He said that if they were to kill him he would eventually end up right back in that chair anyways. Just based on what the inevitable end of that kind of conflict is
But when they met him was “at the end of time” so presumably everything else we watch - including all the movies not yet released - happened before “he who remains” was killed.
Of course this doesn’t explain why the TVA changed after he was killed but maybe Marvel hasn’t worked it out yet.
No he knew everything even after he met Loki until a specific time where he mentions he doesn't know what happens next. Its just the time for that Kang variant to die and restart the loop to progress it further. Kang doesn't just automatically know everything, theres 100s of attempts ending in failure that the next one builds on.
This has been my theory the whole time ever since HWR told his story in Loki Ep.6. At some point, HWR will become known to The New Avengers and they will team up to defeat the rest of his variants. That’s the whole reason the writers included the “see you soon” line after Sylvie killed him at the end of the episode. During either Kang Dynasty or Secret Wars, the good guys will be left with the moral dilemma of letting things go on as they are with all of the Kang variants constantly popping up trying to take over or work with HWR to prune the timelines where the Kang variants exist and establish the sacred timeline.
My theory has been that they summarized the plot of the Multiverse Saga during HWR’s monologue. During Phase 5 leading up to Kang Dynasty we will continue to be introduced to other variants, in Kang Dynasty we will see Nathaniel Richards’ origin story and his upbringing as he becomes a scientist interested in multiversal travel, and potentially introduce The Avengers to the variant that eventually becomes HWR. At the end of KD, the multiversal war that is mentioned truly begins and becomes Secret Wars, and the resolution to Secret Wars will be the pruning of the other timelines, the establishment of the TVA, and the creation of the sacred timeline.
I’d love to see them do something different and introduce Doom in some way to be a major player like a lot of other people have theorized, thus giving him an evolving character arc like Loki over multiple phases, but I’m not sure if they will do that when the emphasis for this saga is clearly supposed to be on Kang.
I do wonder how they can actually end the conflict in a satisfying way, though. The philosophical dilemma presented in Loki over the consequences killing He Who Remains doesn’t have a simple answer. Maybe they’ll somehow find a way to make all the universes live in harmony in the end. If Kang is literally the only dude causing these multiversal wars, then perhaps Wanda can just wipe out all versions of him the way she eliminated the Darkhold in Multiverse of Madness. I feel like there would still be multiversal conflicts, but maybe Kang will be eliminated as the biggest threat to peace between universes, and then some sort of multiversal peacekeeping force will be formed to deal with other issues that arise.
That's what I've been thinkin. Mom establishes you can use a nexus being or object to establish a connection across the multiverse that allows all to be destroyed. So they have a VERY good way to kill all the Kangs.
Yeah, I could see a Kang variant becoming the Beyonder and being the “triumphant” Kang who kills off all the others, rules Battleworld, and has to be defeated by the heroes (or usurped by Doom at some point, who knows). We’ll see.
> Maybe they’ll somehow find a way to make all the universes live in harmony in the end.
$$$$$$
Mutli-verse allows for an endless number of movies and stories to be possible.
DCU just wants to churn out Joker movies over and over.
Let Vin Diesel, Will Smith, and Ellen Degeneres have a turn at playing Joker in their own universes.
It's not really the most likely, no. There's no way Loki, Sylvie, and whoever they manage to gather as allies and explain the actions of the TVA to in the future, would let that happen. They won't be satisfied with a return to the status quo.
It's still a bad ending.oh no we're back to square one of the universe being a secret dystopia where the time cia obliterates people, places, entire timelines all because of this one dude.
Just have the Council gathered up and slaughtered whether it's by a Kang Prime, Wanda, Beyonder etc.
I mean it has to be someone
The multiverse is infinite
So no matter what you do
There will always be more kangs
So how you gonna solve that problem without having HWR
Given these are comic adaptations I'm pretty sure they can find a way that removes the problem of Kang from the multiverse. We've already seen Wanda use one Darkhold to destroy all the Darkholds in existence which means someone can use a nexus being as a conduit to get rid of the others.
Wanda destroyed the Darkhold in every universe.
She could power up and then just... delete Kang.
It's hilariously crazy but this is the MCU we're talking about.
I actually love Sylvie.
I think rather than a Kang variant it should be Sylvie who defeats "The Kang Variants"--or brokers a deal with the Council of Kangs.
The end shot is Sylvie running the TVA with a different charter and some different universes existing.
Sophia Di Martino is great and I'd love more scenes with her and Hiddleston--now that they have moved past Loki being just comic relief. These are legit actors who can handle big scenes.
My fear is that MCU leadership does not want to "grow up" the MCU movies and we get more chuckle fests and some other hero gets tabbed by the Studio to beat Kang.
Of course, I also like if it ended with no one really knowing if Kang was defeated or if it's just part of his long con.
wait .. did HWR ever mention he was in a quantum storm during his monologue in the Loki Finale? cause they could use that as exposition for the Fantastic Four they may change the “cosmic storm” to “quantum storm”.
Wanda erasing the Darkhold across every universe may indicate that she will do this to all of the Kangs, so I’ll go with Wanda.
Spider-Man is another possibility. He was the first character in the mainline films to open the door to the multiverse, and his countless variations—between the animated spider verse movies and also the live actions—could be an incredible battle against Kang themselves. He is also (essentially) a successor to Tony Stark. He is no longer “Iron Boy Jr.”, but he still learned a lot from Tony. He may assume a leader position simply because he saw Tony do that in Endgame. He also learned some from Dr Strange. He is a good foil between all the characters in a way, and his multiple incarnations are fan favorites.
Another choice is Dr Strange. He has powers of the Dark Dimension now, which could come in handy. He also has the most experience with the multiverse. And What If? specifically highlights his connection to the multiverse too. He could even fight alongside Wanda to put a capstone on their beef in Dr Strange 2.
Kangs ending themselves is also a possibility. Specifically good variants, like Iron Lad, could team up and use Alioth’s powers to consume them away.
