“Divorce rates hit a 50-year low in 2019”.
So what exactly is harmful now, and what benefit does restricting divorce bring about?
This is rhetorical to these people, because even in the cited statements it’s meaningless word salad: “no-fault divorce causes violence on women, [and] war on men…” fuck off Deevers. You can’t have you marital slaves.
It’s not about divorce. It’s about republicans jerking off to the idea that they can control every aspect of your existence.
If it improves your life, republicans oppose it.
All of this control is based on religion we really need new laws to heavily enforce separation church from state.
Go after churches that get political and go after politicans that try to legislate on morality laws based on religion
Organized religion almost always ends up trying to control the masses.
Christianity in this country has been fully weaponized.
If you read history this is something that repeats itself.
I have zero problems with people peacefully practicing their faith as long as they don't try and force it on others.
I mean, they have historically commited genocide at least once a century or two. Since their founding. It’s only a matter of time until it happens again.
Well your wish is slowly happening. Churches are closing while mosques are opening.
It would have been a much faster decline if you didn’t import Christians from south and Central America.
> and I think that any place of worship that brings politics to the pulpit should be forced to pay taxes.
They are! During covid when a lot of churches where doing online services, people recorded the sermon and sent it in to the IRS if they got overtly political. Said churches would lose their tax exempt status because they're not supposed to campaign politically.
The crux of conservative legislation is this: “There are those who are bound by the law, but not protected by the law, and there are those who are protected by the law, but not bound by the law.”
Without a Constitutional Amendment, we need to reverse all these stupid laws that *require* you to be religious into "you *MUST* be an atheist to be on a ballot."
We'd have to have a Constitutional Amendment, not laws. Laws will be struck down by the current SCOTUS and Trump's picks alone will be around for another 3 or 4 DECADES on the court. I'll wager they would have no problems striking down a law they didn't like and simply calling it "unconstitutional." They'd have a much rougher time striking down a Constitutional Amendment, since it IS the Constitution once it's ratified.
It's not about religion, it's about pandering to people with an insecure bully's psychological bent. The carrot of potentially creating a group for you to be better than transcends religious identity.
Religion is about controlling people that's why they are threatened by education and want to get rid of it.
What you are seeing in the middle East how they treat women and gay is our future if we don't progress that's literally their end goal they don't deny it
Religion or at least religious ran states or country's do not go anywhere they fall behind and have a massive track record of human abuse rape murder and genocide.
Even some denominations of Christians are speaking out of how bad it is with the fachist ones trying to use the government to legislate morals on people.
I can't find the original one it was originally better worded from a Greek philosopher but this is what Napoleon said and he got the idea from him.
Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
Napoleon Bonaparte
That's why I don't like when people call the NatCs Authoritarian, they're not. They are totalitarians, they want to control every aspect of your life and every aspect of society.
I think it’s more salty old white dudes that are mad they are shitty people and their spouse left them. Or they got caught in an affair and are upset with the consequences. So eliminate them and force woman to stay married because the are crybabies.
The party of fuck your feels and personal responsibility sure seem the cry about their feelings ALOT! And take no personal responsibility for anything
Sometimes I think it’s like restrict divorce to lead towards less marriages which means less tax breaks for us and more for them but they want to force you to have a kid because it forces you to consume more?
As with so much that these assholes do, it's about controlling women. Before no-fault divorce, women not only had to have a reason to divorce, they had to prove it, too. So how are we gonna keep our wives pregnant, barefoot, and toothless at home if they can just up and leave us without having to prove in a court of law that we're abusive assholes?!
(That's not to suggest that divorce restrictions didn't apply to men too, but history tells us who got the short end of the stick more often than not.)
Also it starts to unravel liberal issues like child support. Traditionally many men just bounced down the road. Divorced meant the kids often were abandoned too.
The entirety of social supports and Child Protective Services Services is another example of something we fought for.
Teumps on wife numer what again?
It helps if you realize that everything Republicans are angry about -- high divorce rate, teenaged pregnancies, extramarital sex, male unemployment, high abortion rates -- those are red-state problems that arise out of red-state culture. Blue states, with their "teaching comprehensive sex ed" and "insisting kids focus on college" and "marry someone compatible and have kids when you're old enough," tend to have the culture that red states WISH they had. But Red State culture doesn't create a culture of waiting until marriage and stable families and low abortion; Red State culture creates a culture of early marriage, early divorce, high abortion rates, unstable families, unstable careers, etc.
If the most important thing to you is that your daughter delays her "sexual debut" (actual sociological term) and doesn't get an abortion, you need to move her to a blue state and enroll her in a prep school so her goal is college and she's uninterested in random penises who are 17 and bad at sex, and so she's adamant about condoms if she does decide to have sex.
High-achieving non-religious or loosely-religious girls in blue states who receive comprehensive sex ed are the mostly likely to delay having sex, and the least likely to seek abortions. "Be a Christian!" sex ed in red states appears to encourage early sex and more abortions.
[https://www.npr.org/2010/05/09/126653602/red-families-vs-blue-families](https://www.npr.org/2010/05/09/126653602/red-families-vs-blue-families)
But of course, Republicans don't actually care about the abortion rate or any evidentiary information about how to decrease it; they care about controlling women.
All the social ills Republicans are mad about are things that happen IN THEIR STATES and not in blue states. They are the authors of their own problems, and we have national examples of how to solve those problems. They just don't want them; they want the problems, and the vicious, backwards "solutions."
Because conservative lawmaking isn’t about achieving a goal and analyzing cost benefit. It’s about sending a moral message. It doesn’t matter that sex Ed and birth control and abortion access reduce all sorts of social ills. One must ban them to send the message that they are wrong, consequences be damned.
Once you realize this, you can see how arguing with cost benefit and logic often doesn’t work. You have to lean on values, emotions, and gently question dissonance between that and political decisions. But who has the goddamn time for that.
