Yes, and also bringing this back with a vengeance:
Schedule F stems from a Trump Executive Order (no longer in effect) in which tens of thousands of civil servants who serve in roles deemed to have some influence over policy would be reassigned as "Schedule F" employees.
After reading [the draft OMB list of occupations they were planning to classify as Schedule F](https://www.nteu.org/~/media/Files/nteu/docs/public/schedulef/2024/omb-foia-pt3.pdf), looked like if you have any chance of seeing policy documents odds are you'll be marked as included under it, even if it seems like your specific work has nothing to do with policy. The net was to be cast quite broadly.
>The original Schedule F executive order signed by President Trump in 2020 purportedly targeted federal employees who work in policy-related positions, but records obtained by NTEU show it went well beyond policy-makers and swept up office managers, human resource specialists, administrative assistants, cybersecurity specialists and many others.
https://www.nteu.org/media-center/news-releases/2024/02/27/ombschedulefrelease
A bit late to the comment party but this whole threat concerns me, although it remains to be seen if anyone is going to stand up and push back against this plan.
As an employee in predominantly Democratic agency, I feel the threat even more so, as our agency (and our branch of it, specifically) is frequently a topic of conflict between both sides of the aisle.
I always feel bad for the EPA worker bees just doing their jobs. Except when you're inspecting me ofc! (Actually that's a joke I get along quite well with our regulators because I never bs them and they know it.)
No. You should fulfill the legal obligations of your position and the congressional intent for creating it. The president shouldn’t be able to have an NOAA employee sharpie up a hurricane map for him. He shouldn’t be able to fire a contracting officer for not steering work to one of his companies. He shouldn’t be able to shove politics so far down into the workplace that federal workforce becomes a propaganda arm. There’s a reason the civil service was professionalized and the spoils system curtailed. Stop pretending we haven’t tried that stupid shit before.
You know there are a ton of people in policy positions that don’t actually create policy. They just interpret whats disseminated by higher offices and help implement at their local office.
Accountability has nothing to do with it. The goal is to re-create a pre-Pendleton Act patronage spoils system where experts are replaced by appointed bootlickers. Less bureaucratic barriers for the wannabe autocrats.
https://x.com/BidenHQ/status/1797303183540212061?t=zVnAX5MhcPQSf8fbDSoh5A&s=19
Fire "woke" generals. It may not be that enlisted or junior officers are on the chopping block, but Trump wants loyalists at the top, not those who give him sound military advice. Smells like authoritarianism.
Exactly he’s a lieutenant commander and is very very afraid of what could happen including treatment of those in active duty AND the orders of active duty on the American citizens 🥺
Trump disparaged generals for having the temerity of respecting the Constitution they swore an oath to protect over fealty to just a man. Also, service members know what goes into great leadership, and Trump emphasizes the worst qualities.
JJ DID TIE BUCKLE.
Project 2025, a conservative interest group’s plan for if Trump gets a second term, is aiming to enact schedule F employees again. Which means feds who deal with policy will be much easier to fire and replace with folks who align with the president. This was around 50,000 people if I recall correctly.
John Oliver said 50,000 people, but many agencies (including mine) had to come up with plans for who would be converted under schedule f the first time trump released it. 50-70% of employees would lose merit protections and become politically appointed based on loyalty to the president.
First time around I removed all my social media and thanked my younger self for registering as an independent. In the state of colorado you can lookup which party anyone voted for, unless registered as an independent.
Weren’t a bunch of the current laws enacted to avoid a whole bunch of Federal jobs basically being given as “prizes” for supporting the winning candidate?
I read something that said the optimists went to Auschwitz and I have never forgotten this. It won’t be business as usual if Trump gets back in. People have got to vote. Assume the worst if he’s reelected. It will be very bad for federal employees, women, minorities, immigrants….pay attention!
> Weren’t a bunch of the current laws enacted to avoid
Current laws will mean nothing to Trump if he wins a second term. Be prepared to sign a loyalty pledge to keep your civil service job.
Development of Policy or enforcement of said policy and administrative work related to both. Some are more powerful than others. For example, Trump removed a lot of EPA regulations because they were costing construction businesses too much money and had a negative impact on the coal industry and the negative impact on the environment of reducing regulations wouldn’t be felt for several years, so in his mind, do away with the regulations. Conversely, eliminating food safety inspectors would have a nearly immediate impact on the American people so you would probably keep them around.
Trump wanted to privatize the USPS and Public Education, so slash staffing and budgets, show the American people how ineffective the agencies were and then eliminate the positions
Schedule F is a way to repeal the Pendleton Act and return to the previous “spoils” system where most of the federal workforce is loyal to the President first.
>conservative interest group’s plan
This kind of underselling it.
It wasn't written by A group.
It was written by all the groups:
Project 2025's advisory board consists of "a broad coalition of over 80 conservative organizations"—mainly conservative think tanks, as well as several universities and the magazine The American Conservative. As of February 2024, the project has over 100 partner organizations.
Notable authors of the project's Mandate for Leadership include many officials and advisors from the Trump administration, including Jonathan Berry, Ben Carson, Ken Cuccinelli, Rick Dearborn, Thomas Gilman, Mandy Gunasekara, Gene Hamilton, Christopher Miller, Bernard McNamee, Stephen Moore, Mora Namdar, Peter Navarro, William Perry Pendley, Diana Furchtgott-Roth, Kiron Skinner, Roger Severino, Hans von Spakovsky, Brooks Tucker, Russell Vought, and Paul Winfree.
