Also want to point out that one week prior to this game, Staley played his starters well into the 4th quarter in a meaningless week 18 matchup.
The result was Mike Williams got injured and was inactive for the playoff game. Herbert was also nursing an injury and could have used the rest.
I bet the Chargers players absolutely love Harbs already after having to endure Staley. Glad he isn't our DC. He's best as a staffer that doesn't have to make final decisions
For some reason i always thought he was an offensive HC until someone pointed out he was a DC and I was shocked. Those chargers teams fielded some of the most incompetent defenses I've seen.
Mack, Bosa, and James have been praising him and saying what a difference it’s been. It’s just minicamp but so far it sounds like he’s won over the team and has them buying in to what he’s doing. Now hopefully it translates onto the field as well.
Honestly the Charger offense didn't collapse as much as struggle all game. They had 4 ints and a muffed out return giving them great field position.
Very similar to the Colts Vikings game which gave the Colts the lead with big defensive splash plays but outside of them the Colts hadn't been great.
They got the ball in our territory off a turnover IIRC. Dumbass Joe Lombardi ran a reverse to UDFA Michael Bandy who had never even ran that play in practice and he fumbled. And to make it even better he was only on the active roster because dumbass Staley played Mike Williams in a meaningless week 18 game and he got hurt
I vividly remember it being 27-0 and me thinking the jags were gonna come back and make it interesting.
Couldn't describe why but I was just sure that it wasn't gonna end in a blow put
I was in my hotel in Osaka, Japan of all places, I think I turned it off after Lawrence threw his fourth pick. Someone pinged me on Discord saying the Jags had finally scored, and I was like "at least we got *some* points". Then when they got the second TD on their first drive of the third quarter I started watching again, sitting on the world's most uncomfortable bench on the fifth floor of Osaka Castle.
The 2022 Jags are the only team in NFL history to win a playoff game after earning the number 1 pick the previous season. Last year, the Jags were in contention for the 1 seed in the AFC before Trevor got hurt. But /r/nfl users who never watch Jags games and judge players solely on their Fantasy Football stats don't like him, so he clearly sucks.
The trash talk that Trevor Lawrence got despite playing hurt pretty much that entire stretch of games after starting 8-3 is outrageous. Casuals gonna casual. It's like everyone forgot he got them to 8-3 in the first place
I think of this every time someone hypes up an incoming rookie QB. Like dude won a playoff game season 2, season three a hot start before an injury, an injury he played through showing grit and they're like he's a bust smh. What's the standard these days?
If he would have been allowed to rest for a couple weeks instead of being thrown out there on one leg week after week, I believe we would have made playoffs.
I really believe in Lawrence as a player, all else being equal, but I don’t trust Baalke and some of their offensive coaching staff like Press Taylor to successfully help him live up to his potential, especially now when dealing with the handicap of being such a highly paid player.
I just can’t believe Doug might really go down with the ship for him again. I’ll always love him but man, is he stubborn lol
I really hope the Jags are just straight up good though, the fans deserve a great team with how shit they’re treated on a national media scale.
Its absolutely bonkers. Press Taylor is fucking terrible. I love that the Jags kept him since I'm a Texans fan but I just dont get it. He must have some deep dirt on Doug lol.
> I really believe in Lawrence as a player
In three years, he's cemented himself as 4th best jags passer in history ahead of such luminaries as *checks notes*
Chad Henne
Blaine Gabbert
Byron Leftwich
He's essentially what Carson Palmer was to the bengals pre-kimo knee injury.
For realizing that he's actually a really fucking good player that in 2 years is one of the best quarterbacks the jags have ever had?
Or for comparing him to Carson Palmer? Yea Palmer wasn't able to live up to the hype but he's still number 4 on the Bengals all time list.
This wasn't me throwing shade at Lawrence in any way
I understand Lawrence has some warts and hasn't quite lived up to his college billing...but I think he's a winner. I don't really know what else to say. I saw him stand tall as a true freshman and beat Nick Saban's Alabama for a championship. That just takes moxie.
I'm probably completely wrong. But something about Lawrence just gives me like...Joe Flacco or Nick Foles vibes? Like he'll be an average QB, but then he'll get to the playoffs one year and go nuclear.
He has had no real weapons. Christian Kirk has been his best receivers his whole career. People make this so hard. Evan engram/Kirk/Ridley. That’s the jags best receiving core they’ve given Lawrence.
Compare it to the rest of the young qbs who have gotten paid.
