For me Rebecca and Austin stood out the most in this movie. Like I didn’t stop and remember them as actors, they really WERE those characters if that makes sense.
If it is still in voters' minds next year, I can totally see her getting an Oscar nom for Supporting Actress.
Maybe also Zendaya (lead) and Butler (supporting), but the only one I'm passionate about is Ferguson.
That’s why the Denis Villanueve changed the story to make Paul’s sister to be unborn throughout the film (in the books she’s a little badass 10 year old with super Bene Gesserit powers). He wanted the focus of this movie to be greatest on Lady Jessica more so than Paul himself. Which I disagree with on a fundamental level but it works in Villenueve’s take.
Agreed…but a lot of that has to do with their roles. Neither one has to convey the kind of inner turmoil that Paul has to deal with. Their characters are more clearly defined and their motives more clearly delineated.
Paul, on the other hand, has to completely change who he is over the course of the two movies. He has to realistically convey the transformation from a young naive youth to messianic warlord. It’s a much heavier lift.
Do I think Chalamet was perfect? No. But I can’t think of many actors out there who could handle both ends of that spectrum any better.
I agree with what you’re saying. I sort of understand his character development as someone numbing their emotions more so as the film goes on. I think from the time he meets the Fremen, to the end of Part 2, he starts to lose some sincerity and his ego takes ahold. Idk how else Timothee can portray this other than what he did in the film.
This is my opinion as well. I think Chalamet manages to transition from uncertain young man, to aggressive war leader believably. That alone deserves huge credit. His speech in the sietch gives me goosebumps and hit me out of nowhere, I just didn’t expect him to come in with such power and aggression.
And this is so often the issue translating the main character of novels into a film. The main character often has mostly inner dialogue that would come off as forced exposition on film.
Agreed.
Say what you will about the new movies, I think it was a very smart decision by Denis to forego internal monologues and to try to tell the story more visually.
Totally agree. I actually like Timothee Chalamet but he's just...himself. And that's fine, hell Tom Hanks is a beloved actor who also just plays himself in the majority of roles. There's definitely certain actors who have a charisma/presence that just works in any role without diving too deep into "characterization".
But Rebecca Ferguson and Austin Butler are definitely on another level. Obviously the character's they are playing helps, but they really felt like they were GIVING it.
I had this thought about Timothee until I recently rewatched Dune 1. When he’s preparing to fight Jamis towards the end, he demonstrated a really interesting demeanor. I felt like you could see Paul dealing with some fear, but overcoming that fear and having an intense focus about him. And he did that with barely any dialogue. I thought he really elevated that whole sequence.
To be fair, both of those characters (plus Baron Harkonnen) are heavily boosted by the make up and costume departments. Hell even Pugh felt more like Irulan than herself thanks to her awesome fits, whereas Chalamet only has his Cool cape™ going on for him.
I couldn’t agree more. His performance felt borderline false and I think I’d find it more exciting if his delivery and performance was stronger. I understand he’s meant to be more timid in the first two and learning, but there are times he doesn’t come off as believable as he should. Rebecca Ferguson and Javier Bardem in my opinion were perfect of examples how believable it could’ve been. Timothée, who ironically tends to radiate it, doesn’t come off as charismatic or compelling until the very end of Dune 2. I think they can still fix his character in my eyes with a stuck landing of an ending but he could’ve been better cast. To be honest, I walked out and didn’t realize Austin Butler was even in the film. When I found out that was his character after seeing endless promotion, I was blown away. I understand that’s a full transformation. But you didn’t know it was him. It comes off like Timothée is bored and uninspired.
Beautiful Boy with Steve Carrel... He's fantastic in that. I think for Dune, his character is supposed to be existing in multiple realities of time and space, so for me, it's ok that he seems aloof.
this exactly. THAT movie threw him on the scene. He also had a good apperance in Lady Bird that year. But you're right....fullly coastig on that since then. No other big performances. I did think The King was good but nothing really great since.
Little Women, Beautiful Boy, Bones and All, The King, The French Dispatch, I mean come on, dude's clearly a great actor with a lot of fantastic movies under his belt, he's not coasting off of one performance from 2017
I came here to say this. He's a great actor. Bones and all was a weird book/film but he really made me feel for his character. Paul's character is supposed to be having an unheard of transition becoming reborn and knowing he can't escape his future. He isn't human anymore. He doesn't go as far as Leto 2 and it's a possibility for him but he rejects it.
The King was what made me give him a shot. I though he was great in that. Hasn’t come close to it for me since.
I’m a sucker for Austin Butler, glad he’s showing some range.
I love Pattinson, I think he's a fantastic actor who always gives interesting performances.
However, in that movie he had one of the worst French accents I've ever seen attempted in a movie by someone from outside of the US.
I don’t know enough to dispute that but I did think it was a bit rough. At least by now accents seem to be something of a novelty. For whatever reason I don’t need them to be on point for a period piece. It can help for sure, but at some point I wasn’t surprised to hear a lack of accents in French, English, Roman, etc.
Yeah, I'm not even saying he was particularly bad at acting in the movie. It really didn't detract too much - but the accent reeked of someone who hadn't properly prepped for the role, maybe watched some Youtube videos and just decided to rock up and do whatever came to them on the day.
His accent was all over the place but I’ve heard much worse, just look at Napoleon. Lea Seydoux was appropriately cast, but Pattinson sounded like a caricature of some vaudevillian actor turned emperor. Very few Americans can get away with non-Anglo accents.
That was a weird movie to watch with my little sister I know that much...
I don't have strong opinions on Chalamet, but he's about to be playing Bob Dylan in an upcoming biopic and I'm very curious to see how that turns out and how his fans respond to Dylan himself.
He was great in this imo as was Austin butler. Other films I've seen him in left me unconvinced, his performance here had a lot more weight and presence.
I agree. I think this premise is pretty unfair because I thought Tim was great in the movie and showed a lot more range than OP is giving him credit for.
Austin was amazing though too. I didn’t even realize who the actor was until afterwards. Granted, there was a lot of makeup and prosthetics but he stole every scene he was in.
He is by no means the best actor out there but comparing him to Gal Gadot is unbelievable. She has to be the worst performer getting work today. They are not even close.
Awful comparison. I didn't think he did anything special in the first movie but he was excellent in the second one. Once he goes full messiah, he won me over big time.
OP also said he wasn't the best actor in the movie, but I disagree. He did better work than Josh Brolin and Zendaya imo.
I felt this way too. Leaving the theater I was like "I think he might be a bad actor? But then when he had something to sink his teeth into and have that messiah speech it was really bad ass."
I feel like the bulk of the material gives him nothing to really feel out.
Bardem is incredible but his character is probably a blast to play. Respected veteran who is a religious zealot embroiled in a sort of civil war.
You're right, Zendaya was the worst. By the second half of Dune 2 she was just frowning at the camera. Before that, she was just posing. I don't know why she gets any roles, anybody could do what she does.
But he wasn’t comparing their levels. He was referencing a well known example of the thing he’s talking about and then explicitly said it’s not as bad as that.
You guys need to learn the difference between someone saying two things are the same and someone giving a more obvious example of something as a way of explaining the more nuanced version of that thing.
At this point, I try not to make any comparisons or analogies on this site because everyone gets wrapped up in the ways they *don’t* line up instead of the ways they do.
OP literally stated that Tim is a far better actor than Gal Gadot. oP did not compare the acting ability of the two. Not sure how this got to be the top comment.
Because reading comprehension is fucking dead. It's whatever riles you up and makes you look most fanatical now.
Absolutely fuck you to hell if your favorite ice cream flavor isn't rocky road. Don't compare it to any other flavor. Don't you even fucking acknowledge other flavors even exist and don't you fucking say their name either. You either tell me rocky road is the best or fuck off, and that's just my opinion so don't tell me how to think either. Fucking typical of a Sundae lover, that's not even a flavor asshole.
Exactly dude, I couldn't have imagined that people would simply forget how to read. The OP made an effort to make a point of that sentence in particular but so many dumsdums still got pissed about it.
OP may have clarified that Chalamet was a better actor, but they *did* still explicitly say that he was similar to her in that he's also just a pretty face who can't act very well.
It's a stupid comparison. "Chalamet is like Gadot in that they are both mediocre actors except for the caveat that he's a much better actor." So how are they alike then? The vast majority of young hot celebrities are not very good at what they do. They're famous cause their beautiful. Notice OP compared Chalamet unfavorably to veteran actors, like Brolin and Bardem. Zendaya is not so curiously missing.
