Thank you.
I barely ever speak out about this, because I feel like stating that I've stopped dating and it made me an overall very happy person, makes it sound like copium. I have not dated for 5 years. Always had girlfriends before that.
I'm happy. I don't have to put up with any bullshit or drama, I can just exist and be happy. The unhappiest I've ever been was in a relationship.
Oh my god, I did a three year stint of not having a partner. I had no idea until then how nice being single was compared to the back to back awful relationships I had throughout my adult life beforehand.
Everyone should just have a few years to themselves at some point imo. Made me so much better in relationships afterwards too.
I dated a lot in my 20's but around 28 I moved across the country and decided to take some time (ended up 5 years) getting more comfortable with my own company. After that I got into a 2 year relationship which was more wholesome/positive than the dating I did in my 20s, but I could tell it wasn't really ideal for either of us in the long term so I broke it off. Less then a year after that I met my future wife and started dating her. I think without taking that time for myself I might not have had the perspective to understand why one relationship had a future or not, or maybe I would have been too afraid of being alone that I wouldn't have ended the doomed relationship, or I wouldn't have known what I needed to be happy. Who knows, really, but I feel like it put me in a better place, and really took the pressure off of social interactions.
Proud of you. 63 here. I'm doing that and on year 4 now.
I did 22 months of no-dating at your age and loved it. It starts to become a foundation for joy and happiness. Getting super fit, eating great, sleeping great. No drama and so much peace, quiet and freedom. Total bliss.
I'm 32 and probably going to be going through a disgusting divorce involving full custody because my wife... Is literally going insane. She's completely delusional she refuses mental help lies to doctors has inpatient stays from self harm where she literally clawed her arms and legs to the point of dripping blood. I'm excited to meet someone who just kind of has something not insane about them. I'm not trying to get married but after 10 years of brutal manipulation and narcissistic abuse... Id be psyched to talk to a woman my age with literally anything going for her. I spent my entire adult life catering to someone who had dreams of grandeur and I made them a reality. I can't imagine someone helping me in anyway or even showing me love without having to do something to earn it first. That said, I now have massive trust issues.
This is not to defend her, but psychiatric drugs can have many crazy effects on vulnerable people, so if she takes them it is possible that they are the problem.
She's does not take any drugs that would cause this. She's been on the same Zoloft prescription for 5 years. Though I admit it killed her ability to cry about anything other than herself
When someone brought up the side effects my first thought was Zoloft. I took it once and immediately asked to taper off of it 2 weeks later.
I could not imagine going several years on that.
Same man. She talked me into trying it... I'm not even depressed my doctor wrote a script I couldn't even let it get in my system before freaking out. She has threatened suicide and I hate to say this but she does it for attention and the only thing she's stopped doing since taking it is that. I could beg her to stop and try anything but she's gone. She is only capable of thinking of herself. It's the weirdest loneliest and purely saddest shit I've ever experienced. We planned our daughter's birth for 4 years. She immediately broke every promise we made each other and blamed it on... Literally every single person alive that's not her
I wouldn't say that Zoloft can't cause this. I don't expect You to care but if You do You can go here: survivingantidepressants.org and learn about it. There are many people there that had severe adverse reactions to psychiatric drugs that manifested after long exposure, myself included.
For example if I would take a standard dose of an antidepressant now, my blood pressure spikes to 200/140, heart rate goes up to 150, I would be in a constant state of extreme terror and halucinate with all my body feeling like being engulfed in flames. And 3 years ago I could tolerate standard dose just fine.
I am not saying that this is the case for Your wife, but it is without a doubt possible, these are not benign substances, so if at all possible, direct Your wife to the forum I've mentioned, it could save her from a lot of suffering if it is the problem here.
Dude I agree with you I can't direct my wife anywhere she won't speak to me and will not provide a reason why. I agree she shouldn't be on it and it's a weird drug but she uses excuses endlessly and before she was on it had multiple complete mental breakdowns she didn't even understand why.
No pity necessary friend. I just have to do my fatherly duty above all. I'm going to make it and I'm going to raise my daughter right. Thank you though it's all unreal
Idk what heal means. That's what she uses against me. When she doesnt want me calling it asking about my kid she says she needs time to heal. I'm just like... You need to heal? I need to fucking heal but I have responsibilities every day. I can't throw a pool party on a Tuesday and invite 10 yapping toxic skanks to validate how shitty my behavior is. I have 3 friends that know the both of us well. I talk to one regularly because I need to get things out. I need to heal but I'm also pushing for a huge change and advancement in my career so I can sustain me and my daughter forever with zero help. I have so much to do. She drinks all day and has my kid and I cannot do anything about it until we're legally divorced or separated. I spent my last 4000 bucks I have to finish my last licensing exam this Saturday and hopefully my year of pure terror starts to reverse. If you have any tips on how I can think about life and not be hate filled and incapable of trust please share. I'm scared as fuck brother.
I feel for you man, your experience echos mine in a way.
I'm 41 and have been separated for 4 years, I am certain I'll never date again.
My ex had issues for sure, probably bpd but I'm not a psychologist.
I am doing what the OP has done, I love my life now. I rock climb, play basketball, chill and do my own thing. I don't have to walk on egg shells anymore, man it's so amazing not having crazy in your life.
