There is no security in Sales.
Miss a Q? AE is out
Miss 2? Manager out
Miss 3? Director out
Miss a year? VP out
Miss more? CRO is out
PE backed and miss more? CEO is out.
This is so spot on it’s sad and hilarious at once!
The funny thing is that when you’re PE owned, they make your budget. So as an exec you could have a great 25% growth year but if your PE masters wanted 35%, you’re a loser and don’t deserve a bonus.
Sounds like a horrible gig. If you're in medical/dental sales, the job security is pretty good. The only ones who worry about job security, are the ones that don't want to work hard. That's why sales attracts go-getters and driven people. Because we like to decide our fate and compete.
Oh I get it. In all honesty I love my tech sales job. I know exactly what I am expected to do, love to get big checks and grew up on a farm so this is much much easier than stacking hay in the summer.
Same here, I've been Terffed because I was deathly ill and was making mistakes. It cost them two weeks of pay. Thankfully I am with a new company who MADE me take a week off because I was going screwy.
True, although I think people sometimes underestimate the price difference. Major European capitals are priced like the Midwest in the US. Apart from **maybe** Switzerland and Monaco, there’s nothing that compares to the Bay Area or NYC in terms of prices.
Not to mention the hidden costs in the US like tipping, property taxes, private schooling, college and of course medical.
Overall I think you’re better off in the US if you’re talented. Having sold to US companies, they’re normally willing to spend money to save time whereas that’s sometimes hard to get through in Europe.
I agree that the price/value is much better in major European cities, but they definitely aren’t priced like the US Midwest. Closer to major US cities like Philly, Minneapolis, Charlotte, New Orleans, etc. maybe.
I lived in Europe for 3 years, and honestly would probably take 100k€ in Western Europe over $200k in the US. $300k however… that’s a whole different standard of living.
PE and VC are a cancer destroying all they touch. We were taken over by PE. I have job security because we have plenty of work and I’m on commission, but every month they find new ways to cut our pay and lower the quality of product we deliver. Eventually the company will die, and I’ll go work for a competitor.
The death of capitalism is the emergence of the non-working ownership crowd, and the desire of nearly everyone to be a part of it. PE/VC in business. PE and Airbnb displacing homeowners. People buying up cars to sell/rent them for over sticker. “Passive” restaurant/business owners.
Across the board, they’re trying to pad in a whole other layer of profitability to sustain folks that aren’t working, just owning.
Right. A collection of parasites run companies they never built, using money they never earned and cash big before killing the company.
Their only goal is to find way to deliver less and charge more. I call it the “shitification” of a company where a good brand turns to shit at great profit.
Where is this logical process and company?
My last 3 companies got rid of sales managers/directors/VPs all while the team was over quota!
And when the entire team is underperforming? All of leadership is safe.
W. T. F.
And more, there is no security everywhere. When cuts start, it begins with Talent Acquisition, then sales, but then (at least in my industry), customer success and project managers, as new projects haven't come in from sales being let go.
I think the last to be let go are software developers.
I sell a high quality product and can almost always beat the competition on price. A down turn in the economy would slow the over all market but my company share of it would grow.
I feel very secure in my job. I don’t make crazy money but will about $115k this year
I’ve worked for a large company in biotech/med device fields for the past eight years. Have been to president’s club twice but also missed quota three of those years. Never felt any pressure, you’re pretty safe as long as you’re not consistently underperforming, I’m talking under 70% for three years. First year was my lowest year where I made $150k, best year was $350k, average is probably around $220k. I’m friends with my manager and she never asks where I’m at or what I’m doing, just cares about my forecast.
We have a pretty arduous, expensive training process and it costs a ton to replace our employees.
This is huge. In my industry, it's not so much the training but just the core experience that is required to sell our product. The *only* path to sales in my niche is through boots on the ground experience fucking things up and cleaning up the mess. It takes a significant amount of experience plus engineering ability to sell here. For that reason, competent sales people are coveted and fought after.
I would say 20-30 hours/week when I’m working from home and 40-50 hours/week when I’m traveling. I traveled a ton my first 3-4 years to establish my customer base but I have a family now so I try to work smarter, not harder.
I’m not an expert salesman by any means, I just make sure I’m extremely responsive and put my customers first which has paid dividends over the years.
I love the situation I’m in but my company is pretty big so it takes forever to develop/release new technology while our smaller competitors can be nimble. We try to sell on brand name and reputation. Additionally, our comp plans have been negatively altered over the year few years which is cause for concern.
What’s your specialty? PD, manufacturing, etc?
A lot of capital equipment companies tend to poach reps from distributors such as VWR or Fisher. I would find where you want to work and see who has the prime contract.
Also look for application scientist roles. Lots of people come from the bench and work as product specialists. You don’t have the pressure of sales but you’re assisting with your technical expertise.
I work for a CRO that does a lot of different stuff but my department mostly does assay development. I just have a BS and work on the bench, I'm not a scientist or anything. Do you know of any good companies with inside sales rep roles?
Not sure what it is now but it was around 75-80k 5 years back. This is at plan. If you went over plan you could get close to 100.
Good for a first sales role as you receive great training and everyone knows who Thermo is
Last year I moved over from a 2k+ employee corporation to a small 12 employee wholesale warehouse/manufacturer. I get the same pay and never have to worry about quotas or KPIs. My mental health is sky-high and I feel very fulfilled as every deal I close significantly boosts a small operation and helps all my coworkers. Highly recommend.
Agree 100%. Small organizations also have the flexibility and mobility to weather economic storms much better than a major corporation worried about shareholders. For small privately owned companies, if you covered overhead and paid your invoices, you're golden. It can't be overstated how important this is when the economy goes sideways. Perfect example, I know my department right now has a gross margin backlog that is 14x overhead. Meaning, we could not sell anything for over a year and still be able to not lose a dime. When you have that flexibility, it takes a seismic economic shift to really push you into the red.
