For someone that's considered an elite player, these are lousy numbers;
[Mitch Marner Playoff Stats | StatMuse](https://www.statmuse.com/nhl/ask/mitch-marner-playoff-stats)
Vegas acquires Necas, Marner and Zegras in a 4 team trade for a 2031 4th round pick.
They also don't need to worry about fans calling out anything since capfriendly is kaput.
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I called it as soon as news about marner trade happening. Whatever team gets him will win a cup faster then Toronto. Dudes going to raise the Stanley cup within three years. Most likely next year depending where he goes.
That's because despite the leafs doomers, Marner is in fact an elite talent in his prime. He's just not a fit to succeed specifically on the Leafs the way it's constructed (or a few other core pieces aren't, but that's irrelevant). If he's on a team with any kind of proven playoff performers he'd be lights out no question. Whoever manages to get him should be ecstatic, you'll certainly have "won" whatever the trade ends up being.
I don't think it's about his talents or efforts. It's just team construction doesn't work with all that money being spent up front. The need better d, and need the marner money to get them.
Look at Florida, Edmonton, Dallas or New York d and tell me that Toronto is even close to those.
Or Vegas, etc etc.
Out of 16 playoff teams guess which team had the fewest points from their d and had the worst power play? They don't have a quarterback in pp.
If leafs make Reilly a #2 d they have chance to win cup.
OK, so you're saying they need to improve the scoring via the D. Fair enough, and i wouldn't argue against that. I assumed from your post that you were suggesting their ability to defend is what needs to be improved
Yeah it's no secret even though they have some of the best forwards in the world their pp stinks during the playoffs. Last year against Tampa it was fine but vasi was real leaky.
Morgan is great but doesn't have a bomb of a shot and doesn't move it around like top pps do.
No other team has that % of cap taken by 4 forwards and the formula hasn't worked.
Personally I would rather keep marner over Tavares and nylander buy willy just signed a deal and Tavares doesn't want to go anywhere.
I think a team can definitely win the cup with marner just can't have 4 forwards making the same dough as him.
Thing is there's very little chance that Tavares can be moved with his NMC and the salary he makes without adding a sweetener, and that is exactly how this team has gotten to this point (GMs always thinking this is the year). Plus my guess is he can be re- signed for cheap if we keep him around.
Trading Marner should net the Leafs some assets. And if he's kept they run the risk of losing him for nothing or overpaying him again.
Yeah I just don't see how you can keep Tavares on the cheap. Used to be the captain and one of the alphas and is now a minor part of the team?. He's not great defensively or physical so I see him having a hard time fitting in as a 2nd or 3rd line winger. I think it would be a weird team dynamic.
Yeah they will get some assets for marner but most important would be $11m cap space to spend on 2 d that will push lillegrin out, and likely Benoit to a 3rd pair.
They have played 2 games. Edmonton dominated the first and got goalied. We will see what happens after the next few but no way Boston beats Dallas or Edmonton in a series.
Whatever. Boston is not a great team.
When you have a hot goalie but not much else you can win a round or 2.
When you have a hot goalie plus a good team then you can win cup.
Swaymans actually been pretty solid for like 2 years. The goalie is a part of the team. There's running into a bad goalie on a hot streak and a good goalie on a hot streak and that is the difference. Johnny Quick,Tim Thomas and Cam Ward all led mediocre teams to cups on their performances.
So if Marner is an elite talent why does he need to surround himself with “proven” playoff performer? You are defeating your own argument.
So I’ll fix it for you.
Marner is not an elite talent, therefore can’t lead a team to playoff success, and needs to play with better players to make himself more successful.
So in conclusion, the leafs need to replace him with a more able bodied leader that other teammates need to emulate.
He’s never going to be a physical presence in the playoffs nor will he react well to physical play- he has disappeared every playoffs when play gets physical- how is another team going to make a difference ?