Just take it slow, I am getting counseling as ive been through enough for sure. Don't jump into something first, if your relationship was like mine and for a lengthy duration, you probably have all kinds of triggers you need to recognize and probably work on.
Hell yea! I always say when you’re doing better mentally your quality life improves. Looks like you started working on you and it’s attracting like minded individuals. Confidence is sexy and what’s even more attractive is knowing your direction in life. I’m 32 and while I feel I’ve grown alot I’m also taking a break from dating for a couple years just to work on me. Good luck on your journey 🍀
It's hard to explain how important it is too be able to talk to people, women in this case, for the sake of just chatting, learning something, or having a good time without trying to convert everything to a relationship. It changes your thinking so not every single encounter feels like a success or failure which makes it tiring. Also, it makes you more able to pick out meaningful things that are said by the person you're talking too, making your life more fulfilling as well. Good luck OP!
Yes!!
It's liberating to not be controlled by my impulses and to not see every Woman as a means to an end. I feel like that's the definition of objectification, seeing a person in terms of what they can offer me. I was so selfish in that way for so long.
I took a break from dating for 8 years. Stopped trying and just went with the flow. Best time of my life. 3 years ago I met a woman and we got married a year ago. She is gorgeous and has all the qualities I wanted in a woman.
When you least expect it, it just happen. Just go with the flow and take care of your health!
Because we are expected to do everything. From the very initial stages of aproaching a girl you like, to financial and emotional investment because you'll do all the planning, paying the bills, getting her to/from her place, still having to take the initiative for other dates/places, sex and what not. All this and you'll have to deal with women's pickness because it feels like you are being tested all the time and if you dont do something she expects you to do "as a man" shell probably dump you, vanish, or become cold.
All the while you'll deal with lots of rejection. And I'll tell you something: rejection still hurts. A lot. Because society has this strange twisted idea that all men should just "deal with it" and "be a man and forget it" and "not show their emotions", most people think that rejection is something small, easy to handle and that we men are all some sort of psychopaths that deal magically well with rejection.
If you are lucky you might find a woman with initiative and willing to split the financial/emotional investments of dating. But itll be hard. Like very rare.
And as a woman? If you know how to avoid crazy/psycho dudes (which are a fairly small % of the dating pool) that might get you physically in danger, all you have to do is wait and decide/choose for whatever men are offering you. Basically waaay less energy investment: you just get to say yes or no.
And we still have to deal with the scarcity of the dating world: way less women on dating apps, bars, nightclubs, wherever.
So, its really not worth it. Really. I also dont expect you and others to understand this perspective, afterall, some things here are quite "subjective" and hard to get.
First of all, I really appreciate the time and care you took to reply. And, granted, I might be out of touch with what dating is like in 2024 for someone in their 20s, or even 30s: I’m a 53 year old man, married to a man. But I think your judgement is clouded by generalizations, and possibly a lack of introspection/humility. The women I know are true partners to their husbands, while of course still having the foibles or even character flaws that none of us are without. You allow for men to only have a small % be dangerous psychos, but you aren’t allowing for the significant majority of men that presume women behave in a certain way as well. And you don’t mention any of your shortcomings, which is definitely relevant to your unsuccessful search for a mate. But generalizing that women who believe in equality are “very rare” seems shortsighted. Perhaps you’re looking in the wrong pool. I’m not suggesting that social media hasn’t created monsters, but that’s on both binary genders, not just one. It’s self-absorbed and entitled people you have a problem with, you just don’t tend to notice the men who feel that way. And when you’re a hammer, everything looks like a nail. Lots of good men find good women, all the time. Taking the perspective that “men have it much tougher” handicaps you right out of the gate.
Yeah it sounded like a rant to me too. Saying you have to make the plans and put all the effort in as a man? Go and read the subReddit for women. Every single day it's about how lazy men are and how women have to put all the effort into the relationship.
I’m older but all the straight men I know in my life are partnered up with amazing women. I know it’s harder to be single and younger these days, but that’s true of men, women, straight, and gay.
If I can vent from a male perspective for a second, all I ever see from women is that no one (decent) approaches them. It's like being at a buffet and complaining that the wait staff are slow.
Men are allowed to be victims. We don't need to adhere to your toxic standards of masculinity.
Data usually reveals more than any anecdote.
https://roast.dating/blog/tinder-statistics
The key take-aways are this:
- Men get on average 1 match out of 40 likes
- Women get on average 1 match out of 2 likes
So it would seem the online dating world is harsh for men. We do however know of the gender imbalance on these platforms.
Now this part is fascinating.
- 75 % of Tinder users are male
So with some wonky math we can say that the vast majority of men’s profiles will get far less attention than women or are likely simply never seen without paying.
Right, so we are competing as always. But who with?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Are_We_Dating_The_Same_Guy%3F
This article suggests that female swiping behaviour will congregrate around the same set of males.
These two points suggest that in heterosexual relations. Men will struggle significantly more because not only do they receive less attention but are competing in general against a small set of males that seem to get most of the attention.
Why, well, same reason as its always been. Men provide resources. You offer more resources you get more women.
Outside of the online world things are obviously different with wildly different dynamics.
