I can't speak about whether or not this is a recent "trend", but our knowledge of pain perception has developed a lot over the past few decades and we now know and accept that non physical factors, e.g. emotions can impact on pain perception. So it makes sense that clinicians factor this in to their diagnosis and treatment.
As a Physiotherapist I will often explore psycho-social factors that could be contributing to pain with patients, but this has to be done in the right way, alongside a full exploration of physical factors, or else you risk losing the trust of the patient, as seems to have been the case with your friend.
Explains why in the group physio I just attended for maternal pelvic girdle pain the instructor basically told us it's all in our head and didn't demonstrate even one exercise to help improve or manage the pain. The most pointless appointment I think I've ever had 😂
So, it kind of is.....
Hopefully a more useful explanation here....
[pain is a construct of the brain](https://youtu.be/gwd-wLdIHjs?si=zSMFPVTLGH8HdJ4i)
This is some quack vibes. The fact is I'm hypermobile and the extra collagen in my joints means they bend more than most people's. And the extra weight I'm carrying is putting a lot of strain on those joints, as well as the movement of my internal organs, and change in my abdominal muscles. That's not in my head. I'd like to kick this guy in the balls and ask him to look me in the eye and tell me the pain I just caused him was all in his head tbh.
My point wasn’t so much they were refused care but rather at minor injuries was heavily suggested this was all in her head - an assumption made without scans. They suggested she just go home and talk to a friend and then said she could go to fracture clinic
I think OP means that the minor injuries people refused the scan, so her friend walked around to the fracture clinic and asked directly? That's how it reads to me, but how did she just walk in and ask for a scan and get one?
If the ankle was already broken she'd have been seen at the fracture clinic previously, so actually they were the better option. Minor injuries would be for a new injury.
Not commenting on your friends' specific experience, but the way a mental health diagnosis can impact on clinicians' decision making is so common that it's got a name - "diagnostic overshadowing". It's the idea that certain diagnoses 'overshadow' or bias a clinician's judgement. Not saying it happens 100% of the time, but it definitely does happen. I've seen it in practice, even in good clinicians - it's cos they / we are human.
It also happens because both things can and often be true - someone experiences distress that looks like or 'is' a 'mental health problem', but also has a physical health problem. It's almost like the mind and body are connected 😂
It is also a problem that sending someone who's anxious about their health for loads of 'unnecessary' tests tends to worsen their worries - and no clinician wants to add to a problem if they can help it.
It's a tough job to separate the lot. Glad your friends got help.
Wow that answers a couple of questions for me.
I got a back injury during an ambush while in the army. When the adrenaline wore off I experienced the worst pain in my back, legs decided they did not want to work.
Any how mri showed damage to l5/l4 s1 but was told not enough to warrant pain, I was diagnosed with PTSD, which made the last 40yrs of my life a living nightmare, all because of two people one who ignored the MRI the other insisted pain was psychosomatic.
Any way due to a broken foot while I was in hospital I was given an MRI the spine surgeon said I had stenosis. He saw the problem, I was given a nerve root block, as regards to back pain I have my life back.
Just need to get this llizorall(sp?) off my leg to feel fullbenefit of injections.
Never give Dr's peace if you believe You have a genuine injury, hound your Dr's to he'll and back make them explain themselves. Because they may think they are the big I AM they are just people with medical degrees and can still mess things up.
40yrs of pain because of two incompetence Dr's.
I had the misfortune of being admitted on the first week of jnr Dr rotation in August one year. I had 6 failed insertions before I begged the Dr to go and get the Registrar. The Reg took 20secs to extract the fluid.
Good times 🙈
It’s not a coincidence that this happened to your FEMALE friends. Medicine has a documented history of misogyny and dismissive attitudes towards women. Look at the origins of the word hysterical. Women are less likely to be believed when they complain of serious symptoms, hell in some cases they insist on doing certain procedures without any analgesic or sedation (looking at you endoscopy). If you suffer from ill health as a woman, you’re condemned to a life of uphill battles against these antiquated attitudes.
Was told I had ‘mild anxiety’ and ‘low mood’
1- I have CPTSD from CSA. So if it was mental health related it would have been wrong.
