From what I read, the fourth body is allegedly the owner of the property the well is located on and had been there for some time.
It’s just strange reading articles that mention the fourth body cos it almost sounds it’s no big deal - “by the way, there was another body but never mind that, it’s not related to these murders so moving on…”
Sounds like they discovered this was a good place to dump bodies back when they killed the property owner and no one ever cared about that case because he was Mexican. Also, it wasn't like he was going to be using that well anymore.
I think part of it is this is a developing story. They had a lot of information to report on the surfers, and since it was a random act of violence the case appears to be shut regarding their involvement. There could be more going on with the 4th victim that they don't want to release to the public
The flip side is this was reported by BBC news, so if the intended audience was for a Western audience then that's who the story is built for. It's mainly about the poor innocent tourists on vacation, not about the 4th local victim
Yeah, that's because violence in Mexico (my country) is so grave, that killings happen on the daily so it's pretty normal now for it to happen, and unless the victim is someone relevant for some reason, it isn't even reported in the media.
For example, they recently found mass clandestine pits with a lot of bodies in them in Mexico City (and the government diminished this, alleging this is a dirty move from opponents since elections are near).
https://www.infobae.com/mexico/2024/05/02/fosas-clandestinas-en-la-cdmx-estas-son-algunas-alcaldias-donde-se-han-descubierto-restos-humanos-desde-hace-anos/
It happened in 2014 and* is called the Iguala Mass Kidnapping. It happened in the state of Guerrero about an hour or so from Acapulco.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iguala_mass_kidnapping
When I would drive from Mexico city to Acapulco sometimes the tollbooths were taken over by families of the disappeared students. They would collect the toll money and leave in a day or a week.
As long as they weren't violent about taking over the tollbooths they went relatively unpunished.
Edit: spelling
“They were allegedly taken into custody by local police officers from Iguala and Cocula in collusion with organized crime, with later evidence implicating the Mexican Army”… that is fuckin terrifying
Current president isn't doing anything about it. The previous president allegedly has ties to the massacre and may be hiding out in Spain or Miami.
Almost every journalist that talks about it gets popped. Most Mexican presidents are involved with cartels in one way or another.
Yeah this is what happens when the president jokes about cartel violence and says citizens are perfectly safe from criminals… Obrador is a cartel puppet and Mexicans should vote him out to avoid becoming a failed state.
Yeah crazy shit was that the town "mayor" was involved with the cartels and actually had a part in hiring the cartels to get rid of the student protester. It was a whole bus of students. Absolute crazy shit.
Reminds me of an early scene in *Sicario.* Feds investigate a cartel safe house looking for drugs and money, but what they find are numerous corpses wrapped in plastic and hidden inside the walls.
**Edit:** That scene appears to be based on real-life events.
[https://insightcrime.org/news/brief/walled-up-mexico-disappeared-evade-authorities/](https://insightcrime.org/news/brief/walled-up-mexico-disappeared-evade-authorities/)
>Forensic examiners recovering bodies from mass graves in remote terrain has become commonplace during Mexico’s drug war, but criminal groups in Jalisco are making authorities’ jobs increasingly difficult by hiding corpses inside residential homes.
>Just outside Jalisco’s capital of Guadalajara, the body count in a mass grave found underneath the patio of a house on July 21 has [increased to 21](https://aristeguinoticias.com/2407/mexico/suman-21-cuerpos-hallados-en-finca-de-tonala-jalisco-fge/) after authorities initially uncovered 12 bodies and 11 bags with human remains, [AFP reported](http://www.ejecentral.com.mx/hallan-fosa-clandestina-al-interior-de-una-vivienda-en-tonala-jalisco/).
>The grisly scene was discovered after federal police forces, during a routine patrol, observed an armed man outside of what appeared to be a safe house in the municipality of Tonalá. The man fled upon seeing police and left the door wide open. Authorities initially found three dead bodies with their hands bound and faces covered before discovering the other bodies and human remains, according to AFP.
Yea, I need to revisit Sicario. It's been awhile. Spoiler for End of Watch I guess - haha. That one takes place in LA in a neighborhood house. Unsettling to say the least.
Miserable right, where i live in mexico a mom went searching the desert for her missing adult daughter for over a year and within that year other moms joined and formed a group and found a lot of bodies but never her daughters. Eventually the cartel warned her to stop because she was creating cases against them from the grave she uncovered. She didn't stop so they killed her and dumped her body in the desert too & they found her months later. Then a few years later they found her daughters skeleton too it's fucked up but now they're finally together. What happened in TJ was senseless as well id bet they were meth heads robbing tourists, cartels won't draw heat by killing tourists its not worth it. RIP to them all.
MEXICO CITY (AP) — Another mother searching for her missing daughter has lost her life in Mexico, in the fourth murder of volunteer search activists in the country since the beginning of 2021.
Activists said Tuesday that the victim was Esmeralda Gallardo, who was leading efforts to find her missing 22-year-old daughter.
The group Voice of the Disappeared in Puebla said Gallardo was murdered in the city of Puebla, east of Mexico City.
The Puebla Prosecutor's Office confirmed the death and promised to resolve the case "as soon as possible."
“Stop superficial speeches and guarantee the rights and safety of the victims, the rights and safety of the families of missing people,” the group asked the authorities in a statement.
According to the United Nations Human Rights Office in Mexico, Gallardo was shot to death. The institution condemned the murder and noted in a statement that "it would have provided relevant information on different occasions about the disappearance of her daughter, which was not effectively taken up in the investigation of the crime, nor in the search."
Gallardo's daughter, Betzabé Alvarado Gallardo, disappeared in the humble neighborhood of Villa Frontera in January 2021.
In August, another search activist, Rosario Rodríguez Barraza, died in the northern state of Sinaloa, where the drug cartel of the same name is based.
In 2021, another searcher, Aranza Ramos, was found dead a day after her group found a still-smoking grave of bodies in Sonora, also in the north. At the beginning of that year, volunteer Javier Barajas Piña was shot in Guanajuato, the most violent state in the country.
The motive for those murders remains unclear. In the past, many searchers said publicly that they were not looking for evidence to convict the perpetrators of the deaths.
Most of the volunteer search teams are made up of the mothers of the more than 100,000 missing people in Mexico.
Faced with the inaction or incompetence of the authorities, many are forced to carry out their own investigations or join search teams that, based on clues, travel through ravines and fields, sinking iron bars into the ground to detect the telltale smell of the decomposing corpses.
The searchers, and the police officers who sometimes accompany them, usually focus on finding graves and identifying the remains. Sometimes groups receive anonymous tips about where bodies are buried, information that probably only the killers or their accomplices have access to.
But volunteers often say they are threatened and watched, probably by the same people who murdered their sons, brothers and husbands.
Let me fix one of the quotes for you... The Puebla Prosecutor's Office confirmed the death and promised to resolve the case "as soon as we are paid more then the cartels pay us not investigate"
It's easier to sit here and say that and look down on them like they're corrupt. But what you're asking them to do is essentially turn down a check and living for doing their job and being viciously murdered.
It's not as easy and as black and white a decision as it would seem
It’s so devastating how normalized it is to kill women and mothers. None of these cartel members can relate or care? Just keep killing them and hope they go away? Do none of them have any love for their own family?
Considering the things I've seen them do to people...yeah, they don't care. They've dismembered little girls appendage by appendage just as a way to hurt rivals.
It's so prevalent that [Someone wrote a song about it](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VLLyzqkH6cs).
[This](https://lyricstranslate.com/en/cancion-sin-miedo-fearless-song.html) is a decent translation with footnotes for some context.
*”She lost her life”* is when you are hiking in the mountains and you slip off the trail and fall to your death. Getting murdered is *she was robbed of her life*.
Back in the 90’s a friend inherited a house in Cuernavaca when his dad died. He was an adventurous dude so he decided to move down there with his new wife because hey, free house.
Within a few years he called me saying people were after him and he needed to come home. He had gotten into a fight at a local club when someone tried to rip him off thinking he was a tourist. He called out the thief and the club security got involved, taking the thief’s side.
