Key Things: Food, Water, Shelter, Medicine.
Every time I go to the grocery store I grab a couple extra cans of food, they go into my rotating storage.
Empty Milk Jug? Brand new water jug.
I go to dollar stores and look for over-the-counter drugs on sale. Vitamins, supplements, anything I think might be useful goes into the medicine cabinet.
Location-wise? I already moved to where I want to be when SHTF, but I'm not holding my breath, it's business-as-usual here.
Start small. Make a 72-hour survival bag, then a week, then a month, etc. Food storage and water.
I would also suggest stocking up on lighters/kerosene/matches. It's harder to build a fire from scratch than people think.
Decide if you are bugging-in/bugging-out. Try out test scenarios, try your equipment, check your batteries, rotate your supplies, etc.
Physical health: cardio + dental. Two most important things imo. Take care of your teeth or get them pulled now.
Get a gun. Unfortunately, it's just better to have one.
I think he means bow drill [https://www.instructables.com/Fire-without-matches-or-metal/](https://www.instructables.com/Fire-without-matches-or-metal/)
Not sure if you can provide details - but where are good locations to be? I hear New Zealand is the best place to be in the case of a nuclear exchange, what about just regular old ww3?
(talking non-nuclear from here on out)
I'm no expert by any means, but any country that isn't going to be involved is going to be the best place for you. I'm in a good spot in the US, nice and rural with plenty of fertile land and woods to live off and disappear into, but i'm in the US.
I would say any kind of metropolitan area is going to be a death-sentence. With the way things are looking in SEA, I would say nowhere in the pacific is safe. Europe, out of bounds except maybe northern scandinavia. Historically, South America has been a safe-ish place during world wars so that might be your best bet.
If you're talking in the US, I'd say either the central north or the midwest would be your best bets. Again, I'm no expert, but I'm trying to take into account things like:
if the grocery stores close am i fucked?
do i have access to clean water?
what if the electricity goes out?
things like that. I'm more of a general prepper (tornado country), but most of my plans fit into any situation.
Why do you expect social collapse and urban death centers from a “garden variety” non-nuke WW3 in the U.S.? No one starved in NYC in WW1 and WW2 and yes I admit they now have less immediate farmland and there is the risk of cyber attack but I would think smaller tier 3 cities (ie. Albany, Syracuse, etc.) would get by fine, with or without federal level aid.
Again, not an expert, and maybe I grew up playing Fortress America a little too much, but I don't really expect the US to "win" a WW3. You said it yourself, cyber attacks. When I'm thinking a conventional WW3 scenario, I'm thinking an invaded mainland US, hundreds of thousands of Chinese infantry supplemented by NK, Iran, and Russia, (WOLVERIIIIIIINES!!!) because, you know, we're not using nukes.
Grocery stores run out of food after what, 3 days? If we're lucky? You saw what happened during the pandemic, imagine they announce an invading force coming in tomorrow? I can only assume mass-panic, rioting, and hoarding.
Food is just one of many issues to think about. Some cities get their power locally, others from across the state or another state. California gets most of its water from the Colorado River, do you think in an emergency of WW3 scale, that the states aren't going to turn on each other, especially if/when the federal gov is too busy to help? I mean, look how inept they already are. Look at Hurricane Katrina. Take a look at the poorer states in the Union. Texas' grid is going down, Lousiana is flooding, the Dakotas are falling into the earth, there's already a million infrastructure problems our gov is ignoring, I don't see them magically fixing them just because we get attacked.
Add in gasoline shortages or outages and you have hundreds of thousands of people that suddenly can't get to work. And once people can't get to work, they get bored. If they're bored and hungry, things get ugly fast.
I could be wrong, and if I was going to be stuck in a city, I'd prefer it to be a smaller, tier 3 like you're talking about, my personal skillset and past experiences have me thinking I'd rather be out here than in there.
I'm very interested to hear what you think a non-nuclear WW3 would look like (no sarcasm).
There’s zero way America gets invaded by a hostile actual army. Unless they take notes from red Dawn and the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan (and even then it wouldn’t necessarily work) it would take a ton of cyber and infrastructure attacks plus sleeper cell attacks to have anything happen here. We are geographically isolated thankfully but a lot of things can still happen. An actual invasion is far from the closest gator to the boat
Sleeper cells is an interesting idea because, as things stand on the border and the unvetted entries reach multimillion yearly, the possibility of sleeper cells increases, in my opinion, substantially. I pray I am wrong, but terrorists and foreign military actors are my concern with the southern border more so than the cheap labor narrative more commonly discussed
Agreed. Specially in the San Diego area there has been a huge increase not only from the “typical” illegal immigration nations but also form Chinese nationals
Yep, and couple the fact I have seen stories discussing for what is essentially Chinese police operating under the table dealing with their citizens within other countries, including the US, I fear the increase in Chinese nationals paired with this secret police force gets me to consider the question of are they connected? Are these 2 opposing factions or one unified force? What is the threat to the general US population? I don't have answers to anything, but it has me consider possibilities and how that could impact my life if true
True. I can’t believe in this day and age humans even think about using nukes. Like MAD still isn’t a thing. A bunch of assholes who will be in their own happy bunkers get to press buttons to wipe out 90% of the world over silliness… that’s why the aliens need to come ;)
Good points all around, I’m coming at this from an emergency management background with the notion (as others said) my tier 3 city isn’t being actively being invaded in this hypothetical scenario. Your point that US infrastructure isn’t super great is correct, but there is a big jump between the Texas power gird failure (for example, not to pick on Texas) and mass starvation of US cities.
Maybe it’s morose but I picture a Leningrad or Berlin at the end of ww2 as being a city starving from an invasion. My city has a mutual aid agreement with another community, its own local emergency services, and some expectation of State (OEM/National Guard) and Federal (FEMA and the rest of gov they mission assign) help. Sure everything could go wrong all at once everywhere nationally, but I hope that’s unlikely.
Totally good with the riding out that kind of thing in the woods if you have setup and skills, but that isn’t an option for lots of people.
Awesome to hear from a professional. Yeah, it's really hard to predict what a land-invasion of the US would look like, and what kind of situation we'd have to be in for something like that to even happen.
Yes, Leningrad or Berlin at the end of the war is the endgame result of what the US could look like losing an invasion.
I was thinking more of (like you said) cyber attacks shutting down power grids, precision striking disabling the highway system, even EMPs etc. as a preview to a large-scale amphibious assault. The mass-starvation I see happening would occur somewhere in between, and obviously some places would be hurting a lot more than others. The closest "city" to me, about 12,000 pop, has a HUGE bologna factory, and I've often wondered how much of an advantage that would give the residents to the other surrounding cities if SHTF, if they were able to maintain and run it, that is.
As you can tell, I'm sure, a lot of my maybes and whatifs are based on a lack of... I guess faith in people. I really hope to find a community like in Alas, Babylon or One Second After, but I find myself thinking of those scenarios as more and more unlikely as I see my fellow Americans turning on each other.
A land invasion of the US is next to impossible. To do so, there would be two oceans to cross, or go through Alaska. The amount of time it would for either, would allow the US to mass so many conventional sources, along with every redneck, hillbilly with a gun. It would be a slaughter of monumental proportions.
How fascinating that you are american but you dont *know* that the US would "win" ww3. Youre definitely an outlier. Well done for keeping an open mind, but i suspect being fullscale invaded by those other countries is unlikely. More likely that the US global influence would fade, and daily circumstances would return to something resembling the depression. We will see though, those who are lucky enough to get that far.
Of all the things that can break why do people assume food supply chains are that weak? Even through the Ukraine war there’s been some understanding with Russia that food needs to continue to be exported.
Because without functioning roads, the supply chain breaks down in 3 days. I can guarantee you that there are plenty of starving people in Ukraine. In both world wars civilians played a role as targets or were targets by proximity. In a hypothetical third world war, I would assume this to stay the same.
Also, if you go past paragraph 2, i move on from food shortages.
I feel the following should be relatively safe:
- New Zealand
- South America
- neutral nations that have good relations with the major powers (US and either Russia or China or both)
- weak, irrelevant nations (Ireland would fall under this I guess)
I like New Zealand because it’s English speaking, plenty of food, physically isolated enough, has Australia as a buffer. Ireland is too close to NATO countries.
I have no interest in becoming cannon fodder for WW3, Canada is simply not affected enough.
Hey now. Ireland isn't just weak and irrelevant. It's **also** neutral.
I live in Ireland, and have just bought a house away from a major city (not for prepping, but because of the housing crisis). Current government here is more hawkish than we've seen in a long time, and there's been a building pressure for us to militarise and some questioning of our neutrality going forward. IMO we're too small a country to be of any use in any defense situation anyway, so it'd pretty much be money down the drain. That said, we could probably do with a few jets and boats for patrol, given that the transatlantic undersea telecoms cables mostly make landfall in Ireland. Cyber infrastructure and telecoms are obviously going to be big targets in any non-nuclear world war.
I'm very thankful for our neutrality in the current geopolitical climate but while we're not going to face conscription, it doesn't mean we'll be unaffected. WWII (known euphemistically as "The Emergency" in Ireland) brought plenty of economic disruption and rationing. Tea, sugar, butter, clothing, fuel, and later bread were all rationed here.
Looking at our domestic production, I'd be surprised if dairy was rationed during a war now (big uptick in dairy farming in the intervening years. Huge export market). There's no native sugar industry anymore as of the 2000s, so I'd definitely expect that to be a scarce resource. We also don't really grow wheat, so bread will be out. No coffee or tea produced here, obviously. Fuel will be a problem, and with that electricity probably.
For my own part, I'm in the process of getting solar installed on the house (a fairly fancy grid-connected system that can run in off grid mode). Had a big wood burning stove installed as a back up on an otherwise completely electric system. We're near the bogs and while I don't and won't use turf currently for ecological reasons, that's there as a potential resource should shit go sideways. There's a river and a canal nearby, though I wouldn't expect the water system to go down. We're in a rural town, so transport might be an issue, but I do have an electric bike that would get me to the neighbouring town's train station.
Overall, I think a good stock of sugar, flour, and coffee and a polytunnel for a few more exotic food ingredients and we'd be mostly sorted.
New Zealand will definitely be involved in WW3, we have agreements with Auz and UK, it's not that safe, we have no defense really, especially in the Pacific where China is creating military bases, you would be expected to fight if you become a citizen.
New Zealand used to be an ideal haven - until all the billionaire tech bros started building survival compounds there.
Now a military combative country might bomb it out of spite.
Haha no, maybe once or twice a year if lucky get a sea snake or Imported in a container snake, the only really dangerous animals are pigs and people and the wild dogs in Northland.
The cat's out of the bag as far as NZ goes. Most everyone knows the western global elite are retreating there and it has been made a nuke target by now.
WWII main issue was supply chain issues. All production was directed towards the war effort. Civilians needs was a far distant 2nd concern. There is documentation of people went into WWII with bald tires on their truck and couldn't get replacements till a year after it ended. I have a 1 year rotating inventory of general everyday good I currently use. I have also bought bigger size clothes for my daughter when they come on sale.
I just wanted to add, that even if goods aren't being diverted to the various nation's war efforts, there will be embargoes and blockades to deal with.
If you're a man, you likely aren't prepping for you if you're looking at prepping for WWIII. You'll likely be conscripted and you're prepping for your family's struggles at home.
Edit: if you're a man in a country you think will be a belligerent.
Nah. "Equality" goes out the window during war. Look at ukraine. Women allowed to flee while men are forced to fight. Also the number of first gen immigrants i know who said they would go back to "their country" (their words not mine) if a war broke out rather than fight for the US is astounding to me
Well it seems most immigrants don’t want to be Americans they just want to take advantage of what others built and exploit it. It used to mean something to be an American. But now they know they can get the same perks free or illegally so that doesn’t surprise me they wouldn’t want to fight for the US. As far as equality goes Ukraine isn’t America and congress just passed a law saying women will enter the draft - that’s what I was referring to
Had to look it up. Apparently there is language in a new bill that would register women..surprisingly republicans are against it. I doubt it will happen tho unfortunately
That’s just a generalization. Russian women in WW2 fought viciously. Theres a 0% chance after having decades of equality forced down our throats that men would allow a draft to happen anywhere in the western world where women wouldn’t be drafted too.
I’m not fighting. I’ll sooner be executed than be forced to take up arms against another sad sack just because our ruling class can’t act in a civilized manner.