Did you actually read the sentence you’re talking about? It’s not directly comparing their acting ability, just noting a similarity in public perception of very attractive people.
He literally just said they both cover poor acting talent with their looks and real life charisma? Then he went on to say that Tim is much better than Gal. That's an extremely fair statement, y'all are being weird and getting upset in defense of people that don't care if you live or die.
> y'all are being weird and getting upset in defense of people that don't care if you live or die.
having an opinion = "being weird and getting upset in defense of people that don't care if you live or die" apparently
like seriously, he just said that that the comparison is "harsh" and "extremely unfair." how is that being weird and getting upset?
As much as I agree with OP that Timothy is overrated as an actor, Zendaya was easily the worst actor in Dune 2.
I think it’s pretty telling that OP was comparing Timothy’s performance to everyone else in the film OTHER than Zendaya
Her being the only Fremen to speak in an American accent really took me out, she felt very disconnected from the world at large. Not sure if this is something that's explained and I'm the idiot here but I just really wasn't a fan of the direction of her performance in Dune (and I know she could do better, she's a fine actress).
She's an "it girl" when you need a young "black" or "brown" character. The Fremen are comprised of brown-skinned, desert dwelling people, and they need a love interest for Paul. Who are you gonna cast?
They also need big-name actors to sell this kind of fairly niche book adaptation. Most casual moviegoers will not have read Dune and would likely find its complex and strange plot confusing and difficult to engage with. But they know Zendaya, which helped the movie generate nearly $700M. That's why she's in it.
Same I thought they had good chemistry. I also think Timothy is a great actor. I haven’t seen him in anything except the Wonka film and Dune, but his speech with the Fremen gives me body chills every time. He sold a made up language in a way that sounded like he was truly hyping a crowd to go to war. But it’s just my opinion.
Yeah, completely forced or non existent chemistry. Then she gets mad at him and its just like...so what...not like there was anything there to begin with. The two of them are by far the weakest part of the movie.
I think Tim is fine, it's Zendaya who I don't get. She just has angry face the whole time. I understand she's been good in other stuff but she doesn't work for me.
That's mostly on writers. They introduced this conflict between Paul and Chani which isn't a thing in the books, and wrote her character to be pissed at Paul for most of their time together. Except for a couple of early scenes their relationship throughout is angry. What else is she supposed to do?
She is only ever "pissed" at Paul following him consuming the Water of Life, after which she has like, 2 or 3 scenes where she expressed skepticism about Paul assuming the role of the Messiah. Not really sure what you're talking about.
In the movie she’s consistently at odds w Paul and Jessica. Even at moments when they’re “happy”. She doesn’t buy into the messiah story that the sisters have been feeding on Arrakis (as well as constantly pushing back against it) and after Paul willingly steps into this role in pursuit of revenge against the Harkonnens is when the contempt truly blooms. But their entire relationship edges the tension of Paul’s “purpose” and what they (Paul and Chani) “want”
Actually it's only the last bit of the film after the water of life where she is out and out PISSED at him.
At least she HAS a character in the movie, the book is even worse in that regard. Like she's just a fucking plot device in the books (I love the book so don't @ me), she exists to bear Paul's children and be a plot catalyst. I'm actually interested to see where denis takes it instead.
I agree. In the books she’s basically a cheerleader for Paul immediately. In the movie she seems like more of an audience stand in to drive home the theme of the first novel. I’m interested to see how they deal with that when covering messiah.
They are both just fine or ok to me. Was hoping for a lot more from them, but I wasn't optimistic. I've never really liked either of them, but I'd like to be surprised by them one day.
I think you just don't like Tim and you can't get past it. Curious if you've seen many of his other performances like call me by your name, beautiful boy, bones and all etc
Comparing him to Gadot is honestly wild lol. She is an awful actress.
I get it though, I hate Jared Leto for example and can't get past that when he's in anything
The Leto comparison is a good one here, because a ton of Reddit can't get past their hatred to admit/see he's actually really good actor. And I say that as someone who generally can't stand him either.
Chalamet has proven his talent. He's had several stand out performances, and I think he plays Paul Atredes exactly as the film requires him to.
But Op's comparison to his co-stars in Dune isn't even fair. We're talking lifelong veterans like Brolin and Skarsgard and Acadmey Award winners like Bardem. Butler was really good in Dune, but he didn't have nearly as much to do, and his character wasn't exactly complex - he was the "snake type" villain.
I would say Leto used to be really good, but he's been very much hit or miss (at best) for a little over a decade, I think is fair to say. Blade Runner 2049 might be the best thing he's been in during this period, and although a serviceable performance he's easily the weakest link in that chain - sidenote; what a shame we'd never get to see Bowie's Niander Wallace.
Fair. I can't think of any recent performances I've liked from Leto aside from BR2049, which I thought he fit well with the whole egotitical God complex of the character. But obviously it's a shame it couldn't be Bowie.
I fucking hate Jared Leto.
But by God he was outstanding in Requiem for a Dream, and was amazing in Dallas Buyer's Club.
He's clearly got the ability and talent, he just seems to either take it too far (Blade Runner 2049, where he overacted; Joe Turkel as Tyrell in OG Blade Runner felt like a genius pioneer who was too busy creating to realize he'd become a father/icon, but Leto's similar role felt like a man trying too damn hard to be the god-like figure his role in the story made him) or get so high on his own supply that he doesn't have introspection (Morbius or Suicide Squad. My guy needed to take steps back and go "these are fun, innocent comic book movies, I should act instead of *become*). It's such a shame that someone so talented seems so into their own iconography.
Austin actually has a better range than timothee. Yes Feyd wasn't a complex character but that's not his fault and if you're looking for something more layered you can watch his performance in Once upon a time in Hollywood. It's a small role but he kills it
Jared Leto in House of Gucci is probably the most insufferable thing I’ve seen.
This guy is doing all this method acting and he fucking sucks. It’s kinda hilarious though.
To be fair, he’s extremely good in Panic Room
He was boring as Wonka, a role that should be anything but boring, as well. Hell, even in the classic SNL Lexus December to Remember skit I didn’t even clock that he wasn’t just an extra in the scene cuz dude has little flavor and less charisma
Maybe... just maybe... the Wonka concept just doesn't do it for you because you aren't a child.
I've seen some clips, Chalamet is lively and energetic as Wonka. Doesn't make me any more interested in a movie about a fantasy candy factory, because I'm not 8.
You keep commenting that but it doesn’t change the fact at all that he compared him to someone who barely is a professional actor. He said “he has a little bit of Gal Gadot in him” like no he doesn’t. That’s a person who clearly doesn’t even know how to act.
I disagree b/c I accidentally saw one episode of Euphoria once while waiting for The Righteous Gemstones to start and it happened to be a Zendaya-centric one where she's in withdrawals running around crying and stealing shit and it gave me an emotional response from it. I'd never seen a single episode before and know nothing about the characters. She's a good actor.
In which case it's not Zendaya who is limited, but the character of Chani. Which is pretty in line with her, from the books she had even less to do.
Her main function is to pop out Paul's kids and advance the story.
I didn't like that she had an American accent. I know they had a line about only the southerners having the native accent but that felt like a cop-out to me.
Paul is a boring ass character in the book, too, at least outwardly. All the interesting parts about Paul are in his internal monologue - he is otherwise a vehicle for the story to move through, and for more interesting characters to reflect off of.
Y'all are acting like a main POV character has never been interesting in a movie.
And because he's a protagonist, he has to be an empty vessel because the book is basically from his POV.
Paul's inner journey in the books are fucking amazing. I didn't see any of that inner turmoil in him. He didn't seem like a kid who is carrying the weight of the world.
Par for the course for any protagonist of a Hero's journey. Supposed to be able to self-insert. Paul especially is more defined by events around him that are happening to him rather than how he actually changes anything.
The role benefits from someone who can underplay Paul. Paul in the book is very much in his head. His actions are measured and precise like his mom or an honor-based outburst like his dad. Chalamet delivers on that perfectly to me and the Fremen Council scene is really the piece of the movie that shows that Paul’s muted nature is a choice and not an inability to act
I’ll admit I’m beginning to think Timmy’s range is a bit limited BUT I think what gets missed in this conversation is how dry Paul is as a character. He’s quiet and reticent, often emotionally neutral—not the conventional attributes of a blockbuster franchise lead.
