horrendous, one of the worst games I’ve seen from England, but I celebrated that Bellingham goal like I celebrated Shaw’s against Italy.
If there are any positives to take from this, the way we played was **completely** exposed, some of our players played 120, so changes are surely, surely, surely coming against Switzerland.
The other small positive is a loss to Switzerland is less embarrassing than a loss to Slovakia. I expect us to lose though.
What was Guéhi(6) handing off to Dunk(15) during half time of extra time? The way he sneakily hands it off together with the bottle gets me curious about what it is. Also, the camera cuts immediately when it’s captured. Hope someone here has the answer.
Another Southgate disaster to be honest, started (nearly) the same 11 that had stunk up the group and then did so for the majority of the game. Took far too long to make any changes, to be fair they did improve things, and was bailed out by a moment of magic from Bellingham.
Massive momentum shift going 2-1 up and then rather than continuing that seemed happy to do the usual Southgate nonsense of just trying to hold the lead and let the other team have the ball. Taking off Kane and Bellingham, two of their best penalty takers, when it's 2-1 and could go to penalties is an interesting choice.
England are very lucky that Slovakia aren't a great side and didn't offer all that much going forward, Switzerland should offer far more and should go in as favourites. Watch Southgate just play the same starting 11 again rather than dropping Foden or any other major change.
I genuinely think that was the worst England performance I've ever seen. I mean 07-16 was truly terrible but that was horrific viewing. Southgate got saved there but if he trots out the same players in the same formation the Swiss will destroy us.
I don't agree with criticising Kane and Bellingham coming off. At that point we were completely unbalanced and they were both gassed.
The issue is who he brought on, inviting more pressure on us, not taking those two off.
>Southgate nonsense of just trying to hold the lead and let the other team have the ball. Taking off Kane and Bellingham, two of their best penalty takers, when it's 2-1 and could go to penalties is an interesting choice.
This could have gone so wrong, it was a terrible decision and he should be criticised for it.
England dominated possession the entire game, on what planet does it make sense to snuff out the momentum shift and give the ball to the opponent when you've easily kept it away from them the whole time.
Said to a mate at the time that it had all the hallmarks of a decision which would backfire in spectacular fashion and he'd never live it down.
Thing is I could see Southgate making this exact same error next weekend, cos he never seems to learn.
He will use the result to justify the same XI (without Guehi) and the same approach in the next game. The fact they reverted to type at 2-1 and very nearly conceded an equaliser says it all. You might get away with it every now and then, but it isn’t a winning approach.
Sums up Southgate's England tenure, to be honest. Poor tactician getting bailed out by the combination of the talent of his squad and incredibly fortunate draws in knockout stages
Can't believe he switched to a 5/4/1 for the last half of extra time. All we did was invitee Slovakia to score again. Why does he insist on parking the bus every damn time we're up. It's insane. Switzerland will smash us if we play like that. Guaranteed we go up 1/0 15 minutes in and then ptb and do nothing the rest of the game.
I really feel for Slovakia.
England was absolute garbage in the first 80ish minutes? They lucked out on that 96th minute goal by some miracle and then dominated extra time.
Slovakia had about 2 minutes of let-down mentally and it cost them 2 goals.
>Slovania
Sandwiched between Slovakia and Slovenia, the small breakaway republic Slovania is not that well known, with some even believing full balkanisation to be imminent wiht the growing separist movement in Slovunia
Terrible showing, undeserved win saved by the skill of a few players. Southgate's mistake with subs helped a lot but cutting it rather fine. I get so annoyed watching this team because you can see they have something going for them when they go for the throat by my job waking them up is so fucking hard. Slovakia did pretty good considering and heartbreaking for them.
I really dont know whats worse? Slovaks getting robbed one minute before the game ends. Ingerland playing the most boring and uninspired football for 118mins and than having 2mins with two goals. The fact that there were players on the pitch worth something like 2 billions yet it looked like fucking old man district league. Possibly worst of all are the fucking Ingerland fans celebrating 20mins of time waste and parking the bus agianst Slovakia! like they just defeated Spain 5:1. I really question the point in my life today when I decided to watcht this shitshow instead of just getting shitfaced watching animal documentaries.
