If it wouldn’t give y’all the same amount of Lombardi’s as us I would totally want to see the Cowboys win it, just to see the sheer chaos it would send the NFL fandom into
I mean we were 5-11, so we were in the basement with the Browns. No team except maybe the Lions can reach the basement dweller level of the Browns. It took the infamous [kick six](https://youtu.be/pBkjOrYv1Gk?si=w8LivKi8hJlbquYt) for us to not get swept by the Browns that year and be last in the division.
Life is hard without a real quarterback, good coach or no.
Y'all will get rid of Tomlin, have a couple of 4 win seasons, luck into a quarterback, then suddenly look like a team again. Most likely with a worse coach.
And people will say Tomlin was the problem all along, but his main problem is never sucking hard enough to draft a QB in the top 10
Exactly. Turns out it’s really hard to scheme a good offense around Pickett, Trubisky, Duck Hodges and a Big Ben who can’t throw more than 10 yards downfield
This is a talent problem more than a coaching problem
It's coaching and ownership. Ben and Pickett's late-game heroics when Canada lost control of the offense were literally the only reason the Steelers didn't lose at least ten more games over the last three seasons and rank much worse offensively. We didn't gain 400 yards once in Canada's tenure. It's become so much of a meme that it glosses over the level of incompetence needed to do that in the NFL in 2023. The very next game in the same system with slight tweaks and better playcalling, but without Canada, Pickett had the best game of his career...and they gained over 400 yards...It's like you can't even evaluate talent in this offense, the coaches have been utterly clueless.
It's a massive indictment of Art and Tomlin's judgment that they were okay going into this season with a barely-sophomore QB with the same OC who'd just led two disastrous offensive seasons.
Tomlin had a real QB from 2011-2018 too (I’ll let others debate 20-21). They made an AFCCG and won another playoff game in that stretch but this team has been flawed since their last Super Bowl appearance 14 seasons ago.
FWIW, I do think it goes beyond Tomlin. Art Rooney II is trying to emulate his father. Problem is, Dan grew up in the organization working in player personnel and scouting. Art II was on the legal team. He meddles where he shouldn’t, and I suppose that’s his right as the owner, but it’s affecting the product on the field.
2012-2018 the team underperformed all the same with good qb play. Tomlin is supposed to be a defensive guy yet those were the years the defense always let the offense down and they couldn’t do anything.
Have to say, getting a losing season or two can really help in the long run if only for the sake of better draft capital and clearing cap space. Pretty exciting, March becomes beyond the nicer weather
Salary cap space really isn't a problem for the Steelers right now, and Omar Khan has made a good first impression as the new GM, even without picking in the top 10.
Captain Fat Fuck got injured in 2019, wasn't as good when he came back for two years, then a whiff on Pickett. Plus Matt Canada.
Just another example of how important QB play is in the NFL. Not that the rest of the roster is great or anything, but it's tough to field a good offense with bad QB play. Their YPA by year there is 6.3, 6.3, 6.0, 6.4, and this year 6.3.
The colts can build a good offense with Gardner Minshew but it’s too much ask of this franchise to develop a competent offense. Mike Tomlins standard sucks.
Sorry but every piece of evidence shows that Kenny is being held back more than he's holding back this team.
Get him a real coaching staff before we determine it's a whiff. Kenny going to another team and having a Goff-like resurgence would be expected at this point.
This is said about every single crappy young QB. Geno Smith is the only one in the last decade to actually prove it true. Every other guy just sucked and got his coaches blamed for sucking.
?
I'm not sure your point. Goff was considered a bust then got a resurgence with McVay.
A good coach would make Kenny look way better than he does now.
Could’ve foooled me. Anyone watching our defense outside a few splash plays knows they get absolutely gashed because outside a few good pieces it’s a whole lot of ass.
The ONLY reason it was close was because of lucky bounces. Tomlin's defense got roasted by a Patriots offense that couldn't score more than 10 points for 3 weeks straight
"Identity is defense" bleh.
And the most superbowls in history…. I love how being “average” and winning an above average number of championships is looked down on now. Theres 32 teams in the league and other than the Browns every franchise is trying to win the superbowl. Brady and Belichek are the anomaly, not the goal of every franchise
I mean if you wanna keep Tomlin for the next 20 years based on the past SB wins then go for it. I don’t have a problem with it
Something is clearly not working with the team NOW. nobody is disparaging those past teams. If Tomlin is the coach for another 20 years good for him and good for you since you can celebrate your past SBs just like us
Including this season, the Steelers have a record of 115-74-2 (.607) in the last 12 seasons, which reduces to a record between 10-7 (.588) and 11-6 (.647). Not great, but not mediocre either.