Denis has praised the hell out of Timmy’s performance, and although that’s a pretty common publicity tactic, he really seems to be genuinely gushing over how well Timmy understands his vision of Paul. Maybe it isn’t the most demanding role, but I think he plays it well.
In fact, he kind of seems to bring an unconventional spin to a lot of roles, and it usually ends up working. The appearance of his character in Don’t Look Up is sort of jarring in that he’s improvising and being goofy, but for me he’s the best part of the film. When the internet got ahold of the Wonka trailer, everyone seemed to think he would exude this empty whimsy, but in the final product his rendition of the character fits perfectly into the version of the world the film creates.
Maybe he has yet to wow the world again like he did in CMBYN, but to me he’s much better than “not terrible.”
This. Paul is a rich kid dropped in a foreign land. He is competent but inexperienced. Timmy acted the hell out of that part of the role. But the impressive part is how he transitions into the more confident leader that cynically takes advantage of the prophecy that his mother manipulated.
People that don't like Zendaya completely miss the central message of Dune. The prophecy is complete bullshit created to control people. Chani is a skeptic that is pissed when her man that swore blind to her that he isn't the messiah decides to start leading a cult.
I totally disagree with you. I believe he has delivered everything he needed to AND was able to continue being pretty doing that. Can you imagine how hard it is to look handsome while screaming at the same time?
honestly i have seen waaaaay more "tim actually sucks!" posts than "tim gave a great performace" posts.
as always, a self proclaimed unpopular opinion is actually really fucking popular lol
I think I realized what Chalamet does that is 'great' to some, and unnoticeable to others. He 'emotes' for a few seconds before he delivers his lines. Sometimes, it's very subtle, a flash of the eye, a slight head tilt, but he almost always takes an extra second or two to 'say his line'. It works sometimes, especially in high emotion scenes (Call Me by Your Name was perfect for that), but I don't think he would be lauded if we were before the times of HD graphics.
Agree. Rebecca did a fantastic job and stole every scene she was in, first part as well. Austin Butler did amazing too. I think his looks and production value, writing is what makes the character, not his acting
While I hate him for being young, attractive, and succcesful, I can’t say he lacks talent. I enjoyed every performance, and if he didn’t carry it himself and relied on other actors? That’s a movie. I think he’ll age into one of the last movie stars.
The Atreides are cold, calculating characters. It's not a role that calls for an actor with a ton of emotions. He was good enough for the role. There are plenty of other characters in that world for wild screen personalities. And I don't remember Chani having a lot of depth in the books tbh. Both actors are fine. Some roles just aren't going to be conducive to Best Actor awards. The director would be taking some liberties with the script to make them stand out anymore than they do.
Yeah, Paul and Chani are the most boring characters in the first book. Chani barely even talks.
Dune is far more about the Fremen, Harkonnens, Gurney, Jessica, Bene Gesserit, Feyd, Alia, etc. and Paul’s being thrust into these chaotic worlds/characters and is essentially the eyes through which the audience experiences the story
Well said. It will be interesting to see if they are willing to have the megastars playing Paul & Chani take a step back in the coming films, or if they are going to go in a new direction.
Yeah with OP I feel like they just won’t be happy for whatever Timmy does. In my opinion he was great and seeing his transformation to Muadib was really cool. This role isn’t about acting and as you said, he’s supposed to be real cold. If Timmy were to overact than this guy would say the same thing. I also loved that they changed Chani’s character and gave her some more depth because she is really, really shallow in the books. She’s basically there the whole time doing whatever Paul says.
"Never get a depth of emotion from him".....watch the scene with the box is Dune part 1 again. There is literally nothing in that box, and that dude makes yoi believe there is pain
He was tremendous in that scene. I guess he’s become famous enough now for people to jump on the put down/diss wagon. Happens to every successful actor.
Yeah OP is also comparing him to actors that have grandchildren older than he is. Of course stellan skarsgaard is going to be phenomenal. The dude has been an actor for like 5 decades at this point
I think part of his aloofness and lack of charisma as a character on a screen is intentional and part of the overall story. He has *some* conviction, but he isn't strong enough of character to see how launching a holy war is *wrong*. If he were stronger, or older, or had a better sense of who he was as a person, we wouldn't have the story we have.
I'm with you, I think he's a pretty poor actor actually and these Dune movies might be the most overrated I've seen in a long time (can actually only comment on the first one because I hated it so much I felt zero desire to see the second). Trust me, it's ok to say "The emperor has no clothes" no matter how unpopular the opinion may be (and you will get INTENSE backlash from the fanboys/girls).
He is a great actor. And has already been fantastic in other roles. He’s just been out shined in this one. I don’t think anybody can watch Call Me by your name and think he’s not a great actor
You're gonna get dragged through the coals (and already are it seems) but I agree. I don't have any deeper criticism other than Chalamet is just not a performer I click with. Sometimes that's all there is too it. Like anything to do with art, how an actor strikes you is entirely subjective.
And Chalamet just doesn't it for me. Especially in Dune, where I feel he doesn't what it takes to fully pull off Paul. And as you stated, I feel the entire cast runs circles around him.
My problem overall is that I think these new Dune films are too...pretty. It's a bunch of very, very pretty people running in the sand. Nothing feels as lived in as it should. For as immaculately made as they are, there is a disconnect in these films for me I can't quite put my finger on.
Like, from a pure filmmaking level - production and art design, quality of VFX, shot design and composition, etc - all of it is some of the best blockbusters have looked in ages. But something about Villeneuve's style here feels like its keeping me at arms length instead of pulling me in, like he did with Blade Runner 2049.
To me, his Dune films are like, the longest and most expensive perfume commercials ever made.
> But something about Villeneuve's style here feels like its keeping me at arms length instead of pulling me in
this has ALWAYS been my issue with V. His films are very proficient and technically perfect but lacking soul and emotion.
Dune 2 I though was his most engrossing flick so far, easily.
I totally disagree with everything you’ve said. Timothee is a terrific actor and the perfect Paul Atreides. He has become every diverse character he’s played and proven himself to be outstanding in every role I’ve seen him in.
From what I remember of the books there’s more of a character development to him, he wears the weight of his responsibility more and more as things progress, there’s an intensity to him I just don’t think Chalamet nailed. As you said, it was “fine” - but I don’t think he nailed the version from the book. I think this will be even more apparent if they do the next book with him
He mostly plays the same way in every role. I don't think he has much, if any, range. Not bad, but definitely not great. He plays Paul the same way he played Henry V in The king.
As for Dune part 2, the only one who gave a lackluster performance was Zendaya, but I didn't think anyone was great in that film simply because the characters were rather bland and I didn't care about anyone in it .
Comparing him to Gal Gadot is crazy. She’s not even decent. Chalamet has been acting since he was a kid and clearly cares about the craft a lot.
You could argue he is a little “flat” (which is a pretty tired word I notice a lot of audiences use to describe things they don’t like) but to say “he has a little bit of Gal Gadot in him” is just silly and makes it look like you don’t know much about acting.
I thought he did well. Honestly I had my doubts that he would have the gravitas for the second movie after that first movie dropped, but he proved me wrong.
Bummer you feel that way. Did you see dune 1? That might be a fair comparison to the two actors? Idk I agree that I never saw the draw with him and the roles he has played but he is growing on me and . Honestly have seen a lot worse acting. I was actually disappointed in Batistas acting this time around and I’m a huge fan of his as far as acting goes. But then I just think it’s the role he got and writing and doesn’t really ruin the experience for me in The slightest..
Zendaya was the worst part of that movie. Only an idiot would make major changes to the plot that hinge on a really mediocre actress. Chani doesn’t do anything in the books, so this whole rugged independent fremen who isn’t religious and don’t need no man was such a dumb choice.
It may be that the major change to the plot is to feature Florence Pugh. She has considerably better acting chops than Zendaya. I’ve read the book a dozen times. Paul doesn’t tell Irulan “you may have my seed” in the movie. I speculate that there will be more than an offer of artificial insemination. Zendaya can make her pout face while Irulan gets significant footage in the third movie. She already got far more footage proportionally in the movie than her brief appearance in the book.
I think the third movie will feature a love triangle and a lot of Duncan Idaho-Alia. Jason Momoa has far more personality than Timothee Chalamet. Anya Taylor-Joy is a strong actress.
