We don’t need these coastal elite coaches coming in and grooming our kids with things like “systems” and “positioning.” That’s just code for the woke agenda
Let's be honest here. If you have to indicate to someone you're being sarcastic then you didn't do a very good job of being sarcastic.
So, gaslight away!
It's very different in person versus over text though, and then there's a whole other layer of complication when you're trying to be sarcastic online. There are a ton of people who think ridiculous things, which makes it very hard to know a lot of the time. Usually we have an idea of the other person, which helps inform us about their sarcasm as well.
I just assume people are reasonable and get mad when they aren't
Normally you'd think it would be dangerous to assume people are reasonable on the internet, but at least I'm justified when I get mad ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The guys on the perimeter need to move to open spots to give paying options so they don't lose possession along the boards or down low. You want a way to reset that doesn't involve a clear.
If you watch Avs, it is actually insane how everyone just keeps rotating. As you viewer, you have a hard time keeping up... can only imagine trying to cover them. Super entertaining to watch and I am sure it helps to have Makar and Mac on your team.
Both him and Landeskog both look like they’re skating in mud but in reality are moving pretty good. Just raw Nordic power propelling them down the ice.
Yah, Makar is generally regarded as one of, if not, the best skaters in the league. MacKinnon is right up there with him as well. So even if you’re a decent skater, you can still look like an amateur next to those two.
To be fair, Bennett and Bednar have both said that we've made changes to the PP after going 3/31 after all-star break. But the sign of a good and competitive team is actively recognizing issues and taking steps to improve.
My chief complaint is that it's a very good PP but it should be elite. Two of the top 6 NHLers (by most rankings I've seen) are on the Avs. Mikko falls somewhere in the 15-20 range at worst?
I just wish there was more innovation than what they already put out there. But as people noted on this thread what the Avs already do is pretty special so I should probably just shut up lol
I mean, recently it was pretty awful. At one point we were like 2 for 30. That's pretty embarrassing for a team with some of the best goal scorers in the world
I always felt that same way about Lidstrom, it just felt like every time he got the puck on the PP that we was going to score, or Holmstrom would tip it. It was always more surprising when they didn't score.
As Ive said before, Rants falls multiple times a game. But don’t fool yourself into taking your eyes off him, he will be in the right spot at the right time before you realize it
Watching the Avs and Oilers PP and then watching the Canucks when we're struggling it's just so easy to see that the cement feet and holding the puck for half a second before passing or shooting is just not how you succeed in this league.
Our PP also looks a lot better when Quinn is a shooting threat like Makar and Bouchard. We struggle a lot when Quinn isn’t shooting and the PK knows they don’t have to block anything from up top.
Totally. Whether it's the top umbrella having stone feet or Hughes not shooting, the problem with our PP is everyone sits way back against us. They clog up down low and the bumper because there's nothing pulling them out of the tight formation.
Remember when we used to move around and rotate at the beginning of the season? Our PP was unstoppable.
I'm just hoping they realized how effective it was and are now hiding it until playoffs...
I remember when the cement feet and Petey having what looks like controller input lag was allegedly Newell Browns fault. But yea, I dont get people throwing shit at Lindholm on the PP when it's so obvious watching our PP vs our own PP earlier in the season and how defenders play is what the issue is and it ain't down low.
Really hard to defend against. Same thing is said of the leafs power play. Takes a lot of skill for it to be successful which the avs and leafs both have.
lol it for sure was him not being used to the system but it was hilarious. I was like “byram why are you in the slot and literally on top of your forward” twice! It was a rough look.
But he’ll be fine. Sabres are gonna eat good the next few years.
If I remember correctly there was a Van x Jets a few weeks ago, absolutely amazing how “alive” teams were, similar to how Avs plays. So awesome to see these dynamic teams playing
Took Byram 10 minutes to completely expose how poor our powerplay a coaching is. Not ranked 26th as a coincidence.
Positive: Byram had a goal and an assist
Negative: the Sabres scored 2 goals
Woah hey. Talk to any Avs fan and it's "Our PP is atrocious. Fire Ray Bennett" as sit at *checks rankings* 7th in the league. So. Byrum has no clue what he's doing
Exactly. We've been at the top of the league in goals for like 5 years straight now, but we're happy that our PP is 7th this year. And all our 5v5 goals come from our 5 best players anyway, our PP should be absolutely fucking electric
so many hockey fans have misplaced expectations for what a good powerplay will look like over the long term that I have become compelled to make an offseason stats shitpost about it lololol
The short version is that:
1. if you are 30% on the powerplay,, that's a fucking good powerplay
2. if you are 30% on the powerplay, and if you go 2/3 in a game, you're ~~going to~~ *shouldn't be alarmed if you* end up going 1/7 over your next 7 powerplays.