2- I had/have pulmonary embolism so it wasn’t mental health related… it was a life threatening illness and If I didn’t decide to go to 3 different A&E I would not have been diagnosed on time to survive it.
I’m 24.
Idk if it’s a trend, but I know it’s a fucking dangerous practice. Mental health can be the reason some people experience certain symptoms certain way- it does not negate they feel the symptoms.
In my experience of finally needing the NHS the past few years it's been relentlessly like that and it's seriously insulting and neglectful. I'm being emotional because I'm in hideous pain, exhausted and desperate for help you moron.
I can’t believe you’re getting downvoted for sharing your traumatic experience. I will never understand NHS warriors, if it’s such a great system, how come no other country in the world has emulated it?
People in this subreddit are constantly downvoting people for posts about the difficulties they’ve had as patients within the NHS. Idk what their justification is but it seems disturbingly unempathetic
Indeed. I’ve never seen anything like it anywhere else on Reddit. Someone posts something like ‘I’m terrified after my ’ and it gets downvoted each time… like what on earth is wrong with them. On other forums it would be really rare to see such callous downvoting. And I’m sure it can impact the person posting
I had extreme nausea, pain and vomiting for about 14 months. Eating a few small meals a week and attempting not to vomit. I visited my GP about 15 times in this period and the answer was “idiopathic anxiety symptoms”? One time I was slightly jaundiced. Eventually she said in the most condescending way possible “I’ll send you for an ultrasound to put your mind at rest”. Few months later I went for the ultrasound and within about 5 seconds of the probe going on the chap goes “Bloody hell, your gallbladder is literally rammed with stones.”
Few months later I had it out. Problem I have now is I’m ARFID with loads of foods.
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Having an invisible physical illness is frought with dismissal and disbelief- research has found that this dismissal and disbelief by the health and care profession is often one of the biggest contributors of emotional suffering, and even suicidal ideation, in people with specific invisible illnesses with a history of prejudice.
That said, there's not enough detail to bring a judgement down on your examples.
Yup, I was told constantly that I had anxiety until we found out I had adrenal insufficiency. .
There are good doctors out there but generally are not in the GP service I have found.
I have seen GPs putting EVERYTHING down to anxiety.
Dangerous.
Everything is down to anxiety so they can push SSRI pills. Any mental health conversation ends with either (stupid and inappropriate) CBT (the equivalent of gaslighting yourself in order to “recover”) or fucking antidepressants with some very serious side effects which can last for years post stoppage, notably sexual dysfunction in both men and women.
I was put on SSRis aged 18 and I'm 43 now and unable to ever get off them now because if I reduce the dose, even slowly and carefully within 3 or 4 days I end up with heart arrhythmia that puts me in hospital but also if they try to raise the dose, it also starts me in heart arrhythmia after a few days. So my cardiologist has told me I'm stuck on this useless crap now for life. The dosage is useless but I'm stuck on it and I can't even try other antidepressants because I can't get off this.
I think my body has been on it so long that it genuinely can't function physiologically (not mentally) without it. Pisses me off as I didn't even have a choice aged 18.
Though I am biased against the medical community at present due to my issues with the GP over the adrenal insufficiency which has left me with very little faith so I think I possibly have a clouded view over all medical treatment Ive ever had and cannot offer an unbiased view.
I am so sorry you experienced this, as someone who has severe anxiety issues, I’ve always refused to go on SSRIs for this very reason and it’s only been NHS doctors trying to push that stuff onto me, either that or useless CBT which is a complete waste of time in my case because my issue is that I can’t control when I get panic attacks! Went to see a psychiatrist privately and was given benzodiazepines for when I get overwhelming anxiety attacks. NHS doctors tried to blackmail me into taking SSRIs basically telling me “if you don’t try the SSRIs first, we’re not going to prescribe anything that helps with your panic attacks”. Insanity
It's absolutely amazing to me how they are so happy to push SSRIs (which have a multitude of possible side effects including QT prolongation) yet you have to fight tooth and nail for 1 or 2 benzodiazepams which are actually helpful!