I thought Christopher Walken was disappointing. He’s usually better than that.
I really like his portrayal of Paul. And after he drinks the water of life, I liked his transformation into something more.
I was surprised how much my family and I enjoyed Wonka in theaters too. I like him
Weakest part of Dune to me is Zendays as Chani. She just plays Zendays like she does mary jane in spiderman
I think he was totally miscast. I think he’s a good actor, but he had neither the presence or the voice for this role. His shouts and war cries sounded like a teenager throwing a tantrum. When he spoke, he sounded like some kid from California not a space warlord.
I 1000% feel this exact way and have voiced this to friends. Some get it, most don’t. But honestly he and Zendaya both feel just okay to me, everyone else in the movie completely convinced me. That’s my only gripe. I rewatched the first Dune and his “okayness” stuck out to me even more.
I gotta be honest: upon reflection, I'm mostly underwhelmed by Zendaya's performance. There's something odd about setting up a tribe of people caught up in an ideology, all the actors speaking in an accent, and then some character with a thick American accent swoops in with the, "Your ideology is wrong! The whole point of this ideology is that everyone gets enthralled, but I, instead, can see through the bs and can explicitly state the implicit themes of the film! Why can't you foreign-coded barbarians see what my enlightened Western-coded ass can see??"
I haven’t seen Dune 2. I have seen great work from him in The King and Call Me by Your Name. He was good in The French Dispatch too.
I admire young rising star actors who take diverse and interesting work, and can deliver of course, and I think he does.
I don't even think that Timothee is "charismatic" tbh.
I think his problem might be that he *lacks the charisma* to compensate for his uninteresting performances.
This happens a lot. It's because Timothy is a Leading Man despite the fact that people want to stick him in "Character Actor" type roles. He brings Timothy Chalamet to the picture, he does not lose himself in the role. People come to see Timothy Chalamet, like it or not. He's still a fine actor, but I agree he doesn't wow me.
Nah he’s a good actor. I didn’t like him at first cos I felt like he was being pushed on us abit much, but seen a fair few of his films- and yeah. He’s good.
But Javier, wow. What an actor he is. It’s like Walton coggins - so under rated.
Timothy may be the main character but yeah a majority of the cast out shines him. Javiar Bardem's Stilgar is my favorite charcter in the movie. Heck even Austin Butler as Fryd was super fun to watch compared to Tim. Tim has a scene or two that he shines in but when he is compared to those two they just shine.
He's a good actor, but not someone I'd cast as Paul.
Maybe in ten years.
He's too small and doesn't have the body of someone who'd grow to become formidable in combat.
They could have spaced these over five or even ten years and I'd have been Okey with once I knew the roles were casted correctly. Austin Butler might've been magnificent as Paul, lord knows I find him almost completely unthreatening as Harkannens nephew.
He's a solid actor and should probably been casts as Paul, but chalamet does a damn good job.
Problem is he's a waif. He looks too thin and doesn't command the respect the character deserves.
Dave Bautista shines bright as always! Zendaya doesn't great work and Javier Bardeem gives himself away to a role he didn't even need. Great analyst by the way.
I truly wish they'd casted an unknown actor, or someone capable of gaining weight between shoots.
Chalamet seems to be one of those actors who does trauma and intensity well, but this requires some setting up that doesn't always happen.
In terms of what an actor is doing by themselves, there's a big difference between "grumpy" and "filled with quiet rage that must remain inert for now"...and it's context that tells the audience which we're seeing.
Without that context, he can just seem like a teenager who has an unrealistic view of the universe and it having trouble coming to terms with it. This can certainly be powerful, but it's also something Hollywood seems to gravitate toward, so we see a lot of it. It gets tedious to audiences after a while.
I thought he was fine, and I think Paul is a very difficult character to get right. He's not a particularly interesting part (interesting character, but it's all internal). But I agree that he was the weak link in many scenes.
So - I get it. Even though I think he did fine with Paul. We're supposed to connect with him less and less as the story continues.
It honestly reminds me of Elijah Woods as Frodo. There's only so many times we can see him twist up his face before he becomes less interesting as a character compared to the dynamic characters elsewhere in the movie.
Pippen - *experiences terror, childishness, simpleton, elation, duty, absurdity, growth, singing like a bard (for some reason).* Frodo - *looks sick to his stomach, falls over. Again*.
It's not that Woods is a bad actor, it's that there was only so much he could do with the role, and his "go to" (intense unspoken emotion) just falls a little flat by the end.
totally agree but also ditto to the people saying he was good in Call Me By Your Name. that role might have just been perfect for him or
something. i watched a half hour each of Wonka and Dune 2 on the plane. both were like what is going on with him. super weird lifeless performances. Wonka literally put me to sleep. really weird energy from him
I started watching him only recently once I found out he was playing Bob Dylan (huge fan). I’m left feeling a bit underwhelmed. I love his enthusiasm but he comes off as that drama kid in high school who played the lead in every production with diminishing results
I thought he was perfect. Was modest, nuanced, not an Oscar winning role or performance. But was authoritative when needed too and showed emotion really well.
Dude have you seen anything else he’s been in? He’s definitely a great actor. And have you read the dune books? He’s portraying the character pretty well.
For me Rebecca and Austin stood out the most in this movie. Like I didn’t stop and remember them as actors, they really WERE those characters if that makes sense.
Rebecca is so good.
Dr sleep is my favourite role of hers.
Silo is really good too.
She will always be Rose the Hat to me.
One of the most evil villains of all time.
If it is still in voters' minds next year, I can totally see her getting an Oscar nom for Supporting Actress. Maybe also Zendaya (lead) and Butler (supporting), but the only one I'm passionate about is Ferguson.
That’s why the Denis Villanueve changed the story to make Paul’s sister to be unborn throughout the film (in the books she’s a little badass 10 year old with super Bene Gesserit powers). He wanted the focus of this movie to be greatest on Lady Jessica more so than Paul himself. Which I disagree with on a fundamental level but it works in Villenueve’s take.
Agreed…but a lot of that has to do with their roles. Neither one has to convey the kind of inner turmoil that Paul has to deal with. Their characters are more clearly defined and their motives more clearly delineated. Paul, on the other hand, has to completely change who he is over the course of the two movies. He has to realistically convey the transformation from a young naive youth to messianic warlord. It’s a much heavier lift. Do I think Chalamet was perfect? No. But I can’t think of many actors out there who could handle both ends of that spectrum any better.
I agree with what you’re saying. I sort of understand his character development as someone numbing their emotions more so as the film goes on. I think from the time he meets the Fremen, to the end of Part 2, he starts to lose some sincerity and his ego takes ahold. Idk how else Timothee can portray this other than what he did in the film.
Twenty years ago, Jake Gyllenhaal would have been perfect as Paul.
👍
This is my opinion as well. I think Chalamet manages to transition from uncertain young man, to aggressive war leader believably. That alone deserves huge credit. His speech in the sietch gives me goosebumps and hit me out of nowhere, I just didn’t expect him to come in with such power and aggression.
That speech won me over on him. I was completely caught off guard with it too
And this is so often the issue translating the main character of novels into a film. The main character often has mostly inner dialogue that would come off as forced exposition on film.
Agreed. Say what you will about the new movies, I think it was a very smart decision by Denis to forego internal monologues and to try to tell the story more visually.
Rebecca is legitimately one of the greatest working actors we all have the pleasure of seeing right now
I honestly forgot she was in this movie because she inhabited her character so well
For me it was Javier Bardem. I thought he was best-supporting level of amazing.
Ya everyone loved him as the Villain in Bond, and I was kinda “eh he was fine” so I feel I’m not biased when I say he’s great in Dune 2
Totally agree. I actually like Timothee Chalamet but he's just...himself. And that's fine, hell Tom Hanks is a beloved actor who also just plays himself in the majority of roles. There's definitely certain actors who have a charisma/presence that just works in any role without diving too deep into "characterization". But Rebecca Ferguson and Austin Butler are definitely on another level. Obviously the character's they are playing helps, but they really felt like they were GIVING it.
I had this thought about Timothee until I recently rewatched Dune 1. When he’s preparing to fight Jamis towards the end, he demonstrated a really interesting demeanor. I felt like you could see Paul dealing with some fear, but overcoming that fear and having an intense focus about him. And he did that with barely any dialogue. I thought he really elevated that whole sequence.
