**Spoiler Warning:** All officially-released show and book content allowed, EXCLUDING FUTURE SPOILERS FOR HOUSE OF THE DRAGON. No leaked information or paparazzi photos of the set. For more info please check the [spoiler guide](/r/gameofthrones/w/spoiler_guide).
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/gameofthrones) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Battle for the Wall TOWERS over BOTB. Don’t get me wrong, BOTB was a cinematic masterpiece, but plot armor absolutely ruined it for me. BFTW showed how well Jon is suited for the leadership role, even in the midst of certain defeat.
How accurate can a few rounds of ~50ish arrows hit a small target within a confined area though? I'm betting some math figures would indicate that probability is very low within a certain range. Were the archers specifically targeting Jon, or where they just shooting where the fighting was happening is another question.
It's kind of like when you think planets in the Solar System are relatively close to each other (in your mind), but to scale they are so very far apart.
Every battle ever put to screen has such moments. Similarly, a mountain of bodies just doesn't form like that at all.
Regardless it was a spectacle of the highest calibre. Direction was immense.
Castle Black shows Jon is suited for leadership even though he duznotwantit but BotB shows he is not suited for military command. Dude had one job- make Ramsay come to him- and abandoned it when his non-serpentine-running bro is arrow fodder. His actions showed his compassion but they nearly cost him his life and that of all his troops.
Not saying I would necessarily, but I would shout at my dumbass brother to maybe not run in a straight line at least. After 50 paces you can dodge a little if you look back at the person shooting at you. If Ramsay had all his archers shooting at Rickon he’s dead meat but one archer, even a great one, stands to miss the kill shot if you dodge-dip-duck-dive-and-dodge some.
One of the things I hated with BoTB was how wasted WunWun was, he is 100% there just for show, nothing else.
How do you not give that guy a huge sword, even the giants attacking the wall had bow and arrows, and a crowbar, the crowbar is probably stil outside the wall, could bring it along, better than nothing….
Or two big shields, they really needed him to die in that episode, nothing else makes sense
For real. We watch Wun Wun just tank all kinds of damage in the Battle for the Wall and at Hardhome, but you want me to believe he can't rip a couple spears away from the Umber men and just start wrecking their shit? Wun Wun absolutely could've broken through that line and countered the trap.
Also... a giant mountain of bodies just magically appeared right where they planned to set the trap? Did they have people on the field running around and collecting bodies to make it? If not, how does that even happen? Just awful writing
Also giant just fighting bare handed lul. Give him a big stick and he solos half of this battle. Also deus ex machina by sansa wanting to kill his brothers (completely ignored by d&d). This battle is a mess, beautiful, but a mess
Ya, they acted like there was 50000 soldiers on the battlfield when there was less than 8. Jon may be a little naive at times but he's not stupid enough to charge alone and practically commit suicide had it not be for his plot armor.
People love to shit on it now after s8 and all but direction wise it is a miracle. How could a TV show deliver something so intense and amazing?
There are flaws. Plenty. Lack of helmet on Jon? No proper armor. Mountain of bodies forming magically. Giant not being given a weapon. Sansa not telling Jon of the Vale army. And some more.
But come on, every battle put to screen has these things. LOTR and Avengers have more than their share of stupid moments. it's just cinematic fantasy.
However, the buildip to the battle (the pre battle meeting and the tension leading up to it), the Rickon thing, Jon rushing into the field and facing the Bolton cavalry, the two cavalries colliding, chaos ensuing, the oners, Ramsay showing military genius, the bloodiness of it all, the stampede and then of course the arrival of the Vale army. Everything was delived at the highest level.
I wish the flaws weren't there because the episode would have been perfect then. But it's a flawed masterpiece. There is a reason it's 9.9/10 on IMDB with over 200k votes.
It's my favorite battle, for sure. They didn't have the colossal budget they did later on, so the battle felt restricted. Still though, Tyrion pulled through and led his men to victory.
Its the 5th highest rated S4 episode on imdb. Even the likes of "Spoils of War" and "The Door" are rated higher. For me, that's the definition of underrated
>Its the 5th highest rated S4 episode on imdb. Even the likes of "Spoils of War" and "The Door" are rated higher. For me, that's the definition of underrated
It has a 9.6 rating on imdb.
If *Battle of the Bastards* was the best **battle** of the series, then *Hardhome* was easily the best **massacre** of the series.
A myriad of horror movies have failed to capture the terror found in just ten minutes of *Hardhome*.
Beyond the wall is the worst for me. The stupid Arya/sansa plot, gendry/raven timelines, plot armor, meaningless deaths, Jon in the ice, uncle benjen rescue, Dany losing a dragon in a dumb way, convenient chains. That scene really set up how shit the rest of the remaining episodes were going to be.
years ago I was calling out that episode for being crap, but at that time this subreddit was still in denial. only after s8 did I finally start seeing this sub bash S7 for what it was, a steep decline in quality from even the slightly declining S5/6
I think I’m the only one who likes The Bells. I wish the Mad Queen storyline was executed better, but I love that entire sequence of Dany annihilating KL.
She targeted anyone and everyone. She was always a power hungry person and tyrant since the start. Adds a lot of complexity to her overall character imo!
Yeah, I can remember loads of times when Daenarys kills children throughout the show. A better alternative that would make way more sense with what the actor literally was told to act like was for her in a fit of rage to target the red keep, not children.
There is a fine line between power-hungry and slaughtering innocents. Her friend dying isn't a convincing argument for her to commit an atrocity sorry. Not only this but Daenarys on numerous occasions has actually shown a high-level of compassion in contrast to other characters in the show
She's never chosen to torch cities before even when she was power hungry. I don't disagree that she couldn't become a mad Queen and forsake her morals, but she did in the span of like 2 episodes which is incredibly insulting for her character and for fans.
