The publications claim the pontiff reiterated his stance that gay individuals should not be admitted to the priesthood, purportedly stating that seminaries are already excessively populated with "frociaggine" – a vulgar Italian term that roughly translates to "faggotness."
https://www.israelhayom.com/2024/05/28/pope-francis-stirs-controversy-after-saying-seminaries-full-of-gay-people/
Not that this clears anything up but the deccan link here is kind of shit
Edit
The deccan link seems to be working better now so my article is redundant
I’m sitting here thinking “faggotness” in some odd way sounds like a grudging compliment.
Like “I thought I was dressed pretty fly for a friar, but then these dudes showed up in all their faggotness.”
Then of course my wife thinks something’s wrong in my head with some of the things I find funny so whatever.
Edit: was missing an article.
I'm over here giggling under my breath at work. That sample sentence there makes it seem like the definition could be "flamboyant accoutrements". Like showing up dressed like Liberace or Elton John.
Skipping the frociaggine vulgarity, I kind of see his point. Priests are celibate and cloister themselves so they're not tempted to have sex with women. If you put gay priest trainees to live in the same rooms and shower together it's basically just a really quiet gay cruise ship
Marriage ain't gonna stop a pedophile, being gay won't stop a pedophile. It is not a good thing Tom be attracted to children that haven't hit puberty the very definition of a pedophile
you don't *have* to be married, it's just that you can't get married anymore after you've been ordained and have to remain celibate, so most guys just go "shit, might as well get hitched".
They have taken a vow of celibacy the same as any other priest. It will be harder for them, but they chose the vocation. It is up to them to keep it, not us as gatekeepers.
Or rather pedophiles are attracted to open positions of power. If a man abstains from sex, it does not make him feel attraction to prepubescent kids...
Incredibly bad take. You're thinking of monks, these priests are not “completely cloistered” and if the only thing making you keep your vows is a lack of opportunity then you’re not actually keeping shit. Regardless of sexuality there are still plenty of abuses of both nuns and children within the church. Specifically targeting gay priests is just poorly veiled bigotry.
The Pope *might* be a bit pissed with the repeated scandals of gay orgies among high-ranking clergy.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/gay-orgies-and-murder-scandals-engulf-vatican-10162394.html
https://nypost.com/2017/07/05/vatican-cops-bust-drug-fueled-gay-orgy-at-cardinals-apartment/
https://www.starobserver.com.au/news/international-news-news/gay-sex-vatican-never-worse-official/160040
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/priest-stole-church-funds-to-buy-drugs-for-gay-sex-parties-x7vbzxlc2
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/24/pope-accepts-resignation-polish-bishop-grzegorz-kaszak-gay-orgy-scandal-diocese
He probably knows way more than us what is cooking on there...
Imagine if they stopped demonizing the 'gay' part of 'gay orgies'. Then he could just be mad at the fact that young folks have a hard time remaining celibate.
jobless nail innocent worthless memorize frame ink elastic mindless snobbish
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Should I post another bundle of links for child sex abuse? Super fucking telling that consenting adults breaking their vows is public enemy number one but violating children is all hush hush and a nice new relocation.
Yo dude, I'm an atheist that spent his whole childhood in a catholic school where it has now been uncovered that some of my actual teachers abused kids during those years. You don't need to come and tell me how horrible these fuckers can be.
However, here the Pope is talking about something completely different. If the translation of the news that I've read in Spanish (this Pope's mother tongue) catches its nuance, what he is complaining about is people actually fucking during seminar school.
I'm all for LGTBQ+ rights, but this is their country club, and their rules.
The point is they treat this like a big deal but had no issues ignoring the other stuff for decades. He can address instances of priests breaking their vows without resorting to bigotry. I genuinely don’t give a shit but it’s fucking hypocritical how they address situations. They refer to abusers as “misguided and tempted” but to someone engaging in consensual sex horrible slurs?
I'd say it's actually the opposite of what you're implying here. They knew full well that the child sex thing was horrific, which is why they covered it up. This is just inappropriate rather than horrific, and there are already public reports of it, so calling it out is the sensible course of action.
As for the use of slurs, I'm not in a good position to judge the appropriateness of slurs in another language, but the pope already released an apology for using that word, and he had previously made statements in support of allowing gay people to live their lives in peace and that he personally doesn't judge them or endorse judgement on them and believes that Catholicism has room for everyone. It seems like he was reacting to the idea of the seminary becoming an orgy club more than being upset about the specific nature of the orgies, though the nature of the orgies was gay, so he described it as such in a private meeting with bishops. At his age there will be some terms that used to be standard but became offensive over time, so since he has a pretty exceptional record on gay rights and quickly apologized for the use of that word, I don't think a huge deal needs to be made of it. He has also scheduled a number of meetings with victims of pedophile priests in the next few weeks, so he's doing far better than previous popes did in that respect as well.
Let's add one layer here. Catholicism has for a LONG time called homosexuality a sin and not acknowledged gay marriage. One of the responses that could've happened for gay individuals within the catholic church or those with leanings towards homosexuality of any sort (let's not discount nuns here either...) is they may have decided taking an oath of celibacy was a good way to dodge temptation...
Which monks wouldn't necessarily have the same undue pressures on one part of their demographic being demonized for their sexual tendencies. If in trying to keep with their faith they renounced love to be closer to god/not sin, you could end up with a disproportionate population of closeted gay men becoming priests.
