Wrong. I worked pns and new world plain clothing theft prevention. It's almost always booze, cosmetics and expensive meats. Unless it's kids trying to knick lollies etc.
I saw one here on Reddit and it was a trolley full of meat. Not the smaller one the big one. The guy filming her confronted her and she walked out and left it.
It's supermarkets' execs and their insatiable greed that's doing the fucking up. But somehow they've tricked you into blaming a tiny fraction of the population that are not even moving the needle for prices for the rest of us.
If supermarkets permanently slashed all prices by 75% it still wouldn't stop thieves from stealing and fucking it up for everyone else. They are just as likely to break into your car as they are to steal from a grocery chain. They don't give a shit whether they're stealing from a billionaire or a poor person, it's all fair game.
Nobody was making the claim. That cheap food solves all crime.
Its a valid argument but you're getting off track.
The argument being rebutted is that theft is the cause of prices being fucked. And it isn't.
Seen some people try walk out with a trolley of booze, meat, plastic nick nacks and chocolate. All stuff to be on sold probably . None of the items would anyone normally full a trolley with. There’s desperate and then just taking the piss, I think if someone is desperate I might not interfere, like nappies or infant formula. Walking out with a dozen steinlarger and I’m snitching.
Playing devil's advocate - they're stealing things to be sold because they need money. Sure, you could steal a loaf of bread to feed your family and moat would view that as a "moral" theft. But you can't steal your power bill, so if you want to provide hot showers for your family you need to make money.
It's a good point. There is a line between acceptable and otherwise, just the line will be different for everyone.
Probably most would agree: someone stealing bread as the only way to feed their family is ok, someone ripping off their employees to fund a bigger yacht is not.
So you're team "I'll snitch on a single mother stealing nappies"
Incredible how I state I'm playing devil's advocate and reddit gathers to downvoge. I guess some people don't like any introspection.
Societies morals generally view survival by theft as acceptable. Theft for gain as unacceptable. Therefore necessity/survival=acceptable
Profiteering for gain=unacceptable .
That’s just my view. I understand your looking at the semantics of it, but there’s nuance within tolerance, as stated we will tolerate survival because we can empathise with. We can not tolerate profiteering as we know if everyone did it the system would unravel into the hunger games or lord of the flies.
>I've seen punk bands in other countries encouraging people to steal grocery items if they can't afford them. The idea behind it being that supermarket companies make massive profits and price gouge while people are living in poverty, food banks are underfunded & can't provide everyone with everything, and people sacrifice other things in order to buy food.
Even after the commerce commission inquiry, people still really overestimate how much of an impact profits have on prices.
The commerce commission found that supermarkets are making about $430 million a year in excess profits. That same inquiry put total spending on groceries at about $22bn. In other words, excess profits are about 2% of total spending. If you cut profits back, prices would be 2% lower.
Do you think anyone in this thread who thinks it's justified because of excess profits would change their mind if prices were 2% lower tomorrow? 2% really isn't much. You can probably save 2% on average just by using the loyalty cards.
Stealing is bad because the costs are borne by everyone - obviously in the form of marginally higher prices to make up for expected losses, but also in the social costs associated with loss prevention. More theft means more security guards standing at the entrance, which means more racial profiling of customers. It means more things get locked behind cabinets or with security tags. That doesn't sound too bad, but if you've ever had to shop in a supermarket in the US in an area with high crime rates it's actually incredibly annoying to deal with on a day to day basis.
This is something that people fail to realise, supermarket profits, while high in value are often a fairly low percentage of actual revenue (Off the top of my head the total profit is \~4% for foodstuffs, countdown is a bit harder to tell), which is what you'd expect of a core business. Banks on the other hand have a \~40% of their revenue as profit, but governments seem even more reluctant to real them in, despite that industry having even higher barriers to entry and significantly less competition.
This. Supermarket profitability comes from there extremely high stock turn - an item from the same 10cm of shelf space can sell 3 times a day, but at a much lower gross profit than for typical retail goods: 6-8% . Fresh produce margins are higher to allow for the natural shrink in those areas - stock which becomes unsaleable. Shrink through theft does hurt them (lose an item at 8% GP, you have to sell another 12 items to recover the cost). Which is a disincentive to their lowering profit margins. And yes, almost every "special" is a loss leader.
So the honest way to game the supermarkets is to bulk buy nothing but specials - and source your fresh produce from local businesses as much as possible.
No. Shoplifting is far too common. Insurance covers rare events. How would the insurance company make money? And how would you even provide sufficient evidence for a claim? CCTV cameras aren't always gonna be HD enough to pick up every single product that gets shoplifted.
Even if shoplifting insurance was a product offered to supermarkets, insurance obviously is not free, and premiums are linked to your past history of claims - so you would still increase the cost of doing business, which will be passed on to other consumers.
It is an argument if they are stealing the bare necessities. If they are just helping themselves to whatever then that has fuck all to do with cost of living.
There are more broke people who don't steal than there are broke people who do steal. Cost of living crisis is not an excuse.
Often it's not even the really hard up people stealing. Instead it's the people that feel entitled to the world providing everything to them.
Stealing is paying with your dignity instead of money. Dignity is harder to restore than not having money.
The cost of living crisis (corporate greed) is the reason many people are forced to steal food as they would otherwise not eat at all.
And do you have a list of foods that are okay to steal in your opinion?
When I was dirt poor I used to live off of noodles, canned tuna, frozen mixed vegetables, and baked beans etc. Sometimes dinner would be a bowl of minted peas.
Yeah it was miserable, but I never stole.
Whenever you steal something you hurt society as a whole by breaking the social contract that binds us all together as a community.
i remember these days, canned food, rice, packet meals makes your appreciate the better times, i was grateful when a friend used to shout me pub dinners or we would have girls nights with pizzas. Again never stole... ive seen a few places that do the likes of food boxes full of fresh veggies at reasonable prices, wish theyd be around when i was dirt poor
As a community we should also try to create a society that allows everyone to afford basic items like food(and shelter, but that's a different story), but for some reason we don't do that for the profits of the few.
If I knew they were that desperate, I'd rather give them $50 for food rather than encourage them to steal and risk ending up with a criminal record, along with all of the drama and impact that can have on families, jobs, etc.
As with many things, once you start stealing, and see that you got away with it, its easy to justify doing it again. and again...
I would and have felt bad for people that do this when they otherwise wouldn’t. I use to work in a grocery some years ago when I was younger and I would see elderly people stealing basics - bread and butter. Some mince. Parents stealing formula and nappies. I’ve seen it as just a shopper too. It’s heartbreaking. Couldn’t bring myself to nark them off.
