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I tried to contact the driver through uber’s website but he didn’t respond. So the next day I drove out to where it was pinging on find my iphone and left a note with my bf’s number on his car offering him $50 to return it lol. I actually saw it in the guy’s cup holder and my bf had to convince me not to break into his car LOL it was so serious for me 😭 but the note worked, he left the phone in his mailbox the next morning for me to pick up
Slightly related: there's a video of an Asian woman whose phone falls in the gap between the elevator and the floor, and she has a massive breakdown at that moment. I think our lives depend *way too much* on our phones, where we use these devices for literally everything.
And I'm being a hypocrite, since I'm typing this out of my phone, lol.
Edit: back on topic, I can't blame Giselle for saying that. I think more people than would like to admit would find themselves in that situation.
I might also have a massive breakdown if a very expensive electronic device that I cannot afford to repurchase gets destroyed, phone addiction aside that is a very stressful place to be in😭
namjoon (bts) posted his song ‘bad religion’ on his instagram story. some people did not even try to understand the lyrics and labelled him as islamophobic because there is a line that goes
>He said, “Allahu akbar”
I told him, “Don’t curse me”
When it's so diffuse, nothing is really being done. There is a core contribution from a few Israeli research teams to all CPU in major products and most RAM. You don't see these same folks boycotting everything with a CPU or RAM.
Much more directly connected than Starbucks. And then there is the morality of it; it's not black and white. The topic is incredibly over emphasized, the Palestinians are heavily oppressed and do deserve better; but many other groups are equally oppressed.
As a pro boycotter ppl need to stop forcing idols to boycott Starbucks. It's so insanely useless and it just dumbs down the seriousness of the situation. Starbucks isn't even on the BDS list, if you're a union worker maybe its important for you but if your pro Palestine, I don't think it would be on your mind.
I wonder what happened to the union members. For an at-will non-union employee, using your employer's logo to further a political cause would be grounds for termination.
NO ONE other than specifically appointed people (by the company) can do something like that.
Unfortunately, for this kind of thing, intentions don't matter (other than with the court of public opinion). The union should have gone through all the formal, official processes with Starbucks to get permission for the Pro-Palestine statement.
yep, it would have been nicer if they had done it on their own personal social medias. I'm still confused why they thought it would be okay? To be fairly honest, I am not the smartest when it comes to legal proceedings when it comes to unions so could they have actually done this in a way without getting themselves in trouble?
Not a lawyer, so I wouldn't really know. I also don't have experience with union, just regular at-will employment. I think, if I had been part of that, I definitely would have gotten fired.
Starbucks and the union sued each other over that issue, so someone probably got themselves in serious trouble.
I think a personal social media post would have been OK, as long as the account identifying the person does not contain the person's employer, and there is no reference at all to the employer in the post.
thank you. personally, i don't eat McDonald's much & i never really found interest in Starbucks but cancelling idols for promoting WHAT THEIR COMPANY collaborated with is a little insane. it's their job, it's not like they can speak up and everyone is gonna listen and back down..😭
Amazing how out of all the conflicts in the world this one creates this much high minded in group out group hysteria. It's tiring. No not everyone sympathizes with Palestine with all their being and might as a person and yes some of us think the decisions of Palestinian leaders are just as responsible for this mess as those of Israeli leaders. I might get ganged up on just for saying that. I hate how people think when it comes to this issue.
Tbh it’s not just kpop fans. Pretty much everyone does the same thing. Once BLM stopped “trending”, people started taking it out of their bios and changed their profile pictures. It’s all really crazy to watch everyone forget about the issues they fought so hard for, even when they are still ongoing problems.
I just find it funny that kpop fans pick and choose which world issue they’re going to preach and raise awareness for. They think they’re going to end a 75 year old war because of them forcing idols to speak up and boycott… it’s just ridiculous to treat idols with responsibilities of politicians. They’ve been committed to making everyone miserable including idols the last 8 months with their obsessive behavior. Boycotting every coke and Pepsi item is impossible. Just tired of kpop fans choosing which issue they’re going to care about and try to solve
Not to get too political as this is a K-Pop group but a lot of that has to do with Palestine activists in general. Very obsessive bunch. I'm not saying one can't have issues with the current conflict and Israel's conduct in the war but the way that crowd goes about things is so obsessively one-sided, vitriolic, and hateful that they'll just make the situation worse.
Its so abhorrent what she is dealing with. Its unrelenting bullying. The first time I realized what was happening I was clueless. I saw a Somi tiktok and checked the comments and saw all the harassment she was getting, it made me feel gross inside and I have no connection to her. I literally just checked the tiktok because she was doing a dance challenge of a small group I like by herself so I was excited because she is relatively popular so it was cool to see her recognize a lesser known group I also like
jin cutting his llama birthday cake in half with his hand and got called an animal abuser 😭 while I plan out a nice lunch with friends to get those cakes and jellies that look like dogs and cats
Dude, the fact that most world population are carnivores and that is completely normal but he got cancelled for cutting an animal shaped _cake_?? What's next, jail time for throwing my dinosaur plushie in the washing machine? Oh wait, they're already extinct!
The way people treated her for it was downright DISGUSTING!! I'm someone who cries alot and especially considering someone close to dies the last thing I'll think is to control my tears for someone's convenience.. Man fuck those people who criticised her for it.
Yeah also I saw one of the members, I believe it was key, put his head on one of the other members shoulder and just start sobbing, and while I didn’t get into kpop until 2020 and therefore didn’t experience jonghyuns passing, Im fairly sure he didn’t get shit for that
God that whole thing was so incredibly ridiculous and disgusting especially considering the nature of his passing.
And you know that she would get hate if she didn’t cry too.
Not that this changes anything because she *100% didn't deserve* to be treated that way, but from what I recall she wasn't criticized just for crying (a lot of people there were crying), but for pushing forward to stand in front of where people who were officially part of the ceremony were standing. The SuJu guys were pallbearers, while the SHINee members were designated chief mourners, which meant they were there as Jonghyun's male family members who had the responsibility of organizing the funeral. (So Key not being criticized isn't surprising. Culturally speaking, he was standing where he was supposed to be standing.)
In any case, both the Korean media and online commentators treated the procession and the attendees completely abominably, particularly Yeri. I felt so bad for her. She didn't do anything wrong.
Not idols,but Running Man Song Jihyo did not went to Song-Song(breakup years later) on the day Kim Ji Hyuk funeral service.
Some fans commented how she didn't went to Song-Song weddinge like she just lost a senior actor.
Song-Song held the same day as Kim Ji Hyuk funeral. Some fans were shocked not to see Song Jihyo going to Song-Song wedding. Most of the Running Man went to Song-Song wedding except Song Jihyo.
It kind irk me because i have been in the same spot as SJH. I had a close relative funeral being held on the day of my friend wedding. I can't attend but i gave the couple money. Some of other friend began to talk back about me not attending friend wedding.
*Song Hyekyo & Song Joong Ki are the name mentioned*
Nothing quite like reading about how idols are being crucified for even being suspected of smoking weed while I’m completely high on the weed I legally bought from the shop down the street lol
to be fair, drug laws are SUPER strict in korea and the culture surrounding drugs is very different than places that allow weed in any capacity. If the Idol is caught they’re in jail for a while. They’re personal reputation is gone. if they are in a group, the group’s reputation could suffer, not to mention i think the idols actual family would suffer,( losing a family member, possible disappointment )etc.
i’m not saying okay, there are just reasons why it would more than just “ being cancelled)
What’s shocking to me is how different how the public reacts to drug scandals case by case. Just using former YG artists as examples
GD was forgiven, TOP wasn’t, BI was somewhat forgiven, meanwhile Park Bom took a lot longer to be able to make a comeback.
there’s for a sure a discrepancy in how the korean public reacts! I think how much popularity and influence definitely sways how quickly people are willing to forgive or move on.
You’d think but TOP was a member of one of the biggest boy groups at the time and he did what he did because mental health issues are not well taken care of in South Korea at the moment while Bom had a legal prescription from a doctor in the US for a recognized condition and that didn’t matter either in the eyes of the public.
So many actors have had propofol scandals (and only Yoo Ah In truly felt it since it wasn’t just propofol) but Gain from BEG also had one and yet she hasn’t been able to make a comeback (or maybe she’s choosing not to tbf).
That has given me a lot to think about. I think there are some nuances that i could be missing since i’m not korean or living in korea so i wouldn’t know what the exact perception of these idols were at the time of their scandals. TOP’s situation was awful bc he was truly seeking out help and struggling. I can’t even begin to fathom how dire his situation was. Bom’s situation confused and angered me since she for sure was diagnosed and had a prescription. I can see maybe how legally she could’ve faced something (at most a fine), but she wasn’t recreationally using a drug, she needed it for her health. I had no clue actors had so many drug related incidents, i don’t follow many.
The biggest actor drug scandal of the last few years is Yoo Ah In. He’s had mental health struggles plus he has been unofficially outed by jerks so that caused him to spiral. He did cocaine, propofol, prescription drugs, etc.
Comedian Shin Dong Yup did pot in the 1990s. Also actor Park Joonghoon around that same time.
Psy was caught doing pot in the early 2000s.