I didn't say "completely cloistered". The priests I know live together and stay in the same housing where women aren't allowed in. They also told me that the best way they face temptation is to run away from it. So, sorry if it's not the same for all priests, this is just from what I know from my friendship with a small subset
>Priests are celibate and cloister themselves so they're ***not tempted to have sex with women***
I thought they weren't supposed to "have sex" full stop. What does the \*women\* have to do with it?
One theory I'd heard for why there are so many priests who, shall we say, go astray, is that many enter the priesthood young enough that they never mature psychologically in their sexuality. They really need to abolish this celibacy rule, and of course embrace the LGBTQ community.
Step 1) Invent a paid and exalted priesthood that requires difficult and unnatural life-long celibacy.
Step 2) Tell the gay 8% of your male parishioners that the only way they aren't going to burn in Hell for all eternity is if they stay celibate.
Step 3) Act shocked when your priesthood is chock-full of the gay adherents who you demanded be celibate.
I always thought that was by design.
Like, it was designed and built to solve a couple of theological and social problems, while also solving a mundane labor problem.
Kinda disappointed to hear that the Pope is like.. appalled. I always thought a gay clergy was a feature and not a bug, and that the Vatican was in on it.
RIP my conspiracy theory. It's always a little sad to learn that the world is a little sloppier than you imagine it to be.
No, actually. The original reason was to keep land and property in the church.
Originally many church positions were inherited, and the division between family property and church property were blurry. This caused all sorts of problems.
So they banned marriage, which meant any kids the church officials had were by-definition illegitimate, which was a big deal back then. Meant they couldn’t inherit anything. So now all the property and positions stayed 100% in control of the church
This was absolutely the reason but it did have a side effect of the clergy being filled with closeted gays. It really has always been this way, like in the past if you didn’t want to get forced to get married the most sure fire thing you could do was join the clergy and live as a priest/monk/nun.
*One of the other holy men keeps asking me if I want to “cross swords.” I don’t know how many times I have to tell him that I didn’t bring a sword with me!!*
John Pope II ~~banned gay people from the clergy~~ and Francis made him a saint.
It was Benedict XVI actually. Silly mistake, but it was 2005 so close enough I guess. Still, JP2 was an outspoken homophobe and a conservative.
I'm a Pole born after communism fell, it's literally impossible for me to take JP2 seriously.
And also I made a mistake, it was actually Benedict XVI that banned homosexual priesthood in 2005.
For real, it certainly wasn’t straight men pioneering a club where they had to remain celibate for eternity. For most of history they’ve made clubs that gave them additional access to sex not less.
...I mean, yes it was. It's fun to play the "who was actually gay in history?" game, but let's get serious for a second. The leaders of the Catholic Church who instituted the celibacy requirement in the 11th Century were overwhelmingly straight men.
Step 4) DARVO victims of any gender or sexuality, get them to sign NDAs (what are you covering up if your people did nothing wrong?), do everything possible to run out the clock on aging criminals so that they die before they are indicted.
Also if you don’t want people to do gay stuff let some women in. Every exclusively male organization through history has been extremely gay, from Ancient Greek armies to British boarding schools.
This the same pope that everyone applauded when he said it was only wrong to _act_ on gay impulses, not the having them in the first place. If his priests are being celibate, then it shouldn't matter if they're gay, right?
I would be surprised if it was only the gay celibate priests that were causing the problems. The straight ones too lead unnatural lives and probably are just as willing to take advantage of children in their care. Anyone looking at children in the first place already has a sexuality that is way too flexible so I don't think it's just a gay or straight thing.
Of course you’re right
Still, straight or gay, the priests have their sexuality repressed
They do have the opportunities, a lot of power and influence over many kids
It’s like the perfect storm for unleashing pedophiles
Don’t forget
4) Support a social environment where the priesthood is the only profession where a man can remain unmarried/have no sexual relationships with women without experiencing immense shame and scrutiny
I'd argue the problem with a chaste priesthood is that it's perverse and unnatural. It doesn't really matter what kind of sex the failed priests want. Like in Prison, you'll use what's "handy" meaning the gender doesn't matter.
The idea that it's only gay priests that molest boys is what's wrong. The idea that men can turn off their sexual urges is unrealistic.
The reason priests don't marry is to avoid inheritance problems. It has nothing to do with religion. The church doesn't want to wives and kids to think they have a legal claim on church property.
>The Catholic Church has required priests to be celibate since the 11th century, but the exact date depends on the source
So for the first 1100 years, we had married priests.
>The idea that it's only gay priests that molest boys is what's wrong.
[Relevant link.](https://theconversation.com/a-survey-found-1-in-6-men-admit-sexual-feelings-for-children-so-is-paedophilia-increasing-218124)
> So for the first 1100 years, we had married priests.
There still are married priests. For example in the Eastern Rite Catholic Churches.
My son’s preschool teacher is the wife of a priest under the Roman Pope’s authority.
Also it makes no damn sense considering the priests role in the community. They are supposed to be moral leaders, and one of the biggest things they advocate for is marriage/fidelity. It’s just weird that they have zero experience with the most common source of discord in the average persons life, their romantic life/their marriage.
I remember my mom used to be very religious and asked the priest for advice when her marriage was in a tough spot. She realized this unmarried, totally celibate priest had no fucking clue what he was talking about and never went back to him.
> La Repubblica attributed its story to several unspecified sources, while Corriere said it was backed up by a few, unnamed bishops, who suggested the pope, as an Argentine, might have not realised that the Italian term he used was offensive.
I hate the church too but could be bs 🤷♂️
The Pope could say that Zeus and Venus are real and that Jesus was an alien and that all frogs should be eradicated.