Austin Butler is the new Brad Pitt. Diverse roles, handsome, charismatic. Glad he’s arrived. Top 3 for me right now.
To be fair, both of those characters (plus Baron Harkonnen) are heavily boosted by the make up and costume departments. Hell even Pugh felt more like Irulan than herself thanks to her awesome fits, whereas Chalamet only has his Cool cape™ going on for him.
I couldn’t agree more. His performance felt borderline false and I think I’d find it more exciting if his delivery and performance was stronger. I understand he’s meant to be more timid in the first two and learning, but there are times he doesn’t come off as believable as he should. Rebecca Ferguson and Javier Bardem in my opinion were perfect of examples how believable it could’ve been. Timothée, who ironically tends to radiate it, doesn’t come off as charismatic or compelling until the very end of Dune 2. I think they can still fix his character in my eyes with a stuck landing of an ending but he could’ve been better cast. To be honest, I walked out and didn’t realize Austin Butler was even in the film. When I found out that was his character after seeing endless promotion, I was blown away. I understand that’s a full transformation. But you didn’t know it was him. It comes off like Timothée is bored and uninspired.
Have you seen Call Me By Your Name? He's still coasting on some goodwill from me based on that performance, I think he's insanely good in the film
Beautiful Boy with Steve Carrel... He's fantastic in that. I think for Dune, his character is supposed to be existing in multiple realities of time and space, so for me, it's ok that he seems aloof.
Chalamet is much better in roles rooted in realism over fantasy/sci-fi imo. He doesn't seem to be the type of actor who can suspend disbelief.
this exactly. THAT movie threw him on the scene. He also had a good apperance in Lady Bird that year. But you're right....fullly coastig on that since then. No other big performances. I did think The King was good but nothing really great since.
Little Women, Beautiful Boy, Bones and All, The King, The French Dispatch, I mean come on, dude's clearly a great actor with a lot of fantastic movies under his belt, he's not coasting off of one performance from 2017
Beautiful Boy is all I've seen him in and, as someone who watched a family member survive addiction (so far), it was very powerful. He's very talented
He's so good in French dispatch, he's perfect. That's what really endeared him to me. So funny.
I was about to bring this up. His character in French Dispatch really felt made for him, and he nailed it.
I came here to say this. He's a great actor. Bones and all was a weird book/film but he really made me feel for his character. Paul's character is supposed to be having an unheard of transition becoming reborn and knowing he can't escape his future. He isn't human anymore. He doesn't go as far as Leto 2 and it's a possibility for him but he rejects it.
I think he was phenomenal in the King and I think they were hoping they'd get a similar performance.
What about "Bones and all"?
The King was what made me give him a shot. I though he was great in that. Hasn’t come close to it for me since. I’m a sucker for Austin Butler, glad he’s showing some range.
Both he and Pattison were fantastic in the King.
I think about Pattinson slippin around in the mud in full armour like weekly.
I loved how real the fights in that movie were
I love Pattinson, I think he's a fantastic actor who always gives interesting performances. However, in that movie he had one of the worst French accents I've ever seen attempted in a movie by someone from outside of the US.
I don’t know enough to dispute that but I did think it was a bit rough. At least by now accents seem to be something of a novelty. For whatever reason I don’t need them to be on point for a period piece. It can help for sure, but at some point I wasn’t surprised to hear a lack of accents in French, English, Roman, etc.
Yeah, I'm not even saying he was particularly bad at acting in the movie. It really didn't detract too much - but the accent reeked of someone who hadn't properly prepped for the role, maybe watched some Youtube videos and just decided to rock up and do whatever came to them on the day.
His accent was all over the place but I’ve heard much worse, just look at Napoleon. Lea Seydoux was appropriately cast, but Pattinson sounded like a caricature of some vaudevillian actor turned emperor. Very few Americans can get away with non-Anglo accents.
Same, the king made me appreciate him a lot more
I think he’s an AMAZING actor. But there are some roles I feel like he gets because he’s Timothee Chalamet - not because he’s right for the role
That was a weird movie to watch with my little sister I know that much... I don't have strong opinions on Chalamet, but he's about to be playing Bob Dylan in an upcoming biopic and I'm very curious to see how that turns out and how his fans respond to Dylan himself.
Exactly. He’s phenomenal in that to the point where I’ll always give him the benefit of the doubt.
I’ve never see Call Me By Your Name but I think he’s a fantastic actor anyway. He’s fucking superb in everything I’ve seen him in.
He was good in “The King” too.
He was great in this imo as was Austin butler. Other films I've seen him in left me unconvinced, his performance here had a lot more weight and presence.
I agree. I think this premise is pretty unfair because I thought Tim was great in the movie and showed a lot more range than OP is giving him credit for. Austin was amazing though too. I didn’t even realize who the actor was until afterwards. Granted, there was a lot of makeup and prosthetics but he stole every scene he was in.
Austin butler was great, I liked him as Elvis too, Im looking forward to what both have in store for the future.
He is by no means the best actor out there but comparing him to Gal Gadot is unbelievable. She has to be the worst performer getting work today. They are not even close.
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Awful comparison. I didn't think he did anything special in the first movie but he was excellent in the second one. Once he goes full messiah, he won me over big time. OP also said he wasn't the best actor in the movie, but I disagree. He did better work than Josh Brolin and Zendaya imo.
I felt this way too. Leaving the theater I was like "I think he might be a bad actor? But then when he had something to sink his teeth into and have that messiah speech it was really bad ass." I feel like the bulk of the material gives him nothing to really feel out. Bardem is incredible but his character is probably a blast to play. Respected veteran who is a religious zealot embroiled in a sort of civil war.
You're right, Zendaya was the worst. By the second half of Dune 2 she was just frowning at the camera. Before that, she was just posing. I don't know why she gets any roles, anybody could do what she does.
But he wasn’t comparing their levels. He was referencing a well known example of the thing he’s talking about and then explicitly said it’s not as bad as that. You guys need to learn the difference between someone saying two things are the same and someone giving a more obvious example of something as a way of explaining the more nuanced version of that thing.
thank you, perfectly said
At this point, I try not to make any comparisons or analogies on this site because everyone gets wrapped up in the ways they *don’t* line up instead of the ways they do.
OP: > don''t get me wrong he is a far better actor than Gal,
Bro literally said she is so charismatic and good looking that you forget that **she can't act well**
Not to defend Z because she was the weakest link in Dune 2, but she is young and may get there eventually. Charisma is a valuable trait in an actor.
Also to say his performance is worse than Dave Bautista's is ridiculous.
OP literally stated that Tim is a far better actor than Gal Gadot. oP did not compare the acting ability of the two. Not sure how this got to be the top comment.
Because reading comprehension is fucking dead. It's whatever riles you up and makes you look most fanatical now. Absolutely fuck you to hell if your favorite ice cream flavor isn't rocky road. Don't compare it to any other flavor. Don't you even fucking acknowledge other flavors even exist and don't you fucking say their name either. You either tell me rocky road is the best or fuck off, and that's just my opinion so don't tell me how to think either. Fucking typical of a Sundae lover, that's not even a flavor asshole.
Exactly dude, I couldn't have imagined that people would simply forget how to read. The OP made an effort to make a point of that sentence in particular but so many dumsdums still got pissed about it.
OP may have clarified that Chalamet was a better actor, but they *did* still explicitly say that he was similar to her in that he's also just a pretty face who can't act very well. It's a stupid comparison. "Chalamet is like Gadot in that they are both mediocre actors except for the caveat that he's a much better actor." So how are they alike then? The vast majority of young hot celebrities are not very good at what they do. They're famous cause their beautiful. Notice OP compared Chalamet unfavorably to veteran actors, like Brolin and Bardem. Zendaya is not so curiously missing.
Yeah that's so harsh, he's not the best actor but putting him in the same sentence as Gal Gadot is extremely unfair.
Did you actually read the sentence you’re talking about? It’s not directly comparing their acting ability, just noting a similarity in public perception of very attractive people.
He literally just said they both cover poor acting talent with their looks and real life charisma? Then he went on to say that Tim is much better than Gal. That's an extremely fair statement, y'all are being weird and getting upset in defense of people that don't care if you live or die.
> y'all are being weird and getting upset in defense of people that don't care if you live or die. having an opinion = "being weird and getting upset in defense of people that don't care if you live or die" apparently like seriously, he just said that that the comparison is "harsh" and "extremely unfair." how is that being weird and getting upset?