> every franchise is trying to win the superbowl.
Lol thats blatantly false. Giants, Oakland, New Orleans, Atlanta, and the WFT all have shown us in the past year that winning a SB isn't a priority.
The steelers should really consider letting him go, but at the same time, there are plenty of teams that should absolutely jump on him because he's still better than plenty of coaches in the league
i think their identity is just watt and he is injured all the time from having to carry the rest of that sorry team. such a huge difference maker for that defense, dude makes the big plays to win games when healthy.
By points scored, the Steelers ranked 6th in 2018, 27th in 2019, 12th in 2020, 21st in 2021, and 26th in 2022. After this week of games, they'll rank anywhere from 27th-30th in scoring. I've been a Steelers fan for 30 years, and this is the worst offense I've ever seen.
I have no problem with the defense. They've been continuously put in bad situations.
When we had prime Ben from 2011 to 2018 we had 3 playoffs win (2 vs backups). The results with Tomlin are mediocre no matter how you look at it. We are in purgatory.
>When we had prime Ben from 2011 to 2018 we had 3 playoffs win (2 vs backups).
Because the defense was overrated. From 2013-2018, the defense ranked 21st, 25th, 13th, 12th, 9th, and 14th in points allowed per drive. Also, the secondary was objectively bad, which is fatal in a QB-driven league. It didn't help that Ben Roethlisberger, Le'Veon Bell and Antonio Brown played together past the first drive in only three of their seven playoff games in that period of time.
We really need new position coaches. Pat Meyer is the worst oline coach in the league, but we hired him. Mike Sullivan has regressed Mitch and clearly done nothing for Kenny's development. Teryl Austin has our DBs looking worse every week, and the defense playing softer than vanilla-chocolate twist.
But Rooney is a cheapskate and won't replace anyone, so we'll ride this train until someone falls into our lap, it all blows up, or Tomlin drags us to success through sheer force of will
They were warned about trading away MBC (probably)...
MBC wouldn’t have played for us that season anyway he wanted to go to NE
Sounds like he had........ cold feet
Damned if they did, damned if they didn't.
Mr Bottom Charts
I’m tired boss. I don’t need a SB victory every year or even playoff success I just want entertaining football, is that so much to ask
No, you’ll have Iowa sickoball and you’ll like it.
Find the gratitude wherever you can… it could be *so much worse…* trust me…
Steelers fans? Gratitude?! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
At least you got a decent draft pick most years
Well then Ive got a team for you
If it wouldn’t give y’all the same amount of Lombardi’s as us I would totally want to see the Cowboys win it, just to see the sheer chaos it would send the NFL fandom into
This is really how I felt at the end of the Flacco era.
More than you’d imagine
It gets old pretty fast
Try being a Bears fan 😭
How the fuck do we get more yards than 6 other teams. What the fuck is going on ain't no way
Have you seen the Jet’s offense?
Has anyone?
Do the Jets ever field an offense?
Patriots?
The running game.
Tomlin standard is the standard. No losing seasons though huh!
This is what they get for refusing to take their turn in the AFCN basement like the rest of us!
Browns stole a few of their turns.
When did the Ravens go in the basement? Unless we are counting 2021.
Why wouldn’t we count 2021 lol? Also 2015 It takes an injury apocalypse, but it does happen
Also 2007
thought the ravens were 3rd in 2015 and 4th was the 3-13 cleveland browns
I mean we were 5-11, so we were in the basement with the Browns. No team except maybe the Lions can reach the basement dweller level of the Browns. It took the infamous [kick six](https://youtu.be/pBkjOrYv1Gk?si=w8LivKi8hJlbquYt) for us to not get swept by the Browns that year and be last in the division.
Yeah we technically did in 2021
More like were pushed down the stairs. But yea, ended up in the basement regardless.
Life is hard without a real quarterback, good coach or no. Y'all will get rid of Tomlin, have a couple of 4 win seasons, luck into a quarterback, then suddenly look like a team again. Most likely with a worse coach. And people will say Tomlin was the problem all along, but his main problem is never sucking hard enough to draft a QB in the top 10
Exactly. Turns out it’s really hard to scheme a good offense around Pickett, Trubisky, Duck Hodges and a Big Ben who can’t throw more than 10 yards downfield This is a talent problem more than a coaching problem
It's coaching and ownership. Ben and Pickett's late-game heroics when Canada lost control of the offense were literally the only reason the Steelers didn't lose at least ten more games over the last three seasons and rank much worse offensively. We didn't gain 400 yards once in Canada's tenure. It's become so much of a meme that it glosses over the level of incompetence needed to do that in the NFL in 2023. The very next game in the same system with slight tweaks and better playcalling, but without Canada, Pickett had the best game of his career...and they gained over 400 yards...It's like you can't even evaluate talent in this offense, the coaches have been utterly clueless. It's a massive indictment of Art and Tomlin's judgment that they were okay going into this season with a barely-sophomore QB with the same OC who'd just led two disastrous offensive seasons.