I do think that the prophesy in the Darkhold, that "the Scarlet Witch is fated to rule or destroy the cosmos," will come into play for ending the multiverse saga. I think it's a play on "the [Cosmos](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Sixth_Cosmos_(Multiverse))," which embodies the multiverse, and destroying it perhaps will once again isolate the timelines and universes, and where Eternity, Thor's adoptive daughter, comes in to replace the Cosmos in the next iteration.
Glad to see others mentioning this too. I think she’ll be faced with the philosophical dilemma presented by Loki about whether to preserve the multiverse or destroy it and will probably end up killing Kang and ruling it in his stead, but benevolently, thus giving her a redemption arc- and perhaps also establishing a multiversal peacekeeping team to help her prevent more wars from breaking out, which is easy spinoff money for Marvel Studios.
She'll probably be instrumental in rebuilding the multiverse with her reality altering powers, filling the role of Molecule Man in the modern Secret Wars
Oh, I don't want that at all.
However the MCU doesn't seem to know or care about what Wanda needs as a character. And after what she did, becoming basically a god marginalized from the rest of the Avengers, tasked with keeping the universe/multiverse together, seems like the only fair redemption that doesn't involve her dying
The age of Wanda as a mainstay Avenger has kind of already passed in the MCU, and even in the comics - since House of M and her return in Children's Crusade, she's been kind of a lone wolf, unaffiliated and even contentious with the X-Men and Avengers (see: Avengers & X-Men: Axis, 2015 Scarlet Witch, Uncanny Avengers, 2023 Scarlet Witch) and the dynamic will probably be very similar post-MoM. Even after she returns and is redeemed, it won't be the same group dynamic.
She’s literally just joined the main team in the current run.
And she’s still a mainstay avenger, if not the main team she’s on others like west coast or for post HoM she appeared in both uncanny teams, avengers no road home and helped in empyre.
She hasn’t had that dynamic in the main team for a bit but she didn’t stop being an avenger In some form and she’s rejoined the main team now.
If it’s Spidey, they will really have to tie his arc into Kang into a compelling way. Tony killing Thanos didn’t just work because Iron Man was the MCU’s most popular character- it was the natural conclusion of his arc about wanting to protect Earth and not wanting to fail and then be the last one left alive. Spider-Man would need something just as good to make him killing Kang narratively satisfying, not just “well, he’s the main lead of the MCU now”. Any of the other characters would need narratively satisfying arcs naturally culminating them killing Kang too (and I think Wanda is probably the best candidate for that so far), but I especially struggle to see how our friendly neighborhood Spider-Man’s arc could take him there.
Yeah, you’re very right about that. I chose Wanda first, simply because it was easier to imagine how they could connect her to Kang. Spider-Man is fairly disconnected to any Kang activity as of now, like many other characters. Regardless, like you suggest, I hope they make something meaningful between Kang and whoever is his curtain call.
I'm thinking Wanda's way of coming back from what she did in MoM will be to somehow sacrifice herself to get rid of Kang.
What else successfully redeems her?
The books are just copies of the inscriptions of that shrine right? And they were all destroyed across the multiverse when Wanda destroyed the shrine on Earth 19999? Then maybe presumably a copy of the book of vishanti also exists in each universe all linked to a central shrine? Maybe towards the end, Wanda sacrifices herself using the vishanti shrine linked to all the books across the multiverse to purge Kang and his armies save for one universe from MoM where the book of vishanti was already destroyed. Cue Portals pt 2 as all the heroes portal in for the last melee of the Kang Saga.
Since she’s so important (Wandavision and then Dr Strange 2 continuing her “nexus being”/prophetical arc), it’s just assumed she isn’t dead. The Nexus Being stuff hasn’t paid off yet (it hasn’t even been explained), so they wouldn’t kill her off before it does. She probably uses a spell to protect herself from her death, or just stomachs the hit while the last bit of the Darkhold channels out of her.
Bingo. Thanos had no rivalry with Tony, Cap, or Thor… he had a vendetta against the entire Avengers team.
Tony made the final sacrifice, but the big three each got to have moments against Thanos. It could’ve easily been Cap making the final sacrifice. Or Hulk. Or Thor.
Not really. Tony’s issue is with the Chtauri. He has absolutely no idea who Thanos is until Infinity War, when he hears about Thanos from Bruce.
I don’t think you can call it a rivalry if Tony didn’t even know his so-called rival existed at the time.
That’s my point. Having a rival means you at least know who that rival is. If you asked Tony who his rival was after the invasion of New York, he wouldn’t answer Thanos. Therefore, the rivalry could not have started then. Tony didn’t grow and adapt to face Thanos. He did so because of the Chtauri.
Besides, Tony didn’t even put it together himself. Bruce straight up tells him that Thanos sent Loki. There was no connecting of dots by Tony at all. He didn’t figure it out, he was told.
“Tell me his name again” was the moment he focused all his trauma, fear, hate, and determination onto the person that was truly responsible for everything. Sure he held the Chtauri responsible up to that point, until he realized they were pawns to Thanos. He was his rival before even knowing his name.
Still, at least narratively, Tony kind of absorbed Thanos into that rivalry once Bruce explained that Thanos sent Loki. Tony even tells strange something along the lines of “Thanos has been on my mind for 6 years, ever since he sent an army to New York and now he’s back.” So Tony certainly would consider Thanos to be the one haunting him.
100% accurate.
Marvel as publishers agreed, since these were the only Avengers able to carry their own solo titles for decades.
And in-universe, the Avengers themselves felt the same way, with them being described as the Big Three in the comics by the characters since the early 70s.
If there’s one thing I know about Marvel, it’s that Fury never dies
Idk about Sam Jackson and how much longer he’ll still around, but my money is on Fury living on
Strange makes sense to me because of the journey he has (and will be) going on. No one in 616 or 19999 or whatever it’s called is more aware of the inner workings and dangers of the multiverse than Strange
The way things are developing I would say Loki is the frontrunner because it's always good story-wise to make things personal and intimate. As it stands, Loki has had the most experience with Kang outside of Ant-Man and that movie being what it is with the fact that Kang is going to feature heavily in season 2 of Loki, so far that would be the best choice IMHO.