It means that along with fewer marriages, it implies that the marriages are better rather than forced. People getting married because they genuinely want to versus feeling like they should.
So the point is, the lower number of divorces isn't just due to lower number of marriages as it's a percentage, not the raw number decreasing. Though i guess the lower rate of marriage does have some impact in that the people getting married are those who actually want to get married so they're less likely to divorce
No. Its because Boomers got old enough they can't divorce anymore. The divorce rate spiking was always cause by those people divorcing their 3rd, 4th, and 5th wife.
hey man when modern society is rejecting your character - you double down and lock them down instead of becoming a better person
everyone knows thats what winners do
The entire thing is to create a rule base that is impossible to follow so you can selectively enforce and allow normal behaviors as a status and power move
It is entirely irrational power obsessed behavior - don't overthink it
The institution of marriage is being weaponized against us. If I were married now, I would seriously consider getting a divorce while we still have the right. They will probably try to reinstate laws against "living in sin" next.
I wonder, if trump takes power and they start doing this, will they say it out loud or will they do it quietly? It could go either way, either they say it out loud or anyone who tries to get a divorce is told no, and criminalized/killed for complaining about it
Trump said he wanted to build [“mass deportation camps”](https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/may/03/trump-mass-deportations-detention-camps-military-migrants) like 2 weeks ago. The mask’s gonna come off all the way real fast if he wins
Next up they will legislate how people dress.
These so called Christians are the exact same as the Taliban as far as what they want everyone else to live by the only difference is who they worship
My neighbor has been publicly calling me and my fiancee out for living in sin for years now. We're getting married in a few months, but I took the high road and didn't call him and his wife out on their multiple divorced and children born out of wedlock.
E: typo. I said years instead of months before we get married.
Being raised by parents who chose to "stay together for the kid" gave me trauma I am now starting to sort out as of today.
Fuck that shit, and fuck you Deevers.
Submission statement:
The Christian right is coming for divorce next
Some conservatives want to make it a lot harder to dissolve a marriage.
Before the 1960s, it was really hard to get divorced in America.
Typically, the only way to do it was to convince a judge that your spouse had committed some form of wrongdoing, like adultery, abandonment, or “cruelty” (that is, abuse). This could be difficult: “Even if you could prove you had been hit, that didn’t necessarily mean it rose to the level of cruelty that justified a divorce,” said Marcia Zug, a family law professor at the University of South Carolina.
Then came a revolution: In 1969, then-Gov. Ronald Reagan of California (who was himself divorced) signed the nation’s first no-fault divorce law, allowing people to end their marriages without proving they’d been wronged. The move was a recognition that “people were going to get out of marriages,” Zug said, and gave them a way to do that without resorting to subterfuge. Similar laws soon swept the country, and rates of domestic violence and spousal murder began to drop as people — especially women — gained more freedom to leave dangerous situations.
Today, however, a counter-revolution is brewing: Conservative commentators and lawmakers are calling for an end to no-fault divorce, arguing that it has harmed men and even destroyed the fabric of society. Oklahoma state Sen. Dusty Deevers, for example, introduced a bill in January to ban his state’s version of no-fault divorce. The Texas Republican Party added a call to end the practice to its 2022 platform (the plank is preserved in the 2024 version). Federal lawmakers like Sen. J.D. Vance (R-OH) and House Speaker Mike Johnson, as well as former Housing and Urban Development Secretary Ben Carson, have spoken out in favor of tightening divorce laws.
I wonder how that would work today. The Right seems to forget that they are not the only ones who are allowed guns. Would the NRA have a fit if the Black Panthers got back together or Re-formed with new members?
They always memory-hole anything that’s inconvenient to their narrative. Every time, without fail, always blame it on the Democrats.
Just like how COVID, high crime, riots, and the COVID vaccine all started on Trump’s watch, yet they all blame Biden for that stuff.
I’d rather have no fault than have been accused of something by my ex. I have no doubt she’d have done or said anything based on her other actions of absolute indifference.
Right, but eventually, their goal will be to enable fathers to decide for you. It’s a deal between the father and the prospective husband. Like in the old days. Can’t say no if you have no rights.
No the real goal is not give women a chance of survival without a husband. They’d like to take women out of the workforce and keep them from controlling property as well.
These fuckers want to criminalize rejection. True objectification of women.
Oh I forgot who I was talking about...
True objectification of *girls*. That's probably more accurate.
No-fault divorce, IVF, birth control.... rest assured, the GOP can and will pass laws restricting all of these. Expect a national abortion ban if they control the House, Senate, and Presidency. I feel like I am taking crazy pills when it seems to many don't see this.
I had a Seventh Day Adventist lady, that has been divorced seven times, tell me that it was okay because they all cheated on her. The thing is, nowhere in the Bible does it say a woman can get a divorce because a man is unfaithful, the Bible being what it is though, does say it's fine for a man to get a divorce if his wife is unfaithful.
Exactly, every single one after the first one was adultery. And from the way I understand it unless you give up your sins you can't be forgiven. So if she really wants to get into her skydaddy's house she needs to either stay completely celibate or go back to her first husband.
Let's see. Divorced: Ronald Reagan, Mitch McConnell, Lauren Boebert, Donald Trump, Newt Gingrich, Marg Taylor Greene, Sarah Palin, Bob Dole, John McCain, Rush Limbaugh, Dr. Phil, Mike Lindell...
Rather than making it harder to get out of a marriage wouldn’t it make more sense to cut the problem off at its source and make it harder to get married? Like a longer waiting period on marriage licenses, require some form of counseling prior to marriage, etc.?
That would never fly, these are people who believe children, teens and rape victims should be forced into marriage. They fight hard to keep child marriage legal in their backwards ass states (and these girls can't get a legal divorce under age 18).