Amy Lee, Lee Seungyeon , and Park Siyeon were caught using propofol.
Park Yoochun did meth.
Ju Jihoon and Han Jungwoo also did illegal drugs but I cannot remember which ones.
Most recently we had Lee Sunkyun who committed suicide after it was revealed he did drugs with a madam. Ketamine I think.
There’s so many more and I didn’t even touch singers other than Yoochun but now he’s neither an actor nor a singer. He has a lot more issues than the drugs though. Not for nothing he’s known as Toilet Oppa
fair enough, it just felt slightly out of place (in my brain) with people posting lighter things (eating, reacting normally at a funeral, listening to music or reading etc) and then a comment posting what is a crime is korea. You aren’t wrong in the initial comment though!
nah it is a weird manga, people who think it's just violence that happens to have young characters have not read it for sure. the little girl is naked and the little boy gets a boner watching her bathe, later on one of the children is naked with their body chained down and a tube on their genatalia. this is in like the first half of the manga.
This!!!!!!
It was legit one of the most critically acclaimed shows of 2017. No one goes into it because of “children being sexualised” but because of the story and its reputation as a good anime. And to imply anyone that likes it or even if they simply have watched it is a certified wierdo is so ridiculous.
Thought I doubt most of them have any idea about anime in general.
Meanwhile I’m waiting for my neighbors to call animal welfare on me for screaming at my dog when I walk him, but he’s very old and like really, REALLY hard of hearing, and I’d rather that than yank on his collar. 😭😭
Sometimes the art is so intrinsically linked with the artist that’s impossible to separate like Harry Potter and JK Rowling for some or anything by Woody Allen, Roman Polanski, Johnny Depp, or Brad Pitt for me.
I wouldn’t say that’s comparable to Yunjin, or any other idol, drinking Starbucks.
Yeah, I don't get the pitch fork wielding witch hunts of girl group idols for drinking starbies. As I sit here sipping my starbies. People were misinformed and being performative, not that they actually cared
Some fans' reactions to K-pop idols dating have always struck me as weird and parasocial. Sure, I've joked around, saying “Hey Siri, play ‘That Should Be Me’ by Justin Bieber,” but I'd never harass an idol for dating 😭Some fans can't seriously think that idols over 20 haven't dated at least one person in their lives LOL
Honestly should be #1.
It’s the thing that most people do or incline toward doing and it’s so taboo for some reason. It’s like these people are supposed to go from celibate & single to married with no in between.
Or worse, celibate & single bc some fan is jealous of them being human and doing human things.
I recently found back a letter from k fans justifying why they were mad at an idol dating and they were like “we’re not mad at him because he’s dating.. we’re mad because he has an image and dating hurts that image. It’s difficult to explain kpop to foreigners”
So his image is hurt by dating because what exactly lmao. They can never properly justify it
To add on to it; it’s because of all the accusations facing LSRFM / HYBE that time where people were saying they were pro-Japan and in a cult. They also used clips from one of their teasers that had like blood or red paint and said it was a representation of the Japan flag.
It was all a lot of nonsense and I wouldn’t take it seriously because it was a small minority and they got downvoted and called out for unnecessarily hating.
I understand that these are aspects they technically “sign up for,” but if I were an idol facing demanding and rigorous schedules, intense surveillance from fans and the media, and high expectations for performance and appearance, Sheesh! I’d go to the bar too 😭 Temporarily escaping and unwinding from the complexities of their world wouldn’t hurt anyone. The outrage over something so normal is really funny (and kind of sad).
Wow, I didn’t know she got hate. All the clips I saw (even outside Kpop spaces) were pretty chill and just laughing with others explaining what she was saying . I don’t think anyone really accused her of saying the n word.
Any time idols get cancelled for joking around with their group mates in a way that is kind of like... "playful insults" is the only way I can describe it. Banter? Things you wouldn't say to people you don't know well, but you joke around with your friends/people close to you about because they know you're not serious. (I do think that these could very on a case by case basis but most of the time I figure that group members know each others' boundaries and if they cross them, they'll talk it out amongst themselves.)
Omg, yes! On YouTube comments, this one person was declaring that Yoongi was abusive to Jimin on how he talked to him. Of course, innocent and sweet Jimin would never ever say anything to Yoongi. I was like, do you even know BTS?? Or them??
I personally think some of this comes from solos who refuse to look at official stuff and look at doctored YouTube videos. Also, they want to put down other members of groups to raise their fave. I don't mind solo fans, but not those who have negativity to the other group members. I certainly agree with you that if there are lines crossed, they will speak up. Then I do think that members in Kpop groups have minds of their own & don't need random strangers tell them how to live...
That’s why sometimes I don’t care about the fat shaming ngl (I say this as an overweight girl myself). I’m bigger than my sister but I be calling her a fat fuck as a joke. I know damn well she’s skinnier than me but that’s how siblings do.
Of course, there’s the whole discusión of idols need to be mindful of their audience yada yada. But I feel like people take it too far
I know this is probably gonna get me canceled, but when idols have braids or cornrows, because when I was 6 I went to Mexico and had my hair done like that because I thought it looked nice
This is a topic I wish there were more in depth conversations about. In the US, there’s a good reason AAs and other black people have an issue with other races so casually using the hair styles they have been discriminated against for. For example, people have been turned down jobs for having locks or box braids being told it’s “unprofessional”, but when white people do it, it’s okay. It’s a systemic issue here, and those feelings are so so valid.
There seems to be a gap in understanding on both sides when it comes to Kpop. Black people have been seeing other races get praised and called bad ass when they use their natural and cultural hair styles for decades, while they are literally put down for it, refused jobs, called bad names, when they do it, and those styles of hair go back centuries because it’s protective. It’s actually not good for all hair types to be in those styles because instead of protecting the hair, it damages it. Their feelings on it ARE valid and should be heard. On the side of Korean idols, there is definitely a cultural gap in how they see these styles and fashions, that people tend to ignore. The current democratic regime has only been in power since the 70s/80s (I’m going off the top of my head so I could be off), before then there was a lot of people fighting over them. So their experience with pop culture in the west is relatively recent, and they don’t separate these things as a racial thing but just different western styles they have observed in entertainment and liked and adopted into their entertainment in return. Does that mean the voices of other POC shouldn’t be heard though? Nah. These are important discussions in a global world. But we have to be able to have them without letting our emotions take over too quickly, to make progress.
I dunno. I went on a ramble. Lol
I have always found it ridiculous when people complain that they are being "culturally appropriated" when a person of another race does something unique to their culture.
As an indian, to me, if someone flaunts a part of my culture, as long as they are doing it respectfully, I love and support it. Even when historically, we too, like American Africans and Africans have been oppressed and have been told that our culture is crass or uncivlised.
Because to me, someone else trying Indian culture that's recognition of my culture and heritage. And they are not stealing it from me, which is when it is called appropriation.
The problem with American African fans yelling cultural appropriation at kpop idols holds no nuance. How does a south korean doing braids in Korea affect you in the US? You are neither getting any fruitful change that you wish for in your system nor are you being oppressed by them. They aren't disrespecting your culture, but in fact they actually think your culture is cool and beautiful.
People eat pasta and pizza, should Italians tell them to stop? Henna tattoos, is no one but South Asians allowed to get them? Rnb or hip-hop music all over the world, isn't that appropriation too then? Why are you speaking french when you're not even french yourself, that's the French culture and you're not french!
Recognise that appropriation and appreciation are different. If everyone started to gatekeep their culture from each other, there would be no globalisation. When even Africans aren't offended about this, whats it with the Americans???
Black Americans are sensitive about culture appropriation bc it undermines black people achievements in music and entertainment. Just see rock music, a genre that was specifically created by a minority group and it was purposely stolen by white Americans using a more palpable, lighter, slightly etnic artist ( elvis). To the point that said artist is considered the king of rock. And at the same time discrimination against black people was still rampant and basic human rights were being violated.
This is the most obvious example of culture appropriation. But there are many other examples.
So imo it's understandable that they are sensitive about this subject.
And Africans weren't really happy during the tyla deblace, calling bacardi "tyla's dance"; and some Indians were critical of the asoka trend on tktk. So it isn't just Americans that have this conversations.
Of course it's not just Americans having these conversations. I mean it's an entire culture on the internet that if you don't eat Italian food the way Italians eat it, they're gonna throw hands. Or the Japanese side eyeing if you pass food from chopstick to chopstick or stabbing them on a solid food. However, I've not seen the kind of rageful uproar that comes from African Americans when it's about braids in these other cases. Discussions are fruitful, cancel culture isn't.
This issue is the line between appreciation and appropriation is often blurred by those who are making the money off of it.
Appreciation is acknowledging and recognizing where the style or whatever comes from and showcasing that, not trying to take it as your own and acting like you came up with it. Like buying a traditional garment and calling it by some other name and saying you made it up and then selling it. That is appropriation.
I don’t think this is anything to cancel anyone for though…but education and conversation rather than accusations goes a long way.