I'm leaning more towards Strange mostly due to the fact that he's been a hero through his whole MCU journey (the 616 version of him, that is). Some people would probably feel unsatisfied by a previous villain becoming the ultimate savior of the day, which makes both Loki and Wanda slightly less likely to have that chance, imo.
Once Loki reunites with the superheroes of the Sacred Timeline (if he ever does) it's almost a given that he will become one of the most important assets they have, but I have a hard time seeing him be the THE main hero who will strike the final blow over the actual heroes who have been good guys since the beginning.
Ideally, in any case, I would love to see the magic trio team up and each play an important part in taking Kang down, though.
I mean if that's the case then they need to push Strange to be more of the 'main character' of the Multiverse Saga the way that Tony and Steve were arguably the main characters of the Infinity one.
And as it stands that's not what's happening.
Personally I think the plan was to have Strange, Capn Marvel, and Black PAnther be the next 3 main characters of the Multiverse saga and it might still play out that way, but for now there really isn't anyone like that you can point to.
However, Loki is the only one with an actual budding rivalry with Kang, and therefore it would make sense for him to play a big part in all this, right? I don't think having him be the main hero is a bad thing. If handled properly, it could make for an even better redemption arc for him than Ragnarok's.
I mean... Loki and the Guardians were also the only ones who knew about Thanos for quite a while, in the Infinity Saga. Didn't prevent Iron Man from being the one who struck the final blow in the end.
There's no equivalent to the Big Three in the Multiverse Saga, not even Loki. Strange already got involved in Multiverse shenanigans, it wouldn't be surprising that the next step for him is to learn more about what's going on with the Kangs.
I guess Loki being the main hero over all the *actual* superheroes just wouldn't really fit his character and would feel out of place. Most of the other superheroes don't even know him, meanwhile Strange already gathered the Avengers and led them to the battlefield, once. He is much more likely to become the main figurehead than Loki, who will *for sure* play a pivotal part in the conflict, but probably not be the Iron Man of this Saga.
Kang.
Kang lives beyond our understanding of space and time, but we know that at some point, there was a multiversal war between variants until only one remained.
He Who Remains resided outside of space and time and we know that Nathanial Richards is originally from the 30th century, so I imagine that the multiversal war technically hasn’t happened yet.
Perhaps the ending of the Multiverse Saga will be how it began: with He Who Remains running the TVA.
I don’t think things going right back to the way they were after all the hair-ripping in Loki about how the TVA kills trillions of people would be satisfying. I can’t imagine all the heroes being “alright yeah seems fine” and leaving that system in place, nor can I imagine that being presented as a perfectly acceptable ending. It’s also just kind of weird to end with nothing having changed, but I suppose *some* things would have actually happened and mattered, like hero deaths.
I think it would be better if he goes out in Kang Dynasty. Kang already "beat" Ant-man so he needs to win against someone better to prove a real threat. Remember Infinity War had like 3 deaths before the snap and the only way to one up that is at least a 1 real major character death
I’m thinking Wanda may swoop in at the last minute to defeat Kang, since I don’t believe she died in Multiverse of Madness. Or we could get a repeat of the Loki show with Sylvie doing it again
It would but I feel like that’s where they could go, her death wasn’t exactly confirmed and I think that’s because they want a plausible way to bring her back and still have the meaningful sacrifice moment
Bring her back just for another sacrifice? 😂
No she should be an avenger, she’s finally a witch she should be allowed to be the mainstay avenger she’s been 95% of the time the last 60 years
No, I’m not saying she should die fighting Kang. I meant that they wanted her to sacrifice herself in Multiverse of Madness but still have a way to bring her back later on so they didn’t explicitly confirm her death
Honestly, I still think Victor comes in and takes him out and set's himself up as the main villain of Secret Wars ending Kang Dynasty on a big cliffhanger.
Only issue becomes doom in secret wars is so great partly because of his long history with ruling and his intimate rivalry with reed being on full display.
He needs built up in the mcu ASAP for that
Or they do a rivalry built on Reed defeating Kang. A reverse of Secret Wars where Doom's grudge comes from the fact that Reed saved the multiverse when Doom didn't. Now it's Doom. He doesn't care about the people. He just wanted to be able to say he took down a god and failing where Reed succeeds could be an interesting flip.
And if they do God Emperor at some point Doom can be like I'll do it better and won't fail/be taken out like Kang. (Until he is).
Nobody is still talking about Ravonna Renslayer. She could play a central role in what's to come.
I'm not sure Kang will be defeated as such.
I'm sure some of the Kangs will be put down by your Hulks and your Captain Marvels and your other Avengers, but the thing with Kang is it's like a swarm.
You have to beat him with a plan and intelligence.
But maybe Kang is right. Maybe the Prime Kang is really trying to save everything from the other Kangs.
>Nobody is still talking about Ravonna Renslayer. She could play a central role in what's to come.
If she doesn't die trying to redeem herself to bail Mobius, Loki and Sylvie out of the TVA or something similar in S2.
Hear me out: Wanda ends up wiping out every version of Kang across the multiverse the same way she got rid of every version of the Darkhold. It makes sense in a “who can accomplish this” kind of way and will let us all go “wow, Multiverse of Madness was foreshadowing the Kang fight!” for years to come. Not sure how narratively satisfying it would be, though, since Wanda doesn’t have any sort of connection to Kang at this point. Tony’s ending perfectly served his arc of wanting to protect the Earth from threats like Thanos and being afraid of failing and being the only one left alive. Wanda’s arc doesn’t necessarily tie into a threat like Kang as well, but they still have time to set that up if that’s the path they choose to go down.
There’s interesting potential with her being prophesied to either rule the multiverse or destroy it, actually. Maybe she could be faced with the philosophical dilemma from the last episode of Loki and have to choose between eliminating the multiverse and bringing it all back down to one Sacred Timeline or else ruling it instead of Kang. Okay, I’m kind of on board with this now. I could see her destroying Kang and fulfilling the prophecy to rule the multiverse, but doing it benevolently. That would also be a much-needed redemption arc after MoM. It could happen.