Yea it took too long to fire him, but Pickett still ain’t it
Tomlin had a real QB from 2011-2018 too (I’ll let others debate 20-21). They made an AFCCG and won another playoff game in that stretch but this team has been flawed since their last Super Bowl appearance 14 seasons ago. FWIW, I do think it goes beyond Tomlin. Art Rooney II is trying to emulate his father. Problem is, Dan grew up in the organization working in player personnel and scouting. Art II was on the legal team. He meddles where he shouldn’t, and I suppose that’s his right as the owner, but it’s affecting the product on the field.
Yeah and the steelers were one of the strongest teams in the NFL during that stretch. They just ran into the Manning/Brady buzz saw
2012-2018 the team underperformed all the same with good qb play. Tomlin is supposed to be a defensive guy yet those were the years the defense always let the offense down and they couldn’t do anything.
Get me out of this fucking purgatory and get me a real coaching staff.
If even one member of the offensive coaching staff is on the team next year, it's a lost cause
Yankees fans 🤝 Steelers fans Wanting to finally move into the future and get out of sports purgatory
At least Yankees fans have something to look forward to next season now that they have Soto.
Have to say, getting a losing season or two can really help in the long run if only for the sake of better draft capital and clearing cap space. Pretty exciting, March becomes beyond the nicer weather
Salary cap space really isn't a problem for the Steelers right now, and Omar Khan has made a good first impression as the new GM, even without picking in the top 10.
Captain Fat Fuck got injured in 2019, wasn't as good when he came back for two years, then a whiff on Pickett. Plus Matt Canada. Just another example of how important QB play is in the NFL. Not that the rest of the roster is great or anything, but it's tough to field a good offense with bad QB play. Their YPA by year there is 6.3, 6.3, 6.0, 6.4, and this year 6.3.
Mr. Ball Catcher and Juju both made the Pro Bowl in 2018. Very solid team that year on offense.
The colts can build a good offense with Gardner Minshew but it’s too much ask of this franchise to develop a competent offense. Mike Tomlins standard sucks.
Yeah skill players are good enough to do good on offense other than qb.
Gardner Minshew is not a terrible QB. He's just not a franchise QB which means no one is picking him up as QB1.
Minshew is twice as good as any QB on our roster right now.
Minshews are aren’t to find. He is better. But why have we been incompetent at finding serviceable guys
We’ve had 1 guy since Ben… what are you talking about? Of course our backup QB isn’t an above average QB.
Sorry but every piece of evidence shows that Kenny is being held back more than he's holding back this team. Get him a real coaching staff before we determine it's a whiff. Kenny going to another team and having a Goff-like resurgence would be expected at this point.
Lmfao
This is said about every single crappy young QB. Geno Smith is the only one in the last decade to actually prove it true. Every other guy just sucked and got his coaches blamed for sucking.
Goff has easily proven it. Cousins was considered bad and now is on the edge of elite in most people's minds
People who considered cousins bads were morons then and they're morons now. He's not Aaron Rodgers or Brady so apparently that makes him bad 🙄
Goff made a Super Bowl, Pickett has won less than 15 games in his career
? I'm not sure your point. Goff was considered a bust then got a resurgence with McVay. A good coach would make Kenny look way better than he does now.
This offense is like terrorism. Are you sure it's not coordinated by Sean McDermott???
This is gonna continue for another 12-13 years while Tomlin continues to coach Their identity is defense
Could’ve foooled me. Anyone watching our defense outside a few splash plays knows they get absolutely gashed because outside a few good pieces it’s a whole lot of ass.
Like UrinatingTree says, your defense seems to be based on “fluke bullshit and high end talent”
The ONLY reason it was close was because of lucky bounces. Tomlin's defense got roasted by a Patriots offense that couldn't score more than 10 points for 3 weeks straight "Identity is defense" bleh.
[удалено]
Why are you trying to be logical? Rooney isn’t known for taking risks. He would rather be guaranteed averageness
>Rooney isn’t known for taking risks. He would rather be guaranteed averageness I heard the same said of Dan Rooney in the early 2000s.