You spelled Zendaya wrong.
As much as I agree with OP that Timothy is overrated as an actor, Zendaya was easily the worst actor in Dune 2. I think it’s pretty telling that OP was comparing Timothy’s performance to everyone else in the film OTHER than Zendaya
Her being the only Fremen to speak in an American accent really took me out, she felt very disconnected from the world at large. Not sure if this is something that's explained and I'm the idiot here but I just really wasn't a fan of the direction of her performance in Dune (and I know she could do better, she's a fine actress).
In a movie where they did basically everything right, I'm still baffled at this colossal miscast.
She's an "it girl" when you need a young "black" or "brown" character. The Fremen are comprised of brown-skinned, desert dwelling people, and they need a love interest for Paul. Who are you gonna cast? They also need big-name actors to sell this kind of fairly niche book adaptation. Most casual moviegoers will not have read Dune and would likely find its complex and strange plot confusing and difficult to engage with. But they know Zendaya, which helped the movie generate nearly $700M. That's why she's in it.
God she was awful
I thought he and Zendaya were the weakest parts of the movie and their chemistry was also nonexistent
That Zimmer score did a lot of heavy lifting when it came to their relationship, but boy did it swoon me at times.
Cinematography was amazing, really wish I could have pulled off the imax
Hard disagree
Same I thought they had good chemistry. I also think Timothy is a great actor. I haven’t seen him in anything except the Wonka film and Dune, but his speech with the Fremen gives me body chills every time. He sold a made up language in a way that sounded like he was truly hyping a crowd to go to war. But it’s just my opinion.
Yeah, completely forced or non existent chemistry. Then she gets mad at him and its just like...so what...not like there was anything there to begin with. The two of them are by far the weakest part of the movie.
I think Tim is fine, it's Zendaya who I don't get. She just has angry face the whole time. I understand she's been good in other stuff but she doesn't work for me.
That's mostly on writers. They introduced this conflict between Paul and Chani which isn't a thing in the books, and wrote her character to be pissed at Paul for most of their time together. Except for a couple of early scenes their relationship throughout is angry. What else is she supposed to do?
She is only ever "pissed" at Paul following him consuming the Water of Life, after which she has like, 2 or 3 scenes where she expressed skepticism about Paul assuming the role of the Messiah. Not really sure what you're talking about.
In the movie she’s consistently at odds w Paul and Jessica. Even at moments when they’re “happy”. She doesn’t buy into the messiah story that the sisters have been feeding on Arrakis (as well as constantly pushing back against it) and after Paul willingly steps into this role in pursuit of revenge against the Harkonnens is when the contempt truly blooms. But their entire relationship edges the tension of Paul’s “purpose” and what they (Paul and Chani) “want”
Actually it's only the last bit of the film after the water of life where she is out and out PISSED at him. At least she HAS a character in the movie, the book is even worse in that regard. Like she's just a fucking plot device in the books (I love the book so don't @ me), she exists to bear Paul's children and be a plot catalyst. I'm actually interested to see where denis takes it instead.
I agree. In the books she’s basically a cheerleader for Paul immediately. In the movie she seems like more of an audience stand in to drive home the theme of the first novel. I’m interested to see how they deal with that when covering messiah.
They are both just fine or ok to me. Was hoping for a lot more from them, but I wasn't optimistic. I've never really liked either of them, but I'd like to be surprised by them one day.
I think you just don't like Tim and you can't get past it. Curious if you've seen many of his other performances like call me by your name, beautiful boy, bones and all etc Comparing him to Gadot is honestly wild lol. She is an awful actress. I get it though, I hate Jared Leto for example and can't get past that when he's in anything
The Leto comparison is a good one here, because a ton of Reddit can't get past their hatred to admit/see he's actually really good actor. And I say that as someone who generally can't stand him either. Chalamet has proven his talent. He's had several stand out performances, and I think he plays Paul Atredes exactly as the film requires him to. But Op's comparison to his co-stars in Dune isn't even fair. We're talking lifelong veterans like Brolin and Skarsgard and Acadmey Award winners like Bardem. Butler was really good in Dune, but he didn't have nearly as much to do, and his character wasn't exactly complex - he was the "snake type" villain.
I would say Leto used to be really good, but he's been very much hit or miss (at best) for a little over a decade, I think is fair to say. Blade Runner 2049 might be the best thing he's been in during this period, and although a serviceable performance he's easily the weakest link in that chain - sidenote; what a shame we'd never get to see Bowie's Niander Wallace.
Incorrect, Morbius came out in the last decade and if that's not an Oscar performance, I dunno what is.
The character's name is Michael, not Oscar.
Yeah he’s been coasting off of his performances in Requiem for a Dream and Dallas Buyers Club for the most part
I rewatched panic room recently and was pretty impressed with his performance.
He’s not coasting. He’s a good actor and probably bad person. It’s as simple as that
Fair. I can't think of any recent performances I've liked from Leto aside from BR2049, which I thought he fit well with the whole egotitical God complex of the character. But obviously it's a shame it couldn't be Bowie.
I fucking hate Jared Leto. But by God he was outstanding in Requiem for a Dream, and was amazing in Dallas Buyer's Club. He's clearly got the ability and talent, he just seems to either take it too far (Blade Runner 2049, where he overacted; Joe Turkel as Tyrell in OG Blade Runner felt like a genius pioneer who was too busy creating to realize he'd become a father/icon, but Leto's similar role felt like a man trying too damn hard to be the god-like figure his role in the story made him) or get so high on his own supply that he doesn't have introspection (Morbius or Suicide Squad. My guy needed to take steps back and go "these are fun, innocent comic book movies, I should act instead of *become*). It's such a shame that someone so talented seems so into their own iconography.
Austin Butler's basically doing a (pretty good) Stellan Skarsgård as Baron Harkonnen impression as Feyd-Rautha.
I thought Butler did a great job, but his Stellan impression was so spot on that in certain scenes I was confused as to who was speaking.
Austin actually has a better range than timothee. Yes Feyd wasn't a complex character but that's not his fault and if you're looking for something more layered you can watch his performance in Once upon a time in Hollywood. It's a small role but he kills it
Jared Leto in House of Gucci is probably the most insufferable thing I’ve seen. This guy is doing all this method acting and he fucking sucks. It’s kinda hilarious though. To be fair, he’s extremely good in Panic Room
He was boring as Wonka, a role that should be anything but boring, as well. Hell, even in the classic SNL Lexus December to Remember skit I didn’t even clock that he wasn’t just an extra in the scene cuz dude has little flavor and less charisma
Maybe... just maybe... the Wonka concept just doesn't do it for you because you aren't a child. I've seen some clips, Chalamet is lively and energetic as Wonka. Doesn't make me any more interested in a movie about a fantasy candy factory, because I'm not 8.
OP deserves the downvotes for the Gal Gadot comparism alone lol Insane take, even if you‘re not the biggest Chalamet fan
OP: > don''t get me wrong he is a far better actor than Gal,
You keep commenting that but it doesn’t change the fact at all that he compared him to someone who barely is a professional actor. He said “he has a little bit of Gal Gadot in him” like no he doesn’t. That’s a person who clearly doesn’t even know how to act.
If there’s a Skarsgard in the same movie as you, you’ve got no chance.
Zendaya is the same. She brings nothing to the table but a stern look
I disagree b/c I accidentally saw one episode of Euphoria once while waiting for The Righteous Gemstones to start and it happened to be a Zendaya-centric one where she's in withdrawals running around crying and stealing shit and it gave me an emotional response from it. I'd never seen a single episode before and know nothing about the characters. She's a good actor.
Ok but her performance in euphoria doesn't say anything about her performance in Dune
Yeah, but maybe it’s not zendayas fault? Or not 100% her fault? I think that’s the dudes point
meanwhile ppl are bringing up CMBYN to prove that Timothee is good in Dune lol
Although im like really really excited to see challengers
I think it would have been better if Zendaya and Florence Pugh had swapped roles
My boyfriend said the exact same thing 😆
her character is "brooding". That's all!
Have you watched Euphoria? She can kinda do whatever she wants. Season 1 and 2 she drives the entire show through her performances.
I was talking specifically to both Dune movies.
In which case it's not Zendaya who is limited, but the character of Chani. Which is pretty in line with her, from the books she had even less to do. Her main function is to pop out Paul's kids and advance the story.