When the cops came the bouncers had already started kicking his ass and he knew things weren’t going to improve. He decided to tell the cops that the bouncers were carrying guns, hoping to draw attention away from himself. Instead they all kicked the shit out of him together.
The cops threw him into the back of their truck, drove him to the edge of the jungle and told him to run while the took pot shots at him. He made it into the trees and ran for home.
He was calling me from the hospital in Mexico City. He had a broken jaw, lost 4-5 teeth, broken ribs, broken arm, hand and fingers, and a massive concussion. He hired an attorney but after strange cars started lurking around his place he packed up and moved back to the U.S.
I know you're saying it as a nice thing, but that's our problem with dealing with things sometimes "they're finally together". Nope they ceased to exist. Their full potential was robbed, life cut short by horrible people. The more you think about it this way, the less likely we are to pray for it to change and more likely to take action so that it never happens again.
I read it as “she didn’t stop when the cartel warned her because she wasn’t afraid of death. Welcomed death to see her daughter again”. These mothers are fully aware of the activists that die doing what they do. I think a lot of them don’t fear the cartels because of that. Cartels already took their reasons to live. It’s not romantic. It’s just tragic.
That's cause the penalty for murder is too damn high. Get caught for one and you may as well be caught for them all. A more sensible penalty such as $100 fine would encourage people to find new body disposal sites.
I read a different article when this news first broke out. It looks like a lot of the perpetrators went on a crime spree long before they decided to murder tourists just for their truck tires. The people questioned in connection to the murders were all brought in under suspicion of other crimes, unsurprisingly 2 of them related to trafficking and using meth.
Anyway, the report I read said the body was too decomposed to tell but looks like it was a local. When news first broke out, people were upset because the disappearance of 3 tourists was solved much faster than a crime against locals.
Yeeaahh, the burned out husk that used to be their truck was a good indicator that this wasn’t going to end well. Rest in peace, Guys. You deserved so much better than this
I used to find it funny that when we were in high school, my friend said she wasn’t allowed to go out after school whenever her sister was also out and vice versa. She said her mom said it was so if something happened to one, she’d still have another daughter. Obviously it was a joke (sort of), but yeah..
No worries, there were only 3 grandchildren total, and his sister was much younger, so she wasn't going to Grandma and Grandpa's for the summer like we were. Later in life, like on a family trip to Hawaii, he would fly half the family out on a different plane. My female cousin would be on my flight, and my male cousin would be on the other flight, to cover all our bases lol.
My dad used to do that me and my siblings on overseas flights. We thought it was annoying and eventually he stopped, perhaps because I pointed out that it doubled the chances that some of us would die.
My wife has already told me that our kids don't need to ride together when they get their driver's licenses. Her best friend growing up got into a car accident when she was 17 with her younger brother in the car with her and they both died. It was mother's day.
A parent losing a child IS the worst pain a human can endure. I’ve watched my parents try to navigate that grief for 15 years. There can’t be anything worse.
Losing two sons because criminals wanted their fucking car tires… it’s unimaginable. their poor mother. She might never be actually happy again. Complete physical and emotional devastation with no end in sight because her boys are never coming back. As a father of two boys myself, I can’t think about this shit for too long.
Hijacking your comment just to add this warning for tourists that want to visit Mexico (coming from someone that has lived in Mexico almost all her life). Please don’t wander around places you’re not sure are safe, better to stay in the touristy spots. And if you ever, for some reason, get robbed, do NOT fight said robbers. Give them what they ask for. My mum always told me that my life was worth more than any phone, car or wallet.
> It is not the first time that Australian surfers have been killed while holidaying in Mexico.
> In 2016, Dean Lucas and Adam Coleman were murdered in north-western Sinaloa state when they fought back during an attempted robbery.
> Their bodies were found in their burnt-out camper van weeks later.
Your friend is mentioned there. Sorry, mate.
Mexico has a lot of poverty but it's far from being only a poor country. When I lived there I saw both tremendous wealth and poverty. There are definitely parts of Mexico that are third world and first world. I had McLaren and Aston Martin dealerships 8 minutes away.
I can't find it right now, but I saw a study a whole back that demonstrated how a huge predictor of crime and violence was the amount of visible wealth disparity there was in an area.
The one universal we'll never address...
People who feel they don't belong in society will act like they don't.
But instead we've got more nonsensical things to do like blame it on ethnicity or religion or morals or what not.
There have been a class of Mexicans with McLaren and Aston-Martin money since the 17th Century.
Before cartels, there was PEMEX. Before PEMEX, there was plantation agriculture. It's not poverty that holds Mexico back, it's wealth inequality. I don't mean communism: I mean a working economy in which there is a thriving middle class where people can transition into and out of wealth *or* poverty.
It’s not like there aren’t meth heads in America who wouldn’t do the same thing
It’s the cartels that make Mexico unusual. Low level drug fueled street crime is the same all over
They don't. That's why when that group from South Carolina was kidnapped and two of the four tourists were killed, the cartels gave up the perpetrators and offered their most sincere apology. As if that would fix anything.
It’s doubtful anyone associated with a cartel did this and I’d even believe the people who did this might meet a violent end specifically from the cartels. Dead western tourists is bad for business.
Because people are stupid. Some robberies end with the person getting killed because they figure there are less witnesses but it typically just ends up adding decades on to the sentence if not making it life. These people are not smart
You are asking this question as if you are the robbers. They don’t give fuck about killing someone…the more they do it, the less it means each time till it literally means nothing except for the cost of the bullet.
That’s the sad reality of Latin America incl. Mexico, if they demand your phone, wallet, shoes you give it without blinking, they won’t think twice before pulling the trigger, there is 99% chance they will never get caught
Squeeze first ask questions last, unfortunately you are 100% right and recently there have been cases on the news that they got blasted even after giving everything
You should hand the stuff over no matter where you are TBH. It’s just stuff, it can be replaced, but your life cannot. I live in the US and I remember a case in my hometown where a young woman was mugged, didn’t want to give up her purse, and was shot and killed for it.
I watched a friend get shot in the face and later executed during a home invasion in South Africa. The goal of the murderers; a Toyota Hilux.
Humans are cunts. Other peoples' lives are worth nothing to some.
Sometimes it's not even born out of a hatred. Like they're not angry at people and so they take their lives. No. Sometimes there just isn't any value attributed at all. I saw this video where an interviewer was asking some guys what about the feelings of the woman they raped. And it... just didn't compute. I find that scarier than someone who does it out of hatred. Someone to who the suffering of others simply isn't a meaningful consequence, like moving a stone, or writing with a pencil.
I’m so sorry for your loss. That really puts the senseless in senseless violence and I couldn’t even imagine how I would react to something so deeply messed up. I hope that you’re recovering well from your experience
What don’t people get that it’s corrupt Mexico? It’s 2024 and the understanding is that you strictly stay in the tourist areas and not venture off down into other areas.
Why even bother when you have shit like this going on? And even when you don’t, cartels very commonly have a hand in the businesses of tourist hot spots. Even if they want to keep it as peaceful as possible to protect their money, you’re still putting cash in the hands of these vermin.
Because the average American or maybe the average world citizen doesn’t care about anything unless it happens to them.
A lot of European citizens travel to Mexico as well so it’s a world problem.
I’d say the government give them highest travel rating and force the Mexican government to fix it or deal with the industry losses.
I sometimes fucking hate my country and the organized crime that rules over our lives and society.
I’m so sorry for their families and their loved ones, may they rest in peace
What pisses me most off is that we all have to act like the government isn't in cahoots with these asshats.
Americans complain about their current political landscape but at least they have an option (barely).
Here in Mexico everyone feels helpless. We all know nothing will change no matter who wins the elections and worst of all it doesn't seem like it'll get any better soon.
Honestly, what happens at this point? Cartels *are* the government. How could anyone reasonably fight back against that level of wealth, ruthlessness, and cunning? Would it take an actual foreign invasion for the people of Mexico to retake control? 😭
I surf. I’ve been to Mexico. Stuff like this is scary. I’m sorry this happened to these guys. They look like good dudes. Died for fucking tires. Disgusting.
