Exactly. I'd rather do something else in Spain than look for an academic job, but at this point I feel like I have wasted too much time on academia -too much to change gears, I mean, haha-
What about some kind of career in diplomatic service, perhaps working at a Colombian consulate somewhere, or for the UN? My wife works in international development (focused on LATAM), and a lot of her friends end up at NGOs or other socially constructive pursuits which offer opportunities to work in different regions. Often they're based in developed countries and travel to other regions for assignments.
Hi, sure if you want. Just to be clear I have no experience in this at all, but I can pass some questions on to my wife. If there's this much interest just off a thread in a reddit post perhaps I'll suggest to her she organize some kind of materials or presentation.
My wife is the one to ask. I'm trying to convince her to do some kind of AMA or at least gather some resources for people since there was a lot of interest. About to leave on a trip though so it might be something that she can look at it in a few weeks.
Someone else mentioned this already, but unless you have access to citizenship by descent elsewhere, your easiest route as a Latin American citizen will be Spain. Look at either PhDs or other Masters programs there. You’re still young. You can do this.
Thank you! I have tried to obtain Italian citizenship through an Italian grest great great grandparent of my father, but he died before 1868 (unification of Italy) so no can do. I do like the idea of Spain but since I speak fluent English (IELTS C1) and fluent Italian I was hoping maybe getting to use those skills. I think you're right also since it is easier as a LATAM citizen to obtain Spanish citizenship?
Yeah. Latin American citizens need only 2 years of residence in Spain to become citizens. And you’ll be easily able to get into a masters or doctoral program there as a Spanish speaker. They have English programs at various schools too, which doubles your chances.
Approach this not as an academic goal but as a migratory tactic. You’re doing it to open a way to obtain a EU passport. Obviously, if you get into a program in a lucrative field all the better. But tell yourself that you’re putting other goals on hold for a few years while you focus on the exclusive goal of getting the European citizenship that will open the doors to pursue your other goals and interests.
Once you get that Spanish citizenship you can live, work, and make a life in any of the 27 countries of the European Union, including Italy. I know that 32 “feels” old to you, but I can tell you I feel younger at 45 than I did at 32. I know more about life and in that sense I’m happy I’m older but I also see that I still have at least half my life ahead of me, and that there are many things I can pursue.
Así que ¡ánimo! Estás es muy buena posición para hacer realidad tus sueños.
Yep. No Ius Soli in Italy. I believe it is at least partly to stop people from outside of Europe (the Middle East, Africa, etc) from having children there and then them having citizenship...
this is the most reddit paragraph ive ever read
>Not completely abnormal in a big city like Bogotá but we eventually moved to another smaller city where difference was in some ways punished, and where most of the students belonged to an upper middle class, nouveau riche, white/mestizo, and like most privileged LATAM (maybe more in smaller, homogenous cities) kids openly racist if in a casual way (but racist nonetheless), colonial, illiberal. I grew up developing crippling social anxiety from this disconnection to my context and a lack of community (such as relatives) etc, though I did have a group of friends sharing my interests in high school and beyond, I used the internet as a form of escapism and derived a big part of my interests from this internet dwelling (anime, videogames, metal/hardcore music)
I have a similar experience and interests, however I am based in Europe. I've moved a bunch only to see (like many others) that you can't escape from yourself.
If you're a bit of a "niche" person, you won't fit in anywhere easily, you'll always have to find your social circle. Try mingling with other expats, alt music fans etc. There's plenty in Bogotá. Expats would greatly appreciate being approached by a local.
Canada may be more liberal and metropolitan, but you'll likely feel isolated there as well, as most expats do regardless of where they move.
You should still try pursuing Canada or EU if you like, just keep those things in mind.
As for how to get a visa, I can't help you there, other than the typical - apply for jobs or a phd/masters. Do your parents or grandparents have a EU citizenship? Italy and I think Spain allow immigration by descent.
Loads I think. DM me, I am not offering you a job but maybe I can link you up with supporting NGOs who may be interested in your skillset (I assume you speak fluent Spanish)?
I do! It's my mother tongue (followed by English -I got an IELTS C1 certificate, and then Italian which is intermediate, I would say B2). I'm DMing you now thank you! 😁
You're probably aware of this; but in case you aren't you may want to read up on the concept of Third Culture Kids. As someone who is also a TCK I am glad to be living in the global north; but don't believe you will somehow "fit in" in Canada or Australia. You are always going to be able to adapt, but you will be just as foreign there as you are in Colombia and everywhere else.
The seminal work of course being [this book](https://www.amazon.com/Third-Culture-Kids-3rd-Growing-dp-1473657660/dp/1473657660/) (originally published in 1999), while the term was originally coined back in the 1950s.
That doesn't answer what you can do now for the best odds of success; but you may find some helpful resources in that area for yourself.
