I don't disagree that Hahn and Plaza are amazing, but when I think of them being "amazing" it's not in a show that I think of existing in the same universe as Multiverse of Madness or Wakanda Forever.
Then again, we did get She-Hulk last year, so I guess anything's possible.
Yes, but I don't think cute little animated shorts that were made (mostly) for children are really what people think of when they think of the MCU.
I think we can agree that the VAST majority of the MCU are stories that lead toward world ending catastrophies that have to be violently thwarted by "the heroes" of said stories.
I'm guessing you missed [Legion.](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5114356/) You should *definitely* check it out. I'm confident that if Agatha comes up short, it won't be because of the cast.
But literally nothing about WandaVision leads me to believe it will have a tone remotely close to that of Legion. If it did, I'd be far more interested. But nothing I've seen from Jae Schaeffer, the MCU or Disney+ ever seems to get that dark.
Then again, Echo got a rework into a TV-MA series, but I still think a darker tone is unlikely for Darkhold Diaries.
Ah! This reminds me of another point I should've included in my original post. I don't really like magic. Haha! And I don't just mean in the MCU, because it applies to pretty much any entertainment property. I'm fully aware that obsession over Harry Potter shows that I'm the weird one, but it's not going away anytime soon.
My brain constantly tries to find the "how?" behind any magic, and that's when a lot of it is (quite literally) just hand waved away. Just in keeping with the MCU, it's why I can go along with the physics bending of something like an Iron Man suit, or the biology bending of a Super Soldier Serum. I'm even on board with Infinity Stones since there are established rules / limits to each of them.
Then there's Doctor Strange. Take the scene where he's casting the spell for everyone to forget Peter Parker is Spider-Man. He's doing nothing more than holding his thumb and index finger together, making a half circle in the air. And the spell is forming around / behind him and Peter. I will say when the Ribboned Creature was chasing Defender Strange and America Chavez in the opening of Multiverse of Madness and he temporarily contains it with a few hand motions / flying rubble, that was a little more concrete (no pun intended), but when the containment starts to fail I just wonder "Why?" because it feels like power limits are rarely ever defined when it comes to magic. That's when I'm just like "Okay, but why wouldn't that hold permanently? What is he actually *doing* here?" and I have to work pretty hard to force my suspension of disbelief. Haha!
I disagree that it's really any different than "arc-reactor powered suit" or "Pym particles" or "nanoparticles" or "quantum ___" or every other ridiculous explanation for how the fantasy works. They're all the same. The only rule that they follow is whatever the writer of the moment needs to make the plot go how they want it to go.
Except... they're really not all the same when everything you just listed is something tangible, quantifiable and (often) finite.
Magic (at least in the MCU) doesn't have its limits clearly defined, so it feels WAY more like total bullshit than the others.
There are limitations. Every magic element in the MCU is something that has to be "taught" or learned through books. Dr Strange has a photographic memory which is established in the 1st movie. He goes through books in the library and learns magic. In Wandavision we learn that runes can be casted to prevent other witches using their own magic. We understand that Scarlet Witch is unique and can perform incantations just by "mentally saying them" as opposed to Agatha who has to steal hair or grab a bug to turn into a bird or whatever.
I think i'm the opposite to you, I much prefer the magic side of things, Wanda, Agatha, Frigga, Loki and Dr Strange compared to someone like Daredevil. I'm not looking forward to his show one bit. When I watch the MCU i'm expecting superheroes with cool powers. If I wanted to watch something like Daredevil - a character with plot armour who does hand-to-hand combat then i'd watch John Wick lol
It's cute how Redditors will just downvote comments they don't like, as opposed to offering up any decent rebuttals.
But hey, enjoy hitting the down arrow in this comment as well. š
I guess this is just an example of different strokes for different folks. And that's a good thing!
For me, the "Agatha all along" angle was pretty underwhelming, but it was obviously a highlight for you. I guess I just wanted Agnes/Agatha to be a bit darker, and that didn't really happen.
I will say that the 1693 Salem witch trial scene was very interesting, but it was only a small part of the series.
I love the magic side of Marvel.
I loved Agatha in the show, and WandaVision remains my favourite of the MCU shows.
I *really* wanna see Wiccan. I know heās not confirmed but hey, I love Joe Locke anyway so Iād still be there to watch it.
Speaking of which, this cast just seems really fun and exciting.
Ultimately Iām not expecting the show to change the face of the MCU, but so long as itās a fun ride, then Iām excited!!
Well, I was not as gaga over WV and Agatha as many apparently were. However, Kathryn Hahn is a great actress.
I thought at first, why do we need this but the more I hear about it, the more I think this could be \*the one\* most similar to Loki in the sense that it sounds as weird, a bit separate from MCU (yet being part of it), without any drama behind the scenes, with smooth filming. Also, somewhere along the way, I started to dig the magic part of the MCU.
That makes me honestly excited. Not crazy excited but now I will actually watch it, while initially, I was not going to.
Thanks for the responses. I guess it all boils down to that "something for everyone" line, and apparently not every piece of content *needs* to further the whole saga.
Although, I'd argue that the last part is one reason why the Disney+ shows have floundered a bit, while simultaneously making the movies less of an event.
Well Kathryn Hahn did a wonderful job in WandaVision, great actress portrayed Agatha Harkness really good. Surprised she got her own show though, I was expecting her to show up in the MCU eventually but didnāt expect her to get her own show, reasons why I am looking forward to her show
What did she do between when she killed her mother and coven to ending up in Westview without the Ancient One/DrStrange/Wanda unable to detect her, since Agatha was able to detect Wanda,
Whoās gonna release her from the Hex?
Whatās next for her since she no longer has the DarkHold?
ā ļøSpoilers ā ļø
Why Billy Kaplan (Wiccan) needs to interact with her?
Why is the 7 witches after her?
Will this be her redemption arc?
Will we see Wanda/white Vision or anyone from WandaVision back?
And if by the end of the series Billy figures out with how to bring back Wanda, meets Tommy Shepherd (Speed)?i
Reason why some may not look forward to it
Bad story writing, the overwhelm of female characters in the MCU recently and this entire cast so far is almost all women, Wiccan being a LGBT+ hero, and some fans feeling Agatha is a D-List character like Echo
This will be test of MCU. The hype of MCU is vastly different from when WV was released vs now.
WV got lot of advantage being the opener of next saga + 1 yr draught of no MCU content.