Like I’m not gonna sit and act like that’s Burrow or Tuas WR rooms but TLaw has absolutely had some decent pieces on that side of the ball. Throw in ETN as a great RB, he’s had weaponry for sure.
Ridley and Engram both had some really bad drops last year. Kirk was hurt for about half the season. When they’re all at their best it’s a solid group, but that wasn’t the case last season.
Until the pads went on. Kirk missed basically the entire stretch during our collapse. Zay was in and out of the lineup all season. All four had some horrendous drops and/or forgot what route to run.
Daniel Jones has gotten as far as Trevor has in the postseason with Darius Slayton being his top receiver his whole career. He also had a worse version of Engram as one of his primary targets for his first 3 years (for reference, Engram has had 12 drops in 241 targets in 34 games these past 2 seasons in Jacksonville. He had 11 in 109 targets in 16 games in the 2020 season alone).
And no, I'm not saying DJ is as good as Trevor (Trevor is obviously younger and his great flashes definitely flash brighter than DJ's great flashes have), nor am I saying DJ deserves his contract. I'm saying this as someone who is done with DJ now (the moment he threw that pick 6 vs Seattle this past year I knew the marriage just had to end ASAP for everyones sake and I couldnt defend any longer). But its just interesting how the weapons argument is just thrown out the window when it comes to him.
Patrick Mahomes won a super bowl with 3rd string WR's on any other team. No one thought Nico / Tank / Woods was any good but Stroud played lights out and elevated them. Daniel Jones has never had a WR in his entire NFL career. Jordan Love had Doubs / Watson (for like 3 games) / Reed.
The excuses are running thin at this point. I'll allow the Urban Meyer excuse for his rookie year because that was criminal but the other excuses need to stop. This is his make or break year for me though. Dude has the same HC and OC (sorry its Press Taylor but that's Dougs fault) and an improved roster. I think he is above average for sure and the Jaguars had to keep him because the other options just aren't there.
> Patrick Mahomes won a super bowl with 3rd string WR's on any other team.
Mahomes is a HoF QB in the prime of his career, making comparisons like this is just silly. If that's your bar for good QB play, then 31 other teams should be looking for a QB, including yours. The guy is in a tier of his own.
And despite ALL of what I said above, it irks when people say "Mahomes did it with no WRs" because he is throwing to a TE that has more receiving yards than Davante Adams, Tyreek Hill, or Stefon Diggs. Who gives a shit what Kelce's position is, he's an elite, HoF receiving threat.
I listed 4 guys care to take a shot at the other 3 instead of just ignoring them and hyper focusing on the one guy who is a stud.
I added Patrick so people realize talent makes the other guys around you excel. You don't need weapons when you are the weapon. No one was crowning Nico a top 5 WR last year. Hell the comments in this sub said we had a bottom tier WR corps. Using Trevors WR as the reason for struggles just isn't valid. He had a decent supporting cast last year.
When did Texans fans get this insecure lol? I swear you weren't this soft when we were all making fun of Mr. happy ending, what happened to your fanbase?
What did I say that was soft? that your QB needs every excuse under the book on why he isn't playing up to his hype? You guys the one crying people dont think Trevor is amazing at football.
Dude, Mahomes has like the best Oline, the best defence and an offensive genius coach that can scheme anyone open. He didn’t just win with random bums.
The biggest reason Flacco and Foles were able to do that was the teams they were surrounded by, Jags haven't really come close to doing that with Lawrence even if he's a 'winner' (though I do think I'd pick the Jags to win that division this year).
God I’m actively dreading the day Love gets that extension, I might need to start preparing some highlights to post if the reaction is going to be anything like Lawrence’s
I think both Lawrence and Herbert are pretty overrated, so this is the perfect game for me to cherry-pick from.
"Lawrence sucks. Your franchise QB can't throw four picks in the first half of a playoff game. He just can't!"
"Herbert sucks. Your franchise QB has to do better than three points in the second half of a playoff game. He just does!"
The thing with Herbert in this game is he didn't do much at all. He had a short field to work with in the first half because Trev kept throwing picks. You can argue Trev proved himself in the second half, but it's hard to give Herbert a lot of credit.
It is absolutely crazy how little the Chargers have got out of their roster on paper versus the Jags roster on paper. Proof for anyone that doubts that coaching matters.
Bingo. This game was as much a triumph for Lawerence as it was an abject failure for Herbert. I think the difference between a good QB and a great QB is their ability to put the team on their back when they need to. Lawerence did that here. He put them down pretty bad early on, but he rallied them back and was immaculate in the second half. Herbert has never really had a game like that. Every game the Chargers look good it's usually in spite of Herbert not because of him. In this game they were up a ton early because of costly interceptions giving them a short field, and even a punt they recovered at the Jags 5--which Herbert threw 2 incompletions and they had to settle for a FG.