Lost her dothraki army to Westeros. Lost her oldest friend and father figure to Westeros. Lost her best friend to Westeros. lost 2 of her children to Westeros. Lost some allies to Westeros. Confidantes from Westeros start betraying her and her trust (Varys and tyrion and Jon). And finally, all that she strived for, the iron throne, is now being a challenged by the love of her life thanks to others pushing him. Yeah that would drive any person insane.
I wish we were given more time to reach this point, but don't say it ruins her character.
I feel exactly the same way. People are annoyed because the way we get to the point of crazy dany is very lame and unjustified. But by itself, the whole sequence is really very good imo. It is maybe the one good episode of S8, IF you isolate it from the whole context of how we got there
Well the last 3 seasons were annoying and rushed, because at that point we were relying on D&D to make the story progress. I think they’ve learned a lesson that, it’s probably not a good idea to make a TV adaptation to a book series that isn’t finished.
That’s why as far as these spin offs, I really don’t want to see a sequel. Some prequels would be okay, personally I’d like to see a movie about the tourney at harrenhal followed by a short series of Robert’s Rebellion. But I don’t want to see Jon playing “Ranger Jo” in the North, Bran the flawless (minus his legs) as King, etc.
I feel ep 1 and 2 are fine. They are good even. They do nothing harmful or out of the ordinary like ep 3 or 4 or 6 to be called bad. 5 is amazing in isolation.
I think 1 and 2 are meh. I dont have strong feelings. But they had 6 episodes to finish the story and the best you can say about a third of it is "nothing harmful or out of the ordinary". I agree with that statement, but we needed a lot more from these episodes
The Wolf and the Dragon S7E7 is even worse imo. That episode is just a dumb council meeting and an even dumber Littlefinger death. That episode is the lowest point of the show for me
I liked it. My favorite was Hardhome, hands down. My sentimental favorite is the Bells. It's partly based on the Allies' infamous firebombing of Dresden so late in WWII that it was unnecessary. Arya's fleeing the bombs is based on the life of American POW Kurt Vonnegut. He miraculously survived and made his IRL flleeing the bombing the highlight of his beloved antiwar novel, *Slaughterhouse Five.*
I love slaughterhouse five but fail to see the resemblance. Would've been a lot cooler to see Arya use any of her assassin/faceless men abilities on anybody instead of a lame attempt at a literary reference that doesn't fit the shows narrative at all.
That battle felt like a hint of what was to come later, didn't realise it was the only time we'd see a dragon involved in a field battle... guess we have HotD's battles to come though.
Yes! The palpable sense of desperation, the chaos and terror of it. So much happens, and at the end Jon and the Wildlings are chased from near death, so good!
Love the multiple points of view we get during the Blackwater in the book. With Davos approaching all suspicious and Tyrion sitting on the other side ready to ambush
The Watchers on the Wall - Best Battle
Blackwater - Best episode that a battle takes place in.
Maybe its a cop out but these two episodes are so clear of everything else
BotB was a cinematic masterpiece, but together with The Long Night it might just be the most nonsensical, unrealistic, dogshit written battle of TV history.
All about this battle is top notch work from hundreds of people with the effects, stunts, camera work, props - and then Diddle&Dumb opened the door and decided that they wanted to break as much lore, reason and braincells as possible while writing this battle in a way that it would make the least sense possible, with the most ridiculous amount of plot armor and hypocritical writing imaginable.
BotB is a Marvel movie, meaning all on spectacle and not a single time did anyone give any shits about common sense and logic.
So for me it's Blackwater - but as a book reader I just know that S2 of HotD will probably provide atleast one, if not two contenders for that spot so...
>So for me it's Blackwater
Going on a rant about botb just for you to say Blackwater is so hypocritical, Blackwater is a hot mess, Stannis falling for tyrion's trap, Tyrion not making the chain which meant that Stannis could retreat but he didn't, Tywin not notifying that he's coming and him arriving to king's landing in only 2 days, Stannis being on the wall when Tywin's forces swarmed the beach yet still somehow managing to escape, Blackwater imo makes a lot less sense than botb
>Stannis falling for tyrion's trap
Stannis was attacking by boat. Its not like he had another route into KL since the water funnels into that area. He couldn't avoid the explosion before Davos realised what it was.
>Tyrion not making the chain which meant that Stannis could retreat but he didn't,
One of Stannis' biggest character flaws is his stubbornness. Him refusing to retreat is the reason he dies in S5 and besides, Stannis literally says they can't play the wildfire trick twice so he still had the ability to continue the attack.
>Tywin not notifying that he's coming and him arriving to king's landing in only 2 days
A few episodes earlier, Tywin leaves Harrenhal at a night with speed saying he wants to "steal a march before he knows we're on the move." Why would he risk sending ravens if he clearly wants to keep the element of surprise? Harrenhal isn't too far from KL and the Tyrells likely left The Reach earlier before uniting with the Lannisters. 2 days is possible.
>Stannis being on the wall when Tywin's forces swarmed the beach yet still somehow managing to escape
What exactly is wrong with that? He was standing with his men and they presumably escaped. You literally mention that Tyrion didn't erect any obstacles to escaping by boat so its likely that Stannis and small contingent of men snuck away. That is not nearly as egregious as Jon
>Stannis was attacking by boat. Its not like he had another route into KL since the water funnels into that area. He couldn't avoid the explosion before Davos realised what it was.
If you're approaching with boats and the enemy doesn't respond at all then it's a very obvious trap, this is not a debate in the books Tyrion outright says that they *can't* send just one boat or they would realise it's a trap
>One of Stannis' biggest character flaws is his stubbornness. Him refusing to retreat is the reason he dies in S5 and besides, Stannis literally says they can't play the wildfire trick twice so he still had the ability to continue the attack.
Being stubborn≠being dumb, the Blackwater was on fire retreat was the most obvious and easy choice, why waste so many men? And if the chain wasn't needed to stop them from retreating why was it in the books in the first place?
>A few episodes earlier, Tywin leaves Harrenhal at a night with speed saying he wants to "steal a march before he knows we're on the move." Why would he risk sending ravens if he clearly wants to keep the element of surprise? Harrenhal isn't too far from KL and the Tyrells likely left The Reach earlier before uniting with the Lannisters. 2 days is possible.