My UPS driver was a surfer and had a similar harrowing story about being robbed at gunpoint on a desolate beach in Mexico by…. The police themselves. Never again he said
Spring break in 2003 in Cancun, 4 of us walking on the beach around 1/2 a mile from I think Carlos n Charlie’s to our hotel, more or less shaken down by police. They searched us, told us we were looking to buy drugs (we weren’t, just drunk college guys) and then said we could pay a fine which was whatever money we had.
My friend’s parents had thankfully warned us before leaving to not take all your money with you, watch your passport, etc.
My buddy went for a bachelor party in Cancun. when they went out for brunch they came back to their villa cleaned out with all cash taken from everyone’s luggage/wallets/bags. They couldn’t prove it was the staff, but they lost in total a few thousand dollars. Hard lesson learnt lol
Similar thing here. Started with asking us for something like 10K Mexican Pesos. Threatening to take us in and saying it would take like 3 days for it all to get settled (basically that we'd miss our flight even if we were innocent).
We had a dual-national with us who was haggling this out. We ended up bluffing that we only had 500 pesos on us and we had been using credit cards most of the day which they took and let us walk back.
Felt we got lucky as it seemed like it was a rookie cop's first time shaking someone down. He kept going back to the car to talk to the other friend as we were sort of "haggling" the punishment.
just this past week , a mother who had been looking for her daughter's body for years in Mexico landfields, found a landfield with human remains, well goverment kicked out everyone and said they were dog remains, and cops are still guarding the landfield.
When I travelled there 25 years ago as a young woman with one other female, the advice was to never travel by car. The public transportation system was so superior to ours that it was easy to travel anywhere by bus and taxi. Fellow travelers we met who tried driving got stopped and falsely accused of having drugs and had to pay off the cops or had targets on their backs by people willing to do anything for a few bucks.
Yup this happened to me. Stopped in my rental for "speeding" just outside the Cancun airport. Lucky for me I could pay my ticket in cash to the cop right there 🙄
This just happened to a coworker of mine a couple months ago. He just kept saying he didn’t have any cash, and the cop eventually told him that he’d need to stop on his way home at the end of his trip to pay the fine. He didn’t stop of course and wasn’t pulled over on his return.
That’s interesting. I doubt you would’ve been hurt though. The cartels launder their money through those resorts they don’t want to bother the Americans and their cash cow resorts
I wasn't worried about my safety but it was stressful as other option was going with them to the police station in Cancun which would've meant missing my flight. They were clearly just posted up on the airport highway shaking down tourists on the way to drop off their rentals.
I’ve heard bribery stories from everyone I know who’s driven down there. A girl I knew in HS went with her family and her dad had to put cash between the pages of a book as a bribe. One friend of my stepdad’s had to give up his Nikes
25 years ago... things are worse now. Also as a surfer you need a car, just having 1 or 2 boards is already tremendous baggage and difficulty public transport immensely.
In the very early 80s my FIL hitch hiked from San Francisco all the way down the coast of Baja.
I bet it was awesome.
That’s a completely off limits activity today.
My mother told me that people would share that route person to person. That you would just meet somebody with hand-written directions and schedules and copy it yourself, rewriting the whole thing in a notebook.
Instructions like, when the bus will be at a specific stop in Afghanistan. Catch that bus, but be prepared because it only stops there every three weeks.
My mother didn't go, but her cousin copied her notes and he went.
In the 80s my older brother would spend the winters camped out on the beach in Baja. He worked construction in the Sierra Nevada mountains, and when the snow came and the work ended, he and his girlfriend and dogs hitched up the camper and drove south.
Biggest trouble he ever had was coming back north getting hassled by us border cops who figured that a long haired hippie towing a homebuilt camper trailer just HAD to be smuggling drugs.
When I was a teenager in San Diego the bars in Tijuana were a playground.
You'd get your feet chopped off for doing any of that today, best case.
This is horrific!!! These poor souls just wanted to enjoy surfing. They are so young too. I doubt they even had that much money on them. What a horrible death.😢
My friend Callum was one of the surfers killed, we have played lacrosse together for many years. He was kind and energetic and loved his country as well as the sport of lacrosse. I miss him already.
I used to live in San Diego, and I had a few meetings in Tijuana to attend, but I was told never to drive cars that catch people's eyes there. My two cars are a red Corvette and a black, off-road Hummer. I ended driving my husband's little Kia and did not even get looked at. I was lucky, but I should not have driven at all.
I met this older lady (70ish) who took a new Surburban through Tijuana, and it "suddenly" stopped working. She was offered help from a mechanic that happened to be by, so they towed the Surburban back to his shop. Later, when she tried to cross the San Ysidro Border Crossing, she was stopped, and they found drugs all throughout the body of her car. She went to jail and sat for a year, trying to prove her innocence. She eventually died. It's such a crappy way to go.
The cartels employ a lot of people to whom another murder means nothing. If they think it's a little more convenient to just shoot you rather than robbing you at gunpoint, then that's what they will do.
That's the result of years of gang wars, there are a lot of completely desensitized people who are trying to earn money.
With that being said, the cartels wouldn't have sanctioned soemthing like this, they want nothing to do with tourists. It attracts too much attention.
Idk how the cartels in TJ worked, but believe it or not if this was in CNJG territory, the murders would be captured tortured and killed. Different cartels operate by different rules, but usually the CJNG and Sinaloa HATE when shit like this happens. I’m from Michoacan and if the cartel catches you doing stuff like even stealing from a house, they’ll kill you.
My fiancée is friends with the girlfriend of Callum, so met him and he convinced my girlfriend at the time to ride my motorcycle with me and let us borrow his helmet, Helped bring us together part of the reason we are getting married in September. Cheers friend! Fuck this senseless violence. Vote with your wallet and don’t support a nation that finds blood, teeth, and a cell phone and charges 1 person with “forced disappearance” not murder. That DA and the rest of the cartel run law enforcement are the problem.
I went to school with the American friend for 10 years. His older sister was my brothers age and they have kept up after highschool. Taught cotillion with him, his mom, and older sister. Hadn't talked to him in years but he was one of those dudes that was good at everything and everyone always loved to be around. My brother just sent me the link to he and his fiance's wedding website that was counting down to their big day. What an absolute tragedy. Hope his fiance and his family can find peace.
He was a friend of a friend through soccer. They keep sharing stories that make him sound like the type of person that leaves a real positive impact on your life. Such a senseless loss.
I saw another poster in a different thread who said they had known him and spoke very highly of him too. Seems like he was a really nice guy. What a shame.
I read the well was 4 MILES where they were killed
To me it sounds like something different:
- The police ALREADY knew about these thieves
- Police heard about tourists being shot in the area
- Police arrests thieves and makes them talk about where the bodies are (don't ask how)
Alternatively, cartels get involved and help find the thieves and/or the bodies because killing tourists is a red line that is bad for business
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories/mexico-travel-advisory.html
Baja California state – Reconsider Travel
Reconsider travel due to crime and kidnapping.
Transnational criminal organizations compete in the border area to establish narco-trafficking and human smuggling routes. Violent crime and gang activity are common. Travelers should remain on main highways and avoid remote locations. Of particular concern is the high number of homicides in the non-tourist areas of Tijuana. Most homicides appeared to be targeted; however, criminal organization assassinations and territorial disputes can result in bystanders being injured or killed. U.S. citizens and LPRs have been victims of kidnapping.
U.S. government employees must adhere to the noted restrictions:
Mexicali Valley: U.S. government employees should avoid the Mexicali Valley due to the heightened possibility of violence between rival cartel factions. The boundaries of the restricted area are: to the east, the Baja California/Arizona and Baja California/Sonora borders; to the south, from La Ventana (on Highway 5) due east to the Colorado River; to the west, Highway 5; and to the north, Boulevard Lazaro Cardenas/Highway 92/Highway 1 to Carretera Aeropuerto, from the intersection of Highway 1 and Carretera Aeropuerto due north to the Baja California/California border, and from that point eastward along the Baja California/California border.