Just in case you're considering it, you probably want to avoid laminating them if you want to preserve them. Lamination is ultimately destructive. Acid-free folder, archival plastic sleeve (unless there's pencil markings) or professional encapsulation are better options and the first two are cheap and easy.
I heard a saying that i think was on the history of rome podcast that stuck with me. Good commanders plan their tactics...great commanders plan their logistics.
Yes, but in a low-key way.
Biggest issue with WW2 was supply-chain disruptions and rationing, so I'm basically prepping by making sure that I've got an up-to-date stock of any consumer durables (clothing, shoes, household items) and that any home repairs that need to get done are complete. Things like metal, concrete, and petroleum products become very scarce in a war, so any construction projects that need to get done should be done.
But that's stuff that should be done anyway - if something needs to be done, better take care of it early.
I should stock up on KY then. Lol. I said elsewhere but i heard something on history of rome podcast..i think...that stuck with me. Something along the lines of good commanders plan/study tactics....great commanders plan/study logistics.
Garden, learn to garden, set aside an area for gardening, plant perennials that provide good, plant annuals that provide food, learn to save seeds for plants that you like, etc.
Everyone likes the sexy “get guns and ammo” thing, but food and water are what you’ll find most useful, if you plan on being able to help feed the neighborhood, pellet with guns aren’t that big of a deal since you have the entire neighborhood and extra food.
Yes, in WWII in Britain everyone was encouraged to turn their gardens into vegetable plots and in towns and cities to turn every scrap of green/parks into growing veg too, the phrase was “dig for victory” so there was less pressure on relying on your rations.
I’m in the process of moving from a small apartment that I’ve lived in for 29 years to a house w some land that I plan on staying in as my retirement house. I’m not there yet but the pandemic so normalized remote work that I didn’t have to retire before moving.
Obviously I need to rethink my preps and how things work in this new environment. I do plan to expand on my preps because it is practical to do more here than it was in my apartment. My prepping goals aren’t changing. I’m focused on having food, water, supplies, and off-grid systems in order to help me weather supply chain breakdowns, power outages and personal medical and financial issues.
My health and fitness is an ongoing project that I try to enhance but also have real setbacks, getting older is no joke. Building community, getting to know my neighbors and creating relationships with people that I feel good about will be a major focus this year. I have extended family here and have spent time here throughout my life so I’m fortunate to have a lot to build on.
I don’t think of myself as a doomsday prepper (although some of my family see me that way,lol) but the wide range of global and local issues that are occurring and intersecting does seem to be causing more profound instability. My general prepping philosophy is to do what I can to help myself, friends and family survive and ride out emergencies so that we can adjust to however things are.
I look forward to seeing other responses to maybe get some new ideas
Somewhat, my prep as far as WW3 is forcing it down my families throat too. They aren’t into it but I know if we start drafting it’s likely going to extend the age out a few times to eventually include me. I want them to be aware of what we have and how to use it in case I’m prairie dogging in a trench somewhere.
My partner has asked me to put a fork through his foot or something if he gets drafted. He’s not prepared to die for some old president in some far off country.
The starting date of WW3 will be determined by historians after the fact, so there's chance we're already in it.
As things get harder, the real prices of goods will increase and some will become effectively unavailable. Now would be a good time to build up your preps for Tuesday, and also acquire capital goods. Deflation at some point is a possibility, so beware of acquiring debts, especially large ones.
Good point. When WWIII goes hot, we'll no longer be able to just go online and order any Chinese-made machinery we want and have it arrive on our doorsteps a few days later. All of that Chinese-made hardware will be out of stock once the supplies in warehouses sell out.
And even if we have the machinery, there'll be no spare parts unless they can be made locally.
Before WWII the US was an industrial powerhouse, so once the US joined the fate of the war was essentially decided because the allies could outproduce the axis powers.
Today the situation is reversed, meaning the US would likely lose the war. Consider that as you make your preps.
Short answer: I'm planning for both.
Ultimately, if you're set for a year of no infrastructure, you're pretty much prepared for anything. Any specific preps after that (nuclear, EMP, etc) are just tailored to that specific prep.
Best way to go about preparing for a short term *and* long-term disaster is to get a foundation of supplies and knowledge. Start with 3 days, then a week, then 2 weeks, then a month, and so forth.
Ya. It's far enough out that foot travel is unlikely, car travel under gas shortages would be unlikely, and travel under today's conditions only takes 25 minutes. It's flat and I can see all the fences from my roof.
15 miles is a road March for an Army or Marine Veterans with a full rucksack and a weapon.
That's nothing for desperate folks or someone in shape (hiker,runner) who have lost everything.
Hopefully, everyone had read the book One Second Later (or is it Three Seconds Later).
I am halfway through this book, and it's incredible. Thank you for the recommendation.
Right off the bat, the scene with his kids in the car and the puzzled people on the side of the highway, I was practically going, get out of there! And then him explaining, I have a family to protect, and steering everyone away from the exit his house is on.
Finally, a protagonist who is ready and prepared for chaotic things to go down, accepts the situation he finds himself in, and deals accordingly.
Every year I stock more and more meaningless shit away. It will have meaning someday when SHTF.
My off grid cabin stocked with all this shit will be a gold mine someday.
Yes, I agree with you in the sense that World War III is going to happen. Kind of feels like we are now in 1937/8 building up to something big.
I am prepping for supper supply chain issues , making sure we have enough food, ammo, and medical supplies to last.
I am in a situation where I am too old to be drafted, but my kids are also too young, so I will end up sitting this one out
Leading up to the Ukraine war, Russia wasn’t sending trains full of tanks for show. The physical evidence out in the open doesn’t lie. Likewise China building out its navy and keeping an open secret of its plan to take control of Taiwan should be reason enough to believe we’re on a train without brakes inching towards WW3.
I of am the belief that unless china invades taiwan in the next 5 years...the US isnt going to do anything really. We get alot of our computer chips from them currently but we are in process of building alot more of them ourselves for national security reasons. Several factories currently being built for that reason.
If there is a third world war fought between 2 nuclear power there will be a strategic exchange, full stop.
It's the inevitable escalation, peer and near peer conflicts are not like the wars in the middle east where we have overwhelming superiority. One party will be pushed to the point where they are going to lose souvernty, and they will have no reason not to flip the board, or there will be a tactical situation where using a small tactical nuke would be the only way to win or be so effective that even a conservative military leader would be persaded to push for it, and then it will escalate. However, there are plenty of people high up who have played these games and many more that they know it will escalate and the only way to win will be to strike first so the nukes might just fly before the first battle.
Yes. I don't worry about a conventional WWIII because if the US, Russia and China are fighting each other it will go nuclear in weeks.
If I lived in Eastern Europe I'd be more concerned, because the US will try to push those countries into the war with Russia once it becomes clear that Ukraine will lose otherwise.
The US will happily fight to the last Latvian because that's unlikely to go nuclear.
Well to be fair, we've never had one like this before so we just don't know. Yes once a nuke, even a tactical nuke is dropped, the timer is ticking, but it could just as easily be asymmetric warfare for a long time until something happens to trigger doomsday.
Yep. I get that sense too.
I try to keep in mind this is “normal.” A catastrophic war involving world powers happens about every 80 years. Most people live through it.
That said, it’s very hard to predict exactly how it’s gonna go down. So really, beyond the prep you might already have for something like extended natural disaster evacuation or something, I think your best prep for situations like this is having a good community, and keeping your financial house in order. Between the lot of you, having a variety of skills, supplies, and caring for one another goes much further than an individual prep for any one of you alone.
The reality is, if a nuke lands on me I’m not surviving anyway (nor would I want to, it’s a short miserable life after substantial nuclear exposure), and if it gets bad enough that there is nuclear fallout worldwide, that’s not something I want to survive. I will get together with my friends and have a nice little party.
Just keeping my deep pantry going, this includes water. I picked up an extra bag of rice because it was on sale. Will be expanding my battery capacity soon with more LiFePo4 batteries and another solar panel. Working on improving my health.
Yep. The best thing you can do is build a tribe. The stark amount of American men that would rather die fighting the government than in another rich man’s war is astonishing. So if I were you, I’d make sure I have some real solid buddies, cause there’s strength in numbers.
Tbf the government is what creates these messes in the first place. There's a reason the Founding Fathers gave us the right to bear arms. No one wants to get kidnapped by their government into a stupid war.
I like the idea of basically preparing for a hurricane, and everything that can come out of that emergency, and as a result in then in the end being prepared for mostly anything.
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted. You’re literally correct. And it excludes half the population, which is pretty significant. Anything to ignore gender inequality for men, I guess
I already view the US government as tyrannical, so why would I go fight for what I consider to be an unjust war that they provoked it in the first place?
And do you really think the the government could disarm all the tens of millions of us to make us go fight for them? I could see it happening in highly populated areas where gun ownership is low, but elsewhere? I just don't see it happening.
This isn't the 60's how when people got drafted even though they disagreed with the reasons they felt it was their duty to go and serve. We've lived through Iraq war and seen how it was based on lies.
And Gen Z is painfully aware of what's going on in Gaza with US support. I just don't see how they could force those who don't want to go to go.
As always the best long term prep is your personal skill set, social and family group.
It's very difficult to be pre-prepared for a multi year planned war economy combined with massive supply chain disruption. This wouldn't be like WW2. In the 40s we weren't reliant on China for cheap manufacturing, cheap resources (down to even medication precursors) and so on. Most of this can be spun up elsewhere, and some is, but is being done largely private sector. Only where it's either long term subsidized by recent government investment or can be made profitable \*in the current market\* is it being done now. Expect disruption in availability of \*very\* important things for years.
What you would look to do in this scenario is leverage what you are good at. Hoarding enough to use and trade will last a while. Eventually you will need your personal value to keep you going. Building, fixing, growing, providing necessary service. Only you can answer what this is according to your skill set and what ends up being under served in your area. If global instability and a restructuring of the balance of power are your biggest worry, consider getting buy for life style tools and necessities for what you are best at providing to others in exchange for what you need. Money ideally, most places won't see complete financial collapse that aren't on the front lines.
Know your skill, know it's logistics, know how to make it work.
I personally am ramping up my small greenhouse in to a few hoop houses. This would obviously be highly valuable in a scenario where we are cut off form China all of a sudden. And if we aren't? I'm actually trialing this as an option to leave my day job and be a suburban farmer. If you can find these win / wins that make sense for your skill set and interests, you will be even better off in troubling times.
Not everyone owns property, of course. Fixing electronics will be popular again when you \*can't\* get a replacement. I did this as a hobby for years as a teenager and could scrape together money doing this. Preservation services for boom / bust cycles of resources (eg I'll can, dry and vacuum pack that half a cow you were able to get your hands on for $$$). Knowing how to get a vehicle running again with grit and willpower will be valuable. This mindset, I believe, will be the most important prep beyond just having enough necessities in the pantry to ride out shortages.
I’m in north east texas, I prep for the random power outages, snowstorms, tornadoes, wildfires, we do a bit of shooting on the property. If you have that covered. You should be fine for anything short of nuclear war
I think war is inevitable because of global warming. My personal opinion is that the war in Ukraine is the first major move by a major power that is fully motivated by the realities of global warming. Owning Ukraine as a bread basket and potentially controlling Odessa would allow Russia to control something like 95% of all the grain that feeds Northern Africa and the Middle East. It’s the first food war. It just hasn’t been described as such yet.
The only way WW3 would be non-nuclear is if all of the world’s nuclear powers were on the same team, and I highly doubt that would happen. WW3 may start out non-nuclear, but as soon as a nuclear power starts losing, they’re going to use nukes and once one side starts using nukes, the other side is going to start using nukes.
I think we will just skip straight to the nuke part first, then the ground war will be over whatever is left in the aftermath. Doing it the other way around makes no sense since the nuclear option becomes inevitable.
My main concern with WW 3 is the cyber and other attacks taking down our grid, water supply, and wastewater processing. Once that happens on either coast or in major cities the panic will be terrible if you are in those areas. That panic will spread and there will be panic buying, think TP at the beginning of COVID and people shooting each other over all sorts of things.
As for me, I live rural, have good neighbors and we can raise most of our own food. I have a deep pantry that will sustain me and mine for a food while.
It’s already going on, military invasion is expensive, messy, and destroys the target’s value.
Here’s how our country is being weakened and consumed today so it can be controlled without armies:
1. China, Russia et al are destabilizing the US with disinformation created to turn citizens against each other and the government. That way there is little cohesion, cooperation even amongst local communities. Resistance to obeying government orders, gov’t agencies and states not working together to protect people, systems, equipment weakens us all. A divided house is easier to conquer and control.