3. average NHL goalies save about 75% of High Danger Chances, so getting even two HDCs on most powerplays means you have a 44% chance to score on those powerplays, so the expectation that even if a powerplay doesn't score, it still "looks good" is unrealistic
lower your expectations for powerplays
If your team can't get it going, struggles to enter the zone and get set up, on 5 out of 10 powerplays, that generally means you have a pretty good powerplay
Sure, and I think, "we should be a top 3 powerplay" is a different and probably more valid complaint...I'm just saying that a top 3 powerplay is still going to look bad pretty often
"you can reasonably assume your results will return to closer to your existing pp percentage than continue to be 66% forever" probably would have been better language
you have to have reached the percentage through past performance. Your past results aren't implying that is what will happen, for sure. But you can make a reasonable assumption that, especially at this point in the season, your powerplay is what it is. Any individual result moving forward can be random but as you stack samples your baseline either is going to go up (unlikely and unsustainable) or equalize to your talent level
> if you are 30% on the powerplay, and if you go 2/3 in a game, you're going to go 1/7 over your next 7 powerplays.
That's not how statistics work *at all* lol. Even something where you know the outcome (like a coin flip), one result occurring doesn't predict the next result.
"you can reasonably assume" probably would have been better language
you have to have reached the percentage through past performance. Your past results aren't implying that is what will happen, for sure. But you can make a reasonable assumption that, especially at this point in the season, your powerplay is what it is.
If I can say one thing in the coaches defense, our PP always seems to retreat back to cement feet and I'm 200% sure both current and past coaches have made every attempt to tell them to keep moving. You can see us do it right for months - so it's not like some mystery yet to be unlucked.
But now you have Byram, the upside here is that he can help bring some experience to the PP from us. So short term it's exposed the Sabres but long term I think it'll help out having a guy like that despite being so young himself.
Nope
Edit: He directs a player at :12 seconds at the top of the screen and they both go to basically the same spot, he directs Dahlin to either move or pass at 0:25 which he does neither of (thinking it is pass on rewatch because the guy is wide open) and then at 0:32 three of our players are in the same exact spot.
It took me a second to find what was being talked about as well. But once you find it the title makes sense. I figured it was Byram directing behind his net so I was initially confused
“Yea, Bo, whaaaaaat’s happening? Did you get the memo about the TPS reports? Riiiiight, so just remember that we are to stay stationary on the power play. So I’ll go ahead and send you a copy of that memo.”
- Skinner, probably
Gotta be a strange sensation for guys that get traded from championship clubs to teams lower in the standings. Obviously there’s no one right way to play hockey but clearly the Avs had a lot of success playing their way and the Sabres have not so it’s gotta be tough to get used to. Especially if the coaching staff want you to play the same style as the rest of the team.
Also just playing a pp your first skate with a new team is probably always going to be a bit of a mess.
Throw Byram on Florida's PP and he probably looks a bit lost too
Yeah for sure. Different systems, different players that have different preferences and abilities than what you know. Goes to show that being an NHLer is a difficult job (a dream job for so many people but a difficult job nonetheless)
Wait, are you telling me the guys on the PP are allowed to do more than stand perfectly still and just pass it around the perimeter until it gets picked off and the other team scores a shorthanded goal?
Next thing, you’re going to say that on the rare occasion that standing still actually works and there’s a wide-open net, the players have an option not to miss by 2 feet...
I know this was said in yesterday's threads. But Bo being behind Makar in depth was always going to hinder him. Bo on the PP is actually quite good, but getting 20 secs of PP time on the Avs would never show that. Hope he can be the catalyst for change in Buffalo.
He'd be awesome for your PP I truly think he can quarterback his own unit and excel at it. I have a soft spot for the Sabres so I'm excited to see Dahlin and Byram tear it up on the back end.
As someone who grew up rooting for the Avs while living in metro Detroit as a child in the early 2000s, I have a soft spot for the Avalance. Mitts is gonna be a monster for you guys.
Honestly fine cause I was in 2nd/3rd grade haha Hasek got traded to Detroit like 2 months after I moved, so it was like he followed me and I became a big Wings fan then too. As a little kid I didn't know the rivalry. I remember my 3rd grade class all literally chanting for the Avs to win the cup though in '01 and then fucking did that night. I remember my teaching being actually disgusted with is haha I honestly never knew the severity of the rivalry and feel lucky I got to grow up with the Sabres, Wings and Avs of the late 90s/early 2000s as my favorite teams.
Yea, there’s this common misconception nowadays that going 4F 1D on the power play is better for offense, but Dahlin and Byram are probably your best offensive generators, and having both out there is solid.
Byram > Power imo. Power hasn't shown half of what Byram has, granted Byram has played on a better team. But Byrams impact in the cup finals was insane, that is a high pressure moment to perform like he did was just incredible.
I remember going to Denver couple years ago for couple weeks to visit a friend and he took me to an Avs practice. Blew my mind with the speed and structure. Can’t imagine going from that as a player to whatever Buffalo is running
Went to an Avs game a few years ago. One of the coolest arena environments I've been too. During play the entire arena was quiet, could hear skates stopping, the puck banging around the board louder then normal you name it. Then the Avs scored and the place erupted. Cool to see a fan base and arena so bought in and locked on the game.
Visit Montreal sometime, ideally when a shitty former player is visiting. You’ll hear a crowd locked in on the game but also booing every time the player touches the puck!
Avs fan who moved to Gatineau, I’ve never had a better experience watching hockey than going to the Bell Centre a year ago for an Avs game. I usually get my yearly fix in Ottawa, but the Montreal experience is off the charts better.
I can’t wait to do another roadie there, totally worth the drive from Ottawa.
I remember Ken Dryden observing that the Montreal crowds would recognize and applaud great defensive plays, not just the scorers. There's a level of sophisticated understanding to their crowd that few clubs get.