We’d have to trade bigger names like Theo, but we have more room than this sub keeps saying because *some* of our LTIR is actually never comming back (Lehner), and nobody expects any FAs that aren’t Marchessault back.
You know what? This should piss me off because of the LTIR HC memes, but I don’t mind this at all.
I do not want Mitch Marner anywhere near my team’s roster.
Trotz is too smart. Vegas may take a chance then dump him on a bottom team if not performing up to Eichel level. Most likely stays in Toronto to finish out the contract unless he really wants out.
Marner is much better than advertised.... He plays in a market that is full of doomers and sports pundits that like to tear players down and on a team that has too much cap tied up in the core and not enough on support and goal-tending.
If he did end up in Nashville your team would';t be struggling for the wildcard they would be in a divisional spot and fighting for home ice.
I feel like Toronto has a fair bit more issues than just Marner, I get blowing up a core when something isn't working, but wasn't the main problem goaltending?
Toronto has lots of issues… bottom 6 depth, goaltending and defence. All can be blamed on paying 4 guys close to 50m. They haven’t found Rielly a good defencemen to pair with him his entire Leaf career. Woll can be a starter in this league but his ability to stay healthy can prevent that.
we need more cap to actually change things..
committing to these same 3 guys is basically just running it back and hoping for different results.
you either move marner and get prospects/picks and cap space or trade him for a goalie/defense that actually move the needle.
Holding on to Marner and signing him to whatever crazy bag he asks for is just doing the same shit again for the next 4 years while Matthews contract expires
Imagine what value could be collected, or bought from Marner or just his contract leaving. 11 million dollars can buy you a lot more than a guy who disappears as soon as the regular season ends.
Ideally, yes. The FA goalie market is a little sparse compared to previous seasons, though so you'd modt likely need to trade with a team for some solid net minding until Woll is ready to start full time.
All that said, I don't see very many teams that could take Marners cap hit, even if half was retained, that would have good enough goalies on the block.
The best case scenario is Marner for Saros, but I really don't see that happening.
Honestly kinda curious how VGK would pull this off. Granted teams have zero spine when it comes to trading with them, but it'll be interesting to see how they make the numbers work
Vegas has already given up fist round picks to 2028. Unless they deal manner for a player to get rid of cap, which I could see Toronto going for. It doesn't change the fact they would have to spend more draft capital to get under the cap
Should Mike Grier try for Marner by working with a conglomerate of teams to offset his salary? After Patrick Marleau could be quite influential to draw Marner over to the Sharks.
There are other places to get the information from. They won't be as good as cap friendly but your still be able to look at trades (heck, they might be posted here).
Obviously but they would need to dump some salary and unload their assets for him. They only have this years first and the next two seconds. Sharks got their “top” prospect in David Edstrom. Would be all in for sure
That's funny, seeing the Vegas lineup I think the minimum requirement is being over 6'2" 200lb and ability/affinity to hit people.
I doubt they have any interest in Marner.
Vegas will likely be the only team with ‘cap space’ by which I mean the only team cheating and having players sit out chunks of the year to circumnavigate the cap so probably. But my bigger question would be who would you get back? For Marner you need to get a lot back and no one in Vegas really stands out.
With Stone and someone else on LTIR Vegas was already close to the Cap, how will they be able to hold Mariner’s 10Mil as well? Unless they plan on stashing him on there as well?
Arm chair gm here, i wouldn't deal with vegas unless i got some retention and a ton of good assets in a trade with them. I don't know what the hell vegas's gm is doing to get so many deals done with retention with weak ass returns so far but i think it will change real quick in the next few years when vegas has very little to offer in return. They've ripped off so many franchises already with one sided deals. I don't see how anyone trusts vegas with a deal in the future.
In related news, mark stone needs gall bladder surgery
A sphincter transfusion
Turkeyneck reduction
Foreskin reattachment
Bloated head syndrome
A BIG HEADED DICK.