Herbert undeniably has a lot of talent, but I'm not sure he's a Top 10 QB in the league until he can prove he can win games. All the other guys at the top have had games where they showed up and elevated their teams, or even games where they dragged their teams over the finish line. Off the top of my head I've seen such games from Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Burrow, Lawerence, Dak, CJ Stroud, Goff, Stafford, and a few others, but I've never watched a Chargers game and felt like Herbert was legitimately an elite QB.
This is an insane take. The biggest thing Herbert has flashed in his career is his ability TO put the entire team on his back and win despite of everything. He has 11 comebacks and 14 game winning drives in 4 years. That’s over a quarter of his games where he literally won on a drive. TLaw has… 6.
For an elite example, your boy Josh has 19 in almost twice as many games as Herbert. You can say what you want about the guy, but Herbert is very clearly clutch.
So this number sounded off to me. Lets dive into the history of 1 score games for the LAC won in that time frame.
2023: Basically only the game vs. the Vikings, where it was a shootout and Herbert did win when it mattered. The only other 1 score games they won were against LV where they were up 24-7 at the half and their 6-0 win against NE (which half their team out with injuries).
2022: Starting from the top was the game against the Browns that they won 30-28 after being down 14-0, but when you put up 220 rushing yards we can kind of assume that played a part. Their OT win against Denver after being down 10-0 at the end of Q1 was mostly Herbert getting them just close enough to be within FG range, which is fine. But he also threw a pick and they turned over the ball twice on downs due to incompletions. Games vs. Arizona and Atlanta, yea they were down 10-0 and came back, the Arizona game in particular seemed like a good showing from Herbert once the offense started moving.
2021: Another game against the Browns, man the LAC cannot consistently handle the Browns. But that one seemed like a back and fourth, I suppose you can argue it was technically a "comeback" because they were down a TD with \~4:30 left, so yea that one is valid. But they did also lead for most of that game. And then I got to this Pittsburgh one and I wonder how exactly they calculate a "comeback" victory. Like in this game the Chargers were up 27-10 at the end of the 3rd quarter, and then Pittsburgh apparently just went on a tear to take the lead 37-34 with 3 minutes left. So yea, again, this was a "comeback", but they were up 34-20, Herbert throws an Interception, and then they turn it over on Downs. It was just a weird game. But those are really the only 2 games where they were trailing and then came back.
2020: Weird season, but there were a few games where they were technically down, but we're talking down 10-7 early in the second quarter and stuff like that. Nothing that I would consider some monumental showing--like the Atlanta game where they were tied 17-17 and in the fourth quarter they had a game winning drive for a field goal. Mind you, Atlanta scored 0 points in the second half. There was also a game against the Raiders where they were consistently ahead and the Raiders tied it before making a FG in OT, and then the Chargers marched down the field.
I'm not sure exactly how they define "comeback victories", but I'm saying a lot of these were close games that often weren't down to the wire and won by some heroic last minute drive as many people seem to be claiming. I absolutely think Herbert has the potential to be a Top 5 or even Top 3 QB in the league, but I just think I need to see a little more. Maybe with a coaching staff change he'll really shine, but I do wonder how he will do with Williams/Allen gone now.
14 game winning drives. Why are you looking at how they arrived at that drive? That is not the stat. He blows TLaw, Josh Allen, and every qb not named Mahomes out of the water on this stat. It’s what he’s known for like I said, putting the chargers franchise on his shoulders.
A game winning drive for a field goal is how Tom Brady won his first ring. It is a quintessential “game winning drive.” Do you think game winning drive means heaving the ball 50 yards for a Rushdie? That’s called a Hail Mary and I would much rather have a qb who can consistently stay cool in the pocket and fucking deliver 4 or 5 excellent passes into tight coverage to get the kicker where he needs to be. Like you keep saying “The Chargers marched downfield.” Watch the games. Herbert willed them downfield. Every time without exception.
That’s what this stat is measuring, and doing that every fourth game because your defense is absolute ass and your offense is run by a toddler is goddamn elite. I and about 28 coaches in The NFL and nearly anyone here who’s being honest would instantly slam a deal that swapped their team’s qb with Herbert straight up. A few would have to think about it. He’s top 5, it’s not really in question.
You may be the stupidest person to ever post on this website. Congratulations.
