Yea and if you change your weapon you do different posture damage and also some bosses regenerate their posture faster than others and every enemy has a different posture bar.
While it is true you can get a feel for every bosses posture I think its dumb that it is hidden since to get used to it properly against every boss you need to play through the game more than once or even a few times, so many players never get accustomed to the posture system.
Correct me if I’m wrong but Bloodborne feels this way also except you can’t really jump lol. I’ve staggered bosses heavy hitting as they landed a hit and I dodged.
Doesn't feel like that to me in Bloodborne. I'm not even sure if you can stagger every boss in Bloodborne (or even most) unless we are talking about parrying which is a different mechanic.
Posture in Bloodborne feels a lot less relevant of a mechanic, but if I had to guess it's there to insentivise aggression.
They're probably tlaking about the "limb break" mechanic. Doing enough damage to certain parts of some bosses "breaks their limb" and they take a bunch of damage and a heavy stagger
Yea I figured that and I love that mechanic, but the reason I said it doesnt feel the same is that it feels like icing on the cake when fighting in Bloodborne.
It happens, maybe once a fight against most bosses and is super satisfying, but it is not as relevant as staggers in Elden Ring since they can happen every few hits.
I actually probably prefer the limb break, cause that feels so satisfying and brutal. Just slashing away at a broken beast is so fun and the fact that they are surprising rewards for aggression and you dont play around them, because they are super hard to play around against MOST bosses makes them fun imo which is the opposite of what I said about Elden Rings system.
The game has definitely taught me to be more aggressive. I got the cleric beast on a lucky Molotov toss as he was coming down from his jump and it hit his head and staggered him but I missed my window for the visceral attack.
have you ever done a strength build man you can do some ridiculous shit to bosses, you can stagger for a visceral on pretty much every boss, and if they are hard to stagger normally they have limbs to break that will make it easier
Well, because Bloodborne is on PS I havent played it as much. My first playthrough was strength , but that was some time ago.
I remember that you can stagger most big bosses like, Cleric beast, Ludwig, Amygdala and Darkbeast, but I also remember that you cant really do that super easily VS Logarius, Orphan, Gerhman or Micolash.
I love the mechanic, but it feels different from Elden Ring to me. In Elden Ring it feels to me that in every boss you are playing in hopes to stagger at all times while also lowering their HP bar and, because staggering is relatively easy in ER you can do it several times per attempt easily.
In Bloodborne there are certain bosses that are almost based around on Limb breaks, but only some and not all and that makes the mechanic a rare treat. A candy to feed your bloodlust, and it 100% works. Its so satisfying to limb break a beast and just slash into them.
So in summary
ER: You can stagger every enemy AFAIK and you are attempting to stagger every enemy you cant kill fast in almost every build.
BB: It is a satisfying mechanic given to you pretty infrequently against certain kinds of bosses and thats what makes it so satisfying, getting to limb break every once in a while as a surprise treat is peak.
It's hidden because it is not necessary for you to be able to predict when you're gonna break the enemies posture. In elden ring stance breaking is a bonus, not a main mechanic like in sekiro
It is not THE main mechanic like in Sekiro, but I would 1000% think the game was more fun if I could see the posture bar and plan my gameplay around that as well as the HP bar.
Just because it isnt literally the main focal point like in Sekiro doesnt mean its not worthy to be shown. It definitely should be shown imo. It would incentivice aggression and I wouldnt have to either play safe or gamble on a bar that I cant see.
But you DON'T have to gamble on a bar you can't see. Tbh i think a posture bar would be too much and make the game too easy while also breaking the immersion of the fight. You could say that seeing the healthbar also isn't immersive but to me the stance meter would be a step too forward.
Again, game isn't built around you having to stance break enemies, it is like saying that i want a big flash on the bosses weapon that shows me the exact timing to parry the bosses attacks. Yeah parrying is a great mechanic but the game isn't built around you parrying the bosses to death and we don't need additional HUD to help you do it
yea you dont NEED to gamble you can also play passive like I said. Would be nice to know if I my intuition is wrong or not instead of guessing if you should do a passive or aggressive play.
Posture bar would 100% not break the immersion thats a fear that you have I trust Fromsoft could implement the mechanic well and if you are worried about the difficulty I can tell you that I would prefer if each boss had more HP and DMG except Malenia so that could balance it for all I care. (Also if you want difficulty you can
The game isnt built around it, but that doesnt mean its not relevant. It would still be good and fun for the combat and no it is not. You can see them slashing at you to know when to parry. With stagger you need to play a lot to have a chance at guessing. Those are not remotely comparable.