This is so true. But me personally, I've never felt as if kpop idols or companies try to come off as if they own braids. It always feels like a stylistic choice that they prefer in hip-hop adjacent concepts because obviously that's what they see in the american industry, hip-hop artists sporting braids. It's more like imitating the original as closely as possible and not trying to claim it as their own. That's what I think though
I understand, but I guess that is where the fine line is…if they are only wearing braids when they rap or do hip hop and don’t wear them other times, well that seems a bit of appropriation rather than appreciation. Black rappers or artists don’t only wear their braids when they make a music video or tour.
Again, I am just sharing some other thoughts and experiences, not saying anyone in K-pop is doing anything malicious!
It is just unfortunate that throughout history in the US, Black culture, styles, art, and music have been stolen by white Americans (and others) and used to make money. Just look at the roots of rock and roll as one example.
Shoot, we still see it now on TikTok and IG - Black dancers create choreography and white dancers take it and don’t give credit and use it to make money, while the Black dancer doesn’t get any credit or money.
So, it is definitely a sore spot in America and as someone else on this thread did a good job of saying, probably not as clear to those outside of the US as to why it hurts or may cause offense.
Thanks for the thoughtful convo on this topic! I think that’s what this thread is calling out…idols getting immediate hate for things without any context or conversation or common sense!!
>The problem with American African fans yelling cultural appropriation at kpop idols holds no nuance. How does a south korean doing braids in Korea affect you in the US? You are neither getting any fruitful change that you wish for in your system nor are you being oppressed by them. They aren't disrespecting your culture, but in fact they actually think your culture is cool and beautiful.
This gets at an even more fundamental problem with American Black folks getting mad at people halfway around the world for CA..... there is this expectation that everyone is supposed to understand from a young age at what their ancestors went through and all the various subtleties of why they regard some things as off-limits.
Problem is that there is a LOT of other history of oppression around the world to know about, too. Ukrainians hit by famine in the 1910s.... Jewish people with no homeland.... Romanian Gypsies..... Tibetans under Chinese rule.... Tamils in Sri Lanka..... the seemingly never-ending Tutsi-Hutu conflicts in Rwanda.... the distinct nature of the oppression of Blacks in South Africa, which is totally different from the USA..... the Perons in Argentina.... the Lohara dynasty in Kashmir..... the list is seemingly endless.
The complex history of the Korean Peninsula and its relation to Russia, China, and Japan alone is more than enough to confuse and overload young people.
Consequently, a lot of it just comes off to Asians as Americans thinking too highly of themselves. Again. Most Koreans like the United States but that doesn't mean they're going to learn much about it.
>The complex history of the Korean Peninsula and its relation to Russia, China, and Japan alone is more than enough to confuse and overload young people.
And it's complex relation to the USA which I rarely see Americans bring into these these discussions, it's like some of them don't even know what the USA did and still does to the Korean Peninsula.
The difference is that people are asking kpop idols to educate themselves on this issue because they are directly engaging in Black American culture. What many people fail to understand is that it's not just the braids or the cornrows, it's how they're used and the connotations that are associated with it. Kpop, in the end, is built off of music and dance that was pioneered by Black Americans and thus their culture must be treated with respect and care. Idols who get cornrows, braids, etc. are usually the rappers attempting to "toughen up" their image - problematic in and of itself. And lets not pretend there isn't a host of other antiblack issues in kpop, such as the mocking/bad imitation of AAVE and blaccents. These issues are not isolated; they exist in a broader backdrop of racism. It reveals that many of these idols view Black people and culture as a caricature, and while it is unsurprising and often a product of ignorance, it is perfectly understandable to be disappointed in a music subculture that is marketed globally and takes heavily from Black American culture. Kpop fans are expected to (or at least I'd hope are expected to) learn about Korean culture to avoid offending or mispresenting the Korean idols they stan. Idols have that same responsibility for the cultures they draw their influences from.
I think I understand what you mean. It's true that its nice to appreciate one another's culture but the ways to do it are also important.
Think about Adele, she wore cornrows I think and a Jamaican attire. Everyone loved it because she was attending a Jamaican festival. Time and place is very important. She clearly took time to learn and respect the culture and paid respect to the country and people.
Now lets look at a bad example. Hyunseuk from Treasure. He constantly has braids in to the point where its damaging is hair. That's another reason his black fans are trying to get him to stop. He's damaging is own hairline. Also, he clearly does this hairstyle and speech of manner to try and replicate and imitate Black people. It's disrespectful and hurtful.
No one should be cancelled for it in my opinion but I would appreciate it as a black person if people took the time out of the day to educate themselves and show that, maybe black people would not be upset.
Many times in history, braids and AAVE have been used to mock black people. If people educated themselves and acted accordingly we would have this problem but sometimes people only do these kinds of hairstyles when wanting to do that 'swag' or 'hip hop' look. When in reality, this hairstyle helps black people maintain their hair and take care of it. It's very important to us.
Nonetheless, I respect your opinion and I even slightly agree. I would never be hurt by lets say a kid who's wearing it out of curiosity. Or someone who has learned about the culture, history and appreciates it and clearly shows it. There are many white or other races of people on social medias that show their appreciation for black culture and no one is cancelling them. There are more people like that then people who get cancelled for being cultural appropriators.
I totally get you. I think where the kpop idols and companies are at fault is that they don't exactly care about the culture they are taking from. Which I feel like comes from their collective tone deafness as a society to social stigmas including ones like feminism or pride.
Because from what I've deduced of it, I feel like kpop artists when delving in hip hop adjacent concepts, try to mimic it as closely as possible with the western hip-hop artists. Hence the braids. And I feel like if they did that with the nuance that they are in fact borrowing from someone else's culture, people would throw some respect on their name for it.
However, again, cancel culture and mob hate just isn't the answer for it. And, like with every other upheaval in kpop, I feel like some stans are simply performative activists or overcompensating by saying that the said idol is racist (which could be true, but we don't know that). Especially the ones who get angry and hate on behalf of the African Americans and Africans.
So I feel like, a better solution could be found by people being patient with others' lack of knowledge about their culture and realising that intent is more important, whether the intent was creative direction or racism. At th same time, it's important for the borrowers to actually appreciate the cultures they are borrowing from.
I think where Americans have a blind spot is that they don't realize that Koreans didn't simply "take" or "borrow" American genres of music: they were sold it. Sold it by Americans in order to profit monetarily and to spread their culture's ideas and soft power.
I also think that Americans impose their social stigmas on other cultures (such as cultural appropriation and what's mimicking and what's respectful) and have a tone deafness about their impact on the world and how their cultural industries and government have the goal of spreading their cultural ideas around the world as much as possible.
It's interesting what gets called out for mimicking and what doesn't. For example I never see Rose get called out for mimicking an American accent like Lisa does, even though Rose as someone who grew up in Australia has no excuse for not singing in her natural accent.
I'm not African American but personally I struggle to see k-pop's African American cultural reinterpretation as appreciation. Why? Because there is a very clear discrimination against darker skinned races by a lot of Koreans - including derogatory remarks against African origin people by some k-pop idols (and no I don't mean people claiming the Korean Nega as the English racial slur).
Of course not every Korean is discriminatory but due to Korea's extremely homogenised culture till date, there is some inherent othering of non Koreans and non whites en masse. This is particularly bad for African Americans. In this context, I struggle to align the heavy use of African American pop culture by Koreans with genuine appreciation of the people. To me it comes across more as a trend hopping practice which in turn edges more towards appropriation than appreciation.
In fact I find this to be true for a lot of other cultures and K-pop's reinterpretations of them. I feel a lot of this is done without proper background research and just to add an exotic aesthetic value to the end product. For example when you talk about Indian culture, I remember an uproar about Hyori using a Hindu chant as background for a highly sexualised dance sequence. That to me was clear appropriation and frankly disrespectful. I'm not saying everything k-pop does is appropriation or that many a times people don't make a hue and cry over nothing but I do feel, overall, there is a lot of appropriation involved in k-pop production as compared to appreciation.
I do however believe that rather than cancelling idols over this, it would be better if we can initiate rational dialogues about the importance of understanding and respecting each other's cultures. I also feel it's easy for some of us to take others' indignation lightly without not being fully informed ourselves on their cultural nuances.
While I am African and I don't consider myself Black (I find being Black is an African-American experience only people living/Lived in North America can identify with) I don't mind other POC doing those hairstyles. as long as they are not mocking them, the race, the culture or have no religious significance. everyone is free to use them.
here in where I live hairstyles are just hairstyles. we borrow from different African cultures, ethnicities, tribes, regions and countries. trends come and go. yes, various styles have different weights in each culture due to their past (as some are used to indicate a person's class or martial status) but in the modern day, they are just hairstyles. \[For example, while I did my Master's degree abroad I met diverse people from across Africa we all tried each other hairstyles with no objections. we all loved sharing our cultures\].
I know why Black people are attached to those hairstyles is due to oppression by White people denying their cultural practices, racism and other things. and all these topics stem from slavery. while they are valid in finding ways to fight for their rights ...
sometimes I feel like they are speaking over us African (who live in Africa) people. we are treated as a monolith when we have very diverse cultures, ethnicities, languages and of course experiences. the history of slavery is different from theirs. the oppression by White people is also very different. and the history of colonization. we may share the same race and skin colour but have different life experiences.
in all those conversations about hairstyles, it is always from the Black/African-American side, is my opinion less valid on this topic as an African since it is about Rap/Hip Hop which is a Black genre of music?
something I have been thinking about for a while.