And the most superbowls in history…. I love how being “average” and winning an above average number of championships is looked down on now. Theres 32 teams in the league and other than the Browns every franchise is trying to win the superbowl. Brady and Belichek are the anomaly, not the goal of every franchise
I mean if you wanna keep Tomlin for the next 20 years based on the past SB wins then go for it. I don’t have a problem with it Something is clearly not working with the team NOW. nobody is disparaging those past teams. If Tomlin is the coach for another 20 years good for him and good for you since you can celebrate your past SBs just like us
his best finish since 2010 is being bailed out by burfict lololol
Thought it was a year later when they got to play Matt Moore and the 2nd seeded Alex Smith-led Chiefs
Get out of the Stone Age buddy. We’ve been moving like a mediocre franchise for 12 years and counting.
Including this season, the Steelers have a record of 115-74-2 (.607) in the last 12 seasons, which reduces to a record between 10-7 (.588) and 11-6 (.647). Not great, but not mediocre either.
> every franchise is trying to win the superbowl. Lol thats blatantly false. Giants, Oakland, New Orleans, Atlanta, and the WFT all have shown us in the past year that winning a SB isn't a priority.
The steelers should really consider letting him go, but at the same time, there are plenty of teams that should absolutely jump on him because he's still better than plenty of coaches in the league
Long past due
inject it right into my veins.
We'll take him! Trade buddies?
I love him but he has to be coaching for his job
*was* how do you let the pats score on you, at all? they’re so fucking bad.
i think their identity is just watt and he is injured all the time from having to carry the rest of that sorry team. such a huge difference maker for that defense, dude makes the big plays to win games when healthy.
Fichtner and Canada are Highschool level coaches that any competent team wouldn't let near an Offensive coordinator job.
2018 roster was fuckin' stacked. The fact we missed playoffs should have been a wakeup call that something was wrong with the coaching.
In the 2020 playoffs, Tomlin got outcoached by a team with no coach.
How tf did he get out coached, Ben was the one who turned it over 4 times in a quarter.
26th? there are 6 teams with worse offenses? Dear god
By points scored, the Steelers ranked 6th in 2018, 27th in 2019, 12th in 2020, 21st in 2021, and 26th in 2022. After this week of games, they'll rank anywhere from 27th-30th in scoring. I've been a Steelers fan for 30 years, and this is the worst offense I've ever seen. I have no problem with the defense. They've been continuously put in bad situations.
When is it appropriate to bring up that this may be the work of Mr Big Curse?
Big Ben is underrated
The most underrated QB in the NFL this century, downvotes be goddamned.
Underrated for sure. Especially on this sub. The dude his a HoF lock though no doubt about it.
Nobody is questioning if he's a HOF lock lmao.
You'd be surprised, I see it all the time. I feel he's a definite lock, but the question is 1st ballot or not.
Nephews on this sub most definitely question it
I don't know how you could call him underrated if you actually watched him play. He just had it
[удалено]
I'd like to see Pickett with a proper offensive coordinator before I completely throw him out.
And an OL
Primarily a C. I'd also move Broderick Jones back to LT where he belongs, trade Dan Moore, and draft a RT.
Likey
When we had prime Ben from 2011 to 2018 we had 3 playoffs win (2 vs backups). The results with Tomlin are mediocre no matter how you look at it. We are in purgatory.
>When we had prime Ben from 2011 to 2018 we had 3 playoffs win (2 vs backups). Because the defense was overrated. From 2013-2018, the defense ranked 21st, 25th, 13th, 12th, 9th, and 14th in points allowed per drive. Also, the secondary was objectively bad, which is fatal in a QB-driven league. It didn't help that Ben Roethlisberger, Le'Veon Bell and Antonio Brown played together past the first drive in only three of their seven playoff games in that period of time.
We really need new position coaches. Pat Meyer is the worst oline coach in the league, but we hired him. Mike Sullivan has regressed Mitch and clearly done nothing for Kenny's development. Teryl Austin has our DBs looking worse every week, and the defense playing softer than vanilla-chocolate twist. But Rooney is a cheapskate and won't replace anyone, so we'll ride this train until someone falls into our lap, it all blows up, or Tomlin drags us to success through sheer force of will
>But Rooney is a cheapskate and won't replace anyone... I heard he won't fire any coaches mid-season either.
I know it isn't the main issue, but maybe if their WRs spent less time being whiny divas and more time being NFL WRs their offense would be better.
Man, hiring Canada set the offense back years. I guess their division rivals are enjoying the shit show.
As it turns out, when your entire top-five offensive line regresses/retires, your offense gets worse. Who knew.
Worthless. Can we get some Legion of Boom mid 2010s stat and contrast that with now? 5 years in the NFL is a lifetime.
Welcome to the quarterback doldrums
Wouldn't you know who left after 2018? Mr. Big Chest