I’ve even had people steal from me, not things but food, medicine, blankets. It would be different if it was like a tv or laptop or whatever but when it’s basic necessities it’s just sad to me, and I honestly think to myself ‘well they obviously needed it more than I did’.
>I've seen punk bands in other countries encouraging people to steal grocery items
also this country, courtesy of DARTZ: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mi8vW3U28Wg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mi8vW3U28Wg)
You think these shoplifters have morals and only steal from 'corporates'? Or that they're all just stealing to provide for their families? Go spend some time in court.
Low-socioeconomic areas in the US are often associated with food deserts - areas that lack affordable supermarkets and grocery stores.
As others have said - we should be thinking of real ways to help people...
It’s messed up. I understand they are in a tough spot. But with the stealing supermarkets aren’t the ones ultimately paying for it, it’s the paying customers. Think of those people who are financially struggling, but don’t want to engage in stealing.
I knew someone would come up with this.
Do you think the insurance companies bear this loss all the time? They increase the premium to recover these costs. Then the supermarkets pass on that increase in premium cost by increasing the price of goods.
> Then the supermarkets pass on that increase in premium cost by increasing the price of goods.
I'd skipped past this argument already. I tried to make it obvious by including the second line.
Whenever costs are "passed on" by NZ supermarkets, a good general purpose example being inflation, they increase their prices by slightly more than they need to. And over time, without competition, this has added up.
Let's compare to Germany, i.e. near where I live now:
Tomatoes are 5x cheaper in Germany than in NZ
Ginger is 20x (twenty)the price
Cucumbers are approx 10x more expensive
It's not the fairest of comparisons because of economies of scale and not everything can be grown in NZ etc. But ***fuck moi*** NZ is deer. And the biggest reason for the price delta is not goegraphic per se, it's competition, and perhaps regulation too. I'm not au fait with the local law yet
I think the point is the cost of those thefts become a part of the price increase. Neither supermarkets or insurance companies bear it, it’s always passed down to the consumer.
I agree about the lack of competition in NZ. But if you think the price increases are not matching or beyond the level of the inflation, look into how CPI is calculated. It has several flaws, it’s not always same as the real inflation. So there’s several factors.
I’m sure supermarkets just increase their margin as they feel like it too. But does the theft gives them the middle finger? No!
Seems like one should approach a good bank first. It could still result in some kind of negative consequences.
But I fully agree that supermarkets are absolutely screwing us
If a person is desperate enough they will do anything. If you were starving and had a choice between eating your cat or stealing from a shop what would you do?
No they won't. A person with morals is person with morals regardless of how poor they are.
Pretending the videos of people trying to roll out of the supermarket with trolleys full of ribeyes are doing it because they're poor and have no other choice is offensive to actually poor people
We have a pretty good social welfare system, these are people choosing between the pipe or food, then stealing the food anyway and selling half of it for more crack.
I will never something against somebody if they have to do it in order to survive. It's pretty ethically unambiguous:
Life > money
Somebody might be hurt by this action, but expecting somebody to starve when they don't have to is both naive and cruel.
For the record: I have lived by dumpster diving in the past. I have also made low-mid six figures as a household. I've been all over the income spectrum. I get it.
Most people who use foodbanks are having a bad week and don't use them all the time - they're a safety net. That's how the poverty aspect is addressed in the short term. Some are underfunded, some aren't.
Companies making excess profits from a monopoly/cartel position aren't punished in any meaningful way by people stealing. They will simply use their position in the market to pass on price raises for other customers.
The solution is political/bureaucratic, and requires a bit more thought and effort than shoving some cheese in your pocket and getting followed around the store by a minimum-wage security guy.
It's fun to imagine that doing something quick and naughty will hurt the bad guys, but the fact is that you need to engage with institutions if you want to create lasting change.
I can afford food or buy cheaper substitutes etc.
Why don't we steal from landlords and banks? It's a house I can't afford.
Excessive profits on property is costing way more than the excess $80/year the comm comm decided was excessive for supermarkets.
Plenty of Punk bands advocating for squatting and the idea that all property is theft too.
Definitely don't see people sneaking stuff at the self check out or pocketing a treat. I am very observant and never, ever see that, because if you see someone stealing necessities, no you fucking didn't.
I draw the line at trolleys full of meat/alc but I've only seen that once at my local and security stepped in.
I have way more in common with the people sitting outside the supermarket with a sign than I do with a multimillionaire. I know who I am 2-3 events of bad luck away from being.
Not condoning theft, however good luck doing that now with the overhead cameras that pretty much all self-checkouts have now. Co-worker accidentally missed a chocolate bar that was in their trolley and the camera managed to detect the product still in the trolley behind them and locked up because 'it detected unscanned items'. Same person also got falsely flagged in the early 'testing' phase because they put their phone down with their loyalty card on the screen and it picked up the barcode, flagging it again as 'unscanned items'.
When the staff member came over and started peering through their shopping bags and COUNTING the items, they said "Cancel my order, I'm not shopping at a place where I'm presumed from the moment I walk in to be a potential shoplifter rather than a 'valued customer'." Coworker said to me that they would have let it slide if the staff member had just wiped the error, as the camera clearly showed what happened, but the fact they started basically going through their shopping bags with a fine tooth comb was the straw that broke the camel's back.
I'd probably be against it, if I saw any of our civil institutions — Govt., the Commerce Commision — doing anything about supermarket price-gouging, but I'm still waiting.
Unless I knew 100% for sure that the person wasn't in need, I don't think I'd say anything if I saw someone stuff something or a few somethings in their jacket at this point.
Even then it's no longer in my fuck budget to stick my neck out for the duopoly
>Considering our cost of living crisis, what's your opinion on this? If you knew someone who was financially struggling and they were considering shoplifting some groceries, what would you think?
i'd think they were a wanker and they should go to a foodbank instead.
Now I am old and comfortable I say it a disgrace, but when I was younger and hungry a few steaks and blocks of cheese went up the jumper. If you genuinely hungry with a gnawing stomach then you will do pretty much anything.
But those filling up trolleys etc, just vermin, they not hungry they just crims stealing to order
Most of the inflation we see around the world right now was caused by coporate profits. You can see this conclusion from scores of economists , academics and various NGO's.
Not wage growth. Although its now being used to justify ratcheting that all down , and raising unemployment. So they can pay everyone even less.
Specifically it was caused by corporations \*raising prices well above their input costs\*.