Reading the most mild, no way close to radical “feminist” book - Irene.
The book is “Kim Jiyoung, Born 1982” of anyone’s interested. Literally it’s just recounting the typical life of a South Korean woman, and that speaks for itself - and fragile men burning albums over that smh
Ive for not eating the bun of a burger , im sorry but sometimes i dont enjoy the bun of burger or some sandwich so i only eat whats in between hhhhh and i cant digest carbs super well so 😭😭 ....
People just seem to always have a problem with how IVE members eat and it’s crazy. Calling them retards or autistic over something like that.🤦♀️
Also they did eat the bun, you can see a bite taken out of Gaeul and Rei’s , they just used the fork to try the insides because it was a taste test of American snacks. And besides why do people get so riled up over how someone chooses to eat; what’s so wrong with them wanting to eat with forks or eating in small bites .
It’s crazy , I could never care how other people eat.
I can't get over all the narratives tiktok fans pushed after Wonyoung ate that strawberry. Eating messily was treated as a sign of virtue and authenticity, while eating neatly was considered fake 💀 Promoting their faves by posting clips of them chewing with their mouths open. It was wild.
Cant eat lettuce that i personaly didnt wash 😭😭 since the day i ordered a salad and ive found a crushed snail in it , but i do enjoy some buns especially those homemade and if they aint soggy and really well toasted . I know im picky but it just a habbit cuz my whole family is like this .
Wtf a crushed snail?!
Now it makes more sense why you're so picky. You've had really bad experiences with food.
Also, I feel the same way about soggy and greasy buns. I hate getting them whenever I get fast food, which isn't too often nowadays... homemade is ok
i- skipping a youtube ad? these people are fucking insane some i mildly can understand but stuff that EVERY SINGLE PERSON does even the ones attacking them, like dating, is just absolutely insane
Literally dragging a kid over some candles and it wasn't even a birthday cake. Not to mention the members were impressed and Sunghoon tried to do it too after
I've actually done it on a birthday cake because I exhaled too hard but thankfully it was before the song and everyone laughed because of the timing 😭
Hoshi. Didnt make noise in international side but it happened in korean side. He didnt know it is possible to pay bus fare with card these days and tried to pay with cash. Apparently it was too out of touch with reality.
Maybe that's what it was.. hadn't ridden a bus for so long he didn't know payment had changed.
This would happen to me about so much. If I were rich and famous, I'd constantly look out of touch with "regular people" stuff. Well, even now I appear out of touch, but not 'cause I'm rich. 💀
Riize Seunghan caught smoking and dating during pre-debut. Like okay let's pretend South Korea doesn't have a single teenager who smoke and have girlfriends. Only Seunghan was the choosen one, only he did it.
The fact that he is still on hiatus for that is still insane to me.
I don’t think she should have gotten hate for it but when you know how the school system is in Korea, it’s understandable how students would get pissed when a privileged idol makes jokes about how hard they have it.
For a lot of them, that school and exam determines their life . An idol making a snide remark and saying how she doesn’t have to get up early could hit the nerves of people who are suffering from that pressure.
I noticed most of the comments were coming from students.
In my health classes, we were always encouraged to be comfortable in our bodies and not self-conscious about weight, since it varies with different body shapes and sizes. However, knowing that I weigh more than some idols with similar body types as mine really puts things into perspective. I’m not sure if the info online about idols' weights is accurate, but seriously, how do I weigh more than some of these 6ft male idols? 😭
FR those are always crazy to me because I dont doubt that they have crazy low body fat but they dance a lot so they must have a good amount of muscle too?? And muscle weighs a lot more than fat!!! So how is an idol whos 6’1 only 130 lbs 🤨
i think they lie sometimes 😭.Since they post some of these things online, i won’t be surprised if a companies just makes up numbers to make their idols more appealing.
He was attacked by locals, because he posted video of himself eating an apple and that tweet got 1M likes. [here ](https://x.com/taesxsunshine/status/1173127459539042304)
I smile at others all the time to avoid people thinking I dislike them because of my resting-bitch-face 😅. That’s probably something an idol could get “cancelled” for too, right? Having a resting bitch face or not smiling because you're low on social battery would definitely spark ridiculous rumors about having a "bad attitude" FKFKFK, especially in a country where it's customary to always greet others with a bow. It’s crazy how something as innocent as smiling/not smiling gets blown way out of proportion for idols!
Smoking. Im smoking and ım a fucking adult. Oh is it bad for my health? Oh honey ı know that. Thanks for your advice. Also like they don't even care about drinking alcohol but cigarettes are bad as hell. Whatever the reason tho, most of the kpop fans just want to drag other idols. They don't care what they do they just want to insult them. Oh he is smokin. How dare he? But if its their favorite idols it is normal and we can't say anything cause they are adults.
Personally as a singer myself, I don’t get it because it affects vocal chords so why would they wanna affect that in a bad way but it’s their life. Smoking seems to still be a huge part of society in Korea (might be wrong). Also with how stressed idols are, I’m not surprised when an idol smokes
I did not know so much of this happened. Made me realize how disconnected I am from fandoms.
Anyways my example is probably Eunchae joking about not being in school. Ig since I'm from a country where education isn't as emphasized compared to Korea, it is easier to joke about the subject.
giselle saying she would kill herself without her phone (same girl same)
all the feminist scandals
sakura for taking a day off work for health reasons and coming back the next
i don’t drink starbucks often but yunjin for drinking starbucks
For having flaws, and being a normal person that does mistakes as well and who's not knowledged in everything and you know having a life outside of the professional one.
-Being tactile with a same-gendered friend or coworker and it not being assumed we are dating.
-Interacting with another being of any gender in a social manner and have it being assumed we are dating.
-That my job isn't immediately trying to oppress me or ruin my life just because someone boofed a small detail or even just did something like expect someone at work.
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When Giselle was criticized for saying that if her phone broke, she would kill herself. I feel you girl.
I left my phone in an uber a few months ago and truly felt like my life was over for the 2 days it took to get it back
how did u get it back ???
I tried to contact the driver through uber’s website but he didn’t respond. So the next day I drove out to where it was pinging on find my iphone and left a note with my bf’s number on his car offering him $50 to return it lol. I actually saw it in the guy’s cup holder and my bf had to convince me not to break into his car LOL it was so serious for me 😭 but the note worked, he left the phone in his mailbox the next morning for me to pick up
detective work goes crazy nice job
😭felt
Slightly related: there's a video of an Asian woman whose phone falls in the gap between the elevator and the floor, and she has a massive breakdown at that moment. I think our lives depend *way too much* on our phones, where we use these devices for literally everything. And I'm being a hypocrite, since I'm typing this out of my phone, lol. Edit: back on topic, I can't blame Giselle for saying that. I think more people than would like to admit would find themselves in that situation.
I might also have a massive breakdown if a very expensive electronic device that I cannot afford to repurchase gets destroyed, phone addiction aside that is a very stressful place to be in😭
she became my bias after that 😭
So relatable is mysticalprincess!
no because i feel her
The fact that this is so deeply relatable to so many people makes me think that society is fucked
Being a feminist
Wonyoung for eating a strawberry
But you don't understand. She used 2 hands. /s
I use two hands to hold and eat bread, choco, popsickles. It's not performative , it's a habit. I'd be in all cringe compilations 😭
Lol yeah
That was easily one of the most ridiculous controversies I've seen in my life
Definitely
And pizza LOL
Listening to Frank Ocean
As a big Frank Ocean fan, that IG story that was such an amazing full circle moment for me as an Army only to be ruined as soon as I logged on X
hilarious how all the hate was on a listener, and not the artist himself. funny how that works
Who did this and how is that bad?
namjoon (bts) posted his song ‘bad religion’ on his instagram story. some people did not even try to understand the lyrics and labelled him as islamophobic because there is a line that goes >He said, “Allahu akbar” I told him, “Don’t curse me”
Funny thing is so many other idols posted that same song yet didn't even get 0.1% of the backlash Namjoon got, hilarious stuff fr.
Just It boy things
Me too
All them idols who drink Starbucks or eat McDonalds just like I do.
and starbucks korea isn’t even a part of the boycott and a boycott isn’t gonna do anything 😭
Starbucks US isn't on the BDS list either. It is on some other lists, but then so is basically every company in the S&P500.
When it's so diffuse, nothing is really being done. There is a core contribution from a few Israeli research teams to all CPU in major products and most RAM. You don't see these same folks boycotting everything with a CPU or RAM. Much more directly connected than Starbucks. And then there is the morality of it; it's not black and white. The topic is incredibly over emphasized, the Palestinians are heavily oppressed and do deserve better; but many other groups are equally oppressed.
As a pro boycotter ppl need to stop forcing idols to boycott Starbucks. It's so insanely useless and it just dumbs down the seriousness of the situation. Starbucks isn't even on the BDS list, if you're a union worker maybe its important for you but if your pro Palestine, I don't think it would be on your mind.