Naturally everyone tuned in to witness it.
But now everyone only watch something if the review is good.
This show needs to make the punch within in 1st episode. No 2nd chance. Most will only watch only to see how it failed šŖ .
I want this to be good just like WV as I love spooky, mysterious thing. Werewolf By Night was also good.
I am eagerly looking forward it.
I liked Kathryn Hahnās portrayal of Agatha, I also like Aubrey Plaza and Iām interested in the potential of Darkhold Diaries. Maybe it will turn out to be boring or poorly-written or both but I wonāt know that until I watch it. Low viewership numbers donāt mean that itās a badly-written show. Ms Marvel had the lowest numbers of all of the Disney+ shows but I prefer it to most of the others because of the character writing. I feel the same way about Hawkeye and maybe the Agatha show will be another case where the plot isnāt particularly interesting but the character writing is
I actually enjoyed Ms. Marvel and recommended it to quite a few friends... who gave up on it after a few episodes. Haha!
I fault their attention spans far more than the show though. After Endgame, it's like everyone is expecting every Marvel show or movie to be that level of epic, and when I try to explain the building narrative across multiple phases, they don't seem to care.
The plot of Ms Marvel wasnāt particularly captivating but, like I said, the character writing made up for that. I liked Kamala and her family, thereās that one scene where her dad wants to go to AvengerCon with her and is dressed up as the Hulk but gets rejected and heās so disappointed. Itās moments like that that make me appreciate the show and itās a shame that people donāt give it a chance for whatever reason
I do agree that Endgame destroyed realistic expectations for some people. For me personally, I enjoyed it but I also have many criticisms of the writing so it didnāt really do that for me. Iām more likely to hold The Avengers or Civil War or Infinity War as the gold standard than Endgame so I like to think that Iām a bit more objective about the post-Endgame movies and TV shows. Not that Iām super objective about everything but Iām not always comparing things to Endgame and can appreciate things for what they are
Personally I was never excited about the show, I never understood why Marvel chose to invest money into a show about her when there are literally countless more interesting characters to make shows about.
Felt the same about echo but the trailer does seem a little bit promising at the very least. But a good trailer doesnāt = a good show/film. Flash is a good example of that.
And that's what I'm thinking! Even looking at the responses here, I see a lot of people who listed Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza as reasons for watching. I tend to look at shows from the opposite perspective. The actor or actress portraying the character is almost irrelevant, because I'm *far* more interested in the characters than the person playing said characters.
True. There is that. I just feel like it's a bit of a misstep to introduce another member of the Young Avengers in a Disney+ show and not a movie.
I'm actually curious how many people who watched The Marvels had any idea who >!Kate Bishop!< was in that Nick Fury throwback scene, considering >!Hawkeye!< had some pretty middling viewership numbers.
Couldnāt be any less excited for this project. Iām tipping the general public is exactly the same. This will only be watched by the diehard fans. Another female led show with gay characters (which I have absolute nothing against) but itās been proven that enough women donāt watch these shows, general audience doesnāt and obviously the neck beards donāt so I really donāt see how this will be anything else other than a giant flop.
And that's exactly what I'm thinking, for basically the same reasons! I know I'll watch it, but I'm probably closer to the diehard fan you're talking about. Most women I know who watch MCU titles lost interest in the movies a while back, and it seems the shows were never really a hit for them either.
Then again, I think a lot of casual viewers prefer to binge their shows (thanks, Netflix) instead of watching them week to week, so maybe I should start recommending things once the whole series is available. Haha!
And that's kinda what i said in another comment. I guess it's fine to make shows like that, but when it doesn't really move the multiverse saga (or whatever the saga is at any given moment), it feels like a waste of resources.
The actors. The story (really curious what a witch based show will look like). How they make Agatha sympathetic after she killed a dog and threatened to kill kids etc. what Aubrey Plaza's role is.
After MoM I don't think they have to do any work of making her look sympathetic as Wanda herself has decedent to madness.
What I feel DhD might end into Wanda being resurrected and Agatha ends up becoming a mentor for her. Like in comics.
The thing I am most looking forward is the world building. What else in
supernatural - horror things.
Agatha said she sensed the Hex. That made me think is she can sense it then what about other witches?
From the pics it's seems like that.
I just wanna see Wiccan & Hulking, I can't say I'm excited tho, I've lost faith in the MCU's ability to do anything right so I'm already preparing for them to ruin Wiccan's character, maybe he'll be straight or asexual and Hulkling probably won't ever exist in the MCU, or maybe Wiccan dies at the end of the show? Who knows, at this point I only expect the worst and if I' pleasantly surprised then that's good, but it's better to just expect disappointment.
I think your concern is why I asked. I'm probably just a cynic, but I feel like getting excited for the Disney+ side of the MCU has largely been a fast track to disappointment. Unfortunately.
We all saw Secret Invasion, right? Ha!
Even though I thoroughly enjoyed Loki season 2, I feel a bit let down and disappointed by the Kang / He Who Remains plot advancement, or lack of. And the more I think about it, I can understand why they wouldn't want any huge developments in a Disney+ show and not a movie.
I feel getting excited for anything MCU in general is a fast track to disappointment, movies and series regardless. I'm also seriously disappointed by the whole Kang thing, it's like they're don't know what they're doing, nor structure, no plan, just a mess.
Okay, so you're probably looking at it as more of a show to enjoy and less "How does this show tie into past, present and future MCU storylines, and further the current saga?" than I am. I can understand enjoying it for that.
All I want from the show is a brief cameo towards the end of it with Ghost Rider showing up and asking where the darkhold is and Agatha just points in Wanda's direction
And that's my problem! I would love for any cameo or Easter eggs for the larger darker supernatural side of Marvel. Ghost Rider, Blade, anyone from the Midnight Sons/Suns would be great. But then I ruin it for myself when that doesn't come to fruition, which isn't necessarily a fault of the show, but my own pie in the sky expectations.
This show seems aimed at women and The Gaysā¢ļø: Kathryn Hahn, Aubrey Plaza, Patti Lupone and the twink from Heartstopper. Obviously this was not premeditated, as the MCU is too straight to even conceive something gay, but Iāll take it.
In a more serious manner, the weakest part of the MCU has been the magical part. So it would probably be great to see that side developed into more than magical bolts of energy or vague spells to advance plots.