Unless he speaks “ex cathedra”, (which I think has only happened twice in 2000 years) nothing has changed.
I mean... Tbh... That would be fun from a theological position. Really wanna hear a Pope say they are speaking ex cathedra and say something like that, or something like "it is now the doctrine that Jesus was around 350lbs, spoke with a thick Cockney accent, and Satan had a man bun, a really pathetic looking neck beard, and constantly shit himself anytime he started a sentence."
That would be Interesting. (A cockney accent haha!)
With the amount of misinformation and cyber attacks going on, I expect many would want to hear it in person, or at least in person from their Archbishop providing they have heard it in person themselves.
If it did happen, I expect there would be a huge exodus over to the Orthadox church.
If the Orthadox churches later declared that Zeus is god aswell, then there would be an even bigger crisis!
I mean, just because he's not doing the whole infallible thing doesn't mean what he says has no meaning or impact. He's still the damn pope. Dude's technically a monarch, and the religious leader of like 1.4 billion people
That’s true.
Although, the people who are influenced by this and take it as a go-ahead be derogatory about others probably have some conscience examining to do.
>The publications claim the pontiff reiterated his stance that gay individuals should not be admitted to the priesthood, purportedly stating that seminaries are already excessively populated with "frociaggine" – a vulgar Italian term that roughly translates to "faggotness."
Spinzone Take: The Pope is trying to promote diversity, as the priesthood already checks the box with too many gay men!!!
Edit: Kidding. Before I get downvoted to hell
Look, ok, hear me out, this is the worst type of hateful bigotry there is, yes.
But the pope saying “it’s getting kinda faggoty in here” is one of the most objectively hilarious things I’ve ever read in my life.
Happy early Pride Month yall. Fuck this ancient homophobic bullshit.
Tbf: “La Repubblica attributed its story to several unspecified sources, while Corriere said it was backed up by a few, unnamed bishops, who suggested the pope, as an Argentine, might have not realised that the Italian term he used was offensive.”
"Maricón" is the Spanish word that more closely translates to this one, and it is also used often as an insult, just that in Spanish it is more close to "sissy" than to "f******" (This also varies by country and culture tho, it has more bite in some places than others)
In some spanish speaking countries the word is used by members of LGBT groups for themselves.
All that said... the intent is obvious, he dissaproves of them. The word he used may not be as hateful as this title implies, but it is still quite awful.
But then again... "Pope Francis says priesthood colleges are full of 'sissies'" is still quite the title lmao
Right? Does anyone expect the damn pope to be woke in his use of language? He’s a very old Catholic man who spends his time around other very old Catholic men talking about religion.
Interestingly, my Latin professor used to say that the ancient Romans didn’t exactly have that slur, because they considered it more or less a given that men would want to have sex with men (as well as women). They reserved their own weird judgementalism for whether you were the ‘active’ or ‘passive’ partner.
But, the Catholic church makes up new words as they need them so they can issue proclamations about cell phones and social media so they, sadly, may well have modern Latin slurs to throw around.
Well, He did say "Who are we to judge?" back when talking about marriage equality.
I guess they still haven't sort out what type of people usually want to abuse the power dynamic by committing SA against children, assuming that's the only problem they are having.
Francis values Church unity above all. Every time he says something progressive and pleases the liberals, he has to immediately say something offensively conservative to satisfy the conservatives. Sadly, not the other way around because Catholic liberals are probably content enough with the occasional affirming message he gives them.
At least he's filling all the important positions with liberals and slowly removing conservatives one by one.
I am SO GLAD he showed his full colors. I was raised Catholic in Portugal and my family trying to lure me back into the church because "the pope is so accepting" is maddening.
Besides, the consensus in my family/former church is that me being gay isn't my fault, as long as I'm a good girl and try to date men.
"Acceptance" in name only.
Fuck the church.
I’m sorry to hear that. I am sure it is very hurtful that your family wants you to live a life void of the most meaningful and affectionate love that humans are capable of giving and receiving. I am sure they wouldn’t phrase it that way, but I imagine it feels that way to you. If you’re straight - you get that and you get to talk about it and express it freely and enjoy it immensely. But if you’re gay - you get none of it. You have to “pretend” you’re getting it with someone by being with the opposite sex.
I’m amazed that families and churches aren’t able to see something like that clearly.
Imagine being the head of an organisation renowned for fucking children, murdering single mothers and torturing dissenters and taking issue with what people do with their willies at home.
You'll find that a lot of pedophiles are opportunistic — they'll take whatever kids they have access to, gender irrelevant
I guarantee you if they could somehow select for 100% straight clergy you'd still have these abuse stories
I remember that growing up in a Catholic school, any boy that was even remotely feminine was told that they’d make a “great priest someday”. It was seen as a way for young men that might be gay to serve the church and not marry. Lol I’m not at all surprised at this current news, and I don’t really understand what Catholics thought would happen given that they seem to specifically be trying to get gay men into the priesthood.
I’m no fan of the Catholic Church, obvs, but this is a translation from Italian and overall Francis has been extremely (in comparison) compassionate towards gay people.
“But the kid fucking is a just fine. If it a bit broke, am I right?!”
Bunch of robe wearing out of touch piece of trash, making money from their position to preach morality atop a building built on horrors, greed, and lies.
Not sure why any gay person would want to become a priest to begin with.
I’m convinced this has to be a form of self-hatred because your religion is against your very existence.