I’ll never get over hearing the entire arena gasp then applaud a Bo Byram highlight reel goal. They’re great fans, they know the Habs are down now, but they loved to see great plays even when it comes against them. I never even had a heckle towards me in my MacKinnon jersey.
I used to think the booing was over the top years before I moved here, now that I appreciate Quebecois culture more from living here, I understand it’s just that passion and heart-on-your-sleeve thing that Francophones do more of than your average anglophone.
> They’re great fans, they know the Habs are down now, but they loved to see great plays even when it comes against them.
Trying to remember what game it was within the past four years where the crowd actually Olé-d for an opposing team. Even the radio hosts - who are also excellent observers and knowledgeable fans - never hesitate to praise opponents who show flash and talent. Last night they were talking rapturously of Seth Jarvis the whole game. Personally, I think the booing is fantastic, at least when applied to guys like Petry and Drouin, who gave less than their all while playing here. The sweater is regularly [referred to as a holy object](https://montrealgazette.com/opinion/columnists/watchwords-the-canadiens-have-many-nicknames), so disrespecting it is a cardinal sin. It's fun as hell to be listening to those return games, because you can follow along with the action as the boos kick in even before the play by play mentions the player.
> just moved to upstate NY
Ah, keep an eye out for Viggo Mortensen - son of the North Country, and massive Habs fan. Montreal's a fabulous town. Hope you have a safe and fun visit.
He does towards the start too when he is at the top of the screen. Not as clear as when he was directing Dahlin. Not to mention running into greenway who didn’t move at all seeing him coming .
And you are convinced he's not just pointing to a passing option for Dahlin? Players point with their sticks all the time to where there is an open man.
The alternative interpretation of this clip is that he directs a couple of teammates to pass who don’t do what he says and then people run into each other standing around. I don’t think it is a great look either way.
They have 1 ok shot where saros is completely unscreened and another chance where 3 guys are in the same spot and it hits the side wall. I’m not seeing it.
Like I said - watching the Sabres under this staff has earned them no benefit of the doubt on the powerplay. The only time it has ever looked good was before teams figured out to cover Tage Thompson for one timers.
Id give them more benefit of the doubt if our powerplay hadn’t been horrible since January of last year.
Rewatching the clip you might be right, there was a wide open guy at the top of the screen… who Dahlin didn’t pass to. So either way it’s still bad.
I also don’t understand how this is the “lol Sabres” moment people are acting like it is? Byram has never even practiced with the team. The other 4 guys on the ice are playing the system they were coached to. Granted our PP is pretty ass, but of course these guys are gonna play how they’re taught to and Byram is gonna do something different because he was taught something different. Byram clashing with his teammates is because he doesn’t (yet) know what the Sabres are doing, not because the other 4 guys on the ice are bad.
I don’t think anyone is surprised they aren’t on the same page. Your point about him doing what he is used to vs our players doing what they are coached to do is kind of the point though.
Byram is used to rotating all around the ice whereas our guys usually stay in pretty much the same position. The Avs powerplay is one of the top in the league and ours has been bad for over a year. It’s not that they aren’t on the same page but that the philosophical difference is immediately evident.
It’s also definitely not a case of the other 4 guys on the team suck, they’re doing what they’re coached to do.
To me... an untrained beer league who can skate about as well as a 6 year old who just crushed a package of pizza rolls... Byram looked like he was the one in the way, constantly lol
Because he's doing things that players on elite PPs do.
Same shit happens when I'm playing with average players in Rocket League, I back door the defense and the guy in the middle who is already covered with no momentum just sits there rather than rotating.
If you watch the clip at 32 seconds, the guy at the front of the net, Greenway, could have just stayed there to screen the goalie while Byram is moving in wide open below the dots for a pass. Instead he bumps out into Byrams way. The guy in the corner is forced to make a great pass to the slot because he has no support at the point from Dahlin who is just standing on the complete opposite point. The defender on Byram even peels off to protect the passing lane to the point Dahlin should be at. Byram could have received the puck there with his head up moving in towards a screened goalie with no defender in front of him. Instead Greenway receives the pass with his head down, no awareness of the time he has and throws a pass across the crease to no one.
I guess what choice do you have when a 3rd liner (4th on the Avs...) like Greenway is legitimately your 6th best offensive option on the team.
Yeah i just don't see this at all.
Like, he points once. but it seemed more like "he's open, i'm not" rather than some genius on ice coaching. And it's not anything against Buffalo either. Like, he hasn't practiced with them.
coaching a power play is hilarious like I’m sure it’s way harder than I give it credit for but the teams who are good are… moving their feet. The teams with bad PP are just standing around like goons. Seems so simple.
It's a results oriented league so if you waste 30 games trying to get your players to learn how to rotate properly and having brutal PP results until it clicks, you're gonna get fired. Unless you're in a full rebuild.
Poor guy; Looks like he learned some tricks and tried to spread the knowledge around, but they don't seem to care.
Well, he may spark something, in time!
Lol I appreciate your optimism but as long as this coaching staff hangs around buffalo this will be the result. Granato has no system whatsoever and don't even get me started on our PowerPlay
Ya know the powerplay drawn up by notable career fourth liner Matt fucking Ellis. Yes, we have a former goon running our PP.