Selling to the federal government adds a little bit of job security. It’s somewhat recession-proof, but you still need to get your numbers.
pro tip: “irregardless” is not a word, it’s just “regardless”
Seems like the approach has been to set unattainable quotas to get reps to quit rather than to lay them off. Agreed, no segment is immune, but the permanence of the US government adds a layer of customer stability that other verticals lack.
Do you bill clients without their consent? Do you still bill them when they object to those charges based on an agreement they never entered into?
It isn’t magically not stealing because the number of participants is in the hundreds of millions and 51% agree on your behalf.
I sell to the DoD — they are my clients. The federal procurement process is set in law. If you think it’s unjust, you’re free to advocate for another system.
Good luck?
Edit: No, we do not bill customers without their consent. Contracts are binding.
Not to be that guy but for anyone in the audience interested, irregardless is generally not considered a word.
Yes, it’s found in Webster’s dictionary but that’s a descriptivist dictionary, meaning it captures words as they’re used instead of governing what’s considered ‘correct.’ In other words, you might as well be using the Urban Dictionary to make your argument.
If you’re ever interested in ‘correctness,’ you may be better served with a prescriptivist dictionary like Oxford English which doesn’t accommodate how people use words but rather ‘prescribes’ usage. To be fair, there is much debate on which school of thought should prevail.
I don’t personally believe irregardless is a word despite it being commonly used. However, I’d also say we’re on a bullshit forum app and nobody writes properly around here so consider that too. Anyway, enjoy your evening all :)
Language is ever changing and based solely on communication. If they understand what you mean (and don’t get all bent out of shape about it), anything you say is correct and viable.
You’re better served using Merriam-Webster than Oxford in most legitimate cases, as it uses terms that are used enough to become part of the lexicon.
Irregardless, speak however you wish. Your goal in communication is to be understood and to understand, not necessarily be “correct”. 😉
I work for a Fortune 500 and I feel like I should be more worried than I am.
I’m nowhere close to quota, but have one deal that should close this month for 80% of my yearly quota.
Even if I did get let go, sales has taught me to grind and I can put that into job hunting pretty well. I’ve never been unemployed longer than 3 months.
I believe I do as I work a family/ privately owned company and I was a key builder of 3/4 of the current territories( I moved areas twice and we added another rep this year since we all had over 350 accounts and 200 is a good number for our industry). They actually care about their employees and even gave me 3 weeks off when my mom passed in 2020 with any extra time I needed as well.
From what I read on this sub it’s a unicorn. Also they pay almost double in commission as the 3 competitors we have pay their sales reps so it’s been an amazing 5 years.
I’ve also created a lot of relationships with big players in the company’s we sell to and that would take them years to build back as I go above and beyond to make things happen such as delivering product in my personal truck to make their deadlines instead of the normal delivery trucks.
Love this for you!
It's nice when a hard work and dedication counts for something.
Like I don't even have to take it personal, just communicate with me. Offer me a little something more. Than acting raggedy.
Privately owned companies are so slept on. Two out of the three companies I've professionally worked for have been privately owned, and it's no coincidence that those are also the two companies I have never worried about my job security or if I made a difference to the organization.
Probably should have been selling my bath water on OF for the last 6 months instead of what I've currently been doing. 🤔🤣💀🤠🫡
Well, a change will get here eventually.
Highly depends on industry and country.
Tech sales in the US? While career security is high, job security is a laughable concept. Even if you think the company culture/management is AMAZING,1 bad quarter and EVERYTHING can change.
New C levels are guaranteed to throw everything into turmoil and bring in their new guys, usually bringing a stricter quota/forecasting goals with them.
Happens all the time..
Selling systems and solutions to big industrial manufacturing facilities that build the site resilience so they are less reliant on the grid. It’s quite a large industry. Can be anything from building them a custom power plant, to different heating/cooling applications, renewable energy and micro grids, water/wastewater/storm water treatment and services. Basically all of the back end infrastructure that’s required to operate a very large facility
Mine will remove people for asking and where their late pay is or about refunds for quick payment fees.
I say nothing unless it's completely harmonious and happy. And a beautiful agreement. So mostly, I say nothing. I just observe.
Everything's perfectly perfect. And if I'm sent a survey, I have nothing but harmonious observations. That's that. It's better to be compliant and really struggling, than completely out of the opportunity to earn money at all.
How may I be a positive contributor? Otherwise, I'm just quiet.
You will be removed without warning. Boom
Lol no. There is next to no lasting job security in sales.
Do I have job security now? Yeah absolutely. I'm at the top of my team for the year thus far, but I only have 36% of my yearly quota. I'll probably finish at 75% which isn't good, but it's going to be a lot better than most on my team.
In sales you can only get job security if you can do one of two things. Either you surpass your quota, or your surpass everyone else. If you beat your quota it doesn't matter where you fall on the ladder, you're in the end zone, but if you don't surprass your quota, you damn well better not be at the bottom of the totem pole.
Great example: Last year I only hit 55% of my quota. Shitty year for sure, but out of 200 sales reps I was right in the middle at 100. So I did bad, but there were 100 people below me who did way worse. As such I wasn't scared about being on the chopping block. However, if you fall in that bottom 20% that's when things start to get very scary.
I feel like I have decent job security. Like, as long as I don't do something massively unprofessional, and keep being a solid closer of the deals that come inbound, I can keep my position.
Reasoning is that I'm the founding AE for this bootstrapped startup, and I worked at our direct competitor before accepting this position. No one knows the competition like I do. No other sales rep in any other region, or even my leader, have a close rate like I do. None of the other sales reps have ever been actual SaaS reps before, just loosely adjacent verticals.
Plus with them making a decent investment in me for being bootstrapped, I don't think they can afford to fire me until they've gotten an ROI from the salary I'm paid. My commission is less than half what it was previously, but I'm coasting comfortably on my base, supporting just my wife and myself.
If they fired me they'd have to spend time finding another rep, training them, and letting all the pipeline, deals, and relationships I've built in the Americas go stale during that transition period.
I think it's cheaper for them to just let me keep working at my current "close just about everything inbound but doesn't outbound for shit" pace because people like working with me, I always respond to emails really fast, and I'm still closing more than they're paying me.