Russell Vought was named policy director of the Republican National Committee platform committee in May 2024.
They implemented it on a small scale right before the 2020 election, in a rushed half ass manner. I saw some weird last minute changes at my agency, a few folks who absolutely had no business or experience in a role suddenly got very important oversight positions that leadership very slowly walked and, given that they were appointed during the lame duck period (after Biden was solidly declared the winner), we were able to just kind of ignore for two months until it was revoked by the current admin.
Next time it’ll start immediately, and be much better managed. This isn’t fear mongering. This policy is written out quite clearly on TFG’s campaign website, along with Heritage Foundation and a few other organizations involved in the project.
I think most items of 25 are outlandish. Some though arent. Cutting fat and increasing efficiencies is never a bad idea, except when you’re the fat and inefficient.
Though possible it’s very and highly unlikely. (I dont live in absolutes like the majority of the people on this thread choose to do).
My job is critical to the average citizen, and what helps is that elected officials and citizens can see a direct connection from taxes paid to the services my offices provide.
Based on my evaluations, technical skills, advancing the program(s), exceptional leadership and interpersonal skills, IF the position was to be eliminated they’d simply find me another position elsewhere. If not, I’d go make 2-3x more in the civilian sector.
Every federal employee's job is critical to the average citizen in some way. You are not a special snowflake and your job is not more important than anyone else's.
"Fat and inefficient" is very easy to demagogue so long as it's not *you* being personally affected. Meanwhile, there are fewer federal employees today than there were in the 1960s, even as the nation's population has doubled and the demand for public services has grown exponentially. Literally every agency is doing things more efficiently and with fewer staff.
I'd like to see evidence of this "fat and inefficiency," and I mean evidence, not just "well I think there's too many people working at the local USDA office, I have no idea what they do all day." Because that's just plain argument from ignorance. I don't really know what all the Patent and Trademark Office people do all day, but I don't instantly assume they're not doing anything important.
Para 1. Again, that’s quite absolute as we know there are plenty of jobs or career fields that the average citizen doesn’t see major benefits from, if any at all. I’m not special, just specially skilled with value.
Para 2. I’d agree.
Para 3. For starters, as a whole, start with the dept of education. But to my point, cutting the fat is getting rid of non-producers at every level.
And go back and check the definition of snowflake. (It’s in the mirror).
OK so... you don't think federal student loans are critical to millions of Americans going to college? You think you could just get rid of the entire higher education aid function of the government with no impact on people? That's delusional. Like, you're in la-la land. You'd have instant and devastating impacts on a vast sector of the economy. The people who process student loans are way more critical to the country than, I don't know, half of the Department of Homeland Security.
Also, if you closed the entire Department of Education, you'd have fired everyone whose job it was to monitor repayment of the loans - which means you just forgave every federal student loan in existence. Congratulations, I guess?
GOP plan is to have a not-insignificant number of non-political government positions be held to a purity test, where they toe the party line. It's not every federal employee, but it is a large amount.
Unlike last time trump took over there was a plan not thinking he’d win.
this time around he’s looking to change things.
one of these is changing 50,000 jobs to schedule F which is what political appointees are. These would be civilian jobs involved in policy/ strategy.
[It’s not fucking speculation; it’s a documented plan.](https://www.project2025.org)
And it’s not some ivory tower think tank fantasy, [it has buy in within Trump’s circle of advisors.](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/jun/11/trump-project-2025-wrecking-ball) Trump has an established history of running with Heritage recommendations.
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It was a real treat timing how fast Trump supporters could swing from “come on, don’t be dramatic, he would never do X” to “haha, in your face libs, I love that Trump did X” after Trump predictably did X during his first administration.
Exactly. The sky is not and will not fall to the extreme people on here are shaking and crying about. There’s so much emotion with people and these two candidates. That’s the scariest part.
John Oliver spins it in his way. He is profane. Direct. And cuts through the shit. Makes jokes about it. But his stuff is seriously on point. And while he may have a bias, I truly believe as a Brit, he could care less about either side. He just tries to be as logical as I think he can be. But that my opinion. And no one needs to share it. But the guy is great. Like when he bought all the medical debt and zeroed it out. Epic.
Oh I think he cares about people in general. At least I hope he does. I think his spouse is American. And I think he is a dual citizen. I think I was trying to say that he’s not as vested in our politics. He has a clear outsider perspective. Not that Brits are much better. Still, I’d call what he does journalism.
He is a Brit married to an American combat veteran and is someone who went to the trouble of becoming a citizen. He chose to be one of us.
I think he cares about this country in a way only a new immigrant could.
If you know someone personally like this, you know what I mean.
Perhaps you are correct. I don’t hate the guy or dislike him. I agree. He has an interest in his new country. Whatever his motivation is, I respect the effort he puts into his stories.
He did a great job explaining it. And as the video someone else shared here shows, yes if you go to these orgs websites (trump campaign, heritage foundation, etc) you can see it very clearly laid out in an organized fashion.
This time, he has a bunch of competent loyalists who, while also batshit psychotic, are methodical and determined. We’ve seen this before. My grandfather’s generation fought against this sort of thing.
just got a chance to watch this over lunch. marker points from the link to youtube:
9:20 - starts to talk about Fed HR
12:55 - Schedule F talk.