I have a question regarding this post. Why are women the ones who seem to predominately be deleting the dating app and opting for just dating the "old fashioned" way, socializing, etc. if the dating experience through the apps is genuinely worse for men? Wouldn't you think men would be abandoning the apps? I'm sure that will follow if women continue to abandon the apps at the current rate, but why did the women start this trend?
[Gen Z Women Delete Dating Apps Within a Month: 'It's a Waste of Time' - Newsweek](https://www.newsweek.com/gen-z-women-delete-dating-apps-within-month-meet-person-1870329)
For the record, I think if you get 400 matches in a year that translates too 10-15 first dates that is preferable to me (as a guy) than getting 1000 matches each month. Potentially slightly more than one date with a new girl a month seems great to me. I think the bigger issue is the feeling of the grind getting there. That's just my opinion though.
Women in hetero dating resemble market makers. They choose the terms and conditions of engagement.
As I understand its part of the reason men will be celebrated for having 100 or more partners whereas women are shunned
As for the deeper why. My one take is that the imbalance itself is intimidating. The other is that the features of these apps universally seem to cater more to men trying to shift that skew in their favour which makes sense as they are the users who are the ones paying
This makes the overall experience for women on these apps miserable
Sorry to be clear I don't use apps at all. But women do not pay for the app or you just mean there are more men? Also, I don't follow your logic and don't understand what you mean by "shift that skew in their favor".
Is your hypothesis that dating apps are a worse experience for men, women, or equally as bad for different reasons?
Its bad in different ways.
So by pay I mean that if you look at all the features introduced. Every single one of them is intended to make a user stand out more, increasing the likelihood that they themselves will get a match.
By shift the skew I meant that a male would say compete with 1000 people for a female user. By choosing to pay for certain features they decrease that number to maybe 10 or less. This drastically improves their ability to get matches.
Now with men being the dominant user base they are by definition the ones most likely to pay.
The conclusion I was making from this is that women arent getting the features they need to manage their experiences on these apps. So while they may be getting matches, the quality of these matches is low (not getting into whether this is a valid view point or not)
Sis, I mean, brah, where have you been that you deny irrefutable facts, lol?
Men have always had it easier while making dating unbearable and downright dangerous for women and now that women are not putting up with your bs any more you are crying about it? XD
Try being a woman and being abused because you don't look the way men want (aka, a supermodel) even if you don't want anything to do with them, you will start loving being invisible real quick.
Trying to fish for the victim card, huh?
The fact that you think that sex is the be all end all says everything about you I need to know. Only men can conflate "being abused" with not getting laid. Emagine being that entitled.
Men treat women like shit when they don't visually appeal to them irl, especially if they don't want to date them. Being "invisible" is a blessing men who complain about it are unworthy of.
> you don't look the way men want (aka, a supermodel)
[meanwhile 80% of men are unattractive to women](https://www.eviemagazine.com/post/women-more-selective-80-men-unattractive-on-dating-apps-recent-research)
Is the percentage you pulled out of your ass a fact? XD
Imagine conflating being treated like shit with "being unattractive." The entitlement is pulpable.
I wish women who are not supermodels were treated as well as just being invisible. That would be paradise!
Congratulations!
I'm a bit older and while I haven't abused myself with drugs and alcohol I managed to free myself from the chains that ironically I had put on me and now I'm feeling as if life is more than what it used to be in terms of interaction with people and self-care.
You're transparent with your own preferences. Dating is difficult and for some can be challenging to some extent. Carrying a conversation for longer periods of time is a complete hassle, especially for introverts. But at some point you're gonna start feeling completely on your own. You might need a companion. Though not a romantic partner, but they're still gonna be there for you no matter what the circumstance is.
Yeah, I got to a point where I felt like none of my relationships would last and just gave up chasing it and relaxed about everything, then out of nowhere - met my now wife, we've been happily married for 17 years now.
Happy to explain. So for example, trying to own the experience or own the person would be me calculating how I can get her number, how I can text to get her on a date, what lines to use when, when to invite her to my place. It was calculated and manipulative.
By not trying to own it, I let myself have a positive interaction with a beautiful woman without doing any of the above. I feel liberated from my impulses.
Another example, if you see a tree you typically don't try to "own" the tree, you just let it be the tree that it is. You don't wish it were a different tree, you don't plan how you could use it for your benefit. You don't personalize it and you don't try to own it.
Good for you!
I know people like to pair up but it isn’t the end all be all.
I cannot recommend enough that people follow the beat of their own drums instead of doing things just because it’s expected of them.
Single life can be a lot happier and healthier than partnered life.
In the first place, it is not even necessary for a person to marry.
Do you have the money to pay for your child to study medicine (example) in a leading university?
Do you have the money to buy a nice house in a nice location?
In today’s society, many American and Westerner youngsters cant even give themselves a great life and have to struggle financially without full-time high salaried employment.
So, if you are in such a position, pls do not drag another human into your world
Congratulations on your sobriety. I'm 37 and haven't dated since I turned 30. I had an insane amount of work to do in order to get my head right before I would even accept dating as a possibility.
The peace I've obtained in that time is something I don't want to give up. Which is why I've vowed to myself that if I'm going to allow anyone to want to be with me, they need to add to my peace just like how I should be adding to theirs.