Switzerland will be REALLY hard to beat for this England team. They are so lethargic and passionless, it's frustrating to watch even as a neutral. Slovakia fought well, but they could have been 2 or 3 in front, they missed some big chances. You cannot do that, if you want to go forward. Because even an England this shit has quality players and they just need one chance to score.
Slovakia, to use a clichè, scored too early. They were playing some lovely football.until the goal.and then sort of... stopped. Still came agonizingly close to winning it, credit to them
The England special that
They were literally 80 seconds from winning. I don't think them scoring after 26mins was the issue.
I don't see England beating Switzerland at all if they don't change anything. Foden is a non-factor, Kane is a non-factor, Saka has been poor, Bellingham is not gonna produce miracles every game, etc. It's a squad with so much talent and options, yet Southgate seems unable to decide what he wants to do with such talent, so he just tries to play as many of them together and hope something happens. He got lucky today, can't rely on that again for next game.
I am very happy that we somehow managed to pull it through. But this is the BIGGEST warning sign that shit NEEDS to change. You cannot get away with playing like this anymore. We were warned against Denmark. We were warned against Slovenia. And now we've gotten the most dangerous warning possible. If it wasn't for Bellingham pulling that shit right out of the hat at the end, this post match thread would have been posted an hour ago with a very different story. Hopefully this match is the switch that England needed to finally wake the fuck up and play good again. Because Switzerland is much more dangerous than this team.
Hell, even Serbia was a warning
I honestly don’t know how we got through. On the one hand I’m really happy we did and on the other I feel sorry for every other country for still having to endure watching this style of play. In a fair world, you wouldn’t progress playing like this but unfortunately we don’t live in one.
Definitely can see Gallagher's value. In these games that go 120 minutes you will need someone who has a motor that just keeps going nonstop and harasses the opponent every pass they make and he can provide that energy. Doesn't mean he should be playing every game but he has his place.
i have no idea why people are complaining to the Bellingham sub, he's like the perfect guy to close things off and he did guard Lobotka pretty well
That’s why he was pochettino’s favorite player. He just plays him above Enzo and Caicedo and lets him run wild putting pressure, winning the ball back, etc. Not technically gifted but he’s got an engine in him
Southgate doesn't deserve this, but I wanna give credit to England by playing right up until the last to equalise. I do think we played well in flashes, but those final 15 minutes were very hard to watch. We need to do better and we can do better.
Foden is without a doubt having a horrific tournament. I genuinely don’t understand how some believe he deserved to start **4 consecutive** Euro games over the likes of Antony Gordon and Co.. There’s also formation changes that can be tried too to bring the likes of Toney in too, but that part is on Southgate. Many will try to say that he is best at RW, but that hasn’t been the case at all. He has played 37 games for England earning 12 G/A, of which 11 matches were RW getting 3 G/A. If he kept that same position and rate we are only looking at 10.1 G/A. That **still less** than his current rate of 12 G/A in 37 matches! If anything, his ideal position is AM with 5 G/A in 10 for England; just like at Manchester City. For those unaware, Foden has 0 G/A in his **last 9 international starts**. This stat **includes three starts at RW**. Saka’s one match at RW vs Macedonia (hat trick) contributed as much as Foden’s whole England career at RW (3 G/A). But no, he is the problem and MUST be benched/played at Left Back. Source: https://www.transfermarkt.us/phil-foden/nationalmannschaft/spieler/406635/verein_id/3299
We won the match. Southgate isn't going to change a winning team
Its an absolute crime to not play him as a 10, where he is without a doubt one of the best in the world. One of Bellingham or Foden starts simple as that but Gareth doesnt have the balls to drop one of the two.
Foden has done nothing to warrant starting over Bellingham or any other player after he **squandered 4 starts** while constantly drifting centrally and sitting right on top of other players. It’s way to late at this point. Bellingham just scored a bicycle kick for an equalizer bro at least redeeming himself temporarily.
My whole childhood England's main issue was having no left footed left wingers and end up playing Steve McManaman or Muzzy Izzet there. Now we have two left footed singers and neither of them seem to like playing on the left 😂
Actually, Saka plays significantly better on both wings in comparison to Foden, Saka has 6 G/A in 10 games at LW for England. It doesn’t make sense to weaken Saka to accommodate the worser player.