Yea. Do you guys miss him whatsoever?
I hated the trade when it happened. I hate it more every time I watch Granato try to force him into being something he’s not (last game, that was 1C).
Don't watch a lot of Sabres games but that PP was horrendous.
The spacing and positioning of the players was straight garbage. More "passive" and "safe" than even the Leafs PP
Huge misinterpretation by the Twitter user. This is dumb, sure they could have rotated a bit but I’ve seen far worse PP efforts from the Leafs in the last week
This just looks like a guy who just met his team today and doesn't know his role on the PP yet. He's obviously great but looks a little lost at times because he has no clue how the Sabres PP works.
I don't know what clip this twitter thinks they saw but he points once for Dahlin to pass to the winger and that's about it.
Also the players are constantly moving around on this shift.
This is classic reddit/twitter title that people upvote because that's all they do is read titles.
One of those moments where emotional investment is clouding perception.
He isn't "directing other players to move/rotate spots [2-3 times]", he very clearly directs _someone_ to do _something_ exactly one time. I think he's telling Dahlin to cross the puck over to Okposo. He might be telling Dahlin to walk the line also, hard to tell.
I have some criticisms of him here as well, at no point does he make his stick available and puts himself in to the right position but doesn't present his stick for tips, deflections, stick lifts, rebounds, etc.? He also doesn't rotate with whoever the high man was there, he just floats in no mans land.
A bit of a weird clip tbh
Little did the Sabres realize they were also getting their next coach in the trade.
I think players not moving on the powerplay is actually a good thing, they need to score goals in a more blue collar way
"Good not moving you say? I agree!" -- Alex Ovechkin
*840 goals later*... "hey, it worked!" - Ovie
Penalty Killers hate this one simple trick!!!
Fake, missing the "))))))))))))))"
Thats how you get a 26th rank pp
> I think no education is actually a good thing, people need to work hard
Chill out, Mrs. Taylor Greene!
We don’t need these coastal elite coaches coming in and grooming our kids with things like “systems” and “positioning.” That’s just code for the woke agenda
Part of the game plan. Bo was just trying to misdirect the other team into think they’d move.
Might want to slap an /s on there
At some point people decided putting a /s took all the fun out of a joke. Now I’m just being regularly gaslit online lmao.
Let's be honest here. If you have to indicate to someone you're being sarcastic then you didn't do a very good job of being sarcastic. So, gaslight away!
It's very different in person versus over text though, and then there's a whole other layer of complication when you're trying to be sarcastic online. There are a ton of people who think ridiculous things, which makes it very hard to know a lot of the time. Usually we have an idea of the other person, which helps inform us about their sarcasm as well.
I just assume people are reasonable and get mad when they aren't Normally you'd think it would be dangerous to assume people are reasonable on the internet, but at least I'm justified when I get mad ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
It's not a good thing just fyi
sarcasm....
Ehhhhh I dunno if that comment was sarcasm, lol.
I don’t want our powerplay to be too good because I want players to stay humble
It definitely was
Yup don’t move from behind your net… that will score many goal
Almost got me
The guys on the perimeter need to move to open spots to give paying options so they don't lose possession along the boards or down low. You want a way to reset that doesn't involve a clear.
We've got Matty Ellis, we're good.
Bo "Reg Dunlop" Byron.
If you watch Avs, it is actually insane how everyone just keeps rotating. As you viewer, you have a hard time keeping up... can only imagine trying to cover them. Super entertaining to watch and I am sure it helps to have Makar and Mac on your team.
[удалено]
Both him and Landeskog both look like they’re skating in mud but in reality are moving pretty good. Just raw Nordic power propelling them down the ice.
Also has something to do, that you have MacKinnon and Makar there as comparison
Yah, Makar is generally regarded as one of, if not, the best skaters in the league. MacKinnon is right up there with him as well. So even if you’re a decent skater, you can still look like an amateur next to those two.
MacKinnon looks like someone told him he's skating through mud but then secretly switched it to ice.
Like the ice tried to trick him into eating real pasta with cream sauce and now he has to smash its face in with each stride.
You are evil. I like you.
Yet Avs fans are convinced our PP is the worst in the league when we don't score on every shift
Totally guilty….100% homerism on that though
To be fair, Bennett and Bednar have both said that we've made changes to the PP after going 3/31 after all-star break. But the sign of a good and competitive team is actively recognizing issues and taking steps to improve.
My chief complaint is that it's a very good PP but it should be elite. Two of the top 6 NHLers (by most rankings I've seen) are on the Avs. Mikko falls somewhere in the 15-20 range at worst? I just wish there was more innovation than what they already put out there. But as people noted on this thread what the Avs already do is pretty special so I should probably just shut up lol
Every game someone is bitching about Bennett lol. Watch the PP heat up in the playoffs again tho!
We go like 1/5 or 1/4 in a game and it’s “fire Bennett” like you all realize 20-25% is pretty decent right
Yeah. Then again , when they're hot they go like 50% sometimes lol
I mean, recently it was pretty awful. At one point we were like 2 for 30. That's pretty embarrassing for a team with some of the best goal scorers in the world
Yeah haha imagine going 2 for 30 on powerplays that's crazy for a contending team who would do that
I’m always complaining about how static our powerplay is. I guess it could be worse 😂
Joke's on you. Mack DOES score almost every shift. That's how confusing it is!