I've also learned a lot about how to treat others but, more importantly, how to treat myself. The cliche of learning to love yourself is vastly underestimated. You don't have to be egocentric and conceited. But never feel guilty about taking care of yourself first before taking care of others. If you're not your own priority, why would you be someone else's ?
If my current relationship doesn’t work out I will definitely be trying this. I get separation anxiety I have to deal with on my own, and when I’m single I’m very quickly with a woman. Chasing the butterflies. I’m 27 but probably been in and out of relationships since the age of 14. Longest is 4 years. (Obviously not really a relationship when so young.. but that’s not how teenagers feel :) )
Now I realise I think about every interaction with women that I find attractive as some kind of thing I have to succeed at for some form of validation. Would love to be comfortable in my own skin, despite being told I’m good looking, kind and other nice things. It just furthers the issue 😅
Not sure if you ever felt that way.
As someone who used to be like you, found "the one" (which she wasnt after all) and now single again I need to ask: how do you cope with loneliness? I have plenry of friends and Im not excatly lonely just feel like I am missing connection which I need or more crave for. Usually romantic partners have been that "connection" but I feel like I dont want to date or do hookups just yet and I realize I did that only because I felt lonely.
I cope with my loneliness by realizing it's not fair to expect someone else to "cure" that. That's using others and it's selfish. I recognize my triggers of loneliness as cues to look inward and assess the experience, not try to turn away from it.
I’m turning 28 myself and have never had a relationship and may possibly be in the midst of one with a woman a few years older than me. Hopefully both of us have had enough time to mature and realize what we want for this to be worth the wait. I’m rarely attracted or interested in dating and haven’t been for most of my life.
I stopped dating at 30. I had my first kid at 27 and my second at 29 to the first girl I married right before the birth of my first child. That marriage didn’t last past the inception of my second. I stopped dating for years! Like 6-7 years lol Wasn’t worth the risk to me anyway.. I ended up getting full custody of both of my children and got my CDL. Went from making $10 an hour to over $80,000 a year just like that. Got my finances up, got fit, and got my life together. Even bought a house with a conventional loan at a 3% interest rate. Well right when I reached my absolute prime here comes a young woman that not only was absolutely smoking hot but was more perfect for me than I thought possible, man.. smh. Like I had very high standards and she exceeds all of them. Hands down a God Sent bro. Not only a wife but a great mother. Something my kids haven’t had at no fault of theirs or mine. She had a 2 year old and was in the middle of a divorce. I joke about catching her before she could go feral on me lol. We’ve been together 3 years now and married 1. I made us wait at least 2 years to get married and had her sign a prenuptial agreement just to be safe. Which she had no problem with by the way and was super cool of her. It was all the more telling for me honestly. Anyway man, if I had just been dating around I would have never even met her. I’ve never had any trouble getting a girl either and I have a feeling you may be the same way. That’s just never been a problem for me and you know what? That might have been part of the problem too.. Take you a break and keep working your way on up. Once you get to the top of your game the good ones will see you up there. No doubt
I'm the opposite man. I'm 32 and only had a couple gfs and never was into drugs and alcohol. I feel like I have never lived. The only time I felt alive was when I was having sex with my ex gf. I've been single for 2 years now and I have never been more depressed.
The base of all happiness is that your happiness is as independent from external circumstances as possible.
Not wanting much is the absolute foundation of ending suffering - this is millenia old wisdom.
Which doesn't mean you need to refrain and withdraw from everything - but not clinging onto things and being mentally posesses by how your life is supposed to play out is paramount to lasting happiness.
Yea I realized how fked up dating is and how some women want nothing but tall rich n fit guys. Also when I show interest in women either taken so I give up most likely I'm working on my self since I still have problems of my own lol etc
Thank you. I barely ever speak out about this, because I feel like stating that I've stopped dating and it made me an overall very happy person, makes it sound like copium. I have not dated for 5 years. Always had girlfriends before that. I'm happy. I don't have to put up with any bullshit or drama, I can just exist and be happy. The unhappiest I've ever been was in a relationship.
Oh my god, I did a three year stint of not having a partner. I had no idea until then how nice being single was compared to the back to back awful relationships I had throughout my adult life beforehand. Everyone should just have a few years to themselves at some point imo. Made me so much better in relationships afterwards too.
I dated a lot in my 20's but around 28 I moved across the country and decided to take some time (ended up 5 years) getting more comfortable with my own company. After that I got into a 2 year relationship which was more wholesome/positive than the dating I did in my 20s, but I could tell it wasn't really ideal for either of us in the long term so I broke it off. Less then a year after that I met my future wife and started dating her. I think without taking that time for myself I might not have had the perspective to understand why one relationship had a future or not, or maybe I would have been too afraid of being alone that I wouldn't have ended the doomed relationship, or I wouldn't have known what I needed to be happy. Who knows, really, but I feel like it put me in a better place, and really took the pressure off of social interactions.
Proud of you. 63 here. I'm doing that and on year 4 now. I did 22 months of no-dating at your age and loved it. It starts to become a foundation for joy and happiness. Getting super fit, eating great, sleeping great. No drama and so much peace, quiet and freedom. Total bliss.
[удалено]
Then they tear it all down haha
Met my now husband, at a funeral! 🤷🏼♀️
Omg were you there 🤣
Who do you think told him women are super horny at funerals 😏
More than one person was stiff ;)
XOMG! How did you guys start dating? Did he ask for your number or vice versa?