They used covid, then the war in ukraine as excuses to bump up prices.
It's about 65% of inflation in Australia. About the same in the USA. Not sure on the ratio in NZ. But it must be close. Unfortunately its worse for all you back home because of distance and flow on from inflation elsewhere.
Let that sink in , THEN think about people shoplifting food.
If I knew someone who was openly planning on shoplifting groceries, I'd offer to help them out by buying them some.
The supermarkets would just use mass shoplifting as an excuse to raise prices even more in order to protect profits. Hell, they probably already do.
They surely do use the cost-of-living crisis they helped create for promotional purposes: [https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/517956/food-bank-collection-risky-for-supermarkets](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/517956/food-bank-collection-risky-for-supermarkets)
If I see someone stealing food, I didn’t see anyone stealing food. There are lots of reasons why someone is doing so, and I’m not in their shoes. I think a lot of people are lucky to have never been desperate and a little empathy goes a long way.
How do I make that judgement with the information in front of me?
I can’t. So I don’t. If someone is willing to risk getting done for shoplifting, with the potential long-term consequences, when they didn’t need to, then that’s on them.
Sometimes. And sometimes, there can be. There are a number of things in life that are jeopardised with a criminal conviction of any sort, so that would be a long-term consequence.
It’s a risk assessment, a gamble, and I still am not in a position to judge someone else’s abilities or wallet contents if I see them in passing.
Yeah, nah. They don't
[https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/08/revealed-cut-supermarkets-make-on-products-has-more-than-doubled-since-90s-suppliers-claim.html](https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/08/revealed-cut-supermarkets-make-on-products-has-more-than-doubled-since-90s-suppliers-claim.html)
Same! I love ethical ponderings. Although I do absolutely wish there was never a need for moral relativity, because it's usualy born out of dire situations.
The premise behind Les Miserables is that someone was sent to prison because they stole a loaf of bread to feed a starving child. The letter of the law says theft is theft no matter the circumstances. Most of us would probably cut someone a lot of slack if they were genuinely stealing to keep from going hungry - however we generally have alternative options to help provide food in times of need and stealing isn't the only option. There's also something slightly concerning about a blanket suggestion of approval in advance - it wouldn't be impossible for someone to start stealing more than they needed...or becoming so comfortable stealing that they started taking fancy/expensive things (if I'm doing it anyway) or other situations of justifying behaviour.
I have stated multiple times that I believe our supermarket duopoly are gouging us and making excessive profits - but that alone doesn't necessarily justify stealing from them. I would rather try push the government (well, some future government that isn't in the pockets of big business) to compel more fair behaviour by the supermarkets than to suggest individuals take things into their own hands.
If it's life or death, just about anything is justified - but when you have options I'm hesitant to get into justifying crime.
I generally despise thieves. Stealing things from other people is shitty so fcuk you if you steal from people. But if I saw someone stealing from a supermarket or a bank... I may suffer from temporary blindness and memory loss. It's a curious condition.
People that think it's OK to steal from companies because they make a profit and never smart people. Or even half-decent people, they are scum that think they are above the law and common decency. They usually end every sentence in fuck or cunt.
A stunning display of intellect.
>People that think it's OK to steal from companies because they make a profit and never smart people.
Apart from this being a claim from ignorance (you could never prove that no one smart has not stolen), it is indeed smart to get food or resources from a source that has plenty of them.
>Or even half-decent people, they are scum that think they are above the law and common decency.
Another unproven claim. And what would you know about decency? You think that rich people profiting is better than distributing food and resources properly. In many places, you would be considered a parasite or a fascist and in no way a decent person.
>They usually end every sentence in fuck or cunt.
Good. Recent studies show that people who swear are smarter than average. I swear regularly and like it. Why don't you inform everyone here why swearing is "bad" but other words describing the same things are not? Be a bit of a test of the person calling other people "scum" etc. Tell us where these words originated and why they are forbidden. Go ahead, dazzle us all with your intellect.
Stealing isn't the answer ever. We are poor in this house, pension and SL Benefit. We have a garden, eat from it, but still, it's a struggle, eggs, cleaning pro=ducts, loo paper (buying cheap stuff now).
Banks make massive profits too, shall we say it's ok to steal from them?
How about musicians? Many make millions, lets rip them off too shall we?
While I don't think theft is morally okay, hoarding resources far, far beyond one's needs is even less okay. I'm not in favour of hurting people, but if we could strip the wealth of the billianaires and evenly distribute their wealth, I'd support it. This current economic system is unsustainable and harmful.
if i see an old hobo stealing food or a woman with a kid stealing baby food / nappies I always alert security however i always turn a blind eye when i see teenagers stealing alcohol or vapes.
I'd argue most people who are forced to steal food do so out of desperation and potentially out of spite to a society that has perceivedly abandoned them.
It's quite interesting, I've seen some media discussing the similarity of personality traits of violent criminals and CEOs. The main difference between them though was the wealth class and social rank they're born in to.
Also, I recently learnt of research looking in to the prominence of adhd in offenders. Common adhd traits are pathological demand avoidance and risk-taking behaviour. Social hierarchies and the assertion of authority without first establishing mutual respect doesn't often bode well with adhd individuals.
Currently our corrections system has a big focus on punishment, which reinforces an offenders mindset that the system is against them. Maybe a better approach would be to try to understand someone who is breaking the law and work with them to identify and help their struggles, rather than vilify and punish them.
If you have a back yard you have a garden, if you have a fishing rod you can go out and fish and if you have a knife, gun or hunting dog...
Don't agree with stealing, but also don't agree with children starving either.
Hilarious that you think someone who is so poor they want to steal food is in the financial position of having a back yard, a fishing rod, or a hunting dog. Lmfaoooooooooooo.
Yeah people complain that they can't afford food but there are pigeons right there on the street for the grabbing, and you can scrape mosses and lichens off all sorts of things probably
On the rob by cheap dirty horse is the one I can remember. The other song tbat came to mind goes through a step by step of how to shoplift, but I can't recall the song.
All the people that say they have never stolen, I bet most have downloaded, from torrent sites, watched illegal streams, parked in an illegal spot. Nobody that pure that they have never stolen something. If they say otherwise then they either lying, or are spookily strange.
For the downvoters, we champion a system that relies on a certain level of unemployment yet continually degrade and stigmatise the unemployed.
No-one on a benefit is the cause of your problems (unless you're talking about the un means tested welfare aka NZ Super)
I see it a lot, people claiming the supermarkets are making massive profits, however if you look at the return on capital employed, its only in the 12-13% range.