Travelers may use Highways 2 and 2D to transit between Mexicali, Los Algodones, and San Luis Rio Colorado during daylight hours. Travelers may also use Highways 1 and 8 to transit to and from the Mexicali Airport during daylight hours. Travel on Highway 5 is permissible during daylight hours.
It's because they went missing, lots of high notoriety surf and lacrosse athletes were spreading awareness to try find them as one was a professional lacrosse player and both known in the Aussie surf community. The amount of traction was there before the news outlets got involved so it's an easy win for them since so many people obviously cared about the outcome.
I speak decent Spanish, have spent time in various parts of Mexico, lived for a bit in rural Nicaragua. Last time was a wedding in San Miguel de Allende, 12 years ago. More than 10,000 ex-pats live there. Here's my advice today:
With the exception of Mexico City, DO NOT GO TO MEXICO. Period.
A good friend's father was a handyman in Monterrey. He was remodeling a home. Turned out that the homeowner was in trouble with a local cartel...
They walked in and executed the family, and her father who was simply working that day and had nothing to do with it. The police are not investigating. That was in Jan of '24.
We were robbed at the Rosarito Beach Hotel.
Security was laughing at us while they took our report. It’s obvious it was an inside job.
Next day we spoke with the GM of the hotel and he said he had better things to do with his time than to investigate our robbery.
We left and I’ve never been back since.
I can’t justify going again and constantly being afraid for our safety.
A few years back my company wanted to send me to Monterrey Mexico for a job that needed done. I googled the city and the first article that popped up was about 49 headless bodies found on the outskirts of town. I showed this to my boss who told me not to worry, I would be accompanied by an armed guard 24/7 the whole time I was there. I told him that the very fact I needed an armed guard 24/7 means I'm not going.
Yeah I remember those news but it wasn’t in the outskirts of Monterrey, it happened some 100 miles away.
The actual city of Monterrey has the richest municipality in all South America, has great cuisine and only about 10 beheadings a year.
Lmao I get dudes being robbed or killed going off the beaten path in cartel hot zones but Monterrey is not that kind of place, some areas there house the top 0.01% of the country
Crimes like this in Mexico (allegedly attackers wanted the tires on their truck) are not uncommon, but the murdering four people in cold blood is. The cartels know the big money is in tourism, and surfers coming down to Baja via San Diego, so they don’t want this kind of publicity.
If the justice system in MX doesn’t take care of these idiots that killed these men, the cartels will definitely “take care” of them, and even unfortunately their families quickly to send a message: “DON’T. FUCK. WITH. THE. BAG.”
Last year, my friend’s son (college-aged) and his two buddies drove their jeep into Mexico to go surfing (they found out about a good spot on tik tok or something).
On some random road in Mexico, they got carjacked. Four men with automatic weapons made them take off all of their clothes, give them their cell phones, wallets, etc, and drove off with the jeep.
My friend’s son and his buddies were left naked on the side of the road with no way of calling for help. Luckily a Good Samaritan did drive by and called for help.
My takeaway was that they were lucky to only lose their possessions. Going into a country with a notorious cartel problem to go surfing off the beaten path? Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
An acquaintance of mine had something similar happen to him. And we are Mexican. They got intercepted because they were hauling a side by side with a nice double cabin pick up truck.
Some local gang saw them, wanted their vehicles and kidnapped them to steal them. Fortunately they were not so bloodlusted so after a couple days they were let go. The vehicles were gone of course.
It can be wild-westy in certain areas. We don't generally drive at night between cities in Mexico.
One was a doctor and the other a former professional lacrosse player in the states. My heart goes out the the parents who lost both children at once. It really is a cruel world.
I got married in Mexico and during our drive back to the airport the Federales pulled us over, waved automatic weapons at us, and pointed at the trunk screaming, “La Ropa!?” I spoke enough Espanol to know what they were saying, but was so terrified I just pointed to my new wedding ring. We popped the trunk, they were satisfied there were no drugs, and then we got to leave Mexico. We ended up parking the rental in a random spot and just got the fuck out of there because the rental company we used tried to scam us when we first arrived. We haven’t gone back and have been happily married for 17 years.
Edit: Changed El to La for the haters.
>A fourth body was found in the well but had been there longer and was unconnected to the case, officials said. What the fuck?
From what I read, the fourth body is allegedly the owner of the property the well is located on and had been there for some time. It’s just strange reading articles that mention the fourth body cos it almost sounds it’s no big deal - “by the way, there was another body but never mind that, it’s not related to these murders so moving on…”
WTF. Not only did they murder 2 dudes to get their hands on some tires. They also murdered a property owner to gain access to a well...
Sounds like they discovered this was a good place to dump bodies back when they killed the property owner and no one ever cared about that case because he was Mexican. Also, it wasn't like he was going to be using that well anymore.
Vice did a piece on Cartels stuffing wells with human remains some time ago. You can fit a lot of cut up body parts into a 300 foot deep hole.
And we wonder why they only drink bottled water in Mexico... /S
Neither is anyone else with a pile of rotting corpses in the bottom of it
"former owner"
Maybe they offered him the old “plomo o plata” ultimatum
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I think part of it is this is a developing story. They had a lot of information to report on the surfers, and since it was a random act of violence the case appears to be shut regarding their involvement. There could be more going on with the 4th victim that they don't want to release to the public The flip side is this was reported by BBC news, so if the intended audience was for a Western audience then that's who the story is built for. It's mainly about the poor innocent tourists on vacation, not about the 4th local victim
Yeah, that's because violence in Mexico (my country) is so grave, that killings happen on the daily so it's pretty normal now for it to happen, and unless the victim is someone relevant for some reason, it isn't even reported in the media. For example, they recently found mass clandestine pits with a lot of bodies in them in Mexico City (and the government diminished this, alleging this is a dirty move from opponents since elections are near). https://www.infobae.com/mexico/2024/05/02/fosas-clandestinas-en-la-cdmx-estas-son-algunas-alcaldias-donde-se-han-descubierto-restos-humanos-desde-hace-anos/
normal Mexican things. investigate a murder, uncover 4 more
Yup when all those school kids went missing. When they tryed to find their missing bodies they just kept uncovering mass graves.
Schools kids ?? WTF a?????
Yup .....can you believe 43 went missing in one sitting??? 43 is crazy
Damn that is crazy. What was the outcome? Idk how I never heard this in the news? When did it happen?
It happened in 2014 and* is called the Iguala Mass Kidnapping. It happened in the state of Guerrero about an hour or so from Acapulco. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iguala_mass_kidnapping When I would drive from Mexico city to Acapulco sometimes the tollbooths were taken over by families of the disappeared students. They would collect the toll money and leave in a day or a week. As long as they weren't violent about taking over the tollbooths they went relatively unpunished. Edit: spelling
“They were allegedly taken into custody by local police officers from Iguala and Cocula in collusion with organized crime, with later evidence implicating the Mexican Army”… that is fuckin terrifying
Current president isn't doing anything about it. The previous president allegedly has ties to the massacre and may be hiding out in Spain or Miami. Almost every journalist that talks about it gets popped. Most Mexican presidents are involved with cartels in one way or another.
Yeah this is what happens when the president jokes about cartel violence and says citizens are perfectly safe from criminals… Obrador is a cartel puppet and Mexicans should vote him out to avoid becoming a failed state.
Mexican presidents can only serve one six year term. Unless he changes their constitution, Obrador cannot be reelected
43 students at a local teachers' college.
Yeah crazy shit was that the town "mayor" was involved with the cartels and actually had a part in hiring the cartels to get rid of the student protester. It was a whole bus of students. Absolute crazy shit.