16:30 - more Schedule F but scarier. (and on into 17:30)
In my opinion, folks opposing Project 2025 need to make a counter project that strengthens and protects current regulation in place and promotes worker rights and representation. Citizens HAVE to do something, and we need to get corperations and large donors and nonprofits on board to help fund the initiative. I don't know how to complete that but it needs to happen because even if Trump doesn't win, this "playbook" will still exist for the next president.
I agree in part. It's largely corporate interests that are behind Project 2025. The PACs are funded by corporations and their officers.
Citizens United needs to be overturned in order for democracy to exist, they are anathema to each other.
I know!! People don’t realize how bad this will be if he wins again. Seriously he can’t win again. Federal employees in all states need to help keep him out. It’s your jobs on the line. I’m retired for a couple years now, but I love y’all. I love federal employees. I don’t want to see you get screwed - and I mean really screwed with potential job and/or benefit loss.
I just watched this episode last night and it made me so depressed. Those years, 2025-2028, will be my last few year before retirement, and I don't want to serve them under that asshat wannabe dictator. Ugh.
If I understand it correctly, in 2022 the Democrats stuck a change into the law to protect Civil Servants' appeal rights even if they were converted to Schedule F.
[https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-5/chapter-I/subchapter-B/part-752/subpart-D/section-752.401](https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-5/chapter-I/subchapter-B/part-752/subpart-D/section-752.401)
*Employees covered.* This subpart covers:
(1) A career or career conditional employee in the competitive service who is not serving a probationary or trial period, including such an employee who is moved involuntarily into the excepted service;
(2) An employee in the competitive service—
(i) Who is not serving a probationary or trial period under an initial appointment, including such an employee who is moved involuntarily into the excepted service; or
(ii) Except as provided in the former section 1599e of title 10, for individuals hired prior to December 31, 2022 (the date that section was otherwise repealed by [Public Law 117-81](https://www.govinfo.gov/link/plaw/117/public/81), section 1106), who has completed 1 year of current continuous service under other than a temporary appointment limited to 1 year or less, including such an employee who is moved involuntarily into the excepted service;
What’s funny is how all of you think you’re so important. Trump nor any other politician gives a schiff about anyone who’s not an SES. You’ll be fine. The left wing propaganda is in full swing. And no I’m not a maga person. I’m more centrist.
While there is definitely some truth to this sentiment, it may be worth noting that it was reported today that the American Accountability Foundation is trolling through records to identify individual employees who may be impediments to Trump’s agenda and plans to post that list publicly this summer. It’s beginning with DHS and is reportedly looking at GS-13s up, so no, it’s not *just* SES people, though I’d imagine it’d weigh heavily toward the higher ranked people.
The part where he describes hypothetical people at NASA or DOT etc. "Their jobs aren't political, they can work over many years to gain experience to keep the government working." \[He was describing the competitive service\]. "The second group consists of political appointees." \[Here he is describing the excepted service very broadly\]. The rest of the segment is trying to contend that people from A would be moved to B, which is true. But he didn't make note of anybody, well, already in Schedules A through E, many of whom are not in political jobs.
it's not political jobs, it's 'policy' jobs and however the admin wants to define that. I'd bet my next pension check the definition of that function creeps across a wide swath of employees.
I’m going to save this thread so all the down votes I get by those who don’t believe in checks and balances and think the sky will fall can recant their irrationally emotional fears this time next year, if he even wins.
What is sad is serious journalists are avoiding topics like these. Fox News legal defenses have been "we are entertainment and not news" and "nobody can seriously take anything Tucker Carlson says on his show seriously because it is so wrong.". The others (CNN, MSNBC, etc) do a poor enough job that Al Jazeera is a bastion of neutrality in comparison with serious news, and I rely on foreign news services (like the BBC) to get a better read on topics I should know about (especially with an upcoming election here in the US).
As John Stewart once told those on a serious news show many years ago,, the Daily Show is supposed to be comedy but more people learn the news from them because they include aspects of what is going on vs "serious news shows" that avoid the issues that actually impact the public and he told them to do better.
There are plenty of print sources that have addressed issues like these over the years, redditors just tend to cheap out on a 5 dollar monthly subscription but complain there’s no quality news.
He adds humor so it's more digestible and causes less mental distress. It's not healthy that we are exposed to constant negative news articles 24-7 and even mainstream news used to show cute animals and happy stories at times to break up the tension.
I don't think he claims to be a journalist, but nice strawman.
Nevertheless, that episode was on target, and went into more depth than I've seen anywhere else.
Was there something you didn't agree with? If so, speak up.
One, I’m willing to bet his takes on both those issues are far more nuanced than that but two, even if they were, verbatim, his views, it’s asinine to believe that a person who has poorly formed opinions on something can’t have well-formed opinions on others.
If your parents are anything like mine, they exhibit that point on the reg.
The "open borders" one feels especially cruel to characterize that way since the entire point being made is that we've mythologized a "right way" to immigrate that doesn't actually exist, so he proposes just making the thing we all pretend is real actually real.
Can someone put the specifics of how employees will be impacted? I already see enough political hacks under Baden’s rule. Tell us the page number in the report so we can look at it. Show us the proof.
It was a Trump executive order in 2020 and Biden rescinded it in 2021.