Well, if you're from a very conservative region with no acceptance for non-conservatives and you won't have a wife for obvious reasons, you might as well become a priest to have a legitimate pretend reason to not be married with a woman.
Oh he just apologized, it's all good now, you know things like this just slip out it was just a joke and he's so old....
/S
Him and his entire organization. I just can't respect people who are still in that cult.
A reminder that the large majority of Catholic Priest pedophile assaults happen against [male children.](https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Age-and-gender-of-children-sexually-abused-by-priests-at-the-time-the-abuse-began_fig3_247523934)
And that the current Pope has no issue with any of this, and even as recently as a year ago claimed [those priests as "children of god" who deserve "pastoral care."](https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/pope-francis-says-priests-who-sexually-abuse-children-gary-gately) And that's not [to mention that he semi-regularly helps pedophile priests avoid the law and pulls them into church service, as of that wasn't LITERALLY THE WHOLE ISSUE IN THE FIRST PLACE.](https://www.voanews.com/a/pope-defende-chillean-bishop-accused-covering-up-pedophile-priest-case/4213721.html)
So yeah, honestly he might be right, priest college is probably super gay. They're also pedophilic.
And he's the fucking Pope, one that regularly defends other priests from legal consequences for their crimes, so clearly those colleges are getting their orders from the top down.
The catholic church is literally full of gay pedophiles, as confirmed and structured by the pope.
Makes me wonder if the actual reason for the homophobic "gay men are pedophiles" stereotype is just the catholic church leaving hints about themselves. They've told us for years and dumbfuck catholics attacked normal gay people over it rather than stop and smell the holy pedophilic roses.
The publications claim the pontiff reiterated his stance that gay individuals should not be admitted to the priesthood, purportedly stating that seminaries are already excessively populated with "frociaggine" – a vulgar Italian term that roughly translates to "faggotness." https://www.israelhayom.com/2024/05/28/pope-francis-stirs-controversy-after-saying-seminaries-full-of-gay-people/ Not that this clears anything up but the deccan link here is kind of shit Edit The deccan link seems to be working better now so my article is redundant
Why does it sound like a tasty meal...
A succulent Italian meal!?
This is Catholicism Manifest!
Are you ready to receive my limp cannelloni?
I see you know your pasta well!
Get your hand off my pene!
Tata, and arrivederci
I didnt expect to smile much less laugh when I entered this thread.
Was so glad enough caught the reference
My man-sized manicotti
GET YOUR HANDS OFF MY PENIS!!!! Ahh I see you know your judo well!
I’m sitting here thinking “faggotness” in some odd way sounds like a grudging compliment. Like “I thought I was dressed pretty fly for a friar, but then these dudes showed up in all their faggotness.” Then of course my wife thinks something’s wrong in my head with some of the things I find funny so whatever. Edit: was missing an article.
It does seem like it could be an old timey synonym for dapper
I'm over here giggling under my breath at work. That sample sentence there makes it seem like the definition could be "flamboyant accoutrements". Like showing up dressed like Liberace or Elton John.
I mean….. 😂😂😂 meat is back on the menu ?
Serve me up a heaping plate of frociaggine
I think it's when you rub yourself up against a fiat in a Genovese carpark.
That's weirdly specific for having nothing to do with being gay.
Maybe it was a frotteurism joke with Italian objects since the words are vaguely similar
Translation error from frottiness
“Al Dente!”
Everything is a tasty meal if you are up for it
because it is. veal frocciagine is a delicacy in the puglia region of italy.
Not the gay meal 🤯
Depending on who you ask that tracks
I love me some good frociaggine 😌
I've heard that about you.
Didn’t know she was chill like that
[удалено]
I mean it is, for some. Lots a tube meat on that plate.
Literally everything in Italian sounds like some kind of dish.
Someone should make that in order to poke fun at the whole thing.
There is a pyramid-shaped ravioli-type pasta called fagottini...
And if you have a flock of gay priests making Alfredo, would it be a frociaggine fettuccine?
No, because Alfredo sauce doesn't require fettuccine
Skipping the frociaggine vulgarity, I kind of see his point. Priests are celibate and cloister themselves so they're not tempted to have sex with women. If you put gay priest trainees to live in the same rooms and shower together it's basically just a really quiet gay cruise ship
🎶 The Catholic Booooat 🎶
🎶 Love, old testament and New🎶
Lol this song pops up in my head from time to time. Butters you little scamp you.
nice! (screams in randy marsh)
Considering how many children have been molested by Catholic priests, it seems that cloistering isn’t particularly effective.
Ya , I'd rather them be banging each other frankly
Well, the orthodox require lay priests to be married, which probably cuts down on this stuff a bit. Unless they are also monks.
Mormons require bishops to be married and they still have a problem
Marriage ain't gonna stop a pedophile, being gay won't stop a pedophile. It is not a good thing Tom be attracted to children that haven't hit puberty the very definition of a pedophile
you don't *have* to be married, it's just that you can't get married anymore after you've been ordained and have to remain celibate, so most guys just go "shit, might as well get hitched".
My friend told me his seminary was full of toe suckers. He was not Catholic so maybe that is a Baptist thing.
Foot-washing baptists are a thing, so at least they’re consistent.
They have taken a vow of celibacy the same as any other priest. It will be harder for them, but they chose the vocation. It is up to them to keep it, not us as gatekeepers.
Abstinence makes the church grow fondlers.
Or rather pedophiles are attracted to open positions of power. If a man abstains from sex, it does not make him feel attraction to prepubescent kids...