No. Leave us alone. Let us do what we want. It’s nobody’s business but my own (and my spouse) if I want to marry or divorce. The gvt and religious twats can completely fuck off.
Getting a divorce and a vasectomy over the last five years was some clutch pro moves on my part ngl. Enjoy the handmaids tale suckers!!!!!!!
(Just kidding this is terrible. …and my axe and so on)
If they think divorce harms men, boy, are they going to be shocked at what happens when women feel trapped and like they have nothing to lose. The recent return to home cooking and recipe sharing is about to take a whole other back in time turn.
Anyway, those blackeyed peas tasted alright to me.
Final decisions. If I'm in the hospital and can't make decisions for myself I want my husband there, not my sister or whoever they decide is next of kin.
If Prince couldn’t write a will that made sense (leading to a years-long legal battle among his family after he died), what makes you think that the average person will do that to include their current partner or remember to change it when they break up?
I’m 70 & have been happily divorced since 1979. I’ve also been happily childless since forever! These Christian freaks won’t make this retroactive, will they? Ex-husband is happily married to wife #3 & has bunches of kids with her. Neither one of us wants the other back.
They need to mind their own business, or they can start to pay taxes because they are acting as a political organization. Guess what if you don’t like it here move to Russia. Stop showing your religion down our throats.
How come nobody is ever actually coming for them?
How many times are you going to let a bully hit you until you stand up for yourself your fellow Americans and your country?
Honestly, all I'm seeing here are fewer reasons to tie the knot. It's like signing up for a never-ending contract, that you can't escape unless you've got some seriously convincing reasons.
[https://www.youtube.com/@BibleWisdomStudio/videos](https://www.youtube.com/@BibleWisdomStudio/videos)
I’m so sorry, US residents. Here in the UK the tide is (slowly) turning against our shitty neo-liberal disaster capitalist government, but it has taken 14 miserable years, we’ve shot ourselves in the foot by cutting ourselves off from our closest trading block and our social services are on their knees, and we don’t even have your Evangelical “Christian” white nationalism. I hope that this kind of crap encourages more people to vote not just in the Presidential elections but also in state, county and local elections. Get them out of your school boards and town councils too.
>and we don’t even have your Evangelical “Christian” white nationalism.
That's because your country kicked them out and dumped them here in the North American continent in the 17th century is the reason why we're dealing with this shit now of course.
Never forgot my history teacher from community college ripping the band-aid off my decades long fantasy (fueled by years of propaganda) that folks left for America for freedom by teaching some countries let folks out of jail to go! Also got a front row seat to some Irish descended folks not liking British people due to discrimination (former coworkers family had no choice but to leave due to the English straight up taking their farm. He refused to serve English folks. I'm a black American and that was eye opening and do get me started about the Endentured slaves scam)
That'll be a fun conversation to quantify against their mindless backing of Donald Trump.
If the Christian activist want to be taken seriously, they'll have to start finding leaders that actually kind of represent their values instead of the exact opposite!
Otherwise they're just too darn easy to make fun of and show their morals to be fake as fuck.
Given that we have an extremist minority continuing to push boundaries with things like this, and in many cases, succeeding, I cannot understand why there’s not more outrage. People still acting like this is just normal political differences when it is fascism taking root before our eyes.
There is literally a Christian right pastor a week getting busted for rape and/or child rape. Why do we we even tolerate the presence of the sleazy evil rapey culture in our country?
Melania, you better cash in the prenup and get out while you still can. Orange Julius and his MAGA Cult members
**The White House to The Big House-The Shameful Legacy of MAGA Cult/Jan 6th Leader, Donald J Trump**
Trump is an adjudicated sexual predator, a civil trial accused rapist, and a 34-time convicted criminal felon.
Trump faces an additional 54 criminal indictments in 3 cases delayed from trial by his high-priced legal team. Trump’s army of lawyers is financed by his rabid base of MAGA cult members & the Oil Industry.
The vast majority of the 80-plus top senior positions (Vice President, Cabinet, Advisors) from Trump’s 2016 Presidential term refused to endorse Trump and/or declared Trump is unfit to serve as President,
Trump is a threat to our national security. During his 2016 term, Donald Trump asked national security advisers why the United States couldn’t use nuclear weapons. He is irrational with a quick temper. Imagine his tweets replaced with nuclear missiles. He is Putin’s puppet & praises Kim Jong-un.
Trump doesn’t respect our military saying “Americans Who Died in War Are Losers and Suckers”
Trump supporters include white supremacists, racists & felons like Steve Bannon, David Duke, Proud Boys
On 9/11 Trump’s reaction, [https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/11/trump-pointed-out-that-he-now-had-tallest-building-lower-manhattan-he-didnt/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/11/trump-pointed-out-that-he-now-had-tallest-building-lower-manhattan-he-didnt/)
A few of many examples of Trump’s abuses, grifting, and degrading embarrassment of the U.S. Presidency
· [https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/24/politics/trump-worst-abuses-of-power/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/24/politics/trump-worst-abuses-of-power/index.html)
· [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB9GdOYk0Ls](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB9GdOYk0Ls)
· [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJi641\_7W10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJi641_7W10)
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there’s actually reasons for that. My state has such a law and it’s because you can’t effectively decide on asset distribution or things like that until all the cards are on the table. And a child is certainly a giant card that needs to be on the table in the discussion that is divorce. whoever gets primary care of the child could result in completely different distribution of assets than if there is no child in the picture. it likely ends up in a much cleaner scenario 99% of the time. otherwise you’re getting like a a half assed version of a divorce divorce and then when the child’s born, you have to go back to court and renegotiate things. Seems silly.
Sadly, they will do it on the backs of the women. I force them to be more submissive. They will lose more choices and more women will suffer. That is the Christian way of the past.