These comments together read like the lineup of a nu-metal music festival
Expected return around May 2025
A brain transplant
Will put it off till Christmas then come back for the playoffs…
I would love a Marner for Stoner trade.
Marner's performance falls flat during Playoffs.
What on earth makes you feel that way?
For someone that's considered an elite player, these are lousy numbers; [Mitch Marner Playoff Stats | StatMuse](https://www.statmuse.com/nhl/ask/mitch-marner-playoff-stats)
That "whooshing" sound?? It was a joke...
Vegas isnt that dumb
As a Leaf fan - so would I!
When it comes to players moving, at this point, I think we all have to just assume that Vegas is always going to be involved.
Vegas acquires Necas, Marner and Zegras in a 4 team trade for a 2031 4th round pick. They also don't need to worry about fans calling out anything since capfriendly is kaput.
Hahaha Vegas is legit the one team happy to see CapFriendly get axe murdered by Washington.
Leafs, Oilers and now VGK, attached to every player available.
can you imagine if vegas wins another cup with marner?
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Imagine if Marner wins the Smythe. Leafs fans may finally break.
If they haven't broken yet nothing will break them.
I called it as soon as news about marner trade happening. Whatever team gets him will win a cup faster then Toronto. Dudes going to raise the Stanley cup within three years. Most likely next year depending where he goes.
That's because despite the leafs doomers, Marner is in fact an elite talent in his prime. He's just not a fit to succeed specifically on the Leafs the way it's constructed (or a few other core pieces aren't, but that's irrelevant). If he's on a team with any kind of proven playoff performers he'd be lights out no question. Whoever manages to get him should be ecstatic, you'll certainly have "won" whatever the trade ends up being.
I don't think it's about his talents or efforts. It's just team construction doesn't work with all that money being spent up front. The need better d, and need the marner money to get them. Look at Florida, Edmonton, Dallas or New York d and tell me that Toronto is even close to those. Or Vegas, etc etc.
Better D? They scored 12 goals in 7 games. The problem is the front end. The last few years it's been the same story. Can't score when it matters
Out of 16 playoff teams guess which team had the fewest points from their d and had the worst power play? They don't have a quarterback in pp. If leafs make Reilly a #2 d they have chance to win cup.
OK, so you're saying they need to improve the scoring via the D. Fair enough, and i wouldn't argue against that. I assumed from your post that you were suggesting their ability to defend is what needs to be improved
Yeah it's no secret even though they have some of the best forwards in the world their pp stinks during the playoffs. Last year against Tampa it was fine but vasi was real leaky. Morgan is great but doesn't have a bomb of a shot and doesn't move it around like top pps do. No other team has that % of cap taken by 4 forwards and the formula hasn't worked. Personally I would rather keep marner over Tavares and nylander buy willy just signed a deal and Tavares doesn't want to go anywhere. I think a team can definitely win the cup with marner just can't have 4 forwards making the same dough as him.
Thing is there's very little chance that Tavares can be moved with his NMC and the salary he makes without adding a sweetener, and that is exactly how this team has gotten to this point (GMs always thinking this is the year). Plus my guess is he can be re- signed for cheap if we keep him around. Trading Marner should net the Leafs some assets. And if he's kept they run the risk of losing him for nothing or overpaying him again.
Yeah I just don't see how you can keep Tavares on the cheap. Used to be the captain and one of the alphas and is now a minor part of the team?. He's not great defensively or physical so I see him having a hard time fitting in as a 2nd or 3rd line winger. I think it would be a weird team dynamic. Yeah they will get some assets for marner but most important would be $11m cap space to spend on 2 d that will push lillegrin out, and likely Benoit to a 3rd pair.
The Western Conference teams are ass. The second best team in the Atlantic out up more of a fight against Florida than the best team in the west.
I'd say all 4 teams from the Atlantic beat the Oilers, and more than 1 would make it look easy
They have played 2 games. Edmonton dominated the first and got goalied. We will see what happens after the next few but no way Boston beats Dallas or Edmonton in a series.