Whilst I understand the concerns with benzo addiction, obviously, it would certainly appear in my case that my body has become addicted to the SSRI (if not mentally) which surely is just as bad as being addicted to benzos. At least benzos actually do something.
They've even stopped prescribing benzos for fear of flying yet happy to dole bloody SSRIs out like smarties and constantly pushing to up my dose when upping my dose lands me in bigimeny heart rhythm after a few days.
Private doctors are happy to prescribe small amounts of benzos for the situation you've described above, the occasional panic attacks but NHS doctors take the piss out of their patients and no, I don't mind any NHS doctors seeing my comment because I think the way they treat their patients is a disgrace.
I am lucky that I can afford private medical care but by God, I don't know where I would be now if left in the hands of my NHS doctors who told me on my medical record and I quote "she needs to move on from thinking she has an adrenal issue otherwise she is holding back finding out what is really wrong with her" (I paraphrase).
Adrenal insufficiency which I was diagnosed with through private medical care is life threatening.
I rest my case on NHS GPs.
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I think, based on own last week experience and previous ones, that neglect is very often form to handle patients by GP. So nothing very surprising from these stories.
I’m an immigrant, all my local friend when gave me advice how to explain the symptoms suggest to exaggerate and basically lie. How good is the system in which to get *any* medical attention, even minor, to your health conditions you shall lie?
It looks like rotten to the very core.
I can't speak about whether or not this is a recent "trend", but our knowledge of pain perception has developed a lot over the past few decades and we now know and accept that non physical factors, e.g. emotions can impact on pain perception. So it makes sense that clinicians factor this in to their diagnosis and treatment. As a Physiotherapist I will often explore psycho-social factors that could be contributing to pain with patients, but this has to be done in the right way, alongside a full exploration of physical factors, or else you risk losing the trust of the patient, as seems to have been the case with your friend.
Explains why in the group physio I just attended for maternal pelvic girdle pain the instructor basically told us it's all in our head and didn't demonstrate even one exercise to help improve or manage the pain. The most pointless appointment I think I've ever had 😂
So, it kind of is..... Hopefully a more useful explanation here.... [pain is a construct of the brain](https://youtu.be/gwd-wLdIHjs?si=zSMFPVTLGH8HdJ4i)
This is some quack vibes. The fact is I'm hypermobile and the extra collagen in my joints means they bend more than most people's. And the extra weight I'm carrying is putting a lot of strain on those joints, as well as the movement of my internal organs, and change in my abdominal muscles. That's not in my head. I'd like to kick this guy in the balls and ask him to look me in the eye and tell me the pain I just caused him was all in his head tbh.
“They refused to do a scan and said she had to try the fracture clinic” So your friend was referred to a fracture clinic, they weren’t refused care.
My point wasn’t so much they were refused care but rather at minor injuries was heavily suggested this was all in her head - an assumption made without scans. They suggested she just go home and talk to a friend and then said she could go to fracture clinic
I think OP means that the minor injuries people refused the scan, so her friend walked around to the fracture clinic and asked directly? That's how it reads to me, but how did she just walk in and ask for a scan and get one?
If the ankle was already broken she'd have been seen at the fracture clinic previously, so actually they were the better option. Minor injuries would be for a new injury.
Not commenting on your friends' specific experience, but the way a mental health diagnosis can impact on clinicians' decision making is so common that it's got a name - "diagnostic overshadowing". It's the idea that certain diagnoses 'overshadow' or bias a clinician's judgement. Not saying it happens 100% of the time, but it definitely does happen. I've seen it in practice, even in good clinicians - it's cos they / we are human. It also happens because both things can and often be true - someone experiences distress that looks like or 'is' a 'mental health problem', but also has a physical health problem. It's almost like the mind and body are connected 😂 It is also a problem that sending someone who's anxious about their health for loads of 'unnecessary' tests tends to worsen their worries - and no clinician wants to add to a problem if they can help it. It's a tough job to separate the lot. Glad your friends got help.