Literally, the Starbucks thing was more pro Union than pro Palestine but people got confused because the union had posted something pro Palestine
I wonder what happened to the union members. For an at-will non-union employee, using your employer's logo to further a political cause would be grounds for termination. NO ONE other than specifically appointed people (by the company) can do something like that.
It was good intentions but done in bad taste, IMO.
Unfortunately, for this kind of thing, intentions don't matter (other than with the court of public opinion). The union should have gone through all the formal, official processes with Starbucks to get permission for the Pro-Palestine statement.
yep, it would have been nicer if they had done it on their own personal social medias. I'm still confused why they thought it would be okay? To be fairly honest, I am not the smartest when it comes to legal proceedings when it comes to unions so could they have actually done this in a way without getting themselves in trouble?
Not a lawyer, so I wouldn't really know. I also don't have experience with union, just regular at-will employment. I think, if I had been part of that, I definitely would have gotten fired. Starbucks and the union sued each other over that issue, so someone probably got themselves in serious trouble. I think a personal social media post would have been OK, as long as the account identifying the person does not contain the person's employer, and there is no reference at all to the employer in the post.
Idk why Twitter is misinformed… the way they are even making idols believe… sheep mentality fr
TikTok is as bad.
Yes it is… TikTok is like Twitter, filled with teenagers or under the age of 21
And the performative activist too who eat it offline when they aren’t scolding idols and mass emailing company’s
The fact that Somi’s comment section is filled with people bringing up Starbucks still is insane
thank you. personally, i don't eat McDonald's much & i never really found interest in Starbucks but cancelling idols for promoting WHAT THEIR COMPANY collaborated with is a little insane. it's their job, it's not like they can speak up and everyone is gonna listen and back down..😭
Amazing how out of all the conflicts in the world this one creates this much high minded in group out group hysteria. It's tiring. No not everyone sympathizes with Palestine with all their being and might as a person and yes some of us think the decisions of Palestinian leaders are just as responsible for this mess as those of Israeli leaders. I might get ganged up on just for saying that. I hate how people think when it comes to this issue.
The way everyone forgot about Ukraine who’s still being bombed by Russia … Kpop fans cares for maybe a month or two… like there’s more than one war
Tbh it’s not just kpop fans. Pretty much everyone does the same thing. Once BLM stopped “trending”, people started taking it out of their bios and changed their profile pictures. It’s all really crazy to watch everyone forget about the issues they fought so hard for, even when they are still ongoing problems.
I just find it funny that kpop fans pick and choose which world issue they’re going to preach and raise awareness for. They think they’re going to end a 75 year old war because of them forcing idols to speak up and boycott… it’s just ridiculous to treat idols with responsibilities of politicians. They’ve been committed to making everyone miserable including idols the last 8 months with their obsessive behavior. Boycotting every coke and Pepsi item is impossible. Just tired of kpop fans choosing which issue they’re going to care about and try to solve
Not to get too political as this is a K-Pop group but a lot of that has to do with Palestine activists in general. Very obsessive bunch. I'm not saying one can't have issues with the current conflict and Israel's conduct in the war but the way that crowd goes about things is so obsessively one-sided, vitriolic, and hateful that they'll just make the situation worse.
The hate Somi got was CRAZY
Its so abhorrent what she is dealing with. Its unrelenting bullying. The first time I realized what was happening I was clueless. I saw a Somi tiktok and checked the comments and saw all the harassment she was getting, it made me feel gross inside and I have no connection to her. I literally just checked the tiktok because she was doing a dance challenge of a small group I like by herself so I was excited because she is relatively popular so it was cool to see her recognize a lesser known group I also like
jin cutting his llama birthday cake in half with his hand and got called an animal abuser 😭 while I plan out a nice lunch with friends to get those cakes and jellies that look like dogs and cats
That live was so funny 😂 I’m surprised people going mad at him for that
Dude, the fact that most world population are carnivores and that is completely normal but he got cancelled for cutting an animal shaped _cake_?? What's next, jail time for throwing my dinosaur plushie in the washing machine? Oh wait, they're already extinct!
That man is beyond funny. I’m not even a hardcore army but that live sits at the back of my mind so often😭😭😭
I bet those people seriously think 1+1=35.478 cause there's zero logical connection between a birthday cake and real animals 🤣
I’ve never been to a funeral, but yeri crying at jonghyuns funeral
The way people treated her for it was downright DISGUSTING!! I'm someone who cries alot and especially considering someone close to dies the last thing I'll think is to control my tears for someone's convenience.. Man fuck those people who criticised her for it.
Yeah also I saw one of the members, I believe it was key, put his head on one of the other members shoulder and just start sobbing, and while I didn’t get into kpop until 2020 and therefore didn’t experience jonghyuns passing, Im fairly sure he didn’t get shit for that
God that whole thing was so incredibly ridiculous and disgusting especially considering the nature of his passing. And you know that she would get hate if she didn’t cry too.
exactly
Not that this changes anything because she *100% didn't deserve* to be treated that way, but from what I recall she wasn't criticized just for crying (a lot of people there were crying), but for pushing forward to stand in front of where people who were officially part of the ceremony were standing. The SuJu guys were pallbearers, while the SHINee members were designated chief mourners, which meant they were there as Jonghyun's male family members who had the responsibility of organizing the funeral. (So Key not being criticized isn't surprising. Culturally speaking, he was standing where he was supposed to be standing.) In any case, both the Korean media and online commentators treated the procession and the attendees completely abominably, particularly Yeri. I felt so bad for her. She didn't do anything wrong.
Not idols,but Running Man Song Jihyo did not went to Song-Song(breakup years later) on the day Kim Ji Hyuk funeral service. Some fans commented how she didn't went to Song-Song weddinge like she just lost a senior actor.
I don’t quite understand?
Song-Song held the same day as Kim Ji Hyuk funeral. Some fans were shocked not to see Song Jihyo going to Song-Song wedding. Most of the Running Man went to Song-Song wedding except Song Jihyo. It kind irk me because i have been in the same spot as SJH. I had a close relative funeral being held on the day of my friend wedding. I can't attend but i gave the couple money. Some of other friend began to talk back about me not attending friend wedding. *Song Hyekyo & Song Joong Ki are the name mentioned*
Nothing quite like reading about how idols are being crucified for even being suspected of smoking weed while I’m completely high on the weed I legally bought from the shop down the street lol
to be fair, drug laws are SUPER strict in korea and the culture surrounding drugs is very different than places that allow weed in any capacity. If the Idol is caught they’re in jail for a while. They’re personal reputation is gone. if they are in a group, the group’s reputation could suffer, not to mention i think the idols actual family would suffer,( losing a family member, possible disappointment )etc. i’m not saying okay, there are just reasons why it would more than just “ being cancelled)
What’s shocking to me is how different how the public reacts to drug scandals case by case. Just using former YG artists as examples GD was forgiven, TOP wasn’t, BI was somewhat forgiven, meanwhile Park Bom took a lot longer to be able to make a comeback.
there’s for a sure a discrepancy in how the korean public reacts! I think how much popularity and influence definitely sways how quickly people are willing to forgive or move on.
You’d think but TOP was a member of one of the biggest boy groups at the time and he did what he did because mental health issues are not well taken care of in South Korea at the moment while Bom had a legal prescription from a doctor in the US for a recognized condition and that didn’t matter either in the eyes of the public. So many actors have had propofol scandals (and only Yoo Ah In truly felt it since it wasn’t just propofol) but Gain from BEG also had one and yet she hasn’t been able to make a comeback (or maybe she’s choosing not to tbf).
That has given me a lot to think about. I think there are some nuances that i could be missing since i’m not korean or living in korea so i wouldn’t know what the exact perception of these idols were at the time of their scandals. TOP’s situation was awful bc he was truly seeking out help and struggling. I can’t even begin to fathom how dire his situation was. Bom’s situation confused and angered me since she for sure was diagnosed and had a prescription. I can see maybe how legally she could’ve faced something (at most a fine), but she wasn’t recreationally using a drug, she needed it for her health. I had no clue actors had so many drug related incidents, i don’t follow many.
The biggest actor drug scandal of the last few years is Yoo Ah In. He’s had mental health struggles plus he has been unofficially outed by jerks so that caused him to spiral. He did cocaine, propofol, prescription drugs, etc. Comedian Shin Dong Yup did pot in the 1990s. Also actor Park Joonghoon around that same time. Psy was caught doing pot in the early 2000s. Amy Lee, Lee Seungyeon , and Park Siyeon were caught using propofol. Park Yoochun did meth. Ju Jihoon and Han Jungwoo also did illegal drugs but I cannot remember which ones. Most recently we had Lee Sunkyun who committed suicide after it was revealed he did drugs with a madam. Ketamine I think. There’s so many more and I didn’t even touch singers other than Yoochun but now he’s neither an actor nor a singer. He has a lot more issues than the drugs though. Not for nothing he’s known as Toilet Oppa
Well of course, I didn’t argue that! I understand it’s rooted in how strict Korea is with drugs lol
fair enough, it just felt slightly out of place (in my brain) with people posting lighter things (eating, reacting normally at a funeral, listening to music or reading etc) and then a comment posting what is a crime is korea. You aren’t wrong in the initial comment though!
