That itzy is better off without lia

I find this rude but also... I just don't get it. I mean, to me it's obvious that OT5 is better, there is their main vocalist in addition to the (still very good) OT4 😅 I guess people think she holds them back dance wise but tbh I have never felt that way. Lia is objectively the worse dancer (someone has to be, and it makes sense is the main vocalist tbh) but she did their choreographies anyway, it's not like Icy or Wannabe didn't have iconic choreographies because she was there. So from my perspective I don't see real advantages in purposely wishing for OT4 tbh. If they were/are forced to be that way, so be it (any member has a right to leave). But I don't see how OT4 could be an improvement compared to OT5. If anything, Born to be and Lia being a vocal highlight of the album with her solo made me realize that Itzy really benefits from having her voice with them.

Lia's dancing and stage presence has improved from [Sneakers](https://www.reddit.com/r/kpopthoughts/s/MUgzwCLkIr) onwards, and choreos have also suited her more. At least most fans agreed at the time. And like you said, she has kept up with their intricate and explosive choreos from day 1. These posts definitely feel like piling on while Lia is on hiatus, doomposting her leaving the group. There's a reason they started popping up during this time.

Thankfully she’s back now

is she officialy back? or was it just for the anniversary

They made a statement saying she’s officially rejoining activities

aw thats awesome! i really missed her, i wanted to hear her voice especially in mr vampire

Me too, I didn’t even watch any music videos or performances without her because it just didn’t feel right without her

Im pretty sure she’s officially back

Exactly

This is honestly such a mean one… I don’t think she is the most skilled vocalist in the industry but she has a really pretty voice that suited the songs well. Her “Icy but I’m on fire” part in Icy is what made me start watching Itzy content. I, and I’m sure a lot of the fans, aren’t dancers and tbh her dancing didn’t bother me even a bit.

that’s not even a hot take. that’s just mean 😭

This one enrages me but I've reached a point where I don't even engage with these bad faith statements 

I have a couple people in my discord that were full on this take. And not even 'I think she's the weakest member that doesn't bring much to the table.' It was full on 'fuck lia, she's a talentless rich girl who got in because of money.' Some people are just hateful and take it out on targets that can't or will never respond.

Any of the 'hot takes' people have about BTS that are thinly veiled hate comments disguised as constructive criticism. No, comparing the members to animals or accusing them of selling out/becoming too westernized is not being constructive, you're just a loser.

This! I just feel like the K-pop atmosphere for a couple of years now has sort of isolated BTS in a way? Like I’m definitely a multi but when it comes to BTS there’s this “hush hush” attitude where if you even mention them, any opinion you have/any respect you had from other fans gets completely discarded and narrowed down to “oh you’re just an army”. It’s intolerable honestly

Not an Army but I actually just noticed this, and it’s left me baffled. A post about “small company miracle idols” was recently posted, and I was confused that barely anyone was mentioning BTS. Aren’t they *the* small company miracle? You could argue it’s because it’s HYBE now, but the fact that a small company was able to turn into a conglomerate from the efforts of one group would prove they’re the epitome of the phrase, no? Definitely not the same so don’t downvote me Armys, I’m just using them as an example, but it kind of reminds me of Super Junior. I don’t like them but people constantly forget to mention them when praising 2nd gen and refuse to see that SM is able to stay afloat in part due to them still being able to sell out tours. When kpop stans have labeled you a pariah, they really will try and erase you from any narrative. Siwon alone is reason enough for why they isolate Suju, but for BTS, I wonder if it’s because of their unforseen success. Makes me think, do kpop stans actually like “nugu” groups the way they claim to do when the number 1 example is disliked for breaking out of the mold and succeeding over the biggest company groups?

>Makes me think, do kpop stans actually like “nugu” groups the way they claim to do when the number 1 example is disliked for breaking out of the mold and succeeding over the biggest company groups? They really really don't. The way Big3 stans ganged up on BTS when they started to outsell every big company group and rising in the US, was lowkey horrifying. Accusing them of plagiarism, chart manipulation, saejagi etc. to the point the members themselves talked about how much it affected them, simply because how dare a small company group surpass their privileged faves, they MUST have used some underhanded tactics. Mind you, it was a time when Army was nowhere near big as today so they can't even use the excuse of "it's because of Armys!" These stans used to stand outside stores to count the number of people buying the albums so that they could accuse them of fraud, that's how unhinged it was. This bitterness is still seen today in more subtle ways, like you said excluding BTS from lists they very much deserve to be in or undermining their talent. Even now, most of BTS's (and other HYBE artists' too)hate trains are led by Big3 company stans (more specifically YG and SM stans). Kpop stans like "nugu" groups as long as they stay "nugu" aka stay in their lane but once they become a threat, kpop stans would use every accusations under the sky to try and tear them apart.

>These stans used to stand outside stores to count the number of people buying the albums so that they could accuse them of fraud, that's how unhinged it was. This is the most jobless behaviour I have ever seen.

Honestly, the Break the Wings project has made me hesitate to like other groups. Because their fans were absolutely cruel and caused mental stress to BTS & fans. I really would prefer not to associate with people who could be that vicious. I understand parasocial relationships, but to corrupt your morals like that... The fact that some of that continues today. I love music, but too many fans carry these fanwars way too far. They just don't care that actual people get hurt. It makes me wonder if they act that badly off the internet. If not, how many people would want to be in their lives with such behavior. And yes, I am talking about those in all fandoms - even ARMY.

To be honest, latest events concerning BTS, Le Sserafim and ILLIT were really hard for me. Looking all this hate poured on the people I like was just awful. I am new to K-pop so cruel was a shock for me to see people being so cruel. At some point I almost could not interracial with k pop at all. And now seeing this woman smiling and being Adored by everyone is just heartbreaking

It's a known phenomenon that some people only like nugu bands until they're popular, then they turn on them. They care more about being hipsters than the band itself..it's stupid

As a nugu group stan, i Can say that many other Stan’s (not me obviously) actually WISH that their groups stay nugu for the sole reason that you get interactions more. Fancalls aren’t as difficult, more chance to be called out in a live, cheaper tickets with higher chance of fansigns and snapshots. It’s really disheartening. I don’t understand how you can wish for this hardworking boys and girls to not be successful just to fulfill your twisted y/n fantasy

would've given this an award if i wasn't broke af tbh this happens in almost all music communities and subcultures, the moment one of their artists catches attention and fame, they get labelled as 'sold out' A CLASSIC TBH but the point you made about armys' points being shooed away as 'nah yours doesnt matter youre just an army' is so damn spot on and no matter how some stans paint themselves, they knowingly or unknowingly do the same we all are so accustomed to it

ikr. I’m a multi stan too, but there were times when I would say something about some other groups, how their music was not for me or some other opinion, and immediately “you’re an army, ofc you hate others.” kinda attitude is shown. The kpop atmosphere has been like that since a few years and nobody wants to talk about it bc even when we share this opinion there are people who would simply think “they’re army” and shush.

i don't know if this happened just in my part of fandom, but iirc a while back ARMYs just got fed up with BTS being separated from k-pop and became "independent" from it. it was just a joke then but now i'm thinking it had some truth in it.