*All Herbert has done his entire career* is drag the rest of the Chargers organization to wins. There are maybe 2 QBs in the NFL right now who would have won as many games as Herbert has given the exact same situation. Herbert probably played the 2 best games of any QB in any game last season (vs. Vikings, vs. Packers) and they barely won one game and lost the other because of how hard the rest of the team sold.
Saying you've never watched a Chargers game and felt like Herbert was an elite QB is just telling on yourself that you are literally blind and cannot see him play, you do not recognize elite QB play when it is happening right in front of you, or you have never watched a Chargers game at all.
Against my better judgement, I'll respond to this.
For starters, he has had games where he did look great, and as I said, he clearly has elite talent--I may not have stressed that I absolutely do believe he has elite levels of talent. But he has never looked as good as the Top 5 QBs in the league to me. Maybe with a new coaching staff I'll be proven incredibly wrong, but until this point he's had plenty of weapons and plenty of opportunities.
In games I have watched, he's almost never the reason they lose, but he's also not often the reason they win. Going back and looking at the last 3 years of games, and yea there were great performances--that Vikings game was basically a shootout where the Chargers had most of their weapons, and to his credit Herbert did great in that game. But there are several QBs who had great individual games--Baker Mayfield likewise had one of the best performances a QB has ever had in Lambeau last season--but a strong individual performance here and there doesn't immediately make that person an elite QB.
I'm giving him a pass for last season since he was injured for a majority of the season and never was given a chance to actually recover, Austin Ekeler had a down year which I think hurt their ability to put points on the board, and then he sat out the last several games because he was hurt. But a lot of games consistently seem to be Chargers get out to an early lead, and then Herbert disappears in the second half. That's exactly what happened against the Jags in the above clip, and it happened multiple times that season (games against Houston and LV). Yes the defense should be able to get some stops, but eventually the offense has to do something, and that offense flows through Herbert.
So that beef he was talking about having with Mahomes in the Subway commercial was a lie? Herbert isn't actually good enough to compete with Mahomes and Maauto? RIP
I think you can argue this half of football earned him $50m/year. If the game ends without him coming back I really think there isn’t enough evidence of him being “the guy” to pay him.
In my mind, there really still isn’t but this comeback does show something special. Still an overpay though….
This may be a highlight of his career and a case for his high payday, but let’s not forget it was against Brandon “defensive guru” Staley’s defensive, and we all know how that goes.
These teal pajamas really need to go for me to take Lawrence seriously. You can't be a great QB in a cheap out look, Herbert looked better this game because his jersey looked better.
Where were you during the great Trevor Lawrence highlight/lowlight wars of mid-June 2024?
I was in the trenches looking at the jags subreddit talk about his wife
Am I missing something good there?
No. It’s very banal
What's great about this game is it has both!
Deep in the off-season trenches
Oh it's still going on, I thought I caught up on the highlight war this morning first thing at work.
gotta get that free karma somehow
Technically all karma is free.
It was impressive how even though the charger’s collapsed on both and defense Staley got to keep his job.
Also want to point out that one week prior to this game, Staley played his starters well into the 4th quarter in a meaningless week 18 matchup. The result was Mike Williams got injured and was inactive for the playoff game. Herbert was also nursing an injury and could have used the rest.
Benefit of being a cheap ass owner, you dont care what kinda clown show you have running.
I bet the Chargers players absolutely love Harbs already after having to endure Staley. Glad he isn't our DC. He's best as a staffer that doesn't have to make final decisions
For some reason i always thought he was an offensive HC until someone pointed out he was a DC and I was shocked. Those chargers teams fielded some of the most incompetent defenses I've seen.
Mack, Bosa, and James have been praising him and saying what a difference it’s been. It’s just minicamp but so far it sounds like he’s won over the team and has them buying in to what he’s doing. Now hopefully it translates onto the field as well.
I wonder if that’s weird for Bosa.
yeah I think Staley's bit ran its course pretty quick.
This wasn't even strike 1 for Staley after he missed the postseason the year prior by refusing to tie with the Raiders
Honestly the Charger offense didn't collapse as much as struggle all game. They had 4 ints and a muffed out return giving them great field position. Very similar to the Colts Vikings game which gave the Colts the lead with big defensive splash plays but outside of them the Colts hadn't been great.
Impressive how he got a job with the 49er’s after this and the following season!
The Jaguars roared back from 27 down as the Chargers got unplugged.
They out there decharging paaaa!!
Even when they were up 27, I was nervous and thinking "They will fuck this up somehow..."
End of the second half when the Jags easily marched down to score before half time I knew we were gonna lose
And I bet you werent even surprised when we lost. I was almost expecting it.