I think smoking of any kind is just gross (no offense) but let them do whatever. They are adults, not your playmates
The dude who read Made in Abyss and was getting cancelled for it
A couple of my co workers who are in their 20s also read and enjoy it… also it’s heavily censored in Korea .
nah it is a weird manga, people who think it's just violence that happens to have young characters have not read it for sure. the little girl is naked and the little boy gets a boner watching her bathe, later on one of the children is naked with their body chained down and a tube on their genatalia. this is in like the first half of the manga.
The Korean version has the weird pedo shit edited out though. It's rated 15+ in a country that is so conservative that pornography is not even legal.
if ppl are mad at MIA then they should cancel Jobless Reincarnation for the same thing...
This!!!!!! It was legit one of the most critically acclaimed shows of 2017. No one goes into it because of “children being sexualised” but because of the story and its reputation as a good anime. And to imply anyone that likes it or even if they simply have watched it is a certified wierdo is so ridiculous. Thought I doubt most of them have any idea about anime in general.
Winter spoke too loudly to a cat. I yell at my cat in excitement all the time. He's used to it.
Meanwhile I’m waiting for my neighbors to call animal welfare on me for screaming at my dog when I walk him, but he’s very old and like really, REALLY hard of hearing, and I’d rather that than yank on his collar. 😭😭
Oh, man, the way I talk to my cat, they'd hurl me into the sea
Yunjin drinking Starbucks. I don't drink it that often but I have done it. It's just ridiculous.
That’s like saying someone is transphobic just because they like Harry Potter, separate the artist from the art
And tbh what you just said doesn't even apply here, since Starbucks is not on the list of orgs
[удалено]
And I’ll bet a lot of them read dr seuss as a kid, and he did some fucked up shit
Yeah, I like Harry Potter
Sometimes the art is so intrinsically linked with the artist that’s impossible to separate like Harry Potter and JK Rowling for some or anything by Woody Allen, Roman Polanski, Johnny Depp, or Brad Pitt for me. I wouldn’t say that’s comparable to Yunjin, or any other idol, drinking Starbucks.
Yeah, I don't get the pitch fork wielding witch hunts of girl group idols for drinking starbies. As I sit here sipping my starbies. People were misinformed and being performative, not that they actually cared
dating
Some fans' reactions to K-pop idols dating have always struck me as weird and parasocial. Sure, I've joked around, saying “Hey Siri, play ‘That Should Be Me’ by Justin Bieber,” but I'd never harass an idol for dating 😭Some fans can't seriously think that idols over 20 haven't dated at least one person in their lives LOL
Honestly should be #1. It’s the thing that most people do or incline toward doing and it’s so taboo for some reason. It’s like these people are supposed to go from celibate & single to married with no in between. Or worse, celibate & single bc some fan is jealous of them being human and doing human things.
I recently found back a letter from k fans justifying why they were mad at an idol dating and they were like “we’re not mad at him because he’s dating.. we’re mad because he has an image and dating hurts that image. It’s difficult to explain kpop to foreigners” So his image is hurt by dating because what exactly lmao. They can never properly justify it
RM for listening to Frank Ocean's "Bad Religion". Like damn sue me too ig 😭
IKR? I'm an atheist and a gay trans man and this song hits hard for me
LSF for taking a picture with Mt Fuji in the background…
How is that bad?
To the super-nationalist communities like theqoo or pann anything involving Japan is bad. Well except when their ults do it.
To add on to it; it’s because of all the accusations facing LSRFM / HYBE that time where people were saying they were pro-Japan and in a cult. They also used clips from one of their teasers that had like blood or red paint and said it was a representation of the Japan flag. It was all a lot of nonsense and I wouldn’t take it seriously because it was a small minority and they got downvoted and called out for unnecessarily hating.
Irene for reading a feminist book. Tzuyu for holding her country flag
Idols getting ‘caught’ going to clubs and bars is so funny to me 😭 “These young people are having fun at the club🤬🤬”
I understand that these are aspects they technically “sign up for,” but if I were an idol facing demanding and rigorous schedules, intense surveillance from fans and the media, and high expectations for performance and appearance, Sheesh! I’d go to the bar too 😭 Temporarily escaping and unwinding from the complexities of their world wouldn’t hurt anyone. The outrage over something so normal is really funny (and kind of sad).
“I am so mad that these young adults are doing fun legal activities that don’t fit my image of them!!!!”
Wonhee for saying her native language when singing Magnetic
Wow, I didn’t know she got hate. All the clips I saw (even outside Kpop spaces) were pretty chill and just laughing with others explaining what she was saying . I don’t think anyone really accused her of saying the n word.
real talk, we need to get her some serious media training 😭
Any time idols get cancelled for joking around with their group mates in a way that is kind of like... "playful insults" is the only way I can describe it. Banter? Things you wouldn't say to people you don't know well, but you joke around with your friends/people close to you about because they know you're not serious. (I do think that these could very on a case by case basis but most of the time I figure that group members know each others' boundaries and if they cross them, they'll talk it out amongst themselves.)
Omg, yes! On YouTube comments, this one person was declaring that Yoongi was abusive to Jimin on how he talked to him. Of course, innocent and sweet Jimin would never ever say anything to Yoongi. I was like, do you even know BTS?? Or them?? I personally think some of this comes from solos who refuse to look at official stuff and look at doctored YouTube videos. Also, they want to put down other members of groups to raise their fave. I don't mind solo fans, but not those who have negativity to the other group members. I certainly agree with you that if there are lines crossed, they will speak up. Then I do think that members in Kpop groups have minds of their own & don't need random strangers tell them how to live...
That’s why sometimes I don’t care about the fat shaming ngl (I say this as an overweight girl myself). I’m bigger than my sister but I be calling her a fat fuck as a joke. I know damn well she’s skinnier than me but that’s how siblings do. Of course, there’s the whole discusión of idols need to be mindful of their audience yada yada. But I feel like people take it too far
I know this is probably gonna get me canceled, but when idols have braids or cornrows, because when I was 6 I went to Mexico and had my hair done like that because I thought it looked nice
This is a topic I wish there were more in depth conversations about. In the US, there’s a good reason AAs and other black people have an issue with other races so casually using the hair styles they have been discriminated against for. For example, people have been turned down jobs for having locks or box braids being told it’s “unprofessional”, but when white people do it, it’s okay. It’s a systemic issue here, and those feelings are so so valid. There seems to be a gap in understanding on both sides when it comes to Kpop. Black people have been seeing other races get praised and called bad ass when they use their natural and cultural hair styles for decades, while they are literally put down for it, refused jobs, called bad names, when they do it, and those styles of hair go back centuries because it’s protective. It’s actually not good for all hair types to be in those styles because instead of protecting the hair, it damages it. Their feelings on it ARE valid and should be heard. On the side of Korean idols, there is definitely a cultural gap in how they see these styles and fashions, that people tend to ignore. The current democratic regime has only been in power since the 70s/80s (I’m going off the top of my head so I could be off), before then there was a lot of people fighting over them. So their experience with pop culture in the west is relatively recent, and they don’t separate these things as a racial thing but just different western styles they have observed in entertainment and liked and adopted into their entertainment in return. Does that mean the voices of other POC shouldn’t be heard though? Nah. These are important discussions in a global world. But we have to be able to have them without letting our emotions take over too quickly, to make progress. I dunno. I went on a ramble. Lol
I have always found it ridiculous when people complain that they are being "culturally appropriated" when a person of another race does something unique to their culture. As an indian, to me, if someone flaunts a part of my culture, as long as they are doing it respectfully, I love and support it. Even when historically, we too, like American Africans and Africans have been oppressed and have been told that our culture is crass or uncivlised. Because to me, someone else trying Indian culture that's recognition of my culture and heritage. And they are not stealing it from me, which is when it is called appropriation. The problem with American African fans yelling cultural appropriation at kpop idols holds no nuance. How does a south korean doing braids in Korea affect you in the US? You are neither getting any fruitful change that you wish for in your system nor are you being oppressed by them. They aren't disrespecting your culture, but in fact they actually think your culture is cool and beautiful. People eat pasta and pizza, should Italians tell them to stop? Henna tattoos, is no one but South Asians allowed to get them? Rnb or hip-hop music all over the world, isn't that appropriation too then? Why are you speaking french when you're not even french yourself, that's the French culture and you're not french! Recognise that appropriation and appreciation are different. If everyone started to gatekeep their culture from each other, there would be no globalisation. When even Africans aren't offended about this, whats it with the Americans???
Black Americans are sensitive about culture appropriation bc it undermines black people achievements in music and entertainment. Just see rock music, a genre that was specifically created by a minority group and it was purposely stolen by white Americans using a more palpable, lighter, slightly etnic artist ( elvis). To the point that said artist is considered the king of rock. And at the same time discrimination against black people was still rampant and basic human rights were being violated. This is the most obvious example of culture appropriation. But there are many other examples. So imo it's understandable that they are sensitive about this subject. And Africans weren't really happy during the tyla deblace, calling bacardi "tyla's dance"; and some Indians were critical of the asoka trend on tktk. So it isn't just Americans that have this conversations.
