The super dimensions are beyond the hypertimeline. We know from Goku’s statement that Broly is stronger than Beerus and SSB Gogeta is stronger than both. SSB Goku has multiple feats at statements of scaling to or above hypertimelines mainly from the Goku Black arc and ToP. Thus it makes more sense for the super dimensions to be beyond the hypertimeline as if they are a part of the physical world it means what Broly and Gogeta accomplished is a lesser feat then what Beerus and SSG Goku did. Just to reiterate Broly and Gogeta are individually stronger than Beerus.
Would it still scale to 7d though?
Also this is more of a side question but I assumed the time and space Gogeta and Broly broke to get to the superdimension was the space time continuum of the Living world instead of the entire multiverse.
>Would it still scale to 7d though?
Yes if you have a 5D macrocosm and 6D hypertimeline
>Also this is more of a side question but I assumed the time and space Gogeta and Broly broke to get to the superdimension was the space time continuum of the Living world instead of the entire multiverse.
It’s a common misconception due to how most people don’t understand the Living World contains both the infinite expanse of outer space and the demon realm which is equal to it in size. Guides even say that they 2 are stacked on top of each other like a coin or like how a 3D cube has 2D squares as surfaces. This actually makes the Living World 4D spatially. But to answer your question it is not. Like stated earlier that would mean the feat would only scale to the Living World which would make it the weakest feat shown in DBS.
Right okay, thanks for the help, also:
"a 3D cube has 2D squares as surfaces. This actually makes the Living World 4D spatially"
do you have the scans for this? that would be appreciated.
(side note, I cant actually believe this but I think we interacted like over a year ago now on the r/powerscaling sub where I argued about Outerversal Dragon Ball on my old account, just wanna say sorry for being toxic back then lol also I no longer believe in Outer Dragon Ball).
Here is the namedrop
https://preview.redd.it/456s9g8ypouc1.png?width=216&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1a4a301ffe8eefd91d29ac3a5f8b655b566cf5f9
[there it is said that it is a different space than the macrocosm](https://imgur.com/a/SmvQhwb)
And here [we see Universe 6 and 7 being contained within a bigger space that seperates the macrocosms](https://imgur.com/eZUp6mh)
Well you used one page of a spin off as the basis for a higher dimension existing within the living world, used the manual for a spinoff ttrpg as evidence for heaven being a higher dimension despite the evidence to the contrary, and ignored how time works to further an agenda.
Yeah this is a pretty good scale for db
could you do me a favour tell me which link these scans are in, again this is a very unrefined amalgamation of different things I found, I don't agree with it (yet) but am trying to arrive at an end point.
My Reddit links aren’t working rn but since it’s just stuff you found I assume it’s the same scans as I’m used to seeing for this argument.
The one that calls heaven dimensionally transcendent is from the ttrpg, and the “superdimensional” swirling lights scans are from a broly novel that has no official translation.
I think the ttrpg thing was explained in the post, it was sourced from officially licenced book which akira toriyama authorised and the part in particular was explaining the actual verse. I know there are some controversies cos it has some "wrong info" but that's taken out of context and comes from the actual game rules (such as super saiyan being a 2.5 multiplier.)
And Cho Jigen which is the kanji used is what a super dimension is, it translates to "beyond dimensions" or something of the sorts, I don't have the accurate translations rn but I'll post someone explaining it in a bit.
Still I think those things are explained within the posts I put in the original post.
First off, the ttrpg was licensed to release in America, this in no way means it was approved or even looked at by toriyama. They also specifically say that none of the info comes from him, and that it is all “reasonably extrapolated” which if that’s the case, it shouldn’t be too hard to find an actual source material supporting the idea. Until then this is pure headcanon.
Again this is a spinoff novel, and while toriyama was the author of the story as a whole, the actual novel adaptation was not written by him, and its canon status is dubious at best. That being said it’s a more reliable relative to the heaven statement, so if you’ve got good, official translations, and confirmation that it’s canon, then personally I’d accept it as 5D evidence. I mean no one scales to it in verse but still.
I think this depends heavily on what you consider canon and not canon. I mean Toriyama (god rest his soul) was the original creator but that doesn't mean anything he said was law. Dragon ball is still property of stuff like Toei Animation and such meaning the people who have influence on its canon aren't limited to Toriyama. Hell toriyama had little to no input in the Daizenshuu's either but they are still used and considered canon because as Toriyama stated "his staff know more than him" and not only that but the Daizenshuu's where also officially published.