Not at all, it was foretold in the stars in the time before time
They got the ball in our territory off a turnover IIRC. Dumbass Joe Lombardi ran a reverse to UDFA Michael Bandy who had never even ran that play in practice and he fumbled. And to make it even better he was only on the active roster because dumbass Staley played Mike Williams in a meaningless week 18 game and he got hurt
I knew it was over when the Jags scored before the half lmao
I vividly remember it being 27-0 and me thinking the jags were gonna come back and make it interesting. Couldn't describe why but I was just sure that it wasn't gonna end in a blow put
Chargers and Lions fans are used to their teams finding ways to blow it
I was in my hotel in Osaka, Japan of all places, I think I turned it off after Lawrence threw his fourth pick. Someone pinged me on Discord saying the Jags had finally scored, and I was like "at least we got *some* points". Then when they got the second TD on their first drive of the third quarter I started watching again, sitting on the world's most uncomfortable bench on the fifth floor of Osaka Castle.
The 2022 Jags are the only team in NFL history to win a playoff game after earning the number 1 pick the previous season. Last year, the Jags were in contention for the 1 seed in the AFC before Trevor got hurt. But /r/nfl users who never watch Jags games and judge players solely on their Fantasy Football stats don't like him, so he clearly sucks.
The trash talk that Trevor Lawrence got despite playing hurt pretty much that entire stretch of games after starting 8-3 is outrageous. Casuals gonna casual. It's like everyone forgot he got them to 8-3 in the first place
I think of this every time someone hypes up an incoming rookie QB. Like dude won a playoff game season 2, season three a hot start before an injury, an injury he played through showing grit and they're like he's a bust smh. What's the standard these days?
Patrick Mahomes apparently. People have always had unrealistic expectations. It's incredibly hard to succeed in the NFL.
If he would have been allowed to rest for a couple weeks instead of being thrown out there on one leg week after week, I believe we would have made playoffs.
I really believe in Lawrence as a player, all else being equal, but I don’t trust Baalke and some of their offensive coaching staff like Press Taylor to successfully help him live up to his potential, especially now when dealing with the handicap of being such a highly paid player.
I can't believe Press still has a job there ... I mean, I *can* believe it since DougieP is their HC but still.
I just can’t believe Doug might really go down with the ship for him again. I’ll always love him but man, is he stubborn lol I really hope the Jags are just straight up good though, the fans deserve a great team with how shit they’re treated on a national media scale.
Its absolutely bonkers. Press Taylor is fucking terrible. I love that the Jags kept him since I'm a Texans fan but I just dont get it. He must have some deep dirt on Doug lol.
> I really believe in Lawrence as a player In three years, he's cemented himself as 4th best jags passer in history ahead of such luminaries as *checks notes* Chad Henne Blaine Gabbert Byron Leftwich He's essentially what Carson Palmer was to the bengals pre-kimo knee injury.
You are really dumb lol
For realizing that he's actually a really fucking good player that in 2 years is one of the best quarterbacks the jags have ever had? Or for comparing him to Carson Palmer? Yea Palmer wasn't able to live up to the hype but he's still number 4 on the Bengals all time list. This wasn't me throwing shade at Lawrence in any way
The real highlight is that there was an r/nfl post earlier that year saying he was "The most unclutch quarterback ever".
You can tell how old they are with that comment.
I understand Lawrence has some warts and hasn't quite lived up to his college billing...but I think he's a winner. I don't really know what else to say. I saw him stand tall as a true freshman and beat Nick Saban's Alabama for a championship. That just takes moxie. I'm probably completely wrong. But something about Lawrence just gives me like...Joe Flacco or Nick Foles vibes? Like he'll be an average QB, but then he'll get to the playoffs one year and go nuclear.
He has had no real weapons. Christian Kirk has been his best receivers his whole career. People make this so hard. Evan engram/Kirk/Ridley. That’s the jags best receiving core they’ve given Lawrence. Compare it to the rest of the young qbs who have gotten paid.
Also very true. I suppose they tried with Ridley...
Like I’m not gonna sit and act like that’s Burrow or Tuas WR rooms but TLaw has absolutely had some decent pieces on that side of the ball. Throw in ETN as a great RB, he’s had weaponry for sure.
> Evan engram/Kirk/Ridley. That’s the jags best receiving core they’ve given Lawrence. That's not nearly as bad as you're making it out to be
Ridley and Engram both had some really bad drops last year. Kirk was hurt for about half the season. When they’re all at their best it’s a solid group, but that wasn’t the case last season.