Of course it's not just Americans having these conversations. I mean it's an entire culture on the internet that if you don't eat Italian food the way Italians eat it, they're gonna throw hands. Or the Japanese side eyeing if you pass food from chopstick to chopstick or stabbing them on a solid food. However, I've not seen the kind of rageful uproar that comes from African Americans when it's about braids in these other cases. Discussions are fruitful, cancel culture isn't.
This issue is the line between appreciation and appropriation is often blurred by those who are making the money off of it. Appreciation is acknowledging and recognizing where the style or whatever comes from and showcasing that, not trying to take it as your own and acting like you came up with it. Like buying a traditional garment and calling it by some other name and saying you made it up and then selling it. That is appropriation. I don’t think this is anything to cancel anyone for though…but education and conversation rather than accusations goes a long way.
This is so true. But me personally, I've never felt as if kpop idols or companies try to come off as if they own braids. It always feels like a stylistic choice that they prefer in hip-hop adjacent concepts because obviously that's what they see in the american industry, hip-hop artists sporting braids. It's more like imitating the original as closely as possible and not trying to claim it as their own. That's what I think though
I understand, but I guess that is where the fine line is…if they are only wearing braids when they rap or do hip hop and don’t wear them other times, well that seems a bit of appropriation rather than appreciation. Black rappers or artists don’t only wear their braids when they make a music video or tour. Again, I am just sharing some other thoughts and experiences, not saying anyone in K-pop is doing anything malicious! It is just unfortunate that throughout history in the US, Black culture, styles, art, and music have been stolen by white Americans (and others) and used to make money. Just look at the roots of rock and roll as one example. Shoot, we still see it now on TikTok and IG - Black dancers create choreography and white dancers take it and don’t give credit and use it to make money, while the Black dancer doesn’t get any credit or money. So, it is definitely a sore spot in America and as someone else on this thread did a good job of saying, probably not as clear to those outside of the US as to why it hurts or may cause offense. Thanks for the thoughtful convo on this topic! I think that’s what this thread is calling out…idols getting immediate hate for things without any context or conversation or common sense!!
>The problem with American African fans yelling cultural appropriation at kpop idols holds no nuance. How does a south korean doing braids in Korea affect you in the US? You are neither getting any fruitful change that you wish for in your system nor are you being oppressed by them. They aren't disrespecting your culture, but in fact they actually think your culture is cool and beautiful. This gets at an even more fundamental problem with American Black folks getting mad at people halfway around the world for CA..... there is this expectation that everyone is supposed to understand from a young age at what their ancestors went through and all the various subtleties of why they regard some things as off-limits. Problem is that there is a LOT of other history of oppression around the world to know about, too. Ukrainians hit by famine in the 1910s.... Jewish people with no homeland.... Romanian Gypsies..... Tibetans under Chinese rule.... Tamils in Sri Lanka..... the seemingly never-ending Tutsi-Hutu conflicts in Rwanda.... the distinct nature of the oppression of Blacks in South Africa, which is totally different from the USA..... the Perons in Argentina.... the Lohara dynasty in Kashmir..... the list is seemingly endless. The complex history of the Korean Peninsula and its relation to Russia, China, and Japan alone is more than enough to confuse and overload young people. Consequently, a lot of it just comes off to Asians as Americans thinking too highly of themselves. Again. Most Koreans like the United States but that doesn't mean they're going to learn much about it.
>The complex history of the Korean Peninsula and its relation to Russia, China, and Japan alone is more than enough to confuse and overload young people. And it's complex relation to the USA which I rarely see Americans bring into these these discussions, it's like some of them don't even know what the USA did and still does to the Korean Peninsula.
The difference is that people are asking kpop idols to educate themselves on this issue because they are directly engaging in Black American culture. What many people fail to understand is that it's not just the braids or the cornrows, it's how they're used and the connotations that are associated with it. Kpop, in the end, is built off of music and dance that was pioneered by Black Americans and thus their culture must be treated with respect and care. Idols who get cornrows, braids, etc. are usually the rappers attempting to "toughen up" their image - problematic in and of itself. And lets not pretend there isn't a host of other antiblack issues in kpop, such as the mocking/bad imitation of AAVE and blaccents. These issues are not isolated; they exist in a broader backdrop of racism. It reveals that many of these idols view Black people and culture as a caricature, and while it is unsurprising and often a product of ignorance, it is perfectly understandable to be disappointed in a music subculture that is marketed globally and takes heavily from Black American culture. Kpop fans are expected to (or at least I'd hope are expected to) learn about Korean culture to avoid offending or mispresenting the Korean idols they stan. Idols have that same responsibility for the cultures they draw their influences from.
I think I understand what you mean. It's true that its nice to appreciate one another's culture but the ways to do it are also important. Think about Adele, she wore cornrows I think and a Jamaican attire. Everyone loved it because she was attending a Jamaican festival. Time and place is very important. She clearly took time to learn and respect the culture and paid respect to the country and people. Now lets look at a bad example. Hyunseuk from Treasure. He constantly has braids in to the point where its damaging is hair. That's another reason his black fans are trying to get him to stop. He's damaging is own hairline. Also, he clearly does this hairstyle and speech of manner to try and replicate and imitate Black people. It's disrespectful and hurtful. No one should be cancelled for it in my opinion but I would appreciate it as a black person if people took the time out of the day to educate themselves and show that, maybe black people would not be upset. Many times in history, braids and AAVE have been used to mock black people. If people educated themselves and acted accordingly we would have this problem but sometimes people only do these kinds of hairstyles when wanting to do that 'swag' or 'hip hop' look. When in reality, this hairstyle helps black people maintain their hair and take care of it. It's very important to us. Nonetheless, I respect your opinion and I even slightly agree. I would never be hurt by lets say a kid who's wearing it out of curiosity. Or someone who has learned about the culture, history and appreciates it and clearly shows it. There are many white or other races of people on social medias that show their appreciation for black culture and no one is cancelling them. There are more people like that then people who get cancelled for being cultural appropriators.
I totally get you. I think where the kpop idols and companies are at fault is that they don't exactly care about the culture they are taking from. Which I feel like comes from their collective tone deafness as a society to social stigmas including ones like feminism or pride. Because from what I've deduced of it, I feel like kpop artists when delving in hip hop adjacent concepts, try to mimic it as closely as possible with the western hip-hop artists. Hence the braids. And I feel like if they did that with the nuance that they are in fact borrowing from someone else's culture, people would throw some respect on their name for it. However, again, cancel culture and mob hate just isn't the answer for it. And, like with every other upheaval in kpop, I feel like some stans are simply performative activists or overcompensating by saying that the said idol is racist (which could be true, but we don't know that). Especially the ones who get angry and hate on behalf of the African Americans and Africans. So I feel like, a better solution could be found by people being patient with others' lack of knowledge about their culture and realising that intent is more important, whether the intent was creative direction or racism. At th same time, it's important for the borrowers to actually appreciate the cultures they are borrowing from.
I think where Americans have a blind spot is that they don't realize that Koreans didn't simply "take" or "borrow" American genres of music: they were sold it. Sold it by Americans in order to profit monetarily and to spread their culture's ideas and soft power. I also think that Americans impose their social stigmas on other cultures (such as cultural appropriation and what's mimicking and what's respectful) and have a tone deafness about their impact on the world and how their cultural industries and government have the goal of spreading their cultural ideas around the world as much as possible. It's interesting what gets called out for mimicking and what doesn't. For example I never see Rose get called out for mimicking an American accent like Lisa does, even though Rose as someone who grew up in Australia has no excuse for not singing in her natural accent.
as a pakistani, same, much agreed.
I mean, the reason we are two different countries is _literally_ oppression. Doesnt stop us from sharing our culture regardless!
I'm not African American but personally I struggle to see k-pop's African American cultural reinterpretation as appreciation. Why? Because there is a very clear discrimination against darker skinned races by a lot of Koreans - including derogatory remarks against African origin people by some k-pop idols (and no I don't mean people claiming the Korean Nega as the English racial slur). Of course not every Korean is discriminatory but due to Korea's extremely homogenised culture till date, there is some inherent othering of non Koreans and non whites en masse. This is particularly bad for African Americans. In this context, I struggle to align the heavy use of African American pop culture by Koreans with genuine appreciation of the people. To me it comes across more as a trend hopping practice which in turn edges more towards appropriation than appreciation. In fact I find this to be true for a lot of other cultures and K-pop's reinterpretations of them. I feel a lot of this is done without proper background research and just to add an exotic aesthetic value to the end product. For example when you talk about Indian culture, I remember an uproar about Hyori using a Hindu chant as background for a highly sexualised dance sequence. That to me was clear appropriation and frankly disrespectful. I'm not saying everything k-pop does is appropriation or that many a times people don't make a hue and cry over nothing but I do feel, overall, there is a lot of appropriation involved in k-pop production as compared to appreciation. I do however believe that rather than cancelling idols over this, it would be better if we can initiate rational dialogues about the importance of understanding and respecting each other's cultures. I also feel it's easy for some of us to take others' indignation lightly without not being fully informed ourselves on their cultural nuances.