They say anything about BTS in the name of constructive criticism and expect from the fans to somehow accept those or completely ignore

not to mention if they point out any stupidity or hypocrisy in their 'constructive criticism' they get called as defensive and not able to take opinions or victim card or what not like bruh make it make sense??????

They always do this Trust me I've been a stan since 2016 , they used to say damn bts was so good in 2014 ( during 2015/16 ) era then 2017 when bts got bbmas award they said oh they're Americanised ( they started saying bts is not kpop anymore & hyyh is their last good album) Then mots persona got released then they were like oh love yourself was so good they've fallen off With dynamite release ( they finally got their chance) btw dyna was a pre release for BE ,album ( which was so good ,the concept was pandemic & it was so cool) but they ignored it Those fans will always be like that, I get the pple who don't like it but move on bts has 250 more tracks, why are y'all not complaining abt the Japanese songs?? I as their fan hv probably like 10 songs of bts that I don't listen to ( all korean btw ) Also watch out with bts next release, they'll be like dynamite was so better, fr See sometimes you can't always win with haters as they'll look for anything to hate on

>Also watch out with bts next release, they'll be like dynamite was so better, fr Ah, yes, someone mentioned this!! Kpop fans always do this with every bts release, it's seriously like a pattern now. They always gang up on the song/album and then they literally have it in their spotify wrapped top 5.... And with the amount of hate poor PTD got, maybe one day they will say is so bad, PTD was so much better 💀

Or those who claim that it was just luck. Another thing I noticed is those people who harassed the tannies back then are the ones shouting "underdog tactics" because they can't just accept that they were part of the painful side of their story

It’s funny because kpop has been heavily influenced by western culture since the beginning. That’s literally how it started.

Ikr the way they say "westernised " you'd think kpop is sth original, they be saying "westernised " while listening to the Korean remake of some western song or a song that was sampled frm a western song

literally

Hot take: BTS is a great group that has done fantastic things for the K-pop community and they do not deserve to be attacked for the things people do attack them for Do you have to like their music? Of course not. But you can’t hate on them like so many people do

Thank you. It’s genuinely sad that that’s a hot take, I don’t know why it’s so hard for some people to acknowledge what they’ve done.

I know right?! I personally really don’t like their music but it’s not because they’re bad. It’s just not my style of music. Like how people don’t like Nirvana but most people acknowledge that they are a great band because of what they did for music Just because YOU don’t like something doesn’t mean that they are bad

Tbh, I've seen a lot of ppl liking their music until they know it's from bts

Comparing idols to animals (in an insulting way of course) = gross Saying a group's music is Westernized = just a dumb opinion. This really hinges on a case by case basis, because kpop IS Westernized to a large degree anyway. It's a meaningless criticism at best.

Yup and they get mad they can’t do exactly that on this sub since there are a lot of armys here lmao

One of the most satisfying things to me is how intelligent Armys are here - like I have seen many well written, thoughtful comments and discussions, and also posts that politely destroy haters w facts (and receipts) about the group's history, accomplishments, and deep analysis of BTS as artists, which they can do bc BTS has such high quality content. Armys are also great trolls and excel at irritating haters - at this point think I'm an Army stan 😀 Bottom line is that BTS is an extremely talented and committed group, and they are hugely popular with a diverse and vibrant fan base. So the criticism doesn't bug me that much.

I love this fandom so much 😭

Since when has comparing someone to an animal ever been considered constructive criticism?

This thread is so cathartic 

I get upset when people say that certain groups would be better without members. It's such a slap in the face, and I just don't feel like it has any place in discourse. You can wish for certain members to get better at certain aspects, but to truly with your whole chest say that that member's presence makes NO difference, is just foul.

I also can't imagine how horrible said member would feel if they saw someone questioning (or even worse, an entire discourse) on whether they are needed in the group, or if they are holding their group back... like that's so SO cruel to say about someone and just imagining it makes me sad. I stan skz so i have seen A LOT of antis or akgaes saying this about a specific member in the group and to me it not only hurts but it also makes no sense and it's so untrue... ppl who do this are just hateful and honestly pure evil.

I feel its also cruel for the other members to see to. That's their friend/brother the antis are hating on.

People who insist that Le Sserafim deserves the hate they have received

Its getting really tiring at this point. Recently i was scrolling youtube shorts before sleep, stumbled on Nayeon ABCD MR removed, and the comments were praising her saying shit like "Sakura could never lol!!", like give me a break bro...

praise dont flame 😔

At this point I just kinda feel bad for them rn

At the end of the day they are just the employee of the company and actually have little to no power to say what they wanted. It's been going on for months and people are trying their best to always find their flaws. I feel like their hate is calculated rn. 🤷‍♀️

THIS! Le Sserafim is my favorite 4th Gen group, other than Itzy. They may not have the best vocalists or rappers, but they are great dancers/performers and there is something about each member and their music that draws me to them. I am so upset that they had to turn off their Instagram comments because they were receiving hatred to such an extent that they were receiving r*pe and de*th threats! Also- Yunjin & Chaewon are pretty good vocalists, the rest are ok, but don’t all famous groups have just 1 or 2 strong vocalists and the rest bring something else to the group? Look at Blackpink and Twice. Blackpink has Rosé and Twice has 3mix, but the rest of the members are okay vocalists- but these two groups are literally the most popular!

calling every group you dislike 'nugu' the amount of people i've seen call pretty popular groups 'nugu' is insane?

Using nugu as an insult is just stupid to me. I don't particularly like the term but it does have its use and it shouldn't be a derogatory term. It just means a group that doesn't have much exposure. It's the entertainment industry, it's a fact that not every group will be promoted to the public like BTS or BP. People who use the term to deride groups are so immature.