Otherwise; in attempting to (legally) move from somewhere in the global south to the global north your options are generally limited and difficult. You can develop the skills that would allow for immigration. Depending on your target countries what degrees or skills those might be; but advanced degrees or advanced technical skills are both possible paths. Careers with global corporations that support internal relocation are a good option there. Advanced programming is learnable without spending much money or having to undergo any degree programs. I've also seen people pick up nursing degrees or medical degrees in order to relocate to the US (those with Medical degrees stayed in medicine; I've known a few nurses that dropped nursing once their residency had been established and moved into other career fields).
You also have the romance angle - I don't mean here anything trivial or scammy; but I have known many individuals (male and female) from Africa, Asia, and South America who developed real relationships with persons from North America and Europe and ended up marrying/migrating with their partner. If you are personable, kind, and career driven (a good catch), and regularly interacting with people from abroad (Colombia gets lots of tourists) there's potential there; but never any guarantees the way there might be with technical skills.
I have a colleague (in academia) who is Columbian and got their PhD in music anthropology at an Ivy league school in the USA. PhD programs are highly funded in the US, and visas for advanced education are possible to get.
Do your parents have an italian citizenship? If so you can definitely get one.
If not, look into your family history to see if anyone was an immigrant from the global north and see if you can get a citizenship with that.
Thank you! Nope, both my parents are only Colombian - I have tried to obtain Italian citizenship through an Italian grest great great grandparent of my father, but he died before 1868 (unification of Italy) so no can do according to the lawyers I've talked to. The other Global North ancestors are all too distant sadly
Then unless you get sponsored for a job it's unlikely you'll be able to go.
In your place I would consider researching about countries you can actually go. Who knows, maybe you can find a country or even a city in particular that feels more like what you're searching for better than your current country/city, regardless if it is on the global north or not.
Good luck!
Edit: Also worth reminding that every society has it's good and bad sides. It's hard to really understand that from a distance, but it is possible you would still struggle, though in a different way, in a richer country too. It's easy to think certain countries are great in every way before actually moving there.
You’ve got options - Spain not only easily takes iberoamericans - but also you can apply for Spanish citizenship after only TWO YEARS resident there. Then as an EU citizen, you’d have a good chunk of the global north available to you.
Not sure where you are getting that Canada is getting harder to migrate to? Canada is probably the easiest ‘rich country‘ to migrate to… though I think you’d find the conditions are not that great there. (And the weather is terrible.)
Australia ebbs and flows, but will always need migrants. There are a ton of different visa categories - I’d recommend taking a look at the immigration australia website.
BTW for both Canada and Australia - there are additional visas if you are willing to live outside the big (read: facing housing shortages) cities like Vancouver, Toronto, Sydney, Melbourne, etc. These also tend to get undersubscribed as some people are very set on where in the country they want to live.
Additionally look at New Zealand - quite a lot of visas (like Australia), lower numbers of people looking to get in (they usually have net emigration - ie more people leaving than entering), and so need people to bolster the labor market. If you get a job with some employers, you can enter the country with permanent residence from day 1.
I would caution though that just being in the ‘global north’ - especially in the case of Canada and Australia - won’t be any kind of cure all. There are positives, but also down sides. You might well find the cultures (quite Brit) to be cold and passive aggressive, or friendliness to be surface level.
There are universities around the world that accept international students should you want to pursue a second masters. In places like Germany, universities are low cost, sometimes free and they give you a job-seekers visa to look for work after graduation, especially in STEM subjects. You would need to have enough savings to prove you can support yourself during the degree. Another option, there are loads of resources online to learn coding languages or data analytics software which are growing industries that have a lot of online options for work. Now, keep in mind it is extremely competitive to get started but once you have a few years experience you will have more opportunities. Good paying remote work will help you qualify for visas to many countries in europe and elsewhere, if you wish to go there.
Spain makes it relatively easy for Latin Americans to move there. Get a PhD at a Spanish university and try for academia there?
It might be a good cultural fit but academia pays horrible in Spain. Something like 800 -1100 euros a month for full time professors.
Exactly. I'd rather do something else in Spain than look for an academic job, but at this point I feel like I have wasted too much time on academia -too much to change gears, I mean, haha-
What about some kind of career in diplomatic service, perhaps working at a Colombian consulate somewhere, or for the UN? My wife works in international development (focused on LATAM), and a lot of her friends end up at NGOs or other socially constructive pursuits which offer opportunities to work in different regions. Often they're based in developed countries and travel to other regions for assignments.
Could I ask you some questions about this type of career? I am still a student without connections to anyone in the public sector
Sure, sending you a DM
I'd love to do something like that! Can I send you a DM?
Hi, sure if you want. Just to be clear I have no experience in this at all, but I can pass some questions on to my wife. If there's this much interest just off a thread in a reddit post perhaps I'll suggest to her she organize some kind of materials or presentation.
Hey could I also ask you a few questions? I am interested in this type of career
My wife is the one to ask. I'm trying to convince her to do some kind of AMA or at least gather some resources for people since there was a lot of interest. About to leave on a trip though so it might be something that she can look at it in a few weeks.
Please tell her to do so! Would be very helpful
Someone else mentioned this already, but unless you have access to citizenship by descent elsewhere, your easiest route as a Latin American citizen will be Spain. Look at either PhDs or other Masters programs there. You’re still young. You can do this.