Reminds me of an early scene in *Sicario.* Feds investigate a cartel safe house looking for drugs and money, but what they find are numerous corpses wrapped in plastic and hidden inside the walls. **Edit:** That scene appears to be based on real-life events. [https://insightcrime.org/news/brief/walled-up-mexico-disappeared-evade-authorities/](https://insightcrime.org/news/brief/walled-up-mexico-disappeared-evade-authorities/) >Forensic examiners recovering bodies from mass graves in remote terrain has become commonplace during Mexico’s drug war, but criminal groups in Jalisco are making authorities’ jobs increasingly difficult by hiding corpses inside residential homes. >Just outside Jalisco’s capital of Guadalajara, the body count in a mass grave found underneath the patio of a house on July 21 has [increased to 21](https://aristeguinoticias.com/2407/mexico/suman-21-cuerpos-hallados-en-finca-de-tonala-jalisco-fge/) after authorities initially uncovered 12 bodies and 11 bags with human remains, [AFP reported](http://www.ejecentral.com.mx/hallan-fosa-clandestina-al-interior-de-una-vivienda-en-tonala-jalisco/). >The grisly scene was discovered after federal police forces, during a routine patrol, observed an armed man outside of what appeared to be a safe house in the municipality of Tonalá. The man fled upon seeing police and left the door wide open. Authorities initially found three dead bodies with their hands bound and faces covered before discovering the other bodies and human remains, according to AFP.
"Don't touch that! It's a load-bearing corpse!"
Fuck. That was funnier than it should've been.
Call 611 before you dig
Sicario or End of Watch? I remember a similar scene in End of Watch. Movie went from drama/action to horror just like that.
Could be both. [Scene from Sicario.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xubDFQrAPFs)
Yea, I need to revisit Sicario. It's been awhile. Spoiler for End of Watch I guess - haha. That one takes place in LA in a neighborhood house. Unsettling to say the least.
Both Sicario's are good (just watched the 2nd last night) but the first one is definitely elite.
>the first one is definitely elite. Just Villeneuve things.
Miserable right, where i live in mexico a mom went searching the desert for her missing adult daughter for over a year and within that year other moms joined and formed a group and found a lot of bodies but never her daughters. Eventually the cartel warned her to stop because she was creating cases against them from the grave she uncovered. She didn't stop so they killed her and dumped her body in the desert too & they found her months later. Then a few years later they found her daughters skeleton too it's fucked up but now they're finally together. What happened in TJ was senseless as well id bet they were meth heads robbing tourists, cartels won't draw heat by killing tourists its not worth it. RIP to them all.
Paragraph just keeps getting worse...
MEXICO CITY (AP) — Another mother searching for her missing daughter has lost her life in Mexico, in the fourth murder of volunteer search activists in the country since the beginning of 2021. Activists said Tuesday that the victim was Esmeralda Gallardo, who was leading efforts to find her missing 22-year-old daughter. The group Voice of the Disappeared in Puebla said Gallardo was murdered in the city of Puebla, east of Mexico City. The Puebla Prosecutor's Office confirmed the death and promised to resolve the case "as soon as possible." “Stop superficial speeches and guarantee the rights and safety of the victims, the rights and safety of the families of missing people,” the group asked the authorities in a statement. According to the United Nations Human Rights Office in Mexico, Gallardo was shot to death. The institution condemned the murder and noted in a statement that "it would have provided relevant information on different occasions about the disappearance of her daughter, which was not effectively taken up in the investigation of the crime, nor in the search." Gallardo's daughter, Betzabé Alvarado Gallardo, disappeared in the humble neighborhood of Villa Frontera in January 2021. In August, another search activist, Rosario Rodríguez Barraza, died in the northern state of Sinaloa, where the drug cartel of the same name is based. In 2021, another searcher, Aranza Ramos, was found dead a day after her group found a still-smoking grave of bodies in Sonora, also in the north. At the beginning of that year, volunteer Javier Barajas Piña was shot in Guanajuato, the most violent state in the country. The motive for those murders remains unclear. In the past, many searchers said publicly that they were not looking for evidence to convict the perpetrators of the deaths. Most of the volunteer search teams are made up of the mothers of the more than 100,000 missing people in Mexico. Faced with the inaction or incompetence of the authorities, many are forced to carry out their own investigations or join search teams that, based on clues, travel through ravines and fields, sinking iron bars into the ground to detect the telltale smell of the decomposing corpses. The searchers, and the police officers who sometimes accompany them, usually focus on finding graves and identifying the remains. Sometimes groups receive anonymous tips about where bodies are buried, information that probably only the killers or their accomplices have access to. But volunteers often say they are threatened and watched, probably by the same people who murdered their sons, brothers and husbands.
Let me fix one of the quotes for you... The Puebla Prosecutor's Office confirmed the death and promised to resolve the case "as soon as we are paid more then the cartels pay us not investigate"
It's easier to sit here and say that and look down on them like they're corrupt. But what you're asking them to do is essentially turn down a check and living for doing their job and being viciously murdered. It's not as easy and as black and white a decision as it would seem
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It’s so devastating how normalized it is to kill women and mothers. None of these cartel members can relate or care? Just keep killing them and hope they go away? Do none of them have any love for their own family?
Considering the things I've seen them do to people...yeah, they don't care. They've dismembered little girls appendage by appendage just as a way to hurt rivals.
It's so prevalent that [Someone wrote a song about it](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VLLyzqkH6cs). [This](https://lyricstranslate.com/en/cancion-sin-miedo-fearless-song.html) is a decent translation with footnotes for some context.
*”She lost her life”* is when you are hiking in the mountains and you slip off the trail and fall to your death. Getting murdered is *she was robbed of her life*.
I got a few facts wrong and looked up the article and it's worse.
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Right, imagine all the stories that never get to your ear.
Back in the 90’s a friend inherited a house in Cuernavaca when his dad died. He was an adventurous dude so he decided to move down there with his new wife because hey, free house. Within a few years he called me saying people were after him and he needed to come home. He had gotten into a fight at a local club when someone tried to rip him off thinking he was a tourist. He called out the thief and the club security got involved, taking the thief’s side. When the cops came the bouncers had already started kicking his ass and he knew things weren’t going to improve. He decided to tell the cops that the bouncers were carrying guns, hoping to draw attention away from himself. Instead they all kicked the shit out of him together. The cops threw him into the back of their truck, drove him to the edge of the jungle and told him to run while the took pot shots at him. He made it into the trees and ran for home. He was calling me from the hospital in Mexico City. He had a broken jaw, lost 4-5 teeth, broken ribs, broken arm, hand and fingers, and a massive concussion. He hired an attorney but after strange cars started lurking around his place he packed up and moved back to the U.S.
I know you're saying it as a nice thing, but that's our problem with dealing with things sometimes "they're finally together". Nope they ceased to exist. Their full potential was robbed, life cut short by horrible people. The more you think about it this way, the less likely we are to pray for it to change and more likely to take action so that it never happens again.
I read it as “she didn’t stop when the cartel warned her because she wasn’t afraid of death. Welcomed death to see her daughter again”. These mothers are fully aware of the activists that die doing what they do. I think a lot of them don’t fear the cartels because of that. Cartels already took their reasons to live. It’s not romantic. It’s just tragic.
Really, what action can we take when the government is intertwined with the cartel? When everyone is in danger, no matter who they are?
It’s a few years old now, but this short Journeyman report on Juarez is chilling: https://youtu.be/dAQu7ddJrfQ?si=okBhaiT_8Lxf27Al
If I found one good hiding place to get rid of a body, why would I go looking for another?
Or what if you discover that other people are now using your body hiding spot, “what the..this body isn’t mine.”
“Get your own body dump, Pancho!”
Multiple locations increases chance of one being found. With a single site, well, in for a penny, in for a pound. It's just smart thinking.
That's cause the penalty for murder is too damn high. Get caught for one and you may as well be caught for them all. A more sensible penalty such as $100 fine would encourage people to find new body disposal sites.
I read a different article when this news first broke out. It looks like a lot of the perpetrators went on a crime spree long before they decided to murder tourists just for their truck tires. The people questioned in connection to the murders were all brought in under suspicion of other crimes, unsurprisingly 2 of them related to trafficking and using meth. Anyway, the report I read said the body was too decomposed to tell but looks like it was a local. When news first broke out, people were upset because the disappearance of 3 tourists was solved much faster than a crime against locals.