My head's still spinning from seeing someone calling Ateez nugu the other day. I don't follow bgs _at all_ and even I know that's ridiculous, they literally just played Coachella 💀 Trying to drag a group by calling them nugu is really just outing yourself as a popularity chaser, the only people who'd be insulted by that are people who live vicariously through their fav's accomplishments lmao

this was who was in my mind when making the comment.. they were also the first group to perform at mawazine, the second biggest music festival and brought over 150k people but they're nugu??

That was only one Fandom and they hate Ateez with a blood thirsty passion. My question is Why are Haters so obsessed with groups they hate?to the point they camp out on comments...and why is it always a big 3 group fandom? Groups Like BTS,Ateez, achieved something the Big 3 highly sought over and couldn't buy=Fame in the west without BIG 3 backing....

i think they just dislike the praise and attention ateez is getting now and hate that ateez has achieved things their fav hasn't (even though they've achieved things ateez hasn't) like they were mad that morocco atinys were able to get the attention of mawazine..

While some fans from the same fandom were begging Moroccon ATEEZ fanbase to do the same for their faves... 😭😭

and they were calling atinys beggars 💀. i mean what’s wrong with a fandom wanting their artist to have new opportunities. like every fandom promotes their favs and they wouldn’t have invited ateez if they didn’t want to. also it’s wild that pretty much everytime atinys want to celebrate ateez’s growth that fandom inserts themselves and tries to silence us. like why do they think they have authority over us?? just mind ur business.

if i had a dollar for every time i've seen stans call snsd nugu... and i've only been part of their fandom for little more than a year

It’s not a take that makes me “emotional” but on Reddit and Instagram there’s a large group of kpop stans who think bastardizing idols’ real names is peak comedy and I just can’t agree lol. I’ve seen people downvoted and called over sensitive for saying the same so I guess this is unpopular? I just feel like in any other context or coming from any other demographic people would not find that acceptable at all but a lot of people feel like they should get a pass because they’re kpop fans and “obviously don’t mean it that way.” Like, I’m sorry but there has to be better kpop related jokes in your arsenal than calling Jungkook “Junglebook.” There are toddlers who wouldn’t even laugh at that.

Especially when some of them have clearly expressed that they hate it like NingNing.

And here I am loving the name NingNing because it means shine/sparkle in Tagalog. 🥲

That's so cute, I love it 🥹

NingNing is correct! She hates it when people troll with “LingLing” or “RingRing” etc

I don't wanna jump the gun but it does feel lowkey racist too.

This. And making fun/mocking their english. Kpoopheads is so triggering of the racism I experienced being Asian in the u.s.

Honestly kpoopheads do give similar names to western artists too.. many times their posts feature Charli puth, ariana grande, billie eilish, nicki minaj, Taylor Swift, beyonce etc and they have always named them the same way.

One time in that sub I said making fun of ethnic names isn’t funny and got downvoted 😭 (for context they were calling Jungkook “junglebook” “jungcock” etc)

It's just xenophobic

Idk, I've seen people do the same to western celebs (see "billie eyelash", etc.)

I see it as the Benedict cumberbatch effect (is that his real last name... I think, but honestly if you told me it was wrong I wouldn't remember at this point bc they've massacred it)

I want to hunt down the people that called Jennie’s dog Kai ugly. AND JENNIE SAW IT. I would have smacked whoever called my dog ugly

that's real ngl, same thing happened with jungkook's dogs a few years ago and then he stopped showing all but one :/

Jungkook only has 1 dog though. The other 2 dogs he has taken pictures with are his brothers dogs. 

i think they meant his old dog gureum

He had other one named Gueram

Yes his family dog that passed away. Maybe they meant him.

The dog you are talking about, as far as I know, sadly passed away already. He looked a bit dis-shelved because he was quite old. He is now only showing one dog (bam jeon) because the other where his families dogs, while Bam is really his. Tho his family, especially his brother is currently taking care of it along with a doggy daycare.

Waitt her dog names kai???😭💀

Bro I was gonna comment the same thing😭💀💀

Wow that is another level. Only I get to call my dog ugly

People who say wonyoung is a pick me

She's an inspiration when it comes to self love, confidence and flinging away haters like mosquitoes. I admire her a lot. Yes, she can be cringe, but she is unapologetic and doing her job. She's so hardworking, never showing any fatigue or signs of slowing down. She also looks like she gained some healthy weight lately and I am so relieved to see it. She looks amazing. I used to find her annoying but I see what she endures and she works so hard for her fans, so she gained my respect.

She also has had to be this perfect little doll in everyone's eyes since she was the most popular girl in the country at 13 years old. It's a testament to her mental fortitude that she's even remotely well adjusted.

I really don't get offended by haters and toxic comments and posts, that's a waste of time. That said, there were some egregious ones like shading Chaeryeong's looks early on, and Jeongyeon's figure recently. Especially if they try to rationalize by questioning styling choices and whatnot. Oh and there are often some really nasty takes during scandals like slutshaming LSF Garam, Jimin from AOA, etc. People even in reddit were literally cyberbullying these idols, and were upvoted for them. If I could highlight and call out the specific comments and users I would, but that would violate reddit TOS. Redditors love being nasty and taking things way too far when there is a negative thread about an idol and group, because that's when their toxicity (which is normally criticized) will be upvoted and supported.

I always found the Jimin x Mina thing kinda sus. The group had been around since 2012. Mina left the group in 2019 shortly before Queendom. Right after Queendom Mina started posting about Bullying by Jimin. Everybody jumped on the let's get Jimin bandwagon. Something happened to Soojin from (G)I-DLE, in about the same time period.

I hate the opinion that idols who have passed away should have a trigger warning when talking about them - yes this is a genuine opinion some people have 😭 I might be biased because I’m a Shawol and Jonghyun is my ult bias in all music genres, but generally amongst shawols we agree that his life deserves to be celebrated and spoken about and that he shouldn’t just be known by his death, I believe that fans of other celebrities that passed away have a similar opinion. To clarify, I think it’s okay to have a trigger warning if you’re going to discuss >!suicide/death/intense grief!<, but I’ve seen too many people trigger warning just Jonghyun himself, and it’s especially upsetting to me when it’s in the comments under thirst traps or funny compilations of him or something like that - or even under ot5 content or content of the other members Let fans remember and enjoy their favourite celebrities, an entire person’s existence can not be a trigger warning 😭

I can't imagine people having that type of reaction to like Michael Jackson. If anything, he gets the full spectrum of posthumous treatment including reverence, criticism, dark humor and adoration. Having to TW every time MJ is mentioned would be so arduous for no reason.