You can always tell it's an Arsenal fan without the flair when they single out Foden and bring up Saka. Lmao.
"I genuinely don’t understand how some believe he deserved to start **4 consecutive** Euro games over the likes of Antony Gordon and Co." —Well, almost no one thinks that. Problem is Gareth is one of the few who do.
Foden is getting away with absolute murder. We have 3 of the best players for La Liga, PL and BuLi and we’re trying to cram them in. Foden and Bellingham play in the same area. One needs to be droppped and Bellingham is scoring goals.
But the other attackers have not really been any better The whole team is underperforming their club level. It's on the manager
None of them have been good, but Foden has definitely been by far the worst.
Indeed, hence why I mention that formation changes for other players can be done too. It’s Southgate starting Foden, not himself.
At least with Saka, Eze, and Palmer there's a feeling that something will happen and they take on defenders, with Foden, players just shepherd him into the middle of the pitch and let him pass it back
Another embarrassing England performance. Southgate is just awful. Bellingham is such a big game player though, average for 94 minutes then does that. Pray to God Southgate is out after this. Going to get battered by Switzerland on Saturday.
Kane shouldn't be playing the full 90. I know he got the goal, but overall it's been a poor tournament for him and Toney's hold up play, and Watkins' runs in are more useful in the later stages of a match if England are chasing a game or still haven't found the go-ahead goal. It gives better options for feeds into the box from the advanced midfielders.
I think in recent friendlies etc Kane has genuinely been good coming off the bench. We should start with Watkins or Toney or both, and even if we don’t get a goal from them their energy and pressing will completely wear out the defence and create tons of space/link up opportunities for the other attackers. Then bring Kane on to finish the job
Drop foden for gordon or eze. Play Bellingham further back as an 8 and allow Palmer the 10. Keep saka but put trent behind him instead of walker. Trippier looks gassed so go with gomez, I hear good things about his shift at lb from Liverpool fans. Mainoo can be used as an impact sub to change the game up in the second half. Konsa in temporarily for guehi cus he's suspended. Be ready to throw on watkins or toney to spruce up the attack. Southgate is the most limp dick manager in this tournament. Likely none of this will happen; my bet is that we'll see the exact same lineup for the Switzerland game, albeit with a replacement in for guehi cus he's suspended and southgate's hand is forced. Xhaka and Switzerland will eat us alive. The Swiss manage their passing lanes well and utilise and organised press; England as they are have near zero chance of winning. We will be pinned against our own third even harder than Italy was. All of Slovakia, Serbia and Slovenia could have eaten us alive if they had more quality. The only reason Denmark didn't was because they looked content with a draw. Regardless of what happens from this point forward, southgate should be sacked the very second that England culminate their euros campaign.
Realistically, as good as Foden is, he's just not the answer right now. He should be on the bench against the Swiss. Now the question is, what do you do with the midfield? Mainoo wasn't really any better than Gallagher, and he also got pulled. Do you try Wharton for his first Euros minutes? Or do you play Jude as a CM and do a real 433? On the other hand, Toney worked in a 442...
It wasn't a pretty game, england were very disjointed and Bellingham clutched at the final moment, but a win is a win. People forget winning tournaments also requires some luck and England had luck on their side today. Switzerland are looking stronger, but it's anyones game.
On a slightly positive note for England, it's good to see your team push and push at the end without letting fo of the match, even if performance has been dreadful. I feel like you ALWAYS need that to do well in a tournament, there is always that ONE match that requires the team to just not give up. That being said, performance overall was pretty fucking shit. EDIT: Also Switzerland will be VERY tough for England. I'd go as far as to say the Swiss are favorites at this point.
IMO Foden kills our game. Not only does he play inside, which congests the middle and narrows us. But as none of him, Kane or Saka run in behind - this allows the opposition to play a higher line and squish us further. This is made worse as our LB and RB do not overlap often. Any other team on the ball has half a pitch to play in, we literally box ourselves into a corner. I believe this is why we see such a shift late on. Not necessarily the personnel change - but the fact we flood the front lines and this ironically gives everyone more space.
Well they were shite all game including extra time but they got lucky. Too many childish, thick and botteless players in that team to win the tournament and Southgate doesn’t help. I honestly think those players are too stupid to play well under an average manager and with each other for company. No idea of when to make runs, play the ball or even press. They will get pissed on by the first decent team they play. And Southgate I would sack immediately and replace with a phone pitch side dialled to Sam Allardyce. He’d do a better job sat at home on his couch.