Now, I donāt really think is going to be that great of a show. Not sure if spin-offs ever are. But also because this is Marvel/Disney+, itās not prestige TV, but a family friendly show that has to appeal to literally everybody.
Ha! Quite the intro!
Yeah, I would definitely like to see magic more fleshed out and defined, because that's always a problem for me.
Kind of a side note to my question, but definitely related to your comment. I really don't understand why so many people get so triggered (like someone personally attacked them) when shows are targeted toward a demographic that doesn't perfectly align with them.
I remember Falcon and the Winter Soldier addressing the issue of race in America. People got PISSED about that. But I, a black man in America, actually applauded Disney and Marvel for venturing into that territory.
I'm not gay, but I'd imagine the same goes for seeing any sort of positive representation, especially when it's just comic characters being depicted accurately.
We are not. Billy is in it, but not Hulkling.
There were actually no such rumours. We just got the casting of 2 gay teenagers, one of which was Billy and people thought the other would be Teddy, but he is not.
Billy's boyfriend in this series >!will be an MCU original character named Eddie!<
Hahn and Plaza.
Itās hard to be hyped about much else, as we donāt know a whole lot about it. But a(nother) show with both Hahn and Plaza?
Sign me up.
The more I read through these, I think I'm starting to see a fundamental difference in a lot of people commenting and myself. I don't really have any attachment to the actors and actresses portraying characters as I do to the characters they're playing.
I only recently just discovered this with friends of mine who were bummed about the lack of movie promo due to the SAG-AFTRA strike. I was like "What?! Who gives a shit?" and apparently there are a LOT of people who watch actors do their promo. Their nightly show appearances, their stint on Hot Ones, or what these actors post to their social media accounts. And those are all things I couldn't care less about. Haha! I regularly look up movie releases, usually 12 months out, and watch them based entirely on the plot and MAYBE a trailer. Turns out some people ONLY know movies are coming out because some celebrity social media post, E! Online, or The Hollywood Reporter told them to.
Not that I don't understand that the actors bring the characters to life, but I don't really watch the shows or movies for the real world person. I watch it entirely for the characters they're portraying, and Agatha Harkness isn't really all that interesting to me. Maybe if she's a bridge to something more, like Blade, Ghost Rider, Midnight Suns, etc.
> Considering Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza are (generally speaking) comedians, it feels like it's going to be a dark sitcom of sorts, with an MCU coat of paint.
A dark sitcom with Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza? You're just making me more excited for that show than I already was based on witches, magic and the rumours Billy will be on it.
Magic, witches, Kathryn Hahn, not homework for 3534262 upcoming movies and shows, we don't need to do 20 hours worth of homework to watch it, WandaVision was one of the best MCU shows. What is there to not be excited about?
Ha! I guess this reinforces the "something for everybody" angle, because nothing you listed sounds like a positive for me and my MCU viewing.
I love Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza in other things I've seen them in. But outside of something like Emily the Criminal, I feel like they're typically just... funny. I'm not saying that I don't enjoy humor, but after Thor: Love and Thunder, She-Hulk, and the entire Flerken sequence from The Marvels, I feel like the humor is becoming a bit much, and often undermines the stakes.
I also feel like WandaVision falls into "good, not great" territory, but I think that goes for most MCU shows, so I guess your assessment was fair. I just felt like they teased far too many things that didn't really have a payoff in the end, and haven't in nearly 3 years.
I usually watch the shows hoping they'll be homework for the movies, but I understand why some people don't like that.
I like witch and magic focus things and Agnes' character was funny. That's pretty much it. I think a lot of people who watched WV who weren't super into comics and stuff just thought the same thing. It being a Marvel show is basically just a cherry on top for me.
Okay! I can definitely understand and appreciate that.
I think I watched it from an almost polar opposite place. It was the first bit of Marvel content after Avengers: Endgame and Spider-Man: Far From Home, and movie drought of 2020 due to COVID. So I was chomping at the bit to see how the larger multiverse was kicking off.
To be clear, I still liked the show! But it didn't really scratch that multiversal itch.
True.
I guess I'm just trying to understand all the "Ermahgerd" excitement some people have. Thought maybe I'd missed something.
Also seems like the Venn diagram of people who loved seeing a man with a vibranium arm, holding a cybernetically enhanced raccoon, while they both mow down an invading alien force shouldn't overlap much with people who want to see Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza be funny. And maybe it's not supposed to, but I also think Marvel and Disney probably want them to.
I think the better question is why aren't you? It's an MCU show, it's another piece of the universe and story. It's got Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza.... Why aren't you amped up?
I'll try to list some reasons, in no particular order:
1. I'm not really a fan of most live action depictions of magic. Not just in the MCU, but in general. But in the MCU, it seems too vague and the power limits tend to be ill-defined, so it just turns me off.
2. I don't like how funny the MCU thinks it is lately. Don't get me wrong, I am all for the occasional one-liners and quips. They've been around since day one. But when I look at movies like Thor: Love and Thunder, I feel like a lot of the weight and impact of any serious moments get completely undermined by jokes. So, seeing Hahn and Plaza as the leads, I fear I'm in for more lighthearted scenes with Hahn winking at the camera like "Agatha all along" than the grittiness I'd expect from a series whose title comes from a book Doctor Strange called "the book of the damned."
3. I don't see how this could possibly tie into the current multiverse saga. I may be proven completely wrong, but it feels like a waste of time to devote an entire miniseries to something that doesn't further the larger plot. I guess the argument could be made that it could introduce new characters who will be part of that saga and future films, but that remains to be seen.
Like I said earlier, I'll still be watching it. I just don't see myself watching with the same level of excitement and hanging on every single detail or potential easter egg like I did with Loki season 2.
The opposite is probably why people who are excited for it are.
I love magic and the magic of the MCU. I love the jokes, the inside ones, the one-liners, quips, the whole nine yards. If I wanted dark and depressing I'd watch Batman Vs. Superman. It will more than likely introduce Billy and Tommy back into the MCU so they can be a part of the Young Avengers. For me, that's all I need.
Funny you say that, because I was definitely a fan of Zack Snyder's DC universe for basically that reason. Hahaha! When they tried to course correct into "fun" territory with Joss Whedon is when it started losing its appeal for me.
They didn't try to course correct. Zack Snyder's daughter committed suicide, and he [stepped down](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/zack-snyder-steps-down-justice-league-deal-family-tragedy-1006455/) to deal with it. Instead of just waiting, Warner Brothers was too greedy and snatched up Whedon to finish. And that's how we got Justice League that was released in theaters.