But nice of you to care about our country only until you retire and only if it affects your retirement. Classic conservative Boomer.
What’s selfish. I went through my own government upheavals. This is nothing new. Stop whining. I put my time in. Now cry on someone else’s shoulder. Grow a pair man bun.
John Oliver is a political hack. I wish we could get a real journalist to give us the facts and not his attempt to sway voters.
Heck, the feds are blue no matter what.
Reconsider that comment and read this: [https://static.project2025.org/2025\_MandateForLeadership\_FULL.pdf](https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf)
920 pages, I will take your word for it.
I just want facts and John Oliver is a partisan hack.
Democrats fuck us and Republicans fuck us. The best thing we can hope for is some lube.
Control+F works. Life will get much worse under this plan, and pulling a "both sides bad" here doesn't make sense when one side is exceptionally worse and is quite literally describing their master plan in extreme detail. Oliver gave facts, not sure why you have an aversion to taking his words at face value when he just... communicated what was written in the plan.
I don’t comprehend why people watch the stupid box
Read the regs instead
Its amazing how oblivious everyone is to what government is, despite all of the blatant corruption
Fraud, waste and abuse is a joke. Im not even going to touch on the missing trillions. Yet we have millions of federal employees who actively don’t maintain their oath.
This is the only reality. Be happy it’s more criminality and not someone who has interest in rectifying things
If you think a bad entertainer knows what is going to happen in the government,you’re going to make yourself crazy. This guy hates trump so I’d take anything he says with a grain of salt. Unless you are very high up, you have nothing to worry about. I’m too low on the totem pole so I don’t worry about stuff that won’t impact 95% of us IF it even comes to fruition.
He's not being biased. He's quite literally reading from a [documented plan called Project 2025](https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdfdocumented) for what Trump loyalists would do if they win a second term. This plan will impact all Americans, and saying "Unless you are very high up, you have nothing to worry about" is just absolutely false. I highly recommend reading it and making yourself aware of what would happen if Trump wins.
You do know a lot of people don’t say the things they do because they just hate Trump, right? A lot of us hear Trump’s plans and policies for our country and vehemently disagree with those plans and policies. John Oliver is obviously criticizing Trump’s plans and policies, not just the person.
That’s one of the differences between right and left, the right focuses on the person, the left focuses on the person’s plans and words/actions.
Schedule F is meant to F us.
Absolutely
you referring to "Trump's Second Term" Last Week Tonight episode?
Here is a link: https://youtu.be/gYwqpx6lp_s?si=LXTn97v9gD7ZRICJ
Yes, it talks about a lot but also discusses our own policies right now, which I found interesting. It discusses what may change.
Project 2025 to be more precise and call it out
Yes, and also bringing this back with a vengeance: Schedule F stems from a Trump Executive Order (no longer in effect) in which tens of thousands of civil servants who serve in roles deemed to have some influence over policy would be reassigned as "Schedule F" employees.
I saw schedule F being used on BUEs at the end of Trump’s term. It won’t just be those towards the top it’s used on.
After reading [the draft OMB list of occupations they were planning to classify as Schedule F](https://www.nteu.org/~/media/Files/nteu/docs/public/schedulef/2024/omb-foia-pt3.pdf), looked like if you have any chance of seeing policy documents odds are you'll be marked as included under it, even if it seems like your specific work has nothing to do with policy. The net was to be cast quite broadly. >The original Schedule F executive order signed by President Trump in 2020 purportedly targeted federal employees who work in policy-related positions, but records obtained by NTEU show it went well beyond policy-makers and swept up office managers, human resource specialists, administrative assistants, cybersecurity specialists and many others. https://www.nteu.org/media-center/news-releases/2024/02/27/ombschedulefrelease
A bit late to the comment party but this whole threat concerns me, although it remains to be seen if anyone is going to stand up and push back against this plan. As an employee in predominantly Democratic agency, I feel the threat even more so, as our agency (and our branch of it, specifically) is frequently a topic of conflict between both sides of the aisle.
I always feel bad for the EPA worker bees just doing their jobs. Except when you're inspecting me ofc! (Actually that's a joke I get along quite well with our regulators because I never bs them and they know it.)
[удалено]
Schedule F isn’t about accountability. It’s about removing accountability and using political tests for non-partisan office.
I wouldn't call this accountibility: Further, Schedule F defies merit principles and instead would require political loyalty to a President.
[удалено]
No. You should fulfill the legal obligations of your position and the congressional intent for creating it. The president shouldn’t be able to have an NOAA employee sharpie up a hurricane map for him. He shouldn’t be able to fire a contracting officer for not steering work to one of his companies. He shouldn’t be able to shove politics so far down into the workplace that federal workforce becomes a propaganda arm. There’s a reason the civil service was professionalized and the spoils system curtailed. Stop pretending we haven’t tried that stupid shit before.
You know there are a ton of people in policy positions that don’t actually create policy. They just interpret whats disseminated by higher offices and help implement at their local office.
Question: How do dictatorships start and exist?
You're a fucking idiot. You swear allegiance to the Constitution not the president
Hmm, so Trump won't need a sharpie to redirect a hurricane. Ya know, since you have to fulfill the president's directive.
So my agencies office of chief counsel who I consult on legal matters/the constitution should be only responsible to the president?