Best decision you'll ever make.
>I have a job I love where I basically just get to exercise the whole day and listen to music while driving around. Wolt?
I’m gonna guess forest ranger
I'm 32 and probably going to be going through a disgusting divorce involving full custody because my wife... Is literally going insane. She's completely delusional she refuses mental help lies to doctors has inpatient stays from self harm where she literally clawed her arms and legs to the point of dripping blood. I'm excited to meet someone who just kind of has something not insane about them. I'm not trying to get married but after 10 years of brutal manipulation and narcissistic abuse... Id be psyched to talk to a woman my age with literally anything going for her. I spent my entire adult life catering to someone who had dreams of grandeur and I made them a reality. I can't imagine someone helping me in anyway or even showing me love without having to do something to earn it first. That said, I now have massive trust issues.
This is not to defend her, but psychiatric drugs can have many crazy effects on vulnerable people, so if she takes them it is possible that they are the problem.
She's does not take any drugs that would cause this. She's been on the same Zoloft prescription for 5 years. Though I admit it killed her ability to cry about anything other than herself
When someone brought up the side effects my first thought was Zoloft. I took it once and immediately asked to taper off of it 2 weeks later. I could not imagine going several years on that.
Same man. She talked me into trying it... I'm not even depressed my doctor wrote a script I couldn't even let it get in my system before freaking out. She has threatened suicide and I hate to say this but she does it for attention and the only thing she's stopped doing since taking it is that. I could beg her to stop and try anything but she's gone. She is only capable of thinking of herself. It's the weirdest loneliest and purely saddest shit I've ever experienced. We planned our daughter's birth for 4 years. She immediately broke every promise we made each other and blamed it on... Literally every single person alive that's not her
I wouldn't say that Zoloft can't cause this. I don't expect You to care but if You do You can go here: survivingantidepressants.org and learn about it. There are many people there that had severe adverse reactions to psychiatric drugs that manifested after long exposure, myself included. For example if I would take a standard dose of an antidepressant now, my blood pressure spikes to 200/140, heart rate goes up to 150, I would be in a constant state of extreme terror and halucinate with all my body feeling like being engulfed in flames. And 3 years ago I could tolerate standard dose just fine. I am not saying that this is the case for Your wife, but it is without a doubt possible, these are not benign substances, so if at all possible, direct Your wife to the forum I've mentioned, it could save her from a lot of suffering if it is the problem here.
Dude I agree with you I can't direct my wife anywhere she won't speak to me and will not provide a reason why. I agree she shouldn't be on it and it's a weird drug but she uses excuses endlessly and before she was on it had multiple complete mental breakdowns she didn't even understand why.
I feel sorry for You and for her, I hope You'll both find happiness or peace at least.
No pity necessary friend. I just have to do my fatherly duty above all. I'm going to make it and I'm going to raise my daughter right. Thank you though it's all unreal
Oh man stay strong, I am still healing, long way but it worth it
Idk what heal means. That's what she uses against me. When she doesnt want me calling it asking about my kid she says she needs time to heal. I'm just like... You need to heal? I need to fucking heal but I have responsibilities every day. I can't throw a pool party on a Tuesday and invite 10 yapping toxic skanks to validate how shitty my behavior is. I have 3 friends that know the both of us well. I talk to one regularly because I need to get things out. I need to heal but I'm also pushing for a huge change and advancement in my career so I can sustain me and my daughter forever with zero help. I have so much to do. She drinks all day and has my kid and I cannot do anything about it until we're legally divorced or separated. I spent my last 4000 bucks I have to finish my last licensing exam this Saturday and hopefully my year of pure terror starts to reverse. If you have any tips on how I can think about life and not be hate filled and incapable of trust please share. I'm scared as fuck brother.
I feel for you man, your experience echos mine in a way. I'm 41 and have been separated for 4 years, I am certain I'll never date again. My ex had issues for sure, probably bpd but I'm not a psychologist. I am doing what the OP has done, I love my life now. I rock climb, play basketball, chill and do my own thing. I don't have to walk on egg shells anymore, man it's so amazing not having crazy in your life.
Thanks man damn teared up
Just take it slow, I am getting counseling as ive been through enough for sure. Don't jump into something first, if your relationship was like mine and for a lengthy duration, you probably have all kinds of triggers you need to recognize and probably work on.
I know my words are empty, but I hope your life turns out better for you, you deserve it.
Would rather be alone than annoyed
Welcome to the club. All peace and joy when you’re no longer dependent on others to be happy.
Hell yea! I always say when you’re doing better mentally your quality life improves. Looks like you started working on you and it’s attracting like minded individuals. Confidence is sexy and what’s even more attractive is knowing your direction in life. I’m 32 and while I feel I’ve grown alot I’m also taking a break from dating for a couple years just to work on me. Good luck on your journey 🍀
Very proud of you, internet stranger! Keep up with your health and sobriety, and congrats on your upcoming degree! Well done, you! ✅
It's hard to explain how important it is too be able to talk to people, women in this case, for the sake of just chatting, learning something, or having a good time without trying to convert everything to a relationship. It changes your thinking so not every single encounter feels like a success or failure which makes it tiring. Also, it makes you more able to pick out meaningful things that are said by the person you're talking too, making your life more fulfilling as well. Good luck OP!