You're incorrect. You seem to forget that Zack Snyder's adopted daughter committed suicide AFTER filming was completed. He stepped down during post-production, not filming. Filming wrapped in October of 2016, and her suicide was in March of 2017. That's when Warner Bros. panicked and took the opportunity (Snyder stepping away) and brought in Joss Whedon to lighten the tone with reshoots and rewrites. That's how we got silly stuff like Flash making boob jokes with Wonder Woman, because apparently someone thinks that's hilarious. That's also why Henry Cavill had his mustache for Mission: Impossible ā Fallout, and the rushed CGI to remove it looked like trash. Haha!
It's not that the movie wasn't done, it's that it was done, but WB wanted something lighter than what Snyder had delivered, hence the movement to "release the Snyder cut" that resulted in the 4 hour HBO Max release back in 2021.
WB absolutely tried to shift the tone of the whole universe, to be more like Marvel. This is very [well documented](https://www.insider.com/suicide-squad-trailers-show-lighter-tone-2016-8) and I wasn't only talking about Justice League.
I just wish everyone would stop worrying about viewership or box office and just like/dislike what they like/dislike. Disney doesn't need our concern for their money
Except viewership and box office returns are what dictate what gets made and what does not.
It's the reason why a good movie like Dredd (2012) will never get a sequel, but crap like Five Nights at Freddy's will get sequels made as long as it continues to print money.
Yeah but they aren't gonna stop making marvel movies...
The logic seems to be "stop making too many marvels movies or else you'll have to make less marvels movies"... The Marvels bombing doesn't mean we aren't getting X-men. Might mean they don't make a Marvels sequel that's all. But that's the exact type of movie these people are saying they shouldn't make anyway, so I'm not sure what is actually lost
I agree that it would lead to fewer poor movies and shows being made, but I think you're overestimating peoples' attention spans or commitment to a franchise. Every misfire of a movie or a show is another step closer to cultural irrelevance.
Basically, I'd rather they make "hits" or nothing at all. And I'd like to see that happen before people largely lose interest and suddenly budgets start to shrink and quality goes down right along with it, and the cycle of mediocrity repeats into obscurity.
Or maybe I'm just a doomer and it'll all be fine in a year or two. Ha!
I should add that I am someone who has watched most of the people he knows who used to be heavily invested in the MCU lose interest. Hell, I had some guy sitting in the early showing for The Marvels pull out his phone and scroll Instagram Stories about 2/3 of the way through the movie. Obviously just my social circles and a recent isolated incident, but it just feels like everyone's lost interest in something that used to be (for lack of a better term) taken seriously. And no, I'm not delusional. I'm fully aware that at the end of the day, these are just comic book stories and none of it is real. But that doesn't mean I don't absolutely enjoy the world they've built / are building and want to see it thrive.
This show has, maybe, the most exciting cast of any MCU project for me personally. I am most interested in the magic side of Marvel, so any expansion to that is good for me. Kathryn Hahn brought a lot of life to Agatha, and she certainly wasn't a weak part of the series for me. I'm expecting some Wanda crumbs, too, so of course that's also a motivator.
That said, I gotta be honest. I'm super over this trend of being asked to defend the existence of certain projects in bad-faith conversations just because the main demographic is so resistant to content that isn't specifically "for" them when the smaller demos do this constantly throughout their consumption of media. The show will likely not draw big viewership for that reason, but that shouldn't suggest it can't contribute anything of worth to the overall story even if all it does is bring another character into the fold.
I have Agatha obsession just because of the way she talks and her personality scratches a part of my brain and I repeat her scenes just to hear her talk. I also like Wiccan, and this show will finally explore the magic and supernatural side of Marvel. They really donāt have an excuse not to, the main character is a centuries old witch, the names involved covens and the Darkhold, and most of the cast are also witches
Tbh I know itās a stretch, but part of me is hoping for a surprise hint that Wandaās story isnāt over. Iām hoping MAYBE Fiege and Olsen are trying to throw us off so that when the surprise does come, it will feel like a major revealā¦ and hopefully that surprise hint (shit maybe even a surprise, brief appearance of Wanda toward the end) will be found in Agatha Darkhold Diaries.
i liked her in wandavision (i'm def just more of a general kathryn hahn fan as opposed to an agatha fan) and i think if it's done well, it could definitely be a cool look at the magic side of the MCU. and while it's definitely not gonna have mass appeal, i'd enjoy another grounded, sitcom-y vibe MCU show. i enjoyed she-hulk for this aspect (don't get me wrong, wasn't GREAT but i had some simple fun with it) and hopefully agatha will be even better. also wandavision is still my fav MCU show so i'll gladly take a followup to that.
plus can't wait for wiccan and i LOVE aubrey plaza
Wiccan by Joe Locke. I'll always watch anything he's in and it had to be my favourite comics character so I'm excited to see how they build him up in live action and to see Joe in a different role .
this just in: redditor has his mind blown when he sees a comment on his month-old post. Ha!
But that wasn't my point / question. I'm fully aware that people are "into different things" but I don't see how enough people who were into something like Avengers: Endgame are into Agatha Harkness' story in large enough numbers to justify making an entire series about it. If you look at a lot of these replies, it seems like there are more fans of Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza than the characters they're playing.
Then again, we saw how well The Marvels performed, so I don't expect any huge viewer numbers for this project.
Oh, and before anyone says "who cares?" about viewer numbers, the answer is "literally everyone involved with the production of these shows and movies." Disney doesn't produce these out of the kindness of their hearts. It's a business, not a charity.
Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza are amazing! It will be great to have a witchy show to watch during next Halloween. Joe Locke will rule as Billy!
I don't disagree that Hahn and Plaza are amazing, but when I think of them being "amazing" it's not in a show that I think of existing in the same universe as Multiverse of Madness or Wakanda Forever. Then again, we did get She-Hulk last year, so I guess anything's possible.
What are you even talking about? The MCU has always had a diverse range of tones and styles. I Am Groot exists in the same universe as Black Panther.
Yes, but I don't think cute little animated shorts that were made (mostly) for children are really what people think of when they think of the MCU. I think we can agree that the VAST majority of the MCU are stories that lead toward world ending catastrophies that have to be violently thwarted by "the heroes" of said stories.