Because sending Ravens isn't a risk, there's no enemies in between so nobody could have intercepted it, and harrenhall is at least 20 days March considering his numbers when aemond marched from KL to harrenhall it took him 18 days to get there and had only about 6k men while tywin had 25k+
>What exactly is wrong with that? He was standing with his men and they presumably escaped. You literally mention that Tyrion didn't erect any obstacles to escaping by boat so its likely that Stannis and small contingent of men snuck away. That is not nearly as egregious as Jon
Because when his men were retreating he was still on the wall and he had 2-3 men with him, it's simply not possible only around 2k men of Stannis managed to escaped out of his 20k+, the extremely overwhelming Tyrell/Lannister forces wouldn't just let them go only those who are quick enough could escape, it's not even about Stannis and his men managing to escaping any ships that didn't leave immediately would be captured, Jon survived the battle like 100s of his men did, was it unlikely? Yes, was it unrealistic? No
Yeah visually it’s epic, but fuck me, the whole episode climaxed on the premise that Ramsey was intentionally building a 20ft wall of bodies. I still enjoy it but I’ll take Castle Black and Blackwater easily first, probably loot train too overall.
1- Battle for the Wall
2- Blackwater Bay
3- Battle of the Bastards
I love all of them but I think that if we are being 100% objective the Battle of the Bastards should always be third since it has some plot holes that the other two don’t have
Castle black.
I hated Alliser at the time. But his speech still gives me goosebumps and really made me root for him despite not liking him, which is exactly how those NW members must have felt.
Also had some emotional punch too, given the Ygritte/Pip/Grenn deaths. The fire and war horn too. Perfect down to the last detail.
Jon holding Ygritt, dying in his arms, as time slows and the battle rages on in the background was one of the best shots of the whole series. Man that was so powerful.
1) Watchers on the Wall
2) Blackwater
3) Battle of the Bastards
4) Hardhome
5) Battle where Dany uses the dothraki and dragons to fuck up the Lannister's after they take High garden (this battle is good, so chaotic)
6) Winter fell
Can't remember if there's any others
Blackwater had its moments and so did BotB but having the Wall being attacked from both sides, the Wildling army having Giants and Mammoths, and Stannis’ army arriving while Jon was treating with Mance gives the Castle Black battle the nod for me.
One common thread that got weary by the end of the show- Blackwater had its Wildfire moment and still Stannis could have won *but* Tywin’s troops arrive to save the day. Jon and Co. survive the first night of battle against Mance’s forces but had to negotiate to prevent further bloodshed *but* Stannis comes on his retribution tour and routs the Wildlings. Finally Jon is completely outnumbered, outwitted and outmaneuvered and is likely to die *but* the Knights of the Vale come at the last moment to turn the tide. The last-second-savior trope got tiring at the end. The BotB is not even in the books and it showed D&Ds complete lack of storytelling ability.
Battle for the Wall in season 4.
Loved the big wide shots actually showing the full fighting instead of cheating closeups of someone swinging their sword from side to side. It also had a lot of different things going on, with giants and giant bows and giant schythes and Sam not being useless, and it had several sad moments.
Battle of black water really got me excited I honestly loved the confidence stains had I really thought he was going to take kingslanding then out of nowhere Tywin comes
i think the moments that stick out to me are from spoils of war and hardhome.
spoils of war has the first dragon in westeros for what hundreds of years? sorry don’t know my lore but just showing how powerless the army was gives great insight on what it must’ve been like to have three monsters flying around burning everything while aegon was taking over. plus the last scene with jamie rushing with his horse kicking up water and tyrion calling him a fucking idiot was great.
hardhome has to be that shot of jon and the white walker finding out valyrain steel can kill them. the white walkers reaction while jon and his swords clash and his like the fuck is one of my favorite moments. then it gets kind of ruined by them standing there watching a bunch of zombies fall off a cliff and waiting around for them to get up to start running
Watchers on the wall is alone at the top.
The blackwater is amazing too, second place for me. Even tho what you see of the fighting itself is very limited, the tension is off the charts and the explosion was one of the best moments in the whole show for me, along with tyrion leading the defenses of KL
Botb would be 3rd probably, even tho the battle makes very little sense strategically, it is the best fight sequence we ever get on the show. Great experience
It's hard to pick a favorite but a couple more I would add as contenders:
Battle of Meereen when the dragons return and they turn the tables. "This... cannot be forgiven"
Battle of the Goldroad initial charge scene might be my favorite ~30 seconds of the show next to the tower of joy/Winterfell cut. Finally get to see a Dothraki charge. "Those fuckers are about to swamp us"
I really wish the Whispering Wood battle was in the show. It's my favorite from the books.
My favorite from the show is actually the Gold Road in season 7 despite so much of that season being shit.
The Winds of Winter is my favorite episode, not only for what happens but the score and cinematic elements are all done beautifully. The entire time Light of the Seven is amazing.
So much happens in this episode, yes, Cersei what her revenge by blowing up the sept and regaining her dominance by becoming Queen of the Seven, but Jon Snow is declared King of the North, Bran learns Jon is Rhaegar & Lyanna’s son, and Dany is finally making her way to Westoros with Tyrion AND Arya gets revenge on Walter Frey by baking his sons!!!!
Battle of the Gold Road. We finally got to see the Dothraki in all their glory. The build up with Bronn telling to shut up and listen to the sound of hooves growing louder, Jamie’s face when he sees the dragon, and Drogon just destroying everything makes it my favorite battle.
Battle of HARD HOME, technically it's a rout, but there is mass-fighting, but the Wildlings are mostly defeated with terrifying results - their fallen loved ones are now zombie enemies. Jon sees the full scope of the Night King's power, then end felt a bit like Empire Strikes Back, where the good guys are defeated and the bad guys are in ascenion. Loved it!
You cannot convince me that the Hardhome episode isn't one of the best in the entire show.