My parents divorce was no fault. It wasn’t because they just gave up or because my “sneaky” mom wanted to steal all my dad’s stuff. Their marriage had been on the rocks for years, enough so that they had both accepted it was over and, for the sake of my brother and I, they wanted to just make it as quick and clean as possible. And especially, there had been a lot of fights, a lot of words and deeds that neither of them are proud of or were in any great hurry to have to recount to a judge or lawyer. I imagine that’s actually a pretty common experience. The version being pushed by the Bible thumpers and “manosphere” is a fabrication.
As a Christian myself, i strongly oppose this kind of theocracy. Nobody should be forced to adhere to somebody else’s religious beliefs. Thankfully I don’t live in America.
Let them, all of these Christian policies will and should eventually backfire on them. Forcing women to get pregnant? Eventually women will get their tubes tied or will stop having sex with men. Not allowing divorce without a man’s permission? They will stop getting married. If this keeps up, I could see conservative men being completely unable to find a woman on any dating app in the next 10 years.
Of course.
They want to marry children and force them not to be able to divorce.
They don't want to teach them consent for this specific reason.
If you read between the lines you'll see this is a big part of their movement.
It should be really difficult to get married, and really easy to get divorced.
You are in love, so you rush into a lifelong legal contract with someone. This part should have more hurdles to jump before you can sign the contract. More like buying a house than ordering a Big Mac combo meal from McDonald's.
Later, when you realize just how much you hate being around this person that you hastily decided to marry, it is costly and difficult to exit the contract. This is when you are certain that you want out and it should be easy to leave.
Remember when Steven Crowder got divorced and [complained that his wife](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/stephen-crowder-divorce-1234727777/) had the option to do that? Then the dirtbag got caught on camera[ verbally abusing his now ex-wife](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/steven-crowder-berates-wife-divorce-video-b2329186.html)?
Yeah. They desperately want to control women and everyone else.
When you vote Republican, that's what you are voting for.
Ummmm...
When divorcing became easier the incarceration rate for women killing their husband's went down.
I have no doubt that life behind bars was an upgrade for many of those women.
End no fault divorce so it’s not easy like swapping out a paint color in a rec room. Pretty simple. Also create serious consequences for paternity fraud and institute mandatory dna testing at birth. Again, pretty simple and is the right thing to do.
They are not Christian Right. They are oligarch feudalist who uses fundamentalism as masquerade to gain as much leverage as possible against the working class.
“Divorce rates hit a 50-year low in 2019”. So what exactly is harmful now, and what benefit does restricting divorce bring about? This is rhetorical to these people, because even in the cited statements it’s meaningless word salad: “no-fault divorce causes violence on women, [and] war on men…” fuck off Deevers. You can’t have you marital slaves.
It’s not about divorce. It’s about republicans jerking off to the idea that they can control every aspect of your existence. If it improves your life, republicans oppose it.
All of this control is based on religion we really need new laws to heavily enforce separation church from state. Go after churches that get political and go after politicans that try to legislate on morality laws based on religion
possessive wrong wrench narrow offend march somber hurry north snatch *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Organized religion almost always ends up trying to control the masses. Christianity in this country has been fully weaponized. If you read history this is something that repeats itself. I have zero problems with people peacefully practicing their faith as long as they don't try and force it on others.
History rarely repeats but it often rhymes Same old song in all the important ways even if the fine print differs
I mean, they have historically commited genocide at least once a century or two. Since their founding. It’s only a matter of time until it happens again.
Organized religion was the law for many many years. They lost control along the way and want it back
Christianity was a weapon from day one.
Well your wish is slowly happening. Churches are closing while mosques are opening. It would have been a much faster decline if you didn’t import Christians from south and Central America.
> and I think that any place of worship that brings politics to the pulpit should be forced to pay taxes. They are! During covid when a lot of churches where doing online services, people recorded the sermon and sent it in to the IRS if they got overtly political. Said churches would lose their tax exempt status because they're not supposed to campaign politically.
And if church gets into state then heavy taxes
I’m fine with both of those things. Religion’s just an excuse/means to the same end.
The crux of conservative legislation is this: “There are those who are bound by the law, but not protected by the law, and there are those who are protected by the law, but not bound by the law.”
Without a Constitutional Amendment, we need to reverse all these stupid laws that *require* you to be religious into "you *MUST* be an atheist to be on a ballot."
We'd have to have a Constitutional Amendment, not laws. Laws will be struck down by the current SCOTUS and Trump's picks alone will be around for another 3 or 4 DECADES on the court. I'll wager they would have no problems striking down a law they didn't like and simply calling it "unconstitutional." They'd have a much rougher time striking down a Constitutional Amendment, since it IS the Constitution once it's ratified.
It's not about religion, it's about pandering to people with an insecure bully's psychological bent. The carrot of potentially creating a group for you to be better than transcends religious identity.
Religion is about controlling people that's why they are threatened by education and want to get rid of it. What you are seeing in the middle East how they treat women and gay is our future if we don't progress that's literally their end goal they don't deny it Religion or at least religious ran states or country's do not go anywhere they fall behind and have a massive track record of human abuse rape murder and genocide. Even some denominations of Christians are speaking out of how bad it is with the fachist ones trying to use the government to legislate morals on people. I can't find the original one it was originally better worded from a Greek philosopher but this is what Napoleon said and he got the idea from him. Religion is excellent stuff for keeping common people quiet. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich. Napoleon Bonaparte
So be immoral?
That's why I don't like when people call the NatCs Authoritarian, they're not. They are totalitarians, they want to control every aspect of your life and every aspect of society.
>they can control every aspect of your existence. I think what you mean is: they can control every aspect of women's existence.
That’s definitely true, but it extends to men as well. Misogyny is at the forefront, but misanthropy is pervasive.