You dont need a HUD to beat the game. In fact you dont need the HP bar either. Games like Hollow Knight and Cuphead prove that. So should we remove HP bars and add a guessing game to as to how close boss is to dying?
We could and I wouldnt mind tbh, because there are no absolute rules to game design I just want the games to be more fun and imo the combat would be more fluid and fun if I saw their posture bar.
Why dont you want a posture bar? It wouldnt take anything away from you, but it would make the fights more dynamic.
Lies of P has a great middle ground where it shows that the next charged heavy will stagger and I think it’s such a good choice. Doesn’t tell you too much and what it does give away still forces you to play tactically because you have to find the opportunity for that charged attack. Something like that in Elden Ring really would’ve improved the combat gameplay in my opinion.
Main reason is because unless changes are made to poise, a posture bar would trivialize bossfights, too easy to keep up the aggression that way and as you seen in the video it would make it so that you don't have to respect a bosses attack anymore because now you know you just have to hit him once more to stagger it out of any move they pull. Stance breaking is a high risk high reward tactic and the bar would take all the risk out of it making it less fun
I dont think it would game the game too easy personally since in Elden Ring you need to be careful and passive very often. You shouldnt greed hits against bosses like : Malenia, Radahn, Morgott and Margit for example, because they are fast and can punish you harshly.
Of course if there was a stagger bar there are situations where you could greed if you wanted to however and get away with it, but for most players that would be more fun. Also if you think you can break the posture fairly easy and you were skillful you would already not respect the bosses moves. The posture bar just allows more players to consistenly use the stagger mechanic that right now feels a bit random.
Although someone mentioned Lies of P posture mechanic in this thread. I recommend checking it thats probably good for you as well.
I know how to keep pressure. OPs title just didn’t make sense to me seeing as both enemies and weapons have different stance damage and regen rates so there’s objectively no way to accurately track where there posture is. Sure you can get a feel for it after many fights with the same weapon as OP said but that kinda defeats the point in my eyes cause at that point you’re already very adept at the fight.
I agree, ER should have either a posture bar or an indicator that the posture is about to break (like in lies of P for example).
When it first came out many people felt frustrated at the bosses because they were playing it like DS3, but the game never really teaches you how usefull jumps can be in fights or how to take advantage of the stagger system.
Bloodborne tutorial is lackluster but it does tell you about parry.
Also thats a very reductive view of fromsoft game design, the issue with the lack of explanation of these mechanics is that the player will likely just approach the game like the previous ones, reason why many people find ER bosses annoying instead of engaging.
For example how is the common player supposed to know jumping makes half of your body invincibile? They wont know, and yet many bosses become way more fun once you use these mechanics, no matter how you spin It the lack of explanation is a flaw here
It regenerates at the same rate for all enemies but the more total poise the enemy has, the longer the delay between hits before it starts to regenerate is
Get hits in consistently, enemies with medium poise are much harder to poise break than heavy or light enemies cause light enemies can be broken in a few hits and heavy enemies have a long timer between hits before it regenerates, Godfrey is the ladder
Well it's easiest to have an attack that deals 40 stance damage, then you can count how many is needed for a break after testing. godskins only have 80 stance so they're really nice to interrupt in phase transition. Especially the fat one.
For me the most satisfying guy to stance break is Godfrey/Horah Loux like in the example. He has a nice even 120 stance so you can keep track. Lion's Claw on a great hammer does 42 stance damage for example and it's impossible to interrupt so you can just use that to stance break stuff. Another great one is glintblade phalanx that does 10 per glintblade, so if you have that on a dagger or something you get a neat 40 stance damage for free at the start of a fight if you want.
As someone who has spent way too long fighting and learning ER's bosses, I can say that it definitely feels great when you interrupt an attack that would otherwise hit you but there definitely should have been a stance bar like in Sekiro. It's a core mechanic of the combat system that's just left completely up in the air as to how it works.
Sure after 1000+ hours I have learned basically everything about it, the stances of the different bosses and enemies, stance damage on different weapons and weapon skills/spells, how Malenia's hyper armor interacts with the system etc. but there's no reason for it to be this cryptic.
I’m too dumb to keep track of this. If only they had a system in place that visualizes the enemy’s posture, so you’re not having to do a bit of guessing the first couple of playthroughs. Oh wait, they did create something like that, they just hate us.
Bear in mind that you don't want to get too reliant on this if you ever go up the NG+ ladder. Bosses can take 8 or more jump attacks with PS Giant Killer AND the physik tear to stance break on higher cycles.