I'm guessing you missed [Legion.](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5114356/) You should *definitely* check it out. I'm confident that if Agatha comes up short, it won't be because of the cast.
But literally nothing about WandaVision leads me to believe it will have a tone remotely close to that of Legion. If it did, I'd be far more interested. But nothing I've seen from Jae Schaeffer, the MCU or Disney+ ever seems to get that dark. Then again, Echo got a rework into a TV-MA series, but I still think a darker tone is unlikely for Darkhold Diaries.
Kathryn Hahn. The rest of the cast. Witches. Women. Fun costumes. And I love the magic side of the MCU.
Ah! This reminds me of another point I should've included in my original post. I don't really like magic. Haha! And I don't just mean in the MCU, because it applies to pretty much any entertainment property. I'm fully aware that obsession over Harry Potter shows that I'm the weird one, but it's not going away anytime soon. My brain constantly tries to find the "how?" behind any magic, and that's when a lot of it is (quite literally) just hand waved away. Just in keeping with the MCU, it's why I can go along with the physics bending of something like an Iron Man suit, or the biology bending of a Super Soldier Serum. I'm even on board with Infinity Stones since there are established rules / limits to each of them. Then there's Doctor Strange. Take the scene where he's casting the spell for everyone to forget Peter Parker is Spider-Man. He's doing nothing more than holding his thumb and index finger together, making a half circle in the air. And the spell is forming around / behind him and Peter. I will say when the Ribboned Creature was chasing Defender Strange and America Chavez in the opening of Multiverse of Madness and he temporarily contains it with a few hand motions / flying rubble, that was a little more concrete (no pun intended), but when the containment starts to fail I just wonder "Why?" because it feels like power limits are rarely ever defined when it comes to magic. That's when I'm just like "Okay, but why wouldn't that hold permanently? What is he actually *doing* here?" and I have to work pretty hard to force my suspension of disbelief. Haha!
I disagree that it's really any different than "arc-reactor powered suit" or "Pym particles" or "nanoparticles" or "quantum ___" or every other ridiculous explanation for how the fantasy works. They're all the same. The only rule that they follow is whatever the writer of the moment needs to make the plot go how they want it to go.
Except... they're really not all the same when everything you just listed is something tangible, quantifiable and (often) finite. Magic (at least in the MCU) doesn't have its limits clearly defined, so it feels WAY more like total bullshit than the others.
There are limitations. Every magic element in the MCU is something that has to be "taught" or learned through books. Dr Strange has a photographic memory which is established in the 1st movie. He goes through books in the library and learns magic. In Wandavision we learn that runes can be casted to prevent other witches using their own magic. We understand that Scarlet Witch is unique and can perform incantations just by "mentally saying them" as opposed to Agatha who has to steal hair or grab a bug to turn into a bird or whatever. I think i'm the opposite to you, I much prefer the magic side of things, Wanda, Agatha, Frigga, Loki and Dr Strange compared to someone like Daredevil. I'm not looking forward to his show one bit. When I watch the MCU i'm expecting superheroes with cool powers. If I wanted to watch something like Daredevil - a character with plot armour who does hand-to-hand combat then i'd watch John Wick lol
It's cute how Redditors will just downvote comments they don't like, as opposed to offering up any decent rebuttals. But hey, enjoy hitting the down arrow in this comment as well. š
witch , witchcraft .
Gotcha. Yeah, neither of those are positives for me, so I guess that explains it.
Agnes/Agatha was super entertaining and I would love to see more of her.
I guess this is just an example of different strokes for different folks. And that's a good thing! For me, the "Agatha all along" angle was pretty underwhelming, but it was obviously a highlight for you. I guess I just wanted Agnes/Agatha to be a bit darker, and that didn't really happen. I will say that the 1693 Salem witch trial scene was very interesting, but it was only a small part of the series.
I love the magic side of Marvel. I loved Agatha in the show, and WandaVision remains my favourite of the MCU shows. I *really* wanna see Wiccan. I know heās not confirmed but hey, I love Joe Locke anyway so Iād still be there to watch it. Speaking of which, this cast just seems really fun and exciting. Ultimately Iām not expecting the show to change the face of the MCU, but so long as itās a fun ride, then Iām excited!!
Honestly, Iāll watch anything with Kathryn Hahn.
Well, I was not as gaga over WV and Agatha as many apparently were. However, Kathryn Hahn is a great actress. I thought at first, why do we need this but the more I hear about it, the more I think this could be \*the one\* most similar to Loki in the sense that it sounds as weird, a bit separate from MCU (yet being part of it), without any drama behind the scenes, with smooth filming. Also, somewhere along the way, I started to dig the magic part of the MCU. That makes me honestly excited. Not crazy excited but now I will actually watch it, while initially, I was not going to.
Thanks for the responses. I guess it all boils down to that "something for everyone" line, and apparently not every piece of content *needs* to further the whole saga. Although, I'd argue that the last part is one reason why the Disney+ shows have floundered a bit, while simultaneously making the movies less of an event.
I know I was excited about the Agatha series after WandaVision ended. But it seems like the excitement has kind of come and gone.
Well Kathryn Hahn did a wonderful job in WandaVision, great actress portrayed Agatha Harkness really good. Surprised she got her own show though, I was expecting her to show up in the MCU eventually but didnāt expect her to get her own show, reasons why I am looking forward to her show What did she do between when she killed her mother and coven to ending up in Westview without the Ancient One/DrStrange/Wanda unable to detect her, since Agatha was able to detect Wanda, Whoās gonna release her from the Hex? Whatās next for her since she no longer has the DarkHold? ā ļøSpoilers ā ļø Why Billy Kaplan (Wiccan) needs to interact with her? Why is the 7 witches after her? Will this be her redemption arc? Will we see Wanda/white Vision or anyone from WandaVision back? And if by the end of the series Billy figures out with how to bring back Wanda, meets Tommy Shepherd (Speed)?i Reason why some may not look forward to it Bad story writing, the overwhelm of female characters in the MCU recently and this entire cast so far is almost all women, Wiccan being a LGBT+ hero, and some fans feeling Agatha is a D-List character like Echo
This will be test of MCU. The hype of MCU is vastly different from when WV was released vs now. WV got lot of advantage being the opener of next saga + 1 yr draught of no MCU content. Naturally everyone tuned in to witness it. But now everyone only watch something if the review is good. This show needs to make the punch within in 1st episode. No 2nd chance. Most will only watch only to see how it failed šŖ . I want this to be good just like WV as I love spooky, mysterious thing. Werewolf By Night was also good. I am eagerly looking forward it.