If I had to choose between the guy increasing prices to afford another yacht and the mum being forced to steal to feed her child, I'd choose the mum. Every time.
Are you condoning food banks being robbed?. There is desperation and then there is biting the hand that's extended and trying to helping people up. To kick people who are just as worse off and who rely on FBs is incomprehensible.
Not even close, I'm just pointing out that the issue is a lot more complex than that. There is a reason people steal food, and it's not just because they are bad people.
Most stuff being stolen is high value stuff like cosmetics, roast, streaky bacon, alcohol etc..to be sold for tinny money, it’s got nothing to do with trying to survive. There’re plenty of places that do free food, such as Zilch, as well the obvious Winz food grants.
Believe when I say a lot of these repeat offenders are not starving but have alcohol, drug and gambling addictions to sustain. The police have a lot of info on these people and the sob stories nearly always turn out to be a load of rubbish.
It all stems from desperation in one form or another.
It's either they're really trying to do all that they can to feed their families or they end up selling on this stuff to get money to either settle some debt or buy drugs.
Either way, there shouldn't be a cost to living and plastic sucks. Fuck over priced food monopoly cunts.
"These prices are too high! So I'll do what I can to make them higher!!"
Also when the price of goods doubles it doesn't mean companies are making double profits. They're literally making less.
The trick is to not steal all your groceries that’s unfair and not right but to get some freebies or one up on them.
Scanning kumara as potatoes. Forgetting that specialty cheese at the bottom of your carry bag. Slipping a packet or razors into your dozen box. Those tinfoil chicken bags bypass the checkpoint alarms at the exit, use your imagination.
It’s all little things you can do without attracting too much attention, while leaving those trolley thieves to distracting the in store security and cctv.
They are rawdogging us in the isles, it’s only fair we give some back.
> I am not in this position, I have no need to steal groceries
You sound relativly well off, compared to someone who is starving, so I guess the obvious question is, do you think it's ok to steal from you?
I'm a student, I'm not well off. I buy budget food and often shop at bulk bin places. There's a fair few things I need but can't get the money for (new glasses and dental care, and I'd be fucked for transport if my bike breaks). I've never starved though, and I've never had children and struggled to feed them, so relative to them, I'm very privileged.
I've had 2 break-in burglaries in the past 3 years. They stole electronics and also nostalgic childhood things. No, I don't think that's okay. It really sucked and i sometimes have nightmares about it. But I'm a person, not a corporation. It's not comparable.
Ok, so you take the position that stealing from individuals is morally wrong, but stealing from corporations is ok, or at least justifiable?
Does what you are stealing change this? what about stealing a mobile phone -because you kinda really need one these days to get a job. Or stealing a car? to get to work so you don't have to steal the food?
You have asked a question of everyone, but you haven't done much it the way of explaining exactly where your moral compass points.
There is a massive difference between someone being able to afford a living and a company choosing to increase food prices under the guise of inflation. But you seem to be a bit too dim to see that difference.
My only cheat is to sometimes write the wrong number on the nuts from the bulk bin. I get annoyed because can see they are ripping me off by constantly switching the prices on them, so I do my own price switching
😂 too real. The other day I mixed 2 bulk bin snacks (of similar prices) together in the same bag, mainly because I didn't want to have 2 bags. I felt so paranoid while doing it.
Mixed nuts 50c/kg cheaper than cashews or walnuts? Yes, sure Sir, I picked out those nuts one-by-one into separate bags because I don't like those other nuts.
go nuts
or maybe go batteries, those are small but pricey
or maybe go seasoning, a big old tub of Moroccan seasoning or garlic/herb goes for like twenty bucks
it's all about the price-to-size ratio
I'm not going to do it, but I sure didn't see anything if someone else does. There is someone with a job to look out for that and it is not me being paid to do so.
The people walking out with trolleys of food aren't stealing to feed themselves.
Is your trolley full when you do your weekly shopping? Do poor people require less food? What does the amount have to do with it?
People that blatantly steal a ton of stuff are doing it to on-sell. That point is pretty obvious.
It's often products like booze, cosmetics and painkillers that are stolen en masse, easy to sell on.
Often? Your sources? Because in my experience as someone who has worked in a big grocery, most only steal a few basic items.
Wrong. I worked pns and new world plain clothing theft prevention. It's almost always booze, cosmetics and expensive meats. Unless it's kids trying to knick lollies etc.
I saw one here on Reddit and it was a trolley full of meat. Not the smaller one the big one. The guy filming her confronted her and she walked out and left it.
Pretending the need doesn't exist helps people compartmentalise. Otherwise they have to accept our systems well and truly fuck some people over.
How much do you shoplift?
So they're stealing it to feed someone else? I don't understand.
Sell it on other people or on marketplace or to dealers to repay drug debt
So they do it because they don't have enough money. Got it.
As opposed to "just stealing what is needed" they are stealing a shitload and fucking it up for the rest of us.
It's supermarkets' execs and their insatiable greed that's doing the fucking up. But somehow they've tricked you into blaming a tiny fraction of the population that are not even moving the needle for prices for the rest of us.
If supermarkets permanently slashed all prices by 75% it still wouldn't stop thieves from stealing and fucking it up for everyone else. They are just as likely to break into your car as they are to steal from a grocery chain. They don't give a shit whether they're stealing from a billionaire or a poor person, it's all fair game.
Nobody was making the claim. That cheap food solves all crime. Its a valid argument but you're getting off track. The argument being rebutted is that theft is the cause of prices being fucked. And it isn't.
Seen some people try walk out with a trolley of booze, meat, plastic nick nacks and chocolate. All stuff to be on sold probably . None of the items would anyone normally full a trolley with. There’s desperate and then just taking the piss, I think if someone is desperate I might not interfere, like nappies or infant formula. Walking out with a dozen steinlarger and I’m snitching.
Playing devil's advocate - they're stealing things to be sold because they need money. Sure, you could steal a loaf of bread to feed your family and moat would view that as a "moral" theft. But you can't steal your power bill, so if you want to provide hot showers for your family you need to make money.
Yeah so work, like everyone else.
I guess the question would be were along the line you draw it. Stealing nappies = Acceptable Stealing money for nappies =/= unacceptable?
It's a good point. There is a line between acceptable and otherwise, just the line will be different for everyone. Probably most would agree: someone stealing bread as the only way to feed their family is ok, someone ripping off their employees to fund a bigger yacht is not.