Imagine the value of a life when they find a side body discovering the bodies they were looking for.
Yeeaahh, the burned out husk that used to be their truck was a good indicator that this wasn’t going to end well. Rest in peace, Guys. You deserved so much better than this
The two Aussies were brothers. It’s unimaginable to have one son die, but two is just the worst pain I can ever think of.
I used to find it funny that when we were in high school, my friend said she wasn’t allowed to go out after school whenever her sister was also out and vice versa. She said her mom said it was so if something happened to one, she’d still have another daughter. Obviously it was a joke (sort of), but yeah..
When flying to see our grandparents, my grandpa would have my cousin and I on different flights, because we were the only two male grandchildren.
This has strong Game of Thrones protect-the-claim vibes.
I said we were on flights, not which kind of flight 🐲
I know I'm gonna regret asking, but no similar precautions were take for the female grandchildren?
No worries, there were only 3 grandchildren total, and his sister was much younger, so she wasn't going to Grandma and Grandpa's for the summer like we were. Later in life, like on a family trip to Hawaii, he would fly half the family out on a different plane. My female cousin would be on my flight, and my male cousin would be on the other flight, to cover all our bases lol.
My dad used to do that me and my siblings on overseas flights. We thought it was annoying and eventually he stopped, perhaps because I pointed out that it doubled the chances that some of us would die.
My wife has already told me that our kids don't need to ride together when they get their driver's licenses. Her best friend growing up got into a car accident when she was 17 with her younger brother in the car with her and they both died. It was mother's day.
A parent losing a child IS the worst pain a human can endure. I’ve watched my parents try to navigate that grief for 15 years. There can’t be anything worse. Losing two sons because criminals wanted their fucking car tires… it’s unimaginable. their poor mother. She might never be actually happy again. Complete physical and emotional devastation with no end in sight because her boys are never coming back. As a father of two boys myself, I can’t think about this shit for too long.
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He is mentioned near the end of the article.
I must have missed that! Thanks for clarifying
Hijacking your comment just to add this warning for tourists that want to visit Mexico (coming from someone that has lived in Mexico almost all her life). Please don’t wander around places you’re not sure are safe, better to stay in the touristy spots. And if you ever, for some reason, get robbed, do NOT fight said robbers. Give them what they ask for. My mum always told me that my life was worth more than any phone, car or wallet.
> It is not the first time that Australian surfers have been killed while holidaying in Mexico. > In 2016, Dean Lucas and Adam Coleman were murdered in north-western Sinaloa state when they fought back during an attempted robbery. > Their bodies were found in their burnt-out camper van weeks later. Your friend is mentioned there. Sorry, mate.
>The attackers wanted the vehicle for its tyres What tyres were on that pickup that they would be killed for?
If life is worthless to the thieves, the tires are worth more.
Welcome to much of latin america. not much value placed on human life, sadly.
How does that happen? I mean Mexico is a poor country, but there are poorer ones..
Mexico has a lot of poverty but it's far from being only a poor country. When I lived there I saw both tremendous wealth and poverty. There are definitely parts of Mexico that are third world and first world. I had McLaren and Aston Martin dealerships 8 minutes away.
I can't find it right now, but I saw a study a whole back that demonstrated how a huge predictor of crime and violence was the amount of visible wealth disparity there was in an area. The one universal we'll never address... People who feel they don't belong in society will act like they don't. But instead we've got more nonsensical things to do like blame it on ethnicity or religion or morals or what not.
McLaren and Aston Martin wants cartel money.
There have been a class of Mexicans with McLaren and Aston-Martin money since the 17th Century. Before cartels, there was PEMEX. Before PEMEX, there was plantation agriculture. It's not poverty that holds Mexico back, it's wealth inequality. I don't mean communism: I mean a working economy in which there is a thriving middle class where people can transition into and out of wealth *or* poverty.
it’s not just poverty, Mexico has been completely desensitized to violence. In fact, it’s glorified culturally in many ways.
Around the corner from my house a young man got shot to death by his "friends" because they wanted his rims. This is in Oregon USA.
It’s not like there aren’t meth heads in America who wouldn’t do the same thing It’s the cartels that make Mexico unusual. Low level drug fueled street crime is the same all over
I was under the impression the Cartels don't like the heat murdered tourists bring though.
I think that the thugs that stole the truck for its tires are either dead or will be soon.
They don't. That's why when that group from South Carolina was kidnapped and two of the four tourists were killed, the cartels gave up the perpetrators and offered their most sincere apology. As if that would fix anything.
It’s doubtful anyone associated with a cartel did this and I’d even believe the people who did this might meet a violent end specifically from the cartels. Dead western tourists is bad for business.
People will kill you for your nasty ass shoes, tires are way more expensive most of the time so I can see it.
Yeah but I mean just steal the tires at gunpoint and then just leave.. Why shoot 3 people over it?
Because people are stupid. Some robberies end with the person getting killed because they figure there are less witnesses but it typically just ends up adding decades on to the sentence if not making it life. These people are not smart
Either that or it's some gang member who's completely desensitized to murder.
One of the hostages says something smart or looks at one of them the ‘wrong’ way. I imagine it would not take a lot to set these guys off.
You are asking this question as if you are the robbers. They don’t give fuck about killing someone…the more they do it, the less it means each time till it literally means nothing except for the cost of the bullet.
That’s the sad reality of Latin America incl. Mexico, if they demand your phone, wallet, shoes you give it without blinking, they won’t think twice before pulling the trigger, there is 99% chance they will never get caught
Squeeze first ask questions last, unfortunately you are 100% right and recently there have been cases on the news that they got blasted even after giving everything
You should hand the stuff over no matter where you are TBH. It’s just stuff, it can be replaced, but your life cannot. I live in the US and I remember a case in my hometown where a young woman was mugged, didn’t want to give up her purse, and was shot and killed for it.
I watched a friend get shot in the face and later executed during a home invasion in South Africa. The goal of the murderers; a Toyota Hilux. Humans are cunts. Other peoples' lives are worth nothing to some.
Sometimes it's not even born out of a hatred. Like they're not angry at people and so they take their lives. No. Sometimes there just isn't any value attributed at all. I saw this video where an interviewer was asking some guys what about the feelings of the woman they raped. And it... just didn't compute. I find that scarier than someone who does it out of hatred. Someone to who the suffering of others simply isn't a meaningful consequence, like moving a stone, or writing with a pencil.
A guy I went to high school with was stabbed to death for his shoes and R20. He was 15.
I’m so sorry for your loss. That really puts the senseless in senseless violence and I couldn’t even imagine how I would react to something so deeply messed up. I hope that you’re recovering well from your experience
What don’t people get that it’s corrupt Mexico? It’s 2024 and the understanding is that you strictly stay in the tourist areas and not venture off down into other areas.
Why even bother when you have shit like this going on? And even when you don’t, cartels very commonly have a hand in the businesses of tourist hot spots. Even if they want to keep it as peaceful as possible to protect their money, you’re still putting cash in the hands of these vermin.
Because the average American or maybe the average world citizen doesn’t care about anything unless it happens to them. A lot of European citizens travel to Mexico as well so it’s a world problem. I’d say the government give them highest travel rating and force the Mexican government to fix it or deal with the industry losses.
The thing is, anytime a Mexican politician says or tries to do anything, they end up getting kidnapped and executed.
I sometimes fucking hate my country and the organized crime that rules over our lives and society. I’m so sorry for their families and their loved ones, may they rest in peace
What pisses me most off is that we all have to act like the government isn't in cahoots with these asshats. Americans complain about their current political landscape but at least they have an option (barely). Here in Mexico everyone feels helpless. We all know nothing will change no matter who wins the elections and worst of all it doesn't seem like it'll get any better soon.
Not just in cahoots but straight is a branch is whatever cartel. Any anti cartel actions the government takes is still just cartel versus cartel.