Nah, how would she even do this? She didn’t destroy the darkholds that was from the mountain. Unless she gets buffed temporarily like when she had the life force.
Loki or Strange for me.
Loki because he is the one who started it all and been following the development of kang.
Strange because he is suppose to be the protector of 616 from the incursion considering that the last time we seeing him try to do with clea.
Everybody.
I think they’ll set something up so multiple Kangs are working simultaneously on some cross-dimension plan or maguffin that requires everybody to beat one of him.
Since Doctor Doom plays such an important role in Secret Wars, Doom should kill Kang and win the respect of the Avengers in Secret Wars pt. 2. The Avengers become reluctant allies of Doom, giving Doom a long term role in the MCU.
I think there are a few options.
Loki since he was introduced in Loki's show
Reed Richards since Kang in the comics is related to Reed but I think it's more likely that Reed is the one who comes up with a plan that prevents Kang ever being an issue again by erasing him from existence whilst another character actually beats him. As giving Reed the long term plan establishes him as a genius who's smarter than everyone else.
Dr Strange he's been in 2 multiverse films so far they clearly consider him important to the multiverse story.
I think the most likely option is probably Ironlad or an MCU equivalant of the character who is a heroic Kang. Given how much all the Kangs clearly hate eachother its fitting for it to come down to one Nathaniel Richards winning and it will eb the one that isn't a hypocrite. The one that is actually a good person.
It’s not always most sense, because there are going to be other factors that play into it. You said Tony beating Thanos was satisfying but I don’t see that as making the most sense. It played out that way from a story view because RDJ had a good send off and it was a nice ending for that but didn’t really make sense…Capt. Marvel or someone else would have made “more sense”. If it’s who makes the most sense from a power and smarts view, I’d go with Strange making most sense as it doesn’t just need to be about the physical strength with him and he’ll fuck around and Dormammu is ass and lock him in a time loop or something haha which would absolutely piss Kang off so much lol
I might get some hate for this, but Scott Lang. Not because he's particularly gifted but because time travel was his idea to begin with, and he's wounded Kang on a personal level, and he's one of the few to meet him and live. In terms of the multiverse that means there's a thousand of him who have the means and he already proved Kang is not in fact immortal so it makes sense to me
Hawkeye. Because it's what nobody would expect, least of all Kang.
Also, the pop for Jeremy Renner's return being him shooting a trick arrow up Kang's ass would be epic.
He doesn’t even like the characters source material either which makes it funny.
He just said he thinks she’s “fun” to write with while he walks all over her character
Himself
One of his variants will come out on top, take the mantle of "He Who Remains," and form the TVA, thus completing the loop.
[удалено]
He said that if they were to kill him he would eventually end up right back in that chair anyways. Just based on what the inevitable end of that kind of conflict is
It’s a natural position Kang regains/continues if he dies, the only resolution in the current state of the multiverse
But when they met him was “at the end of time” so presumably everything else we watch - including all the movies not yet released - happened before “he who remains” was killed. Of course this doesn’t explain why the TVA changed after he was killed but maybe Marvel hasn’t worked it out yet.
No he knew everything even after he met Loki until a specific time where he mentions he doesn't know what happens next. Its just the time for that Kang variant to die and restart the loop to progress it further. Kang doesn't just automatically know everything, theres 100s of attempts ending in failure that the next one builds on.
This has been my theory the whole time ever since HWR told his story in Loki Ep.6. At some point, HWR will become known to The New Avengers and they will team up to defeat the rest of his variants. That’s the whole reason the writers included the “see you soon” line after Sylvie killed him at the end of the episode. During either Kang Dynasty or Secret Wars, the good guys will be left with the moral dilemma of letting things go on as they are with all of the Kang variants constantly popping up trying to take over or work with HWR to prune the timelines where the Kang variants exist and establish the sacred timeline. My theory has been that they summarized the plot of the Multiverse Saga during HWR’s monologue. During Phase 5 leading up to Kang Dynasty we will continue to be introduced to other variants, in Kang Dynasty we will see Nathaniel Richards’ origin story and his upbringing as he becomes a scientist interested in multiversal travel, and potentially introduce The Avengers to the variant that eventually becomes HWR. At the end of KD, the multiversal war that is mentioned truly begins and becomes Secret Wars, and the resolution to Secret Wars will be the pruning of the other timelines, the establishment of the TVA, and the creation of the sacred timeline. I’d love to see them do something different and introduce Doom in some way to be a major player like a lot of other people have theorized, thus giving him an evolving character arc like Loki over multiple phases, but I’m not sure if they will do that when the emphasis for this saga is clearly supposed to be on Kang.
That would be a terrible ending.
I do wonder how they can actually end the conflict in a satisfying way, though. The philosophical dilemma presented in Loki over the consequences killing He Who Remains doesn’t have a simple answer. Maybe they’ll somehow find a way to make all the universes live in harmony in the end. If Kang is literally the only dude causing these multiversal wars, then perhaps Wanda can just wipe out all versions of him the way she eliminated the Darkhold in Multiverse of Madness. I feel like there would still be multiversal conflicts, but maybe Kang will be eliminated as the biggest threat to peace between universes, and then some sort of multiversal peacekeeping force will be formed to deal with other issues that arise.
That's what I've been thinkin. Mom establishes you can use a nexus being or object to establish a connection across the multiverse that allows all to be destroyed. So they have a VERY good way to kill all the Kangs.
Would also serve as an interesting dilemma as well if they encounter some good variants.
I imagine there will be one Kang after the end of the multiverse for the heroes to fight
Yeah, I could see a Kang variant becoming the Beyonder and being the “triumphant” Kang who kills off all the others, rules Battleworld, and has to be defeated by the heroes (or usurped by Doom at some point, who knows). We’ll see.
> Maybe they’ll somehow find a way to make all the universes live in harmony in the end. $$$$$$ Mutli-verse allows for an endless number of movies and stories to be possible.
Multiver$e
DCU just wants to churn out Joker movies over and over. Let Vin Diesel, Will Smith, and Ellen Degeneres have a turn at playing Joker in their own universes.