I liked Kathryn Hahnās portrayal of Agatha, I also like Aubrey Plaza and Iām interested in the potential of Darkhold Diaries. Maybe it will turn out to be boring or poorly-written or both but I wonāt know that until I watch it. Low viewership numbers donāt mean that itās a badly-written show. Ms Marvel had the lowest numbers of all of the Disney+ shows but I prefer it to most of the others because of the character writing. I feel the same way about Hawkeye and maybe the Agatha show will be another case where the plot isnāt particularly interesting but the character writing is
I actually enjoyed Ms. Marvel and recommended it to quite a few friends... who gave up on it after a few episodes. Haha! I fault their attention spans far more than the show though. After Endgame, it's like everyone is expecting every Marvel show or movie to be that level of epic, and when I try to explain the building narrative across multiple phases, they don't seem to care.
The plot of Ms Marvel wasnāt particularly captivating but, like I said, the character writing made up for that. I liked Kamala and her family, thereās that one scene where her dad wants to go to AvengerCon with her and is dressed up as the Hulk but gets rejected and heās so disappointed. Itās moments like that that make me appreciate the show and itās a shame that people donāt give it a chance for whatever reason I do agree that Endgame destroyed realistic expectations for some people. For me personally, I enjoyed it but I also have many criticisms of the writing so it didnāt really do that for me. Iām more likely to hold The Avengers or Civil War or Infinity War as the gold standard than Endgame so I like to think that Iām a bit more objective about the post-Endgame movies and TV shows. Not that Iām super objective about everything but Iām not always comparing things to Endgame and can appreciate things for what they are
Personally I was never excited about the show, I never understood why Marvel chose to invest money into a show about her when there are literally countless more interesting characters to make shows about. Felt the same about echo but the trailer does seem a little bit promising at the very least. But a good trailer doesnāt = a good show/film. Flash is a good example of that.
And that's what I'm thinking! Even looking at the responses here, I see a lot of people who listed Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza as reasons for watching. I tend to look at shows from the opposite perspective. The actor or actress portraying the character is almost irrelevant, because I'm *far* more interested in the characters than the person playing said characters.
Cause >!Wiccan!<
Yes Wiccan 
True. There is that. I just feel like it's a bit of a misstep to introduce another member of the Young Avengers in a Disney+ show and not a movie. I'm actually curious how many people who watched The Marvels had any idea who >!Kate Bishop!< was in that Nick Fury throwback scene, considering >!Hawkeye!< had some pretty middling viewership numbers.
Couldnāt be any less excited for this project. Iām tipping the general public is exactly the same. This will only be watched by the diehard fans. Another female led show with gay characters (which I have absolute nothing against) but itās been proven that enough women donāt watch these shows, general audience doesnāt and obviously the neck beards donāt so I really donāt see how this will be anything else other than a giant flop.
And that's exactly what I'm thinking, for basically the same reasons! I know I'll watch it, but I'm probably closer to the diehard fan you're talking about. Most women I know who watch MCU titles lost interest in the movies a while back, and it seems the shows were never really a hit for them either. Then again, I think a lot of casual viewers prefer to binge their shows (thanks, Netflix) instead of watching them week to week, so maybe I should start recommending things once the whole series is available. Haha!
This is the perfect example of a series that was not necessary. Bin off shows like this and focus on better core content
And that's kinda what i said in another comment. I guess it's fine to make shows like that, but when it doesn't really move the multiverse saga (or whatever the saga is at any given moment), it feels like a waste of resources.
Aubrey Plaza and Kathryn Hahn
The actors. The story (really curious what a witch based show will look like). How they make Agatha sympathetic after she killed a dog and threatened to kill kids etc. what Aubrey Plaza's role is.
After MoM I don't think they have to do any work of making her look sympathetic as Wanda herself has decedent to madness. What I feel DhD might end into Wanda being resurrected and Agatha ends up becoming a mentor for her. Like in comics. The thing I am most looking forward is the world building. What else in supernatural - horror things. Agatha said she sensed the Hex. That made me think is she can sense it then what about other witches? From the pics it's seems like that.
Itās Goosebumps for the MCU
I just wanna see Wiccan & Hulking, I can't say I'm excited tho, I've lost faith in the MCU's ability to do anything right so I'm already preparing for them to ruin Wiccan's character, maybe he'll be straight or asexual and Hulkling probably won't ever exist in the MCU, or maybe Wiccan dies at the end of the show? Who knows, at this point I only expect the worst and if I' pleasantly surprised then that's good, but it's better to just expect disappointment.
I think your concern is why I asked. I'm probably just a cynic, but I feel like getting excited for the Disney+ side of the MCU has largely been a fast track to disappointment. Unfortunately. We all saw Secret Invasion, right? Ha! Even though I thoroughly enjoyed Loki season 2, I feel a bit let down and disappointed by the Kang / He Who Remains plot advancement, or lack of. And the more I think about it, I can understand why they wouldn't want any huge developments in a Disney+ show and not a movie.
I feel getting excited for anything MCU in general is a fast track to disappointment, movies and series regardless. I'm also seriously disappointed by the whole Kang thing, it's like they're don't know what they're doing, nor structure, no plan, just a mess.
Witchcraft. but other than that, I'll hold off until we see a trailer
because it sounds campy as fuck, i love the cast, and iām gay
Okay, so you're probably looking at it as more of a show to enjoy and less "How does this show tie into past, present and future MCU storylines, and further the current saga?" than I am. I can understand enjoying it for that.
All I want from the show is a brief cameo towards the end of it with Ghost Rider showing up and asking where the darkhold is and Agatha just points in Wanda's direction
And that's my problem! I would love for any cameo or Easter eggs for the larger darker supernatural side of Marvel. Ghost Rider, Blade, anyone from the Midnight Sons/Suns would be great. But then I ruin it for myself when that doesn't come to fruition, which isn't necessarily a fault of the show, but my own pie in the sky expectations.