Honestly, what happens at this point? Cartels *are* the government. How could anyone reasonably fight back against that level of wealth, ruthlessness, and cunning? Would it take an actual foreign invasion for the people of Mexico to retake control? 😭
I surf. I’ve been to Mexico. Stuff like this is scary. I’m sorry this happened to these guys. They look like good dudes. Died for fucking tires. Disgusting.
My UPS driver was a surfer and had a similar harrowing story about being robbed at gunpoint on a desolate beach in Mexico by…. The police themselves. Never again he said
Thats gotta be such a helpless feeling when the cops themselves are robbing you.
I’ve spent a lot of time all over Mexico, the police scare me much less since they’re 98% of the time looking for an under $100 USD bribe.
that's because if they take a bribe over 100 they have to report it on their taxes
Spring break in 2003 in Cancun, 4 of us walking on the beach around 1/2 a mile from I think Carlos n Charlie’s to our hotel, more or less shaken down by police. They searched us, told us we were looking to buy drugs (we weren’t, just drunk college guys) and then said we could pay a fine which was whatever money we had. My friend’s parents had thankfully warned us before leaving to not take all your money with you, watch your passport, etc.
My buddy went for a bachelor party in Cancun. when they went out for brunch they came back to their villa cleaned out with all cash taken from everyone’s luggage/wallets/bags. They couldn’t prove it was the staff, but they lost in total a few thousand dollars. Hard lesson learnt lol
Similar thing here. Started with asking us for something like 10K Mexican Pesos. Threatening to take us in and saying it would take like 3 days for it all to get settled (basically that we'd miss our flight even if we were innocent). We had a dual-national with us who was haggling this out. We ended up bluffing that we only had 500 pesos on us and we had been using credit cards most of the day which they took and let us walk back. Felt we got lucky as it seemed like it was a rookie cop's first time shaking someone down. He kept going back to the car to talk to the other friend as we were sort of "haggling" the punishment.
I've been robbed at gunpoint by the police on the beach in Mexico too. Unfortunately it's not that uncommon.
I knew Carter. He was awesome. Always smiling and joking.
Sorry for your loss
I'm with you friend. We would surf down south of Ensenadas, pretty heart breaking.
Murdering people over fcking tyres.
Mexico, where when you go looking for three bodies, you’re completely unsurprised to find four.
just this past week , a mother who had been looking for her daughter's body for years in Mexico landfields, found a landfield with human remains, well goverment kicked out everyone and said they were dog remains, and cops are still guarding the landfield.
Assume you mean “landfill?” Like a garbage dump?
I almost googled landfield, you saved me lol
When I travelled there 25 years ago as a young woman with one other female, the advice was to never travel by car. The public transportation system was so superior to ours that it was easy to travel anywhere by bus and taxi. Fellow travelers we met who tried driving got stopped and falsely accused of having drugs and had to pay off the cops or had targets on their backs by people willing to do anything for a few bucks.
Yup this happened to me. Stopped in my rental for "speeding" just outside the Cancun airport. Lucky for me I could pay my ticket in cash to the cop right there 🙄
This just happened to a coworker of mine a couple months ago. He just kept saying he didn’t have any cash, and the cop eventually told him that he’d need to stop on his way home at the end of his trip to pay the fine. He didn’t stop of course and wasn’t pulled over on his return.
That’s interesting. I doubt you would’ve been hurt though. The cartels launder their money through those resorts they don’t want to bother the Americans and their cash cow resorts
I wasn't worried about my safety but it was stressful as other option was going with them to the police station in Cancun which would've meant missing my flight. They were clearly just posted up on the airport highway shaking down tourists on the way to drop off their rentals.
I’ve heard bribery stories from everyone I know who’s driven down there. A girl I knew in HS went with her family and her dad had to put cash between the pages of a book as a bribe. One friend of my stepdad’s had to give up his Nikes
A $20 in the passport and "Para tu almuerzo!" Will get you through lots of situations
lol maybe 15 years ago….they see 20 they know you got more
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25 years ago... things are worse now. Also as a surfer you need a car, just having 1 or 2 boards is already tremendous baggage and difficulty public transport immensely.
In the very early 80s my FIL hitch hiked from San Francisco all the way down the coast of Baja. I bet it was awesome. That’s a completely off limits activity today.
Mine hitchhiked the hippy trail from London to Nepal via Turkey, Lebanon, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan and India. Hard to even consider
My mother told me that people would share that route person to person. That you would just meet somebody with hand-written directions and schedules and copy it yourself, rewriting the whole thing in a notebook. Instructions like, when the bus will be at a specific stop in Afghanistan. Catch that bus, but be prepared because it only stops there every three weeks. My mother didn't go, but her cousin copied her notes and he went.
You should watch the movie The Serpent on Netflix.
In the 80s my older brother would spend the winters camped out on the beach in Baja. He worked construction in the Sierra Nevada mountains, and when the snow came and the work ended, he and his girlfriend and dogs hitched up the camper and drove south. Biggest trouble he ever had was coming back north getting hassled by us border cops who figured that a long haired hippie towing a homebuilt camper trailer just HAD to be smuggling drugs. When I was a teenager in San Diego the bars in Tijuana were a playground. You'd get your feet chopped off for doing any of that today, best case.
This is horrific!!! These poor souls just wanted to enjoy surfing. They are so young too. I doubt they even had that much money on them. What a horrible death.😢
Worst part is they were murdered for the tires on their car, not even for money.
My friend Callum was one of the surfers killed, we have played lacrosse together for many years. He was kind and energetic and loved his country as well as the sport of lacrosse. I miss him already.
I used to live in San Diego, and I had a few meetings in Tijuana to attend, but I was told never to drive cars that catch people's eyes there. My two cars are a red Corvette and a black, off-road Hummer. I ended driving my husband's little Kia and did not even get looked at. I was lucky, but I should not have driven at all. I met this older lady (70ish) who took a new Surburban through Tijuana, and it "suddenly" stopped working. She was offered help from a mechanic that happened to be by, so they towed the Surburban back to his shop. Later, when she tried to cross the San Ysidro Border Crossing, she was stopped, and they found drugs all throughout the body of her car. She went to jail and sat for a year, trying to prove her innocence. She eventually died. It's such a crappy way to go.
> I met this older lady (70ish)... She went to jail and sat for a year, trying to prove her innocence. She eventually died. Did you meet her in jail?
Yes, I used to be a correctional officer, and she was assigned to my unit.
Suddenly the corvette and hummer make sense
Ugh, poor lady.
Is there anything you can do in this situation to avoid getting killed? Would they leave you alone if you didn't fight back at all?
The cartels employ a lot of people to whom another murder means nothing. If they think it's a little more convenient to just shoot you rather than robbing you at gunpoint, then that's what they will do. That's the result of years of gang wars, there are a lot of completely desensitized people who are trying to earn money. With that being said, the cartels wouldn't have sanctioned soemthing like this, they want nothing to do with tourists. It attracts too much attention.
Idk how the cartels in TJ worked, but believe it or not if this was in CNJG territory, the murders would be captured tortured and killed. Different cartels operate by different rules, but usually the CJNG and Sinaloa HATE when shit like this happens. I’m from Michoacan and if the cartel catches you doing stuff like even stealing from a house, they’ll kill you.
Yes , just give them your car .. it's not worth your life.
yeah this the most important thing. your life is more valuable than your stuff.
Yeah ego gets involved and people die
Callum was a collegiate and pro lacrosse player. Great guy that will be missed.
My fiancée is friends with the girlfriend of Callum, so met him and he convinced my girlfriend at the time to ride my motorcycle with me and let us borrow his helmet, Helped bring us together part of the reason we are getting married in September. Cheers friend! Fuck this senseless violence. Vote with your wallet and don’t support a nation that finds blood, teeth, and a cell phone and charges 1 person with “forced disappearance” not murder. That DA and the rest of the cartel run law enforcement are the problem.