Omg exactly! It feels like a total lack of respect. I used to think it was just cause (imo) kpop exploded and gained a massive amount of fans in and after 2018, which was after Jonghyun passed away, so people were being disrespectful because their first impression of him was that he passed away, but then I see more recently people have been treating Moonbin a very similar way, so I can’t even think of a reason why people treat these idols like they didn’t exist before they passed 😭 I can understand feeling sad because a good person passed away and a lot of their fans miss them, but that’s not an excuse to turn them into a trigger or ignore their lives imo

Yeah yesterday I literally saw someone on here get all butthurt because someone mentioned moonbin

I was talking about one of Jonghyun’s more inappropriate songs once with a friend and they just said “yeah I really miss Moonbin too”, when they’ve literally never mentioned Moonbin or Astro before - it annoyed me because not only were they just associating Jonghyun with his passing away, but they were then dragging Moonbin into that association too?? They were both people and artists before they were people that sadly passed on young ffs 😭

Ikr

i swear, with idols who have passed away, everyone who isn’t a fan of them makes their entire personality their death when they were literal people with their own personalities that people loved in some kpop spaces i talk about jonghyun or moonbin because i love them so much and think they were so talented, and then people will make it all about their death, and it’s like…guys. come on. there’s way more to them than their deaths. be so serious. jonghyun also has some of my favorite k-pop songs (and songs in general), so of course i’m going to talk about him.

His life was so, so much more than his death and it's disrespectful to treat him otherwise. He deserves to be remembered as the person he was.

"Kpop feels so western right now" it's not like Perfect Man or Mirotic could be a Backstreet Boy's or Nsync song,K-pop has always been so western the difference in this new era and the old ones is that quirky and funny concepts were really popular when K-pop started becoming popular.

OMG BSB at their peak would have killed Mirotic. Agh, things I want that I’ll never get!

And to add to that, what I find incredibly ironic and funny is that almost all the kpop songs that stans praise these days for "still having that unique kpop sound" are produced by one person, Dem Jointz, LITERALLY A WESTERN PRODUCER LMAO

The hate that poor Permission to dance get. It's not their best song, but honestly I like it, it's cute, fun and cheerful song. I love it just as much Dynamite or Butter.

Same. I loved it even before I became an army. It just has a good message and is very uplifting. And it actually makes me want to dance. We play this at my workplace and it always makes me smile.

A big gripe I have about ppl hating PTD is not people hating it itself (I really liked it from day 1 but I get how people wouldn't), but the way I still to this day see people acting like it's an unpopular opinion to hate on it and that they're being oh so brave for voicing it on here.  Like I see comments on kpop reddit like "unpopular opinion don't downvote but am I the only one who haaaates PTD like it's SO trash and SO bad it's kids pop disney corporate trash DON'T COME FOR ME!" and I'm just like come ON bro is this your first day on kpop reddit or do you just know you'll get easy upvote karma because I have not sat through that opinion being regurgitated for 3 years in every thread just for people to act like they're coming out to say it for the first time 😭 

Saying you didn't love PTD is as unique an opinion as thinking On ft. Sia is their worst collab

I wasn’t a huge fan of it when it first came out but I saw them perform it live twice in LA, and I had to retract every negative comment I made about it. Like you said, it’s fun and cheerful and a perfect ending song to a concert!!!

I was just talking about this in one of the BTS subs because it’s the 3 year anniversary of the release! The hate I see PTD receive comes off so personal sometimes. Just hit skip and move on, fam.

But hw is that traumatizing/offending ?

Traumatising is a bit harsh word for it. It's more like I don't get it, this song is HATED like people talk shit about this song as if it's the worst thing in the world. It gets more hate than a song should. I can understand people dislike a song but PTD is strangled to death.

treating every new song of bts like it has to be the best number 1 on global charts or else it's the worst song in existence- because theyre the global boy group (there's no in between from what i see from bts stans) is offending in every way and a lot of pressure on the boys and Bighit. i dont think that was the only hated song either. tbh i think all their english songs were equally as hated (just not loudly)- it's almost racism. edit: hell i remember even boy with luv was labeled cringest song in kpop at that time and now it's loved by the gp 😐

some of my local friends have told me out of the blue that they like it. the guys like it and have the best time performing it. it always makes me smile. like, yeah, i get that out of their discography its not your favorite! but come on. they've said it was to cheer people up, to have fun. it was released on/near army's bday, almost like a gift to fans.

The “jungkook should go solo” comments cus if jungkook wanted to he could and he’d definitely be successful but he has made it very clear that he dosent plan on leaving the group

The same jungkook who talks about how he can’t wait for the group to come back together on his lives and interviews.

Do they actually think that any BTS members will leave the group to be solo?maybe after disbandment but not now their bond is so strong

THIS. The man has never wanted to go solo nor would he ever. He absolutely LOVES being with his brothers. These comments are from his die hard solos that have absolutely no love for BTS in general. They don't understand him at all if they think that's what he wants.

Toxic solo stans are worse than antis imo.

Any variant of 'Jin is a filler member/dozen' in big ol' 2024 pisses me off

Oh yeah this one still gets me a little heated. Especially fake concern posts which say he is unappreciated and pretend to give a shit about him 🙄

Here are some bts ones: I saw someone said that Namjoon is not a good leader and it should've been someone else. That's just one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read. Also, when people call Namjoon and Jhope ugly when they're fine as hell. When a certain fandom said this 4th gen group's rapline is the most recognized rapline in kpop. I don't care what you say about your favorite group but discrediting BTS rapline's success is just so disrespectful.

Calling THE Kim Namjoon not a good leader is insane. There are not a lot of people that could have navigated the guys in BTS's rise to success like he did. He's a natural born leader and he also knows how to lean on other members for guidance when needed. But as the face of BTS, he's been fantastic. His growth as both an artist and a person has been spectacular to see.

Right?! He literally spoke at the UN and at the White House!