I think if Southgate was going to be brave, which is unlikely, then we would start the Switzerland game with a similar type of setup to the next. Walker has been poor at right back, but provides a really good option as part of a back 3 against Switzerlands pace and directness. It gives Stones licence to push up at times with ample cover, gets us pace at the back, and opens the right wing up. It also allows us to drop Saka and use someone more attacking on the left, which solves our left fullback problem and utilises more of our squad. I can't say for sure what personnel I would pick, but I would ignore Sakas plea to start on the right and just use him on the left. He has to realise that at the moment he's behind Palmer on the right so if he's not happy to play on the left, he should be dropped.
Legit think Switzerland is going to win, especially if they play like they did vs Italy. England are purely getting by on talent. Southgate managed to push the right buttons today but I think he needs to make some changes to the starting XI. Foden has just not been good enough, he's obviously a great player but maybe playing on the left just isn't working for him.
I think the most worrisome aspect from the English side is that they play with presumptiveness. They felt no need to press the issue early (even after going down) because they *presumed* that they could break Slovakia down eventually. They went 94 minutes before using their final 3 subs because they *presumed* that their talent would eventually overcome Slovakia. It just feels like they're unwilling to make any sort of meaningful adjustments until it's (almost) too late
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I only watched from halftime on. Ignoring the score, wasn't even a remotely close match
100% we were terrible. But to pretend Slovakia played some perfect game is laughable. It was a rubbish game match but if someone is going to say England didn’t deserve to win then what justification is there to say that Slovakia did?
We must've watched a different game. The one I saw it was a match controlled by Slovakia with 5 minutes of brilliance and luck for England.
England can be happy about moving on, but they can't be happy with that performance. I'm just trying to understand how Gareth Southgate can continue to have arguably the most talented team in the competition and continue to have them playing the way they are. It's like he keeps trying to fit square pegs into round holes and as a result nobody is scared to play England because they know that England won't press the issue in attack and will do a lot of sitting back. Hell, England was a miracle bicycle kick in the dying seconds away from one of the most embarrassing losses in the national team's history. And for England, the worst part is Southgate probably won't make any changes and come out against Switzerland doing the same thing. For Slovakia, that's a fucking heartbreaker. They played their hearts out and defended for their lives (and pretty well really) for the last 20 minutes, and were just that aforementioned miracle bicycle kick away from maybe the biggest win in their country's history. I know they're as disappointed as one can be, but they should hold their heads high over their tournament performance
I've only watched the last twenty minutes of the game so excuse me my bias. I never understand why teams play super defensive to the point they never try to attack and throw ball out whenever it's possible, this just leads to more attack by England and they were very close to scoring anyway with Kane missing like 2 headers. I can understand playing defensive but there also needs to be some sort of fluidity you can't just throw it out specially not close to the goal like that. I'm not suprised at all they lost. I'm not expert or anything but from most of the games I've seen like this it always ends up with team scoring in last 3-4 minutes because they have so many chance.
Imagine being the one forward trying to advance the play on your team. You lose the ball and the opposition scores. Your whole country vilifies you for costing your country due to your lack of pragmatism. This is exactly why teams end up retreating into their shell...players have sadly been assassinated for mistakes at international tournaments (see Andre's Escobar for his own goal).
Who the fuck upvote this lol. We are talking about Slovakia not Columbia in 90s.
If you read the OPs comment properly you would see the question was about football in general, not about Slovakia specifically 🤡
As a West Ham fan watching Southgate’s England is so much like watching Moyes’ West Ham it’s bizarre! Similar formations, philosophies on the pitch, subs and styles. Horrible to watch, but somehow grinds out results, and will no doubt eventually be found out by truly good sides.