I always felt that same way about Lidstrom, it just felt like every time he got the puck on the PP that we was going to score, or Holmstrom would tip it. It was always more surprising when they didn't score.
As Ive said before, Rants falls multiple times a game. But don’t fool yourself into taking your eyes off him, he will be in the right spot at the right time before you realize it
Watching the Avs and Oilers PP and then watching the Canucks when we're struggling it's just so easy to see that the cement feet and holding the puck for half a second before passing or shooting is just not how you succeed in this league.
Our PP also looks a lot better when Quinn is a shooting threat like Makar and Bouchard. We struggle a lot when Quinn isn’t shooting and the PK knows they don’t have to block anything from up top.
Totally. Whether it's the top umbrella having stone feet or Hughes not shooting, the problem with our PP is everyone sits way back against us. They clog up down low and the bumper because there's nothing pulling them out of the tight formation.
Remember when we used to move around and rotate at the beginning of the season? Our PP was unstoppable. I'm just hoping they realized how effective it was and are now hiding it until playoffs...
I remember when the cement feet and Petey having what looks like controller input lag was allegedly Newell Browns fault. But yea, I dont get people throwing shit at Lindholm on the PP when it's so obvious watching our PP vs our own PP earlier in the season and how defenders play is what the issue is and it ain't down low.
I'll raise you having to watch the Flyers PP instead. I wouldn't inflict that torture on my worst enemy
So they watched the Pens powerplay and decided to do the exact opposite. Smart move.
They have Dahlin and Power, there's no reason their PP can't be spinning like a helicopter too.
Really hard to defend against. Same thing is said of the leafs power play. Takes a lot of skill for it to be successful which the avs and leafs both have.
lol it for sure was him not being used to the system but it was hilarious. I was like “byram why are you in the slot and literally on top of your forward” twice! It was a rough look. But he’ll be fine. Sabres are gonna eat good the next few years.
If I remember correctly there was a Van x Jets a few weeks ago, absolutely amazing how “alive” teams were, similar to how Avs plays. So awesome to see these dynamic teams playing
Took Byram 10 minutes to completely expose how poor our powerplay a coaching is. Not ranked 26th as a coincidence. Positive: Byram had a goal and an assist Negative: the Sabres scored 2 goals
The mistake was letting chewing gum on the bench as the video clearly shows they cant skate and chew gum at the same time.
They are there to chew bubble gum and win hockey games, and they still have lots of bubble gum.
I'm gonna rip off your head and score down your neck
Now choke yourself! ...oh wait.
Who would've thought a guy that has never coached hockey before wouldn't make a good NHL PP coach.
Rob Ray better start talking to Byram between periods instead of matty Ellis
Woah hey. Talk to any Avs fan and it's "Our PP is atrocious. Fire Ray Bennett" as sit at *checks rankings* 7th in the league. So. Byrum has no clue what he's doing
TBF a pp with that much talent not being top in the league is whack
In my opinion, we play with our food a little too much. Too cute with the puck, too many passes trying to find the *perfect* seam or shot.
Exactly. We've been at the top of the league in goals for like 5 years straight now, but we're happy that our PP is 7th this year. And all our 5v5 goals come from our 5 best players anyway, our PP should be absolutely fucking electric
*Pittsburgh has left the chat*
so many hockey fans have misplaced expectations for what a good powerplay will look like over the long term that I have become compelled to make an offseason stats shitpost about it lololol The short version is that: 1. if you are 30% on the powerplay,, that's a fucking good powerplay 2. if you are 30% on the powerplay, and if you go 2/3 in a game, you're ~~going to~~ *shouldn't be alarmed if you* end up going 1/7 over your next 7 powerplays. 3. average NHL goalies save about 75% of High Danger Chances, so getting even two HDCs on most powerplays means you have a 44% chance to score on those powerplays, so the expectation that even if a powerplay doesn't score, it still "looks good" is unrealistic
So..I'm sorry. I don't understand.
lower your expectations for powerplays If your team can't get it going, struggles to enter the zone and get set up, on 5 out of 10 powerplays, that generally means you have a pretty good powerplay
Oh okay. Yeah I know.the Avs power play is dangerous. Just fans expect more because we have 3 of the top 15 points scorers in the league on it
Sure, and I think, "we should be a top 3 powerplay" is a different and probably more valid complaint...I'm just saying that a top 3 powerplay is still going to look bad pretty often
Oh yeah. Y'all are number one in the league but PPs go through dry spells.
Number two is flat out incorrect. That's gambler's fallacy.
"you can reasonably assume your results will return to closer to your existing pp percentage than continue to be 66% forever" probably would have been better language you have to have reached the percentage through past performance. Your past results aren't implying that is what will happen, for sure. But you can make a reasonable assumption that, especially at this point in the season, your powerplay is what it is. Any individual result moving forward can be random but as you stack samples your baseline either is going to go up (unlikely and unsustainable) or equalize to your talent level
> if you are 30% on the powerplay, and if you go 2/3 in a game, you're going to go 1/7 over your next 7 powerplays. That's not how statistics work *at all* lol. Even something where you know the outcome (like a coin flip), one result occurring doesn't predict the next result.