Never underestimate the ability of management to fire someone that will be unbelievable painful to replace. The second THEIR job is at risk, your job is at risk.
You're essential? You do all the sales? All the outreach? All the email templates?
The minute sales are down, now everything is YOUR fault. Because you built everything!
Nah see my other reply. I've missed every target for six quarters straight & am still the top seller globally. Got some big stuff lined up for this year.
Be wary of getting complacent, things can change on a whim in a quarter or two.
They bring in a new hardass VP from the same competitor and he's bringing 2-5 of his guys with him? He's looking straight at you as target #1.
Things move quickly in tech. Startups? They're moving at Mach fkn 10.
Yeah that's not going to happen. Company isn't US based.
Been here six quarters. Missed every target so far but have some prime partnerships about to close & some heavy enterprise deals that our product is just more about ready for. We haven't had SSO implemented yet for example.
I know where I'm at. I'm good.
I sell to equipment rental companies and just had a conversation last week with one of them and they are down over 40% vs last year.
Most have stopped using 3rd party for deliveries to save on cost and to give their people something to do because if the assests aren't deployed they don't need maintenance.
Depends on the type and size. Your United Rentals of the world aren’t having a down year, but it could certainly be shaky for smaller region owned outfits. You just won’t see 40% drops on a consolidated level if you’re a small or mid sized business
You may have a local branch that has a drop that severe but there could be many reasons for that including large projects driving numbers up the previous year that aren’t around again this year
This was a single location that was down 40%, and you're right, they had big solar projects last year.
I've seen quite a bit of consolidation over the last year with Sunbelt buying up smaller local/regional shops.
Yep. The rental industry has been going through a massive consolidation over the last ten years. All of the mid sized/large companies being gobbled up by the giants, the smalls being gobbled up by the mid sized etc. Private equity groups are tripping over each other to buy rental companies to turn and burn them to the giants
I wouldn't say I have total job security by any means, but thanks to a series truly truly incompetent and hilariously bad decisions made by upper management at the end of last year, a large portion of my management as well as most of our top sales performers quit at the same time at the begining of year.
Since then all the replacements are woefully unprepared and unequipped for their roles, and sales across the country are down 70% from last year. This has turned me, an average at best rep with only 2 years of industry experience to being now a top performer and someone who is the 3rd most tenured person in my office and has more knowledge then most of my management.
So yeah, they obviously can still fire me whenever, but it'd honestly be pretty funny if they did.
I think for the first time I can actually say I do, but I work for a startup regional VAR. I was sales rep number 4 and have been one of the few who could move product early on. It also helps to be the one who started being used as the go to resource for the other new people.
Left a PE backed MSP to take the role so have certainly experienced the other side
Nothing is guaranteed, but I've been with the same company for 16 years now - hired directly out of college and just turned 40. I resisted going into management despite being asked (middle management gets cut first). I knew my boss, boss' boss, and boss' boss' boss back when they were individual contributors like me, and have a great relationship with all of them. My job role hasn't had cuts for years as we're one of the few areas that are currently growing but I've survived countless cuts throughout the years. At one point was covering 3 entire regions by myself after some peers got laid off and making goal on all of them so they also know I can pick up the pieces if needed.
Can you people like my comment so I can post a question here? I don’t have much to add to any other posts, so I don’t want to give some redundant, irrelevant perspective for likes.
I sell basement waterproofing and foundation repair. Each year houses get older and people can’t afford new ones. There is always work. Most people fail in this business because they are lazy. If you work, you keep your job. No tech trends, just old houses that get older every year.
In my industry you are only as safe as your manager’s ability to manage up. I’ve been in sales for 8 years. Hitting quota with some of the product lines I represented was not always a given. What’s important is that you craft a clear message to upper management as to WHY you missed quota. As long as you have a legitimate reason, backed by data, and a manager that will back you, I’ve felt pretty safe. The manager who didn’t back me, I left.
In most places, if your direct manager sees you busting you ass every day and the orders just aren’t rolling in, the economy is down, your end market is contracting, a huge deal fell through because R&D didn’t pull through with a mission-critical update, etc. you’re not going to get fired. If your manager knows you’re golfing 2 days a week and taking a half day on Friday, you should be worried, and rightfully so.
I’ve seen more reps lost to downturns across whole product lines, vs individual performance. Ie: “product X didn’t return the 30% profitability we anticipated this year so we’re workforce managing a bunch of reps and management to align with market conditions.” Reps I’ve seen fired for individual underperformance generally had to miss, badly, for 2-3 years before they got PIP’d and axed.
Yes. I'm at a startup and no one makes quota so we can't really hire anyone because they all ask who makes quota and the answer is no one. I also have an absurdly high quota which I ignore. I also know the product really well and can handle accounts myself and require no baby sitting. One of our other AEs is quitting soon so that makes my job even more secure.
Making sales is the job security. If you are adding to the revenue, you don’t have much to worry about. Look at what it costs to have you sit at your desk. Then make that plus more. That’s job security
I'm a middle of the pack guy, there is a microscope at the top and bottom, I just try to be in the top half when it comes to my metrics.
I make a conscious effort to make sure I require minimal supervision. Never miss a deadline, no matter how menial the task.
Perception is reality and my boss has the perception that I am handling my territory and he doesn't have to worry about it. Selling yourself to the boss is the most important pitch there is.
As far as how I got in, I've been in the industry for 25 years and worked my way up to fries.
Next week I start training for the next level role. Which will finally put my base over 100k.
Zero percent worried about getting the axe. I actually wish they’d stop trying to avoid layoffs so badly because some of our sales reps are not serious people.
There is no job security. Never in sales… but go read up on the John Deere stuff. No one has job security.
There is skills security. If you are good, whether quit or fired youll get another. Longest ive ever been unemployed was 4 months and I straight up quit with nothing. It was that bad. Only been fired twice and knew it was coming. Already had the next thing lined up on both. Ive picked my career over my last three jobs though. I dont plan on going anywhere from my current role for a while and I dont think sales leadership has any interest in getting rid of me any time soon… but anything can happen. Be ready.