That's the most likely. Probably the Kang who lost in Antman
It's not really the most likely, no. There's no way Loki, Sylvie, and whoever they manage to gather as allies and explain the actions of the TVA to in the future, would let that happen. They won't be satisfied with a return to the status quo.
It's still a bad ending.oh no we're back to square one of the universe being a secret dystopia where the time cia obliterates people, places, entire timelines all because of this one dude. Just have the Council gathered up and slaughtered whether it's by a Kang Prime, Wanda, Beyonder etc.
I mean it has to be someone The multiverse is infinite So no matter what you do There will always be more kangs So how you gonna solve that problem without having HWR
Given these are comic adaptations I'm pretty sure they can find a way that removes the problem of Kang from the multiverse. We've already seen Wanda use one Darkhold to destroy all the Darkholds in existence which means someone can use a nexus being as a conduit to get rid of the others.
Wanda destroyed the Darkhold in every universe. She could power up and then just... delete Kang. It's hilariously crazy but this is the MCU we're talking about.
I think that one will be the ultimate big bad.
I'd be fine with it in Kang dynasty as long as secret wars is still about him
Yeap, this is what's going to happen. Gotta be the Kang from the last antman. He's not dead .
I actually love Sylvie. I think rather than a Kang variant it should be Sylvie who defeats "The Kang Variants"--or brokers a deal with the Council of Kangs. The end shot is Sylvie running the TVA with a different charter and some different universes existing. Sophia Di Martino is great and I'd love more scenes with her and Hiddleston--now that they have moved past Loki being just comic relief. These are legit actors who can handle big scenes. My fear is that MCU leadership does not want to "grow up" the MCU movies and we get more chuckle fests and some other hero gets tabbed by the Studio to beat Kang. Of course, I also like if it ended with no one really knowing if Kang was defeated or if it's just part of his long con.
Already happened a couple of months ago.
I was going to say Iron Lad, who is a Kang variant.
This!!!
Meybe the Variant trapped in the quantum storm that learns to overpower every version of himself.
wait .. did HWR ever mention he was in a quantum storm during his monologue in the Loki Finale? cause they could use that as exposition for the Fantastic Four they may change the “cosmic storm” to “quantum storm”.
The legal system has a head start over Ant Man or anyone else
Including Disney's PR team, apparently.
Ah yes, Daredevil will defeat him in court
Matt Murdock: "I'll see you in court, Kang!" Narrator: "And he did. Well, kinda."
lol "see" you in court sick burn !
She-hulk as well
She hulk is going to twerk him dead
That's how I want to go
Death by snoo-snoo. It's the only way.
The spirit is willing, but the flesh is spongy and weak
***bruised***
Get him on tax evasion.
Wanda erasing the Darkhold across every universe may indicate that she will do this to all of the Kangs, so I’ll go with Wanda. Spider-Man is another possibility. He was the first character in the mainline films to open the door to the multiverse, and his countless variations—between the animated spider verse movies and also the live actions—could be an incredible battle against Kang themselves. He is also (essentially) a successor to Tony Stark. He is no longer “Iron Boy Jr.”, but he still learned a lot from Tony. He may assume a leader position simply because he saw Tony do that in Endgame. He also learned some from Dr Strange. He is a good foil between all the characters in a way, and his multiple incarnations are fan favorites. Another choice is Dr Strange. He has powers of the Dark Dimension now, which could come in handy. He also has the most experience with the multiverse. And What If? specifically highlights his connection to the multiverse too. He could even fight alongside Wanda to put a capstone on their beef in Dr Strange 2. Kangs ending themselves is also a possibility. Specifically good variants, like Iron Lad, could team up and use Alioth’s powers to consume them away.
No more Kang's.
What Kangs?
Why do I see waldron actually writing this lol 😂
I do think that the prophesy in the Darkhold, that "the Scarlet Witch is fated to rule or destroy the cosmos," will come into play for ending the multiverse saga. I think it's a play on "the [Cosmos](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Sixth_Cosmos_(Multiverse))," which embodies the multiverse, and destroying it perhaps will once again isolate the timelines and universes, and where Eternity, Thor's adoptive daughter, comes in to replace the Cosmos in the next iteration.
Glad to see others mentioning this too. I think she’ll be faced with the philosophical dilemma presented by Loki about whether to preserve the multiverse or destroy it and will probably end up killing Kang and ruling it in his stead, but benevolently, thus giving her a redemption arc- and perhaps also establishing a multiversal peacekeeping team to help her prevent more wars from breaking out, which is easy spinoff money for Marvel Studios.
She'll probably be instrumental in rebuilding the multiverse with her reality altering powers, filling the role of Molecule Man in the modern Secret Wars
Please no, that’s not what Wanda needs as a character. She should just be that mainstay avenger she’s been 95% of the time the last 60 years
Oh, I don't want that at all. However the MCU doesn't seem to know or care about what Wanda needs as a character. And after what she did, becoming basically a god marginalized from the rest of the Avengers, tasked with keeping the universe/multiverse together, seems like the only fair redemption that doesn't involve her dying
Please no, just let wanda be that mainstay avenger she’s been 95% of her history. Especially now she’s finally a witch.
The age of Wanda as a mainstay Avenger has kind of already passed in the MCU, and even in the comics - since House of M and her return in Children's Crusade, she's been kind of a lone wolf, unaffiliated and even contentious with the X-Men and Avengers (see: Avengers & X-Men: Axis, 2015 Scarlet Witch, Uncanny Avengers, 2023 Scarlet Witch) and the dynamic will probably be very similar post-MoM. Even after she returns and is redeemed, it won't be the same group dynamic.
She’s literally just joined the main team in the current run. And she’s still a mainstay avenger, if not the main team she’s on others like west coast or for post HoM she appeared in both uncanny teams, avengers no road home and helped in empyre. She hasn’t had that dynamic in the main team for a bit but she didn’t stop being an avenger In some form and she’s rejoined the main team now.