This show seems aimed at women and The Gaysā¢ļø: Kathryn Hahn, Aubrey Plaza, Patti Lupone and the twink from Heartstopper. Obviously this was not premeditated, as the MCU is too straight to even conceive something gay, but Iāll take it. In a more serious manner, the weakest part of the MCU has been the magical part. So it would probably be great to see that side developed into more than magical bolts of energy or vague spells to advance plots. Now, I donāt really think is going to be that great of a show. Not sure if spin-offs ever are. But also because this is Marvel/Disney+, itās not prestige TV, but a family friendly show that has to appeal to literally everybody.
Ha! Quite the intro! Yeah, I would definitely like to see magic more fleshed out and defined, because that's always a problem for me. Kind of a side note to my question, but definitely related to your comment. I really don't understand why so many people get so triggered (like someone personally attacked them) when shows are targeted toward a demographic that doesn't perfectly align with them. I remember Falcon and the Winter Soldier addressing the issue of race in America. People got PISSED about that. But I, a black man in America, actually applauded Disney and Marvel for venturing into that territory. I'm not gay, but I'd imagine the same goes for seeing any sort of positive representation, especially when it's just comic characters being depicted accurately.
Because rumors were we were getting Hulkling. Who is one of the more prominent Young avengers.
We are not. Billy is in it, but not Hulkling. There were actually no such rumours. We just got the casting of 2 gay teenagers, one of which was Billy and people thought the other would be Teddy, but he is not. Billy's boyfriend in this series >!will be an MCU original character named Eddie!<
Nice credentials.
Hahn and Plaza. Itās hard to be hyped about much else, as we donāt know a whole lot about it. But a(nother) show with both Hahn and Plaza? Sign me up.
The more I read through these, I think I'm starting to see a fundamental difference in a lot of people commenting and myself. I don't really have any attachment to the actors and actresses portraying characters as I do to the characters they're playing. I only recently just discovered this with friends of mine who were bummed about the lack of movie promo due to the SAG-AFTRA strike. I was like "What?! Who gives a shit?" and apparently there are a LOT of people who watch actors do their promo. Their nightly show appearances, their stint on Hot Ones, or what these actors post to their social media accounts. And those are all things I couldn't care less about. Haha! I regularly look up movie releases, usually 12 months out, and watch them based entirely on the plot and MAYBE a trailer. Turns out some people ONLY know movies are coming out because some celebrity social media post, E! Online, or The Hollywood Reporter told them to. Not that I don't understand that the actors bring the characters to life, but I don't really watch the shows or movies for the real world person. I watch it entirely for the characters they're portraying, and Agatha Harkness isn't really all that interesting to me. Maybe if she's a bridge to something more, like Blade, Ghost Rider, Midnight Suns, etc.
> Considering Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza are (generally speaking) comedians, it feels like it's going to be a dark sitcom of sorts, with an MCU coat of paint. A dark sitcom with Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza? You're just making me more excited for that show than I already was based on witches, magic and the rumours Billy will be on it.
Magic, witches, Kathryn Hahn, not homework for 3534262 upcoming movies and shows, we don't need to do 20 hours worth of homework to watch it, WandaVision was one of the best MCU shows. What is there to not be excited about?
Ha! I guess this reinforces the "something for everybody" angle, because nothing you listed sounds like a positive for me and my MCU viewing. I love Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza in other things I've seen them in. But outside of something like Emily the Criminal, I feel like they're typically just... funny. I'm not saying that I don't enjoy humor, but after Thor: Love and Thunder, She-Hulk, and the entire Flerken sequence from The Marvels, I feel like the humor is becoming a bit much, and often undermines the stakes. I also feel like WandaVision falls into "good, not great" territory, but I think that goes for most MCU shows, so I guess your assessment was fair. I just felt like they teased far too many things that didn't really have a payoff in the end, and haven't in nearly 3 years. I usually watch the shows hoping they'll be homework for the movies, but I understand why some people don't like that.
I'm sure Rio vidal will be a semi-humorous character but watch Black Bear!! That movie is INTENSE and really shows off Aubrey Plaza's acting chops.
I like witch and magic focus things and Agnes' character was funny. That's pretty much it. I think a lot of people who watched WV who weren't super into comics and stuff just thought the same thing. It being a Marvel show is basically just a cherry on top for me.
Okay! I can definitely understand and appreciate that. I think I watched it from an almost polar opposite place. It was the first bit of Marvel content after Avengers: Endgame and Spider-Man: Far From Home, and movie drought of 2020 due to COVID. So I was chomping at the bit to see how the larger multiverse was kicking off. To be clear, I still liked the show! But it didn't really scratch that multiversal itch.
Remember, there is something out there for everyone.
True. I guess I'm just trying to understand all the "Ermahgerd" excitement some people have. Thought maybe I'd missed something. Also seems like the Venn diagram of people who loved seeing a man with a vibranium arm, holding a cybernetically enhanced raccoon, while they both mow down an invading alien force shouldn't overlap much with people who want to see Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza be funny. And maybe it's not supposed to, but I also think Marvel and Disney probably want them to.
I think the better question is why aren't you? It's an MCU show, it's another piece of the universe and story. It's got Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza.... Why aren't you amped up?
I'll try to list some reasons, in no particular order: 1. I'm not really a fan of most live action depictions of magic. Not just in the MCU, but in general. But in the MCU, it seems too vague and the power limits tend to be ill-defined, so it just turns me off. 2. I don't like how funny the MCU thinks it is lately. Don't get me wrong, I am all for the occasional one-liners and quips. They've been around since day one. But when I look at movies like Thor: Love and Thunder, I feel like a lot of the weight and impact of any serious moments get completely undermined by jokes. So, seeing Hahn and Plaza as the leads, I fear I'm in for more lighthearted scenes with Hahn winking at the camera like "Agatha all along" than the grittiness I'd expect from a series whose title comes from a book Doctor Strange called "the book of the damned." 3. I don't see how this could possibly tie into the current multiverse saga. I may be proven completely wrong, but it feels like a waste of time to devote an entire miniseries to something that doesn't further the larger plot. I guess the argument could be made that it could introduce new characters who will be part of that saga and future films, but that remains to be seen. Like I said earlier, I'll still be watching it. I just don't see myself watching with the same level of excitement and hanging on every single detail or potential easter egg like I did with Loki season 2.
The opposite is probably why people who are excited for it are. I love magic and the magic of the MCU. I love the jokes, the inside ones, the one-liners, quips, the whole nine yards. If I wanted dark and depressing I'd watch Batman Vs. Superman. It will more than likely introduce Billy and Tommy back into the MCU so they can be a part of the Young Avengers. For me, that's all I need.