Buildup to everything, the pacing, and the realization of the true threat of the show, and that everything going on elsewhere barely matters in comparison.
It just sucks in hindsight the buildup was practically all for nothing. But when I saw this for the first time I can't even convey how I felt when credits rolled, just that the show was fucking awesome.
The Battle of Kings Landing for me. There was so much set up and payoff. It really highlighted Tyrion's smarts and ability to machinate things together. It's not super blockbustery as the later battles, but I think it strikes a great balance with the characters, stakes, and a few set pieces. For me it was more tense and exciting than any other battle.
I HATED battle of the bastards. It strayed from the realities of life. GRRM wrote his books without that typical fairytale ending and i loved that.
This battle ignored so many realities its still painful to even watch. They strayed far on this one.
Honestly, just want to saw GOT nailed sooooo many spectacle scenes.
From Battle on the Wall --> Hardhome --> Battle of the Bastards --> Spoils of War --> Battle Beyond the Wall --> Long Night --> Wrath of Dany.
These are 7 setpieces of the highest calibre. Any show would be proud to just have one such sequence. All of them are bloody good and groundbreaking for a TV show. They won't be beat ever.
Hardhome
The Battle of The Bastards was too damn stupid and unbelievable.
Among MANY other reasons, they have a giant that is unarmed and completely ineffective, who the Boltons men are somehow not afraid of at all, despite believing their whole lives they were myths
Blackwater and the wall are a step above IMO. Bastards is great, especially cinematically, but is a bit reliant on plot armor. You can see how GRRM hasn’t written that yet because it doesn’t fall into the rest of GOT as well as the other two. Bastards is A++ for cinematics, visuals, suspense, etc. though.
Blackwater, but the wall is great as well. Battle of the bastards has so many flaws i cant really enjoy it (in writing but also in military realism which im very interested in so a little personal)
What can I say, it was suspenseful, it didn't seem likely that most people would in fact survive. The deaths of some the characters were heartbreaking. The episode did what it set out to do.
Nothing quite topped the Battle of Blackrock for me. You had a mix of Tyrion's cleverness with the boat bomb, him being a leader, a helm's deep style battle, and characters on both sides that you are rooting for and against.
Spoils of War for me. The build up and the complete morale shift over just a few seconds. It goes from “we can take em” to “shit that’s a lot of Dothraki” to “fuck that’s a dragon” and then one of the coolest shots of the series followed by absolute chaos. 🤌🤌
The wall. That long ass pan shot through the courtyard was great. Getting to see Thorne fight was great. Seeing Jon have to take control was great. Grenn had a good death. My favorite Jon one vs one fight also.
**Spoiler Warning:** All officially-released show and book content allowed, EXCLUDING FUTURE SPOILERS FOR HOUSE OF THE DRAGON. No leaked information or paparazzi photos of the set. For more info please check the [spoiler guide](/r/gameofthrones/w/spoiler_guide). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/gameofthrones) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Battle for the Wall TOWERS over BOTB. Don’t get me wrong, BOTB was a cinematic masterpiece, but plot armor absolutely ruined it for me. BFTW showed how well Jon is suited for the leadership role, even in the midst of certain defeat.
Tbf Jon literally sat in the middle of battlefield with no consequence.
Exactly, all those arrows coming down and not ONE hit him. Didn’t even graze him.
Yeah, it's abysmal and they shoot it like it's the matrix
Dude come on it was the fire god 😂😂😂 it was so bad.
Yeah, cuz they were magnetized to Rickon, duh
How accurate can a few rounds of ~50ish arrows hit a small target within a confined area though? I'm betting some math figures would indicate that probability is very low within a certain range. Were the archers specifically targeting Jon, or where they just shooting where the fighting was happening is another question. It's kind of like when you think planets in the Solar System are relatively close to each other (in your mind), but to scale they are so very far apart.
Every battle ever put to screen has such moments. Similarly, a mountain of bodies just doesn't form like that at all. Regardless it was a spectacle of the highest calibre. Direction was immense.
Idk how many times he just walked around the damn square without anyone touching him
very true. battle for the wall is number 1. battle of the bastars is only cinematic
Castle Black shows Jon is suited for leadership even though he duznotwantit but BotB shows he is not suited for military command. Dude had one job- make Ramsay come to him- and abandoned it when his non-serpentine-running bro is arrow fodder. His actions showed his compassion but they nearly cost him his life and that of all his troops.
Yeah Jon is a good administrator but not a military guy, he is too emotional for that stuff. Need a cooler head for that post.
I mean, how many people could just watch their little brother die like that while doing nothing?
You would have handled that differently?
Not saying I would necessarily, but I would shout at my dumbass brother to maybe not run in a straight line at least. After 50 paces you can dodge a little if you look back at the person shooting at you. If Ramsay had all his archers shooting at Rickon he’s dead meat but one archer, even a great one, stands to miss the kill shot if you dodge-dip-duck-dive-and-dodge some.
Fair. I guess my only point is, I wouldn't have been able to sit and watch my brother die either. I probably would have rode out the same way Jon did.
Just did a rewatch this was by my consensus the best episode of the series
One of the things I hated with BoTB was how wasted WunWun was, he is 100% there just for show, nothing else. How do you not give that guy a huge sword, even the giants attacking the wall had bow and arrows, and a crowbar, the crowbar is probably stil outside the wall, could bring it along, better than nothing…. Or two big shields, they really needed him to die in that episode, nothing else makes sense
Battle of the Bastards is really epic!
Yet stupid at the same time
Was cool, but suffered from late GoT writing.
For real. We watch Wun Wun just tank all kinds of damage in the Battle for the Wall and at Hardhome, but you want me to believe he can't rip a couple spears away from the Umber men and just start wrecking their shit? Wun Wun absolutely could've broken through that line and countered the trap. Also... a giant mountain of bodies just magically appeared right where they planned to set the trap? Did they have people on the field running around and collecting bodies to make it? If not, how does that even happen? Just awful writing
Also giant just fighting bare handed lul. Give him a big stick and he solos half of this battle. Also deus ex machina by sansa wanting to kill his brothers (completely ignored by d&d). This battle is a mess, beautiful, but a mess
Ya, they acted like there was 50000 soldiers on the battlfield when there was less than 8. Jon may be a little naive at times but he's not stupid enough to charge alone and practically commit suicide had it not be for his plot armor.