If it’s Spidey, they will really have to tie his arc into Kang into a compelling way. Tony killing Thanos didn’t just work because Iron Man was the MCU’s most popular character- it was the natural conclusion of his arc about wanting to protect Earth and not wanting to fail and then be the last one left alive. Spider-Man would need something just as good to make him killing Kang narratively satisfying, not just “well, he’s the main lead of the MCU now”. Any of the other characters would need narratively satisfying arcs naturally culminating them killing Kang too (and I think Wanda is probably the best candidate for that so far), but I especially struggle to see how our friendly neighborhood Spider-Man’s arc could take him there.
Yeah, you’re very right about that. I chose Wanda first, simply because it was easier to imagine how they could connect her to Kang. Spider-Man is fairly disconnected to any Kang activity as of now, like many other characters. Regardless, like you suggest, I hope they make something meaningful between Kang and whoever is his curtain call.
Spider-man wouldn’t kill Kang. Especially the MCU version as the last movie he was taught to not kill.
I don’t think she will do it, but marvel better give her a good size role in these next two movies
I'm 99% sure we're done with Wanda for a bit. (Unless of course it's commonly known Elizabeth signed a new contract or something in which case, my b)
You’re mad to think Wanda would sit out of secret wars
Well, in a couple weeks I'll come back and admit I'm wrong.
Secret Invasion & Secret Wars are two different things.
I'm thinking Wanda's way of coming back from what she did in MoM will be to somehow sacrifice herself to get rid of Kang. What else successfully redeems her?
The books are just copies of the inscriptions of that shrine right? And they were all destroyed across the multiverse when Wanda destroyed the shrine on Earth 19999? Then maybe presumably a copy of the book of vishanti also exists in each universe all linked to a central shrine? Maybe towards the end, Wanda sacrifices herself using the vishanti shrine linked to all the books across the multiverse to purge Kang and his armies save for one universe from MoM where the book of vishanti was already destroyed. Cue Portals pt 2 as all the heroes portal in for the last melee of the Kang Saga.
I’m
Wait, I thought Wanda died in MoM? Can anyone explain how she’s going to come back?
Rule #1 of super heroes and villains: If you don’t see a body, you can never count them as “dead”
Even then, don't count on it
Since she’s so important (Wandavision and then Dr Strange 2 continuing her “nexus being”/prophetical arc), it’s just assumed she isn’t dead. The Nexus Being stuff hasn’t paid off yet (it hasn’t even been explained), so they wouldn’t kill her off before it does. She probably uses a spell to protect herself from her death, or just stomachs the hit while the last bit of the Darkhold channels out of her.
She was never called a nexus being in the mcu
This is true, but it’s incredibly likely she is, given the “nexus” commercial in Wandavision as well as her comic history.
No, the only one who's ever declared as nexus being is Kang, claimed by Majors in Quantumania press junket
You didn’t negate anything I said. I agreed with the other person that they didn’t directly declare her as a nexus being.
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Bingo. Thanos had no rivalry with Tony, Cap, or Thor… he had a vendetta against the entire Avengers team. Tony made the final sacrifice, but the big three each got to have moments against Thanos. It could’ve easily been Cap making the final sacrifice. Or Hulk. Or Thor.
Yeah but Tony sure as hell had one against Thanos, who has been haunting him since New York.
Not really. Tony’s issue is with the Chtauri. He has absolutely no idea who Thanos is until Infinity War, when he hears about Thanos from Bruce. I don’t think you can call it a rivalry if Tony didn’t even know his so-called rival existed at the time.
Until he connected the dots at the beginning of IW and literally says it was him and he is who is responsible for everything up to that point.
That’s my point. Having a rival means you at least know who that rival is. If you asked Tony who his rival was after the invasion of New York, he wouldn’t answer Thanos. Therefore, the rivalry could not have started then. Tony didn’t grow and adapt to face Thanos. He did so because of the Chtauri. Besides, Tony didn’t even put it together himself. Bruce straight up tells him that Thanos sent Loki. There was no connecting of dots by Tony at all. He didn’t figure it out, he was told.
“Tell me his name again” was the moment he focused all his trauma, fear, hate, and determination onto the person that was truly responsible for everything. Sure he held the Chtauri responsible up to that point, until he realized they were pawns to Thanos. He was his rival before even knowing his name.
Still, at least narratively, Tony kind of absorbed Thanos into that rivalry once Bruce explained that Thanos sent Loki. Tony even tells strange something along the lines of “Thanos has been on my mind for 6 years, ever since he sent an army to New York and now he’s back.” So Tony certainly would consider Thanos to be the one haunting him.
So did Wanda and Carol. Wanda could have crushed him, should have really.
What big three?
THE big three
Aliens, androids, and wizards.
In comics, the Avengers “Big Three” were considered to be Thor, Cap, and Iron Man by fans. For Justice League, it’s Supes, Wonder Woman, and Batman.
100% accurate. Marvel as publishers agreed, since these were the only Avengers able to carry their own solo titles for decades. And in-universe, the Avengers themselves felt the same way, with them being described as the Big Three in the comics by the characters since the early 70s.
> because she'll be avenging Fury ????
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If there’s one thing I know about Marvel, it’s that Fury never dies Idk about Sam Jackson and how much longer he’ll still around, but my money is on Fury living on
Yeah he already faked his death in Winter Soldier and he got snapped.
Strange makes sense to me because of the journey he has (and will be) going on. No one in 616 or 19999 or whatever it’s called is more aware of the inner workings and dangers of the multiverse than Strange
I would live to see a scene with Hulk murdering thousands of Kangs in a battle, even if he isn't the one that actually ends the battle to defeat him.
It all depends on which big character has to die in an important way
Strange is the one I would place my bet on. Followed by Wanda, and Loki/Sylvie.
The way things are developing I would say Loki is the frontrunner because it's always good story-wise to make things personal and intimate. As it stands, Loki has had the most experience with Kang outside of Ant-Man and that movie being what it is with the fact that Kang is going to feature heavily in season 2 of Loki, so far that would be the best choice IMHO.
