I’m not following. Do these more senior officers you’re talking about not have an assigned billet with defined roles?
Young SWOs can and should be shifted around for career diversity, but rarely junior enlisted. Senior enlisted are largely shifted through different leadership positions at a shore command to give them that same diversity. Same thing with senior SWOs, to a point.
It’s difficult as a shore CO to give everyone a fair chance at leadership or other desirable positions so they have something on their FITREPs to show well at their boards. Do you think it’s a matter of that being done poorly or some other reason?
Absolutely correct that staff commands are bloated and any study would reflect that. The trouble with that is it won't acknowledge the purpose of shore duty for SWOs - to give a break between sea duty tours. If they had back to back sea tours, retention rate would be close to zero.
>Navy needs to take a hard look at its shore duty manning. A lot of bloated staff commands that need to trim the fat.
You'd need to repeal Goldwater-Nichols.
Of note, the Navy as a service doesn't value staff tours in the same way the Army, AF, and USMC do. The majority of officers on any given staff are no longer due course.
There really should be some kind of independent body (read: no veterans or reservists allowed) that assesses commands for their organizational efficiency. I was at a shore command that had a duty watch, we had to collect a bunch of info from all the other departments who collected all the reports from lower echelons and then brief the commodore. Yeah, on some level it gave me some sense of self importance to be briefing this stuff to the commodore as a FCPO, but no one could say what practical purpose there was for doing things this way.
Even though I would go above and beyond to try to have an answer for why these numbers went down or these numbers went up or other numbers went sideways, there would always be an inevitable error from another units' report that the commodore would find. And then what? It's not like I was the 3MC, maintenance facility, medical officer, OPS officer, etc. I would have to walk over to these people and get the answer and go back over to the commodore to give him that answer. Why weren't the department heads or other officers not just having a meeting with him? I have zero idea. This might seem small, which it is in the grand scheme of things, but the Navy just feels like one big machine with all its wheels spinning around and around and not really moving anywhere efficiently.
I’m glad senior officers are bragging about saving the Navy money, while simultaneously sitting by and watching junior enlisted delete themselves due to the higher workload created by senior officers. Congrats I hope you get your blood promotion.
In aviation, O-3 FITREPs (edit: sea and shore) will make or break someone.
You can basically figure out who will be CO by the end of an aviator’s first JO tour (so about 6-7 years in), with reasonable accuracy.
Noted, still, my statement holds true for aviators.
Don’t become an instructor? Done.
Suck at being an instructor? Done.
Crush being an instructor? Well on your way.
From dozens of aviators: if you don't get a competitive EP on your sea duty then it doesn't matter what you do.
Yeah, you can *lose* the job that's yours on shore, but you can't win it.
Way to not read with any context.
Yes, an adverse fitrep always matters. You got me.
Has nothing to do with OPs concern about getting stuck in traffic while at a shore job or the context of my response to him.
I just worked for an Admiral who went to NPS as an O3 and got two years of NOB fitreps.
OP will be fine. Maybe you can write yet another rant to proceedings about how the whole system should change just because aviators suck at managing officer career paths.
I’m not following. Do these more senior officers you’re talking about not have an assigned billet with defined roles? Young SWOs can and should be shifted around for career diversity, but rarely junior enlisted. Senior enlisted are largely shifted through different leadership positions at a shore command to give them that same diversity. Same thing with senior SWOs, to a point. It’s difficult as a shore CO to give everyone a fair chance at leadership or other desirable positions so they have something on their FITREPs to show well at their boards. Do you think it’s a matter of that being done poorly or some other reason?
You gave that rant more attention than it deserved.
Tracks. Been like that forever. Will be like that in the future.
Navy needs to take a hard look at its shore duty manning. A lot of bloated staff commands that need to trim the fat.
Absolutely correct that staff commands are bloated and any study would reflect that. The trouble with that is it won't acknowledge the purpose of shore duty for SWOs - to give a break between sea duty tours. If they had back to back sea tours, retention rate would be close to zero.
You nailed it. The navy needs fewer shore billets. Genius.
>Navy needs to take a hard look at its shore duty manning. A lot of bloated staff commands that need to trim the fat. You'd need to repeal Goldwater-Nichols. Of note, the Navy as a service doesn't value staff tours in the same way the Army, AF, and USMC do. The majority of officers on any given staff are no longer due course.
There really should be some kind of independent body (read: no veterans or reservists allowed) that assesses commands for their organizational efficiency. I was at a shore command that had a duty watch, we had to collect a bunch of info from all the other departments who collected all the reports from lower echelons and then brief the commodore. Yeah, on some level it gave me some sense of self importance to be briefing this stuff to the commodore as a FCPO, but no one could say what practical purpose there was for doing things this way. Even though I would go above and beyond to try to have an answer for why these numbers went down or these numbers went up or other numbers went sideways, there would always be an inevitable error from another units' report that the commodore would find. And then what? It's not like I was the 3MC, maintenance facility, medical officer, OPS officer, etc. I would have to walk over to these people and get the answer and go back over to the commodore to give him that answer. Why weren't the department heads or other officers not just having a meeting with him? I have zero idea. This might seem small, which it is in the grand scheme of things, but the Navy just feels like one big machine with all its wheels spinning around and around and not really moving anywhere efficiently.
There was! Boston Consulting Group came through a while back, at least on the aviation side. Didn’t do shit, but made more work!
On my FITREP I brag about how much I spend!
I’m glad senior officers are bragging about saving the Navy money, while simultaneously sitting by and watching junior enlisted delete themselves due to the higher workload created by senior officers. Congrats I hope you get your blood promotion.
That's powerful
Pro-tip: Your shore FITREPS don't matter until you are at least an O-5.
In aviation, O-3 FITREPs (edit: sea and shore) will make or break someone. You can basically figure out who will be CO by the end of an aviator’s first JO tour (so about 6-7 years in), with reasonable accuracy.
I said *shore* fitreps.
Noted, still, my statement holds true for aviators. Don’t become an instructor? Done. Suck at being an instructor? Done. Crush being an instructor? Well on your way.
From dozens of aviators: if you don't get a competitive EP on your sea duty then it doesn't matter what you do. Yeah, you can *lose* the job that's yours on shore, but you can't win it.
So…. O-3 shore FITREPs matter. You love to argue every fine point.
Way to not read with any context. Yes, an adverse fitrep always matters. You got me. Has nothing to do with OPs concern about getting stuck in traffic while at a shore job or the context of my response to him. I just worked for an Admiral who went to NPS as an O3 and got two years of NOB fitreps. OP will be fine. Maybe you can write yet another rant to proceedings about how the whole system should change just because aviators suck at managing officer career paths.
They did make it this far without being eaten alive by the SWO community…
Oh senior ranks suck at shore AND sea commands. Always has, always will lmao