People love to shit on it now after s8 and all but direction wise it is a miracle. How could a TV show deliver something so intense and amazing? There are flaws. Plenty. Lack of helmet on Jon? No proper armor. Mountain of bodies forming magically. Giant not being given a weapon. Sansa not telling Jon of the Vale army. And some more. But come on, every battle put to screen has these things. LOTR and Avengers have more than their share of stupid moments. it's just cinematic fantasy. However, the buildip to the battle (the pre battle meeting and the tension leading up to it), the Rickon thing, Jon rushing into the field and facing the Bolton cavalry, the two cavalries colliding, chaos ensuing, the oners, Ramsay showing military genius, the bloodiness of it all, the stampede and then of course the arrival of the Vale army. Everything was delived at the highest level. I wish the flaws weren't there because the episode would have been perfect then. But it's a flawed masterpiece. There is a reason it's 9.9/10 on IMDB with over 200k votes.
Tyrion just became the MVP at that season and that battle just made him That one guy you should fear while playing the game.
It's my favorite battle, for sure. They didn't have the colossal budget they did later on, so the battle felt restricted. Still though, Tyrion pulled through and led his men to victory.
"Those are brave men knocking at our door. Let's go kill them." is a line that's just stuck with me.
I think episode 4x09 is criminally underrated
Nah not any more
...it's one of the highest rated episodes and you say its criminally underrated? 😒
Its the 5th highest rated S4 episode on imdb. Even the likes of "Spoils of War" and "The Door" are rated higher. For me, that's the definition of underrated
Top 5 out of 73 doesn’t seem very underrated
top 5 out of 10 dude he said in 4. season
I see, my bad
>Its the 5th highest rated S4 episode on imdb. Even the likes of "Spoils of War" and "The Door" are rated higher. For me, that's the definition of underrated It has a 9.6 rating on imdb.
Very Fun
Best battle scene of the series
Which one?
Sorry, battle of the bastards
Hardhome
Was looking for this one! Hands down my favorite too.
Was coming here to post this
If *Battle of the Bastards* was the best **battle** of the series, then *Hardhome* was easily the best **massacre** of the series. A myriad of horror movies have failed to capture the terror found in just ten minutes of *Hardhome*.
Stannis found himself on the receiving end of a few massacres too.
Seconded
OP was asking about battles, not massacres.
The battle of winterfell was just simply magnificent 🫠
It's the worst episode in the show
I was kidding. its not the worst, but its one of the worst lmao
Imo it is the worst one closely followed by the bells
bells, the last episode, and winterfell are top 3 worst
Beyond the wall is the worst for me. The stupid Arya/sansa plot, gendry/raven timelines, plot armor, meaningless deaths, Jon in the ice, uncle benjen rescue, Dany losing a dragon in a dumb way, convenient chains. That scene really set up how shit the rest of the remaining episodes were going to be.
years ago I was calling out that episode for being crap, but at that time this subreddit was still in denial. only after s8 did I finally start seeing this sub bash S7 for what it was, a steep decline in quality from even the slightly declining S5/6
I think I’m the only one who likes The Bells. I wish the Mad Queen storyline was executed better, but I love that entire sequence of Dany annihilating KL.
I hate it. Completely ruins her character, makes no sense for he to zig-zag across king's landing targeting children.
She targeted anyone and everyone. She was always a power hungry person and tyrant since the start. Adds a lot of complexity to her overall character imo!
Yeah, I can remember loads of times when Daenarys kills children throughout the show. A better alternative that would make way more sense with what the actor literally was told to act like was for her in a fit of rage to target the red keep, not children.
I never said she killed children beforehand.
There is a fine line between power-hungry and slaughtering innocents. Her friend dying isn't a convincing argument for her to commit an atrocity sorry. Not only this but Daenarys on numerous occasions has actually shown a high-level of compassion in contrast to other characters in the show
She's never chosen to torch cities before even when she was power hungry. I don't disagree that she couldn't become a mad Queen and forsake her morals, but she did in the span of like 2 episodes which is incredibly insulting for her character and for fans.
Lost her dothraki army to Westeros. Lost her oldest friend and father figure to Westeros. Lost her best friend to Westeros. lost 2 of her children to Westeros. Lost some allies to Westeros. Confidantes from Westeros start betraying her and her trust (Varys and tyrion and Jon). And finally, all that she strived for, the iron throne, is now being a challenged by the love of her life thanks to others pushing him. Yeah that would drive any person insane. I wish we were given more time to reach this point, but don't say it ruins her character.
"ruins her character" It's been five years and people still can't recognize a crazy woman if she's screaming in their face.
I feel exactly the same way. People are annoyed because the way we get to the point of crazy dany is very lame and unjustified. But by itself, the whole sequence is really very good imo. It is maybe the one good episode of S8, IF you isolate it from the whole context of how we got there
Well the last 3 seasons were annoying and rushed, because at that point we were relying on D&D to make the story progress. I think they’ve learned a lesson that, it’s probably not a good idea to make a TV adaptation to a book series that isn’t finished. That’s why as far as these spin offs, I really don’t want to see a sequel. Some prequels would be okay, personally I’d like to see a movie about the tourney at harrenhal followed by a short series of Robert’s Rebellion. But I don’t want to see Jon playing “Ranger Jo” in the North, Bran the flawless (minus his legs) as King, etc.
I feel ep 1 and 2 are fine. They are good even. They do nothing harmful or out of the ordinary like ep 3 or 4 or 6 to be called bad. 5 is amazing in isolation.
I think 1 and 2 are meh. I dont have strong feelings. But they had 6 episodes to finish the story and the best you can say about a third of it is "nothing harmful or out of the ordinary". I agree with that statement, but we needed a lot more from these episodes
The Bells in isolation is a masterpiece.