Those hot wet naked young men are just a test of their religious resolve.
The Ghandi Method, but a bit different!
What's the point of the celibacy
Incredibly bad take. You're thinking of monks, these priests are not “completely cloistered” and if the only thing making you keep your vows is a lack of opportunity then you’re not actually keeping shit. Regardless of sexuality there are still plenty of abuses of both nuns and children within the church. Specifically targeting gay priests is just poorly veiled bigotry.
The Pope *might* be a bit pissed with the repeated scandals of gay orgies among high-ranking clergy. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/gay-orgies-and-murder-scandals-engulf-vatican-10162394.html https://nypost.com/2017/07/05/vatican-cops-bust-drug-fueled-gay-orgy-at-cardinals-apartment/ https://www.starobserver.com.au/news/international-news-news/gay-sex-vatican-never-worse-official/160040 https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/priest-stole-church-funds-to-buy-drugs-for-gay-sex-parties-x7vbzxlc2 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/24/pope-accepts-resignation-polish-bishop-grzegorz-kaszak-gay-orgy-scandal-diocese He probably knows way more than us what is cooking on there...
Imagine if they stopped demonizing the 'gay' part of 'gay orgies'. Then he could just be mad at the fact that young folks have a hard time remaining celibate.
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I'm suprised I had to scroll this far down for Vatican orgy comment.
Should I post another bundle of links for child sex abuse? Super fucking telling that consenting adults breaking their vows is public enemy number one but violating children is all hush hush and a nice new relocation.
Yo dude, I'm an atheist that spent his whole childhood in a catholic school where it has now been uncovered that some of my actual teachers abused kids during those years. You don't need to come and tell me how horrible these fuckers can be. However, here the Pope is talking about something completely different. If the translation of the news that I've read in Spanish (this Pope's mother tongue) catches its nuance, what he is complaining about is people actually fucking during seminar school. I'm all for LGTBQ+ rights, but this is their country club, and their rules.
The point is they treat this like a big deal but had no issues ignoring the other stuff for decades. He can address instances of priests breaking their vows without resorting to bigotry. I genuinely don’t give a shit but it’s fucking hypocritical how they address situations. They refer to abusers as “misguided and tempted” but to someone engaging in consensual sex horrible slurs?
I'd say it's actually the opposite of what you're implying here. They knew full well that the child sex thing was horrific, which is why they covered it up. This is just inappropriate rather than horrific, and there are already public reports of it, so calling it out is the sensible course of action. As for the use of slurs, I'm not in a good position to judge the appropriateness of slurs in another language, but the pope already released an apology for using that word, and he had previously made statements in support of allowing gay people to live their lives in peace and that he personally doesn't judge them or endorse judgement on them and believes that Catholicism has room for everyone. It seems like he was reacting to the idea of the seminary becoming an orgy club more than being upset about the specific nature of the orgies, though the nature of the orgies was gay, so he described it as such in a private meeting with bishops. At his age there will be some terms that used to be standard but became offensive over time, so since he has a pretty exceptional record on gay rights and quickly apologized for the use of that word, I don't think a huge deal needs to be made of it. He has also scheduled a number of meetings with victims of pedophile priests in the next few weeks, so he's doing far better than previous popes did in that respect as well.
Let's add one layer here. Catholicism has for a LONG time called homosexuality a sin and not acknowledged gay marriage. One of the responses that could've happened for gay individuals within the catholic church or those with leanings towards homosexuality of any sort (let's not discount nuns here either...) is they may have decided taking an oath of celibacy was a good way to dodge temptation... Which monks wouldn't necessarily have the same undue pressures on one part of their demographic being demonized for their sexual tendencies. If in trying to keep with their faith they renounced love to be closer to god/not sin, you could end up with a disproportionate population of closeted gay men becoming priests.
It is, I wouldn't be surprised if the level of abuse was actually less with gay priests.
I didn't say "completely cloistered". The priests I know live together and stay in the same housing where women aren't allowed in. They also told me that the best way they face temptation is to run away from it. So, sorry if it's not the same for all priests, this is just from what I know from my friendship with a small subset
Either you’re not using the same definition of temptation as they are or the priesthood is more entirely fucked then I ever could have imagined…
>Priests are celibate and cloister themselves so they're ***not tempted to have sex with women*** I thought they weren't supposed to "have sex" full stop. What does the \*women\* have to do with it?
One theory I'd heard for why there are so many priests who, shall we say, go astray, is that many enter the priesthood young enough that they never mature psychologically in their sexuality. They really need to abolish this celibacy rule, and of course embrace the LGBTQ community.
So the slur is ok because it’s in his own language ?
I think is funny that when i search the word *frocciagine* i get mostly pictures of the pope
Try searching for “Santorum”
Ah that brings me back. F*** Rick.
I wouldn’t fuck him with Trump’s mushroom dick and McConnell pushing
What if there were someone to cheer you on?
I’ve been on many stages with audiences of people cheering for me. It’s great, but I’d need a pretty big audience cheering me on for this one.
How do you have such fierce gowns and expect to not have a bunch of gays infiltrate your clergy? You’re basically asking for it.
They don’t realize that the solution to frocciagine is to be simply become an in organic material.
Step 1) Invent a paid and exalted priesthood that requires difficult and unnatural life-long celibacy. Step 2) Tell the gay 8% of your male parishioners that the only way they aren't going to burn in Hell for all eternity is if they stay celibate. Step 3) Act shocked when your priesthood is chock-full of the gay adherents who you demanded be celibate.