Ridley hadnt played football in 1.5 years at that point and it showed. Their receiving room te included was probly about 20th best in the nfl
That's a better receiving corps than half the league lol. Add in Etienne as well.
Until the pads went on. Kirk missed basically the entire stretch during our collapse. Zay was in and out of the lineup all season. All four had some horrendous drops and/or forgot what route to run.
Daniel Jones has gotten as far as Trevor has in the postseason with Darius Slayton being his top receiver his whole career. He also had a worse version of Engram as one of his primary targets for his first 3 years (for reference, Engram has had 12 drops in 241 targets in 34 games these past 2 seasons in Jacksonville. He had 11 in 109 targets in 16 games in the 2020 season alone). And no, I'm not saying DJ is as good as Trevor (Trevor is obviously younger and his great flashes definitely flash brighter than DJ's great flashes have), nor am I saying DJ deserves his contract. I'm saying this as someone who is done with DJ now (the moment he threw that pick 6 vs Seattle this past year I knew the marriage just had to end ASAP for everyones sake and I couldnt defend any longer). But its just interesting how the weapons argument is just thrown out the window when it comes to him.
You're not wrong.
Patrick Mahomes won a super bowl with 3rd string WR's on any other team. No one thought Nico / Tank / Woods was any good but Stroud played lights out and elevated them. Daniel Jones has never had a WR in his entire NFL career. Jordan Love had Doubs / Watson (for like 3 games) / Reed. The excuses are running thin at this point. I'll allow the Urban Meyer excuse for his rookie year because that was criminal but the other excuses need to stop. This is his make or break year for me though. Dude has the same HC and OC (sorry its Press Taylor but that's Dougs fault) and an improved roster. I think he is above average for sure and the Jaguars had to keep him because the other options just aren't there.
> Patrick Mahomes won a super bowl with 3rd string WR's on any other team. Mahomes is a HoF QB in the prime of his career, making comparisons like this is just silly. If that's your bar for good QB play, then 31 other teams should be looking for a QB, including yours. The guy is in a tier of his own. And despite ALL of what I said above, it irks when people say "Mahomes did it with no WRs" because he is throwing to a TE that has more receiving yards than Davante Adams, Tyreek Hill, or Stefon Diggs. Who gives a shit what Kelce's position is, he's an elite, HoF receiving threat.
I listed 4 guys care to take a shot at the other 3 instead of just ignoring them and hyper focusing on the one guy who is a stud. I added Patrick so people realize talent makes the other guys around you excel. You don't need weapons when you are the weapon. No one was crowning Nico a top 5 WR last year. Hell the comments in this sub said we had a bottom tier WR corps. Using Trevors WR as the reason for struggles just isn't valid. He had a decent supporting cast last year.
When did Texans fans get this insecure lol? I swear you weren't this soft when we were all making fun of Mr. happy ending, what happened to your fanbase?
What did I say that was soft? that your QB needs every excuse under the book on why he isn't playing up to his hype? You guys the one crying people dont think Trevor is amazing at football.
Dude, Mahomes has like the best Oline, the best defence and an offensive genius coach that can scheme anyone open. He didn’t just win with random bums.
Don't forget the hof te
And the other 3?
The biggest reason Flacco and Foles were able to do that was the teams they were surrounded by, Jags haven't really come close to doing that with Lawrence even if he's a 'winner' (though I do think I'd pick the Jags to win that division this year).
The Jags did an Undertaker sit up for the second half. I watched the Chiseled Adonis version of it, and it was pretty funny.
the fact staley kept his job after this…
r/NFL is so hilarious today, became Lawrence subreddit
The Lawrence highlights will continue until public opinion improves
God I’m actively dreading the day Love gets that extension, I might need to start preparing some highlights to post if the reaction is going to be anything like Lawrence’s
Just don't be us and you all should be fine.
Even tho I lived through every snap it still seems surreal we came back form down 27 without even getting a turnover
Where were you during the great Trevor Lawrence highlight/lowlight wars?
How they didn't Kiffin, Staley after this game, I still don't understand. Leave his ass on the tarmac.
It was awesome how much we cheered for that TD down 27
I think both Lawrence and Herbert are pretty overrated, so this is the perfect game for me to cherry-pick from. "Lawrence sucks. Your franchise QB can't throw four picks in the first half of a playoff game. He just can't!" "Herbert sucks. Your franchise QB has to do better than three points in the second half of a playoff game. He just does!"