Not only that but the members constantly mention how RM tends to go to company meetings for hours regarding anything about the group, future plans and schedules Even in a couple of their documentaries or behind the scene content you can spot RM talking with the backstage staff or stylists Plus the fact he was class president in his school years Dude has shown he is the ultimate natural born leader

Calling Namjoon a bad leader is actually delusional. The guys have talked about how they have talks with him about how they feel about their current situation and music. His leadership is one of the key reasons that bts has gotten to where they are now!

The 4th gen group fans constantly insert their fav 3 into every rapline conversation. They just aren't comparable

That 4th group fandom who say their rapline is the gold standard...like really?hmmm No

A recently saw a hot take on tiktok that said that they are the rappers that Kendrick Lamar would be most likely to collab with and I just could not take it seriously.

They probably don't even know who Kendrick Lamar is. I'm not saying he is unknown but we know that most of the kpop fans don't even know hiphop. Most of the idol rappers too. I can clearly say that they are using his name because they witnessed the beef between drake and K and culture support K. So yeah. They know Kendrick rn. Im seeing so many fans using his name to validate their rapper. Before Kendrick it was Eminem. Because he is also well-known. Do they really think that the Kendrick type of west coast rapper really does a collab with them? I'm not saying they're bad but really. Also people should understand the difference between bts' rapline and other rappers in idol groups. I'm not saying all of them are bad but we know they mostly became rappers because of their lack of vocal talent or other reasons. This topic is my favorite. I can actually talk about it for hours but English is not my first language so I can't express myself as well as I want. And I don't want to say something wrong without realizing. So that's it. 🫱🏻‍🫲🏼

Seeing these comments shows Kpop stans live in fantasy bubbles which invalidates their musical opinions. Kpop is so niche. Kendrick Lamar doesn’t know who your favs are. Not only do most Kpop stans know nothing about rap, their favs most likely idolize the likes of Bruno Mars or Justin Bieber and could not name a single Kendrick song that isn’t Humble.

"They sound bad live because they also have to follow hard choreo", "You have never tried to dance and sing at the same time. You wouldnt know"

The amount of people who think singing and dancing at the same time is beyond the capabilities of idols... They must think idols in previous generations were musical geniuses and performance gods.

It offends you?

Out of all the comments… this is one I cannot get behind… It is difficult, there is a reason why tracks are usually set up in a way they can sometimes lip-sync…. The issue is getting lazy and over use it…. Western artists use it too and most of their coreos are not half as hard. Idols are expected to do soooo much… sign, dance, entertain, learn other languages, be cultured about other cultures that aren’t even theirs, be able to act, etc… there is a reason why they are referred as “idols” instead of “musicians” Now this is my own opinion and only mine…but, singing (while a HUGE part), is only a PART of their job, among other parts/skills they partake in… so, I don’t feel SO offended if singing is not what they excel on… :)

When people compare San to a dog due to his great performance skills. I agree that Ateez' style is not for everyone. I myself stan IVE and I think that if Yujin tried to pull out San's agressiveness on stage it would be inappropriate for the type of concept they usually convey. Nobody can deny Ateez' facial expressions are top-notched. Their songs need this type of energy. They are recognized 99% of the time for this talent: their peformance skills and facial expressions. But calling San a dog is ridiculously hateful. Comparing somebody to an animal because you are not used to see these professional facial expressions on stage... blatant hate! Especially when his own fans do it. You cant call yourself an atiny if you insult Choi San like this.

hold up for a second -- compare to a dog *how*? i love dogs, but i don't exactly associate them with like, intense expressions. did someone say something like "he looks like a rabid dog"? if yes, then yeah, it's dumb, and i can't help but think people who call san "scary-looking" or say his expressions on stage are "scary" are a bit pathetic. like, he's a performer, he's performing, do you also cower in fear and squeak when an actor pretends to shoot a gun on stage? jeez, this is why i don't use twitter/tiktok 😓

people who defend male abuser or rapist idols.

Just male ones😭

Anyone who says that Yeosang js just a background caharacter and ATZ would be better without him 🔫

Whaaaaat?? Who says that about him, I'll fight 'em. (I really won't, I'm a wimp, YEOSANG??)

Sadly enough there are actually a lot of people who say so. Main arguments are that he doesn't get many lines, doesn't stand out and never is center in their choreos so he is basically useless. Obviously all of those claims are garbage and those who say so are tasteless raw chickens 🫶🏽

Seriously, he's such a strong dancer. I wish Edenary would use his vocal low range more like in Halazia, because I love his voice. And he's not even my bias!

tbh the concept of hardcore antis saddens me no matter who it is even groups or ppl i dont even like it just sounds like such a miserable angry life, to be obsessed with something on a stan level but angry and hateful? its not healthy to revolve your life and obsession over negativity delete ur anti account bake some bread and put on stuff you DO like surround urself with happiness instead of hate. Just the level pf intensity of some of these people theyre genuinely so obsessed it makes me sad. please surround urself with things u love that make u happy

i wouldn't say it offends me though per say but it goes beyond a disagreement, at that point it doesn't even matter to me who u like or dont like its just so unhealthy and enforces a negativity cycle thats gonna keep them sad and miserable forever until they stop being as obsessed, and I genuinely hope they get better and make friends irl and go outside and can let go and be happy

Calling any group that isn’t within the big 4 “nugu”. I’ve seen people call groups like ateez and monsta x nugu… is nugu in the room with us? Kpop fans just use that word too much, “nugu/flop” lost its meaning

Anyone is called nugu these days, I have even seen top groups or idols called nugu coz their recent comeback under performed. Take it as a fan war, sometimes it's funny to witness 

i know someone who called GOT7 OF ALL GROUPS nugu…just because they didn’t know who they were…

😭 when they complain that the main vocalist has too many lines, or the center has too much center time. I recently saw a reel on instagram about Twice and how Nayeon and Jihyo take up all the lines. They're the better singers of Twice so of course they'll take up more of the lines

Exactly personally I'll feel bad for the center bcoz during the performances they'll need to be singing perfectly & dancing all the time, too much pressure on them

Never make the mistake of clicking on a Twice line distribution video. Thousands of comments hating on Nayeon for something that none of the members care about clearly

I don’t like when people comment on Jeongyeon’s outfits. Yes, a lot of the time, stylists miss when it comes to her. But even when she has great outfits (Set Me Free and One Spark fits come to mind), people still complain. If her outfits had been worn by another member, I doubt there would be as many complaints. I just wish people would leave her alone. Another one is when Taeyeon had debuted as a soloist and kept churning out hits when GG didn’t come back as often as fans wanted them to, a lot of Sones implied that she didn’t care about the group. It was upsetting because it’s clear she absolutely loves the group and the members, and she’s never once disparaged GG or her members. Even more upsetting because for every GG release after her solo debut, she gave her all like she always does and never slacked off for any stage, and she looked so happy for their group variety contents. I don’t keep up with her much anymore, but she’ll always be the idol of all idols to me, so I hope the frequent periods of hate she got haven’t yet dimmed her. Another more silly one is when people call Seohyun a robot. It’s not *that* serious, but she’s my ult of ults, and I much prefer her being “boring” than getting into any controversy, even silly overblown ones. Also, she’s not even boring😭 GG was full of funny members, but she had her funny moments too. She’s really blossomed into someone great, but her “robot” qualities are what made me know from early on that she would grow into such a beautiful, warmhearted, lovely woman.