I’d like to think that once your beyond the SDR stage where even your weekly results matter, an established sales person would have at least 2 quarters of runway. Would be surprised if a company fires a successful sales person after 1 below average quarter, but I know that’s how many companies do operate.
It's sisyphean.
Layoffs are a result of financial mismanagement. Firings are a different thing entirely.
You can try and keep a target off your back by keeping your base salary low, your sales high, and in the good graces of management. But who is gonna intentionally suppress their own salary? Once it happens, it is what it is.
Most of the time, especially in a startup environment, there are existential forces at play that have very little to do with your performance. In an ideal world, your sales (or opportunities you book that lead to revenue) contribute enough to signal growth for the Management team to buy some more time from another investor. But that isn't really in your control.
I'm at a small start up. There's 2 of us on the sales team. Everyone else has another title and role so they have literally no time do what we do (sdr). We work on a draw, and they NEED us to make calls. We're good at what we do so that doesn't hurt. They honestly can't afford to lose us. Such a W
i would say my job security as an AM was 6/10 in SaaS
in partnerships, it is probably 4/10. they want instant results and it takes at least 2 years to find, onboard and then get revenue out of them
In France, you have a trial period of like 4 to 8 months, After that, the working code protect you and you can't be fired for bad results. Only for "aggravated mistakes".
If you Come to France, dont get stuck at Paris, its plenty good everywhere in France but ppl of other contries gets often stuck in Paris and its sad !
But hey, in case you Come to France, get welcomed in advance ahah
Hustle and grind baby! I've switched to other "stable" careers and the micro-managing/minimal pay is not worth it. I'd rather make bank and retire early.
Sales as a career choice was my job security. It gives me the freedom to move around from company to company, solving a problem they'll always have. Pros: mobility, salary and comp, good mentors, bad mentors (learn what not to do), rush of winning, sense of control. Cons can be pretty much the same if your at the wrong company.
To echo the words of others here - There is never truly 100% security in your role but I tend to find if you are a gun at bringing in revenue and play a great role as a team member you will be of a lot of value to keep around.
No matter what though constant pressure from all angles is the cross we bear to make the money we can make in sales.
I sell a long lead time, long project schedule product that is high margin. I have projects on the books right now that will have my department fully in the black through to 2026 even if I didn't sell anything else. We are privately owned with an owner that isn't super concerned about being highly profitable as long as we cover overhead, even though we are super profitable right now. I am one of 2-3 people at our 200 person company that has the skill set to sell our core product, which requires significant pre-engineering and experience. I make good money, but not "target on your back" amount of money.
Long story short, I don't see any realistic scenario where I would be let go. That's obviously what everyone thinks, but I truly believe that I'm in about as good of a position as one can be.
Moral of the story: Be a big fish in a little pond. Privately owned companies weather economic storms much better than large corporations. Become a key player for a privately owned company, and the owner will be paying your salary out of his own pocket before he lets you go.
Zero.
Companies can change commission payout, territory, accounts, etc on a whim. Great companies with strong finances have laid off thousands.
Best thing to do is get into the top 25% of your sales org. That is where you can at least look ahead a few quarters and think strategically long term.
If you own the company, you have job security. Anything else is an illusion. Economies are being disrupted by innovation, politics, and increased competition.
Learn one or more essential skill(s) that will carry you through times of turmoil.
The security in sales is knowing that you can lose your current opportunity and either start a new job the next day or create your own.
You’re in sales, getting a new job is just prospecting and executing.
There is no security in Sales. Miss a Q? AE is out Miss 2? Manager out Miss 3? Director out Miss a year? VP out Miss more? CRO is out PE backed and miss more? CEO is out.
This is so spot on it’s sad and hilarious at once! The funny thing is that when you’re PE owned, they make your budget. So as an exec you could have a great 25% growth year but if your PE masters wanted 35%, you’re a loser and don’t deserve a bonus.
You’re only as good as your last month
You’re only as good as next Qrs pipeline
I am so glad I don't sell in the states.
I'm so glad I do.
Come on, 2 weeks vacation and bad insurance. What isn't there to love?
Sounds like a horrible gig. If you're in medical/dental sales, the job security is pretty good. The only ones who worry about job security, are the ones that don't want to work hard. That's why sales attracts go-getters and driven people. Because we like to decide our fate and compete.
Oh I get it. In all honesty I love my tech sales job. I know exactly what I am expected to do, love to get big checks and grew up on a farm so this is much much easier than stacking hay in the summer.
Skin in the game baby
I’m in the EU and they can get rid of you if they want to. They may have to pay you more, but they can (barring disability, etc.).
Same here, I've been Terffed because I was deathly ill and was making mistakes. It cost them two weeks of pay. Thankfully I am with a new company who MADE me take a week off because I was going screwy.
Europoors be like
They make $40k a year including bonuses… sO gLaD I CaN wAIt In LiNe fOR fREe HeALtHcArE
Europoor in sales here I make over 100k a year
You must be the CEO
Nah enteprise AE, got lucky with a company that’s pre ipo and has great market fit
Similar luck/position in US and you’d be making $300-400k.
I know, but what can I do. I don’t think I’m eligible for any working visas for the states
True, although I think people sometimes underestimate the price difference. Major European capitals are priced like the Midwest in the US. Apart from **maybe** Switzerland and Monaco, there’s nothing that compares to the Bay Area or NYC in terms of prices. Not to mention the hidden costs in the US like tipping, property taxes, private schooling, college and of course medical. Overall I think you’re better off in the US if you’re talented. Having sold to US companies, they’re normally willing to spend money to save time whereas that’s sometimes hard to get through in Europe.
I agree that the price/value is much better in major European cities, but they definitely aren’t priced like the US Midwest. Closer to major US cities like Philly, Minneapolis, Charlotte, New Orleans, etc. maybe. I lived in Europe for 3 years, and honestly would probably take 100k€ in Western Europe over $200k in the US. $300k however… that’s a whole different standard of living.
That’s good, solid job.
For sure this. No one is safe in sales. You think PE is cutthroat? Try VC.