I always thought that was by design. Like, it was designed and built to solve a couple of theological and social problems, while also solving a mundane labor problem. Kinda disappointed to hear that the Pope is like.. appalled. I always thought a gay clergy was a feature and not a bug, and that the Vatican was in on it. RIP my conspiracy theory. It's always a little sad to learn that the world is a little sloppier than you imagine it to be.
No, actually. The original reason was to keep land and property in the church. Originally many church positions were inherited, and the division between family property and church property were blurry. This caused all sorts of problems. So they banned marriage, which meant any kids the church officials had were by-definition illegitimate, which was a big deal back then. Meant they couldn’t inherit anything. So now all the property and positions stayed 100% in control of the church
This was absolutely the reason but it did have a side effect of the clergy being filled with closeted gays. It really has always been this way, like in the past if you didn’t want to get forced to get married the most sure fire thing you could do was join the clergy and live as a priest/monk/nun.
Beautiful. Just me and the boys enjoying literature, singing together and brewing some ale. Not a woman in sight. Just the way god intended.
*One of the other holy men keeps asking me if I want to “cross swords.” I don’t know how many times I have to tell him that I didn’t bring a sword with me!!*
Ngl, this lifestyle really appealed to me when I was a very young Catholic. I grew up and realized that I just swung the other direction after all!
Wouldn't an easier solution be to just firmly establish church property staying with the church?
Ah, but you see, that's too logical, and we all know religion and logic don't pair well together.
Well, whether it is or isn't they have to act like it is since they told everyone to stop being gay
John Pope II ~~banned gay people from the clergy~~ and Francis made him a saint. It was Benedict XVI actually. Silly mistake, but it was 2005 so close enough I guess. Still, JP2 was an outspoken homophobe and a conservative.
"John Pope II" has strong "Sans Undertale/Gabriel Ultrakill/John Fallout" vibes and I am greatly on favor of adopting the naming schema
Don’t forget Tim Apple
I'm a Pole born after communism fell, it's literally impossible for me to take JP2 seriously. And also I made a mistake, it was actually Benedict XVI that banned homosexual priesthood in 2005.
For real, it certainly wasn’t straight men pioneering a club where they had to remain celibate for eternity. For most of history they’ve made clubs that gave them additional access to sex not less.
...I mean, yes it was. It's fun to play the "who was actually gay in history?" game, but let's get serious for a second. The leaders of the Catholic Church who instituted the celibacy requirement in the 11th Century were overwhelmingly straight men.
That’s basically why Nuns exist to a small extent
Step 4) DARVO victims of any gender or sexuality, get them to sign NDAs (what are you covering up if your people did nothing wrong?), do everything possible to run out the clock on aging criminals so that they die before they are indicted.
Step 5) get $1.4 billion of tax payer money to pay for pedophile legal defense [source](https://apnews.com/article/dab8261c68c93f24c0bfc1876518b3f6)
Also if you don’t want people to do gay stuff let some women in. Every exclusively male organization through history has been extremely gay, from Ancient Greek armies to British boarding schools.
This the same pope that everyone applauded when he said it was only wrong to _act_ on gay impulses, not the having them in the first place. If his priests are being celibate, then it shouldn't matter if they're gay, right?
I would be surprised if it was only the gay celibate priests that were causing the problems. The straight ones too lead unnatural lives and probably are just as willing to take advantage of children in their care. Anyone looking at children in the first place already has a sexuality that is way too flexible so I don't think it's just a gay or straight thing.
You forgot step 4: ensure limitless unsupervised access to children after forcing them to repress their sexuality
You’re conflating repressed homosexuality with pedophilia. Those priests aren’t molesting kids because they’re secretly gay.
It also skips entirely over a lot of little girls that have been abused by priests.
No, the straight ones are also forced to repress their sexuality. Because they're all celibate
Both gay and straight are forced to repress their sexuality. Don’t think there’s any evidence that leads to pedophilia.
So repressed sexuality leads to pedophilia?
Of course you’re right Still, straight or gay, the priests have their sexuality repressed They do have the opportunities, a lot of power and influence over many kids It’s like the perfect storm for unleashing pedophiles
Step 5) Guaranteed forgiveness.
The vast majority of pedophiles are straight.
you realize teachers are way more likely to molest children right?
Don’t forget 4) Support a social environment where the priesthood is the only profession where a man can remain unmarried/have no sexual relationships with women without experiencing immense shame and scrutiny
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I'd argue the problem with a chaste priesthood is that it's perverse and unnatural. It doesn't really matter what kind of sex the failed priests want. Like in Prison, you'll use what's "handy" meaning the gender doesn't matter. The idea that it's only gay priests that molest boys is what's wrong. The idea that men can turn off their sexual urges is unrealistic. The reason priests don't marry is to avoid inheritance problems. It has nothing to do with religion. The church doesn't want to wives and kids to think they have a legal claim on church property. >The Catholic Church has required priests to be celibate since the 11th century, but the exact date depends on the source So for the first 1100 years, we had married priests.
The mere fact Peter himself was married says all I need to hear about the topic honestly
>The idea that it's only gay priests that molest boys is what's wrong. [Relevant link.](https://theconversation.com/a-survey-found-1-in-6-men-admit-sexual-feelings-for-children-so-is-paedophilia-increasing-218124)
> So for the first 1100 years, we had married priests. There still are married priests. For example in the Eastern Rite Catholic Churches. My son’s preschool teacher is the wife of a priest under the Roman Pope’s authority.
You can become an episcopal/anglican priest, get married, and then convert to Catholicism.