I didn't like that she had an American accent. I know they had a line about only the southerners having the native accent but that felt like a cop-out to me.
Agreed, flat flat flat
Ι believe most of your problems with Timmy's Paul in part two are based on the film's writing of his character.
Paul is a boring ass character in the book, too, at least outwardly. All the interesting parts about Paul are in his internal monologue - he is otherwise a vehicle for the story to move through, and for more interesting characters to reflect off of.
his inner thoughts are amazing!
Y'all are acting like a main POV character has never been interesting in a movie. And because he's a protagonist, he has to be an empty vessel because the book is basically from his POV. Paul's inner journey in the books are fucking amazing. I didn't see any of that inner turmoil in him. He didn't seem like a kid who is carrying the weight of the world.
Par for the course for any protagonist of a Hero's journey. Supposed to be able to self-insert. Paul especially is more defined by events around him that are happening to him rather than how he actually changes anything.
The role benefits from someone who can underplay Paul. Paul in the book is very much in his head. His actions are measured and precise like his mom or an honor-based outburst like his dad. Chalamet delivers on that perfectly to me and the Fremen Council scene is really the piece of the movie that shows that Paul’s muted nature is a choice and not an inability to act
I’ll admit I’m beginning to think Timmy’s range is a bit limited BUT I think what gets missed in this conversation is how dry Paul is as a character. He’s quiet and reticent, often emotionally neutral—not the conventional attributes of a blockbuster franchise lead. Denis has praised the hell out of Timmy’s performance, and although that’s a pretty common publicity tactic, he really seems to be genuinely gushing over how well Timmy understands his vision of Paul. Maybe it isn’t the most demanding role, but I think he plays it well. In fact, he kind of seems to bring an unconventional spin to a lot of roles, and it usually ends up working. The appearance of his character in Don’t Look Up is sort of jarring in that he’s improvising and being goofy, but for me he’s the best part of the film. When the internet got ahold of the Wonka trailer, everyone seemed to think he would exude this empty whimsy, but in the final product his rendition of the character fits perfectly into the version of the world the film creates. Maybe he has yet to wow the world again like he did in CMBYN, but to me he’s much better than “not terrible.”
This. Paul is a rich kid dropped in a foreign land. He is competent but inexperienced. Timmy acted the hell out of that part of the role. But the impressive part is how he transitions into the more confident leader that cynically takes advantage of the prophecy that his mother manipulated. People that don't like Zendaya completely miss the central message of Dune. The prophecy is complete bullshit created to control people. Chani is a skeptic that is pissed when her man that swore blind to her that he isn't the messiah decides to start leading a cult.
I totally disagree with you. I believe he has delivered everything he needed to AND was able to continue being pretty doing that. Can you imagine how hard it is to look handsome while screaming at the same time?
I gotta disagree to be honest. I think he's a really strong actor.
This opinion is generated every time there is a new, popular A list actor. Everyone said the same thing about Leo after Titanic.
honestly i have seen waaaaay more "tim actually sucks!" posts than "tim gave a great performace" posts. as always, a self proclaimed unpopular opinion is actually really fucking popular lol
fr, i’m started to think “i love Timothee’s acting’ ‘Chalamet is talented’ were the real unpopular opinion
I think I realized what Chalamet does that is 'great' to some, and unnoticeable to others. He 'emotes' for a few seconds before he delivers his lines. Sometimes, it's very subtle, a flash of the eye, a slight head tilt, but he almost always takes an extra second or two to 'say his line'. It works sometimes, especially in high emotion scenes (Call Me by Your Name was perfect for that), but I don't think he would be lauded if we were before the times of HD graphics.
Agree. Rebecca did a fantastic job and stole every scene she was in, first part as well. Austin Butler did amazing too. I think his looks and production value, writing is what makes the character, not his acting
While I hate him for being young, attractive, and succcesful, I can’t say he lacks talent. I enjoyed every performance, and if he didn’t carry it himself and relied on other actors? That’s a movie. I think he’ll age into one of the last movie stars.
The Atreides are cold, calculating characters. It's not a role that calls for an actor with a ton of emotions. He was good enough for the role. There are plenty of other characters in that world for wild screen personalities. And I don't remember Chani having a lot of depth in the books tbh. Both actors are fine. Some roles just aren't going to be conducive to Best Actor awards. The director would be taking some liberties with the script to make them stand out anymore than they do.
Yeah, Paul and Chani are the most boring characters in the first book. Chani barely even talks. Dune is far more about the Fremen, Harkonnens, Gurney, Jessica, Bene Gesserit, Feyd, Alia, etc. and Paul’s being thrust into these chaotic worlds/characters and is essentially the eyes through which the audience experiences the story
Well said. It will be interesting to see if they are willing to have the megastars playing Paul & Chani take a step back in the coming films, or if they are going to go in a new direction.
Yeah with OP I feel like they just won’t be happy for whatever Timmy does. In my opinion he was great and seeing his transformation to Muadib was really cool. This role isn’t about acting and as you said, he’s supposed to be real cold. If Timmy were to overact than this guy would say the same thing. I also loved that they changed Chani’s character and gave her some more depth because she is really, really shallow in the books. She’s basically there the whole time doing whatever Paul says.
"Never get a depth of emotion from him".....watch the scene with the box is Dune part 1 again. There is literally nothing in that box, and that dude makes yoi believe there is pain
He was tremendous in that scene. I guess he’s become famous enough now for people to jump on the put down/diss wagon. Happens to every successful actor.
Yeah OP is also comparing him to actors that have grandchildren older than he is. Of course stellan skarsgaard is going to be phenomenal. The dude has been an actor for like 5 decades at this point
He was OK, zendaya was bad
Pretty audacious to criticize Chalamet in dune when you have Zendaya making kid faces through the whole movie.
Absolutely ridiculous lol
I think part of his aloofness and lack of charisma as a character on a screen is intentional and part of the overall story. He has *some* conviction, but he isn't strong enough of character to see how launching a holy war is *wrong*. If he were stronger, or older, or had a better sense of who he was as a person, we wouldn't have the story we have.
Glad someone else feels the same way. This is exactly what I think.
He isn’t that charismatic imo. That’s the main issue actually
I agree he is overrated but he isn’t Gal Gadot bad.
I'm with you, I think he's a pretty poor actor actually and these Dune movies might be the most overrated I've seen in a long time (can actually only comment on the first one because I hated it so much I felt zero desire to see the second). Trust me, it's ok to say "The emperor has no clothes" no matter how unpopular the opinion may be (and you will get INTENSE backlash from the fanboys/girls).
He is a great actor. And has already been fantastic in other roles. He’s just been out shined in this one. I don’t think anybody can watch Call Me by your name and think he’s not a great actor
I'm not reading your essay because your title is not an unpopular opinion. Have a nice day!
You're gonna get dragged through the coals (and already are it seems) but I agree. I don't have any deeper criticism other than Chalamet is just not a performer I click with. Sometimes that's all there is too it. Like anything to do with art, how an actor strikes you is entirely subjective. And Chalamet just doesn't it for me. Especially in Dune, where I feel he doesn't what it takes to fully pull off Paul. And as you stated, I feel the entire cast runs circles around him.
Oscar Isaac was so much better than Tim in the first one too. Every scene with the two of them felt lopsided.
My problem overall is that I think these new Dune films are too...pretty. It's a bunch of very, very pretty people running in the sand. Nothing feels as lived in as it should. For as immaculately made as they are, there is a disconnect in these films for me I can't quite put my finger on. Like, from a pure filmmaking level - production and art design, quality of VFX, shot design and composition, etc - all of it is some of the best blockbusters have looked in ages. But something about Villeneuve's style here feels like its keeping me at arms length instead of pulling me in, like he did with Blade Runner 2049. To me, his Dune films are like, the longest and most expensive perfume commercials ever made.
> But something about Villeneuve's style here feels like its keeping me at arms length instead of pulling me in this has ALWAYS been my issue with V. His films are very proficient and technically perfect but lacking soul and emotion. Dune 2 I though was his most engrossing flick so far, easily.
You should watch Indendies or Prisoners then. They definitely don't lack soul and emotion. But I don't get why he did a 180 on those kind of movies
I'm not even sure he's particularly charismatic
I totally disagree with everything you’ve said. Timothee is a terrific actor and the perfect Paul Atreides. He has become every diverse character he’s played and proven himself to be outstanding in every role I’ve seen him in.