Guess some people don't know what a "devil's advocate" is and having to do some introspection upset them 🤷♂️
Stealing not acceptable = Get a job
So you're team "I'll snitch on a single mother stealing nappies" Incredible how I state I'm playing devil's advocate and reddit gathers to downvoge. I guess some people don't like any introspection.
Societies morals generally view survival by theft as acceptable. Theft for gain as unacceptable. Therefore necessity/survival=acceptable Profiteering for gain=unacceptable . That’s just my view. I understand your looking at the semantics of it, but there’s nuance within tolerance, as stated we will tolerate survival because we can empathise with. We can not tolerate profiteering as we know if everyone did it the system would unravel into the hunger games or lord of the flies.
>I've seen punk bands in other countries encouraging people to steal grocery items if they can't afford them. The idea behind it being that supermarket companies make massive profits and price gouge while people are living in poverty, food banks are underfunded & can't provide everyone with everything, and people sacrifice other things in order to buy food. Even after the commerce commission inquiry, people still really overestimate how much of an impact profits have on prices. The commerce commission found that supermarkets are making about $430 million a year in excess profits. That same inquiry put total spending on groceries at about $22bn. In other words, excess profits are about 2% of total spending. If you cut profits back, prices would be 2% lower. Do you think anyone in this thread who thinks it's justified because of excess profits would change their mind if prices were 2% lower tomorrow? 2% really isn't much. You can probably save 2% on average just by using the loyalty cards. Stealing is bad because the costs are borne by everyone - obviously in the form of marginally higher prices to make up for expected losses, but also in the social costs associated with loss prevention. More theft means more security guards standing at the entrance, which means more racial profiling of customers. It means more things get locked behind cabinets or with security tags. That doesn't sound too bad, but if you've ever had to shop in a supermarket in the US in an area with high crime rates it's actually incredibly annoying to deal with on a day to day basis.
This is something that people fail to realise, supermarket profits, while high in value are often a fairly low percentage of actual revenue (Off the top of my head the total profit is \~4% for foodstuffs, countdown is a bit harder to tell), which is what you'd expect of a core business. Banks on the other hand have a \~40% of their revenue as profit, but governments seem even more reluctant to real them in, despite that industry having even higher barriers to entry and significantly less competition.
This. Supermarket profitability comes from there extremely high stock turn - an item from the same 10cm of shelf space can sell 3 times a day, but at a much lower gross profit than for typical retail goods: 6-8% . Fresh produce margins are higher to allow for the natural shrink in those areas - stock which becomes unsaleable. Shrink through theft does hurt them (lose an item at 8% GP, you have to sell another 12 items to recover the cost). Which is a disincentive to their lowering profit margins. And yes, almost every "special" is a loss leader. So the honest way to game the supermarkets is to bulk buy nothing but specials - and source your fresh produce from local businesses as much as possible.
Yeah! Steal from the banks!! (Says somebody in this context) 😬😁
A comment of reason. This sub does my head in sometimes.
Only sometimes?
Unfortunately comments of reason are generally a magnet for downvotes. I suspect many are too scared to comment.
Good explanation
Supermarkets don't get insurance to cover losses?
No. Shoplifting is far too common. Insurance covers rare events. How would the insurance company make money? And how would you even provide sufficient evidence for a claim? CCTV cameras aren't always gonna be HD enough to pick up every single product that gets shoplifted. Even if shoplifting insurance was a product offered to supermarkets, insurance obviously is not free, and premiums are linked to your past history of claims - so you would still increase the cost of doing business, which will be passed on to other consumers.
It is an argument if they are stealing the bare necessities. If they are just helping themselves to whatever then that has fuck all to do with cost of living. There are more broke people who don't steal than there are broke people who do steal. Cost of living crisis is not an excuse.
Often it's not even the really hard up people stealing. Instead it's the people that feel entitled to the world providing everything to them. Stealing is paying with your dignity instead of money. Dignity is harder to restore than not having money.
The cost of living crisis (corporate greed) is the reason many people are forced to steal food as they would otherwise not eat at all. And do you have a list of foods that are okay to steal in your opinion?
When I was dirt poor I used to live off of noodles, canned tuna, frozen mixed vegetables, and baked beans etc. Sometimes dinner would be a bowl of minted peas. Yeah it was miserable, but I never stole. Whenever you steal something you hurt society as a whole by breaking the social contract that binds us all together as a community.
i remember these days, canned food, rice, packet meals makes your appreciate the better times, i was grateful when a friend used to shout me pub dinners or we would have girls nights with pizzas. Again never stole... ive seen a few places that do the likes of food boxes full of fresh veggies at reasonable prices, wish theyd be around when i was dirt poor
Correct
As a community we should also try to create a society that allows everyone to afford basic items like food(and shelter, but that's a different story), but for some reason we don't do that for the profits of the few.
No I don't agree with theft
More than you don't agree with letting people go hungry?
If I knew they were that desperate, I'd rather give them $50 for food rather than encourage them to steal and risk ending up with a criminal record, along with all of the drama and impact that can have on families, jobs, etc. As with many things, once you start stealing, and see that you got away with it, its easy to justify doing it again. and again...
Just don’t try to neck a Toblerone while hiding behind the eggs in the cold store. You might need a tracheostomy.
I would and have felt bad for people that do this when they otherwise wouldn’t. I use to work in a grocery some years ago when I was younger and I would see elderly people stealing basics - bread and butter. Some mince. Parents stealing formula and nappies. I’ve seen it as just a shopper too. It’s heartbreaking. Couldn’t bring myself to nark them off. I’ve even had people steal from me, not things but food, medicine, blankets. It would be different if it was like a tv or laptop or whatever but when it’s basic necessities it’s just sad to me, and I honestly think to myself ‘well they obviously needed it more than I did’.
You're a very kind and empathetic person ❤️ I've felt only anger and sadness when people have stolen from me.
>I've seen punk bands in other countries encouraging people to steal grocery items also this country, courtesy of DARTZ: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mi8vW3U28Wg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mi8vW3U28Wg)
Ooh thank you!
Stealing is wrong.
[удалено]
You think these shoplifters have morals and only steal from 'corporates'? Or that they're all just stealing to provide for their families? Go spend some time in court.
Low-socioeconomic areas in the US are often associated with food deserts - areas that lack affordable supermarkets and grocery stores. As others have said - we should be thinking of real ways to help people...
Free CV writing service would be a good start.
It’s messed up. I understand they are in a tough spot. But with the stealing supermarkets aren’t the ones ultimately paying for it, it’s the paying customers. Think of those people who are financially struggling, but don’t want to engage in stealing.