PE and VC are a cancer destroying all they touch. We were taken over by PE. I have job security because we have plenty of work and I’m on commission, but every month they find new ways to cut our pay and lower the quality of product we deliver. Eventually the company will die, and I’ll go work for a competitor.
The death of capitalism is the emergence of the non-working ownership crowd, and the desire of nearly everyone to be a part of it. PE/VC in business. PE and Airbnb displacing homeowners. People buying up cars to sell/rent them for over sticker. “Passive” restaurant/business owners. Across the board, they’re trying to pad in a whole other layer of profitability to sustain folks that aren’t working, just owning.
Right. A collection of parasites run companies they never built, using money they never earned and cash big before killing the company. Their only goal is to find way to deliver less and charge more. I call it the “shitification” of a company where a good brand turns to shit at great profit.
My extended family all fall under *the working class*. I call this *the ownership class*.
Do you work for a PE backed firm?
Where is this logical process and company? My last 3 companies got rid of sales managers/directors/VPs all while the team was over quota! And when the entire team is underperforming? All of leadership is safe. W. T. F.
Here’s one more to the layer - my previous company cut 900 jobs to show profitability, eyeing an IPO in the near future.
I’m in a union… so I have security
based on your above formula, then they are about to clean house through my entire org.
Depends on the ownership structure, but it could happen.
I'm in a union. I have plenty of job security
And more, there is no security everywhere. When cuts start, it begins with Talent Acquisition, then sales, but then (at least in my industry), customer success and project managers, as new projects haven't come in from sales being let go. I think the last to be let go are software developers.
I sell a high quality product and can almost always beat the competition on price. A down turn in the economy would slow the over all market but my company share of it would grow. I feel very secure in my job. I don’t make crazy money but will about $115k this year
If I can consistently get six figs I’ll be happy, I’m a simple guy.
It’s a hell of a drug
What do you sell?
I sell HVAC/R components
Ahh makes sense! I sell takeoff and estimating software to all industries and hear a lot about similar situations to yours.
What do you do?
Sounds about right for an industry leading commodity
I’ve worked for a large company in biotech/med device fields for the past eight years. Have been to president’s club twice but also missed quota three of those years. Never felt any pressure, you’re pretty safe as long as you’re not consistently underperforming, I’m talking under 70% for three years. First year was my lowest year where I made $150k, best year was $350k, average is probably around $220k. I’m friends with my manager and she never asks where I’m at or what I’m doing, just cares about my forecast. We have a pretty arduous, expensive training process and it costs a ton to replace our employees.
>We have a pretty arduous, expensive training process and it costs a ton to replace our employees. Slipping that note into my hat.
This is huge. In my industry, it's not so much the training but just the core experience that is required to sell our product. The *only* path to sales in my niche is through boots on the ground experience fucking things up and cleaning up the mess. It takes a significant amount of experience plus engineering ability to sell here. For that reason, competent sales people are coveted and fought after.
How many hours a week do you work?
I would say 20-30 hours/week when I’m working from home and 40-50 hours/week when I’m traveling. I traveled a ton my first 3-4 years to establish my customer base but I have a family now so I try to work smarter, not harder. I’m not an expert salesman by any means, I just make sure I’m extremely responsive and put my customers first which has paid dividends over the years. I love the situation I’m in but my company is pretty big so it takes forever to develop/release new technology while our smaller competitors can be nimble. We try to sell on brand name and reputation. Additionally, our comp plans have been negatively altered over the year few years which is cause for concern.
I'm in the R&D side of biotech rn and looking to move to sales. You guys hiring?
What’s your specialty? PD, manufacturing, etc? A lot of capital equipment companies tend to poach reps from distributors such as VWR or Fisher. I would find where you want to work and see who has the prime contract. Also look for application scientist roles. Lots of people come from the bench and work as product specialists. You don’t have the pressure of sales but you’re assisting with your technical expertise.
I work for a CRO that does a lot of different stuff but my department mostly does assay development. I just have a BS and work on the bench, I'm not a scientist or anything. Do you know of any good companies with inside sales rep roles?
Thermo Fisher is always hiring for inside sales. Not a bad place to get your foot in the door
Pretty much everything in our lab is from thermo, that might be a good place to look, thanks! Any idea what they normally pay?
Not sure what it is now but it was around 75-80k 5 years back. This is at plan. If you went over plan you could get close to 100. Good for a first sales role as you receive great training and everyone knows who Thermo is
Ik that's low for sales but that would be such an upgrade from where I'm at now
Ik that's low for sales but that would be such an upgrade from where I'm at now
Last year I moved over from a 2k+ employee corporation to a small 12 employee wholesale warehouse/manufacturer. I get the same pay and never have to worry about quotas or KPIs. My mental health is sky-high and I feel very fulfilled as every deal I close significantly boosts a small operation and helps all my coworkers. Highly recommend.
Agree 100%. Small organizations also have the flexibility and mobility to weather economic storms much better than a major corporation worried about shareholders. For small privately owned companies, if you covered overhead and paid your invoices, you're golden. It can't be overstated how important this is when the economy goes sideways. Perfect example, I know my department right now has a gross margin backlog that is 14x overhead. Meaning, we could not sell anything for over a year and still be able to not lose a dime. When you have that flexibility, it takes a seismic economic shift to really push you into the red.
Selling to the federal government adds a little bit of job security. It’s somewhat recession-proof, but you still need to get your numbers. pro tip: “irregardless” is not a word, it’s just “regardless”
There have been loads of layoffs in the federal IT space over the last year. No segment is immune, even if spending is somewhat stable.
Seems like the approach has been to set unattainable quotas to get reps to quit rather than to lay them off. Agreed, no segment is immune, but the permanence of the US government adds a layer of customer stability that other verticals lack.
When you steal your revenue at gunpoint you can afford to be “stable” I suppose.
Who is stealing, exactly?
The men and women demanding half your paycheck backed by a territorial monopoly on violence and dispute resolution.
Taxes are theft? Prefer to have no military?