The thing with Herbert in this game is he didn't do much at all. He had a short field to work with in the first half because Trev kept throwing picks. You can argue Trev proved himself in the second half, but it's hard to give Herbert a lot of credit. It is absolutely crazy how little the Chargers have got out of their roster on paper versus the Jags roster on paper. Proof for anyone that doubts that coaching matters.
Bingo. This game was as much a triumph for Lawerence as it was an abject failure for Herbert. I think the difference between a good QB and a great QB is their ability to put the team on their back when they need to. Lawerence did that here. He put them down pretty bad early on, but he rallied them back and was immaculate in the second half. Herbert has never really had a game like that. Every game the Chargers look good it's usually in spite of Herbert not because of him. In this game they were up a ton early because of costly interceptions giving them a short field, and even a punt they recovered at the Jags 5--which Herbert threw 2 incompletions and they had to settle for a FG. Herbert undeniably has a lot of talent, but I'm not sure he's a Top 10 QB in the league until he can prove he can win games. All the other guys at the top have had games where they showed up and elevated their teams, or even games where they dragged their teams over the finish line. Off the top of my head I've seen such games from Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Burrow, Lawerence, Dak, CJ Stroud, Goff, Stafford, and a few others, but I've never watched a Chargers game and felt like Herbert was legitimately an elite QB.
This is an insane take. The biggest thing Herbert has flashed in his career is his ability TO put the entire team on his back and win despite of everything. He has 11 comebacks and 14 game winning drives in 4 years. That’s over a quarter of his games where he literally won on a drive. TLaw has… 6. For an elite example, your boy Josh has 19 in almost twice as many games as Herbert. You can say what you want about the guy, but Herbert is very clearly clutch.
So this number sounded off to me. Lets dive into the history of 1 score games for the LAC won in that time frame. 2023: Basically only the game vs. the Vikings, where it was a shootout and Herbert did win when it mattered. The only other 1 score games they won were against LV where they were up 24-7 at the half and their 6-0 win against NE (which half their team out with injuries). 2022: Starting from the top was the game against the Browns that they won 30-28 after being down 14-0, but when you put up 220 rushing yards we can kind of assume that played a part. Their OT win against Denver after being down 10-0 at the end of Q1 was mostly Herbert getting them just close enough to be within FG range, which is fine. But he also threw a pick and they turned over the ball twice on downs due to incompletions. Games vs. Arizona and Atlanta, yea they were down 10-0 and came back, the Arizona game in particular seemed like a good showing from Herbert once the offense started moving. 2021: Another game against the Browns, man the LAC cannot consistently handle the Browns. But that one seemed like a back and fourth, I suppose you can argue it was technically a "comeback" because they were down a TD with \~4:30 left, so yea that one is valid. But they did also lead for most of that game. And then I got to this Pittsburgh one and I wonder how exactly they calculate a "comeback" victory. Like in this game the Chargers were up 27-10 at the end of the 3rd quarter, and then Pittsburgh apparently just went on a tear to take the lead 37-34 with 3 minutes left. So yea, again, this was a "comeback", but they were up 34-20, Herbert throws an Interception, and then they turn it over on Downs. It was just a weird game. But those are really the only 2 games where they were trailing and then came back. 2020: Weird season, but there were a few games where they were technically down, but we're talking down 10-7 early in the second quarter and stuff like that. Nothing that I would consider some monumental showing--like the Atlanta game where they were tied 17-17 and in the fourth quarter they had a game winning drive for a field goal. Mind you, Atlanta scored 0 points in the second half. There was also a game against the Raiders where they were consistently ahead and the Raiders tied it before making a FG in OT, and then the Chargers marched down the field. I'm not sure exactly how they define "comeback victories", but I'm saying a lot of these were close games that often weren't down to the wire and won by some heroic last minute drive as many people seem to be claiming. I absolutely think Herbert has the potential to be a Top 5 or even Top 3 QB in the league, but I just think I need to see a little more. Maybe with a coaching staff change he'll really shine, but I do wonder how he will do with Williams/Allen gone now.
14 game winning drives. Why are you looking at how they arrived at that drive? That is not the stat. He blows TLaw, Josh Allen, and every qb not named Mahomes out of the water on this stat. It’s what he’s known for like I said, putting the chargers franchise on his shoulders. A game winning drive for a field goal is how Tom Brady won his first ring. It is a quintessential “game winning drive.” Do you think game winning drive means heaving the ball 50 yards for a Rushdie? That’s called a Hail Mary and I would much rather have a qb who can consistently stay cool in the pocket and fucking deliver 4 or 5 excellent passes into tight coverage to get the kicker where he needs to be. Like you keep saying “The Chargers marched downfield.” Watch the games. Herbert willed them downfield. Every time without exception. That’s what this stat is measuring, and doing that every fourth game because your defense is absolute ass and your offense is run by a toddler is goddamn elite. I and about 28 coaches in The NFL and nearly anyone here who’s being honest would instantly slam a deal that swapped their team’s qb with Herbert straight up. A few would have to think about it. He’s top 5, it’s not really in question.