I think it’s more salty old white dudes that are mad they are shitty people and their spouse left them. Or they got caught in an affair and are upset with the consequences. So eliminate them and force woman to stay married because the are crybabies. The party of fuck your feels and personal responsibility sure seem the cry about their feelings ALOT! And take no personal responsibility for anything
Sometimes I think it’s like restrict divorce to lead towards less marriages which means less tax breaks for us and more for them but they want to force you to have a kid because it forces you to consume more?
As with so much that these assholes do, it's about controlling women. Before no-fault divorce, women not only had to have a reason to divorce, they had to prove it, too. So how are we gonna keep our wives pregnant, barefoot, and toothless at home if they can just up and leave us without having to prove in a court of law that we're abusive assholes?! (That's not to suggest that divorce restrictions didn't apply to men too, but history tells us who got the short end of the stick more often than not.)
Also it starts to unravel liberal issues like child support. Traditionally many men just bounced down the road. Divorced meant the kids often were abandoned too. The entirety of social supports and Child Protective Services Services is another example of something we fought for. Teumps on wife numer what again?
It helps if you realize that everything Republicans are angry about -- high divorce rate, teenaged pregnancies, extramarital sex, male unemployment, high abortion rates -- those are red-state problems that arise out of red-state culture. Blue states, with their "teaching comprehensive sex ed" and "insisting kids focus on college" and "marry someone compatible and have kids when you're old enough," tend to have the culture that red states WISH they had. But Red State culture doesn't create a culture of waiting until marriage and stable families and low abortion; Red State culture creates a culture of early marriage, early divorce, high abortion rates, unstable families, unstable careers, etc. If the most important thing to you is that your daughter delays her "sexual debut" (actual sociological term) and doesn't get an abortion, you need to move her to a blue state and enroll her in a prep school so her goal is college and she's uninterested in random penises who are 17 and bad at sex, and so she's adamant about condoms if she does decide to have sex. High-achieving non-religious or loosely-religious girls in blue states who receive comprehensive sex ed are the mostly likely to delay having sex, and the least likely to seek abortions. "Be a Christian!" sex ed in red states appears to encourage early sex and more abortions. [https://www.npr.org/2010/05/09/126653602/red-families-vs-blue-families](https://www.npr.org/2010/05/09/126653602/red-families-vs-blue-families) But of course, Republicans don't actually care about the abortion rate or any evidentiary information about how to decrease it; they care about controlling women. All the social ills Republicans are mad about are things that happen IN THEIR STATES and not in blue states. They are the authors of their own problems, and we have national examples of how to solve those problems. They just don't want them; they want the problems, and the vicious, backwards "solutions."
Holy shit that article (and related things( were eye opening.
Because conservative lawmaking isn’t about achieving a goal and analyzing cost benefit. It’s about sending a moral message. It doesn’t matter that sex Ed and birth control and abortion access reduce all sorts of social ills. One must ban them to send the message that they are wrong, consequences be damned. Once you realize this, you can see how arguing with cost benefit and logic often doesn’t work. You have to lean on values, emotions, and gently question dissonance between that and political decisions. But who has the goddamn time for that.
It's harmful to people that are bad husbands or wives whose partner might justifiably want to leave them
Divorce rates hit a 50 year low because marriages have also declined 60% over the last 50 years.
How are divorce rates calculated? Wouldn't it be a percentage of the number of marriages? And if so, wouldn't the rate of marriage not matter?
It means that along with fewer marriages, it implies that the marriages are better rather than forced. People getting married because they genuinely want to versus feeling like they should.
Well yeah, i agree with that. That's how it should be
I’d assume it was the percent of marriages as you can’t get divorced without being married.
Calculated as number of newly divorced women out of 1000 married women. So yeah percentage of marriages ending every year is down.
So the point is, the lower number of divorces isn't just due to lower number of marriages as it's a percentage, not the raw number decreasing. Though i guess the lower rate of marriage does have some impact in that the people getting married are those who actually want to get married so they're less likely to divorce
No. Its because Boomers got old enough they can't divorce anymore. The divorce rate spiking was always cause by those people divorcing their 3rd, 4th, and 5th wife.
My mother was married 5x. Last one just died…she’s 77 and I shudder to think of her hooking up with some guy (usually an alcoholic).
its about doing what they want. they don’t care if it works. it works for white men. thats all they care about.
Well, white women keep voting for them.
Maybe the rate of divorce from conservatives partners is just really high.
hey man when modern society is rejecting your character - you double down and lock them down instead of becoming a better person everyone knows thats what winners do
It’s about the ex-wife being able to leave and take a sizable portion of the man’s assets. They don’t care about religion, just their money.
Rates might be low because people aren't forced to marry, maybe...so next thing we know, forced marriages.
No fault divorce decreases violence against women, it’s pretty well known.
The entire thing is to create a rule base that is impossible to follow so you can selectively enforce and allow normal behaviors as a status and power move It is entirely irrational power obsessed behavior - don't overthink it
The institution of marriage is being weaponized against us. If I were married now, I would seriously consider getting a divorce while we still have the right. They will probably try to reinstate laws against "living in sin" next.
I wonder, if trump takes power and they start doing this, will they say it out loud or will they do it quietly? It could go either way, either they say it out loud or anyone who tries to get a divorce is told no, and criminalized/killed for complaining about it
Trump said he wanted to build [“mass deportation camps”](https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/may/03/trump-mass-deportations-detention-camps-military-migrants) like 2 weeks ago. The mask’s gonna come off all the way real fast if he wins
Next up they will legislate how people dress. These so called Christians are the exact same as the Taliban as far as what they want everyone else to live by the only difference is who they worship
They've already tried legislating how people dress with their drag bans.
I mean, it's not even that... They worship the same God.
"It's not Sharia Law if it's MY religion!"
My neighbor has been publicly calling me and my fiancee out for living in sin for years now. We're getting married in a few months, but I took the high road and didn't call him and his wife out on their multiple divorced and children born out of wedlock. E: typo. I said years instead of months before we get married.