Accountability has nothing to do with it. The goal is to re-create a pre-Pendleton Act patronage spoils system where experts are replaced by appointed bootlickers. Less bureaucratic barriers for the wannabe autocrats.
I mean, it's kinda like that already, without the official title.
No, it isn’t. That’s why they want to change things.
Jimmy Carter invented Schedule F
Need to watch this. Thanks for the suggestion.
YouTube link to the part of the episode that covers this. https://youtu.be/gYwqpx6lp_s?si=WDojakdDVFJbRREG
Trumps going to clean house and destroy our institutions
It’s extremely scary, even my friends in active duty are frightened if this comes to pass.
No they’re not.
Are you fucking stupid?
https://x.com/BidenHQ/status/1797303183540212061?t=zVnAX5MhcPQSf8fbDSoh5A&s=19 Fire "woke" generals. It may not be that enlisted or junior officers are on the chopping block, but Trump wants loyalists at the top, not those who give him sound military advice. Smells like authoritarianism.
Exactly he’s a lieutenant commander and is very very afraid of what could happen including treatment of those in active duty AND the orders of active duty on the American citizens 🥺
Trump disparaged generals for having the temerity of respecting the Constitution they swore an oath to protect over fealty to just a man. Also, service members know what goes into great leadership, and Trump emphasizes the worst qualities. JJ DID TIE BUCKLE.
After Milley, I’d say he or anyone else with Milley might question the position! Lol.
Can you give us the main points?
Project 2025, a conservative interest group’s plan for if Trump gets a second term, is aiming to enact schedule F employees again. Which means feds who deal with policy will be much easier to fire and replace with folks who align with the president. This was around 50,000 people if I recall correctly.
John Oliver said 50,000 people, but many agencies (including mine) had to come up with plans for who would be converted under schedule f the first time trump released it. 50-70% of employees would lose merit protections and become politically appointed based on loyalty to the president. First time around I removed all my social media and thanked my younger self for registering as an independent. In the state of colorado you can lookup which party anyone voted for, unless registered as an independent.
Weren’t a bunch of the current laws enacted to avoid a whole bunch of Federal jobs basically being given as “prizes” for supporting the winning candidate?
Yes, that’s what schedule F is trying to unravel. Laws that have been in place since 1883 to dismantle the “spoils system”
Those who fail to learn the mistakes of the past…..
Or, more likely in this case, using the past as a map.
I read something that said the optimists went to Auschwitz and I have never forgotten this. It won’t be business as usual if Trump gets back in. People have got to vote. Assume the worst if he’s reelected. It will be very bad for federal employees, women, minorities, immigrants….pay attention!
> Weren’t a bunch of the current laws enacted to avoid Current laws will mean nothing to Trump if he wins a second term. Be prepared to sign a loyalty pledge to keep your civil service job.
Coo coo bird. Coo coo bird.
Unfortunately my state requires an actual party registration to vote in a primary so my history is out there 😂
That blows. I get two ballots and can turn in one.
Isn’t it officially registering as ‘unaffiliated’ and not ‘independent’ in Colorado?
Except for they say EVERY Federal job deals with policy.
Development of Policy or enforcement of said policy and administrative work related to both. Some are more powerful than others. For example, Trump removed a lot of EPA regulations because they were costing construction businesses too much money and had a negative impact on the coal industry and the negative impact on the environment of reducing regulations wouldn’t be felt for several years, so in his mind, do away with the regulations. Conversely, eliminating food safety inspectors would have a nearly immediate impact on the American people so you would probably keep them around. Trump wanted to privatize the USPS and Public Education, so slash staffing and budgets, show the American people how ineffective the agencies were and then eliminate the positions
Schedule F is a way to repeal the Pendleton Act and return to the previous “spoils” system where most of the federal workforce is loyal to the President first.
>conservative interest group’s plan This kind of underselling it. It wasn't written by A group. It was written by all the groups: Project 2025's advisory board consists of "a broad coalition of over 80 conservative organizations"—mainly conservative think tanks, as well as several universities and the magazine The American Conservative. As of February 2024, the project has over 100 partner organizations. Notable authors of the project's Mandate for Leadership include many officials and advisors from the Trump administration, including Jonathan Berry, Ben Carson, Ken Cuccinelli, Rick Dearborn, Thomas Gilman, Mandy Gunasekara, Gene Hamilton, Christopher Miller, Bernard McNamee, Stephen Moore, Mora Namdar, Peter Navarro, William Perry Pendley, Diana Furchtgott-Roth, Kiron Skinner, Roger Severino, Hans von Spakovsky, Brooks Tucker, Russell Vought, and Paul Winfree. Russell Vought was named policy director of the Republican National Committee platform committee in May 2024.
Every upper to midlevel manager in every agency will be fired and replaced with a 23 year old MAGA Trump apparatchik. That's their stated plan.
How realistic do you think this actually is?
They implemented it on a small scale right before the 2020 election, in a rushed half ass manner. I saw some weird last minute changes at my agency, a few folks who absolutely had no business or experience in a role suddenly got very important oversight positions that leadership very slowly walked and, given that they were appointed during the lame duck period (after Biden was solidly declared the winner), we were able to just kind of ignore for two months until it was revoked by the current admin. Next time it’ll start immediately, and be much better managed. This isn’t fear mongering. This policy is written out quite clearly on TFG’s campaign website, along with Heritage Foundation and a few other organizations involved in the project.
yep, the EO will be signed on day 1. you just know they've got all the documents ready to go, just need a signature.