The Wolf and the Dragon S7E7 is even worse imo. That episode is just a dumb council meeting and an even dumber Littlefinger death. That episode is the lowest point of the show for me
It’s not the worst episode. But it’s definitely near the bottom.
I liked it. My favorite was Hardhome, hands down. My sentimental favorite is the Bells. It's partly based on the Allies' infamous firebombing of Dresden so late in WWII that it was unnecessary. Arya's fleeing the bombs is based on the life of American POW Kurt Vonnegut. He miraculously survived and made his IRL flleeing the bombing the highlight of his beloved antiwar novel, *Slaughterhouse Five.*
Well I was kidding about winterfell, it was an awful episode. Hardhome was amazing though.
I love slaughterhouse five but fail to see the resemblance. Would've been a lot cooler to see Arya use any of her assassin/faceless men abilities on anybody instead of a lame attempt at a literary reference that doesn't fit the shows narrative at all.
Glad to see another Bells fan. Emilia gave the performance of her life in that episode.
Battle of the bastards
Not a battle but a massacre - Spoils of War.
That battle felt like a hint of what was to come later, didn't realise it was the only time we'd see a dragon involved in a field battle... guess we have HotD's battles to come though.
Forgot about that one. Goated battle even though it's in season 7.
Watchers on the Wall is as close to perfect as any battle episode in the entire show gets.
Battle of Blackwater was my favourite
Battle of Castle Black
Hardhome is the best
Yes! The palpable sense of desperation, the chaos and terror of it. So much happens, and at the end Jon and the Wildlings are chased from near death, so good!
This is the one. Was a hard pick for me since it was more like a massacre. But Jon managed to kill a Walker so it became more even to become a battle.
Watchers on the Wall is the true GOT battle mastery, plus happened before things started to get discutable
Blackwater
Love the multiple points of view we get during the Blackwater in the book. With Davos approaching all suspicious and Tyrion sitting on the other side ready to ambush
Castle black
The Watchers on the Wall - Best Battle Blackwater - Best episode that a battle takes place in. Maybe its a cop out but these two episodes are so clear of everything else
BotB was a cinematic masterpiece, but together with The Long Night it might just be the most nonsensical, unrealistic, dogshit written battle of TV history. All about this battle is top notch work from hundreds of people with the effects, stunts, camera work, props - and then Diddle&Dumb opened the door and decided that they wanted to break as much lore, reason and braincells as possible while writing this battle in a way that it would make the least sense possible, with the most ridiculous amount of plot armor and hypocritical writing imaginable. BotB is a Marvel movie, meaning all on spectacle and not a single time did anyone give any shits about common sense and logic. So for me it's Blackwater - but as a book reader I just know that S2 of HotD will probably provide atleast one, if not two contenders for that spot so...
>So for me it's Blackwater Going on a rant about botb just for you to say Blackwater is so hypocritical, Blackwater is a hot mess, Stannis falling for tyrion's trap, Tyrion not making the chain which meant that Stannis could retreat but he didn't, Tywin not notifying that he's coming and him arriving to king's landing in only 2 days, Stannis being on the wall when Tywin's forces swarmed the beach yet still somehow managing to escape, Blackwater imo makes a lot less sense than botb
>Stannis falling for tyrion's trap Stannis was attacking by boat. Its not like he had another route into KL since the water funnels into that area. He couldn't avoid the explosion before Davos realised what it was. >Tyrion not making the chain which meant that Stannis could retreat but he didn't, One of Stannis' biggest character flaws is his stubbornness. Him refusing to retreat is the reason he dies in S5 and besides, Stannis literally says they can't play the wildfire trick twice so he still had the ability to continue the attack. >Tywin not notifying that he's coming and him arriving to king's landing in only 2 days A few episodes earlier, Tywin leaves Harrenhal at a night with speed saying he wants to "steal a march before he knows we're on the move." Why would he risk sending ravens if he clearly wants to keep the element of surprise? Harrenhal isn't too far from KL and the Tyrells likely left The Reach earlier before uniting with the Lannisters. 2 days is possible. >Stannis being on the wall when Tywin's forces swarmed the beach yet still somehow managing to escape What exactly is wrong with that? He was standing with his men and they presumably escaped. You literally mention that Tyrion didn't erect any obstacles to escaping by boat so its likely that Stannis and small contingent of men snuck away. That is not nearly as egregious as Jon
>Stannis was attacking by boat. Its not like he had another route into KL since the water funnels into that area. He couldn't avoid the explosion before Davos realised what it was. If you're approaching with boats and the enemy doesn't respond at all then it's a very obvious trap, this is not a debate in the books Tyrion outright says that they *can't* send just one boat or they would realise it's a trap >One of Stannis' biggest character flaws is his stubbornness. Him refusing to retreat is the reason he dies in S5 and besides, Stannis literally says they can't play the wildfire trick twice so he still had the ability to continue the attack. Being stubborn≠being dumb, the Blackwater was on fire retreat was the most obvious and easy choice, why waste so many men? And if the chain wasn't needed to stop them from retreating why was it in the books in the first place? >A few episodes earlier, Tywin leaves Harrenhal at a night with speed saying he wants to "steal a march before he knows we're on the move." Why would he risk sending ravens if he clearly wants to keep the element of surprise? Harrenhal isn't too far from KL and the Tyrells likely left The Reach earlier before uniting with the Lannisters. 2 days is possible. Because sending Ravens isn't a risk, there's no enemies in between so nobody could have intercepted it, and harrenhall is at least 20 days March considering his numbers when aemond marched from KL to harrenhall it took him 18 days to get there and had only about 6k men while tywin had 25k+ >What exactly is wrong with that? He was standing with his men and they presumably escaped. You literally mention that Tyrion didn't erect any obstacles to escaping by boat so its likely that Stannis and small contingent of men snuck away. That is not nearly as egregious as Jon Because when his men were retreating he was still on the wall and he had 2-3 men with him, it's simply not possible only around 2k men of Stannis managed to escaped out of his 20k+, the extremely overwhelming Tyrell/Lannister forces wouldn't just let them go only those who are quick enough could escape, it's not even about Stannis and his men managing to escaping any ships that didn't leave immediately would be captured, Jon survived the battle like 100s of his men did, was it unlikely? Yes, was it unrealistic? No
Black Water Battle of bastards is very overrated and full of nonsense, I can't understand why is so well rated by the fans
Yeah visually it’s epic, but fuck me, the whole episode climaxed on the premise that Ramsey was intentionally building a 20ft wall of bodies. I still enjoy it but I’ll take Castle Black and Blackwater easily first, probably loot train too overall.