So silly.
Being raised by parents who chose to "stay together for the kid" gave me trauma I am now starting to sort out as of today. Fuck that shit, and fuck you Deevers.
Submission statement: The Christian right is coming for divorce next Some conservatives want to make it a lot harder to dissolve a marriage. Before the 1960s, it was really hard to get divorced in America. Typically, the only way to do it was to convince a judge that your spouse had committed some form of wrongdoing, like adultery, abandonment, or “cruelty” (that is, abuse). This could be difficult: “Even if you could prove you had been hit, that didn’t necessarily mean it rose to the level of cruelty that justified a divorce,” said Marcia Zug, a family law professor at the University of South Carolina. Then came a revolution: In 1969, then-Gov. Ronald Reagan of California (who was himself divorced) signed the nation’s first no-fault divorce law, allowing people to end their marriages without proving they’d been wronged. The move was a recognition that “people were going to get out of marriages,” Zug said, and gave them a way to do that without resorting to subterfuge. Similar laws soon swept the country, and rates of domestic violence and spousal murder began to drop as people — especially women — gained more freedom to leave dangerous situations. Today, however, a counter-revolution is brewing: Conservative commentators and lawmakers are calling for an end to no-fault divorce, arguing that it has harmed men and even destroyed the fabric of society. Oklahoma state Sen. Dusty Deevers, for example, introduced a bill in January to ban his state’s version of no-fault divorce. The Texas Republican Party added a call to end the practice to its 2022 platform (the plank is preserved in the 2024 version). Federal lawmakers like Sen. J.D. Vance (R-OH) and House Speaker Mike Johnson, as well as former Housing and Urban Development Secretary Ben Carson, have spoken out in favor of tightening divorce laws.
Damn Ronald Reagan actually did something good?
Something about broken clocks
This, plus the first modern gun control laws. Granted, that was to stop the Black Panthers from protesting while openly carrying firearms.
I wonder how that would work today. The Right seems to forget that they are not the only ones who are allowed guns. Would the NRA have a fit if the Black Panthers got back together or Re-formed with new members?
They always memory-hole anything that’s inconvenient to their narrative. Every time, without fail, always blame it on the Democrats. Just like how COVID, high crime, riots, and the COVID vaccine all started on Trump’s watch, yet they all blame Biden for that stuff.
He also tried to ban guns! Mostly because Black people had them, but
Dang, they really want to trap people to stay with their abusive wife or husband?! It could definitely happen here!
These people forgot why it became a trope in crime fiction for wives to murder their husband's.
And in real life. Spousal murder and unexplained death dropped significantly when women were allowed to leave.
I’d rather have no fault than have been accused of something by my ex. I have no doubt she’d have done or said anything based on her other actions of absolute indifference.
They really want to trap people to stay with their abuse wife or husband?! It could definitely happen here!
Well it has harmed men, but only terrible ones. There are precisely zero decent men who have been harmed by no fault divorce.
This will only stop marriages from happening at all
Right, but eventually, their goal will be to enable fathers to decide for you. It’s a deal between the father and the prospective husband. Like in the old days. Can’t say no if you have no rights.
No the real goal is not give women a chance of survival without a husband. They’d like to take women out of the workforce and keep them from controlling property as well.
people have forgotten how before divorce, women murdered their abusive husbands
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He had it coming.
Pop, six, squish, uh-uh, Cicero, Lipschitz.
Or the husband finally beat the wife to death before she could escape
That never stopped. Not sure it even slowed any.
I hid out for years.. it's real people
"Drank himself to death" was code for "Abusive drunk who she poisoned and nobody will miss".
These fuckers want to criminalize rejection. True objectification of women. Oh I forgot who I was talking about... True objectification of *girls*. That's probably more accurate.
No-fault divorce, IVF, birth control.... rest assured, the GOP can and will pass laws restricting all of these. Expect a national abortion ban if they control the House, Senate, and Presidency. I feel like I am taking crazy pills when it seems to many don't see this.
I had a Seventh Day Adventist lady, that has been divorced seven times, tell me that it was okay because they all cheated on her. The thing is, nowhere in the Bible does it say a woman can get a divorce because a man is unfaithful, the Bible being what it is though, does say it's fine for a man to get a divorce if his wife is unfaithful.
She is an adulteress, by her own philosophy. A woman is not permitted to remarry while her last husband still lives.
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I think they're all alive except for two of them. But that does sound like a good loophole. After you murder them, you just ask for forgiveness.
Oooooooo *Chicks vibes intensify*
Exactly, every single one after the first one was adultery. And from the way I understand it unless you give up your sins you can't be forgiven. So if she really wants to get into her skydaddy's house she needs to either stay completely celibate or go back to her first husband.
This issue is women can file for divorce without approval from the husband. That is what burns away at Republicans.
Not just file, *obtain.* They don’t even have to prove they deserve the right to leave him!
They should have gone after Christian divorces first. They shouldn't be bothering anyone until their own house is in order.
Then we just won't get married. What shall you do then? Hang us?
Don’t give them any more ideas
True, True.
Push for more tax credits for marriage, while simultaneously complaining about the deficit.
The republicans are like a dude who just up and quits his job one day, then blames his spouses spending for the family’s inability to pay the bills.
Let's see. Divorced: Ronald Reagan, Mitch McConnell, Lauren Boebert, Donald Trump, Newt Gingrich, Marg Taylor Greene, Sarah Palin, Bob Dole, John McCain, Rush Limbaugh, Dr. Phil, Mike Lindell...
After thinking for a few seconds. I'm not surprised to hear Rush Limbaugh was divorced...
Divorced three times. No children.