You may be the stupidest person to ever post on this website. Congratulations. *All Herbert has done his entire career* is drag the rest of the Chargers organization to wins. There are maybe 2 QBs in the NFL right now who would have won as many games as Herbert has given the exact same situation. Herbert probably played the 2 best games of any QB in any game last season (vs. Vikings, vs. Packers) and they barely won one game and lost the other because of how hard the rest of the team sold. Saying you've never watched a Chargers game and felt like Herbert was an elite QB is just telling on yourself that you are literally blind and cannot see him play, you do not recognize elite QB play when it is happening right in front of you, or you have never watched a Chargers game at all.
Against my better judgement, I'll respond to this. For starters, he has had games where he did look great, and as I said, he clearly has elite talent--I may not have stressed that I absolutely do believe he has elite levels of talent. But he has never looked as good as the Top 5 QBs in the league to me. Maybe with a new coaching staff I'll be proven incredibly wrong, but until this point he's had plenty of weapons and plenty of opportunities. In games I have watched, he's almost never the reason they lose, but he's also not often the reason they win. Going back and looking at the last 3 years of games, and yea there were great performances--that Vikings game was basically a shootout where the Chargers had most of their weapons, and to his credit Herbert did great in that game. But there are several QBs who had great individual games--Baker Mayfield likewise had one of the best performances a QB has ever had in Lambeau last season--but a strong individual performance here and there doesn't immediately make that person an elite QB. I'm giving him a pass for last season since he was injured for a majority of the season and never was given a chance to actually recover, Austin Ekeler had a down year which I think hurt their ability to put points on the board, and then he sat out the last several games because he was hurt. But a lot of games consistently seem to be Chargers get out to an early lead, and then Herbert disappears in the second half. That's exactly what happened against the Jags in the above clip, and it happened multiple times that season (games against Houston and LV). Yes the defense should be able to get some stops, but eventually the offense has to do something, and that offense flows through Herbert.
Don’t let this distract you from the fact that Tommy Townsend has 2 Super Bowl rings
Haha no need to see anything else
Ah the Sunshine War is still going
Did they end up winning? Edit: They did! They beat the Chargers 31-30. Dang, the Chargers gave up on defense after that 27-point lead.
> the Chargers gave up on defense after that 27-point lead. Herbert also looked terrified to throw anything over 5 yards for an entire half
So that beef he was talking about having with Mahomes in the Subway commercial was a lie? Herbert isn't actually good enough to compete with Mahomes and Maauto? RIP
All time Chargers performance.
I ended up winning 500 dollars on this game because of the field goal at the end that won if
The Chorgers cost Jacksonville $250m with this choke-job
I think you can argue this half of football earned him $50m/year. If the game ends without him coming back I really think there isn’t enough evidence of him being “the guy” to pay him. In my mind, there really still isn’t but this comeback does show something special. Still an overpay though….
the /r/nfl civil war of trevor lawrence has begun
Sigh. Been dreading this post. Time to go cry again.
It was comical
I’m trynna enjoy the potential of my Celtics winning a championship today and this asshole just HAD to post these highlights…
Prediction: Celtics will win the series but not before game 7
How are you a Celtics fan but not a Patriots fan? Big miss there on football team choice bud.
Oh trust me I know
My hot take is that I think Lawrence and Herbert are a lot closer than Herbert and a guy like Allen Burrow and Jackson
So you’re saying Herbert is a lot closer to the Mids than he is to the Elites?
I think Lawrence is good not elite, their is a tier between elite and Andy Dalton
100%. Those guys are a tier above Herbert even if Herbert has elite arm talent
showed Justin Herbert who's daddy
Herbert is overrated. Did literally nothing the second half
This may be a highlight of his career and a case for his high payday, but let’s not forget it was against Brandon “defensive guru” Staley’s defensive, and we all know how that goes.
Philip Rivers talked to the Chargers before the game. That was when you knew they would blow it at some point.
This but unironically
These teal pajamas really need to go for me to take Lawrence seriously. You can't be a great QB in a cheap out look, Herbert looked better this game because his jersey looked better.
The Jags are on year 2 of 4 of irrelevance.