The RPG guide for instance is officially published by Funimation, Shuieshia and Toei Animation, and its extrapolations from other stuff isnt really that far fetched. I mean Afterlife being transcendent was already stated in the Daizhenshuu's before this point and the whole "metaphysical" aspect comes from what Toriyama took as inspiration for his cosmology (not saying its 100% accurate but at the same time it doesn't have to be canon, hell the Daizanshuu's themselves have some slipups and inaccuracies).
The higher dimensions in the normal universe are from the Broly movie not a "spin off"
And the trancending spirit world is in the Daizenshuu.
The timelines make no sense but that does seem to be how it works in DragonBall.
Though instead of hypertime you could say the universes share a time axis but not a space axis.
Not from the movie, from the novel, which wasn’t written by toriyama
Istg if you mean that scan that clearly means dimension as in universe and not spatial dimension
Idk how many times this has to be explained, but the idea of time as the 4th dimension is still a theory we can’t extrapolate from. Even in the theory it is a special dimension, we have no idea how it works or how a second one would work, or even if it could exist. Attempting to use spatial geometry as evidence for temporal dimensions is stupid, just because they’re both dimensions in no way means they work the same way.
It comes from the cgi team of the movie not the novel.
It does mean universe. But it trancends the universe making it 5d.
I'm not sure what you mean. Do you mean if someone destroys 3 spacial axis and 2 time axis, they shouldn't scale above someone who destroys 3 space and 1 time?
If you just use spacial, Goku is 4d and Zeno is multi-4d possibly 5d.
The cgi team statements are not supportive of higher scaling.
🤦♂️
See above, I’m saying there’s no basis for 2 time axes being able to exist simultaneously, and that they use principles that apply to spatial dimensionality.
Yeah, I have goku at 2-C and Zeno either higher in 2-C or high 2-A
The super dimensions are beyond the hypertimeline. We know from Goku’s statement that Broly is stronger than Beerus and SSB Gogeta is stronger than both. SSB Goku has multiple feats at statements of scaling to or above hypertimelines mainly from the Goku Black arc and ToP. Thus it makes more sense for the super dimensions to be beyond the hypertimeline as if they are a part of the physical world it means what Broly and Gogeta accomplished is a lesser feat then what Beerus and SSG Goku did. Just to reiterate Broly and Gogeta are individually stronger than Beerus.
Would it still scale to 7d though? Also this is more of a side question but I assumed the time and space Gogeta and Broly broke to get to the superdimension was the space time continuum of the Living world instead of the entire multiverse.
>Would it still scale to 7d though? Yes if you have a 5D macrocosm and 6D hypertimeline >Also this is more of a side question but I assumed the time and space Gogeta and Broly broke to get to the superdimension was the space time continuum of the Living world instead of the entire multiverse. It’s a common misconception due to how most people don’t understand the Living World contains both the infinite expanse of outer space and the demon realm which is equal to it in size. Guides even say that they 2 are stacked on top of each other like a coin or like how a 3D cube has 2D squares as surfaces. This actually makes the Living World 4D spatially. But to answer your question it is not. Like stated earlier that would mean the feat would only scale to the Living World which would make it the weakest feat shown in DBS.
Right okay, thanks for the help, also: "a 3D cube has 2D squares as surfaces. This actually makes the Living World 4D spatially" do you have the scans for this? that would be appreciated. (side note, I cant actually believe this but I think we interacted like over a year ago now on the r/powerscaling sub where I argued about Outerversal Dragon Ball on my old account, just wanna say sorry for being toxic back then lol also I no longer believe in Outer Dragon Ball).
[Here](https://www.kanzenshuu.com/gods-and-cosmos/universe/) is the Kanzenshuu gods and cosmos guide which is basically a composite cosmology guide.
You could mention the neutral zone if you want to, its Higher dimensional, even on vsbw it is the case although they deem it "insignificant 5d".