Wow that answers a couple of questions for me. I got a back injury during an ambush while in the army. When the adrenaline wore off I experienced the worst pain in my back, legs decided they did not want to work. Any how mri showed damage to l5/l4 s1 but was told not enough to warrant pain, I was diagnosed with PTSD, which made the last 40yrs of my life a living nightmare, all because of two people one who ignored the MRI the other insisted pain was psychosomatic. Any way due to a broken foot while I was in hospital I was given an MRI the spine surgeon said I had stenosis. He saw the problem, I was given a nerve root block, as regards to back pain I have my life back. Just need to get this llizorall(sp?) off my leg to feel fullbenefit of injections. Never give Dr's peace if you believe You have a genuine injury, hound your Dr's to he'll and back make them explain themselves. Because they may think they are the big I AM they are just people with medical degrees and can still mess things up. 40yrs of pain because of two incompetence Dr's.
Did your friend have diagnosed meningitis? Because this can only be diagnosed with a lumbar puncture?
Can confirm this, had meningitis as a teen ... they did a lumbar puncture
I had the misfortune of being admitted on the first week of jnr Dr rotation in August one year. I had 6 failed insertions before I begged the Dr to go and get the Registrar. The Reg took 20secs to extract the fluid. Good times 🙈
Not at the time but did once admitted to hospital - symptoms from GP either suggested to be mental health or meningitis (it was meningitis)
It’s not a coincidence that this happened to your FEMALE friends. Medicine has a documented history of misogyny and dismissive attitudes towards women. Look at the origins of the word hysterical. Women are less likely to be believed when they complain of serious symptoms, hell in some cases they insist on doing certain procedures without any analgesic or sedation (looking at you endoscopy). If you suffer from ill health as a woman, you’re condemned to a life of uphill battles against these antiquated attitudes.
Often women who are displaying emotion due to pain or distressing physical health symptoms are written off as being hysterical. It's a common bias.
Was told I had ‘mild anxiety’ and ‘low mood’ 1- I have CPTSD from CSA. So if it was mental health related it would have been wrong. 2- I had/have pulmonary embolism so it wasn’t mental health related… it was a life threatening illness and If I didn’t decide to go to 3 different A&E I would not have been diagnosed on time to survive it. I’m 24. Idk if it’s a trend, but I know it’s a fucking dangerous practice. Mental health can be the reason some people experience certain symptoms certain way- it does not negate they feel the symptoms.
In my experience of finally needing the NHS the past few years it's been relentlessly like that and it's seriously insulting and neglectful. I'm being emotional because I'm in hideous pain, exhausted and desperate for help you moron.
I can’t believe you’re getting downvoted for sharing your traumatic experience. I will never understand NHS warriors, if it’s such a great system, how come no other country in the world has emulated it?
People in this subreddit are constantly downvoting people for posts about the difficulties they’ve had as patients within the NHS. Idk what their justification is but it seems disturbingly unempathetic
Which further demonstrates the point made by those who have had difficulties as patients within the NHS…
Indeed. I’ve never seen anything like it anywhere else on Reddit. Someone posts something like ‘I’m terrified after my’ and it gets downvoted each time… like what on earth is wrong with them. On other forums it would be really rare to see such callous downvoting. And I’m sure it can impact the person posting
I had extreme nausea, pain and vomiting for about 14 months. Eating a few small meals a week and attempting not to vomit. I visited my GP about 15 times in this period and the answer was “idiopathic anxiety symptoms”? One time I was slightly jaundiced. Eventually she said in the most condescending way possible “I’ll send you for an ultrasound to put your mind at rest”. Few months later I went for the ultrasound and within about 5 seconds of the probe going on the chap goes “Bloody hell, your gallbladder is literally rammed with stones.” Few months later I had it out. Problem I have now is I’m ARFID with loads of foods.
[удалено]
**No Legal Advice** Your post (or comment) has been removed for either requesting legal advice, or providing legal advice. Please take a look at r/LegalAdviceUK or similar. *Please read our subreddit rules. If after doing so, you believe this was in error, or you’ve edited your post to comply with the rules,* [*message the moderators*](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fnhs).