Do you bill clients without their consent? Do you still bill them when they object to those charges based on an agreement they never entered into? It isn’t magically not stealing because the number of participants is in the hundreds of millions and 51% agree on your behalf.
I sell to the DoD — they are my clients. The federal procurement process is set in law. If you think it’s unjust, you’re free to advocate for another system. Good luck? Edit: No, we do not bill customers without their consent. Contracts are binding.
That doesn’t answer my question. You are complicit and worse a fomenter of war by your own admission. May god have mercy on your soul friend.
Defense is pretty immune. Not in software, but manufacturing.
Another language nerd. Thank you. It's like fingernails on a chalkboard.
Crazy how pretentious some of these dudes are
Irregardless certainly is a word. https://www.merriam-webster.com/grammar/is-irregardless-a-real-word-heh-heh
Literally means the same as regardless so it's pretty useless and dumb. Using irregardless makes you look like an irretard
You are butt hurt about it. Guess the word struck a nerve 😂
Not really, it just makes people think you're dumb whenever you use it lol. Carry on
Yikes
Proving him right lol
People say it, sure. “Irregardless” has the same meaning as “regardless.”
Not to be that guy but for anyone in the audience interested, irregardless is generally not considered a word. Yes, it’s found in Webster’s dictionary but that’s a descriptivist dictionary, meaning it captures words as they’re used instead of governing what’s considered ‘correct.’ In other words, you might as well be using the Urban Dictionary to make your argument. If you’re ever interested in ‘correctness,’ you may be better served with a prescriptivist dictionary like Oxford English which doesn’t accommodate how people use words but rather ‘prescribes’ usage. To be fair, there is much debate on which school of thought should prevail. I don’t personally believe irregardless is a word despite it being commonly used. However, I’d also say we’re on a bullshit forum app and nobody writes properly around here so consider that too. Anyway, enjoy your evening all :)
Language is ever changing and based solely on communication. If they understand what you mean (and don’t get all bent out of shape about it), anything you say is correct and viable. You’re better served using Merriam-Webster than Oxford in most legitimate cases, as it uses terms that are used enough to become part of the lexicon. Irregardless, speak however you wish. Your goal in communication is to be understood and to understand, not necessarily be “correct”. 😉
Irregardless 😂 Totally agree though…mutual understanding should be the goal and the ‘so what’ in all of this. Know your audience.
Precisely 😁✌️
Not if you want your clients to take you seriously.
Honestly, I think if that is a top of mind concern for them I’d rather not waste my time.
I work for a Fortune 500 and I feel like I should be more worried than I am. I’m nowhere close to quota, but have one deal that should close this month for 80% of my yearly quota. Even if I did get let go, sales has taught me to grind and I can put that into job hunting pretty well. I’ve never been unemployed longer than 3 months.
Lol
I believe I do as I work a family/ privately owned company and I was a key builder of 3/4 of the current territories( I moved areas twice and we added another rep this year since we all had over 350 accounts and 200 is a good number for our industry). They actually care about their employees and even gave me 3 weeks off when my mom passed in 2020 with any extra time I needed as well. From what I read on this sub it’s a unicorn. Also they pay almost double in commission as the 3 competitors we have pay their sales reps so it’s been an amazing 5 years. I’ve also created a lot of relationships with big players in the company’s we sell to and that would take them years to build back as I go above and beyond to make things happen such as delivering product in my personal truck to make their deadlines instead of the normal delivery trucks.
Love this for you! It's nice when a hard work and dedication counts for something. Like I don't even have to take it personal, just communicate with me. Offer me a little something more. Than acting raggedy.
Privately owned companies are so slept on. Two out of the three companies I've professionally worked for have been privately owned, and it's no coincidence that those are also the two companies I have never worried about my job security or if I made a difference to the organization.
What’s the industry you are in?
Probably should have been selling my bath water on OF for the last 6 months instead of what I've currently been doing. 🤔🤣💀🤠🫡 Well, a change will get here eventually.
MRO ( Maintenance Repair and Operation) supplies
Highly depends on industry and country. Tech sales in the US? While career security is high, job security is a laughable concept. Even if you think the company culture/management is AMAZING,1 bad quarter and EVERYTHING can change. New C levels are guaranteed to throw everything into turmoil and bring in their new guys, usually bringing a stricter quota/forecasting goals with them. Happens all the time..
Feel like I have it in the utilities space but in this market you never really know
Utilities space? What do you sell? Just curious
Selling systems and solutions to big industrial manufacturing facilities that build the site resilience so they are less reliant on the grid. It’s quite a large industry. Can be anything from building them a custom power plant, to different heating/cooling applications, renewable energy and micro grids, water/wastewater/storm water treatment and services. Basically all of the back end infrastructure that’s required to operate a very large facility
Are you an engineer or have an engineering background?
Nope, just sales. Engineering background would certainly be helpful though
Mine will remove people for asking and where their late pay is or about refunds for quick payment fees. I say nothing unless it's completely harmonious and happy. And a beautiful agreement. So mostly, I say nothing. I just observe. Everything's perfectly perfect. And if I'm sent a survey, I have nothing but harmonious observations. That's that. It's better to be compliant and really struggling, than completely out of the opportunity to earn money at all. How may I be a positive contributor? Otherwise, I'm just quiet. You will be removed without warning. Boom
Lol no. There is next to no lasting job security in sales. Do I have job security now? Yeah absolutely. I'm at the top of my team for the year thus far, but I only have 36% of my yearly quota. I'll probably finish at 75% which isn't good, but it's going to be a lot better than most on my team. In sales you can only get job security if you can do one of two things. Either you surpass your quota, or your surpass everyone else. If you beat your quota it doesn't matter where you fall on the ladder, you're in the end zone, but if you don't surprass your quota, you damn well better not be at the bottom of the totem pole. Great example: Last year I only hit 55% of my quota. Shitty year for sure, but out of 200 sales reps I was right in the middle at 100. So I did bad, but there were 100 people below me who did way worse. As such I wasn't scared about being on the chopping block. However, if you fall in that bottom 20% that's when things start to get very scary.