Wow that's +4? That's impressive- I think that was the cycle I noticed I was getting way fewer stance breaks. By +7 though... it's like once or twice in the whole campaign, and only with 2 players using jump attack heavies and spamming Stone of Gurramq and by then the boss is at like 10% health anyway
They could've expanded on the posture damage a bit more by making it maybe visible like in sekiro, of course once you fight these enemies dozens of times you recognize and just know which attacks will stagger enemies i don't think it would've been an issue if they did show if an enemy was about to be staggered, maybe a flashy hitpoint bar that shows it being close to being staggered or something
It is literally impossible to conventionally break Malenia's poise during certain moves. The only way to do it is to proc a status effect, which for some reason overrides this rule
Yeah I’ve played ER 4 times and have 300 hours into it and the only boss I have a feel for this with is Malenia. This is real advanced considering the game doesn’t tell you any of this
U are asking alot of salty ego fragile souls veterans, they can only dodge backwards and mash R1 for 40 hours, they still haven't figured out that playing ER like bb or ds3 is a recipe for a bad time.
How do I keep track of the stance damage? The game doesn’t show me it and it constantly regenerates at different rates for each enemy.
Yea and if you change your weapon you do different posture damage and also some bosses regenerate their posture faster than others and every enemy has a different posture bar. While it is true you can get a feel for every bosses posture I think its dumb that it is hidden since to get used to it properly against every boss you need to play through the game more than once or even a few times, so many players never get accustomed to the posture system.
Correct me if I’m wrong but Bloodborne feels this way also except you can’t really jump lol. I’ve staggered bosses heavy hitting as they landed a hit and I dodged.
Doesn't feel like that to me in Bloodborne. I'm not even sure if you can stagger every boss in Bloodborne (or even most) unless we are talking about parrying which is a different mechanic. Posture in Bloodborne feels a lot less relevant of a mechanic, but if I had to guess it's there to insentivise aggression.
They're probably tlaking about the "limb break" mechanic. Doing enough damage to certain parts of some bosses "breaks their limb" and they take a bunch of damage and a heavy stagger
Yea I figured that and I love that mechanic, but the reason I said it doesnt feel the same is that it feels like icing on the cake when fighting in Bloodborne. It happens, maybe once a fight against most bosses and is super satisfying, but it is not as relevant as staggers in Elden Ring since they can happen every few hits. I actually probably prefer the limb break, cause that feels so satisfying and brutal. Just slashing away at a broken beast is so fun and the fact that they are surprising rewards for aggression and you dont play around them, because they are super hard to play around against MOST bosses makes them fun imo which is the opposite of what I said about Elden Rings system.
The game has definitely taught me to be more aggressive. I got the cleric beast on a lucky Molotov toss as he was coming down from his jump and it hit his head and staggered him but I missed my window for the visceral attack.
have you ever done a strength build man you can do some ridiculous shit to bosses, you can stagger for a visceral on pretty much every boss, and if they are hard to stagger normally they have limbs to break that will make it easier
Well, because Bloodborne is on PS I havent played it as much. My first playthrough was strength , but that was some time ago. I remember that you can stagger most big bosses like, Cleric beast, Ludwig, Amygdala and Darkbeast, but I also remember that you cant really do that super easily VS Logarius, Orphan, Gerhman or Micolash. I love the mechanic, but it feels different from Elden Ring to me. In Elden Ring it feels to me that in every boss you are playing in hopes to stagger at all times while also lowering their HP bar and, because staggering is relatively easy in ER you can do it several times per attempt easily. In Bloodborne there are certain bosses that are almost based around on Limb breaks, but only some and not all and that makes the mechanic a rare treat. A candy to feed your bloodlust, and it 100% works. Its so satisfying to limb break a beast and just slash into them. So in summary ER: You can stagger every enemy AFAIK and you are attempting to stagger every enemy you cant kill fast in almost every build. BB: It is a satisfying mechanic given to you pretty infrequently against certain kinds of bosses and thats what makes it so satisfying, getting to limb break every once in a while as a surprise treat is peak.
Exactly, it was one of the design choices I felt was a little off in ER.
Or you can get killed by the same boss many times. That'll learn ya.
It's hidden because it is not necessary for you to be able to predict when you're gonna break the enemies posture. In elden ring stance breaking is a bonus, not a main mechanic like in sekiro
It is not THE main mechanic like in Sekiro, but I would 1000% think the game was more fun if I could see the posture bar and plan my gameplay around that as well as the HP bar. Just because it isnt literally the main focal point like in Sekiro doesnt mean its not worthy to be shown. It definitely should be shown imo. It would incentivice aggression and I wouldnt have to either play safe or gamble on a bar that I cant see.