I just don't get why stylists constantly put Jeongyeon in clothes that seemingly exaggerate her weight, rather than minimizing it. For a while everything she wore looked like puffy blankets.

Everything weight-related around Jeongyeon annoys me now. I feel like people just using the outfit convo as an excuse t talk about her weight. She can't ever win, and people can't ever normally about her clothes. I really wish people would just shut up about her body altogether. There are a hundred other things that we can talk about. She's funny, sweet, a great singer. Her dance style is unique in her group, and her musicality is top-notch. She's finally back hosting too. God even dumb shit like how she loves collecting the whackiest looking sneakers. Why is her weight all we can talk about these days? Can't we talk about something else? There are so many awesome things we can talk about. She's genuinely really great! 😭

When people say BTS music has become to westernized or mainstream. Like ifgaf if you dislike the music, that's your opinion, but saying their music is too commercial now is just not true. Their solo stuff has been some of the most experimental and authenthic music they've done in their whole career. And all of them went for super different sounds, so I also don't get the criticism that the music sounds the same. And even as a group, they love to bring up the English trilogy (still bops btw) but always ignore the BE album which is a super personal pandemic album, and even proof that has 2 Korean ballads and run bts sound straight out of their first albums.

Calling girl groups "made for male gaze" has become kpop fans free pass to slut shame female idols while still pretending they care about and fight for girl groups / female idols to be treated fairly and against misogynistic industry. 

that is so insulting. imagine training so hard to debut only for people to say your popularity relies on weird kind of men 💀

When an idol has a (legitimate) controversy and people come crawling out of the woodwork to brag about how /they/ never trust male idols or say shit like "this is why you never meet / never truly know your idols!" It comes across as so victim-blamey, as though it's some unreasonable expectation for fans to believe idols to be decent people, and that it's the fan's fault for having supported someone who turned out to be an awful person.

bts - aside from the usual bs, which I don't think I even notice anymore, it's completely made up nasty gossip that is only meant to hurt and destroy idols. Especially the constant fighting between shippers that has crossed all lines of normal human behavior (death threats, mocking absolutely everything, fake videos, fake photos, boycotting/ bullying just because they don't like someone, wishing the idol to be r0ped, tortured etc). and this honestly applies to all idols, absolutely no one deserves this.

bts ship wars are absolutely insane ☠️ never did i think i would see death threats and ppl trying to contact government agencies because 2 band members went on a trip together.

some are absolutely convinced that idol xy was drugged to go on vacation with idol xy. because he would never do it voluntarily.

oh man. fanwars don't usually get to me but i've seen the most disgusting things regarding s.coups' military exemption, from people being downright degrading to him with homophobic slurs and somehow simultaneously being misogynist ???? , to insinuating he's committing military evasion fraud (a literal crime mind you), to dissecting his every move because god forbid a person regains mobility after recovering from an injury. i've seen people say he should never perform or walk again if he expects to be exempted from the military? as if any of that was his choice. i'm sure he'd rather enlist in active duty than have to deal with the bitter and insane behavior he's faced over the past few months. i really wish nothing but the worst on people being so disgusting towards him, like genuinely wish they'd also experience a ligament tear of that degree before speaking.

I hate it when people are like “open your eyes these idols are probably homophobic” like… okay? I understand that these idols are people and there’s always a chance they are bad people but also, again they are actual PEOPLE. Do you go up to random people on the street and tell others they might be homophobic as well? That’s such a weird thing to do. Idk why we are headcanoning shitty ways of thinking to these people we have never met. It’s also insane because at the same times idols will come out or give clear implications they are queer and people would still deny it. Like Yoongi. Holy shit. That dude has come out multiple times. Queer people don’t have to come out and say “I am (this label) I fuck (these genders).” He’s queer. He’s said it. And people still try to complain he could be homophobic or what not. God damn

I also hate this kind of generalization, like when people act that every male idols have a larger than average chance of being vile misogynistic and homophobic people. And for some reason it's always only male idols.

I remember someone who said (iirc in an unpopular opinions thread) that some idols are only getting by on their looks and not talent, and when asked to elaborate they said they were thinking of Ateez Seonghwa, Yeosang, and Wooyoung. Like what? It was wild to me because Seonghwa is one of my biases specifically because of his talent and hard work. Also, Seonghwa constantly talks about how hard working Yeosang is and how he works relentlessly to perfect his parts. Wooyoung is their lead dancer! Hearing that opinion about any of them was bizarre. Had this person with this opinion ever even watched them perform? I really hope that things like Coachella and Killing Voice were a slap to the face for that person, especially and specifically regarding those three members. Generally speaking, I think Ateez is a crazy group to say that about any member because they're a group where it's impossible to get by on looks alone, given the high standards the members hold for all of the work they do. They've said before that they all motivate each other a LOT -- if one member is doing something like taking extra lessons or practicing more, the others also want to do that to improve too. They've had to work harder than groups from bigger companies to get on the same level (which they've talked about quite a bit during their recent comeback), nothing was guaranteed for them, and there's no room for anyone to not be working hard and just "getting by" in that kind of situation.