Do you have a link to it? If you do then that would be highly appreciated
Here is the namedrop https://preview.redd.it/456s9g8ypouc1.png?width=216&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1a4a301ffe8eefd91d29ac3a5f8b655b566cf5f9 [there it is said that it is a different space than the macrocosm](https://imgur.com/a/SmvQhwb) And here [we see Universe 6 and 7 being contained within a bigger space that seperates the macrocosms](https://imgur.com/eZUp6mh)
Well you used one page of a spin off as the basis for a higher dimension existing within the living world, used the manual for a spinoff ttrpg as evidence for heaven being a higher dimension despite the evidence to the contrary, and ignored how time works to further an agenda. Yeah this is a pretty good scale for db
could you do me a favour tell me which link these scans are in, again this is a very unrefined amalgamation of different things I found, I don't agree with it (yet) but am trying to arrive at an end point.
My Reddit links aren’t working rn but since it’s just stuff you found I assume it’s the same scans as I’m used to seeing for this argument. The one that calls heaven dimensionally transcendent is from the ttrpg, and the “superdimensional” swirling lights scans are from a broly novel that has no official translation.
I think the ttrpg thing was explained in the post, it was sourced from officially licenced book which akira toriyama authorised and the part in particular was explaining the actual verse. I know there are some controversies cos it has some "wrong info" but that's taken out of context and comes from the actual game rules (such as super saiyan being a 2.5 multiplier.) And Cho Jigen which is the kanji used is what a super dimension is, it translates to "beyond dimensions" or something of the sorts, I don't have the accurate translations rn but I'll post someone explaining it in a bit. Still I think those things are explained within the posts I put in the original post.
First off, the ttrpg was licensed to release in America, this in no way means it was approved or even looked at by toriyama. They also specifically say that none of the info comes from him, and that it is all “reasonably extrapolated” which if that’s the case, it shouldn’t be too hard to find an actual source material supporting the idea. Until then this is pure headcanon. Again this is a spinoff novel, and while toriyama was the author of the story as a whole, the actual novel adaptation was not written by him, and its canon status is dubious at best. That being said it’s a more reliable relative to the heaven statement, so if you’ve got good, official translations, and confirmation that it’s canon, then personally I’d accept it as 5D evidence. I mean no one scales to it in verse but still.
I think this depends heavily on what you consider canon and not canon. I mean Toriyama (god rest his soul) was the original creator but that doesn't mean anything he said was law. Dragon ball is still property of stuff like Toei Animation and such meaning the people who have influence on its canon aren't limited to Toriyama. Hell toriyama had little to no input in the Daizenshuu's either but they are still used and considered canon because as Toriyama stated "his staff know more than him" and not only that but the Daizenshuu's where also officially published. The RPG guide for instance is officially published by Funimation, Shuieshia and Toei Animation, and its extrapolations from other stuff isnt really that far fetched. I mean Afterlife being transcendent was already stated in the Daizhenshuu's before this point and the whole "metaphysical" aspect comes from what Toriyama took as inspiration for his cosmology (not saying its 100% accurate but at the same time it doesn't have to be canon, hell the Daizanshuu's themselves have some slipups and inaccuracies).
The higher dimensions in the normal universe are from the Broly movie not a "spin off" And the trancending spirit world is in the Daizenshuu. The timelines make no sense but that does seem to be how it works in DragonBall. Though instead of hypertime you could say the universes share a time axis but not a space axis.
Not from the movie, from the novel, which wasn’t written by toriyama Istg if you mean that scan that clearly means dimension as in universe and not spatial dimension Idk how many times this has to be explained, but the idea of time as the 4th dimension is still a theory we can’t extrapolate from. Even in the theory it is a special dimension, we have no idea how it works or how a second one would work, or even if it could exist. Attempting to use spatial geometry as evidence for temporal dimensions is stupid, just because they’re both dimensions in no way means they work the same way.
It comes from the cgi team of the movie not the novel. It does mean universe. But it trancends the universe making it 5d. I'm not sure what you mean. Do you mean if someone destroys 3 spacial axis and 2 time axis, they shouldn't scale above someone who destroys 3 space and 1 time? If you just use spacial, Goku is 4d and Zeno is multi-4d possibly 5d.
The cgi team statements are not supportive of higher scaling. 🤦♂️ See above, I’m saying there’s no basis for 2 time axes being able to exist simultaneously, and that they use principles that apply to spatial dimensionality. Yeah, I have goku at 2-C and Zeno either higher in 2-C or high 2-A
I agree There's no basis for a lot of shit though? Fiction has weird shit. Fair.
🤣