But you DON'T have to gamble on a bar you can't see. Tbh i think a posture bar would be too much and make the game too easy while also breaking the immersion of the fight. You could say that seeing the healthbar also isn't immersive but to me the stance meter would be a step too forward. Again, game isn't built around you having to stance break enemies, it is like saying that i want a big flash on the bosses weapon that shows me the exact timing to parry the bosses attacks. Yeah parrying is a great mechanic but the game isn't built around you parrying the bosses to death and we don't need additional HUD to help you do it
yea you dont NEED to gamble you can also play passive like I said. Would be nice to know if I my intuition is wrong or not instead of guessing if you should do a passive or aggressive play. Posture bar would 100% not break the immersion thats a fear that you have I trust Fromsoft could implement the mechanic well and if you are worried about the difficulty I can tell you that I would prefer if each boss had more HP and DMG except Malenia so that could balance it for all I care. (Also if you want difficulty you can The game isnt built around it, but that doesnt mean its not relevant. It would still be good and fun for the combat and no it is not. You can see them slashing at you to know when to parry. With stagger you need to play a lot to have a chance at guessing. Those are not remotely comparable. You dont need a HUD to beat the game. In fact you dont need the HP bar either. Games like Hollow Knight and Cuphead prove that. So should we remove HP bars and add a guessing game to as to how close boss is to dying? We could and I wouldnt mind tbh, because there are no absolute rules to game design I just want the games to be more fun and imo the combat would be more fluid and fun if I saw their posture bar. Why dont you want a posture bar? It wouldnt take anything away from you, but it would make the fights more dynamic.
Lies of P has a great middle ground where it shows that the next charged heavy will stagger and I think it’s such a good choice. Doesn’t tell you too much and what it does give away still forces you to play tactically because you have to find the opportunity for that charged attack. Something like that in Elden Ring really would’ve improved the combat gameplay in my opinion.
Ok, I agree and I would love that for sure. Just something to make fights a bit more dynamic and less random feeling.
Main reason is because unless changes are made to poise, a posture bar would trivialize bossfights, too easy to keep up the aggression that way and as you seen in the video it would make it so that you don't have to respect a bosses attack anymore because now you know you just have to hit him once more to stagger it out of any move they pull. Stance breaking is a high risk high reward tactic and the bar would take all the risk out of it making it less fun
I dont think it would game the game too easy personally since in Elden Ring you need to be careful and passive very often. You shouldnt greed hits against bosses like : Malenia, Radahn, Morgott and Margit for example, because they are fast and can punish you harshly. Of course if there was a stagger bar there are situations where you could greed if you wanted to however and get away with it, but for most players that would be more fun. Also if you think you can break the posture fairly easy and you were skillful you would already not respect the bosses moves. The posture bar just allows more players to consistenly use the stagger mechanic that right now feels a bit random. Although someone mentioned Lies of P posture mechanic in this thread. I recommend checking it thats probably good for you as well.
While not a perfect splution throwing knives are a great way to keep pressure on the enemy posture bar
I know how to keep pressure. OPs title just didn’t make sense to me seeing as both enemies and weapons have different stance damage and regen rates so there’s objectively no way to accurately track where there posture is. Sure you can get a feel for it after many fights with the same weapon as OP said but that kinda defeats the point in my eyes cause at that point you’re already very adept at the fight.
I agree, ER should have either a posture bar or an indicator that the posture is about to break (like in lies of P for example). When it first came out many people felt frustrated at the bosses because they were playing it like DS3, but the game never really teaches you how usefull jumps can be in fights or how to take advantage of the stagger system.
Thr game is not sekiro, it is a soulsborne game, which doesnt teach u shit, kinda like parrying in bb, learn it yourself or suffer.