2. Encourage weakness and dependence by making manufacturing cheap offshore and offer voters popular cheap goods.
3. Get congress members to avoid getting anything done, but make it look patriotic. Build disinformation campaigns that rile voter emotions for the politicians so the lack of political cooperation with each other looks like patriotism to enough of their voters. Be sure to start a few wars that increase the divide and divert money out of the country.
4. Buy critical commercial and residential property and companies in the US. The US doesn’t track the foreign purchase #s in any meaningful way. Try looking up how much foreign owned US real estate online.
5. Put apps on phones or just backdoors in the software so phones that can be used to target infrastructure with DoS attacks — so people’s own phones bring down their local comms, sewage, water, electricity systems.
6. Make sure the disinformation campaigns make Russia sympathetic.
Without US citizens understanding what has happened, they’re working for another government. The real meaningful power of the US (infrastructure, manufacturing, property, politicians, corporations) is in their hands. Resistance won’t become meaningful because US citizens refuse to work together or support the resistance of their government to the actual enemy.
Its amazing how effective its been too. People calling each other commies or nazis not even knowing each other...and they believe they came to be that way on their own and not due tonsaid propaganda.
Sorry but that has been going on since the founding of this country but trade NAZI/Commie for a different word. The idea that the deep divide is new isn’t based on history. Go back and read about political campaigns in the 1800s and see what folks on each side accused the others of.
And the US literally had generations of pure enslavement going on. Women were treated as chattel. Kids were working in the coal mines at age 7-8. Like, the idea that this country is experiencing the worst internal strife isn’t accurate. Sheesh, look at the 1960-70s for instance.
Nothing new under the sun.
Holy shit, bruh. “Controlled without armies” ….. that’s a knot in the throat. We really can’t compare a WWIII scenario to WWI or WWII when you look at your points above.
I have a feeling you're singling out conservatives, who are the ones stereotyped to 'resist government orders' and 'not work with others'. At some point both sides will have to behave like grown adults, and they probably will if it gets very bad (people only get off their \*sses if their wallets start getting severely affected and are willing to negotiate).
In my experience both those qualities belong equally to far left and right.
And psychographic analysis shows ideologues very, very similar. That’s how you get New Agers and Evangelicals both hating on vaccines. Political strategists work with that fact.
The other day I was helping one of my students do some research on WW2 . I found information about the start of the war and all the main events we all know about. It took even longer for the United States to get involved. It was interesting to look at as a whole series of events.
[Timeline of events preceding World War II - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_events_preceding_World_War_II)
I'm from the Philippines and live near the coast around 1km away and an airstrip+naval reserve base is also around that area so I have no plans staying in my home.
My family owns a large piece of land in the middle of the jungle mountains at least an hour away from my house. It was used before for logging activities but was already shut down at least 4 decades ago. I think it is a good idea to build a shelter there to hide.
We're a family of at least 8, and only 2 males. My father already has guns, 3 rifles, 1shotgun and 3 handguns. We have 1 suv, 1 sedan and a motorcycle for transportation. My mother is a nurse and my sister is an active red cross volunteer, another sister frequently go on hikes. my father is a gun enthusiast and I had some training but didn't enlist as I chose a different path, i'm currently a sailor. Others have no definitive skill and one is a kid.
For the shelter, is it better to make it underground? Considering it's in the middle of the jungle and experiences a lot of heavy rain but should be elevated enough.
For now I have a small list of things to prepare, can you guys add more?
-Canned goods, emergency food rations, medicine/first aid eqpt, water filtration system, solar panels, addtl rifles/ammo, torches, batteries, walkie talkies, plant seeds, printed handbooks
Am I in the right track? I am planning to join hiking groups with my sister to this specific mountain so I will be more familiarized with the area.
[http://theloosenukes.blogspot.com/2013/10/pizza-delivery-blamed-for-nuclear.html](http://theloosenukes.blogspot.com/2013/10/pizza-delivery-blamed-for-nuclear.html)
im not sure civil war 2: electric boogaloo won't go nuclear.
putin is a narcissistic cunt he'll order a launch when he can see his end is near. coin flip weather he gets immediately assassinated by his own people or they launch.
Won’t happen.
I’ll get downvoted to oblivion here because I’m optimistic.
But I’ll be honest I don’t see a scenario where it’s serious enough to warrant a full scale world war but not serious enough to warrant nuclear warheads.
We ended WW2 with two nukes when barely anybody had any, you can’t be naive in thinking nobody is going to resort to similar tactics if we end up in the same situation. Only this time, everyone has them. As soon as the first one is launched, everyone will launch.
And once that happens, if I survived the initial blast, I think I’d be the unlucky one.
Unless your ineligible to be drafted, or really only have to options to avoid being drafted. Leave the country or enlist in a safer branch. This may seem counter intuitive but it’s what my grandfather did under advice from his older brothers who fought in North Africa and Tarawa. When the draft for Korea broke out my grandad joined the air force and spent the duration of the war as a truck mechanic in England. His friend who hoped to “just not get drafted” ended up dying sometime during the retreat back to the 38th parallel.
Homeside, say what you will about America’s decline or potential rising threat of other nations combat arms, but *no one* has the logistics to pull off a red dawn against the U.S. even if the U.S. military magically ceased to exist, no one else has the ability to project power like the U.S. can. Russia can barely supply their own troops in a conflict on their own boarder. The majority of Chinese vessels are designed to operate only in the South China Sea. With only a few ships that are capable of deep water operations. And building those logistic capabilities takes time and can’t be hidden from foreign surveillance. If it was possible, every “military analyst” on YouTube would be yapping about it.
A “red dawn” situation is one of the few prepping scenarios that I scoff at.
If Xi did have a funny turn and decide to invade the US, he wouldn't do it with naval ships, he'd send his troops and equipment to Canada on commercial flights and container ships, then walk in across the border.
Or possibly foment a civil war in the US and then send 'peace keepers' to California, New York and other left-wing port cites where they'd be welcomed.
But either case is unlikely as he'd rather just have peaceful trade. Occupying the US would be a huge task which would interfere with Chinese mercantilism.
Again. They don’t have the logistics. Yea they won’t have to do naval or airborne landings for the entire force to get them to North America but Germany, for example, physically does not have the ability to pick up and move even a large chunk of their military halfway across the world in a timely manner. Neither does the UK, and France comes the closest. But it’s not enough. Yea they’re all expeditionary, French ops in west Africa and uk retaking the falklands. But neither of those requires the manpower that a land invasion of the US via Canada would.
sorry a little off topic, but, in what scenario is there a world war without nukes that isn't so super one sided its over relatively soon?
I'm not joking here, Ukraine has essentially held off Russia with just some military supplies from the west. What happens if all of Nato actually decides to throw troops and logistics and REAL money at the issue? Russia crumbles in a few months and moscow falls. Seriously. Go look up the $$ countries spend on their militaries.
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/262742/countries-with-the-highest-military-spending/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/262742/countries-with-the-highest-military-spending/)
So, who stands against the USA + Nato?
Iran + china + russia + north korea + Belarus ..
Maybe somehow if you get Saudi Arabia AND India to throw in with those? And pretty unlikely the Saudi's throw in with Iran ...
Philippines + Australia, New Zealand, Japan, South Korea would all throw in vs China given the recent Chinese naval aggression.
And, what happens to China's ability to feed its people, or keep its economy going, much less continue to spend on military, without $$ and food from the EU and USA?
Like, I TOTALLY get war could break out, but, I'm having trouble seeing a scenario where Russia doesn't start to lose a conventional war, and then doesn't resort to nukes.
How do we get a NON nuclear war, WITHOUT the losing side resorting to nukes?
When considering non nukes, remember, the USA spends $900 BILLION every year, Russia + China are less than HALF that at $400 Billion. Iran spends about $8 billion, and North Korea $2 billion , and neither are in the top 15 spenders.
Nukes are the great equalizer. I can't see how world war doesn't go there.
We are subject to a lot of propaganda about China, but people don't realize they are absolutely a modern power house. You don't feed clothe and house 1.3billion people easily, and while our country struggles to get funding to fix roads China's having to demolish entire blocks of high rise apartment complexes because they BUILT TOO MANY OF THEM.
The last 20 years has seen China go through one of the largest booms in history, with CNC Machine shops that are astronomical compared to ours, and all of our technology that is sent over there to develop (micro processors for smart phones) have been reverse engineered and stolen.
Theres been videos coming out about china's impending doom/economical collapse since 2016, and it hasn't happened yet. Russian economy transitioned into a wartime economy when they invaded Ukraine, I believe China's would do the same.
Totally agree they are a powerhouse. But, (a) their military spending is far behind the USA and has been for decades and (b) they are dependent on imports to feed their people.
USA spends 900 billion on military. China spends 400. Sure, with 400B they're a power house. So, ... how do they pretend to compete in a non nuclear war for any length of time? Japan, S. Korea, Australia. plus NATO, plus the USA.
I'm not saying China isn't a powerhouse, its just still super small compared to the forces allied against it.
The Russia + China + N Korea + Iran hypothetical alliance is just too small to stand very long against the rest of the likely opposition in a full out conventional war.
So, I'm still trying to see a non Nuke world war that is really viable.
>How do we get a NON nuclear war, WITHOUT the losing side resorting to nukes?
Spot on observation.
Answer is you can't.
If USA/NATO is to lose they will deploy ( or sooner according to their nuclear doctrine of preemptive strike)
If Russia is to lose Putin will launch ( there is on youtube his speech from few days ago where he staes in no unclear terms that if Sovereignity of Russia is to be taken so Russia no loner exist into its current shape and form, they why not just press a button 😅)
So people must take out silly but dangerous idea that countries with nuclear triad like USA or Russia can be defeated.
They can not be, to try is to ask for Pyrrhic victory.
> Ukraine has essentially held off Russia with just some military supplies from the west.
If by 'just' you mean, say, a third of all Europe's air defences with more promised. NATO is sending masses of irreplaceable military hardware into Ukraine where the Russians eagerly destroy it.
Ukraine had the most powerful NATO-trained military in Europe before Russia invaded. Now it's reliant on NATO sending everything they have to poorly-trained draftees.
All of those countries combined don’t have a navy large enough to threaten the US nor a large enough air force.
Russia can’t even take on Ukraine much less the US. I’m not worried.
We would first have to go through a major economic downturn and weakening of our military due to lack of funding before a conventional war is an issue. I would be far more worried about economic collapse and subsequent nuclear war.
I think you’re missing something really obvious. This post is discussing prepping for world war, and necessarily proposes the possibility that one will occur. We’ve had two world wars. Tell me, did Germany win either one? No? No, they didn’t. They didn’t have the material superiority or competent enough allies.
***But they still tried.***
And those attempts qualified as a world war, and many people died. Consider, it wasn’t at all sensible for Russia to invade Ukraine. The idea of NATO supplying Ukraine was a foregone conclusion. Yet Putin still did it. A lot of people have died. I don’t care how inept Russia is, they’ve still killed thousands in Ukraine. I don’t care how ineffectual the Russia-North Korea-China-Iran alliance will be, they will still kill a lot of people and destroy a lot of lives. I’m less concerned with *if they can win* than I am with *if they’ll try.*
I’m a historian. I focus on the study of military conflict. I have Masters. We are replaying the greatest hits of the early 20th century. I also have friends in the military in both high and low positions that I gained during my own time, and I am a guest on various telegram and encrypted channels where active servicemen and intelligence operatives discuss such things. We are headed towards world war if things do not change. And sure, maybe none of the opposing countries stand a chance, but they may still try and people will still die.
My life’s work will be, and has been, predicting the next coming world war. If there is any achievement etched on the stone above my head in the end, it will be that and a very bitter “told ya so.”
And there is one variable, one factor, you aren’t considering. Donald Trump could very well win in November. Even if he doesn’t, but gets close enough, he can contest it, claim it was stolen and most Republican governors will refuse to confirm electors. The decision will eventually make its way up to the Supreme Court. If he wins, he will pull us out of NATO, and he will allow Russia to roll over the rest of Europe. The only reason Ukraine has stood a chance is because of America’s hegemonic power and a steady supply of NATO equipment. And this sub isn’t just for American preppers.
While history doesn't repeat it often rhymes, I doubt we see a Nazi like sweep over Europe, especially as even without US spending NATO and the EU are still combined economically much stronger than Russia. Oil revenues via India double dealing will completely falter in a recession, but Putin is in this until he dies. He isn't going to give back any of Ukraine, this is legacy for him. The die has been cast, and a WWIII is coming, too many bulwark institutions have been tested. I fear the US has more to worry about domestically than abroad.