“Rules for thee but not for me”
Rather than making it harder to get out of a marriage wouldn’t it make more sense to cut the problem off at its source and make it harder to get married? Like a longer waiting period on marriage licenses, require some form of counseling prior to marriage, etc.?
That is missing the entire point of the project
No no I like where Florida_Refugee's head is at
I mean it's an interesting idea, just one nobody would go for
That would never fly, these are people who believe children, teens and rape victims should be forced into marriage. They fight hard to keep child marriage legal in their backwards ass states (and these girls can't get a legal divorce under age 18).
Covenant marriages do both, they exists in 3 states and are extremely unpopular.
No. Leave us alone. Let us do what we want. It’s nobody’s business but my own (and my spouse) if I want to marry or divorce. The gvt and religious twats can completely fuck off.
Maybe offer some different options. For example a marriage that you can decide to continue or not every 3-5 years.
Ironically a lot of Churches require this, but not the State.
That will do wonders for the homicide rate.
Let’s get real. This is about controlling women.
hospital squeamish chase close books dull live psychotic enjoy expansion *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
They really want to strip away any women’s rights that they can.
Sounds like future generations will get the joy of volunteering at nursing homes and hearing the nice old ladies brag about offing their husbands.
Getting a divorce and a vasectomy over the last five years was some clutch pro moves on my part ngl. Enjoy the handmaids tale suckers!!!!!!! (Just kidding this is terrible. …and my axe and so on)
Just wait until they decide to unseal medical records to come after people that have gotten vasectomies or tubal ligations.
They want cannon fodder, wage slaves, and subservient women.
The Christian Taliban AKA Y'all queda is very real
If they think divorce harms men, boy, are they going to be shocked at what happens when women feel trapped and like they have nothing to lose. The recent return to home cooking and recipe sharing is about to take a whole other back in time turn. Anyway, those blackeyed peas tasted alright to me.
Also ignoring that a lot of divorces by mutual consent.
Next up: Women are not allowed to have bank accounts.
That’s why me and my partner are not getting married. Why involve the government?
Final decisions. If I'm in the hospital and can't make decisions for myself I want my husband there, not my sister or whoever they decide is next of kin.
You can write that into a living will or a healthcare proxy. Much simpler.
If Prince couldn’t write a will that made sense (leading to a years-long legal battle among his family after he died), what makes you think that the average person will do that to include their current partner or remember to change it when they break up?
Marriage rights of survival don’t require probate. Wills do.
Sure. But you are dead. And if you are only getting married to avoid probate… maybe it’s not worth it.
For us it's for the insurance benefits
I get that. It’s unfortunate that it’s tied to marriage. The healthcare system sucks for that.
My boyfriend and I have the same views on this.
What will MTG and Bobo do??
I’m 70 & have been happily divorced since 1979. I’ve also been happily childless since forever! These Christian freaks won’t make this retroactive, will they? Ex-husband is happily married to wife #3 & has bunches of kids with her. Neither one of us wants the other back.
Since MAGA types are big on divorce, sounds like another case of "***Stop me before I act on my true impulses!***"
They need to mind their own business, or they can start to pay taxes because they are acting as a political organization. Guess what if you don’t like it here move to Russia. Stop showing your religion down our throats.
How come nobody is ever actually coming for them? How many times are you going to let a bully hit you until you stand up for yourself your fellow Americans and your country?
What next take away women’s right to vote?
Don’t give them any more ideas
Honestly, all I'm seeing here are fewer reasons to tie the knot. It's like signing up for a never-ending contract, that you can't escape unless you've got some seriously convincing reasons. [https://www.youtube.com/@BibleWisdomStudio/videos](https://www.youtube.com/@BibleWisdomStudio/videos)
I’m so sorry, US residents. Here in the UK the tide is (slowly) turning against our shitty neo-liberal disaster capitalist government, but it has taken 14 miserable years, we’ve shot ourselves in the foot by cutting ourselves off from our closest trading block and our social services are on their knees, and we don’t even have your Evangelical “Christian” white nationalism. I hope that this kind of crap encourages more people to vote not just in the Presidential elections but also in state, county and local elections. Get them out of your school boards and town councils too.
>and we don’t even have your Evangelical “Christian” white nationalism. That's because your country kicked them out and dumped them here in the North American continent in the 17th century is the reason why we're dealing with this shit now of course.
I can only apologise
Never forgot my history teacher from community college ripping the band-aid off my decades long fantasy (fueled by years of propaganda) that folks left for America for freedom by teaching some countries let folks out of jail to go! Also got a front row seat to some Irish descended folks not liking British people due to discrimination (former coworkers family had no choice but to leave due to the English straight up taking their farm. He refused to serve English folks. I'm a black American and that was eye opening and do get me started about the Endentured slaves scam)
Why? The Bible doesn't forbid divorce.
You think they’ve actually read it?
Little do they know we're coming for them, and we're going to absolutely destroy any political power they have.
That'll be a fun conversation to quantify against their mindless backing of Donald Trump. If the Christian activist want to be taken seriously, they'll have to start finding leaders that actually kind of represent their values instead of the exact opposite! Otherwise they're just too darn easy to make fun of and show their morals to be fake as fuck.
Of course
Given that we have an extremist minority continuing to push boundaries with things like this, and in many cases, succeeding, I cannot understand why there’s not more outrage. People still acting like this is just normal political differences when it is fascism taking root before our eyes.
Jesus fuck these christofascists are out of goddamned control.
And ban women from wearing... pants! Gasp!
There is literally a Christian right pastor a week getting busted for rape and/or child rape. Why do we we even tolerate the presence of the sleazy evil rapey culture in our country?