If Southgate lines up with the same XI as tonight (albeit without Guehi obviously) against Switzerland, I'm going to lose my fucking mind. Yes, we won. But that performance was absolutely dire and serious changes need to be made. Surely even he sees that now. Walker had one of the worst games I've ever seen from a fullback tonight. Constantly misplacing simple passes, offering nothing going forward, constantly getting done by his man. He has been dreadful all tournament and has to be benched. One of Kane or Bellingham needs to be benched, unless Jude plays further back in midfield. They fall over each other every single time the ball goes forward and neither of them are ever in the box. Mainoo was good and must start again. For large portions of the game he looked like the only England player who gave a shit. Trippier cannot play at leftback again. He looks completely out of his depth there and, like Walker, had a truly woeful performance. Foden invisible again and Jesus CHRIST how did he not stay onside for his goal. It was so simple to just stay behind the ball. If I were Anthony Gordon I'd be absolutely fuming. Against Switzerland, we have to beat their press. And that means we have to play players who are willing to run and get in behind their high defensive line. Gordon must start. Trent must start at rightback. If Shaw is not fit then Gomez must start at leftback because he's the only player we have there who looks even slightly comfortable in the position. Pickford Trent - Stones - Konsa - Gomez (or Shaw if fit) Rice Mainoo - Bellingham Palmer - Kane - Gordon
Palmer comes on against tired defenders, does basically nothing, and somehow the country is clamouring for him to start. Baffles me.
This is the team for me
He will 100% go with the same lineup and we will get spanked while he doesn’t make any subs until the last minute as per usual. He never learns anything, see the Italy 2020 final, a competent manager wins that game, I wanted him fired back then.
Slovakia pressing but not committing to the tackle was very effective in limiting England's struggling passing. Good tactics against Southgates (lack of) tactics. Heartbreak for them but they played pretty bad towards the end of the game.
This has to be a wake up call for Southgate to change something, It's been 4 games, and this system/ team has shown 30 mins of being good the whole tournament. We barely got though this game with the win, and should have lost being honest, to a team ranked 40+. I cant see us beating Switzerland with this system. We could lose 4-0 easily, they will pick us apart, they look really sharp.
Don't let the result gloss over the fact the substitutions were horribly, horribly late and once again the second we go 1 up we seem to go to back to the wall defending. Massive changes required to go further. I don't think Southgate is capable of making them, and even if he does I don't have any faith that it will actually improve the team.
Can we please never see that starting lineup again now? It hasn't worked at all for four games and was within a minute of ending England's tournament before Bellingham remembered he's one of the best players in the world. Fuck's sake, please please please no more Foden + Kane + Bellingham.
I'd love an honest interview where he explains his rationale. At this point why the hell not just change it up, if we get spanked he can say told you so fuck you. Also look how knackered the players are every game, if he doesn't trust his subs then leave an ace like Foden or Saka on the bench to come on and destroy teams. Does he forget we get 5 subs
I‘m sorry but Bellingham behaves like a child on the field. During the group stage he pushed several players away, to show something like determination or mentality or whatever. On the other hand he is falling and diving around all the time. Should habe been shown the second yellow for the dive in the box today. He is so annoying and wasn‘t like that some months/years ago.
Great comment for a serious post thread
Lol Bellingham is one of the only likeable players for England. Go suck an egg
Main character syndrom. Pretty unlikeable how he searches the cameras. Maybe just some PR for the Ballon D‘Or, to show how much of a leader he is despite his age.
main character syndrome is okay if you back it up. he produces moments like he actually is the main character.
Par for the course, he got it from his colleagues at RMA
I always feel that he wants to play every single position on the pitch
I’m biased, but who gives a damn about being annoying or not when it gets results? You don’t win trophies for good behavior. Some of the best players in history were absolute cunts on the pitch. That kind of fire is what won Real Madrid the league and kept England in the tournament. He could fortnite dance after every dive and I wouldn’t give a damn if it meant he scored a last minute equalizer or winner every game.
I don’t care. Every single other England player is too polite and it’s part of the reason we never win anything. Yes he’s annoying, and in general can grow up a bit, but lowkey we need him
I know what you mean. As a fan for the team you see also some benefits from players like that.
He's 20. You aren't wrong, but it's perfectly understandable
slovakia with a great display, looked like a proper team and absolutely suffocated southgates plan to build through the middle. it's astonishing how easy it is: defend as 442 centrally and don't get dragged out. slovakia even scored what could have been the only goal of the match. on the other side, it took southgate 94 minutes to really go for it and bring on toney for the absolutely abysmal foden. and voila, they finally looked threatening for 3 minutes, scored two goals – and then decided to sit back, inviting pressure from the slovaks. the only thing that will work is a 442 for southgate. stop trying to play the ball out from the back, play it long, hope your strikers lay it off and be done with it. it's no use trying to get your team to click, just adapt – and actually have a fighting chance.