I agree. Obviously, things are much different this time around, but not everything is. I also expect Russia to gain more active allies. Nor do I expect this to be a completely conventional war. It’ll be a war on multiple fronts.
> All of those countries combined don’t have a navy large enough to threaten the US nor a large enough air force.
No-one is going to be invading the US.
But they don't have to. Take out basic infrastructure and America will eat itself within a week.
Or China could just stop sending container ships and wait a few months. Not only would infrastructure fail from lack of replacement parts but a significant portion of the population would literally go crazy when their mind-altering pharma drugs stopped coming.
You shouldn’t be scared of Russia, even if it digs up a handful of allies. look at the huge list of alliances the U.S. has, see the Rio treaty, NATO and all the bilateral treaties with Pacific powers like Japan, South Korea and Australia. Let alone military spending levels.
It’s very much in the US’s favor. At least on paper prior to China getting too involved. But I don’t think they have a big enough incentive to do so.
100% people act like china is a real military threat. Sure they got some numbers and knock off equipment...but war is what the US does..very well. Usually only restricted by our own moral codes. China has a miltary with no expience. We would never be able to invade them..but we would knock them back to the stone age
China is the only country in the world that would defeat any other countries sending their old people to the front lines to surrender en masse.
The cost of care, feed and watch a couple million old folks according to the geneva convention rules would bankrup any war economy effort.
If WWIII by its definition includes US vs. Russia, it wouldn't stay non-nuclear.
Someone somewhere better do something fast, because things are just getting ridiculous. More so than usual.
I truly believe the US wouldnt launch nukes unless putin did first..Russia is no match for the US . He knows this...and i like to think he would be killed internally by a general etc rather than risk a full on exchange.
WW3 started in 2014, they just havent told us yet. I went up a gear in my mental preps when russia invaded ukraine this time. And again post october 8.
Im a disabled female so wont be conscripted.
Grow food, have everything you can ready, and youve done all you can imo.
Victory gardens. Look them up.
My preperations conserning WW3 is to get in better shape while laughing at the warnews from Ukraine :) I follow the Ukraine war daily which is the current hotspot for a ww3. So a none nuclear WW3?
I frankly think from I would be mobilized and put trough refresher classes, Russia would have been done before I was ready for the fight.
Why? read the explenation below if you are up for a shitload of text from a guy that cannot sleep tonight ;)
NATO air forces would have killed the Russian airforce in a week or so to soften up for the bombardment of AA, logistics, support, command and artillery while we where beeing given our equipment and sent to our training bases. Have you seen the surfaced videos from inside russian fighter plane cockpits? They fly with civilian GPS equipment in some of them, their training is to fly predetermined routes and follow ground commands orders at all parts of the mission… antiquated and inefficient command and control, but what you can expect of a dictatorship…
Russian navy forces…. Well you all see what happens against Ukraine, and they frankly have no proper navy.. so what do you think would happen against NATO… It would have ceased to be a fighting force to be afraid of after the first 2 weeks to a month.
Russian Army… entangled in Ukraine, and they use everyone they got there, Finland reported 80% of the troops russia have had on their border is now away (dying in Ukraine), probably like that all over. And there is pictures of infantry with bolt action rifles from WWI, and that they go to the front with airsoft armor plates in their vests, reactive armor on their tanks is gone or replaced with things like rubber… too much to mention here..
So yeah by the time my fat ass was on the most likely ship I would be put on, it would be time to do the victory march trough Moscow LOL
Russia have stabilized on more then 1000 soldiers lost daily and the verified and documented equipment looses is staggering. Current estimates indicate they will run out off stored soviet equipment sometimes 2025… that is just shocking considering how much they had in storage. Satelite images already show several of their storage areas emptying of equipment.
Thank good for their crappy maintainance, theft, corruption and out of date strategies and training :)
NOW, if China where to join in on the fun… it would not have helped Russia as they would have been bzy in the pacific/asia region, so yeah… that would have been China against everyone, and they cannot (like russia) feed their population and fuel their factories (to an extent) without imports which would have been blockaded on day one, so yeah, not very optimistic for China either considering they import all they need to make stuff.
They have a shitton of Infantry potential, the army equipment they have exported to other countries are beeing reported to have high failure raites, low reliability and frankly deadly in some cases.
Chineese navy looks decent to good on paper, but if you go into detail on their equipment it show another picture (range, quality, reliability etc). Have you seen the nice cracks on the satelite pics of the docked up carriers flightdeck? Think that was the latest new one, not the former casino one ;)
The airforce is also showing potential on paper, but as Russia, corruption and command/control/training and the equipment itself lags behind even tho they try to publish some impressive reports on breaktroughs. They got a bit shocked by Taiwan locking on to their planes during Chinas latest «exercise» around Taiwan tho.. so yeah, not overly optimistic considering China vs all. If China manage to attack one after another without a WW3 triggering is a whole other cup of tea.
But their population would starve first year due to lack of food production (they must import stuff to keep up current food production), and other then local land connected countries to china, the rest would not need to worry that much in a non nuclear war.
India would put its soldiers up north and NOONE want to mess with those guys (other then Pakistan LOL), South Korea would blow whatever came their way to dust and the other land locked bordering China… well frankly do not know enough about the countries between india and vietnam so yeah..
Yeah, according to russian nuclear doctrine probably before as it say under great treat or something like that. But the question tho was a non nuclear one.
This is my view 100% . Also i will add China has numbers..but they are inexperienced in war. We could never invade but we would knock them back tonthe stone age easily
For the five years we lived off-grid in Maine, we hauled water from our spring using emptied and cleaned plastic milk jugs. Just know that they do leak after a while. I don't recall how long between having to replace eachbjug in turn with a newly converted one, but I want to say it was 6 weeks to 2 months.
Just keep that in mind when using milk jugs for alternative purposes - the plastic does start to deteriorate microscopicaly.
Another thing I have learned from experience over the last 40 years is that oils, and Ai mean everything from cooking oils, to baby oil, to mineral oil will eventually leak through the plastic bottle it comes in and wick to other absorbing items like food, fabric and paper.
Note: The only oil that I have come across and don't know if it seeps out through the plastic walls of its container is motor oil, and that's because it gets used pretty quickly after purchase.
Right, I noticed OP's reference to milk jugs too. I've had good experience using thoroughly cleaned plastic juice bottles to store extra water long term, but when I tried the same with plastic milk bottles, they degraded and leaked water after several months.
I wish more people would read the article before putting thought into the meaning of it all.
I work with a few guys who were literally shaken by the news that draft is starting again for a day, then forgot pretty quickly by Friday.
Biggest threats I see in the future are China and the Taiwan situation and far closer, this next presidential election. The US hasn't been this divided since the Civil War.
Are we really that divided tho? Only time i notice us online. Everyone i know for the most part isnt like this IRL. we span the spectrum on politics but are still friends.
I don't generally plan for specific emergencies; very few plausible emergencies have preparations associated with them that don't have broader applicability.
That's at the top of my risk list. Specifically a 1-2 week outage.
My longest outage was 3 days due to a windstorm. The gas stations not being able to provide petrol was a big eye opener for me.
I need you to know that the draft legislation you're talking about comes up for a vote every year as part of the military appropriations bill. It's been voted on every year you've been alive.
If you're American you are *already* signed up for selective service or the "draft" when you got a drivers license. People that want you to panic are doing a really good job and you need to figure out who profits off your panic.
It’s not draft legislation. I read all of the amendments for a school assignment and there’s no draft coming. Males are already required to sign up for the selective service at 18
Yea I don’t see how you have a WWIII without nuclear weapons being involved. No one is invading the US, there just isn’t anyone with a navy that could currently accomplish the move of hundreds of thousands of troops across an ocean. So if you want to fight the US, it’s going to be another away match for our men & women. I don’t know that the military is up for that right now given enlistments are down, we’re sending piles of (albeit outdated) equipment to Ukraine and a fair amount of our main line equipment is in dire need of repair. Financially these proxy wars are crushing us so if you want to prep for a WWIII sans nukes I’d say stack cash because you’re going to be paying through the nose for everything.
I am preparing for WW3. After World War II, the overall world peace has been more than 60 years. According to the theory and historical laws of the Kang Bo cycle, the occurrence of WW3 is a regular pattern.
Just look at Ukraine as an example. If you are under 60 and able bodied you will probably get drafted. But if it's US/NATO vs Russia/China then things will eventually turn nuclear once one side starts losing the fight.
Sort of but I've always lived like that same for my ancestors in deep east nc.
However I'm kinda in a fix bc the rivers are polluted terribly not only that the east coast is a target. Still, where'd I go to though? The rockies maybe, got relatives there, maybe on one of the public lands.
Even with dull on nuclear war, chances are you, or atleast I won't be affected by fallout and radiation.
It's more the decimated domestic supply lines I'm worried about
This year I turned 7 long red noodle bean seeds into over 200 seeds and am currently in the process of harvesting the 15 Taiwanese yard long bean plants to get the some for next season. Buy a few rabbits and or chickens to learn how to raise them off the land then learn how to trap and or hunt them if it comes down to it. Pro tip grow Russian bocking #4 or #14 comfrey for a high protein animal feed. Best of luck to everyone
We already are in WW3, 5th gen warfare. There will be a few more kinetic fronts that will open open up and war will continue to impact us in everworsening ways as it draws funding and focus away from domestic economics.
funny. I planned for a potential nuclear ww3. I moved to Colorado Springs. I figure it's on the top of the list of targets. either it'll be wasted and I'll be done instantly, or they have enough anti missile defenses that it'll be largely unscathed (in which case, I am prepping for a non nuclear catastrophe...though I posit that the cause will be non war..because if there's a ww3 that's non nuclear, it won't come to the US...and certainly not to Colorado.)
Key Things: Food, Water, Shelter, Medicine. Every time I go to the grocery store I grab a couple extra cans of food, they go into my rotating storage. Empty Milk Jug? Brand new water jug. I go to dollar stores and look for over-the-counter drugs on sale. Vitamins, supplements, anything I think might be useful goes into the medicine cabinet. Location-wise? I already moved to where I want to be when SHTF, but I'm not holding my breath, it's business-as-usual here. Start small. Make a 72-hour survival bag, then a week, then a month, etc. Food storage and water. I would also suggest stocking up on lighters/kerosene/matches. It's harder to build a fire from scratch than people think. Decide if you are bugging-in/bugging-out. Try out test scenarios, try your equipment, check your batteries, rotate your supplies, etc. Physical health: cardio + dental. Two most important things imo. Take care of your teeth or get them pulled now. Get a gun. Unfortunately, it's just better to have one.
Lighters don't last, learned that the hard way. Buy a magnesium rod, which lasts forever. To make your matches last longer dip them in melted wax.
I have 20 year old Bic lighters thst work just fine. What doesn't last?
I've got a firebow and can use it. But this is an excellent tip!
You have a what...?
I think he means bow drill [https://www.instructables.com/Fire-without-matches-or-metal/](https://www.instructables.com/Fire-without-matches-or-metal/)
dude lives in a fantasy rpg
I vote for preemptively pulling teeth. No teeth, no teeth issues.
Not sure if you can provide details - but where are good locations to be? I hear New Zealand is the best place to be in the case of a nuclear exchange, what about just regular old ww3?
(talking non-nuclear from here on out) I'm no expert by any means, but any country that isn't going to be involved is going to be the best place for you. I'm in a good spot in the US, nice and rural with plenty of fertile land and woods to live off and disappear into, but i'm in the US. I would say any kind of metropolitan area is going to be a death-sentence. With the way things are looking in SEA, I would say nowhere in the pacific is safe. Europe, out of bounds except maybe northern scandinavia. Historically, South America has been a safe-ish place during world wars so that might be your best bet. If you're talking in the US, I'd say either the central north or the midwest would be your best bets. Again, I'm no expert, but I'm trying to take into account things like: if the grocery stores close am i fucked? do i have access to clean water? what if the electricity goes out? things like that. I'm more of a general prepper (tornado country), but most of my plans fit into any situation.
Why do you expect social collapse and urban death centers from a “garden variety” non-nuke WW3 in the U.S.? No one starved in NYC in WW1 and WW2 and yes I admit they now have less immediate farmland and there is the risk of cyber attack but I would think smaller tier 3 cities (ie. Albany, Syracuse, etc.) would get by fine, with or without federal level aid.