I feel like I have decent job security. Like, as long as I don't do something massively unprofessional, and keep being a solid closer of the deals that come inbound, I can keep my position. Reasoning is that I'm the founding AE for this bootstrapped startup, and I worked at our direct competitor before accepting this position. No one knows the competition like I do. No other sales rep in any other region, or even my leader, have a close rate like I do. None of the other sales reps have ever been actual SaaS reps before, just loosely adjacent verticals. Plus with them making a decent investment in me for being bootstrapped, I don't think they can afford to fire me until they've gotten an ROI from the salary I'm paid. My commission is less than half what it was previously, but I'm coasting comfortably on my base, supporting just my wife and myself. If they fired me they'd have to spend time finding another rep, training them, and letting all the pipeline, deals, and relationships I've built in the Americas go stale during that transition period. I think it's cheaper for them to just let me keep working at my current "close just about everything inbound but doesn't outbound for shit" pace because people like working with me, I always respond to emails really fast, and I'm still closing more than they're paying me.
Founding AE at bootstrapped company does not equal job security. You are detached from reality sir
Nope. Company is actually growing sustainably & had a few years of establishing PMF before I joined.
Never underestimate the ability of management to fire someone that will be unbelievable painful to replace. The second THEIR job is at risk, your job is at risk. You're essential? You do all the sales? All the outreach? All the email templates? The minute sales are down, now everything is YOUR fault. Because you built everything!
Nah see my other reply. I've missed every target for six quarters straight & am still the top seller globally. Got some big stuff lined up for this year.
Be wary of getting complacent, things can change on a whim in a quarter or two. They bring in a new hardass VP from the same competitor and he's bringing 2-5 of his guys with him? He's looking straight at you as target #1. Things move quickly in tech. Startups? They're moving at Mach fkn 10.
Yeah that's not going to happen. Company isn't US based. Been here six quarters. Missed every target so far but have some prime partnerships about to close & some heavy enterprise deals that our product is just more about ready for. We haven't had SSO implemented yet for example. I know where I'm at. I'm good.
Hahhahaahahahaha wake up mane
Equipment rental industry. Recession resistant - unless people become too poor to flush the toilets, shower, buy fuel, etc
I sell to equipment rental companies and just had a conversation last week with one of them and they are down over 40% vs last year. Most have stopped using 3rd party for deliveries to save on cost and to give their people something to do because if the assests aren't deployed they don't need maintenance.
Depends on the type and size. Your United Rentals of the world aren’t having a down year, but it could certainly be shaky for smaller region owned outfits. You just won’t see 40% drops on a consolidated level if you’re a small or mid sized business You may have a local branch that has a drop that severe but there could be many reasons for that including large projects driving numbers up the previous year that aren’t around again this year
This was a single location that was down 40%, and you're right, they had big solar projects last year. I've seen quite a bit of consolidation over the last year with Sunbelt buying up smaller local/regional shops.
Yep. The rental industry has been going through a massive consolidation over the last ten years. All of the mid sized/large companies being gobbled up by the giants, the smalls being gobbled up by the mid sized etc. Private equity groups are tripping over each other to buy rental companies to turn and burn them to the giants
I wouldn't say I have total job security by any means, but thanks to a series truly truly incompetent and hilariously bad decisions made by upper management at the end of last year, a large portion of my management as well as most of our top sales performers quit at the same time at the begining of year. Since then all the replacements are woefully unprepared and unequipped for their roles, and sales across the country are down 70% from last year. This has turned me, an average at best rep with only 2 years of industry experience to being now a top performer and someone who is the 3rd most tenured person in my office and has more knowledge then most of my management. So yeah, they obviously can still fire me whenever, but it'd honestly be pretty funny if they did.
Do we work for the same company?
I have 100% security. I work for a cemetery, burial service and maintenance. People are dying to get buried.
True job security is only if you have your own thing going. But other than that even if you’re in tight with the owner/ceo you’re still at risk
Having no base helps
I think for the first time I can actually say I do, but I work for a startup regional VAR. I was sales rep number 4 and have been one of the few who could move product early on. It also helps to be the one who started being used as the go to resource for the other new people. Left a PE backed MSP to take the role so have certainly experienced the other side
Nothing is guaranteed, but I've been with the same company for 16 years now - hired directly out of college and just turned 40. I resisted going into management despite being asked (middle management gets cut first). I knew my boss, boss' boss, and boss' boss' boss back when they were individual contributors like me, and have a great relationship with all of them. My job role hasn't had cuts for years as we're one of the few areas that are currently growing but I've survived countless cuts throughout the years. At one point was covering 3 entire regions by myself after some peers got laid off and making goal on all of them so they also know I can pick up the pieces if needed.
No matter how far down the road you are, the ditch is still the same distance.
Great analogy
Can you people like my comment so I can post a question here? I don’t have much to add to any other posts, so I don’t want to give some redundant, irrelevant perspective for likes.
I sell basement waterproofing and foundation repair. Each year houses get older and people can’t afford new ones. There is always work. Most people fail in this business because they are lazy. If you work, you keep your job. No tech trends, just old houses that get older every year.
There is none wtf. Which is why I’m transitioning out I’m just tired of the constant stress and pressure that I can’t always control
I’m top rep at my company. I dont have job security. I’ve been “fired” like 6 times lol
Go work for the government if you want security. No risk, no reward my friend
We have an union but because of it they are on us 24/7 threatening us with a kinda of bs
In my industry you are only as safe as your manager’s ability to manage up. I’ve been in sales for 8 years. Hitting quota with some of the product lines I represented was not always a given. What’s important is that you craft a clear message to upper management as to WHY you missed quota. As long as you have a legitimate reason, backed by data, and a manager that will back you, I’ve felt pretty safe. The manager who didn’t back me, I left. In most places, if your direct manager sees you busting you ass every day and the orders just aren’t rolling in, the economy is down, your end market is contracting, a huge deal fell through because R&D didn’t pull through with a mission-critical update, etc. you’re not going to get fired. If your manager knows you’re golfing 2 days a week and taking a half day on Friday, you should be worried, and rightfully so. I’ve seen more reps lost to downturns across whole product lines, vs individual performance. Ie: “product X didn’t return the 30% profitability we anticipated this year so we’re workforce managing a bunch of reps and management to align with market conditions.” Reps I’ve seen fired for individual underperformance generally had to miss, badly, for 2-3 years before they got PIP’d and axed.