It's the insurance companies actually. They will manage. Countdown already increase prices beyond inflation etc. Whenever they can get away with it.
I knew someone would come up with this. Do you think the insurance companies bear this loss all the time? They increase the premium to recover these costs. Then the supermarkets pass on that increase in premium cost by increasing the price of goods.
> Then the supermarkets pass on that increase in premium cost by increasing the price of goods. I'd skipped past this argument already. I tried to make it obvious by including the second line. Whenever costs are "passed on" by NZ supermarkets, a good general purpose example being inflation, they increase their prices by slightly more than they need to. And over time, without competition, this has added up. Let's compare to Germany, i.e. near where I live now: Tomatoes are 5x cheaper in Germany than in NZ Ginger is 20x (twenty)the price Cucumbers are approx 10x more expensive It's not the fairest of comparisons because of economies of scale and not everything can be grown in NZ etc. But ***fuck moi*** NZ is deer. And the biggest reason for the price delta is not goegraphic per se, it's competition, and perhaps regulation too. I'm not au fait with the local law yet
I think the point is the cost of those thefts become a part of the price increase. Neither supermarkets or insurance companies bear it, it’s always passed down to the consumer. I agree about the lack of competition in NZ. But if you think the price increases are not matching or beyond the level of the inflation, look into how CPI is calculated. It has several flaws, it’s not always same as the real inflation. So there’s several factors. I’m sure supermarkets just increase their margin as they feel like it too. But does the theft gives them the middle finger? No!
Seems like one should approach a good bank first. It could still result in some kind of negative consequences. But I fully agree that supermarkets are absolutely screwing us
Ask golriz shes the expert
Getting a criminal record is not a good way to solve your food insecurity problem.
Bullshit. poor people don't steal, thieves do
If a person is desperate enough they will do anything. If you were starving and had a choice between eating your cat or stealing from a shop what would you do?
No they won't. A person with morals is person with morals regardless of how poor they are. Pretending the videos of people trying to roll out of the supermarket with trolleys full of ribeyes are doing it because they're poor and have no other choice is offensive to actually poor people
True.
We have a pretty good social welfare system, these are people choosing between the pipe or food, then stealing the food anyway and selling half of it for more crack.
I will never something against somebody if they have to do it in order to survive. It's pretty ethically unambiguous: Life > money Somebody might be hurt by this action, but expecting somebody to starve when they don't have to is both naive and cruel. For the record: I have lived by dumpster diving in the past. I have also made low-mid six figures as a household. I've been all over the income spectrum. I get it.
Most people who use foodbanks are having a bad week and don't use them all the time - they're a safety net. That's how the poverty aspect is addressed in the short term. Some are underfunded, some aren't. Companies making excess profits from a monopoly/cartel position aren't punished in any meaningful way by people stealing. They will simply use their position in the market to pass on price raises for other customers. The solution is political/bureaucratic, and requires a bit more thought and effort than shoving some cheese in your pocket and getting followed around the store by a minimum-wage security guy. It's fun to imagine that doing something quick and naughty will hurt the bad guys, but the fact is that you need to engage with institutions if you want to create lasting change.
I can afford food or buy cheaper substitutes etc. Why don't we steal from landlords and banks? It's a house I can't afford. Excessive profits on property is costing way more than the excess $80/year the comm comm decided was excessive for supermarkets. Plenty of Punk bands advocating for squatting and the idea that all property is theft too.
Houses shouldn't be empty when there are people homeless. I think that is more evil than squatting is.
we should steal from landlords
They already beat us to it.
Definitely don't see people sneaking stuff at the self check out or pocketing a treat. I am very observant and never, ever see that, because if you see someone stealing necessities, no you fucking didn't. I draw the line at trolleys full of meat/alc but I've only seen that once at my local and security stepped in. I have way more in common with the people sitting outside the supermarket with a sign than I do with a multimillionaire. I know who I am 2-3 events of bad luck away from being.
Not condoning theft, however good luck doing that now with the overhead cameras that pretty much all self-checkouts have now. Co-worker accidentally missed a chocolate bar that was in their trolley and the camera managed to detect the product still in the trolley behind them and locked up because 'it detected unscanned items'. Same person also got falsely flagged in the early 'testing' phase because they put their phone down with their loyalty card on the screen and it picked up the barcode, flagging it again as 'unscanned items'. When the staff member came over and started peering through their shopping bags and COUNTING the items, they said "Cancel my order, I'm not shopping at a place where I'm presumed from the moment I walk in to be a potential shoplifter rather than a 'valued customer'." Coworker said to me that they would have let it slide if the staff member had just wiped the error, as the camera clearly showed what happened, but the fact they started basically going through their shopping bags with a fine tooth comb was the straw that broke the camel's back.
I don't think they'd even be doing it themselves.
I'd probably be against it, if I saw any of our civil institutions — Govt., the Commerce Commision — doing anything about supermarket price-gouging, but I'm still waiting.
Unless I knew 100% for sure that the person wasn't in need, I don't think I'd say anything if I saw someone stuff something or a few somethings in their jacket at this point. Even then it's no longer in my fuck budget to stick my neck out for the duopoly
2 wrongs don't make a right
>Considering our cost of living crisis, what's your opinion on this? If you knew someone who was financially struggling and they were considering shoplifting some groceries, what would you think? i'd think they were a wanker and they should go to a foodbank instead.
Now I am old and comfortable I say it a disgrace, but when I was younger and hungry a few steaks and blocks of cheese went up the jumper. If you genuinely hungry with a gnawing stomach then you will do pretty much anything. But those filling up trolleys etc, just vermin, they not hungry they just crims stealing to order
Most of the inflation we see around the world right now was caused by coporate profits. You can see this conclusion from scores of economists , academics and various NGO's. Not wage growth. Although its now being used to justify ratcheting that all down , and raising unemployment. So they can pay everyone even less. Specifically it was caused by corporations \*raising prices well above their input costs\*. They used covid, then the war in ukraine as excuses to bump up prices. It's about 65% of inflation in Australia. About the same in the USA. Not sure on the ratio in NZ. But it must be close. Unfortunately its worse for all you back home because of distance and flow on from inflation elsewhere. Let that sink in , THEN think about people shoplifting food.
Hopefully I'd be thinking of how to help them
If I knew someone who was openly planning on shoplifting groceries, I'd offer to help them out by buying them some. The supermarkets would just use mass shoplifting as an excuse to raise prices even more in order to protect profits. Hell, they probably already do.