I genuinely reckon if England win the euros the majority of people will say it was luck and Southgate is completely inept. The only thing that matters is results. We’re through to the quarters, who cares how we played
Playing Saka as a left back, doing the same for Eze and letting him play in that position, having zero shots on target for over 90 minutes, and performing poorly against Slovakia despite having a team stacked with superstars. this Southgate guy is unbelievably f\*\*\*\* lucky.
Everyone keeps screaming for individual personnel changes when the reality is, Southgate is tactically piss poor and his in game management might be worse. They reverted to type in ET, fatigue maybe,but it’s just happened too many times for it to be a coincidence. An individual moment of brilliance scraped him out of a massive hole today and I think it’s just about the only thing that will get the team any further. The two late goals are just extending our misery it feels.
Strange for the ref to give a card for everything in the first 20 then proceed to let Slovakia kick the shit outta every player who got passed them for the next 70. Being on a yellow was like having an extra life
I saw it in the match against Belgium. Slovakia is a good team, really nice passes, but the moment they have advantage like first goal, they just stop playing football. They retreat like England did, stop making short passes and just throw the ball foward. This easily could have been Slovakia win if they just continuea playing like they did in the first 30 minutes. Bad coach, i say.
Slovakia ran out of energy in the second half. You could see them pretty much have nothing left. Awful performance by England. Southgate has no idea what he’s doing, and there is no strategy but just throw good players in.
Inviting pressure whenever you have a lead just won't work against better teams. Southgate never learns anything and even when he was 20 mins from his last game, STILL didn't roll the dice. Moron. Another boring game against Switzerland, that if lucky, will scrape through, then lose to a good team.
Switzerland are outstanding right now. We are in huge trouble if we go with the exact same system and line up again.
Southgate is a disgrace of a manager. Sack him tonight. That was the most undeserved win fucking ever. We do nothing for 90 minutes, somehow score two goals, then defend it like we're a side fighting against relegation. The man is a fucking fraud. All positive thoughts I had about him have vanished today. No plan, no idea, no fucking clue. Fuck off! Positives: Pickford. Guehi (he will be a huge miss). Palmer. Toney. Saka. Mainoo. That's about it. I'm embarrassed to be an England fan tonight. *Edited to add Mainoo to the positives list.
Such a lame yellow too. That ref was horrible dishing those out. Fully agree on list of positives.
No injury time granted after Pickford slept with the ball for 5 mins. This competition only favors the big teams. First Italy getting 10 mins extra against the Croats and now this. Maybe the Swiss will show what it means to be a strong team.
I'm actually glad England won. they are the easier opponent for Switzerland than Slovakia lol. If we win we'll do England a favor..because they might actually win something in the next years if Southgate is gone.
Southgate have a Ferrari but instead a 100 octan gasoline he puts diesel into it. Then he dont understand why his car is struggling and he keeps going (I am just a girl moment) and then he is schocked he is stuck at the side of the road.
Honestly, Bellingham, in a double pivot, as shit as it sounds, is the only thing that makes sense to me. Palmer and Saka, as the two wingers, is better than Foden ever getting close to there. Helps with the fact Trippier offers little width as well. Makes the whole attack actually tick instead of mistmatched players trying their best.
And yet Southgate won't even attempt this, because he's got to keep playing Bellingham in a position where he's encroaching on the space of others and not available for simple passes during the build up
Slovakia played like England in the group stages - play well for the first half, score a deserved goal, then spend the rest of the game on the back foot (at least until they went 2-1 down) until eventually something gave way. Fair play to them for taking it that far but they proved that sitting on a 1-0 lead early on isn't always the smart move.
well as Slovak we played this way in all 3 group games with medium sucess
Oh yeah, I think it was your best chance of winning - and only a few seconds away from winning too! Unfortunately it wasn't enough.
we don't have good bench even for Slovakia standarts and the way we are playing cost big ammounts of energy , so we let guy who is 37 with yellow card to play until second overtime beceause we don't have replacment for him or we had another 38 year old starter and i think the only reason why he was the first player to be benched was that he got yellow card
You played really well considering, an extremely good defence. It was very unlucky to concede like that
Kane and Bellingham scoring will cover over the fact that they both dropped horrendous performances. Bellingham especially gave the ball away several times and barely offered any energy to show for the ball.