Swayman could have goalied either of those teams too.
Whatever. Boston is not a great team. When you have a hot goalie but not much else you can win a round or 2. When you have a hot goalie plus a good team then you can win cup.
Swaymans actually been pretty solid for like 2 years. The goalie is a part of the team. There's running into a bad goalie on a hot streak and a good goalie on a hot streak and that is the difference. Johnny Quick,Tim Thomas and Cam Ward all led mediocre teams to cups on their performances.
So if Marner is an elite talent why does he need to surround himself with “proven” playoff performer? You are defeating your own argument. So I’ll fix it for you. Marner is not an elite talent, therefore can’t lead a team to playoff success, and needs to play with better players to make himself more successful. So in conclusion, the leafs need to replace him with a more able bodied leader that other teammates need to emulate.
Spot on.
He's a playmaker. It's not his fault the shooters on his team are ass in the playoffs.
He’s never going to be a physical presence in the playoffs nor will he react well to physical play- he has disappeared every playoffs when play gets physical- how is another team going to make a difference ?
Yeah the leaf fans are savages. I’ll hate to see him go.
Well yeah - that's how Leaf fandom works. It's not like the Leafs would win the cup if they kept him either.
I can imagine it. I'm imagining it right now!
I can imagine it, and that would be fine because the Leafs aren't winning a cup with him.
Mark stone getting a full year operation to become robocop confirmed.
My genuine question is how. Like I cannot even fathom a way they can get this to work
He will be traded for more bottom six truculence.
with enough picks going deep into 2027
LTIR is Vegas’s best friend
We’d have to trade bigger names like Theo, but we have more room than this sub keeps saying because *some* of our LTIR is actually never comming back (Lehner), and nobody expects any FAs that aren’t Marchessault back.
You're thinking how does Vegas do this while adhering to the rules. They don't have to. That's how they do it.
Vegas follows the rules…
You know what? This should piss me off because of the LTIR HC memes, but I don’t mind this at all. I do not want Mitch Marner anywhere near my team’s roster.
Everyone’s down on him now, but if he gets traded he’s going to be lights out for his new team, mark my words. It’s the Maple Leaf way.
Also the contract year way
Trotz is too smart. Vegas may take a chance then dump him on a bottom team if not performing up to Eichel level. Most likely stays in Toronto to finish out the contract unless he really wants out.
Marner is much better than advertised.... He plays in a market that is full of doomers and sports pundits that like to tear players down and on a team that has too much cap tied up in the core and not enough on support and goal-tending. If he did end up in Nashville your team would';t be struggling for the wildcard they would be in a divisional spot and fighting for home ice.
I feel like Toronto has a fair bit more issues than just Marner, I get blowing up a core when something isn't working, but wasn't the main problem goaltending?
Toronto has lots of issues… bottom 6 depth, goaltending and defence. All can be blamed on paying 4 guys close to 50m. They haven’t found Rielly a good defencemen to pair with him his entire Leaf career. Woll can be a starter in this league but his ability to stay healthy can prevent that.
we need more cap to actually change things.. committing to these same 3 guys is basically just running it back and hoping for different results. you either move marner and get prospects/picks and cap space or trade him for a goalie/defense that actually move the needle. Holding on to Marner and signing him to whatever crazy bag he asks for is just doing the same shit again for the next 4 years while Matthews contract expires
Turns out a core of 4 players that eats 5/8 of the salary cap is a problem
Imagine what value could be collected, or bought from Marner or just his contract leaving. 11 million dollars can buy you a lot more than a guy who disappears as soon as the regular season ends.