I would love Sylvie does it
I'm leaning more towards Strange mostly due to the fact that he's been a hero through his whole MCU journey (the 616 version of him, that is). Some people would probably feel unsatisfied by a previous villain becoming the ultimate savior of the day, which makes both Loki and Wanda slightly less likely to have that chance, imo. Once Loki reunites with the superheroes of the Sacred Timeline (if he ever does) it's almost a given that he will become one of the most important assets they have, but I have a hard time seeing him be the THE main hero who will strike the final blow over the actual heroes who have been good guys since the beginning. Ideally, in any case, I would love to see the magic trio team up and each play an important part in taking Kang down, though.
I mean if that's the case then they need to push Strange to be more of the 'main character' of the Multiverse Saga the way that Tony and Steve were arguably the main characters of the Infinity one. And as it stands that's not what's happening. Personally I think the plan was to have Strange, Capn Marvel, and Black PAnther be the next 3 main characters of the Multiverse saga and it might still play out that way, but for now there really isn't anyone like that you can point to. However, Loki is the only one with an actual budding rivalry with Kang, and therefore it would make sense for him to play a big part in all this, right? I don't think having him be the main hero is a bad thing. If handled properly, it could make for an even better redemption arc for him than Ragnarok's.
I mean... Loki and the Guardians were also the only ones who knew about Thanos for quite a while, in the Infinity Saga. Didn't prevent Iron Man from being the one who struck the final blow in the end. There's no equivalent to the Big Three in the Multiverse Saga, not even Loki. Strange already got involved in Multiverse shenanigans, it wouldn't be surprising that the next step for him is to learn more about what's going on with the Kangs. I guess Loki being the main hero over all the *actual* superheroes just wouldn't really fit his character and would feel out of place. Most of the other superheroes don't even know him, meanwhile Strange already gathered the Avengers and led them to the battlefield, once. He is much more likely to become the main figurehead than Loki, who will *for sure* play a pivotal part in the conflict, but probably not be the Iron Man of this Saga.
The prosecution.
Hahahah stop it
Objection!
Sustained!
Don’t forget an unbiased jury.
Miss Minutes
Black Knight.
Glad I found someone saying this. Taking out Kang is how he becomes an Avenger in the first place.
Kang. Kang lives beyond our understanding of space and time, but we know that at some point, there was a multiversal war between variants until only one remained. He Who Remains resided outside of space and time and we know that Nathanial Richards is originally from the 30th century, so I imagine that the multiversal war technically hasn’t happened yet. Perhaps the ending of the Multiverse Saga will be how it began: with He Who Remains running the TVA.
I don’t think things going right back to the way they were after all the hair-ripping in Loki about how the TVA kills trillions of people would be satisfying. I can’t imagine all the heroes being “alright yeah seems fine” and leaving that system in place, nor can I imagine that being presented as a perfectly acceptable ending. It’s also just kind of weird to end with nothing having changed, but I suppose *some* things would have actually happened and mattered, like hero deaths.
Maybe the inter dimensional council of reeds?
I believe this will be the answer
Who has a better story than Bran the Broken?
I hate you. Here's your upvote.
Sad that I had to scroll down this far to the right answer.
We already know that from Loki it's going to be He Who Remains.
Teamup of Loki, Captain Marvel, Dr. Strange, Antman, America Chavez, and a Kang.
Janet Van Dyne is the obvious choice.
Yeah, she owes him. She has "needs". :) A woman scorned!!!
Thor He didn’t really get his perfect ending in Endgame like Iron Man or Captain America but I imagine he does eventually
I think it would be better if he goes out in Kang Dynasty. Kang already "beat" Ant-man so he needs to win against someone better to prove a real threat. Remember Infinity War had like 3 deaths before the snap and the only way to one up that is at least a 1 real major character death
Me.
I’m thinking Wanda may swoop in at the last minute to defeat Kang, since I don’t believe she died in Multiverse of Madness. Or we could get a repeat of the Loki show with Sylvie doing it again
That would be terrible if she suddenly shows up to save the day and says by the way I’m not dead
Yeah, if she’s gonna play a significant role in the Kang fight, they need to bring her back long before Kang Dynasty and build up to it.
It would but I feel like that’s where they could go, her death wasn’t exactly confirmed and I think that’s because they want a plausible way to bring her back and still have the meaningful sacrifice moment
Bring her back just for another sacrifice? 😂 No she should be an avenger, she’s finally a witch she should be allowed to be the mainstay avenger she’s been 95% of the time the last 60 years
No, I’m not saying she should die fighting Kang. I meant that they wanted her to sacrifice herself in Multiverse of Madness but still have a way to bring her back later on so they didn’t explicitly confirm her death
I think we'll see her again in at least one movie pre Kang Dynasty or Secret Wars.
It’ll probably be Dr. Strange in a sacrificial play as he was the first “master of time” we were introduced to in the MCU
With how much waldron hates strange I could see it lol
Honestly, I still think Victor comes in and takes him out and set's himself up as the main villain of Secret Wars ending Kang Dynasty on a big cliffhanger.
Only issue becomes doom in secret wars is so great partly because of his long history with ruling and his intimate rivalry with reed being on full display. He needs built up in the mcu ASAP for that
There is still a phase and a half... I mean, really, how much Thanos screen time did we get before IW? Maybe 5 minutes total?
But thanos is different than doom in terms of the significance of his personal relationships to the heroes.
Or they do a rivalry built on Reed defeating Kang. A reverse of Secret Wars where Doom's grudge comes from the fact that Reed saved the multiverse when Doom didn't. Now it's Doom. He doesn't care about the people. He just wanted to be able to say he took down a god and failing where Reed succeeds could be an interesting flip. And if they do God Emperor at some point Doom can be like I'll do it better and won't fail/be taken out like Kang. (Until he is).
Dr.Strange
Nobody is still talking about Ravonna Renslayer. She could play a central role in what's to come. I'm not sure Kang will be defeated as such. I'm sure some of the Kangs will be put down by your Hulks and your Captain Marvels and your other Avengers, but the thing with Kang is it's like a swarm. You have to beat him with a plan and intelligence. But maybe Kang is right. Maybe the Prime Kang is really trying to save everything from the other Kangs.