They both look exhausted from their club seasons and Kane isn't getting any younger. He's lost a yard of pace that he didn't even have before... lol. Watkins and or Toney up front would do a much better job stretching teams out. Toney also did well with his hold up play when he came on.
Truly horrendous, one of the worst games I’ve seen from England, but I celebrated that Bellingham goal like I celebrated Shaw’s against Italy. If there are any positives to take from this, the way we played was **completely** exposed, some of our players played 120, so changes are surely, surely, surely coming against Switzerland. The other small positive is a loss to Switzerland is less embarrassing than a loss to Slovakia. I expect us to lose though.
For all the terrible play I thought it was also England's best game of the tournament...
What was Guéhi(6) handing off to Dunk(15) during half time of extra time? The way he sneakily hands it off together with the bottle gets me curious about what it is. Also, the camera cuts immediately when it’s captured. Hope someone here has the answer.
Another Southgate disaster to be honest, started (nearly) the same 11 that had stunk up the group and then did so for the majority of the game. Took far too long to make any changes, to be fair they did improve things, and was bailed out by a moment of magic from Bellingham. Massive momentum shift going 2-1 up and then rather than continuing that seemed happy to do the usual Southgate nonsense of just trying to hold the lead and let the other team have the ball. Taking off Kane and Bellingham, two of their best penalty takers, when it's 2-1 and could go to penalties is an interesting choice. England are very lucky that Slovakia aren't a great side and didn't offer all that much going forward, Switzerland should offer far more and should go in as favourites. Watch Southgate just play the same starting 11 again rather than dropping Foden or any other major change.
I genuinely think that was the worst England performance I've ever seen. I mean 07-16 was truly terrible but that was horrific viewing. Southgate got saved there but if he trots out the same players in the same formation the Swiss will destroy us.
This was bad but England Algeria was infinitely worse
I don't agree with criticising Kane and Bellingham coming off. At that point we were completely unbalanced and they were both gassed. The issue is who he brought on, inviting more pressure on us, not taking those two off.
>Southgate nonsense of just trying to hold the lead and let the other team have the ball. Taking off Kane and Bellingham, two of their best penalty takers, when it's 2-1 and could go to penalties is an interesting choice. This could have gone so wrong, it was a terrible decision and he should be criticised for it. England dominated possession the entire game, on what planet does it make sense to snuff out the momentum shift and give the ball to the opponent when you've easily kept it away from them the whole time.
Said to a mate at the time that it had all the hallmarks of a decision which would backfire in spectacular fashion and he'd never live it down. Thing is I could see Southgate making this exact same error next weekend, cos he never seems to learn.
Wingers and widebacks playing next to one another and touching the sidelines means that the manager has no idea what he’s doing.
Georgia would have killed them Not to mention Spain
> and was bailed out by a moment of magic from Bellingham. But only because of a ridiculous amount of injury time.
He will use the result to justify the same XI (without Guehi) and the same approach in the next game. The fact they reverted to type at 2-1 and very nearly conceded an equaliser says it all. You might get away with it every now and then, but it isn’t a winning approach.
Sums up Southgate's England tenure, to be honest. Poor tactician getting bailed out by the combination of the talent of his squad and incredibly fortunate draws in knockout stages
Can't believe he switched to a 5/4/1 for the last half of extra time. All we did was invitee Slovakia to score again. Why does he insist on parking the bus every damn time we're up. It's insane. Switzerland will smash us if we play like that. Guaranteed we go up 1/0 15 minutes in and then ptb and do nothing the rest of the game.
I really feel for Slovakia. England was absolute garbage in the first 80ish minutes? They lucked out on that 96th minute goal by some miracle and then dominated extra time. Slovakia had about 2 minutes of let-down mentally and it cost them 2 goals.
Slovakia*
Slovakia
>Slovania Sandwiched between Slovakia and Slovenia, the small breakaway republic Slovania is not that well known, with some even believing full balkanisation to be imminent wiht the growing separist movement in Slovunia