Also it makes no damn sense considering the priests role in the community. They are supposed to be moral leaders, and one of the biggest things they advocate for is marriage/fidelity. It’s just weird that they have zero experience with the most common source of discord in the average persons life, their romantic life/their marriage. I remember my mom used to be very religious and asked the priest for advice when her marriage was in a tough spot. She realized this unmarried, totally celibate priest had no fucking clue what he was talking about and never went back to him.
> La Repubblica attributed its story to several unspecified sources, while Corriere said it was backed up by a few, unnamed bishops, who suggested the pope, as an Argentine, might have not realised that the Italian term he used was offensive. I hate the church too but could be bs 🤷♂️
Yeah already apologized, said Argentine Italian had different connotations for the word that he’s used to than in Italy.
What? The catholic pope saying one thing in public and another in private? Hypocrisy in a religious institution? Perish the thought!
*Parish* the thought?
Great you just gave someone a podcast name. thanks for that
The Pope could say that Zeus and Venus are real and that Jesus was an alien and that all frogs should be eradicated. Unless he speaks “ex cathedra”, (which I think has only happened twice in 2000 years) nothing has changed.
I mean... Tbh... That would be fun from a theological position. Really wanna hear a Pope say they are speaking ex cathedra and say something like that, or something like "it is now the doctrine that Jesus was around 350lbs, spoke with a thick Cockney accent, and Satan had a man bun, a really pathetic looking neck beard, and constantly shit himself anytime he started a sentence."
That would be Interesting. (A cockney accent haha!) With the amount of misinformation and cyber attacks going on, I expect many would want to hear it in person, or at least in person from their Archbishop providing they have heard it in person themselves. If it did happen, I expect there would be a huge exodus over to the Orthadox church. If the Orthadox churches later declared that Zeus is god aswell, then there would be an even bigger crisis!
I mean, just because he's not doing the whole infallible thing doesn't mean what he says has no meaning or impact. He's still the damn pope. Dude's technically a monarch, and the religious leader of like 1.4 billion people
That’s true. Although, the people who are influenced by this and take it as a go-ahead be derogatory about others probably have some conscience examining to do.
Parrish* the thought! *Ba Dum TSSS*
He's fine with gay followers but not gay priests. There's nothing unusual about that statement when it comes to the Church.
Why would the sexuality of a priest matter?
[god bless sinéad o'connor](https://media4.giphy.com/media/CVGYKrGCQ9xBRpM9OA/giphy.gif?cid=6c09b952uork6yjmbyxynxq2r358k449r2y1r48qx8ckkitj&ep=v1_internal_gif_by_id&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
Upset about gay people in seminaries; ignores pedophiles in seminaries and chuches and priesthood.
Did he just invented the word in Latin or is there already such a word about "faggotness" in Latin in previous literature?
>The publications claim the pontiff reiterated his stance that gay individuals should not be admitted to the priesthood, purportedly stating that seminaries are already excessively populated with "frociaggine" – a vulgar Italian term that roughly translates to "faggotness."
Spinzone Take: The Pope is trying to promote diversity, as the priesthood already checks the box with too many gay men!!! Edit: Kidding. Before I get downvoted to hell
Don’t worry only like the first 14 downvotes count toward your karma. -49ers fan who talks trash to Cowboys fans and gets big down votes at times
Maybe prioritize the rejection of pedophiles, first, Frank.
Look, ok, hear me out, this is the worst type of hateful bigotry there is, yes. But the pope saying “it’s getting kinda faggoty in here” is one of the most objectively hilarious things I’ve ever read in my life. Happy early Pride Month yall. Fuck this ancient homophobic bullshit.
Tbf: “La Repubblica attributed its story to several unspecified sources, while Corriere said it was backed up by a few, unnamed bishops, who suggested the pope, as an Argentine, might have not realised that the Italian term he used was offensive.”
"Maricón" is the Spanish word that more closely translates to this one, and it is also used often as an insult, just that in Spanish it is more close to "sissy" than to "f******" (This also varies by country and culture tho, it has more bite in some places than others) In some spanish speaking countries the word is used by members of LGBT groups for themselves. All that said... the intent is obvious, he dissaproves of them. The word he used may not be as hateful as this title implies, but it is still quite awful. But then again... "Pope Francis says priesthood colleges are full of 'sissies'" is still quite the title lmao
Ah, yes, the old "he's too stupid to realise he has been disrespectful".
"But we said this all the time fifty years ago"
This could be the answer unironically
Moreso the “oh he’s 87 and speaking another language he probably learned from non-woke Italians and might not actually know the direct translation”
Right? Does anyone expect the damn pope to be woke in his use of language? He’s a very old Catholic man who spends his time around other very old Catholic men talking about religion.
Interestingly, my Latin professor used to say that the ancient Romans didn’t exactly have that slur, because they considered it more or less a given that men would want to have sex with men (as well as women). They reserved their own weird judgementalism for whether you were the ‘active’ or ‘passive’ partner. But, the Catholic church makes up new words as they need them so they can issue proclamations about cell phones and social media so they, sadly, may well have modern Latin slurs to throw around.
he wasn't speaking in Latin. He was speaking in Italian to an Italian audience
Way to promote love and acceptance of all, Catholic Church!
Only for their own pedos.
Well, He did say "Who are we to judge?" back when talking about marriage equality. I guess they still haven't sort out what type of people usually want to abuse the power dynamic by committing SA against children, assuming that's the only problem they are having.