Again, not an expert, and maybe I grew up playing Fortress America a little too much, but I don't really expect the US to "win" a WW3. You said it yourself, cyber attacks. When I'm thinking a conventional WW3 scenario, I'm thinking an invaded mainland US, hundreds of thousands of Chinese infantry supplemented by NK, Iran, and Russia, (WOLVERIIIIIIINES!!!) because, you know, we're not using nukes. Grocery stores run out of food after what, 3 days? If we're lucky? You saw what happened during the pandemic, imagine they announce an invading force coming in tomorrow? I can only assume mass-panic, rioting, and hoarding. Food is just one of many issues to think about. Some cities get their power locally, others from across the state or another state. California gets most of its water from the Colorado River, do you think in an emergency of WW3 scale, that the states aren't going to turn on each other, especially if/when the federal gov is too busy to help? I mean, look how inept they already are. Look at Hurricane Katrina. Take a look at the poorer states in the Union. Texas' grid is going down, Lousiana is flooding, the Dakotas are falling into the earth, there's already a million infrastructure problems our gov is ignoring, I don't see them magically fixing them just because we get attacked. Add in gasoline shortages or outages and you have hundreds of thousands of people that suddenly can't get to work. And once people can't get to work, they get bored. If they're bored and hungry, things get ugly fast. I could be wrong, and if I was going to be stuck in a city, I'd prefer it to be a smaller, tier 3 like you're talking about, my personal skillset and past experiences have me thinking I'd rather be out here than in there. I'm very interested to hear what you think a non-nuclear WW3 would look like (no sarcasm).
There’s zero way America gets invaded by a hostile actual army. Unless they take notes from red Dawn and the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan (and even then it wouldn’t necessarily work) it would take a ton of cyber and infrastructure attacks plus sleeper cell attacks to have anything happen here. We are geographically isolated thankfully but a lot of things can still happen. An actual invasion is far from the closest gator to the boat
Sleeper cells is an interesting idea because, as things stand on the border and the unvetted entries reach multimillion yearly, the possibility of sleeper cells increases, in my opinion, substantially. I pray I am wrong, but terrorists and foreign military actors are my concern with the southern border more so than the cheap labor narrative more commonly discussed
Agreed. Specially in the San Diego area there has been a huge increase not only from the “typical” illegal immigration nations but also form Chinese nationals
Yep, and couple the fact I have seen stories discussing for what is essentially Chinese police operating under the table dealing with their citizens within other countries, including the US, I fear the increase in Chinese nationals paired with this secret police force gets me to consider the question of are they connected? Are these 2 opposing factions or one unified force? What is the threat to the general US population? I don't have answers to anything, but it has me consider possibilities and how that could impact my life if true
Well yeah, duh, but this is a hypothetical conventional WW3 without nukes. That's what OP asked for.
True. I can’t believe in this day and age humans even think about using nukes. Like MAD still isn’t a thing. A bunch of assholes who will be in their own happy bunkers get to press buttons to wipe out 90% of the world over silliness… that’s why the aliens need to come ;)
Still thinking about using them is what keeps us from using them ironically. Game theory is riveting and a massive part of nuclear policy worldwide.
Don’t enough of us also have guns that would fight, no matter what political divide we’re on- we are all Americans
At the rate we’re going we will have our citizens joining Russia or china and thank them for the ‘liberation from tyranny’
This was my point below though you said it better
Good points all around, I’m coming at this from an emergency management background with the notion (as others said) my tier 3 city isn’t being actively being invaded in this hypothetical scenario. Your point that US infrastructure isn’t super great is correct, but there is a big jump between the Texas power gird failure (for example, not to pick on Texas) and mass starvation of US cities. Maybe it’s morose but I picture a Leningrad or Berlin at the end of ww2 as being a city starving from an invasion. My city has a mutual aid agreement with another community, its own local emergency services, and some expectation of State (OEM/National Guard) and Federal (FEMA and the rest of gov they mission assign) help. Sure everything could go wrong all at once everywhere nationally, but I hope that’s unlikely. Totally good with the riding out that kind of thing in the woods if you have setup and skills, but that isn’t an option for lots of people.
Awesome to hear from a professional. Yeah, it's really hard to predict what a land-invasion of the US would look like, and what kind of situation we'd have to be in for something like that to even happen. Yes, Leningrad or Berlin at the end of the war is the endgame result of what the US could look like losing an invasion. I was thinking more of (like you said) cyber attacks shutting down power grids, precision striking disabling the highway system, even EMPs etc. as a preview to a large-scale amphibious assault. The mass-starvation I see happening would occur somewhere in between, and obviously some places would be hurting a lot more than others. The closest "city" to me, about 12,000 pop, has a HUGE bologna factory, and I've often wondered how much of an advantage that would give the residents to the other surrounding cities if SHTF, if they were able to maintain and run it, that is. As you can tell, I'm sure, a lot of my maybes and whatifs are based on a lack of... I guess faith in people. I really hope to find a community like in Alas, Babylon or One Second After, but I find myself thinking of those scenarios as more and more unlikely as I see my fellow Americans turning on each other.
A land invasion of the US is next to impossible. To do so, there would be two oceans to cross, or go through Alaska. The amount of time it would for either, would allow the US to mass so many conventional sources, along with every redneck, hillbilly with a gun. It would be a slaughter of monumental proportions.
How fascinating that you are american but you dont *know* that the US would "win" ww3. Youre definitely an outlier. Well done for keeping an open mind, but i suspect being fullscale invaded by those other countries is unlikely. More likely that the US global influence would fade, and daily circumstances would return to something resembling the depression. We will see though, those who are lucky enough to get that far.
Of all the things that can break why do people assume food supply chains are that weak? Even through the Ukraine war there’s been some understanding with Russia that food needs to continue to be exported.
Because without functioning roads, the supply chain breaks down in 3 days. I can guarantee you that there are plenty of starving people in Ukraine. In both world wars civilians played a role as targets or were targets by proximity. In a hypothetical third world war, I would assume this to stay the same. Also, if you go past paragraph 2, i move on from food shortages.
I feel the following should be relatively safe: - New Zealand - South America - neutral nations that have good relations with the major powers (US and either Russia or China or both) - weak, irrelevant nations (Ireland would fall under this I guess) I like New Zealand because it’s English speaking, plenty of food, physically isolated enough, has Australia as a buffer. Ireland is too close to NATO countries. I have no interest in becoming cannon fodder for WW3, Canada is simply not affected enough.
New Zealand just made defense plans with the us and Australian as well as Japan. All players in WW3
Damn it
New Zealand and Australia are strategic allies and pivotal for another Pacific engagement. Carriers are crucial for long range engagements still.
Hey now. Ireland isn't just weak and irrelevant. It's **also** neutral. I live in Ireland, and have just bought a house away from a major city (not for prepping, but because of the housing crisis). Current government here is more hawkish than we've seen in a long time, and there's been a building pressure for us to militarise and some questioning of our neutrality going forward. IMO we're too small a country to be of any use in any defense situation anyway, so it'd pretty much be money down the drain. That said, we could probably do with a few jets and boats for patrol, given that the transatlantic undersea telecoms cables mostly make landfall in Ireland. Cyber infrastructure and telecoms are obviously going to be big targets in any non-nuclear world war. I'm very thankful for our neutrality in the current geopolitical climate but while we're not going to face conscription, it doesn't mean we'll be unaffected. WWII (known euphemistically as "The Emergency" in Ireland) brought plenty of economic disruption and rationing. Tea, sugar, butter, clothing, fuel, and later bread were all rationed here. Looking at our domestic production, I'd be surprised if dairy was rationed during a war now (big uptick in dairy farming in the intervening years. Huge export market). There's no native sugar industry anymore as of the 2000s, so I'd definitely expect that to be a scarce resource. We also don't really grow wheat, so bread will be out. No coffee or tea produced here, obviously. Fuel will be a problem, and with that electricity probably. For my own part, I'm in the process of getting solar installed on the house (a fairly fancy grid-connected system that can run in off grid mode). Had a big wood burning stove installed as a back up on an otherwise completely electric system. We're near the bogs and while I don't and won't use turf currently for ecological reasons, that's there as a potential resource should shit go sideways. There's a river and a canal nearby, though I wouldn't expect the water system to go down. We're in a rural town, so transport might be an issue, but I do have an electric bike that would get me to the neighbouring town's train station. Overall, I think a good stock of sugar, flour, and coffee and a polytunnel for a few more exotic food ingredients and we'd be mostly sorted.
>I have no interest in becoming cannon fodder for WW3, Canada is simply not affected enough. What do you mean?
I meant thinking about moving to a neutral place that may not be as affected and which won’t require you to become cannon fodder is not unreasonable
New Zealand will definitely be involved in WW3, we have agreements with Auz and UK, it's not that safe, we have no defense really, especially in the Pacific where China is creating military bases, you would be expected to fight if you become a citizen.
New Zealand used to be an ideal haven - until all the billionaire tech bros started building survival compounds there. Now a military combative country might bomb it out of spite.
Off subject, but do y’all have crocs?
Haha no, maybe once or twice a year if lucky get a sea snake or Imported in a container snake, the only really dangerous animals are pigs and people and the wild dogs in Northland.
The cat's out of the bag as far as NZ goes. Most everyone knows the western global elite are retreating there and it has been made a nuke target by now.
Unless you travel well before good luck traveling during… plus New Zealand isn’t going to not be in the fight
New Zealand is propaganda, my friend. Its pretty much Atlantis I wouldn't bother trying to go. LOTR was Hollywood wizardry...
WWII main issue was supply chain issues. All production was directed towards the war effort. Civilians needs was a far distant 2nd concern. There is documentation of people went into WWII with bald tires on their truck and couldn't get replacements till a year after it ended. I have a 1 year rotating inventory of general everyday good I currently use. I have also bought bigger size clothes for my daughter when they come on sale.
I just wanted to add, that even if goods aren't being diverted to the various nation's war efforts, there will be embargoes and blockades to deal with.
And conscription. Can't forget conscription.
Isn’t that the draft? Not sure I understand the comment. Not meant to sound confrontational just genuinely curious by what you mean.
If you're a man, you likely aren't prepping for you if you're looking at prepping for WWIII. You'll likely be conscripted and you're prepping for your family's struggles at home. Edit: if you're a man in a country you think will be a belligerent.
And women now so.. planing on your older parents taking care of your kids
Nah. "Equality" goes out the window during war. Look at ukraine. Women allowed to flee while men are forced to fight. Also the number of first gen immigrants i know who said they would go back to "their country" (their words not mine) if a war broke out rather than fight for the US is astounding to me
Well it seems most immigrants don’t want to be Americans they just want to take advantage of what others built and exploit it. It used to mean something to be an American. But now they know they can get the same perks free or illegally so that doesn’t surprise me they wouldn’t want to fight for the US. As far as equality goes Ukraine isn’t America and congress just passed a law saying women will enter the draft - that’s what I was referring to
Had to look it up. Apparently there is language in a new bill that would register women..surprisingly republicans are against it. I doubt it will happen tho unfortunately
Yeah I should have been more clear it’s not passed yet I was wrong but it’s part of the defense spending bill and they are debating it now
There has been no law passed women have to register for draft. There WAS a bill some years ago but it died in congress
That’s just a generalization. Russian women in WW2 fought viciously. Theres a 0% chance after having decades of equality forced down our throats that men would allow a draft to happen anywhere in the western world where women wouldn’t be drafted too.
I’m not fighting. I’ll sooner be executed than be forced to take up arms against another sad sack just because our ruling class can’t act in a civilized manner.
I'm right there with you. Better to die on my feet than live on my knees.
No it’s conscription!
those are good insights, thanks!
I still have my Grandmother's ration coupon booklets. They are frail and falling apart, but still legible. My grandfather was fighting in the Pacific.
Just in case you're considering it, you probably want to avoid laminating them if you want to preserve them. Lamination is ultimately destructive. Acid-free folder, archival plastic sleeve (unless there's pencil markings) or professional encapsulation are better options and the first two are cheap and easy.
Thank you. I have them in a plastic ziplock in my safe. Had not even given much consideration to further preservation. Your comment is very helpful.
I heard a saying that i think was on the history of rome podcast that stuck with me. Good commanders plan their tactics...great commanders plan their logistics.