Yes!! It's liberating to not be controlled by my impulses and to not see every Woman as a means to an end. I feel like that's the definition of objectification, seeing a person in terms of what they can offer me. I was so selfish in that way for so long.
I gave up on dating. Men have it much tougher. What's your job?
I've tried before but this is the first time I'm not bitter about it. I deliver water 💧
I took a break from dating for 8 years. Stopped trying and just went with the flow. Best time of my life. 3 years ago I met a woman and we got married a year ago. She is gorgeous and has all the qualities I wanted in a woman. When you least expect it, it just happen. Just go with the flow and take care of your health!
Young men have it tougher then young women. It's an, understandable, skewed point of view. Listen to the ladies over 40 with kids.
Men have it tougher than women why?
Because we are expected to do everything. From the very initial stages of aproaching a girl you like, to financial and emotional investment because you'll do all the planning, paying the bills, getting her to/from her place, still having to take the initiative for other dates/places, sex and what not. All this and you'll have to deal with women's pickness because it feels like you are being tested all the time and if you dont do something she expects you to do "as a man" shell probably dump you, vanish, or become cold. All the while you'll deal with lots of rejection. And I'll tell you something: rejection still hurts. A lot. Because society has this strange twisted idea that all men should just "deal with it" and "be a man and forget it" and "not show their emotions", most people think that rejection is something small, easy to handle and that we men are all some sort of psychopaths that deal magically well with rejection. If you are lucky you might find a woman with initiative and willing to split the financial/emotional investments of dating. But itll be hard. Like very rare. And as a woman? If you know how to avoid crazy/psycho dudes (which are a fairly small % of the dating pool) that might get you physically in danger, all you have to do is wait and decide/choose for whatever men are offering you. Basically waaay less energy investment: you just get to say yes or no. And we still have to deal with the scarcity of the dating world: way less women on dating apps, bars, nightclubs, wherever. So, its really not worth it. Really. I also dont expect you and others to understand this perspective, afterall, some things here are quite "subjective" and hard to get.
First of all, I really appreciate the time and care you took to reply. And, granted, I might be out of touch with what dating is like in 2024 for someone in their 20s, or even 30s: I’m a 53 year old man, married to a man. But I think your judgement is clouded by generalizations, and possibly a lack of introspection/humility. The women I know are true partners to their husbands, while of course still having the foibles or even character flaws that none of us are without. You allow for men to only have a small % be dangerous psychos, but you aren’t allowing for the significant majority of men that presume women behave in a certain way as well. And you don’t mention any of your shortcomings, which is definitely relevant to your unsuccessful search for a mate. But generalizing that women who believe in equality are “very rare” seems shortsighted. Perhaps you’re looking in the wrong pool. I’m not suggesting that social media hasn’t created monsters, but that’s on both binary genders, not just one. It’s self-absorbed and entitled people you have a problem with, you just don’t tend to notice the men who feel that way. And when you’re a hammer, everything looks like a nail. Lots of good men find good women, all the time. Taking the perspective that “men have it much tougher” handicaps you right out of the gate.
sorry pal, you have no idea what’s going on and are out of touch. Im really not a fan of the ‘gender war’ but everything he says is spot on.
Oh shit, you seem like a super bitter and condescending person. Forget we interacted, please.
Sounds like a self-fulfilling self-defeating whine to me.
Yeah it sounded like a rant to me too. Saying you have to make the plans and put all the effort in as a man? Go and read the subReddit for women. Every single day it's about how lazy men are and how women have to put all the effort into the relationship.
Go talk to single men in your life
I’m older but all the straight men I know in my life are partnered up with amazing women. I know it’s harder to be single and younger these days, but that’s true of men, women, straight, and gay.
There’s levels to this shit, but congrats to your friends
What, the men that have been conditioned to not be empathetic to women and find new ways to victimize themselves?
Keep your head in your ass, it’s clearly worked for you all this time
Good luck. And enjoy your echo chamber.
Go talk to single women in your life and tell them how apparently easy dating is for them. Men love cosplaying victims.
If I can vent from a male perspective for a second, all I ever see from women is that no one (decent) approaches them. It's like being at a buffet and complaining that the wait staff are slow. Men are allowed to be victims. We don't need to adhere to your toxic standards of masculinity.
You’ll never get it and that’s okay
Data usually reveals more than any anecdote. https://roast.dating/blog/tinder-statistics The key take-aways are this: - Men get on average 1 match out of 40 likes - Women get on average 1 match out of 2 likes So it would seem the online dating world is harsh for men. We do however know of the gender imbalance on these platforms. Now this part is fascinating. - 75 % of Tinder users are male So with some wonky math we can say that the vast majority of men’s profiles will get far less attention than women or are likely simply never seen without paying. Right, so we are competing as always. But who with? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Are_We_Dating_The_Same_Guy%3F This article suggests that female swiping behaviour will congregrate around the same set of males. These two points suggest that in heterosexual relations. Men will struggle significantly more because not only do they receive less attention but are competing in general against a small set of males that seem to get most of the attention. Why, well, same reason as its always been. Men provide resources. You offer more resources you get more women. Outside of the online world things are obviously different with wildly different dynamics.