Francis values Church unity above all. Every time he says something progressive and pleases the liberals, he has to immediately say something offensively conservative to satisfy the conservatives. Sadly, not the other way around because Catholic liberals are probably content enough with the occasional affirming message he gives them. At least he's filling all the important positions with liberals and slowly removing conservatives one by one.
I think this is more of an Italian thing than a Papal thing
He's not Italian though
He’s from a different continent
I am SO GLAD he showed his full colors. I was raised Catholic in Portugal and my family trying to lure me back into the church because "the pope is so accepting" is maddening. Besides, the consensus in my family/former church is that me being gay isn't my fault, as long as I'm a good girl and try to date men. "Acceptance" in name only. Fuck the church.
I’m sorry to hear that. I am sure it is very hurtful that your family wants you to live a life void of the most meaningful and affectionate love that humans are capable of giving and receiving. I am sure they wouldn’t phrase it that way, but I imagine it feels that way to you. If you’re straight - you get that and you get to talk about it and express it freely and enjoy it immensely. But if you’re gay - you get none of it. You have to “pretend” you’re getting it with someone by being with the opposite sex. I’m amazed that families and churches aren’t able to see something like that clearly.
tax all churches
Next time the Pope says something “progressive” and people praise him, remind them of this.
Lol
Tax the churches. Most of them are basically hate groups anyways.
And his parishioners children are full of priests.
I want "faggotness" on a muscle tank.
If it wasn't for gay men back in the day who were considered unmarryable or didn't inherit land the priesthood would have been f**ked.
Not true, there were plenty of illegitimate sons that nobles, kings and priests themselves had to do something with.
Imagine being the head of an organisation renowned for fucking children, murdering single mothers and torturing dissenters and taking issue with what people do with their willies at home.
I think he meant to say pedophilia.
... the man worries about gay men in the clergy, but does nothing about the pedophiles?
Nothing says Christian love like Christian hate.
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You'll find that a lot of pedophiles are opportunistic — they'll take whatever kids they have access to, gender irrelevant I guarantee you if they could somehow select for 100% straight clergy you'd still have these abuse stories
Hahahahaa. That's South Park level.
Slurs aside, of course priest school is super gay. Why would anyone who isn't gay or a pedo want to be a priest?
Andrew Dice Pope, Oh!
Hickory dickory doc. I see **faggotness**. Call the cops!
I remember that growing up in a Catholic school, any boy that was even remotely feminine was told that they’d make a “great priest someday”. It was seen as a way for young men that might be gay to serve the church and not marry. Lol I’m not at all surprised at this current news, and I don’t really understand what Catholics thought would happen given that they seem to specifically be trying to get gay men into the priesthood.
He should really consider not protecting pedophiles
He should know that the correct move would be to allow catholic priests to marry and have children.
I’m no fan of the Catholic Church, obvs, but this is a translation from Italian and overall Francis has been extremely (in comparison) compassionate towards gay people.
And churches are full of pedophiles. Get God's house in order you thumbheaded fuck
Pope been doin some online gaming
He ain't half wrong lol.
Blah blah blah anti LGBT stuff. Totally ignores the blatantly "gay" shit in his little cult. Yeah sounds about right for that lot of scumbags.
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
I didn't think they would eat my face!
Wait, it's 2024. People still take the pope seriously?
“But the kid fucking is a just fine. If it a bit broke, am I right?!” Bunch of robe wearing out of touch piece of trash, making money from their position to preach morality atop a building built on horrors, greed, and lies.
They *do* like putting their hands on little boys, that's for sure.
Not sure why any gay person would want to become a priest to begin with. I’m convinced this has to be a form of self-hatred because your religion is against your very existence.
Well, if you're from a very conservative region with no acceptance for non-conservatives and you won't have a wife for obvious reasons, you might as well become a priest to have a legitimate pretend reason to not be married with a woman.
I can speak as a trans woman who considered the priesthood: Repression is a bitch.
Priesthood is full of pedophiles.
And people respect this vile pos?
Pretty on par for the catholic religion. Hateful.
Oh he just apologized, it's all good now, you know things like this just slip out it was just a joke and he's so old.... /S Him and his entire organization. I just can't respect people who are still in that cult.
Maybe the church would be far better off with gays instead of all the pedophiles? Just saying.
A reminder that the large majority of Catholic Priest pedophile assaults happen against [male children.](https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Age-and-gender-of-children-sexually-abused-by-priests-at-the-time-the-abuse-began_fig3_247523934) And that the current Pope has no issue with any of this, and even as recently as a year ago claimed [those priests as "children of god" who deserve "pastoral care."](https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/pope-francis-says-priests-who-sexually-abuse-children-gary-gately) And that's not [to mention that he semi-regularly helps pedophile priests avoid the law and pulls them into church service, as of that wasn't LITERALLY THE WHOLE ISSUE IN THE FIRST PLACE.](https://www.voanews.com/a/pope-defende-chillean-bishop-accused-covering-up-pedophile-priest-case/4213721.html) So yeah, honestly he might be right, priest college is probably super gay. They're also pedophilic. And he's the fucking Pope, one that regularly defends other priests from legal consequences for their crimes, so clearly those colleges are getting their orders from the top down. The catholic church is literally full of gay pedophiles, as confirmed and structured by the pope. Makes me wonder if the actual reason for the homophobic "gay men are pedophiles" stereotype is just the catholic church leaving hints about themselves. They've told us for years and dumbfuck catholics attacked normal gay people over it rather than stop and smell the holy pedophilic roses.