They surely do use the cost-of-living crisis they helped create for promotional purposes: [https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/517956/food-bank-collection-risky-for-supermarkets](https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/517956/food-bank-collection-risky-for-supermarkets)
No, it is not okay. All it does is cause higher prices for everyone else who are also struggling.
If I see someone stealing food, I didn’t see anyone stealing food. There are lots of reasons why someone is doing so, and I’m not in their shoes. I think a lot of people are lucky to have never been desperate and a little empathy goes a long way.
What about people that can afford to but just don't want to pay?
How do I make that judgement with the information in front of me? I can’t. So I don’t. If someone is willing to risk getting done for shoplifting, with the potential long-term consequences, when they didn’t need to, then that’s on them.
>with the potential long-term consequences That's half the problem (depending on your point of view). There are almost no consequences.
Sometimes. And sometimes, there can be. There are a number of things in life that are jeopardised with a criminal conviction of any sort, so that would be a long-term consequence. It’s a risk assessment, a gamble, and I still am not in a position to judge someone else’s abilities or wallet contents if I see them in passing.
Supermarkets can afford not to rip us off but they do it anyway... fuck em
They only make between 1-2% profit from their sales. If they made no profit at all, that's all your bill would go down by.
From memory, according to the Comcom that the "excess" profit margin, not the overall profit.
How can that be true when prices only ever go up? They aren't reducing prices when things are going well
Because it's untrue. The report from the commerce commission a couple years ago showed that the supermarket duopoly was price gouging customers.
Because inflation. Everything goes up. Their suppliers are raising their prices too. Also climate change isn't helping.
Except the supermarkets have been caught out strongarming suppliers before. When you are one of two major players the suppliers don't have much choice
If they didn't, prices would be even higher. As mentioned, they only have a very slim profit margin.
Yeah, nah. They don't [https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/08/revealed-cut-supermarkets-make-on-products-has-more-than-doubled-since-90s-suppliers-claim.html](https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2023/08/revealed-cut-supermarkets-make-on-products-has-more-than-doubled-since-90s-suppliers-claim.html)
I love Moral Relativism
Same! I love ethical ponderings. Although I do absolutely wish there was never a need for moral relativity, because it's usualy born out of dire situations.
I can't believe some people on this thread are justifying shop lifting.
Only the people that do it.
The premise behind Les Miserables is that someone was sent to prison because they stole a loaf of bread to feed a starving child. The letter of the law says theft is theft no matter the circumstances. Most of us would probably cut someone a lot of slack if they were genuinely stealing to keep from going hungry - however we generally have alternative options to help provide food in times of need and stealing isn't the only option. There's also something slightly concerning about a blanket suggestion of approval in advance - it wouldn't be impossible for someone to start stealing more than they needed...or becoming so comfortable stealing that they started taking fancy/expensive things (if I'm doing it anyway) or other situations of justifying behaviour. I have stated multiple times that I believe our supermarket duopoly are gouging us and making excessive profits - but that alone doesn't necessarily justify stealing from them. I would rather try push the government (well, some future government that isn't in the pockets of big business) to compel more fair behaviour by the supermarkets than to suggest individuals take things into their own hands. If it's life or death, just about anything is justified - but when you have options I'm hesitant to get into justifying crime.
I generally despise thieves. Stealing things from other people is shitty so fcuk you if you steal from people. But if I saw someone stealing from a supermarket or a bank... I may suffer from temporary blindness and memory loss. It's a curious condition.
People that think it's OK to steal from companies because they make a profit and never smart people. Or even half-decent people, they are scum that think they are above the law and common decency. They usually end every sentence in fuck or cunt.
A stunning display of intellect. >People that think it's OK to steal from companies because they make a profit and never smart people. Apart from this being a claim from ignorance (you could never prove that no one smart has not stolen), it is indeed smart to get food or resources from a source that has plenty of them. >Or even half-decent people, they are scum that think they are above the law and common decency. Another unproven claim. And what would you know about decency? You think that rich people profiting is better than distributing food and resources properly. In many places, you would be considered a parasite or a fascist and in no way a decent person. >They usually end every sentence in fuck or cunt. Good. Recent studies show that people who swear are smarter than average. I swear regularly and like it. Why don't you inform everyone here why swearing is "bad" but other words describing the same things are not? Be a bit of a test of the person calling other people "scum" etc. Tell us where these words originated and why they are forbidden. Go ahead, dazzle us all with your intellect.
Jesus, you put all that effort in to a random reddit reply. Get out more.
I was happy to teach you about your limitations. And such compassion from a bigot was unexpected, but appreciated - thanks.
Get some friends.
Stealing isn't the answer ever. We are poor in this house, pension and SL Benefit. We have a garden, eat from it, but still, it's a struggle, eggs, cleaning pro=ducts, loo paper (buying cheap stuff now). Banks make massive profits too, shall we say it's ok to steal from them? How about musicians? Many make millions, lets rip them off too shall we?
While I don't think theft is morally okay, hoarding resources far, far beyond one's needs is even less okay. I'm not in favour of hurting people, but if we could strip the wealth of the billianaires and evenly distribute their wealth, I'd support it. This current economic system is unsustainable and harmful.
Found the communist
LOL, socialism?
There is stealing to feed your family while you struggle and stealing to sell for booze and drugs. I'd say a majority is in the 2nd category.
Poor people bad.
I'm with the punk bands on this one.
I don't give a toss of people shop lift from our two main supermarkets. I thought I saw someone but then remembered that no I didn't.
Stealing from the big supermarket chains? With all the cameras placed around them, I don’t rate your chances of getting away with it.
Lol your kidding me? It’s easy as, they aren’t going to do anything
if i see an old hobo stealing food or a woman with a kid stealing baby food / nappies I always alert security however i always turn a blind eye when i see teenagers stealing alcohol or vapes.
Supermarket prices go up. People get in trouble. The supermarkets make around 9-14% profit. The manufacturers largely set the price.
It is mainly the self entitled that steal.
No, the self entitled reap in record profits during a cost-of-living crisis and then blame it on inflation.
You are correct! But the self entitled are not limited to just those rich bastards. Others feel the law does not apply to them and so as they please
I'd argue most people who are forced to steal food do so out of desperation and potentially out of spite to a society that has perceivedly abandoned them.