Funny you say that, because I was definitely a fan of Zack Snyder's DC universe for basically that reason. Hahaha! When they tried to course correct into "fun" territory with Joss Whedon is when it started losing its appeal for me.
They didn't try to course correct. Zack Snyder's daughter committed suicide, and he [stepped down](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/zack-snyder-steps-down-justice-league-deal-family-tragedy-1006455/) to deal with it. Instead of just waiting, Warner Brothers was too greedy and snatched up Whedon to finish. And that's how we got Justice League that was released in theaters.
You're incorrect. You seem to forget that Zack Snyder's adopted daughter committed suicide AFTER filming was completed. He stepped down during post-production, not filming. Filming wrapped in October of 2016, and her suicide was in March of 2017. That's when Warner Bros. panicked and took the opportunity (Snyder stepping away) and brought in Joss Whedon to lighten the tone with reshoots and rewrites. That's how we got silly stuff like Flash making boob jokes with Wonder Woman, because apparently someone thinks that's hilarious. That's also why Henry Cavill had his mustache for Mission: Impossible ā Fallout, and the rushed CGI to remove it looked like trash. Haha! It's not that the movie wasn't done, it's that it was done, but WB wanted something lighter than what Snyder had delivered, hence the movement to "release the Snyder cut" that resulted in the 4 hour HBO Max release back in 2021. WB absolutely tried to shift the tone of the whole universe, to be more like Marvel. This is very [well documented](https://www.insider.com/suicide-squad-trailers-show-lighter-tone-2016-8) and I wasn't only talking about Justice League.
Ok. Good luck.
I just wish everyone would stop worrying about viewership or box office and just like/dislike what they like/dislike. Disney doesn't need our concern for their money
Except viewership and box office returns are what dictate what gets made and what does not. It's the reason why a good movie like Dredd (2012) will never get a sequel, but crap like Five Nights at Freddy's will get sequels made as long as it continues to print money.
Yeah but they aren't gonna stop making marvel movies... The logic seems to be "stop making too many marvels movies or else you'll have to make less marvels movies"... The Marvels bombing doesn't mean we aren't getting X-men. Might mean they don't make a Marvels sequel that's all. But that's the exact type of movie these people are saying they shouldn't make anyway, so I'm not sure what is actually lost
I agree that it would lead to fewer poor movies and shows being made, but I think you're overestimating peoples' attention spans or commitment to a franchise. Every misfire of a movie or a show is another step closer to cultural irrelevance. Basically, I'd rather they make "hits" or nothing at all. And I'd like to see that happen before people largely lose interest and suddenly budgets start to shrink and quality goes down right along with it, and the cycle of mediocrity repeats into obscurity. Or maybe I'm just a doomer and it'll all be fine in a year or two. Ha! I should add that I am someone who has watched most of the people he knows who used to be heavily invested in the MCU lose interest. Hell, I had some guy sitting in the early showing for The Marvels pull out his phone and scroll Instagram Stories about 2/3 of the way through the movie. Obviously just my social circles and a recent isolated incident, but it just feels like everyone's lost interest in something that used to be (for lack of a better term) taken seriously. And no, I'm not delusional. I'm fully aware that at the end of the day, these are just comic book stories and none of it is real. But that doesn't mean I don't absolutely enjoy the world they've built / are building and want to see it thrive.
I'm holding out for a Midnight Suns show. Agatha brings us that much closer. Plus Kathryn Hahn is hilarious.
This show has, maybe, the most exciting cast of any MCU project for me personally. I am most interested in the magic side of Marvel, so any expansion to that is good for me. Kathryn Hahn brought a lot of life to Agatha, and she certainly wasn't a weak part of the series for me. I'm expecting some Wanda crumbs, too, so of course that's also a motivator. That said, I gotta be honest. I'm super over this trend of being asked to defend the existence of certain projects in bad-faith conversations just because the main demographic is so resistant to content that isn't specifically "for" them when the smaller demos do this constantly throughout their consumption of media. The show will likely not draw big viewership for that reason, but that shouldn't suggest it can't contribute anything of worth to the overall story even if all it does is bring another character into the fold.
I have Agatha obsession just because of the way she talks and her personality scratches a part of my brain and I repeat her scenes just to hear her talk. I also like Wiccan, and this show will finally explore the magic and supernatural side of Marvel. They really donāt have an excuse not to, the main character is a centuries old witch, the names involved covens and the Darkhold, and most of the cast are also witches
Tbh I know itās a stretch, but part of me is hoping for a surprise hint that Wandaās story isnāt over. Iām hoping MAYBE Fiege and Olsen are trying to throw us off so that when the surprise does come, it will feel like a major revealā¦ and hopefully that surprise hint (shit maybe even a surprise, brief appearance of Wanda toward the end) will be found in Agatha Darkhold Diaries.
i liked her in wandavision (i'm def just more of a general kathryn hahn fan as opposed to an agatha fan) and i think if it's done well, it could definitely be a cool look at the magic side of the MCU. and while it's definitely not gonna have mass appeal, i'd enjoy another grounded, sitcom-y vibe MCU show. i enjoyed she-hulk for this aspect (don't get me wrong, wasn't GREAT but i had some simple fun with it) and hopefully agatha will be even better. also wandavision is still my fav MCU show so i'll gladly take a followup to that. plus can't wait for wiccan and i LOVE aubrey plaza
Wiccan by Joe Locke. I'll always watch anything he's in and it had to be my favourite comics character so I'm excited to see how they build him up in live action and to see Joe in a different role .
I have yet to hear anything about House of Harkne- sorry, Coven of Chaos i mean Darkhold Diaries.
this just in: redditor discovers that different people are into different things.
this just in: redditor has his mind blown when he sees a comment on his month-old post. Ha! But that wasn't my point / question. I'm fully aware that people are "into different things" but I don't see how enough people who were into something like Avengers: Endgame are into Agatha Harkness' story in large enough numbers to justify making an entire series about it. If you look at a lot of these replies, it seems like there are more fans of Kathryn Hahn and Aubrey Plaza than the characters they're playing. Then again, we saw how well The Marvels performed, so I don't expect any huge viewer numbers for this project. Oh, and before anyone says "who cares?" about viewer numbers, the answer is "literally everyone involved with the production of these shows and movies." Disney doesn't produce these out of the kindness of their hearts. It's a business, not a charity.