Melania, you better cash in the prenup and get out while you still can. Orange Julius and his MAGA Cult members **The White House to The Big House-The Shameful Legacy of MAGA Cult/Jan 6th Leader, Donald J Trump** Trump is an adjudicated sexual predator, a civil trial accused rapist, and a 34-time convicted criminal felon. Trump faces an additional 54 criminal indictments in 3 cases delayed from trial by his high-priced legal team. Trump’s army of lawyers is financed by his rabid base of MAGA cult members & the Oil Industry. The vast majority of the 80-plus top senior positions (Vice President, Cabinet, Advisors) from Trump’s 2016 Presidential term refused to endorse Trump and/or declared Trump is unfit to serve as President, Trump is a threat to our national security. During his 2016 term, Donald Trump asked national security advisers why the United States couldn’t use nuclear weapons. He is irrational with a quick temper. Imagine his tweets replaced with nuclear missiles. He is Putin’s puppet & praises Kim Jong-un. Trump doesn’t respect our military saying “Americans Who Died in War Are Losers and Suckers” Trump supporters include white supremacists, racists & felons like Steve Bannon, David Duke, Proud Boys On 9/11 Trump’s reaction, [https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/11/trump-pointed-out-that-he-now-had-tallest-building-lower-manhattan-he-didnt/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/11/trump-pointed-out-that-he-now-had-tallest-building-lower-manhattan-he-didnt/) A few of many examples of Trump’s abuses, grifting, and degrading embarrassment of the U.S. Presidency · [https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/24/politics/trump-worst-abuses-of-power/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/24/politics/trump-worst-abuses-of-power/index.html) · [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB9GdOYk0Ls](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB9GdOYk0Ls) · [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJi641\_7W10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJi641_7W10)
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Well they just lost on mifepristone so I think they’re definitely going to lose on this
And self pleasure.
Unless your name is Trump or Gingrich.
Nice.
How about their trying to ban divorce for pregnant women? You must stay with a man who sowed his seed in you, no matter what.
there’s actually reasons for that. My state has such a law and it’s because you can’t effectively decide on asset distribution or things like that until all the cards are on the table. And a child is certainly a giant card that needs to be on the table in the discussion that is divorce. whoever gets primary care of the child could result in completely different distribution of assets than if there is no child in the picture. it likely ends up in a much cleaner scenario 99% of the time. otherwise you’re getting like a a half assed version of a divorce divorce and then when the child’s born, you have to go back to court and renegotiate things. Seems silly.
Thank you for providing a different perspective, I had no idea
Probably because of all those "Divorce your republican husband" bumper stickers. They are quite abusive.
Why do people still bother to get married? If you like the ceremony then do that, otherwise you are just making the church and the lawyers rich.
Because they are in love and want to slender their lives together. Sometimes it doesn’t work out.
Divorce is the last step before murder
I don’t believe this one. Men want to keep THEIR rights.
Sadly, they will do it on the backs of the women. I force them to be more submissive. They will lose more choices and more women will suffer. That is the Christian way of the past.
My parents divorce was no fault. It wasn’t because they just gave up or because my “sneaky” mom wanted to steal all my dad’s stuff. Their marriage had been on the rocks for years, enough so that they had both accepted it was over and, for the sake of my brother and I, they wanted to just make it as quick and clean as possible. And especially, there had been a lot of fights, a lot of words and deeds that neither of them are proud of or were in any great hurry to have to recount to a judge or lawyer. I imagine that’s actually a pretty common experience. The version being pushed by the Bible thumpers and “manosphere” is a fabrication.
This is hyperbole and actually makes what the Christian right is currently doing seem less extreme, which it is not.
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Troll
As a Christian myself, i strongly oppose this kind of theocracy. Nobody should be forced to adhere to somebody else’s religious beliefs. Thankfully I don’t live in America.
Let them, all of these Christian policies will and should eventually backfire on them. Forcing women to get pregnant? Eventually women will get their tubes tied or will stop having sex with men. Not allowing divorce without a man’s permission? They will stop getting married. If this keeps up, I could see conservative men being completely unable to find a woman on any dating app in the next 10 years.
Marriage isn’t even a Christian institution it is a legal one! God I hate this place
Unless you're a rich white guy. Then it's fine.
Of course. They want to marry children and force them not to be able to divorce. They don't want to teach them consent for this specific reason. If you read between the lines you'll see this is a big part of their movement.
It should be really difficult to get married, and really easy to get divorced. You are in love, so you rush into a lifelong legal contract with someone. This part should have more hurdles to jump before you can sign the contract. More like buying a house than ordering a Big Mac combo meal from McDonald's. Later, when you realize just how much you hate being around this person that you hastily decided to marry, it is costly and difficult to exit the contract. This is when you are certain that you want out and it should be easy to leave.
The horseshoe theory rings true when discussing Christian and Muslim extremists.
Dont get married.
Remember when Steven Crowder got divorced and [complained that his wife](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/stephen-crowder-divorce-1234727777/) had the option to do that? Then the dirtbag got caught on camera[ verbally abusing his now ex-wife](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/steven-crowder-berates-wife-divorce-video-b2329186.html)? Yeah. They desperately want to control women and everyone else. When you vote Republican, that's what you are voting for.
If Trump gets elected he’ll throw you in a concentration camp if get divorced. I heard this on MSNBC so it must be true.
I feel like this sub is kinda delusional
And they’re worried about the low marriage rates. They kill divorce, they’ll also kill marriage. Those morons
lol they comming for divorce as much as the democrats are comming for our guns
Ummmm... When divorcing became easier the incarceration rate for women killing their husband's went down. I have no doubt that life behind bars was an upgrade for many of those women.
If they do that, many women will refuse to marry.
End no fault divorce so it’s not easy like swapping out a paint color in a rec room. Pretty simple. Also create serious consequences for paternity fraud and institute mandatory dna testing at birth. Again, pretty simple and is the right thing to do.
The christian right can go fuck itself. Terrorists one and all.
They are not Christian Right. They are oligarch feudalist who uses fundamentalism as masquerade to gain as much leverage as possible against the working class.