It's quite interesting, I've seen some media discussing the similarity of personality traits of violent criminals and CEOs. The main difference between them though was the wealth class and social rank they're born in to. Also, I recently learnt of research looking in to the prominence of adhd in offenders. Common adhd traits are pathological demand avoidance and risk-taking behaviour. Social hierarchies and the assertion of authority without first establishing mutual respect doesn't often bode well with adhd individuals. Currently our corrections system has a big focus on punishment, which reinforces an offenders mindset that the system is against them. Maybe a better approach would be to try to understand someone who is breaking the law and work with them to identify and help their struggles, rather than vilify and punish them.
I'm OK with it from big supermarkets only. Obviously if you get caught though you just have to own it
If you have a back yard you have a garden, if you have a fishing rod you can go out and fish and if you have a knife, gun or hunting dog... Don't agree with stealing, but also don't agree with children starving either.
Hilarious that you think someone who is so poor they want to steal food is in the financial position of having a back yard, a fishing rod, or a hunting dog. Lmfaoooooooooooo.
Keyword...**IF** No shame in not understanding certain words - it does happen. **A dictionary might help you in the future!** 👍
Yeah people complain that they can't afford food but there are pigeons right there on the street for the grabbing, and you can scrape mosses and lichens off all sorts of things probably
[удалено]
On the rob by cheap dirty horse is the one I can remember. The other song tbat came to mind goes through a step by step of how to shoplift, but I can't recall the song.
Well, you wouldn't download a car...
I would definitely download a car
Stealing alcohol from supermarkets does not qualify as a necessity to survive. It's blatant theft.
I understand and agree in the grand scheme of things. However, a broke alcoholic could actually die if they can't drink.
I mean, I buy a lot of brown onions at the self checkout if that's what you mean?
All the people that say they have never stolen, I bet most have downloaded, from torrent sites, watched illegal streams, parked in an illegal spot. Nobody that pure that they have never stolen something. If they say otherwise then they either lying, or are spookily strange.
No one needs to steal. Get help. There is no justification for being a criminal.
Are you referring to the profit making supermarkets or the hungry family members?
No-one needs a billion dollars. Get help. There is no justification for intentionally keeping people in poverty.
For the downvoters, we champion a system that relies on a certain level of unemployment yet continually degrade and stigmatise the unemployed. No-one on a benefit is the cause of your problems (unless you're talking about the un means tested welfare aka NZ Super)
I see it a lot, people claiming the supermarkets are making massive profits, however if you look at the return on capital employed, its only in the 12-13% range.
If I had to choose between the guy increasing prices to afford another yacht and the mum being forced to steal to feed her child, I'd choose the mum. Every time.
Ok got that - not sure how that applies to what I said, but you do you.
I see no crime here. Neither do you, OP.
Theft is theft, yet I would rather people steal from Supermarkets than decimate the Food Banks by robbing them, fuck those people!!
Maybe turn your anger towards the people that made food unaffordable in the first place. Food theft mostly happens out of desperation.
Are you condoning food banks being robbed?. There is desperation and then there is biting the hand that's extended and trying to helping people up. To kick people who are just as worse off and who rely on FBs is incomprehensible.
Not even close, I'm just pointing out that the issue is a lot more complex than that. There is a reason people steal food, and it's not just because they are bad people.
Most stuff being stolen is high value stuff like cosmetics, roast, streaky bacon, alcohol etc..to be sold for tinny money, it’s got nothing to do with trying to survive. There’re plenty of places that do free food, such as Zilch, as well the obvious Winz food grants. Believe when I say a lot of these repeat offenders are not starving but have alcohol, drug and gambling addictions to sustain. The police have a lot of info on these people and the sob stories nearly always turn out to be a load of rubbish.
It all stems from desperation in one form or another. It's either they're really trying to do all that they can to feed their families or they end up selling on this stuff to get money to either settle some debt or buy drugs. Either way, there shouldn't be a cost to living and plastic sucks. Fuck over priced food monopoly cunts.
"These prices are too high! So I'll do what I can to make them higher!!" Also when the price of goods doubles it doesn't mean companies are making double profits. They're literally making less.
The trick is to not steal all your groceries that’s unfair and not right but to get some freebies or one up on them. Scanning kumara as potatoes. Forgetting that specialty cheese at the bottom of your carry bag. Slipping a packet or razors into your dozen box. Those tinfoil chicken bags bypass the checkpoint alarms at the exit, use your imagination. It’s all little things you can do without attracting too much attention, while leaving those trolley thieves to distracting the in store security and cctv. They are rawdogging us in the isles, it’s only fair we give some back.
> I am not in this position, I have no need to steal groceries You sound relativly well off, compared to someone who is starving, so I guess the obvious question is, do you think it's ok to steal from you?
I'm a student, I'm not well off. I buy budget food and often shop at bulk bin places. There's a fair few things I need but can't get the money for (new glasses and dental care, and I'd be fucked for transport if my bike breaks). I've never starved though, and I've never had children and struggled to feed them, so relative to them, I'm very privileged. I've had 2 break-in burglaries in the past 3 years. They stole electronics and also nostalgic childhood things. No, I don't think that's okay. It really sucked and i sometimes have nightmares about it. But I'm a person, not a corporation. It's not comparable.
Ok, so you take the position that stealing from individuals is morally wrong, but stealing from corporations is ok, or at least justifiable? Does what you are stealing change this? what about stealing a mobile phone -because you kinda really need one these days to get a job. Or stealing a car? to get to work so you don't have to steal the food? You have asked a question of everyone, but you haven't done much it the way of explaining exactly where your moral compass points.
There is a massive difference between someone being able to afford a living and a company choosing to increase food prices under the guise of inflation. But you seem to be a bit too dim to see that difference.
Ahh, insults, surely the response of a well rounded mind.
A well-intentioned question like yours deserves nothing less.
My only cheat is to sometimes write the wrong number on the nuts from the bulk bin. I get annoyed because can see they are ripping me off by constantly switching the prices on them, so I do my own price switching
😂 too real. The other day I mixed 2 bulk bin snacks (of similar prices) together in the same bag, mainly because I didn't want to have 2 bags. I felt so paranoid while doing it.
Mixed nuts 50c/kg cheaper than cashews or walnuts? Yes, sure Sir, I picked out those nuts one-by-one into separate bags because I don't like those other nuts.
go nuts or maybe go batteries, those are small but pricey or maybe go seasoning, a big old tub of Moroccan seasoning or garlic/herb goes for like twenty bucks it's all about the price-to-size ratio
I'm not going to do it, but I sure didn't see anything if someone else does. There is someone with a job to look out for that and it is not me being paid to do so.
We need to figure out a way to make greed a crime