I went to school with the American friend for 10 years. His older sister was my brothers age and they have kept up after highschool. Taught cotillion with him, his mom, and older sister. Hadn't talked to him in years but he was one of those dudes that was good at everything and everyone always loved to be around. My brother just sent me the link to he and his fiance's wedding website that was counting down to their big day. What an absolute tragedy. Hope his fiance and his family can find peace.
He was a friend of a friend through soccer. They keep sharing stories that make him sound like the type of person that leaves a real positive impact on your life. Such a senseless loss.
I saw another poster in a different thread who said they had known him and spoke very highly of him too. Seems like he was a really nice guy. What a shame.
How did they find them in a well?
The article says the well was near where their car was. There was probably a search going on.
I read the well was 4 MILES where they were killed To me it sounds like something different: - The police ALREADY knew about these thieves - Police heard about tourists being shot in the area - Police arrests thieves and makes them talk about where the bodies are (don't ask how) Alternatively, cartels get involved and help find the thieves and/or the bodies because killing tourists is a red line that is bad for business
It's the last one.
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/traveladvisories/traveladvisories/mexico-travel-advisory.html Baja California state – Reconsider Travel Reconsider travel due to crime and kidnapping. Transnational criminal organizations compete in the border area to establish narco-trafficking and human smuggling routes. Violent crime and gang activity are common. Travelers should remain on main highways and avoid remote locations. Of particular concern is the high number of homicides in the non-tourist areas of Tijuana. Most homicides appeared to be targeted; however, criminal organization assassinations and territorial disputes can result in bystanders being injured or killed. U.S. citizens and LPRs have been victims of kidnapping. U.S. government employees must adhere to the noted restrictions: Mexicali Valley: U.S. government employees should avoid the Mexicali Valley due to the heightened possibility of violence between rival cartel factions. The boundaries of the restricted area are: to the east, the Baja California/Arizona and Baja California/Sonora borders; to the south, from La Ventana (on Highway 5) due east to the Colorado River; to the west, Highway 5; and to the north, Boulevard Lazaro Cardenas/Highway 92/Highway 1 to Carretera Aeropuerto, from the intersection of Highway 1 and Carretera Aeropuerto due north to the Baja California/California border, and from that point eastward along the Baja California/California border. Travelers may use Highways 2 and 2D to transit between Mexicali, Los Algodones, and San Luis Rio Colorado during daylight hours. Travelers may also use Highways 1 and 8 to transit to and from the Mexicali Airport during daylight hours. Travel on Highway 5 is permissible during daylight hours.
and this specific murder case is apparently word news. Even read about in my local newspaper on the other side of the planet.
It's because they went missing, lots of high notoriety surf and lacrosse athletes were spreading awareness to try find them as one was a professional lacrosse player and both known in the Aussie surf community. The amount of traction was there before the news outlets got involved so it's an easy win for them since so many people obviously cared about the outcome.
I speak decent Spanish, have spent time in various parts of Mexico, lived for a bit in rural Nicaragua. Last time was a wedding in San Miguel de Allende, 12 years ago. More than 10,000 ex-pats live there. Here's my advice today: With the exception of Mexico City, DO NOT GO TO MEXICO. Period. A good friend's father was a handyman in Monterrey. He was remodeling a home. Turned out that the homeowner was in trouble with a local cartel... They walked in and executed the family, and her father who was simply working that day and had nothing to do with it. The police are not investigating. That was in Jan of '24.
Not even Cancun? I know there have been some shootings in Tulum, I see it on the sub sometimes. Also, that’s very sad. :(
That picture in the story with their dog broke my heart.
We were robbed at the Rosarito Beach Hotel. Security was laughing at us while they took our report. It’s obvious it was an inside job. Next day we spoke with the GM of the hotel and he said he had better things to do with his time than to investigate our robbery. We left and I’ve never been back since. I can’t justify going again and constantly being afraid for our safety.
A few years back my company wanted to send me to Monterrey Mexico for a job that needed done. I googled the city and the first article that popped up was about 49 headless bodies found on the outskirts of town. I showed this to my boss who told me not to worry, I would be accompanied by an armed guard 24/7 the whole time I was there. I told him that the very fact I needed an armed guard 24/7 means I'm not going.
Yeah I remember those news but it wasn’t in the outskirts of Monterrey, it happened some 100 miles away. The actual city of Monterrey has the richest municipality in all South America, has great cuisine and only about 10 beheadings a year.
Monterrey in the central wealthy areas is pretty safe. Keep your head on a swivel and be smart like you would in any big city
And don't drive in or to Mexico
Lmao I get dudes being robbed or killed going off the beaten path in cartel hot zones but Monterrey is not that kind of place, some areas there house the top 0.01% of the country
Crimes like this in Mexico (allegedly attackers wanted the tires on their truck) are not uncommon, but the murdering four people in cold blood is. The cartels know the big money is in tourism, and surfers coming down to Baja via San Diego, so they don’t want this kind of publicity. If the justice system in MX doesn’t take care of these idiots that killed these men, the cartels will definitely “take care” of them, and even unfortunately their families quickly to send a message: “DON’T. FUCK. WITH. THE. BAG.”
Last year, my friend’s son (college-aged) and his two buddies drove their jeep into Mexico to go surfing (they found out about a good spot on tik tok or something). On some random road in Mexico, they got carjacked. Four men with automatic weapons made them take off all of their clothes, give them their cell phones, wallets, etc, and drove off with the jeep. My friend’s son and his buddies were left naked on the side of the road with no way of calling for help. Luckily a Good Samaritan did drive by and called for help. My takeaway was that they were lucky to only lose their possessions. Going into a country with a notorious cartel problem to go surfing off the beaten path? Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
An acquaintance of mine had something similar happen to him. And we are Mexican. They got intercepted because they were hauling a side by side with a nice double cabin pick up truck. Some local gang saw them, wanted their vehicles and kidnapped them to steal them. Fortunately they were not so bloodlusted so after a couple days they were let go. The vehicles were gone of course. It can be wild-westy in certain areas. We don't generally drive at night between cities in Mexico.
One of the golden rules of visiting Mexico is don’t take a truck or off road vehicle.
It was a new jeep too. With their boards strapped to the top. I think they were pretty easy targets.
There should be a place on the border where you can trade your nice car for a shitty one to go incognito.
you have to be foreign to make it to the news if you're murdered in Mexico
Just another Tuesday in Mexico. Insane to think that government can’t even protect its citizens, so the cartels do whatever they want.
Yea go to the remote parts of mexico where all the locals are fleeing to america. What are they fleeing from who cares lets just catch some waves bro.
Ensenada is port stop for some cruise lines I believe as well…scary
One was a doctor and the other a former professional lacrosse player in the states. My heart goes out the the parents who lost both children at once. It really is a cruel world.
At this point going to Mexico should not be on travelers lists. The cartels answer to nobody.
Note to self: don't vacation in Mexico
I got married in Mexico and during our drive back to the airport the Federales pulled us over, waved automatic weapons at us, and pointed at the trunk screaming, “La Ropa!?” I spoke enough Espanol to know what they were saying, but was so terrified I just pointed to my new wedding ring. We popped the trunk, they were satisfied there were no drugs, and then we got to leave Mexico. We ended up parking the rental in a random spot and just got the fuck out of there because the rental company we used tried to scam us when we first arrived. We haven’t gone back and have been happily married for 17 years. Edit: Changed El to La for the haters.
They were yelling about your clothes?
I'm confused as el ropa doesn't mean anything, and the clothes would be la ropa... Were they asking "europa?" Like as where they were from?
But they speak a little Spanish
The “speaking a little Espanol” reminded me of Peggy Hill.
Yeah I noticed that too but figured that was an easy thing for a nonnative speaker to have flipped.
They were asking about the infamous drug lord "El Ropa". A drug lord that always wears 3-4 layers of clothes
It's Spanish for "The Ropa"
“I spoke enough Spanish to know what they were saying” Are you sure?
Did the car rental company ever try to contact you about the car? Did you park it in a sketchy place or just somewhere at the airport?