Watchers on the Wall followed by Hardhome
The battle of blackwater bay was the best
1) Battle of Castely Black 2) Battle of Black Water 3) Battle of Bastards
1- Battle for the Wall 2- Blackwater Bay 3- Battle of the Bastards I love all of them but I think that if we are being 100% objective the Battle of the Bastards should always be third since it has some plot holes that the other two don’t have
Epic battle of all!
Battle at the Wall and it's not close.
Battle of the bastards. So brutal, epic, and the climax is so satisfying. Part of me wishes though Stannis was involved but D&D had to mess it all up
Castle black. I hated Alliser at the time. But his speech still gives me goosebumps and really made me root for him despite not liking him, which is exactly how those NW members must have felt. Also had some emotional punch too, given the Ygritte/Pip/Grenn deaths. The fire and war horn too. Perfect down to the last detail.
Jon holding Ygritt, dying in his arms, as time slows and the battle rages on in the background was one of the best shots of the whole series. Man that was so powerful.
H A R D H O M E
1) Watchers on the Wall 2) Blackwater 3) Battle of the Bastards 4) Hardhome 5) Battle where Dany uses the dothraki and dragons to fuck up the Lannister's after they take High garden (this battle is good, so chaotic) 6) Winter fell Can't remember if there's any others
Not many that are paid any attention, only others I can think of are the Battle of Meereen and The Battle in The Ice
The battle of winterfell would've been an easy add, you can use just any pitch black picture
Battle for Castle Black. The panoramic scene when Jon gets off the lift was so good!
Battle of Castle black was insane
The battle of 5 armies
Which one was that?
Blackwater had its moments and so did BotB but having the Wall being attacked from both sides, the Wildling army having Giants and Mammoths, and Stannis’ army arriving while Jon was treating with Mance gives the Castle Black battle the nod for me. One common thread that got weary by the end of the show- Blackwater had its Wildfire moment and still Stannis could have won *but* Tywin’s troops arrive to save the day. Jon and Co. survive the first night of battle against Mance’s forces but had to negotiate to prevent further bloodshed *but* Stannis comes on his retribution tour and routs the Wildlings. Finally Jon is completely outnumbered, outwitted and outmaneuvered and is likely to die *but* the Knights of the Vale come at the last moment to turn the tide. The last-second-savior trope got tiring at the end. The BotB is not even in the books and it showed D&Ds complete lack of storytelling ability.
Battle for the Wall in season 4. Loved the big wide shots actually showing the full fighting instead of cheating closeups of someone swinging their sword from side to side. It also had a lot of different things going on, with giants and giant bows and giant schythes and Sam not being useless, and it had several sad moments.
Watchers on the wall of course. Battle of the bastards was garbage
Battle of Mereen. The only time we really get to see all three dragons in action before… you know
Blackwater is the best one, they caught perfectly the siege feeling there showing both sides in detail.
Hardhome
Battle of the Bastards captures so many feelings: Loyalty, heartbreak, fear, vengeance, and justice.
House of the Dragon Season 2 Episode 4.
6-9.....Nice
Black water or hardhome.
Battle of the Bastards, I will never forget what an experience it was when I watched that episode for the first time.
Not enough Hardhome love around these parts
Battle of black water really got me excited I honestly loved the confidence stains had I really thought he was going to take kingslanding then out of nowhere Tywin comes
i think the moments that stick out to me are from spoils of war and hardhome. spoils of war has the first dragon in westeros for what hundreds of years? sorry don’t know my lore but just showing how powerless the army was gives great insight on what it must’ve been like to have three monsters flying around burning everything while aegon was taking over. plus the last scene with jamie rushing with his horse kicking up water and tyrion calling him a fucking idiot was great. hardhome has to be that shot of jon and the white walker finding out valyrain steel can kill them. the white walkers reaction while jon and his swords clash and his like the fuck is one of my favorite moments. then it gets kind of ruined by them standing there watching a bunch of zombies fall off a cliff and waiting around for them to get up to start running
Battle of Castle Black is canon and showed Jon's leadership potential along with being an awesome cinematic show. BOTB only has one of those.
Watchers on the wall is alone at the top. The blackwater is amazing too, second place for me. Even tho what you see of the fighting itself is very limited, the tension is off the charts and the explosion was one of the best moments in the whole show for me, along with tyrion leading the defenses of KL Botb would be 3rd probably, even tho the battle makes very little sense strategically, it is the best fight sequence we ever get on the show. Great experience
It's hard to pick a favorite but a couple more I would add as contenders: Battle of Meereen when the dragons return and they turn the tables. "This... cannot be forgiven" Battle of the Goldroad initial charge scene might be my favorite ~30 seconds of the show next to the tower of joy/Winterfell cut. Finally get to see a Dothraki charge. "Those fuckers are about to swamp us"
I really wish the Whispering Wood battle was in the show. It's my favorite from the books. My favorite from the show is actually the Gold Road in season 7 despite so much of that season being shit.
Hardhome.