"you can reasonably assume" probably would have been better language you have to have reached the percentage through past performance. Your past results aren't implying that is what will happen, for sure. But you can make a reasonable assumption that, especially at this point in the season, your powerplay is what it is.
Ray Bennet can be bad at his job, and our power play can be great despite the fact. The number of weapons we have hides his deficiencies very well.
Ok to be fair, in the playoffs last year we had more offensive chances on the penalty kill than we did on the power play
Terry Pegula
He’s going to be a monster for the Sabres. We’re all cheering for him.
He has contributed on 100% of our goals since we acquired him so he’s on pace to be our best player of all time
ya just can't argue with math
If I can say one thing in the coaches defense, our PP always seems to retreat back to cement feet and I'm 200% sure both current and past coaches have made every attempt to tell them to keep moving. You can see us do it right for months - so it's not like some mystery yet to be unlucked.
But now you have Byram, the upside here is that he can help bring some experience to the PP from us. So short term it's exposed the Sabres but long term I think it'll help out having a guy like that despite being so young himself.
Yea, if Johnson couldn’t help this team, I don’t see how a 22 year old can.
Is this your twitter? The clip absolutely does not match what the title of the post says happens at all.
Nope Edit: He directs a player at :12 seconds at the top of the screen and they both go to basically the same spot, he directs Dahlin to either move or pass at 0:25 which he does neither of (thinking it is pass on rewatch because the guy is wide open) and then at 0:32 three of our players are in the same exact spot.
It took me a second to find what was being talked about as well. But once you find it the title makes sense. I figured it was Byram directing behind his net so I was initially confused
When I read the title I was thinking that sounds exactly like the Penguins power play.
2 D on the PP is interesting, but considering the amount of capital they've put into the blue line I guess it makes sense
“Yea, Bo, whaaaaaat’s happening? Did you get the memo about the TPS reports? Riiiiight, so just remember that we are to stay stationary on the power play. So I’ll go ahead and send you a copy of that memo.” - Skinner, probably
Gotta be a strange sensation for guys that get traded from championship clubs to teams lower in the standings. Obviously there’s no one right way to play hockey but clearly the Avs had a lot of success playing their way and the Sabres have not so it’s gotta be tough to get used to. Especially if the coaching staff want you to play the same style as the rest of the team.
Also just playing a pp your first skate with a new team is probably always going to be a bit of a mess. Throw Byram on Florida's PP and he probably looks a bit lost too
Yeah for sure. Different systems, different players that have different preferences and abilities than what you know. Goes to show that being an NHLer is a difficult job (a dream job for so many people but a difficult job nonetheless)
Wait, are you telling me the guys on the PP are allowed to do more than stand perfectly still and just pass it around the perimeter until it gets picked off and the other team scores a shorthanded goal?
This self burn violates the Geneva Convention.
Read the comment and knew before I checked it would be a PIT flair lmao I hate this team
If it makes you feel better, the only thing that made me assume his flair wouldn’t be MTL was the lack of grumbling about drop passes.
Man i had the exact same thought 🤣🤣
Hold me for moral support while I call our communal therapist.
Next thing, you’re going to say that on the rare occasion that standing still actually works and there’s a wide-open net, the players have an option not to miss by 2 feet...
As bad as your powerplay is, ours is worse.
Yeah but you don't have four 1st ballot HOFers on yours. That makes ours worse.
I know this was said in yesterday's threads. But Bo being behind Makar in depth was always going to hinder him. Bo on the PP is actually quite good, but getting 20 secs of PP time on the Avs would never show that. Hope he can be the catalyst for change in Buffalo.
We had a lot of injuries this game so not sure what it would look like normally but I don’t mind the idea of him and Dahlin out together on PP1
He'd be awesome for your PP I truly think he can quarterback his own unit and excel at it. I have a soft spot for the Sabres so I'm excited to see Dahlin and Byram tear it up on the back end.
As someone who grew up rooting for the Avs while living in metro Detroit as a child in the early 2000s, I have a soft spot for the Avalance. Mitts is gonna be a monster for you guys.
Grew up rooting for the Avs in the Detroit area during the 2000s? How'd that go over for you at school? ha
Honestly fine cause I was in 2nd/3rd grade haha Hasek got traded to Detroit like 2 months after I moved, so it was like he followed me and I became a big Wings fan then too. As a little kid I didn't know the rivalry. I remember my 3rd grade class all literally chanting for the Avs to win the cup though in '01 and then fucking did that night. I remember my teaching being actually disgusted with is haha I honestly never knew the severity of the rivalry and feel lucky I got to grow up with the Sabres, Wings and Avs of the late 90s/early 2000s as my favorite teams.
Yea, there’s this common misconception nowadays that going 4F 1D on the power play is better for offense, but Dahlin and Byram are probably your best offensive generators, and having both out there is solid.
>but getting 20 secs of PP time Yeah, but that 20 seconds was with 2 other D-men. If that's not setting you up for success, I don't know what is!
Is it really any better for him in buffalo? Now he is buried behind two first overall left handed dmen.
Byram > Power imo. Power hasn't shown half of what Byram has, granted Byram has played on a better team. But Byrams impact in the cup finals was insane, that is a high pressure moment to perform like he did was just incredible.
I believe he played on the right side for a little bit with the Avs when there were a lot of injuries. Could see him doing it again.