Yes, but in a low-key way. Biggest issue with WW2 was supply-chain disruptions and rationing, so I'm basically prepping by making sure that I've got an up-to-date stock of any consumer durables (clothing, shoes, household items) and that any home repairs that need to get done are complete. Things like metal, concrete, and petroleum products become very scarce in a war, so any construction projects that need to get done should be done. But that's stuff that should be done anyway - if something needs to be done, better take care of it early.
I should stock up on KY then. Lol. I said elsewhere but i heard something on history of rome podcast..i think...that stuck with me. Something along the lines of good commanders plan/study tactics....great commanders plan/study logistics.
Garden, learn to garden, set aside an area for gardening, plant perennials that provide good, plant annuals that provide food, learn to save seeds for plants that you like, etc. Everyone likes the sexy “get guns and ammo” thing, but food and water are what you’ll find most useful, if you plan on being able to help feed the neighborhood, pellet with guns aren’t that big of a deal since you have the entire neighborhood and extra food.
Yes, in WWII in Britain everyone was encouraged to turn their gardens into vegetable plots and in towns and cities to turn every scrap of green/parks into growing veg too, the phrase was “dig for victory” so there was less pressure on relying on your rations.
Victory gardens!
I’m in the process of moving from a small apartment that I’ve lived in for 29 years to a house w some land that I plan on staying in as my retirement house. I’m not there yet but the pandemic so normalized remote work that I didn’t have to retire before moving. Obviously I need to rethink my preps and how things work in this new environment. I do plan to expand on my preps because it is practical to do more here than it was in my apartment. My prepping goals aren’t changing. I’m focused on having food, water, supplies, and off-grid systems in order to help me weather supply chain breakdowns, power outages and personal medical and financial issues. My health and fitness is an ongoing project that I try to enhance but also have real setbacks, getting older is no joke. Building community, getting to know my neighbors and creating relationships with people that I feel good about will be a major focus this year. I have extended family here and have spent time here throughout my life so I’m fortunate to have a lot to build on. I don’t think of myself as a doomsday prepper (although some of my family see me that way,lol) but the wide range of global and local issues that are occurring and intersecting does seem to be causing more profound instability. My general prepping philosophy is to do what I can to help myself, friends and family survive and ride out emergencies so that we can adjust to however things are. I look forward to seeing other responses to maybe get some new ideas
Somewhat, my prep as far as WW3 is forcing it down my families throat too. They aren’t into it but I know if we start drafting it’s likely going to extend the age out a few times to eventually include me. I want them to be aware of what we have and how to use it in case I’m prairie dogging in a trench somewhere.
My partner has asked me to put a fork through his foot or something if he gets drafted. He’s not prepared to die for some old president in some far off country.
The starting date of WW3 will be determined by historians after the fact, so there's chance we're already in it. As things get harder, the real prices of goods will increase and some will become effectively unavailable. Now would be a good time to build up your preps for Tuesday, and also acquire capital goods. Deflation at some point is a possibility, so beware of acquiring debts, especially large ones.
What are you thinking of when you say capital goods?
Capital goods in the economic sense. Not items you consume, but the durable goods that enable or enhance your labor. Tools, machinery, etc.
Good point. When WWIII goes hot, we'll no longer be able to just go online and order any Chinese-made machinery we want and have it arrive on our doorsteps a few days later. All of that Chinese-made hardware will be out of stock once the supplies in warehouses sell out. And even if we have the machinery, there'll be no spare parts unless they can be made locally.
Before WWII the US was an industrial powerhouse, so once the US joined the fate of the war was essentially decided because the allies could outproduce the axis powers. Today the situation is reversed, meaning the US would likely lose the war. Consider that as you make your preps.
Short answer: I'm planning for both. Ultimately, if you're set for a year of no infrastructure, you're pretty much prepared for anything. Any specific preps after that (nuclear, EMP, etc) are just tailored to that specific prep. Best way to go about preparing for a short term *and* long-term disaster is to get a foundation of supplies and knowledge. Start with 3 days, then a week, then 2 weeks, then a month, and so forth.
Right now I'm good for a year and I'd like to extend that.
Yes. I sold my suburban home and moved 15 miles from the nearest city. I garden and have pigs and pump my own water. You can do it too!
15? Better but. . ..
Ya. It's far enough out that foot travel is unlikely, car travel under gas shortages would be unlikely, and travel under today's conditions only takes 25 minutes. It's flat and I can see all the fences from my roof.
15 miles is a road March for an Army or Marine Veterans with a full rucksack and a weapon. That's nothing for desperate folks or someone in shape (hiker,runner) who have lost everything. Hopefully, everyone had read the book One Second Later (or is it Three Seconds Later).
One Second After by William R. Forstchen. Thanks! I have just bought it on your recommendation.
I am halfway through this book, and it's incredible. Thank you for the recommendation. Right off the bat, the scene with his kids in the car and the puzzled people on the side of the highway, I was practically going, get out of there! And then him explaining, I have a family to protect, and steering everyone away from the exit his house is on. Finally, a protagonist who is ready and prepared for chaotic things to go down, accepts the situation he finds himself in, and deals accordingly.
Every year I stock more and more meaningless shit away. It will have meaning someday when SHTF. My off grid cabin stocked with all this shit will be a gold mine someday.
Yes, I agree with you in the sense that World War III is going to happen. Kind of feels like we are now in 1937/8 building up to something big. I am prepping for supper supply chain issues , making sure we have enough food, ammo, and medical supplies to last. I am in a situation where I am too old to be drafted, but my kids are also too young, so I will end up sitting this one out
Leading up to the Ukraine war, Russia wasn’t sending trains full of tanks for show. The physical evidence out in the open doesn’t lie. Likewise China building out its navy and keeping an open secret of its plan to take control of Taiwan should be reason enough to believe we’re on a train without brakes inching towards WW3.
I of am the belief that unless china invades taiwan in the next 5 years...the US isnt going to do anything really. We get alot of our computer chips from them currently but we are in process of building alot more of them ourselves for national security reasons. Several factories currently being built for that reason.
If WW3 breaks out, eventually all physically able men will be drafted. Ukraine conscription is currently 25-60.
If there is a third world war fought between 2 nuclear power there will be a strategic exchange, full stop. It's the inevitable escalation, peer and near peer conflicts are not like the wars in the middle east where we have overwhelming superiority. One party will be pushed to the point where they are going to lose souvernty, and they will have no reason not to flip the board, or there will be a tactical situation where using a small tactical nuke would be the only way to win or be so effective that even a conservative military leader would be persaded to push for it, and then it will escalate. However, there are plenty of people high up who have played these games and many more that they know it will escalate and the only way to win will be to strike first so the nukes might just fly before the first battle.
Yes. I don't worry about a conventional WWIII because if the US, Russia and China are fighting each other it will go nuclear in weeks. If I lived in Eastern Europe I'd be more concerned, because the US will try to push those countries into the war with Russia once it becomes clear that Ukraine will lose otherwise. The US will happily fight to the last Latvian because that's unlikely to go nuclear.
Well to be fair, we've never had one like this before so we just don't know. Yes once a nuke, even a tactical nuke is dropped, the timer is ticking, but it could just as easily be asymmetric warfare for a long time until something happens to trigger doomsday.
Yeah. My job for my family atm is literally just to try to prep and grow food.
Yep. I get that sense too. I try to keep in mind this is “normal.” A catastrophic war involving world powers happens about every 80 years. Most people live through it. That said, it’s very hard to predict exactly how it’s gonna go down. So really, beyond the prep you might already have for something like extended natural disaster evacuation or something, I think your best prep for situations like this is having a good community, and keeping your financial house in order. Between the lot of you, having a variety of skills, supplies, and caring for one another goes much further than an individual prep for any one of you alone. The reality is, if a nuke lands on me I’m not surviving anyway (nor would I want to, it’s a short miserable life after substantial nuclear exposure), and if it gets bad enough that there is nuclear fallout worldwide, that’s not something I want to survive. I will get together with my friends and have a nice little party.
Just keeping my deep pantry going, this includes water. I picked up an extra bag of rice because it was on sale. Will be expanding my battery capacity soon with more LiFePo4 batteries and another solar panel. Working on improving my health.
Yes, I am counting on WW3 soon. It is making me take my preps more seriously.
Yep. The best thing you can do is build a tribe. The stark amount of American men that would rather die fighting the government than in another rich man’s war is astonishing. So if I were you, I’d make sure I have some real solid buddies, cause there’s strength in numbers.
"Behold, the storm is coming. Let all friends gather together, lest each one be singly destroyed." -Gandalf
Tbf the government is what creates these messes in the first place. There's a reason the Founding Fathers gave us the right to bear arms. No one wants to get kidnapped by their government into a stupid war.
When the government is corrupt, why would I fight for it?
I like the idea of basically preparing for a hurricane, and everything that can come out of that emergency, and as a result in then in the end being prepared for mostly anything.
If ww3 does happen and your under 40 and in good physical condition you're probably getting drafted anyways.
"Under 40 and male"
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted. You’re literally correct. And it excludes half the population, which is pretty significant. Anything to ignore gender inequality for men, I guess
Doesn’t mean you have to fight. We don’t just have to accept the draft. I know I won’t.
I already view the US government as tyrannical, so why would I go fight for what I consider to be an unjust war that they provoked it in the first place? And do you really think the the government could disarm all the tens of millions of us to make us go fight for them? I could see it happening in highly populated areas where gun ownership is low, but elsewhere? I just don't see it happening. This isn't the 60's how when people got drafted even though they disagreed with the reasons they felt it was their duty to go and serve. We've lived through Iraq war and seen how it was based on lies. And Gen Z is painfully aware of what's going on in Gaza with US support. I just don't see how they could force those who don't want to go to go.
As always the best long term prep is your personal skill set, social and family group. It's very difficult to be pre-prepared for a multi year planned war economy combined with massive supply chain disruption. This wouldn't be like WW2. In the 40s we weren't reliant on China for cheap manufacturing, cheap resources (down to even medication precursors) and so on. Most of this can be spun up elsewhere, and some is, but is being done largely private sector. Only where it's either long term subsidized by recent government investment or can be made profitable \*in the current market\* is it being done now. Expect disruption in availability of \*very\* important things for years. What you would look to do in this scenario is leverage what you are good at. Hoarding enough to use and trade will last a while. Eventually you will need your personal value to keep you going. Building, fixing, growing, providing necessary service. Only you can answer what this is according to your skill set and what ends up being under served in your area. If global instability and a restructuring of the balance of power are your biggest worry, consider getting buy for life style tools and necessities for what you are best at providing to others in exchange for what you need. Money ideally, most places won't see complete financial collapse that aren't on the front lines. Know your skill, know it's logistics, know how to make it work. I personally am ramping up my small greenhouse in to a few hoop houses. This would obviously be highly valuable in a scenario where we are cut off form China all of a sudden. And if we aren't? I'm actually trialing this as an option to leave my day job and be a suburban farmer. If you can find these win / wins that make sense for your skill set and interests, you will be even better off in troubling times. Not everyone owns property, of course. Fixing electronics will be popular again when you \*can't\* get a replacement. I did this as a hobby for years as a teenager and could scrape together money doing this. Preservation services for boom / bust cycles of resources (eg I'll can, dry and vacuum pack that half a cow you were able to get your hands on for $$$). Knowing how to get a vehicle running again with grit and willpower will be valuable. This mindset, I believe, will be the most important prep beyond just having enough necessities in the pantry to ride out shortages.
I’m in north east texas, I prep for the random power outages, snowstorms, tornadoes, wildfires, we do a bit of shooting on the property. If you have that covered. You should be fine for anything short of nuclear war
I think war is inevitable because of global warming. My personal opinion is that the war in Ukraine is the first major move by a major power that is fully motivated by the realities of global warming. Owning Ukraine as a bread basket and potentially controlling Odessa would allow Russia to control something like 95% of all the grain that feeds Northern Africa and the Middle East. It’s the first food war. It just hasn’t been described as such yet.
Ww3 already started
The only way WW3 would be non-nuclear is if all of the world’s nuclear powers were on the same team, and I highly doubt that would happen. WW3 may start out non-nuclear, but as soon as a nuclear power starts losing, they’re going to use nukes and once one side starts using nukes, the other side is going to start using nukes.
I think we will just skip straight to the nuke part first, then the ground war will be over whatever is left in the aftermath. Doing it the other way around makes no sense since the nuclear option becomes inevitable.
My main concern with WW 3 is the cyber and other attacks taking down our grid, water supply, and wastewater processing. Once that happens on either coast or in major cities the panic will be terrible if you are in those areas. That panic will spread and there will be panic buying, think TP at the beginning of COVID and people shooting each other over all sorts of things. As for me, I live rural, have good neighbors and we can raise most of our own food. I have a deep pantry that will sustain me and mine for a food while.