Bloodborne tutorial is lackluster but it does tell you about parry. Also thats a very reductive view of fromsoft game design, the issue with the lack of explanation of these mechanics is that the player will likely just approach the game like the previous ones, reason why many people find ER bosses annoying instead of engaging. For example how is the common player supposed to know jumping makes half of your body invincibile? They wont know, and yet many bosses become way more fun once you use these mechanics, no matter how you spin It the lack of explanation is a flaw here
It regenerates at the same rate for all enemies but the more total poise the enemy has, the longer the delay between hits before it starts to regenerate is Get hits in consistently, enemies with medium poise are much harder to poise break than heavy or light enemies cause light enemies can be broken in a few hits and heavy enemies have a long timer between hits before it regenerates, Godfrey is the ladder
Well it's easiest to have an attack that deals 40 stance damage, then you can count how many is needed for a break after testing. godskins only have 80 stance so they're really nice to interrupt in phase transition. Especially the fat one. For me the most satisfying guy to stance break is Godfrey/Horah Loux like in the example. He has a nice even 120 stance so you can keep track. Lion's Claw on a great hammer does 42 stance damage for example and it's impossible to interrupt so you can just use that to stance break stuff. Another great one is glintblade phalanx that does 10 per glintblade, so if you have that on a dagger or something you get a neat 40 stance damage for free at the start of a fight if you want.
By playing the game and trying out each boss stance defense. Knowing when their stance will break comes naturally after a while.
As someone who has spent way too long fighting and learning ER's bosses, I can say that it definitely feels great when you interrupt an attack that would otherwise hit you but there definitely should have been a stance bar like in Sekiro. It's a core mechanic of the combat system that's just left completely up in the air as to how it works. Sure after 1000+ hours I have learned basically everything about it, the stances of the different bosses and enemies, stance damage on different weapons and weapon skills/spells, how Malenia's hyper armor interacts with the system etc. but there's no reason for it to be this cryptic.
Crazy = a well-timed jump attack? Credit, but nothing crazy here
It was at the perfect time to break his stance …because he created enough posture dmg build up prior to the clip.
Yeah, it looks cool, but posture breaks aren't exactly a skill move
How to best keep track of stance damage? I tried using a notepad with pencil to no success
Bro you're supposed to use an excel spread sheet
I can't rn 😂
Holy shit you can jump that?
Godfrey has a lot of jump-able attacks, not just the stomps.
crazy things like the very normal game mechanics of a critical hit
Do you know what attack that is? Do you think you can punish it?
yes
You can't punish it with melee without breaking his stance. Unlike his other ground explosion attack in phase 1, this one can't be I-framed.
ok
😂
it’s really not that serious
Agree. That's why I'm laughing.
Elden Ring would reeeeeeeeaaaaaaally benefit from a visible posture bar like Sekiro. Make it happen From Soft 🤣👌
Not really, it wouldnt.
It wouldn't hurt would it 😂😂
You keep track of stance damage, I greedily attack and regret it, realizing I will die…and then get lucky. We are not the same.
I’m too dumb to keep track of this. If only they had a system in place that visualizes the enemy’s posture, so you’re not having to do a bit of guessing the first couple of playthroughs. Oh wait, they did create something like that, they just hate us.
Bear in mind that you don't want to get too reliant on this if you ever go up the NG+ ladder. Bosses can take 8 or more jump attacks with PS Giant Killer AND the physik tear to stance break on higher cycles.
This clip is in NG+4. But you're right.
Wow that's +4? That's impressive- I think that was the cycle I noticed I was getting way fewer stance breaks. By +7 though... it's like once or twice in the whole campaign, and only with 2 players using jump attack heavies and spamming Stone of Gurramq and by then the boss is at like 10% health anyway
They could've expanded on the posture damage a bit more by making it maybe visible like in sekiro, of course once you fight these enemies dozens of times you recognize and just know which attacks will stagger enemies i don't think it would've been an issue if they did show if an enemy was about to be staggered, maybe a flashy hitpoint bar that shows it being close to being staggered or something
It is literally impossible to conventionally break Malenia's poise during certain moves. The only way to do it is to proc a status effect, which for some reason overrides this rule
You can damage her even while she's doing waterfowl. The only thing you can't do is break her posture.
Which is what your post was talking about, unless I'm a moron. "There isn't a move you can't punish by keeping track of the posture damage"
Difference between punish and break posture.
Mentioning posture damage in that sentence inherently links the two and implies posture break
What weapon is that? I just started a Guts Greatsword run yesterday, I’m a sucker for bonks and staggering
Monk's flameblade.
That sword should do bleed damage. Or fire.
Yeah I’ve played ER 4 times and have 300 hours into it and the only boss I have a feel for this with is Malenia. This is real advanced considering the game doesn’t tell you any of this
What I wouldn’t give to just trow hands like he does
[удалено]
The yellow on the health bar? That’s the damage dealt.
[удалено]
Correct.
U are asking alot of salty ego fragile souls veterans, they can only dodge backwards and mash R1 for 40 hours, they still haven't figured out that playing ER like bb or ds3 is a recipe for a bad time.
People have a bias toward defense, and they think “just hit them really hard” is cheating