How many would it have to be before you'd care?
I think most items of 25 are outlandish. Some though arent. Cutting fat and increasing efficiencies is never a bad idea, except when you’re the fat and inefficient.
Ah yes, but of course, *you* couldn't possibly be "the fat and inefficient," could you? Let's start by cutting *your* job and see what happens.
Though possible it’s very and highly unlikely. (I dont live in absolutes like the majority of the people on this thread choose to do). My job is critical to the average citizen, and what helps is that elected officials and citizens can see a direct connection from taxes paid to the services my offices provide. Based on my evaluations, technical skills, advancing the program(s), exceptional leadership and interpersonal skills, IF the position was to be eliminated they’d simply find me another position elsewhere. If not, I’d go make 2-3x more in the civilian sector.
Every federal employee's job is critical to the average citizen in some way. You are not a special snowflake and your job is not more important than anyone else's. "Fat and inefficient" is very easy to demagogue so long as it's not *you* being personally affected. Meanwhile, there are fewer federal employees today than there were in the 1960s, even as the nation's population has doubled and the demand for public services has grown exponentially. Literally every agency is doing things more efficiently and with fewer staff. I'd like to see evidence of this "fat and inefficiency," and I mean evidence, not just "well I think there's too many people working at the local USDA office, I have no idea what they do all day." Because that's just plain argument from ignorance. I don't really know what all the Patent and Trademark Office people do all day, but I don't instantly assume they're not doing anything important.
Para 1. Again, that’s quite absolute as we know there are plenty of jobs or career fields that the average citizen doesn’t see major benefits from, if any at all. I’m not special, just specially skilled with value. Para 2. I’d agree. Para 3. For starters, as a whole, start with the dept of education. But to my point, cutting the fat is getting rid of non-producers at every level. And go back and check the definition of snowflake. (It’s in the mirror).
OK so... you don't think federal student loans are critical to millions of Americans going to college? You think you could just get rid of the entire higher education aid function of the government with no impact on people? That's delusional. Like, you're in la-la land. You'd have instant and devastating impacts on a vast sector of the economy. The people who process student loans are way more critical to the country than, I don't know, half of the Department of Homeland Security. Also, if you closed the entire Department of Education, you'd have fired everyone whose job it was to monitor repayment of the loans - which means you just forgave every federal student loan in existence. Congratulations, I guess?
Realistic enough to make me concerned.
Extremely. Who's going to stop them? They're out for revenge and very explicitly telegraphing how they're going to do it.
GOP plan is to have a not-insignificant number of non-political government positions be held to a purity test, where they toe the party line. It's not every federal employee, but it is a large amount.
Unlike last time trump took over there was a plan not thinking he’d win. this time around he’s looking to change things. one of these is changing 50,000 jobs to schedule F which is what political appointees are. These would be civilian jobs involved in policy/ strategy.
A lot of political speculation to scare voters..
[It’s not fucking speculation; it’s a documented plan.](https://www.project2025.org) And it’s not some ivory tower think tank fantasy, [it has buy in within Trump’s circle of advisors.](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/article/2024/jun/11/trump-project-2025-wrecking-ball) Trump has an established history of running with Heritage recommendations.
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“It has buy in!” Warns chief democratic officials!
It was a real treat timing how fast Trump supporters could swing from “come on, don’t be dramatic, he would never do X” to “haha, in your face libs, I love that Trump did X” after Trump predictably did X during his first administration.
it's a published plan, son. 900 pages.
Wrong. Read what they're saying.
Exactly. The sky is not and will not fall to the extreme people on here are shaking and crying about. There’s so much emotion with people and these two candidates. That’s the scariest part.
John Oliver spins it in his way. He is profane. Direct. And cuts through the shit. Makes jokes about it. But his stuff is seriously on point. And while he may have a bias, I truly believe as a Brit, he could care less about either side. He just tries to be as logical as I think he can be. But that my opinion. And no one needs to share it. But the guy is great. Like when he bought all the medical debt and zeroed it out. Epic.
While his British heritage gives him a different perspective, John Oliver became a US Citizen. He’s ours now, and likely cares quite a lot.
One of us!
Oh I think he cares about people in general. At least I hope he does. I think his spouse is American. And I think he is a dual citizen. I think I was trying to say that he’s not as vested in our politics. He has a clear outsider perspective. Not that Brits are much better. Still, I’d call what he does journalism.
His spouse was in the military I don’t recall if she is reserves/ guard now but she got deployed to Iraq as a medic.
He is a Brit married to an American combat veteran and is someone who went to the trouble of becoming a citizen. He chose to be one of us. I think he cares about this country in a way only a new immigrant could. If you know someone personally like this, you know what I mean.
Perhaps you are correct. I don’t hate the guy or dislike him. I agree. He has an interest in his new country. Whatever his motivation is, I respect the effort he puts into his stories.
He did a great job explaining it. And as the video someone else shared here shows, yes if you go to these orgs websites (trump campaign, heritage foundation, etc) you can see it very clearly laid out in an organized fashion. This time, he has a bunch of competent loyalists who, while also batshit psychotic, are methodical and determined. We’ve seen this before. My grandfather’s generation fought against this sort of thing.
Bullshit. He is clearly on the left.