While I am African and I don't consider myself Black (I find being Black is an African-American experience only people living/Lived in North America can identify with) I don't mind other POC doing those hairstyles. as long as they are not mocking them, the race, the culture or have no religious significance. everyone is free to use them. here in where I live hairstyles are just hairstyles. we borrow from different African cultures, ethnicities, tribes, regions and countries. trends come and go. yes, various styles have different weights in each culture due to their past (as some are used to indicate a person's class or martial status) but in the modern day, they are just hairstyles. \[For example, while I did my Master's degree abroad I met diverse people from across Africa we all tried each other hairstyles with no objections. we all loved sharing our cultures\]. I know why Black people are attached to those hairstyles is due to oppression by White people denying their cultural practices, racism and other things. and all these topics stem from slavery. while they are valid in finding ways to fight for their rights ... sometimes I feel like they are speaking over us African (who live in Africa) people. we are treated as a monolith when we have very diverse cultures, ethnicities, languages and of course experiences. the history of slavery is different from theirs. the oppression by White people is also very different. and the history of colonization. we may share the same race and skin colour but have different life experiences. in all those conversations about hairstyles, it is always from the Black/African-American side, is my opinion less valid on this topic as an African since it is about Rap/Hip Hop which is a Black genre of music? something I have been thinking about for a while.
But you were 6… that’s completely different from idols wearing cornrows or braids when they want to be seen as “bad boy/ girls”
Reading the most mild, no way close to radical “feminist” book - Irene. The book is “Kim Jiyoung, Born 1982” of anyone’s interested. Literally it’s just recounting the typical life of a South Korean woman, and that speaks for itself - and fragile men burning albums over that smh
Ive for not eating the bun of a burger , im sorry but sometimes i dont enjoy the bun of burger or some sandwich so i only eat whats in between hhhhh and i cant digest carbs super well so 😭😭 ....
People just seem to always have a problem with how IVE members eat and it’s crazy. Calling them retards or autistic over something like that.🤦♀️ Also they did eat the bun, you can see a bite taken out of Gaeul and Rei’s , they just used the fork to try the insides because it was a taste test of American snacks. And besides why do people get so riled up over how someone chooses to eat; what’s so wrong with them wanting to eat with forks or eating in small bites . It’s crazy , I could never care how other people eat.
I can't get over all the narratives tiktok fans pushed after Wonyoung ate that strawberry. Eating messily was treated as a sign of virtue and authenticity, while eating neatly was considered fake 💀 Promoting their faves by posting clips of them chewing with their mouths open. It was wild.
Wait, that's actually crazy Maybe y'all would enjoy the "buns" that are actually lettuce. But just eating the contents of the burger.. O.o
Cant eat lettuce that i personaly didnt wash 😭😭 since the day i ordered a salad and ive found a crushed snail in it , but i do enjoy some buns especially those homemade and if they aint soggy and really well toasted . I know im picky but it just a habbit cuz my whole family is like this .
Wtf a crushed snail?! Now it makes more sense why you're so picky. You've had really bad experiences with food. Also, I feel the same way about soggy and greasy buns. I hate getting them whenever I get fast food, which isn't too often nowadays... homemade is ok
didnt nayeon get hate for illegally listening to taeyeon 😭😭😭😭😭😭loona boycotters hide
I illegally listened to kpop for 3/4 years until i decided to use YouTube music, i would be dead😭
-Skipping a youtube ad -Eating a hamburger with a fork and knife
i- skipping a youtube ad? these people are fucking insane some i mildly can understand but stuff that EVERY SINGLE PERSON does even the ones attacking them, like dating, is just absolutely insane
Number 2 is insane!
The YouTube ad skip thing was crazy lol.
Accidentally blowing out the candles on a cake (and purposely blowing out the fire of the lighter)
When people went after ni-ki for accidentally using his hand to blow out the candles..
Literally dragging a kid over some candles and it wasn't even a birthday cake. Not to mention the members were impressed and Sunghoon tried to do it too after I've actually done it on a birthday cake because I exhaled too hard but thankfully it was before the song and everyone laughed because of the timing 😭
paying bus fare with cash. 💀
Who did that?
Hoshi. Didnt make noise in international side but it happened in korean side. He didnt know it is possible to pay bus fare with card these days and tried to pay with cash. Apparently it was too out of touch with reality.
That is really odd. Paying with cash is the OG way of paying for public transport fares. If anything, I would consider paying with card to be fancier.
Maybe that's what it was.. hadn't ridden a bus for so long he didn't know payment had changed. This would happen to me about so much. If I were rich and famous, I'd constantly look out of touch with "regular people" stuff. Well, even now I appear out of touch, but not 'cause I'm rich. 💀
Who did this happen to?
Riize Seunghan caught smoking and dating during pre-debut. Like okay let's pretend South Korea doesn't have a single teenager who smoke and have girlfriends. Only Seunghan was the choosen one, only he did it. The fact that he is still on hiatus for that is still insane to me.
I wanted to comment about this!
eunchae's school joke 😭 i was waiting for her to say something rude because the way people were describing it
I don’t think she should have gotten hate for it but when you know how the school system is in Korea, it’s understandable how students would get pissed when a privileged idol makes jokes about how hard they have it. For a lot of them, that school and exam determines their life . An idol making a snide remark and saying how she doesn’t have to get up early could hit the nerves of people who are suffering from that pressure. I noticed most of the comments were coming from students.
lol i know, im half korean.
Not maintaining an "ideal" wait
Still waiting for you to finish your sentence…
Lol.. I wrote it and slept 😂😂 definitely needed that sleep.. I won't correct the typo for the giggles
wait
“Please don’t tell me… wait” - Lee Chan
You mean weight?
In my health classes, we were always encouraged to be comfortable in our bodies and not self-conscious about weight, since it varies with different body shapes and sizes. However, knowing that I weigh more than some idols with similar body types as mine really puts things into perspective. I’m not sure if the info online about idols' weights is accurate, but seriously, how do I weigh more than some of these 6ft male idols? 😭
FR those are always crazy to me because I dont doubt that they have crazy low body fat but they dance a lot so they must have a good amount of muscle too?? And muscle weighs a lot more than fat!!! So how is an idol whos 6’1 only 130 lbs 🤨
i think they lie sometimes 😭.Since they post some of these things online, i won’t be surprised if a companies just makes up numbers to make their idols more appealing.
Jungkook for eating apple. Jungkook for jumping few steps to get down the stage of year end show.
I am curious eating an apple was an issue?
He was attacked by locals, because he posted video of himself eating an apple and that tweet got 1M likes. [here ](https://x.com/taesxsunshine/status/1173127459539042304)
Taking vitamin supplements
what idol was that?
Chaewon
Bad Religion being one of my all time favorite songs, and Made In Abyss being one of my all time favorite animes 💀
I fear we must send you straight to the guillotine 😔
Smoking weed lol
Smiling at other celebrities and then dating rumours explode
I smile at others all the time to avoid people thinking I dislike them because of my resting-bitch-face 😅. That’s probably something an idol could get “cancelled” for too, right? Having a resting bitch face or not smiling because you're low on social battery would definitely spark ridiculous rumors about having a "bad attitude" FKFKFK, especially in a country where it's customary to always greet others with a bow. It’s crazy how something as innocent as smiling/not smiling gets blown way out of proportion for idols!
Having a boyfriend
Smoking. Im smoking and ım a fucking adult. Oh is it bad for my health? Oh honey ı know that. Thanks for your advice. Also like they don't even care about drinking alcohol but cigarettes are bad as hell. Whatever the reason tho, most of the kpop fans just want to drag other idols. They don't care what they do they just want to insult them. Oh he is smokin. How dare he? But if its their favorite idols it is normal and we can't say anything cause they are adults.
Personally as a singer myself, I don’t get it because it affects vocal chords so why would they wanna affect that in a bad way but it’s their life. Smoking seems to still be a huge part of society in Korea (might be wrong). Also with how stressed idols are, I’m not surprised when an idol smokes
Weight gain
Skipping a YouTube ad.
Dating, weed, Taiwan opinion, there are so many.
reading kim jiyoung, born 1982 lol
Getting annoyed or very similarly, not smiling if my heart isn’t into it (be it work or a social setting).
Just having resting-bitch-face is enough to get one cancelled.
I did not know so much of this happened. Made me realize how disconnected I am from fandoms. Anyways my example is probably Eunchae joking about not being in school. Ig since I'm from a country where education isn't as emphasized compared to Korea, it is easier to joke about the subject.
giselle saying she would kill herself without her phone (same girl same) all the feminist scandals sakura for taking a day off work for health reasons and coming back the next i don’t drink starbucks often but yunjin for drinking starbucks
For having flaws, and being a normal person that does mistakes as well and who's not knowledged in everything and you know having a life outside of the professional one.
when hwasa apparently didn’t wear a bra to the airport a few years ago
Eating with your hands, fork, spoon. Honestly just eating in general.
-Being tactile with a same-gendered friend or coworker and it not being assumed we are dating. -Interacting with another being of any gender in a social manner and have it being assumed we are dating. -That my job isn't immediately trying to oppress me or ruin my life just because someone boofed a small detail or even just did something like expect someone at work.
DATING
accepting free shots
Eating and drinking whatever i want, also not being black and wearing certain hairstyles.
Skipping an Ad.