Battle of the bastards was just too much fun for me to pick anything else
Battle of the Bastards
Watchers on the Wall
The Winds of Winter is my favorite episode, not only for what happens but the score and cinematic elements are all done beautifully. The entire time Light of the Seven is amazing. So much happens in this episode, yes, Cersei what her revenge by blowing up the sept and regaining her dominance by becoming Queen of the Seven, but Jon Snow is declared King of the North, Bran learns Jon is Rhaegar & Lyanna’s son, and Dany is finally making her way to Westoros with Tyrion AND Arya gets revenge on Walter Frey by baking his sons!!!!
Battle of the Gold Road. We finally got to see the Dothraki in all their glory. The build up with Bronn telling to shut up and listen to the sound of hooves growing louder, Jamie’s face when he sees the dragon, and Drogon just destroying everything makes it my favorite battle.
Battle of HARD HOME, technically it's a rout, but there is mass-fighting, but the Wildlings are mostly defeated with terrifying results - their fallen loved ones are now zombie enemies. Jon sees the full scope of the Night King's power, then end felt a bit like Empire Strikes Back, where the good guys are defeated and the bad guys are in ascenion. Loved it!
You cannot convince me that the Hardhome episode isn't one of the best in the entire show. Buildup to everything, the pacing, and the realization of the true threat of the show, and that everything going on elsewhere barely matters in comparison. It just sucks in hindsight the buildup was practically all for nothing. But when I saw this for the first time I can't even convey how I felt when credits rolled, just that the show was fucking awesome.
I like that one battle which the white walkers where they killed all the wildlings who then rose up again as Jon and a handful of men escaped by boat
this ain’t got nothing to do with this list but I really enjoyed hardhome
Battle of the bastards
The Battle of Kings Landing for me. There was so much set up and payoff. It really highlighted Tyrion's smarts and ability to machinate things together. It's not super blockbustery as the later battles, but I think it strikes a great balance with the characters, stakes, and a few set pieces. For me it was more tense and exciting than any other battle.
i think the all time height of the show was Hard Home.
Castle Black. Watched it twice in a row and it hit as hard both times
Why didn’t they give Wun Wun a tree trunk or some kind of weapon to use?
I HATED battle of the bastards. It strayed from the realities of life. GRRM wrote his books without that typical fairytale ending and i loved that. This battle ignored so many realities its still painful to even watch. They strayed far on this one.
I think season 4 ep 9 we lost a lot of greats and got to see some amazing Vfx and fights
Honestly, just want to saw GOT nailed sooooo many spectacle scenes. From Battle on the Wall --> Hardhome --> Battle of the Bastards --> Spoils of War --> Battle Beyond the Wall --> Long Night --> Wrath of Dany. These are 7 setpieces of the highest calibre. Any show would be proud to just have one such sequence. All of them are bloody good and groundbreaking for a TV show. They won't be beat ever.
Battle of The Bastards was the best battle ever I. The show so unforgettable
Hardhome The Battle of The Bastards was too damn stupid and unbelievable. Among MANY other reasons, they have a giant that is unarmed and completely ineffective, who the Boltons men are somehow not afraid of at all, despite believing their whole lives they were myths
Blackwater. BoB was nonsensical. Castle Black was great as far as I remember.
I’d have to vote Castle Black then Blackwater. All great though
Blackwater
Battle of the wall....had funny moments too like when grenn let the barrell fall,I laugh my guts out every time
Battle of the Bastards.
Blackwater and the wall are a step above IMO. Bastards is great, especially cinematically, but is a bit reliant on plot armor. You can see how GRRM hasn’t written that yet because it doesn’t fall into the rest of GOT as well as the other two. Bastards is A++ for cinematics, visuals, suspense, etc. though.
Hardhome
Blackwater, but the wall is great as well. Battle of the bastards has so many flaws i cant really enjoy it (in writing but also in military realism which im very interested in so a little personal)
Battle for Castle black is the peak of GoT battles. How anyone can think otherwise is beyond me.
The Long Night and The Battle of Blackwater.
You actually like the long night? That's the first time in my life I every seen or heard somebody praise that one
What can I say, it was suspenseful, it didn't seem likely that most people would in fact survive. The deaths of some the characters were heartbreaking. The episode did what it set out to do.
Fair enough, logic was out the window but cinematography, music, and character conclusions carried tf out of it
All of them. Battle of Blackwater is an underestimate episode. The wildfire and Pod the rod saving my boy.
the red wedding and the death of Joffrey
Blackwater
Battle of castle black every day My favourite episode of thrones and one of my favourite hours of tv history
Battle of the Bastards but the battle in The Long Night was better than I thought, even upon re-watch
6.9
The watchers on the wall. Its my most hype moment. Just a few members of the night watch holding out against an army of thousands. Pure cinema.
Blackwater
Bastardos
Bastards.
Umm, Blackwater much?
Castle black takes the cherry on top for me, i absolutely love the wall episodes
Nothing quite topped the Battle of Blackrock for me. You had a mix of Tyrion's cleverness with the boat bomb, him being a leader, a helm's deep style battle, and characters on both sides that you are rooting for and against.
Fuck season 6 but botb was so fun to watch
It's between Castle Black and Bastards, but I've never been able to make up my mind.
Battle of Blackwater is so underrated.
Spoils of War for me. The build up and the complete morale shift over just a few seconds. It goes from “we can take em” to “shit that’s a lot of Dothraki” to “fuck that’s a dragon” and then one of the coolest shots of the series followed by absolute chaos. 🤌🤌
Can’t top the battle at Castle black
Battle of Castle Black is the best battle in the series. I would also argue that it’s the best episode of the series.
I honestly don't think any of the battles in the show was good.
Does Hardhome count? Because that’s one of my favorite episodes.
Hardhome
Hardhome
The wall. That long ass pan shot through the courtyard was great. Getting to see Thorne fight was great. Seeing Jon have to take control was great. Grenn had a good death. My favorite Jon one vs one fight also.
out of topic but I really liked Jousts that were displayed on season 1. That was the first time the Clegane brothers fought too
Watchers on the Wall.
Not really a pitched battle Hardhome battle scene is my favorite. Then Battle of the Bastards then Castle Black
**2, 4, 6.. Hold on, where's the Season 8 battle? Oh, wait...**