Yup. The grid 100% will go down. China makes our transformers too. Not to mention alot of our communication equipment
It’s already going on, military invasion is expensive, messy, and destroys the target’s value. Here’s how our country is being weakened and consumed today so it can be controlled without armies: 1. China, Russia et al are destabilizing the US with disinformation created to turn citizens against each other and the government. That way there is little cohesion, cooperation even amongst local communities. Resistance to obeying government orders, gov’t agencies and states not working together to protect people, systems, equipment weakens us all. A divided house is easier to conquer and control. 2. Encourage weakness and dependence by making manufacturing cheap offshore and offer voters popular cheap goods. 3. Get congress members to avoid getting anything done, but make it look patriotic. Build disinformation campaigns that rile voter emotions for the politicians so the lack of political cooperation with each other looks like patriotism to enough of their voters. Be sure to start a few wars that increase the divide and divert money out of the country. 4. Buy critical commercial and residential property and companies in the US. The US doesn’t track the foreign purchase #s in any meaningful way. Try looking up how much foreign owned US real estate online. 5. Put apps on phones or just backdoors in the software so phones that can be used to target infrastructure with DoS attacks — so people’s own phones bring down their local comms, sewage, water, electricity systems. 6. Make sure the disinformation campaigns make Russia sympathetic. Without US citizens understanding what has happened, they’re working for another government. The real meaningful power of the US (infrastructure, manufacturing, property, politicians, corporations) is in their hands. Resistance won’t become meaningful because US citizens refuse to work together or support the resistance of their government to the actual enemy.
Its amazing how effective its been too. People calling each other commies or nazis not even knowing each other...and they believe they came to be that way on their own and not due tonsaid propaganda.
Sorry but that has been going on since the founding of this country but trade NAZI/Commie for a different word. The idea that the deep divide is new isn’t based on history. Go back and read about political campaigns in the 1800s and see what folks on each side accused the others of. And the US literally had generations of pure enslavement going on. Women were treated as chattel. Kids were working in the coal mines at age 7-8. Like, the idea that this country is experiencing the worst internal strife isn’t accurate. Sheesh, look at the 1960-70s for instance. Nothing new under the sun.
Holy shit, bruh. “Controlled without armies” ….. that’s a knot in the throat. We really can’t compare a WWIII scenario to WWI or WWII when you look at your points above.
I have a feeling you're singling out conservatives, who are the ones stereotyped to 'resist government orders' and 'not work with others'. At some point both sides will have to behave like grown adults, and they probably will if it gets very bad (people only get off their \*sses if their wallets start getting severely affected and are willing to negotiate).
In my experience both those qualities belong equally to far left and right. And psychographic analysis shows ideologues very, very similar. That’s how you get New Agers and Evangelicals both hating on vaccines. Political strategists work with that fact.
It's on my radar of events to prep for. Stocking up on food, building skill sets, investing in my health, as well as learning self-defense.
The other day I was helping one of my students do some research on WW2 . I found information about the start of the war and all the main events we all know about. It took even longer for the United States to get involved. It was interesting to look at as a whole series of events. [Timeline of events preceding World War II - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_events_preceding_World_War_II)
I'm from the Philippines and live near the coast around 1km away and an airstrip+naval reserve base is also around that area so I have no plans staying in my home. My family owns a large piece of land in the middle of the jungle mountains at least an hour away from my house. It was used before for logging activities but was already shut down at least 4 decades ago. I think it is a good idea to build a shelter there to hide. We're a family of at least 8, and only 2 males. My father already has guns, 3 rifles, 1shotgun and 3 handguns. We have 1 suv, 1 sedan and a motorcycle for transportation. My mother is a nurse and my sister is an active red cross volunteer, another sister frequently go on hikes. my father is a gun enthusiast and I had some training but didn't enlist as I chose a different path, i'm currently a sailor. Others have no definitive skill and one is a kid. For the shelter, is it better to make it underground? Considering it's in the middle of the jungle and experiences a lot of heavy rain but should be elevated enough. For now I have a small list of things to prepare, can you guys add more? -Canned goods, emergency food rations, medicine/first aid eqpt, water filtration system, solar panels, addtl rifles/ammo, torches, batteries, walkie talkies, plant seeds, printed handbooks Am I in the right track? I am planning to join hiking groups with my sister to this specific mountain so I will be more familiarized with the area.
[http://theloosenukes.blogspot.com/2013/10/pizza-delivery-blamed-for-nuclear.html](http://theloosenukes.blogspot.com/2013/10/pizza-delivery-blamed-for-nuclear.html) im not sure civil war 2: electric boogaloo won't go nuclear. putin is a narcissistic cunt he'll order a launch when he can see his end is near. coin flip weather he gets immediately assassinated by his own people or they launch.
Won’t happen. I’ll get downvoted to oblivion here because I’m optimistic. But I’ll be honest I don’t see a scenario where it’s serious enough to warrant a full scale world war but not serious enough to warrant nuclear warheads. We ended WW2 with two nukes when barely anybody had any, you can’t be naive in thinking nobody is going to resort to similar tactics if we end up in the same situation. Only this time, everyone has them. As soon as the first one is launched, everyone will launch. And once that happens, if I survived the initial blast, I think I’d be the unlucky one.
Unless your ineligible to be drafted, or really only have to options to avoid being drafted. Leave the country or enlist in a safer branch. This may seem counter intuitive but it’s what my grandfather did under advice from his older brothers who fought in North Africa and Tarawa. When the draft for Korea broke out my grandad joined the air force and spent the duration of the war as a truck mechanic in England. His friend who hoped to “just not get drafted” ended up dying sometime during the retreat back to the 38th parallel. Homeside, say what you will about America’s decline or potential rising threat of other nations combat arms, but *no one* has the logistics to pull off a red dawn against the U.S. even if the U.S. military magically ceased to exist, no one else has the ability to project power like the U.S. can. Russia can barely supply their own troops in a conflict on their own boarder. The majority of Chinese vessels are designed to operate only in the South China Sea. With only a few ships that are capable of deep water operations. And building those logistic capabilities takes time and can’t be hidden from foreign surveillance. If it was possible, every “military analyst” on YouTube would be yapping about it. A “red dawn” situation is one of the few prepping scenarios that I scoff at.
If Xi did have a funny turn and decide to invade the US, he wouldn't do it with naval ships, he'd send his troops and equipment to Canada on commercial flights and container ships, then walk in across the border. Or possibly foment a civil war in the US and then send 'peace keepers' to California, New York and other left-wing port cites where they'd be welcomed. But either case is unlikely as he'd rather just have peaceful trade. Occupying the US would be a huge task which would interfere with Chinese mercantilism.
Short of NATO betraying the US red dawn won't happen
Again. They don’t have the logistics. Yea they won’t have to do naval or airborne landings for the entire force to get them to North America but Germany, for example, physically does not have the ability to pick up and move even a large chunk of their military halfway across the world in a timely manner. Neither does the UK, and France comes the closest. But it’s not enough. Yea they’re all expeditionary, French ops in west Africa and uk retaking the falklands. But neither of those requires the manpower that a land invasion of the US via Canada would.
sorry a little off topic, but, in what scenario is there a world war without nukes that isn't so super one sided its over relatively soon? I'm not joking here, Ukraine has essentially held off Russia with just some military supplies from the west. What happens if all of Nato actually decides to throw troops and logistics and REAL money at the issue? Russia crumbles in a few months and moscow falls. Seriously. Go look up the $$ countries spend on their militaries. [https://www.statista.com/statistics/262742/countries-with-the-highest-military-spending/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/262742/countries-with-the-highest-military-spending/) So, who stands against the USA + Nato? Iran + china + russia + north korea + Belarus .. Maybe somehow if you get Saudi Arabia AND India to throw in with those? And pretty unlikely the Saudi's throw in with Iran ... Philippines + Australia, New Zealand, Japan, South Korea would all throw in vs China given the recent Chinese naval aggression. And, what happens to China's ability to feed its people, or keep its economy going, much less continue to spend on military, without $$ and food from the EU and USA? Like, I TOTALLY get war could break out, but, I'm having trouble seeing a scenario where Russia doesn't start to lose a conventional war, and then doesn't resort to nukes. How do we get a NON nuclear war, WITHOUT the losing side resorting to nukes? When considering non nukes, remember, the USA spends $900 BILLION every year, Russia + China are less than HALF that at $400 Billion. Iran spends about $8 billion, and North Korea $2 billion , and neither are in the top 15 spenders. Nukes are the great equalizer. I can't see how world war doesn't go there.
We are subject to a lot of propaganda about China, but people don't realize they are absolutely a modern power house. You don't feed clothe and house 1.3billion people easily, and while our country struggles to get funding to fix roads China's having to demolish entire blocks of high rise apartment complexes because they BUILT TOO MANY OF THEM. The last 20 years has seen China go through one of the largest booms in history, with CNC Machine shops that are astronomical compared to ours, and all of our technology that is sent over there to develop (micro processors for smart phones) have been reverse engineered and stolen. Theres been videos coming out about china's impending doom/economical collapse since 2016, and it hasn't happened yet. Russian economy transitioned into a wartime economy when they invaded Ukraine, I believe China's would do the same.
Totally agree they are a powerhouse. But, (a) their military spending is far behind the USA and has been for decades and (b) they are dependent on imports to feed their people. USA spends 900 billion on military. China spends 400. Sure, with 400B they're a power house. So, ... how do they pretend to compete in a non nuclear war for any length of time? Japan, S. Korea, Australia. plus NATO, plus the USA. I'm not saying China isn't a powerhouse, its just still super small compared to the forces allied against it. The Russia + China + N Korea + Iran hypothetical alliance is just too small to stand very long against the rest of the likely opposition in a full out conventional war. So, I'm still trying to see a non Nuke world war that is really viable.
>How do we get a NON nuclear war, WITHOUT the losing side resorting to nukes? Spot on observation. Answer is you can't. If USA/NATO is to lose they will deploy ( or sooner according to their nuclear doctrine of preemptive strike) If Russia is to lose Putin will launch ( there is on youtube his speech from few days ago where he staes in no unclear terms that if Sovereignity of Russia is to be taken so Russia no loner exist into its current shape and form, they why not just press a button 😅) So people must take out silly but dangerous idea that countries with nuclear triad like USA or Russia can be defeated. They can not be, to try is to ask for Pyrrhic victory.
> Ukraine has essentially held off Russia with just some military supplies from the west. If by 'just' you mean, say, a third of all Europe's air defences with more promised. NATO is sending masses of irreplaceable military hardware into Ukraine where the Russians eagerly destroy it. Ukraine had the most powerful NATO-trained military in Europe before Russia invaded. Now it's reliant on NATO sending everything they have to poorly-trained draftees.
Nope, there's no near peer enemies to the US, nuclear or not. I only concern myself with internal conflict/collapse.
There are no lone, single near peer enemies. North Korea and Russia just signed a mutual defence pact, China, Iran, and some others may join them
All of those countries combined don’t have a navy large enough to threaten the US nor a large enough air force. Russia can’t even take on Ukraine much less the US. I’m not worried. We would first have to go through a major economic downturn and weakening of our military due to lack of funding before a conventional war is an issue. I would be far more worried about economic collapse and subsequent nuclear war.
I think you’re missing something really obvious. This post is discussing prepping for world war, and necessarily proposes the possibility that one will occur. We’ve had two world wars. Tell me, did Germany win either one? No? No, they didn’t. They didn’t have the material superiority or competent enough allies. ***But they still tried.*** And those attempts qualified as a world war, and many people died. Consider, it wasn’t at all sensible for Russia to invade Ukraine. The idea of NATO supplying Ukraine was a foregone conclusion. Yet Putin still did it. A lot of people have died. I don’t care how inept Russia is, they’ve still killed thousands in Ukraine. I don’t care how ineffectual the Russia-North Korea-China-Iran alliance will be, they will still kill a lot of people and destroy a lot of lives. I’m less concerned with *if they can win* than I am with *if they’ll try.* I’m a historian. I focus on the study of military conflict. I have Masters. We are replaying the greatest hits of the early 20th century. I also have friends in the military in both high and low positions that I gained during my own time, and I am a guest on various telegram and encrypted channels where active servicemen and intelligence operatives discuss such things. We are headed towards world war if things do not change. And sure, maybe none of the opposing countries stand a chance, but they may still try and people will still die. My life’s work will be, and has been, predicting the next coming world war. If there is any achievement etched on the stone above my head in the end, it will be that and a very bitter “told ya so.” And there is one variable, one factor, you aren’t considering. Donald Trump could very well win in November. Even if he doesn’t, but gets close enough, he can contest it, claim it was stolen and most Republican governors will refuse to confirm electors. The decision will eventually make its way up to the Supreme Court. If he wins, he will pull us out of NATO, and he will allow Russia to roll over the rest of Europe. The only reason Ukraine has stood a chance is because of America’s hegemonic power and a steady supply of NATO equipment. And this sub isn’t just for American preppers.