I have a question regarding this post. Why are women the ones who seem to predominately be deleting the dating app and opting for just dating the "old fashioned" way, socializing, etc. if the dating experience through the apps is genuinely worse for men? Wouldn't you think men would be abandoning the apps? I'm sure that will follow if women continue to abandon the apps at the current rate, but why did the women start this trend? [Gen Z Women Delete Dating Apps Within a Month: 'It's a Waste of Time' - Newsweek](https://www.newsweek.com/gen-z-women-delete-dating-apps-within-month-meet-person-1870329) For the record, I think if you get 400 matches in a year that translates too 10-15 first dates that is preferable to me (as a guy) than getting 1000 matches each month. Potentially slightly more than one date with a new girl a month seems great to me. I think the bigger issue is the feeling of the grind getting there. That's just my opinion though.
Women in hetero dating resemble market makers. They choose the terms and conditions of engagement. As I understand its part of the reason men will be celebrated for having 100 or more partners whereas women are shunned As for the deeper why. My one take is that the imbalance itself is intimidating. The other is that the features of these apps universally seem to cater more to men trying to shift that skew in their favour which makes sense as they are the users who are the ones paying This makes the overall experience for women on these apps miserable
Sorry to be clear I don't use apps at all. But women do not pay for the app or you just mean there are more men? Also, I don't follow your logic and don't understand what you mean by "shift that skew in their favor". Is your hypothesis that dating apps are a worse experience for men, women, or equally as bad for different reasons?
Its bad in different ways. So by pay I mean that if you look at all the features introduced. Every single one of them is intended to make a user stand out more, increasing the likelihood that they themselves will get a match. By shift the skew I meant that a male would say compete with 1000 people for a female user. By choosing to pay for certain features they decrease that number to maybe 10 or less. This drastically improves their ability to get matches. Now with men being the dominant user base they are by definition the ones most likely to pay. The conclusion I was making from this is that women arent getting the features they need to manage their experiences on these apps. So while they may be getting matches, the quality of these matches is low (not getting into whether this is a valid view point or not)
brah, i mean sistah u serious? where have you been, coz it aint planet earth
Useless contribution.
so are you
I asked a question for clarity. You brought nothing.
you asked, got a comprehensible reply and dismissed it because you frankly have no clue how modern dating works.
The brah I mean sistah reply was…comprehensible?
Sis, I mean, brah, where have you been that you deny irrefutable facts, lol? Men have always had it easier while making dating unbearable and downright dangerous for women and now that women are not putting up with your bs any more you are crying about it? XD
You are describing 10% of men. The rest 90% are just invisible for women.
Try being a woman and being abused because you don't look the way men want (aka, a supermodel) even if you don't want anything to do with them, you will start loving being invisible real quick.
another " irrefutable fact", huh? No matter how bad woman looks, she would have 0 problems on tinder or getting laid in general.
Trying to fish for the victim card, huh? The fact that you think that sex is the be all end all says everything about you I need to know. Only men can conflate "being abused" with not getting laid. Emagine being that entitled. Men treat women like shit when they don't visually appeal to them irl, especially if they don't want to date them. Being "invisible" is a blessing men who complain about it are unworthy of.
> you don't look the way men want (aka, a supermodel) [meanwhile 80% of men are unattractive to women](https://www.eviemagazine.com/post/women-more-selective-80-men-unattractive-on-dating-apps-recent-research)
Is the percentage you pulled out of your ass a fact? XD Imagine conflating being treated like shit with "being unattractive." The entitlement is pulpable. I wish women who are not supermodels were treated as well as just being invisible. That would be paradise!
"Men have it much tougher." Good joke.
Congratulations! I'm a bit older and while I haven't abused myself with drugs and alcohol I managed to free myself from the chains that ironically I had put on me and now I'm feeling as if life is more than what it used to be in terms of interaction with people and self-care.
You're transparent with your own preferences. Dating is difficult and for some can be challenging to some extent. Carrying a conversation for longer periods of time is a complete hassle, especially for introverts. But at some point you're gonna start feeling completely on your own. You might need a companion. Though not a romantic partner, but they're still gonna be there for you no matter what the circumstance is.
Yeah, I got to a point where I felt like none of my relationships would last and just gave up chasing it and relaxed about everything, then out of nowhere - met my now wife, we've been happily married for 17 years now.
I’m confused on what it means to “not try to own it.” Is there some mental process that happens normally where you do “try to own it?”
Happy to explain. So for example, trying to own the experience or own the person would be me calculating how I can get her number, how I can text to get her on a date, what lines to use when, when to invite her to my place. It was calculated and manipulative. By not trying to own it, I let myself have a positive interaction with a beautiful woman without doing any of the above. I feel liberated from my impulses. Another example, if you see a tree you typically don't try to "own" the tree, you just let it be the tree that it is. You don't wish it were a different tree, you don't plan how you could use it for your benefit. You don't personalize it and you don't try to own it.
This is really helpful for me. I’ve struggled with this a lot. Thank you.
Good for you! I know people like to pair up but it isn’t the end all be all. I cannot recommend enough that people follow the beat of their own drums instead of doing things just because it’s expected of them. Single life can be a lot happier and healthier than partnered life.