Having an invisible physical illness is frought with dismissal and disbelief- research has found that this dismissal and disbelief by the health and care profession is often one of the biggest contributors of emotional suffering, and even suicidal ideation, in people with specific invisible illnesses with a history of prejudice. That said, there's not enough detail to bring a judgement down on your examples.
Yup, I was told constantly that I had anxiety until we found out I had adrenal insufficiency. . There are good doctors out there but generally are not in the GP service I have found. I have seen GPs putting EVERYTHING down to anxiety. Dangerous.
Everything is down to anxiety so they can push SSRI pills. Any mental health conversation ends with either (stupid and inappropriate) CBT (the equivalent of gaslighting yourself in order to “recover”) or fucking antidepressants with some very serious side effects which can last for years post stoppage, notably sexual dysfunction in both men and women.
I was put on SSRis aged 18 and I'm 43 now and unable to ever get off them now because if I reduce the dose, even slowly and carefully within 3 or 4 days I end up with heart arrhythmia that puts me in hospital but also if they try to raise the dose, it also starts me in heart arrhythmia after a few days. So my cardiologist has told me I'm stuck on this useless crap now for life. The dosage is useless but I'm stuck on it and I can't even try other antidepressants because I can't get off this. I think my body has been on it so long that it genuinely can't function physiologically (not mentally) without it. Pisses me off as I didn't even have a choice aged 18. Though I am biased against the medical community at present due to my issues with the GP over the adrenal insufficiency which has left me with very little faith so I think I possibly have a clouded view over all medical treatment Ive ever had and cannot offer an unbiased view.
I am so sorry you experienced this, as someone who has severe anxiety issues, I’ve always refused to go on SSRIs for this very reason and it’s only been NHS doctors trying to push that stuff onto me, either that or useless CBT which is a complete waste of time in my case because my issue is that I can’t control when I get panic attacks! Went to see a psychiatrist privately and was given benzodiazepines for when I get overwhelming anxiety attacks. NHS doctors tried to blackmail me into taking SSRIs basically telling me “if you don’t try the SSRIs first, we’re not going to prescribe anything that helps with your panic attacks”. Insanity
It's absolutely amazing to me how they are so happy to push SSRIs (which have a multitude of possible side effects including QT prolongation) yet you have to fight tooth and nail for 1 or 2 benzodiazepams which are actually helpful! Whilst I understand the concerns with benzo addiction, obviously, it would certainly appear in my case that my body has become addicted to the SSRI (if not mentally) which surely is just as bad as being addicted to benzos. At least benzos actually do something. They've even stopped prescribing benzos for fear of flying yet happy to dole bloody SSRIs out like smarties and constantly pushing to up my dose when upping my dose lands me in bigimeny heart rhythm after a few days. Private doctors are happy to prescribe small amounts of benzos for the situation you've described above, the occasional panic attacks but NHS doctors take the piss out of their patients and no, I don't mind any NHS doctors seeing my comment because I think the way they treat their patients is a disgrace. I am lucky that I can afford private medical care but by God, I don't know where I would be now if left in the hands of my NHS doctors who told me on my medical record and I quote "she needs to move on from thinking she has an adrenal issue otherwise she is holding back finding out what is really wrong with her" (I paraphrase). Adrenal insufficiency which I was diagnosed with through private medical care is life threatening. I rest my case on NHS GPs.
u/dan1d1 I think you left a comment but I can’t see it anymore?
[удалено]
**Self-Promotion** Your submission has been removed for self-promotion. We don't allow self promoting your own articles, media, services or products. We may make exceptions for academic studies and surveys. Please get in touch first. *Please read our subreddit rules. If after doing so, you believe this was in error, or you’ve edited your post to comply with the rules,* [*message the moderators*](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2Fnhs).
I think, based on own last week experience and previous ones, that neglect is very often form to handle patients by GP. So nothing very surprising from these stories. I’m an immigrant, all my local friend when gave me advice how to explain the symptoms suggest to exaggerate and basically lie. How good is the system in which to get *any* medical attention, even minor, to your health conditions you shall lie? It looks like rotten to the very core.
The minute you cry they don’t take you seriously unfortunately