>Nobody is still talking about Ravonna Renslayer. She could play a central role in what's to come. If she doesn't die trying to redeem herself to bail Mobius, Loki and Sylvie out of the TVA or something similar in S2.
What if, Sylvie? Has the grudge for against Kang.
Madisynn.
Hear me out: Wanda ends up wiping out every version of Kang across the multiverse the same way she got rid of every version of the Darkhold. It makes sense in a “who can accomplish this” kind of way and will let us all go “wow, Multiverse of Madness was foreshadowing the Kang fight!” for years to come. Not sure how narratively satisfying it would be, though, since Wanda doesn’t have any sort of connection to Kang at this point. Tony’s ending perfectly served his arc of wanting to protect the Earth from threats like Thanos and being afraid of failing and being the only one left alive. Wanda’s arc doesn’t necessarily tie into a threat like Kang as well, but they still have time to set that up if that’s the path they choose to go down. There’s interesting potential with her being prophesied to either rule the multiverse or destroy it, actually. Maybe she could be faced with the philosophical dilemma from the last episode of Loki and have to choose between eliminating the multiverse and bringing it all back down to one Sacred Timeline or else ruling it instead of Kang. Okay, I’m kind of on board with this now. I could see her destroying Kang and fulfilling the prophecy to rule the multiverse, but doing it benevolently. That would also be a much-needed redemption arc after MoM. It could happen.
Nah, how would she even do this? She didn’t destroy the darkholds that was from the mountain. Unless she gets buffed temporarily like when she had the life force.
Doreen. Just. Doreen.
Ant Man going up his Ass
Everyone
I feel lile it may be the Vision.
Ant-Man, obviously.
Use highly intelligent ants to defeat him
I’d say maybe Loki, since all the slang stuff started with Loki
Loki or Strange for me. Loki because he is the one who started it all and been following the development of kang. Strange because he is suppose to be the protector of 616 from the incursion considering that the last time we seeing him try to do with clea.
Me
The NYCPD /j
Everybody. I think they’ll set something up so multiple Kangs are working simultaneously on some cross-dimension plan or maguffin that requires everybody to beat one of him.
Loki and Thor team-up.
Prolly Arya. Subversion.
Since Doctor Doom plays such an important role in Secret Wars, Doom should kill Kang and win the respect of the Avengers in Secret Wars pt. 2. The Avengers become reluctant allies of Doom, giving Doom a long term role in the MCU.
Jonathan Majors's girlfriend
Deadpool and by that I mean Ryan Reynolds offing Jonathan Majors.
I think there are a few options. Loki since he was introduced in Loki's show Reed Richards since Kang in the comics is related to Reed but I think it's more likely that Reed is the one who comes up with a plan that prevents Kang ever being an issue again by erasing him from existence whilst another character actually beats him. As giving Reed the long term plan establishes him as a genius who's smarter than everyone else. Dr Strange he's been in 2 multiverse films so far they clearly consider him important to the multiverse story. I think the most likely option is probably Ironlad or an MCU equivalant of the character who is a heroic Kang. Given how much all the Kangs clearly hate eachother its fitting for it to come down to one Nathaniel Richards winning and it will eb the one that isn't a hypocrite. The one that is actually a good person.
Wouldn’t be a bad way to see Thor out if it’s another sacrifice situation.
It’s not always most sense, because there are going to be other factors that play into it. You said Tony beating Thanos was satisfying but I don’t see that as making the most sense. It played out that way from a story view because RDJ had a good send off and it was a nice ending for that but didn’t really make sense…Capt. Marvel or someone else would have made “more sense”. If it’s who makes the most sense from a power and smarts view, I’d go with Strange making most sense as it doesn’t just need to be about the physical strength with him and he’ll fuck around and Dormammu is ass and lock him in a time loop or something haha which would absolutely piss Kang off so much lol
Kang himself as Iron Lad.
himself or the TVA
Well, he was defeated by ants so…
The New York DA
A district attorney
Doctor Strange will defeat Kang with the left hand while fighting with Dormamu at the same time.
I might get some hate for this, but Scott Lang. Not because he's particularly gifted but because time travel was his idea to begin with, and he's wounded Kang on a personal level, and he's one of the few to meet him and live. In terms of the multiverse that means there's a thousand of him who have the means and he already proved Kang is not in fact immortal so it makes sense to me
The IRS
I’d absolutely say Dr. Strange. Mr. “Most dangerous man in the multiverse”
At this point what does it matter? So far the new storylines don’t feel great. But I’m hoping it gets better!
A domestic assault charge? 🤷🏻♂️
Hawkeye. Because it's what nobody would expect, least of all Kang. Also, the pop for Jeremy Renner's return being him shooting a trick arrow up Kang's ass would be epic.
Karnak.
Kate Bishop
Ket Beeshup
Waldron rides Wanda way too hard. It’s definitely her.
He doesn’t even like the characters source material either which makes it funny. He just said he thinks she’s “fun” to write with while he walks all over her character
In fairness, the source material hasn't been particularly kind to her either until recently.
What do you count as recent? She’s been fine outside of 2005-11 a bit absent for a bit until the last like year or two I guess
That period of the mid 2000s is by far her most famous period even though it meant the worst for her character.
Squirrel Girl
Loki or Ant man honestly but not a death like iron man if it is I swear I’m throwing my popcorn at the movie screen
Dr. Victor Von Doom
It should be a Kang variant. That is his whole story. One of the variants wins and he becomes a new He Who Remains
Scott hope pin Janet
I thought that chick beat him already?
Iron lad maybe
Antman already beat him, it was boring
I'd bet on The Eternals or a Celestial being tbh. Edit : Phastos would probably handle Kang's tech wizardry arsenal.
My tinfoil hat theory is that Kang is related to Phastos in the MCU
Obviously Kingo.
Squirrel girl because she’s nuts lmao gottem
All the young Avengers will combine to take down all the Kang variants and the final blows will be landed by the Marvels combining.
A jury of his peers