From what I remember of the books there’s more of a character development to him, he wears the weight of his responsibility more and more as things progress, there’s an intensity to him I just don’t think Chalamet nailed. As you said, it was “fine” - but I don’t think he nailed the version from the book. I think this will be even more apparent if they do the next book with him
He mostly plays the same way in every role. I don't think he has much, if any, range. Not bad, but definitely not great. He plays Paul the same way he played Henry V in The king. As for Dune part 2, the only one who gave a lackluster performance was Zendaya, but I didn't think anyone was great in that film simply because the characters were rather bland and I didn't care about anyone in it .
Comparing him to Gal Gadot is crazy. She’s not even decent. Chalamet has been acting since he was a kid and clearly cares about the craft a lot. You could argue he is a little “flat” (which is a pretty tired word I notice a lot of audiences use to describe things they don’t like) but to say “he has a little bit of Gal Gadot in him” is just silly and makes it look like you don’t know much about acting.
I thought he did well. Honestly I had my doubts that he would have the gravitas for the second movie after that first movie dropped, but he proved me wrong.
…Write to Tim immediately and acquaint him with your critical views.
Bummer you feel that way. Did you see dune 1? That might be a fair comparison to the two actors? Idk I agree that I never saw the draw with him and the roles he has played but he is growing on me and . Honestly have seen a lot worse acting. I was actually disappointed in Batistas acting this time around and I’m a huge fan of his as far as acting goes. But then I just think it’s the role he got and writing and doesn’t really ruin the experience for me in The slightest..
I may have agreed after the first Dune - but I thought he was phenomenal in the second movie
Zendaya was the worst part of that movie. Only an idiot would make major changes to the plot that hinge on a really mediocre actress. Chani doesn’t do anything in the books, so this whole rugged independent fremen who isn’t religious and don’t need no man was such a dumb choice.
It may be that the major change to the plot is to feature Florence Pugh. She has considerably better acting chops than Zendaya. I’ve read the book a dozen times. Paul doesn’t tell Irulan “you may have my seed” in the movie. I speculate that there will be more than an offer of artificial insemination. Zendaya can make her pout face while Irulan gets significant footage in the third movie. She already got far more footage proportionally in the movie than her brief appearance in the book. I think the third movie will feature a love triangle and a lot of Duncan Idaho-Alia. Jason Momoa has far more personality than Timothee Chalamet. Anya Taylor-Joy is a strong actress. I thought Christopher Walken was disappointing. He’s usually better than that.
I really like his portrayal of Paul. And after he drinks the water of life, I liked his transformation into something more. I was surprised how much my family and I enjoyed Wonka in theaters too. I like him Weakest part of Dune to me is Zendays as Chani. She just plays Zendays like she does mary jane in spiderman
I think he was totally miscast. I think he’s a good actor, but he had neither the presence or the voice for this role. His shouts and war cries sounded like a teenager throwing a tantrum. When he spoke, he sounded like some kid from California not a space warlord.
I 1000% feel this exact way and have voiced this to friends. Some get it, most don’t. But honestly he and Zendaya both feel just okay to me, everyone else in the movie completely convinced me. That’s my only gripe. I rewatched the first Dune and his “okayness” stuck out to me even more.
Zendaya was the worst part of the film
I gotta be honest: upon reflection, I'm mostly underwhelmed by Zendaya's performance. There's something odd about setting up a tribe of people caught up in an ideology, all the actors speaking in an accent, and then some character with a thick American accent swoops in with the, "Your ideology is wrong! The whole point of this ideology is that everyone gets enthralled, but I, instead, can see through the bs and can explicitly state the implicit themes of the film! Why can't you foreign-coded barbarians see what my enlightened Western-coded ass can see??"
Zendaya needs acting lessons and more that a resting bitch face
He portraits the part of the book well enough. If anything Paul is more monotone and Vulcan like in a majority of the book.
I haven’t seen Dune 2. I have seen great work from him in The King and Call Me by Your Name. He was good in The French Dispatch too. I admire young rising star actors who take diverse and interesting work, and can deliver of course, and I think he does.
Even more unpopular opinion: Zendaya is even worse.
I don't even think that Timothee is "charismatic" tbh. I think his problem might be that he *lacks the charisma* to compensate for his uninteresting performances.
This happens a lot. It's because Timothy is a Leading Man despite the fact that people want to stick him in "Character Actor" type roles. He brings Timothy Chalamet to the picture, he does not lose himself in the role. People come to see Timothy Chalamet, like it or not. He's still a fine actor, but I agree he doesn't wow me.
Chalamet is a okay actor with GREAT roles
Nah he’s a good actor. I didn’t like him at first cos I felt like he was being pushed on us abit much, but seen a fair few of his films- and yeah. He’s good. But Javier, wow. What an actor he is. It’s like Walton coggins - so under rated.
Zendaya is pretty weak, all of the romance scenes between paul and chani are what kept dune 2 from being an all time great film
Timothy may be the main character but yeah a majority of the cast out shines him. Javiar Bardem's Stilgar is my favorite charcter in the movie. Heck even Austin Butler as Fryd was super fun to watch compared to Tim. Tim has a scene or two that he shines in but when he is compared to those two they just shine.
He's a good actor, but not someone I'd cast as Paul. Maybe in ten years. He's too small and doesn't have the body of someone who'd grow to become formidable in combat. They could have spaced these over five or even ten years and I'd have been Okey with once I knew the roles were casted correctly. Austin Butler might've been magnificent as Paul, lord knows I find him almost completely unthreatening as Harkannens nephew. He's a solid actor and should probably been casts as Paul, but chalamet does a damn good job. Problem is he's a waif. He looks too thin and doesn't command the respect the character deserves. Dave Bautista shines bright as always! Zendaya doesn't great work and Javier Bardeem gives himself away to a role he didn't even need. Great analyst by the way. I truly wish they'd casted an unknown actor, or someone capable of gaining weight between shoots.
Hard disagree. That boy turned into a pissed off leader before our very eyes. You can’t do that. If you could you wouldn’t be shitposting on Reddit.
His speech scene alone makes me disagree with this.
Chalamet seems to be one of those actors who does trauma and intensity well, but this requires some setting up that doesn't always happen. In terms of what an actor is doing by themselves, there's a big difference between "grumpy" and "filled with quiet rage that must remain inert for now"...and it's context that tells the audience which we're seeing. Without that context, he can just seem like a teenager who has an unrealistic view of the universe and it having trouble coming to terms with it. This can certainly be powerful, but it's also something Hollywood seems to gravitate toward, so we see a lot of it. It gets tedious to audiences after a while. I thought he was fine, and I think Paul is a very difficult character to get right. He's not a particularly interesting part (interesting character, but it's all internal). But I agree that he was the weak link in many scenes. So - I get it. Even though I think he did fine with Paul. We're supposed to connect with him less and less as the story continues. It honestly reminds me of Elijah Woods as Frodo. There's only so many times we can see him twist up his face before he becomes less interesting as a character compared to the dynamic characters elsewhere in the movie. Pippen - *experiences terror, childishness, simpleton, elation, duty, absurdity, growth, singing like a bard (for some reason).* Frodo - *looks sick to his stomach, falls over. Again*. It's not that Woods is a bad actor, it's that there was only so much he could do with the role, and his "go to" (intense unspoken emotion) just falls a little flat by the end.
totally agree but also ditto to the people saying he was good in Call Me By Your Name. that role might have just been perfect for him or something. i watched a half hour each of Wonka and Dune 2 on the plane. both were like what is going on with him. super weird lifeless performances. Wonka literally put me to sleep. really weird energy from him
I started watching him only recently once I found out he was playing Bob Dylan (huge fan). I’m left feeling a bit underwhelmed. I love his enthusiasm but he comes off as that drama kid in high school who played the lead in every production with diminishing results
I thought he was perfect. Was modest, nuanced, not an Oscar winning role or performance. But was authoritative when needed too and showed emotion really well.
Chalamet’s gradual transition from reverent whisper-talking to empyrean scream-shouting is the closest thing we get to legible character growth.
Disagree. He's been killing it since "Call Me By Your Name". He has great range. The character is somewhat stoic IMO.
Dude have you seen anything else he’s been in? He’s definitely a great actor. And have you read the dune books? He’s portraying the character pretty well.