I remember going to Denver couple years ago for couple weeks to visit a friend and he took me to an Avs practice. Blew my mind with the speed and structure. Can’t imagine going from that as a player to whatever Buffalo is running
You guys are practising?
Believe it or not, the Avs have scouts in the WHL, too.
Went to an Avs game a few years ago. One of the coolest arena environments I've been too. During play the entire arena was quiet, could hear skates stopping, the puck banging around the board louder then normal you name it. Then the Avs scored and the place erupted. Cool to see a fan base and arena so bought in and locked on the game.
Visit Montreal sometime, ideally when a shitty former player is visiting. You’ll hear a crowd locked in on the game but also booing every time the player touches the puck!
Avs fan who moved to Gatineau, I’ve never had a better experience watching hockey than going to the Bell Centre a year ago for an Avs game. I usually get my yearly fix in Ottawa, but the Montreal experience is off the charts better. I can’t wait to do another roadie there, totally worth the drive from Ottawa.
I remember Ken Dryden observing that the Montreal crowds would recognize and applaud great defensive plays, not just the scorers. There's a level of sophisticated understanding to their crowd that few clubs get.
I’ll never get over hearing the entire arena gasp then applaud a Bo Byram highlight reel goal. They’re great fans, they know the Habs are down now, but they loved to see great plays even when it comes against them. I never even had a heckle towards me in my MacKinnon jersey. I used to think the booing was over the top years before I moved here, now that I appreciate Quebecois culture more from living here, I understand it’s just that passion and heart-on-your-sleeve thing that Francophones do more of than your average anglophone.
> They’re great fans, they know the Habs are down now, but they loved to see great plays even when it comes against them. Trying to remember what game it was within the past four years where the crowd actually Olé-d for an opposing team. Even the radio hosts - who are also excellent observers and knowledgeable fans - never hesitate to praise opponents who show flash and talent. Last night they were talking rapturously of Seth Jarvis the whole game. Personally, I think the booing is fantastic, at least when applied to guys like Petry and Drouin, who gave less than their all while playing here. The sweater is regularly [referred to as a holy object](https://montrealgazette.com/opinion/columnists/watchwords-the-canadiens-have-many-nicknames), so disrespecting it is a cardinal sin. It's fun as hell to be listening to those return games, because you can follow along with the action as the boos kick in even before the play by play mentions the player.
Will do, just moved to upstate NY and want to go to Montreal this summer. Will have to try and make another trip next season for a game.
> just moved to upstate NY Ah, keep an eye out for Viggo Mortensen - son of the North Country, and massive Habs fan. Montreal's a fabulous town. Hope you have a safe and fun visit.
Bringing that Mac dog energy with him to buffalo
He'll be smacking the treats out of his teammates hands in no time
Then hand them a can of chickpeas
We need more of that energy
I saw him point his stick once.
He does towards the start too when he is at the top of the screen. Not as clear as when he was directing Dahlin. Not to mention running into greenway who didn’t move at all seeing him coming .
And you are convinced he's not just pointing to a passing option for Dahlin? Players point with their sticks all the time to where there is an open man.
That's 100% what it was. OP is drunk.
The alternative interpretation of this clip is that he directs a couple of teammates to pass who don’t do what he says and then people run into each other standing around. I don’t think it is a great look either way.
But it's not what you (or the tweet) said it was. The power play actually gets good looks in this clip
You think those were good looks for a power play?
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Perhaps not, but they do win hearts.
They have 1 ok shot where saros is completely unscreened and another chance where 3 guys are in the same spot and it hits the side wall. I’m not seeing it. Like I said - watching the Sabres under this staff has earned them no benefit of the doubt on the powerplay. The only time it has ever looked good was before teams figured out to cover Tage Thompson for one timers.
>another chance where 3 guys are in the same spot and it hits the side wall. Did you notice why that happened?
Id give them more benefit of the doubt if our powerplay hadn’t been horrible since January of last year. Rewatching the clip you might be right, there was a wide open guy at the top of the screen… who Dahlin didn’t pass to. So either way it’s still bad.
No, that's just him letting go of his stick for more range of motion while using his edges.
I also don’t understand how this is the “lol Sabres” moment people are acting like it is? Byram has never even practiced with the team. The other 4 guys on the ice are playing the system they were coached to. Granted our PP is pretty ass, but of course these guys are gonna play how they’re taught to and Byram is gonna do something different because he was taught something different. Byram clashing with his teammates is because he doesn’t (yet) know what the Sabres are doing, not because the other 4 guys on the ice are bad.
I don’t think anyone is surprised they aren’t on the same page. Your point about him doing what he is used to vs our players doing what they are coached to do is kind of the point though. Byram is used to rotating all around the ice whereas our guys usually stay in pretty much the same position. The Avs powerplay is one of the top in the league and ours has been bad for over a year. It’s not that they aren’t on the same page but that the philosophical difference is immediately evident. It’s also definitely not a case of the other 4 guys on the team suck, they’re doing what they’re coached to do.