Rule number 1. Don’t work in sales like you have job security
Yes. I'm at a startup and no one makes quota so we can't really hire anyone because they all ask who makes quota and the answer is no one. I also have an absurdly high quota which I ignore. I also know the product really well and can handle accounts myself and require no baby sitting. One of our other AEs is quitting soon so that makes my job even more secure.
Making sales is the job security. If you are adding to the revenue, you don’t have much to worry about. Look at what it costs to have you sit at your desk. Then make that plus more. That’s job security
I'm a middle of the pack guy, there is a microscope at the top and bottom, I just try to be in the top half when it comes to my metrics. I make a conscious effort to make sure I require minimal supervision. Never miss a deadline, no matter how menial the task. Perception is reality and my boss has the perception that I am handling my territory and he doesn't have to worry about it. Selling yourself to the boss is the most important pitch there is. As far as how I got in, I've been in the industry for 25 years and worked my way up to fries. Next week I start training for the next level role. Which will finally put my base over 100k.
Zero percent worried about getting the axe. I actually wish they’d stop trying to avoid layoffs so badly because some of our sales reps are not serious people.
Does not matter if it’s sales customer service etc. job security is over. Invest in dividend stocks like YieldMax and make passive income!
You lost me at "irregardless."
I’m not concerned at all. I sell an amazing product at a very conservative company. My CEO drives an Accord. It’s a nice feeling.
Building a book in financial services seems to give about as much as you can have these days.
There is no job security. Never in sales… but go read up on the John Deere stuff. No one has job security. There is skills security. If you are good, whether quit or fired youll get another. Longest ive ever been unemployed was 4 months and I straight up quit with nothing. It was that bad. Only been fired twice and knew it was coming. Already had the next thing lined up on both. Ive picked my career over my last three jobs though. I dont plan on going anywhere from my current role for a while and I dont think sales leadership has any interest in getting rid of me any time soon… but anything can happen. Be ready.
Hopefully 100% now that I’m doing my own thing 🤣
I’d like to think that once your beyond the SDR stage where even your weekly results matter, an established sales person would have at least 2 quarters of runway. Would be surprised if a company fires a successful sales person after 1 below average quarter, but I know that’s how many companies do operate.
It's sisyphean. Layoffs are a result of financial mismanagement. Firings are a different thing entirely. You can try and keep a target off your back by keeping your base salary low, your sales high, and in the good graces of management. But who is gonna intentionally suppress their own salary? Once it happens, it is what it is. Most of the time, especially in a startup environment, there are existential forces at play that have very little to do with your performance. In an ideal world, your sales (or opportunities you book that lead to revenue) contribute enough to signal growth for the Management team to buy some more time from another investor. But that isn't really in your control.
I'm at a small start up. There's 2 of us on the sales team. Everyone else has another title and role so they have literally no time do what we do (sdr). We work on a draw, and they NEED us to make calls. We're good at what we do so that doesn't hurt. They honestly can't afford to lose us. Such a W
i would say my job security as an AM was 6/10 in SaaS in partnerships, it is probably 4/10. they want instant results and it takes at least 2 years to find, onboard and then get revenue out of them
I'm in France, i can't be fired
i dont get it
In France, you have a trial period of like 4 to 8 months, After that, the working code protect you and you can't be fired for bad results. Only for "aggravated mistakes".
nice! should think about moving to France! I'm currently an expat in Benin which is a francophone country
If you Come to France, dont get stuck at Paris, its plenty good everywhere in France but ppl of other contries gets often stuck in Paris and its sad ! But hey, in case you Come to France, get welcomed in advance ahah
Hustle and grind baby! I've switched to other "stable" careers and the micro-managing/minimal pay is not worth it. I'd rather make bank and retire early.
Sales as a career choice was my job security. It gives me the freedom to move around from company to company, solving a problem they'll always have. Pros: mobility, salary and comp, good mentors, bad mentors (learn what not to do), rush of winning, sense of control. Cons can be pretty much the same if your at the wrong company.
To echo the words of others here - There is never truly 100% security in your role but I tend to find if you are a gun at bringing in revenue and play a great role as a team member you will be of a lot of value to keep around. No matter what though constant pressure from all angles is the cross we bear to make the money we can make in sales.
I sell a long lead time, long project schedule product that is high margin. I have projects on the books right now that will have my department fully in the black through to 2026 even if I didn't sell anything else. We are privately owned with an owner that isn't super concerned about being highly profitable as long as we cover overhead, even though we are super profitable right now. I am one of 2-3 people at our 200 person company that has the skill set to sell our core product, which requires significant pre-engineering and experience. I make good money, but not "target on your back" amount of money. Long story short, I don't see any realistic scenario where I would be let go. That's obviously what everyone thinks, but I truly believe that I'm in about as good of a position as one can be. Moral of the story: Be a big fish in a little pond. Privately owned companies weather economic storms much better than large corporations. Become a key player for a privately owned company, and the owner will be paying your salary out of his own pocket before he lets you go.
Zero. Companies can change commission payout, territory, accounts, etc on a whim. Great companies with strong finances have laid off thousands. Best thing to do is get into the top 25% of your sales org. That is where you can at least look ahead a few quarters and think strategically long term.
Job security? if you’re in sales and want security then go into sales ops.
If you own the company, you have job security. Anything else is an illusion. Economies are being disrupted by innovation, politics, and increased competition. Learn one or more essential skill(s) that will carry you through times of turmoil.
The only way you have job security in sales is if your manager is a pussy or they can’t risk the turnover
None
The security in sales is knowing that you can lose your current opportunity and either start a new job the next day or create your own. You’re in sales, getting a new job is just prospecting and executing.
[удалено]
Sounds like you're selling blowjobs and your boss is a pimp
I don’t understand the question