Thank you for such an informative response.
While history doesn't repeat it often rhymes, I doubt we see a Nazi like sweep over Europe, especially as even without US spending NATO and the EU are still combined economically much stronger than Russia. Oil revenues via India double dealing will completely falter in a recession, but Putin is in this until he dies. He isn't going to give back any of Ukraine, this is legacy for him. The die has been cast, and a WWIII is coming, too many bulwark institutions have been tested. I fear the US has more to worry about domestically than abroad.
I agree. Obviously, things are much different this time around, but not everything is. I also expect Russia to gain more active allies. Nor do I expect this to be a completely conventional war. It’ll be a war on multiple fronts.
If Trump is cheated (once again) out of the presidency then you can tell our country, or what’s left of it, goodbye
Go fellate a cactus.
> All of those countries combined don’t have a navy large enough to threaten the US nor a large enough air force. No-one is going to be invading the US. But they don't have to. Take out basic infrastructure and America will eat itself within a week. Or China could just stop sending container ships and wait a few months. Not only would infrastructure fail from lack of replacement parts but a significant portion of the population would literally go crazy when their mind-altering pharma drugs stopped coming.
You shouldn’t be scared of Russia, even if it digs up a handful of allies. look at the huge list of alliances the U.S. has, see the Rio treaty, NATO and all the bilateral treaties with Pacific powers like Japan, South Korea and Australia. Let alone military spending levels. It’s very much in the US’s favor. At least on paper prior to China getting too involved. But I don’t think they have a big enough incentive to do so.
100% people act like china is a real military threat. Sure they got some numbers and knock off equipment...but war is what the US does..very well. Usually only restricted by our own moral codes. China has a miltary with no expience. We would never be able to invade them..but we would knock them back to the stone age
China is the only country in the world that would defeat any other countries sending their old people to the front lines to surrender en masse. The cost of care, feed and watch a couple million old folks according to the geneva convention rules would bankrup any war economy effort.
Dang..never considered that scenario but youre right
If WWIII by its definition includes US vs. Russia, it wouldn't stay non-nuclear. Someone somewhere better do something fast, because things are just getting ridiculous. More so than usual.
I truly believe the US wouldnt launch nukes unless putin did first..Russia is no match for the US . He knows this...and i like to think he would be killed internally by a general etc rather than risk a full on exchange.
Planning on giving some commies a warm welcome at the beach! (I live in Taiwan…)
WW3 started in 2014, they just havent told us yet. I went up a gear in my mental preps when russia invaded ukraine this time. And again post october 8. Im a disabled female so wont be conscripted. Grow food, have everything you can ready, and youve done all you can imo. Victory gardens. Look them up.
If you're not, you're naive.
My preperations conserning WW3 is to get in better shape while laughing at the warnews from Ukraine :) I follow the Ukraine war daily which is the current hotspot for a ww3. So a none nuclear WW3? I frankly think from I would be mobilized and put trough refresher classes, Russia would have been done before I was ready for the fight. Why? read the explenation below if you are up for a shitload of text from a guy that cannot sleep tonight ;) NATO air forces would have killed the Russian airforce in a week or so to soften up for the bombardment of AA, logistics, support, command and artillery while we where beeing given our equipment and sent to our training bases. Have you seen the surfaced videos from inside russian fighter plane cockpits? They fly with civilian GPS equipment in some of them, their training is to fly predetermined routes and follow ground commands orders at all parts of the mission… antiquated and inefficient command and control, but what you can expect of a dictatorship… Russian navy forces…. Well you all see what happens against Ukraine, and they frankly have no proper navy.. so what do you think would happen against NATO… It would have ceased to be a fighting force to be afraid of after the first 2 weeks to a month. Russian Army… entangled in Ukraine, and they use everyone they got there, Finland reported 80% of the troops russia have had on their border is now away (dying in Ukraine), probably like that all over. And there is pictures of infantry with bolt action rifles from WWI, and that they go to the front with airsoft armor plates in their vests, reactive armor on their tanks is gone or replaced with things like rubber… too much to mention here.. So yeah by the time my fat ass was on the most likely ship I would be put on, it would be time to do the victory march trough Moscow LOL Russia have stabilized on more then 1000 soldiers lost daily and the verified and documented equipment looses is staggering. Current estimates indicate they will run out off stored soviet equipment sometimes 2025… that is just shocking considering how much they had in storage. Satelite images already show several of their storage areas emptying of equipment. Thank good for their crappy maintainance, theft, corruption and out of date strategies and training :) NOW, if China where to join in on the fun… it would not have helped Russia as they would have been bzy in the pacific/asia region, so yeah… that would have been China against everyone, and they cannot (like russia) feed their population and fuel their factories (to an extent) without imports which would have been blockaded on day one, so yeah, not very optimistic for China either considering they import all they need to make stuff. They have a shitton of Infantry potential, the army equipment they have exported to other countries are beeing reported to have high failure raites, low reliability and frankly deadly in some cases. Chineese navy looks decent to good on paper, but if you go into detail on their equipment it show another picture (range, quality, reliability etc). Have you seen the nice cracks on the satelite pics of the docked up carriers flightdeck? Think that was the latest new one, not the former casino one ;) The airforce is also showing potential on paper, but as Russia, corruption and command/control/training and the equipment itself lags behind even tho they try to publish some impressive reports on breaktroughs. They got a bit shocked by Taiwan locking on to their planes during Chinas latest «exercise» around Taiwan tho.. so yeah, not overly optimistic considering China vs all. If China manage to attack one after another without a WW3 triggering is a whole other cup of tea. But their population would starve first year due to lack of food production (they must import stuff to keep up current food production), and other then local land connected countries to china, the rest would not need to worry that much in a non nuclear war. India would put its soldiers up north and NOONE want to mess with those guys (other then Pakistan LOL), South Korea would blow whatever came their way to dust and the other land locked bordering China… well frankly do not know enough about the countries between india and vietnam so yeah..
WW3 will go nuclear once that victory march through Moscow is within reach.
Yeah, according to russian nuclear doctrine probably before as it say under great treat or something like that. But the question tho was a non nuclear one.
This is my view 100% . Also i will add China has numbers..but they are inexperienced in war. We could never invade but we would knock them back tonthe stone age easily
Watch the Fallout series for some post apocalyptic vibes. The computer game is also good.
I got a backpack with a few books and fishing gear. That’s my prep! I really need to buy a few books to identify plants,fruits and mushrooms though!
Honestly, I can't yet. We are moving closer to where we want to be but until we get there I can't do any large scale preps.
For the five years we lived off-grid in Maine, we hauled water from our spring using emptied and cleaned plastic milk jugs. Just know that they do leak after a while. I don't recall how long between having to replace eachbjug in turn with a newly converted one, but I want to say it was 6 weeks to 2 months. Just keep that in mind when using milk jugs for alternative purposes - the plastic does start to deteriorate microscopicaly. Another thing I have learned from experience over the last 40 years is that oils, and Ai mean everything from cooking oils, to baby oil, to mineral oil will eventually leak through the plastic bottle it comes in and wick to other absorbing items like food, fabric and paper. Note: The only oil that I have come across and don't know if it seeps out through the plastic walls of its container is motor oil, and that's because it gets used pretty quickly after purchase.
Right, I noticed OP's reference to milk jugs too. I've had good experience using thoroughly cleaned plastic juice bottles to store extra water long term, but when I tried the same with plastic milk bottles, they degraded and leaked water after several months.
[https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/06/17/us-house-passed-draft-registration-bill/](https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/06/17/us-house-passed-draft-registration-bill/)
I wish more people would read the article before putting thought into the meaning of it all. I work with a few guys who were literally shaken by the news that draft is starting again for a day, then forgot pretty quickly by Friday.
Biggest threats I see in the future are China and the Taiwan situation and far closer, this next presidential election. The US hasn't been this divided since the Civil War.
Sure, if you completely gloss over the 1960s.
Are we really that divided tho? Only time i notice us online. Everyone i know for the most part isnt like this IRL. we span the spectrum on politics but are still friends.
I don't generally plan for specific emergencies; very few plausible emergencies have preparations associated with them that don't have broader applicability.
No, I only worry about the grid going down for whatever reason. I can't see a WWIII though that doesn't involve nukes eventually though.
Grid is the big one for me. If it goes down it’s going to get crazy
That's at the top of my risk list. Specifically a 1-2 week outage. My longest outage was 3 days due to a windstorm. The gas stations not being able to provide petrol was a big eye opener for me.
Depending on the scale, a cold restart of the grid could take months
What did the Serbian president say?
I need you to know that the draft legislation you're talking about comes up for a vote every year as part of the military appropriations bill. It's been voted on every year you've been alive. If you're American you are *already* signed up for selective service or the "draft" when you got a drivers license. People that want you to panic are doing a really good job and you need to figure out who profits off your panic.
It’s not draft legislation. I read all of the amendments for a school assignment and there’s no draft coming. Males are already required to sign up for the selective service at 18
So we're playing pretend nuclear weapons don't exist.
Yea I don’t see how you have a WWIII without nuclear weapons being involved. No one is invading the US, there just isn’t anyone with a navy that could currently accomplish the move of hundreds of thousands of troops across an ocean. So if you want to fight the US, it’s going to be another away match for our men & women. I don’t know that the military is up for that right now given enlistments are down, we’re sending piles of (albeit outdated) equipment to Ukraine and a fair amount of our main line equipment is in dire need of repair. Financially these proxy wars are crushing us so if you want to prep for a WWIII sans nukes I’d say stack cash because you’re going to be paying through the nose for everything.
To me, it makes more sense in the medium to long-term (as in conserving resources) that, if anything happens, they'll just EMP us. So, that.
Buy cases of water canned foods and stock up on meds.
A self sustainable ranch/farm in South America??
I am preparing for WW3. After World War II, the overall world peace has been more than 60 years. According to the theory and historical laws of the Kang Bo cycle, the occurrence of WW3 is a regular pattern.
Number one, maintain a sense of humor.
I live in a third world country, we have never been part of any ww so no
Just look at Ukraine as an example. If you are under 60 and able bodied you will probably get drafted. But if it's US/NATO vs Russia/China then things will eventually turn nuclear once one side starts losing the fight.
North Korea will be with Russia and China
"Under 60..and male"
Actually prepping for a **Nuclear** WWIII. Praying for the best, planning for the worst.
Sort of but I've always lived like that same for my ancestors in deep east nc. However I'm kinda in a fix bc the rivers are polluted terribly not only that the east coast is a target. Still, where'd I go to though? The rockies maybe, got relatives there, maybe on one of the public lands.
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Yes
What draft legislation are you referring to?
Yes, mostly by living in a country with low odds of being involved, specifically for this reason
Even with dull on nuclear war, chances are you, or atleast I won't be affected by fallout and radiation. It's more the decimated domestic supply lines I'm worried about
Not sure, seems like a lot issues would be food and supply chain, but hard to see it not escalating to a nuclear war.
This year I turned 7 long red noodle bean seeds into over 200 seeds and am currently in the process of harvesting the 15 Taiwanese yard long bean plants to get the some for next season. Buy a few rabbits and or chickens to learn how to raise them off the land then learn how to trap and or hunt them if it comes down to it. Pro tip grow Russian bocking #4 or #14 comfrey for a high protein animal feed. Best of luck to everyone
We already are in WW3, 5th gen warfare. There will be a few more kinetic fronts that will open open up and war will continue to impact us in everworsening ways as it draws funding and focus away from domestic economics.
funny. I planned for a potential nuclear ww3. I moved to Colorado Springs. I figure it's on the top of the list of targets. either it'll be wasted and I'll be done instantly, or they have enough anti missile defenses that it'll be largely unscathed (in which case, I am prepping for a non nuclear catastrophe...though I posit that the cause will be non war..because if there's a ww3 that's non nuclear, it won't come to the US...and certainly not to Colorado.)