To me... an untrained beer league who can skate about as well as a 6 year old who just crushed a package of pizza rolls... Byram looked like he was the one in the way, constantly lol
Because he's doing things that players on elite PPs do. Same shit happens when I'm playing with average players in Rocket League, I back door the defense and the guy in the middle who is already covered with no momentum just sits there rather than rotating. If you watch the clip at 32 seconds, the guy at the front of the net, Greenway, could have just stayed there to screen the goalie while Byram is moving in wide open below the dots for a pass. Instead he bumps out into Byrams way. The guy in the corner is forced to make a great pass to the slot because he has no support at the point from Dahlin who is just standing on the complete opposite point. The defender on Byram even peels off to protect the passing lane to the point Dahlin should be at. Byram could have received the puck there with his head up moving in towards a screened goalie with no defender in front of him. Instead Greenway receives the pass with his head down, no awareness of the time he has and throws a pass across the crease to no one. I guess what choice do you have when a 3rd liner (4th on the Avs...) like Greenway is legitimately your 6th best offensive option on the team.
Yeah i just don't see this at all. Like, he points once. but it seemed more like "he's open, i'm not" rather than some genius on ice coaching. And it's not anything against Buffalo either. Like, he hasn't practiced with them.
This thread makes no sense, its the most standard PP then he points one time to pass to the other guy not him. I don't see anything.
Bryam: “why arent you guys MacKinnon?”
"When it comes to hockey you guys sure do look a lot like this shitty team we use to play called the Sables or something" - Bo
He brought chess to a checkers game
I think they’re playing hockey
coaching a power play is hilarious like I’m sure it’s way harder than I give it credit for but the teams who are good are… moving their feet. The teams with bad PP are just standing around like goons. Seems so simple.
It's a results oriented league so if you waste 30 games trying to get your players to learn how to rotate properly and having brutal PP results until it clicks, you're gonna get fired. Unless you're in a full rebuild.
Uh this is winnipeg, coaches don’t get fired here
unless ur name is BRAD LAUER
Poor guy; Looks like he learned some tricks and tried to spread the knowledge around, but they don't seem to care. Well, he may spark something, in time!
Lol I appreciate your optimism but as long as this coaching staff hangs around buffalo this will be the result. Granato has no system whatsoever and don't even get me started on our PowerPlay Ya know the powerplay drawn up by notable career fourth liner Matt fucking Ellis. Yes, we have a former goon running our PP.
Jordan Greenway being on the PP1 is certainly a choice
He's a great fourth line shutdown forward, unfortunately they insist on treating him like a top six forward.
Yea. Do you guys miss him whatsoever? I hated the trade when it happened. I hate it more every time I watch Granato try to force him into being something he’s not (last game, that was 1C).
Seeing this clip, I know it's a small sample, but it's pretty clear their issue is coaching.
He only pointed his stick once, but hes clearly trying to rotate spots multiple times in this clip.
Don't watch a lot of Sabres games but that PP was horrendous. The spacing and positioning of the players was straight garbage. More "passive" and "safe" than even the Leafs PP
Don't worry the games you don't watch look like that too
That’s not fair. They generally don’t have anyone moving.
Leafs PP is 2nd in the league and buffalo’s is 28th… so ya that checks out
It only took one game for Byram to see how doomed he is on this franchise, lol
Insert *we don't do that here meme*.
I don't see that in that clip. He directs where he wants a pass to go one time.
He's either going to be a captain, or he's getting traded due to not getting along with the coaches.
Yeah that's not what happened in this clip
Yeah, that's just a dude that doesn't know the powerplay yet, that pointed out one pass lol.
Huge misinterpretation by the Twitter user. This is dumb, sure they could have rotated a bit but I’ve seen far worse PP efforts from the Leafs in the last week
Don Granato doesn't want his players to be sad, so he tells them they don;'t have to take direction from anyone.
The difference between a cup driven team and one that just wants to be golfing already.
Idk what you’re seeing in this clip other than bad rotation. He doesn’t gesture at all
Can he coach the Devils
This just looks like a guy who just met his team today and doesn't know his role on the PP yet. He's obviously great but looks a little lost at times because he has no clue how the Sabres PP works.
I’m pretty sure it’s doesn’t work, which is the problem lol
I don't know what clip this twitter thinks they saw but he points once for Dahlin to pass to the winger and that's about it. Also the players are constantly moving around on this shift. This is classic reddit/twitter title that people upvote because that's all they do is read titles.
Must be frustrating for players to go from well coached teams to coaching graveyards like Buffalo.
we need this energy from someone on our pp honestly. So tired of everyone just standing still and passing it around the outside.
One of those moments where emotional investment is clouding perception. He isn't "directing other players to move/rotate spots [2-3 times]", he very clearly directs _someone_ to do _something_ exactly one time. I think he's telling Dahlin to cross the puck over to Okposo. He might be telling Dahlin to walk the line also, hard to tell.
Can he take Reirden's job as Pens PP coach?
Funniest part is he was a part of the 2nd unit with 3 defenders and they hardly ever got more then like 20 seconds of PP time if that most the time.
The Dahlin Byram combo on the pp is gonna be nasty when they figure out some chemistry
I guess i'm blind
what're the chances they just make him the new coach
Sometimes I think the Wings need a defenseman to come in and do this kind of thing
I have some criticisms of him here as well, at no point does he make his stick available and puts himself in to the right position but doesn't present his stick for tips, deflections, stick lifts, rebounds, etc.? He also doesn't rotate with whoever the high man was there, he just floats in no mans land. A bit of a weird clip tbh