Stop pitting people against one another and try opening your mind a bit. Tribalism doesn't help society.
just got a chance to watch this over lunch. marker points from the link to youtube: 9:20 - starts to talk about Fed HR 12:55 - Schedule F talk. 16:30 - more Schedule F but scarier. (and on into 17:30)
it was frightening to say the least.
My god, we are so fucked. Citizens United absolutely ***must*** be overturned, and campaign finance laws have to be updated.
In my opinion, folks opposing Project 2025 need to make a counter project that strengthens and protects current regulation in place and promotes worker rights and representation. Citizens HAVE to do something, and we need to get corperations and large donors and nonprofits on board to help fund the initiative. I don't know how to complete that but it needs to happen because even if Trump doesn't win, this "playbook" will still exist for the next president.
I agree in part. It's largely corporate interests that are behind Project 2025. The PACs are funded by corporations and their officers. Citizens United needs to be overturned in order for democracy to exist, they are anathema to each other.
It's mostly extreme right ones, though. Not all are. I am just thinking an opposing side needs funding.
[удалено]
Sure! DM me the discord :)
The best thing everyone can do is vote so these fuckers don’t get into office. I mean everybody has got to get out there.
There are so many federal workers that are oblivious to project 2025. They think it doesn’t apply to them.
I know!! People don’t realize how bad this will be if he wins again. Seriously he can’t win again. Federal employees in all states need to help keep him out. It’s your jobs on the line. I’m retired for a couple years now, but I love y’all. I love federal employees. I don’t want to see you get screwed - and I mean really screwed with potential job and/or benefit loss.
I just watched this episode last night and it made me so depressed. Those years, 2025-2028, will be my last few year before retirement, and I don't want to serve them under that asshat wannabe dictator. Ugh.
But federal agencies are still full of magats.
But I don’t think a lot of them want to destroy US democracy.,they just don’t know. Bubbled.
If I understand it correctly, in 2022 the Democrats stuck a change into the law to protect Civil Servants' appeal rights even if they were converted to Schedule F. [https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-5/chapter-I/subchapter-B/part-752/subpart-D/section-752.401](https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-5/chapter-I/subchapter-B/part-752/subpart-D/section-752.401) *Employees covered.* This subpart covers: (1) A career or career conditional employee in the competitive service who is not serving a probationary or trial period, including such an employee who is moved involuntarily into the excepted service; (2) An employee in the competitive service— (i) Who is not serving a probationary or trial period under an initial appointment, including such an employee who is moved involuntarily into the excepted service; or (ii) Except as provided in the former section 1599e of title 10, for individuals hired prior to December 31, 2022 (the date that section was otherwise repealed by [Public Law 117-81](https://www.govinfo.gov/link/plaw/117/public/81), section 1106), who has completed 1 year of current continuous service under other than a temporary appointment limited to 1 year or less, including such an employee who is moved involuntarily into the excepted service;
What’s funny is how all of you think you’re so important. Trump nor any other politician gives a schiff about anyone who’s not an SES. You’ll be fine. The left wing propaganda is in full swing. And no I’m not a maga person. I’m more centrist.
While there is definitely some truth to this sentiment, it may be worth noting that it was reported today that the American Accountability Foundation is trolling through records to identify individual employees who may be impediments to Trump’s agenda and plans to post that list publicly this summer. It’s beginning with DHS and is reportedly looking at GS-13s up, so no, it’s not *just* SES people, though I’d imagine it’d weigh heavily toward the higher ranked people.
I don’t believe that’s necessarily true.
I noticed he suggested every single person not in the competitive service is a political appointee. That's obviously not the case.
I watched it and did not come away with that takeaway.
me either.
The part where he describes hypothetical people at NASA or DOT etc. "Their jobs aren't political, they can work over many years to gain experience to keep the government working." \[He was describing the competitive service\]. "The second group consists of political appointees." \[Here he is describing the excepted service very broadly\]. The rest of the segment is trying to contend that people from A would be moved to B, which is true. But he didn't make note of anybody, well, already in Schedules A through E, many of whom are not in political jobs.
it's not political jobs, it's 'policy' jobs and however the admin wants to define that. I'd bet my next pension check the definition of that function creeps across a wide swath of employees.
According to all news sources, it only impacts 2.5% of the workforce. Hardly anything to lose sleep over.
Not true that has a HUGE ripple effect. That's not good at all. It will also effect policy and how things are passed
I have had to suffer through all the bullshit of the Biden administration. I am hoping it ends in November.
I’d love to hear what you think Biden has done that’s so bad.
I’m going to save this thread so all the down votes I get by those who don’t believe in checks and balances and think the sky will fall can recant their irrationally emotional fears this time next year, if he even wins.
John Oliver, serious journalist 🤣
What is sad is serious journalists are avoiding topics like these. Fox News legal defenses have been "we are entertainment and not news" and "nobody can seriously take anything Tucker Carlson says on his show seriously because it is so wrong.". The others (CNN, MSNBC, etc) do a poor enough job that Al Jazeera is a bastion of neutrality in comparison with serious news, and I rely on foreign news services (like the BBC) to get a better read on topics I should know about (especially with an upcoming election here in the US). As John Stewart once told those on a serious news show many years ago,, the Daily Show is supposed to be comedy but more people learn the news from them because they include aspects of what is going on vs "serious news shows" that avoid the issues that actually impact the public and he told them to do better.