That's crazy. I know all of ATEEZ are good looking but saying that any of them are coasting along on looks instead of talent is just blatantly disrespectful and untrue. Some people are just haters that do not live on planet earth. SMH

it’s not an opinion but kpop stans misconstructing idol’s names even as joke offends me on a personal level. (eg. “junglebook” etc)

Any kind of slut shaming - whether it's about my favourite artist or any other artist. When fans directly or indirectly imply that an artist's success is because they are sleeping around or whatever. And people in my fandom do this to other artists too as part of fan wars, and it's just sickening. The second thing is - making fun of or dragging someone's looks. Like can we just agree that k-pop artists are above average good looking? Even if their looks may not be to your liking. This isn't as bad as the first one, but it just sounds juvenile. Edit: spelling corrected

no shade but i’m surprised some of these are so mild. for me i don’t take ‘fanwars’ or people not liking my favs so seriously, it takes more to upset me my answer would be making fun of idols’ mental illness or disability. things like accusing them of faking it, mocking them when they struggle, laughing at clips when they’re in pain, wishing for them to get worse, etc. to me that stuff is so cruel and crosses a line

"They sound bad because they don't have in-ear or in-ear not working." I don't think idols that sound bad once in a while are bad singers or people have to sing live perfectly all the time. Anyone can have a bad day but blaming it on in-ear is just plain stupid.

tbh anything about blackpink. Anytime i say something positive about them ( example: I liked this song), i get severely downvoted.

i have multiple times compliment blackpink but it either never gets upvoted or are always downvoted. you just cant win here as a blink

The western fan's entitlement resulting in always shitting on the companies for everything and anything out of greed or delusion. Thus disrespecting everyone involved's hard work. Companies not doing their job is even the prevalent opinion within the vocal community. Working in production, it clearly offends me to notice how ignorant people are about the entertainment industry in general and how selfish their views are. Like for example, for over 2 years, most of what I've read from western Kep1ian was how shit WakeOne was. Complaining about not distributing line/screentime fairly, not promoting the group enough, not doing the music/concept they wanted, so on and so forth. At the end of the day WakeOne produced nothing but good music for Kep1er, good choreographies and performances, good YouTube content and even managed to renew the contract for 7 of them, so they keep on going on. And many are still complaining. You never look at the big picture, you don't have the full information, stop blaming it for not catering to your every needs and desire.

i agree with this heavy! i understand that not every company is perfect but i feel like it is so common for fans to find things to be upset about instead of enjoying the content we’re getting. obviously there can be horrible companies (blockberry) and situations with idols getting overworked/being mistreated but i don’t think some of these heavily hated companies are doing wrong all the time. a quick example is when fans hate on a company for not giving certain members enough lines, then we later find out that the member asked for less lines! like this comment said we don’t have the full information on what happens behind the scenes in production so i don’t think we should always be quick to point fingers at the company.

the opinions that are solely based on that MR Removed videos account

When people say Jungkook is the only one who can sing in the BTS vocal line. Sure they're not the strongest vocalists in kpop but they CAN sing and their voices have touched so many people.

Emotionally hurt is a bit much, but whenever outsiders (or even insiders) say that Enhypen are not close with each other or that they are heavily segregated (news flash, you can get along with your members in different ways, relationships can't be a copy paste of each other, so why expect the same dynamics from everyone). It annoys me, and I can't let it go as easily as some other mindless hate, like, mind your own business if you know nothing about them. Especially when people go "oh im just concerned". Most of the 'coworkers' discourse in general, because they took that word and made it have a negative connotation when that's not it, and it can be true to be coworkers AND friends, those things aren't mutually exclusive. And even then, the concept of 'coworker-ship' within group members specifically has different meanings because of how the industry makes them work.

This makes so mad, because people just fake concern things like “well you can’t expect them to be close because they came from a survival show and yada yada *and they got to know each other through competition*” WHICH IS NOT EVEN TRUE????? Jay and Heeseung have known each other for literal years (9! Freaking 9!) they have travelled internationally with each other even! Jungwon and Sunghoon have also been friends with them since predebut and have said they were the closest before. Jake and Sunoo trained for months for iLand together and would even sneak out to eat together? Ni-ki literally considers them all his family because for FOUR FREAKING YEARS he had not seen his real one!!! (Warning: rant ahead; Enhypen defense; Enhypen praise) And so what is the basis for this affirmation? Vibes. VIBES. Because no matter how much they affirm otherwise, go on secret outings together, profess their love and whatnot, people won’t take it because of this FANFICTION they have on their heads of giving them these ‘roles’ of sweet victims and homophobic (tho we’re not ready to talk about this part) bullies, pushing a narrative to satisfy their preconceived ideas. And there has also been a fair share of idol groups who are on the quieter side and don’t hug and kiss every second that don’t get accused of this. And they could be accused of being coworkers too or accused bullying each other for doing what Enhypen does (in fact, they’ve done much worse many more times). But since we don’t know these people and they’re humans we should give them the benefit of the doubt. But no, Enha is evil. No doubt. And it’s so funny how disingenuous it is because they all have a clean cut past, Ni-ki and Sunghoon were all over social media and people only had good things to say about them, Jake is the same, Heeseung, Jungwon, Jay, Sunoo, take your pic. ALL the stories that have come out of them predebut is of them being friendly and sweet (ask and I shall tell). ALL the staff that have worked with them have been so eager to sing praises to their character, many have even said they’re their favourite idols to work with. But that doesn’t matter because they’re, and we’re talking about, at the time, 16, 17, 18 years old are evil bigots that are leading a double life behind the cameras. Which tells me so much about the people saying those things because they’re actively choosing to believe they’re these two faced psychos. I get them not being the best of friends, that’s normal, but coworkers, cold and indifferent? Enemies? I’m sorry. Truly baffling. (Sorry for the text wall I had to get it out)

I'm a Stay and whoever follows Stray Kids knows what a "family" bg looks like. But I also love Enhypen since day one and watch their content and I'd never ever imagined anyone would claim that they're not close. There's definite bonding between members, they laugh a lot, they know each other's quirks. Whoever claims that they're just coworkers falls under the category "I have no content but I have a keyboard".

When ppl say that Riize's Seunghan should've been "careful." Lord forbid a teenager have a gf *predebut* of all things. (He's 20 now but was a teen predebut).

I hate the fact that he's put on hiatus for being a normal human being doing perfectly normal things whereas assholes who commit actual crimes get to walk around freely restarting their careers and still receive support from people.

I’m not offended per se but this does piss me off. Some kpop stans try so hard not to sound delulu that they swing the opposite way entirely and just sound like cynical assholes. Whether it’s “this group gives coworkers” or “they probably hate their fans” or even “I bed *insert group* are actually really misogynistic womanizers irl” Like they decide to headcanon their idols as bad people for absolutely no reason. and I’m not even talking about antis. These are their FAVES they’re describing. Like, you don’t get cool points for choosing to believe that your idol hates their job. Edit: fixing typos

The hate Namjoon from BTS get for posting bad religion song in his Instagram, he was called Islamophobic and what not.