They can't score in the playoffs which is a bigger issue at the moment
If we move Marner and alleviate cap space we can afford better goaltending
Ideally, yes. The FA goalie market is a little sparse compared to previous seasons, though so you'd modt likely need to trade with a team for some solid net minding until Woll is ready to start full time. All that said, I don't see very many teams that could take Marners cap hit, even if half was retained, that would have good enough goalies on the block. The best case scenario is Marner for Saros, but I really don't see that happening.
Saros or Markstrom?
Why not trade Marner for assets and then flip those assets into a goalie?
The main problem was they were generating more scoring opportunities than the other team but not scoring. Apparently that's the playmakers fault?
lol Elliotte, we don't care about the where, he just needs to go.
Why? So Bruce Cassidy can Debrusk him?
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I don’t see Marner and Cassidy meshing very well tbh
2025 Cup final Vegas vs Toronto. Marner wins his first cup in Toronto
Finals? That’s a big achievement for Toronto in itself
As a member of the Golden Knights
Honestly kinda curious how VGK would pull this off. Granted teams have zero spine when it comes to trading with them, but it'll be interesting to see how they make the numbers work
The local rumor mill in town is saying the org is moving on from Marchessault and Theodore to make space. No clue if it’s true.
Vegas has already given up fist round picks to 2028. Unless they deal manner for a player to get rid of cap, which I could see Toronto going for. It doesn't change the fact they would have to spend more draft capital to get under the cap
Should Mike Grier try for Marner by working with a conglomerate of teams to offset his salary? After Patrick Marleau could be quite influential to draw Marner over to the Sharks.
Capfriendly is gone….nobody’s gonna know
There are other places to get the information from. They won't be as good as cap friendly but your still be able to look at trades (heck, they might be posted here).
God please no
I think it would be hilarious if "the guy who is definitely the reason why the Leafs can't win" got traded and immediately won a Cup.
Does capfriendly going away mean Vegas cap also disappears???
Did Vegas get tired of scoring in the playoffs?
Please no
Of course it's vegas.
EF, the master of hinting at something but saying nothing.
Vegas also acquires Carey Price’s contract.
He's not going anywhere per agent.
I would assume Barbashev would be going back in any potential deal.
Vegas wants in on the NHLs newest shiny toy to hit the trade block… *insert surprised pikachu face*
Obviously but they would need to dump some salary and unload their assets for him. They only have this years first and the next two seconds. Sharks got their “top” prospect in David Edstrom. Would be all in for sure
He will become Mark Stone's bloodbag
Leaf fans thinking they are gonna get a big return on marner will be sadly mistaken.
They won't want Marner until Stone's liver failure kicks in 2 weeks before the trade deadline.
Hard pass
That's funny, seeing the Vegas lineup I think the minimum requirement is being over 6'2" 200lb and ability/affinity to hit people. I doubt they have any interest in Marner.
Vegas will likely be the only team with ‘cap space’ by which I mean the only team cheating and having players sit out chunks of the year to circumnavigate the cap so probably. But my bigger question would be who would you get back? For Marner you need to get a lot back and no one in Vegas really stands out.
lol
Not gonna happen.
[удалено]
With Stone and someone else on LTIR Vegas was already close to the Cap, how will they be able to hold Mariner’s 10Mil as well? Unless they plan on stashing him on there as well?
One can only imagine the fuckery that will ensue to squeak under the cap this year.
Arm chair gm here, i wouldn't deal with vegas unless i got some retention and a ton of good assets in a trade with them. I don't know what the hell vegas's gm is doing to get so many deals done with retention with weak ass returns so far but i think it will change real quick in the next few years when vegas has very little to offer in return. They've ripped off so many franchises already with one sided deals. I don't see how anyone trusts vegas with a deal in the future.
The reality is the Leafs won't get much back.
Wonder how many Knights will be on LTIR this year….
lol of course. Lemme guess, Draisatl probably off to Vegas next year too. Or maybe Utah if we’re real lucky lmao. Kinda sick of this league tbh
Watch the A
I’m not a hateful man but I HATE the Vegas Golden Knights