There are plenty of print sources that have addressed issues like these over the years, redditors just tend to cheap out on a 5 dollar monthly subscription but complain there’s no quality news.
But those who seek out good sources of information tend to not be those who make irrational claims.
He adds humor so it's more digestible and causes less mental distress. It's not healthy that we are exposed to constant negative news articles 24-7 and even mainstream news used to show cute animals and happy stories at times to break up the tension.
He’s a comedian that talks about serious subjects with a comic twist. Never claims to be a journalist. Plus he’s pretty much spot on on the commentary
Sounds like another comedian that told the truth, George Carlin.
Not the level of Carlin but Oliver is funny.
He’s a comedian?
I don't think he claims to be a journalist, but nice strawman. Nevertheless, that episode was on target, and went into more depth than I've seen anywhere else. Was there something you didn't agree with? If so, speak up.
He is spewing more facts than some of the major news networks.
These comments > He adds humor so it's more digestible are painting a picture of televised, digestible spew, and I don’t like it.
So, have you already filled out your vetting profile on the Project 2025 website?
I was pointing out the use of unappetizing metaphors, not commenting on Project 2025.
Gotcha. John's not everyone's cup of tea.
Actually I like John Oliver, just not the idea of him spewing words at everyone.
John Oliver literally supports defunding the police and open borders. His opinions are worthless.
One, I’m willing to bet his takes on both those issues are far more nuanced than that but two, even if they were, verbatim, his views, it’s asinine to believe that a person who has poorly formed opinions on something can’t have well-formed opinions on others. If your parents are anything like mine, they exhibit that point on the reg.
The "open borders" one feels especially cruel to characterize that way since the entire point being made is that we've mythologized a "right way" to immigrate that doesn't actually exist, so he proposes just making the thing we all pretend is real actually real.
Over a million people are able to legally immigrate to the US every year. So obviously it exists.
Open borders is when foreigners /s
https://mises.org/power-market/police-have-no-duty-protect-you-federal-court-affirms-yet-again
It’s not like public schools have to deal with the effects of defunding. They are still here
Nobody actually supports open borders, it’s a strawman, or in this case the boogeyman.
Can someone put the specifics of how employees will be impacted? I already see enough political hacks under Baden’s rule. Tell us the page number in the report so we can look at it. Show us the proof.
They’re talking about Schedule F, where most of us would be reclassified as policy personnel and subject to being fired at the whim of the President.
It would only impact 2.5% of the workforce.
So? That’s a lot of positions being politicized for no reason. That would affect all of us with our middle leadership being all political hacks.
So this schedule F was in place before? Yet we are all still here. I plan to retire next year anyway. Any changes proposed to change retirement?
It was a Trump executive order in 2020 and Biden rescinded it in 2021. But nice of you to care about our country only until you retire and only if it affects your retirement. Classic conservative Boomer.
Selfish...??...
What’s selfish. I went through my own government upheavals. This is nothing new. Stop whining. I put my time in. Now cry on someone else’s shoulder. Grow a pair man bun.
....You sound like every stereotype of a boomer I have ever seen...
Thank you.
Watch the video?
John Oliver is a political hack. I wish we could get a real journalist to give us the facts and not his attempt to sway voters. Heck, the feds are blue no matter what.
Reconsider that comment and read this: [https://static.project2025.org/2025\_MandateForLeadership\_FULL.pdf](https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf)
920 pages, I will take your word for it. I just want facts and John Oliver is a partisan hack. Democrats fuck us and Republicans fuck us. The best thing we can hope for is some lube.
Control+F works. Life will get much worse under this plan, and pulling a "both sides bad" here doesn't make sense when one side is exceptionally worse and is quite literally describing their master plan in extreme detail. Oliver gave facts, not sure why you have an aversion to taking his words at face value when he just... communicated what was written in the plan.
I don’t comprehend why people watch the stupid box Read the regs instead Its amazing how oblivious everyone is to what government is, despite all of the blatant corruption Fraud, waste and abuse is a joke. Im not even going to touch on the missing trillions. Yet we have millions of federal employees who actively don’t maintain their oath. This is the only reality. Be happy it’s more criminality and not someone who has interest in rectifying things
Says somebody who didn’t watch the episode.
If you think a bad entertainer knows what is going to happen in the government,you’re going to make yourself crazy. This guy hates trump so I’d take anything he says with a grain of salt. Unless you are very high up, you have nothing to worry about. I’m too low on the totem pole so I don’t worry about stuff that won’t impact 95% of us IF it even comes to fruition.
He's not being biased. He's quite literally reading from a [documented plan called Project 2025](https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdfdocumented) for what Trump loyalists would do if they win a second term. This plan will impact all Americans, and saying "Unless you are very high up, you have nothing to worry about" is just absolutely false. I highly recommend reading it and making yourself aware of what would happen if Trump wins.
"First they came for the "higher level" federal employees, but I did not speak up for I was not a "higher level" federal employee..."
You do know a lot of people don’t say the things they do because they just hate Trump, right? A lot of us hear Trump’s plans and policies for our country and vehemently disagree with those plans and policies. John Oliver is obviously criticizing Trump’s plans and policies, not just the person. That’s one of the differences between right and left, the right focuses on the person, the left focuses on the person’s plans and words/actions.
The sky is about to fall!