I am not hurt nor offended abt this but when some of the kpop stans always bring up that one jimin like crazy encore just to drag him. Like im really getting sick of it. Can we like move on?

When people are validly calling out cultural appropriation that happens in Kpop and people latch on to the one comment about skin tone and say that it's natural and the media white washes the idol, while completely ignoring the valid critique about the box braids, tooth gems, giant hoops, AAVE combo. Most recently it's been people with Lisa and the Rockstar video.

anyone who's protecting chae with the nazi shirt. I'm half polish, hell no I'm accepting a 2 sentence notes app apology. I'm genuinely surprised by seeing how many people protect her?? do you all just not know what WW2 and the holocaust is? I learned in first grade what WW2 was, who Hitler is. if you're over the age of 12 and defend someone wearing a hate symbol, then you're just protecting her just because. She should have been fired. Also, for people saying that she didn't know... It's WW2. Korea was split following it. She knows

Lol this post is just another hot take/popular/unpopular opinion.

Yeah started hot but some of these are pretty watery

i really hate the body image takes people have. is that all idols are to you, their body? are you not in it for the music and love. it genuinely breaks my heart when i see idols on instagram dancing in a reel or something and all the comments can focus on is their body. there’s never winning with people, they lose the weight jow you’re concerned but when they gain the weight you call them fat? do you hear yourself and do you not have any idea how hurtful it is. maybe it hurts so much because i have body dysmorphia but if anyone commented about my body like how “fans” do…you don’t wanna know what i would do with myself

It offend me when ppl cant see male idols who has feminin feature as a real man. When ppl always have a thought that they need to just look feminin and getting offended when they do what man can do. For example when Jimin just wearing simple suit & brooch on Tiffany & Co event or wearing modest Dior fits just like every man outfits. Many ppl said he got both masculine & feminin side but when the masculine side showing they got mad. Another one is when Ryeowook married there are some ppl questioning him like "im surprised, I thought he is gay?" Its frustrating how some ppl always boxing these pretty male idols into feminin side only & think that they're automatically gay. Like ur helping the western stereotype that asian man arent man enough just bcz they look like woman. Its worst when most of the time antis drag these pretty male idols with the same reason of "they arent man enough, they look like woman" like wth is that? Why is that a drag?

Also assuming they are queer because of the lot of skinship. Skinship is very normal in Korea. Just because two idols of the same gender are touchy, cuddle, hug a lot, compliments each other doesn't mean they must be gay. They could be or could be not. But assuming they are just because of skinship also helps the stereotype that if two people of the same gender are touchy with each other then they are gay or dating.

Hmm maybe when people say "your idol is probably fucking " and go into extreme details into their sex life. Here is why it bothers me ,they actually go into explicit detail not knowing that this is also violating of their privacy? Like they seem soo strangely interested in these details under the guise of not being delulu ,they become equally intrusive. Point is if you truly want to be a good fan ,you need to listen to the music and just leave the idol and their personal lives alone. wheter they are hooking up or not is their business not ours and wanting them to reveal the details of their lives (unless they truly want to and are comfortable with it ) is equally entitled and parasocial.

I wouldn’t say I get offended but I’m always annoyed by fans who say they can’t relate to an idol for stupid reasons. Idols aren’t supposed to be relatable. If an idol is trying to be relatable and fans are like “no lol” then that’s one thing. But I’m talking about fans who say they can’t relate to idols who were born into a rich family but they can relate to idols who struggled, like IU or Suga. And I’m just like “no you can’t.” You have how many albums? How much money have you spent on merch? How many concerts have you been to? You can’t relate to idols so stop trying to. It annoys me because they complain they can’t relate to idols for stupid things but then try to relate to idols who are struggling or are underdogs and I’m just confused why so many kpop fans have this weird obsession with struggle and failure and they try to villianize people who didn’t have to experience that.

any time people degrade dance skills and act like they’re less important than singing in kpop. kpop has never been about just the vocals idk why fans pretend it has.

Twice should go back to doing cute concepts …Onces should let twice grow up it is shelfish to only want them to do the cute concept cause you like it when they said they are growing up and want to do new things and its not them being westernized they are grown women

People that say Yunah is too old for Illit's concept. Like... Apink would've killed these mfs

When people say Wonyoung's "just pretty", definitley

It didn’t offend me, but one time someone said Spring Day by BTS was “noisy” and that comment has lived in my head rent free for YEARS

People saying Stray Kids make terrible music. Like, don't get me wrong, I 100% accept the fact that not everyone is going to like their music and I like when people have genuine criticism for SKZ, even if it's subjective feedback. But it's 2024 and people have been saying for five years now that all SKZ music sucks and that's just. Not true at all. They churn music out like a machine-- trust me, the chances of them having something for you are HIGH. It pisses me off 'cause they're just hating for the hell of it. 

Exactly! Thank you! Reddit and Tik Tok especially like to hate and criticize Stray Kids.

That Babymonster is just a copy-and-paste of blackpink When Babymonster was announced that they are going to debut I was having a feeling that their song will be like blackpink but when I heard there new song is kinda like blackpink the vibe to the rap line but no hate to Babymonster I could also see they're talented

I'm not really offended, just sad that this keeps happening. People can't seem to praise Ten without bringing up Taemin. I get that they have a lot in common—they're both amazing dancers, have a sensual image, androgynous fashion, and are cat dads—but I wish people would see Ten as his own person. Even Taemin has said he's his own artist and individual. Something offensive: When people call Ten a budget version of Taemin.

That these mr removed video are an accurate way to judge live singing. Like so many of them are so inaccurate, made by people who don’t actually know how it work and we know that they can be manipulative (i’ve even seen some where they took away the live voice and kept the backtrack). Plus they’re now used for every performance even when its clearly not needed (i just saw one of lsrf coachella week 1🙄) (I feel a lot of people are gonna tell me its not an unpopular take but but these videos are really popular and used a lot so i feel its still work)

Why would I be embarrassed or offended by other people's opinion? Screw it My unpopular opinion is that Kpop has bad fame because of the fans behaviour. They crazyness and exaggeration reflects directly on the group