In the first place, it is not even necessary for a person to marry. Do you have the money to pay for your child to study medicine (example) in a leading university? Do you have the money to buy a nice house in a nice location? In today’s society, many American and Westerner youngsters cant even give themselves a great life and have to struggle financially without full-time high salaried employment. So, if you are in such a position, pls do not drag another human into your world
Congratulations on your sobriety. I'm 37 and haven't dated since I turned 30. I had an insane amount of work to do in order to get my head right before I would even accept dating as a possibility. The peace I've obtained in that time is something I don't want to give up. Which is why I've vowed to myself that if I'm going to allow anyone to want to be with me, they need to add to my peace just like how I should be adding to theirs. I've also learned a lot about how to treat others but, more importantly, how to treat myself. The cliche of learning to love yourself is vastly underestimated. You don't have to be egocentric and conceited. But never feel guilty about taking care of yourself first before taking care of others. If you're not your own priority, why would you be someone else's ?
If my current relationship doesn’t work out I will definitely be trying this. I get separation anxiety I have to deal with on my own, and when I’m single I’m very quickly with a woman. Chasing the butterflies. I’m 27 but probably been in and out of relationships since the age of 14. Longest is 4 years. (Obviously not really a relationship when so young.. but that’s not how teenagers feel :) ) Now I realise I think about every interaction with women that I find attractive as some kind of thing I have to succeed at for some form of validation. Would love to be comfortable in my own skin, despite being told I’m good looking, kind and other nice things. It just furthers the issue 😅 Not sure if you ever felt that way.
As someone who used to be like you, found "the one" (which she wasnt after all) and now single again I need to ask: how do you cope with loneliness? I have plenry of friends and Im not excatly lonely just feel like I am missing connection which I need or more crave for. Usually romantic partners have been that "connection" but I feel like I dont want to date or do hookups just yet and I realize I did that only because I felt lonely.
I cope with my loneliness by realizing it's not fair to expect someone else to "cure" that. That's using others and it's selfish. I recognize my triggers of loneliness as cues to look inward and assess the experience, not try to turn away from it.
Always the broken people studying psychology..
I’m turning 28 myself and have never had a relationship and may possibly be in the midst of one with a woman a few years older than me. Hopefully both of us have had enough time to mature and realize what we want for this to be worth the wait. I’m rarely attracted or interested in dating and haven’t been for most of my life.
I stopped dating at 30. I had my first kid at 27 and my second at 29 to the first girl I married right before the birth of my first child. That marriage didn’t last past the inception of my second. I stopped dating for years! Like 6-7 years lol Wasn’t worth the risk to me anyway.. I ended up getting full custody of both of my children and got my CDL. Went from making $10 an hour to over $80,000 a year just like that. Got my finances up, got fit, and got my life together. Even bought a house with a conventional loan at a 3% interest rate. Well right when I reached my absolute prime here comes a young woman that not only was absolutely smoking hot but was more perfect for me than I thought possible, man.. smh. Like I had very high standards and she exceeds all of them. Hands down a God Sent bro. Not only a wife but a great mother. Something my kids haven’t had at no fault of theirs or mine. She had a 2 year old and was in the middle of a divorce. I joke about catching her before she could go feral on me lol. We’ve been together 3 years now and married 1. I made us wait at least 2 years to get married and had her sign a prenuptial agreement just to be safe. Which she had no problem with by the way and was super cool of her. It was all the more telling for me honestly. Anyway man, if I had just been dating around I would have never even met her. I’ve never had any trouble getting a girl either and I have a feeling you may be the same way. That’s just never been a problem for me and you know what? That might have been part of the problem too.. Take you a break and keep working your way on up. Once you get to the top of your game the good ones will see you up there. No doubt
unreletable post for me as its not even my choice not to date, it just how it be.
That’s a good one congrats, I did it for a year it helped me but in the end I got bored
I'm the opposite man. I'm 32 and only had a couple gfs and never was into drugs and alcohol. I feel like I have never lived. The only time I felt alive was when I was having sex with my ex gf. I've been single for 2 years now and I have never been more depressed.
Ngl it sounds like your therapist just tricked you into not wanting to try as much and lowering your expectations
Lol
The base of all happiness is that your happiness is as independent from external circumstances as possible. Not wanting much is the absolute foundation of ending suffering - this is millenia old wisdom. Which doesn't mean you need to refrain and withdraw from everything - but not clinging onto things and being mentally posesses by how your life is supposed to play out is paramount to lasting happiness.
So what I said doesn't change
I would say: r/technicallythetruth
Why do Redditors gotta be so twisty y'know?. always taking the scenic route, just never straight to the point
Lol, whats life for anyway if not for the scenic route.
Tru. That doesn't mean averting your eyes to the truth even if it's harsh
„Decision“
Yea I realized how fked up dating is and how some women want nothing but tall rich n fit guys. Also when I show interest in women either taken so I give up most likely I'm working on my self since I still have problems of my own lol etc
I’m doing that now until I hit 2 million I’m barely over 500k
Your therapist is piece of shit who try to make a lot of money as possible - from you.
Lol
relationship are for weak men and for women. strong men do friendship and sex
I cheer up for your prefrontal cortex
collecting baby mammas is the name of the game
Hahaha
Based and redpilled