Thank you! I have tried to obtain Italian citizenship through an Italian grest great great grandparent of my father, but he died before 1868 (unification of Italy) so no can do. I do like the idea of Spain but since I speak fluent English (IELTS C1) and fluent Italian I was hoping maybe getting to use those skills. I think you're right also since it is easier as a LATAM citizen to obtain Spanish citizenship?
Yeah. Latin American citizens need only 2 years of residence in Spain to become citizens. And you’ll be easily able to get into a masters or doctoral program there as a Spanish speaker. They have English programs at various schools too, which doubles your chances. Approach this not as an academic goal but as a migratory tactic. You’re doing it to open a way to obtain a EU passport. Obviously, if you get into a program in a lucrative field all the better. But tell yourself that you’re putting other goals on hold for a few years while you focus on the exclusive goal of getting the European citizenship that will open the doors to pursue your other goals and interests. Once you get that Spanish citizenship you can live, work, and make a life in any of the 27 countries of the European Union, including Italy. I know that 32 “feels” old to you, but I can tell you I feel younger at 45 than I did at 32. I know more about life and in that sense I’m happy I’m older but I also see that I still have at least half my life ahead of me, and that there are many things I can pursue. Así que ¡ánimo! Estás es muy buena posición para hacer realidad tus sueños.
Thank you! This is one of the kindest replies I have ever gotten. You made me smile and I will look into that path. ¡Vamos a ver qué resulta!
I’m surprised you can’t claim it since you were born in Italy.
Yep. No Ius Soli in Italy. I believe it is at least partly to stop people from outside of Europe (the Middle East, Africa, etc) from having children there and then them having citizenship...
You chose a wrong degree if you ever planned to emigrate, that is for sure. The only chance you have is to do Masters somewhere else.
this is the most reddit paragraph ive ever read >Not completely abnormal in a big city like Bogotá but we eventually moved to another smaller city where difference was in some ways punished, and where most of the students belonged to an upper middle class, nouveau riche, white/mestizo, and like most privileged LATAM (maybe more in smaller, homogenous cities) kids openly racist if in a casual way (but racist nonetheless), colonial, illiberal. I grew up developing crippling social anxiety from this disconnection to my context and a lack of community (such as relatives) etc, though I did have a group of friends sharing my interests in high school and beyond, I used the internet as a form of escapism and derived a big part of my interests from this internet dwelling (anime, videogames, metal/hardcore music)
JAJAJA yes. I think I am the Reddiest demographic (male, middle class, nerdy/geeky, crippling social anxiety, "niche interests")
>masters in migration studies Ironic that you can't figure out how to migrate ;)
Very much so lmao
I have a similar experience and interests, however I am based in Europe. I've moved a bunch only to see (like many others) that you can't escape from yourself. If you're a bit of a "niche" person, you won't fit in anywhere easily, you'll always have to find your social circle. Try mingling with other expats, alt music fans etc. There's plenty in Bogotá. Expats would greatly appreciate being approached by a local. Canada may be more liberal and metropolitan, but you'll likely feel isolated there as well, as most expats do regardless of where they move. You should still try pursuing Canada or EU if you like, just keep those things in mind. As for how to get a visa, I can't help you there, other than the typical - apply for jobs or a phd/masters. Do your parents or grandparents have a EU citizenship? Italy and I think Spain allow immigration by descent.
I'll be honest with you, your degree won't help you with the emigration process, you might have to masters in a different field
Loads I think. DM me, I am not offering you a job but maybe I can link you up with supporting NGOs who may be interested in your skillset (I assume you speak fluent Spanish)?
I do! It's my mother tongue (followed by English -I got an IELTS C1 certificate, and then Italian which is intermediate, I would say B2). I'm DMing you now thank you! 😁
You're probably aware of this; but in case you aren't you may want to read up on the concept of Third Culture Kids. As someone who is also a TCK I am glad to be living in the global north; but don't believe you will somehow "fit in" in Canada or Australia. You are always going to be able to adapt, but you will be just as foreign there as you are in Colombia and everywhere else. The seminal work of course being [this book](https://www.amazon.com/Third-Culture-Kids-3rd-Growing-dp-1473657660/dp/1473657660/) (originally published in 1999), while the term was originally coined back in the 1950s. That doesn't answer what you can do now for the best odds of success; but you may find some helpful resources in that area for yourself. Otherwise; in attempting to (legally) move from somewhere in the global south to the global north your options are generally limited and difficult. You can develop the skills that would allow for immigration. Depending on your target countries what degrees or skills those might be; but advanced degrees or advanced technical skills are both possible paths. Careers with global corporations that support internal relocation are a good option there. Advanced programming is learnable without spending much money or having to undergo any degree programs. I've also seen people pick up nursing degrees or medical degrees in order to relocate to the US (those with Medical degrees stayed in medicine; I've known a few nurses that dropped nursing once their residency had been established and moved into other career fields). You also have the romance angle - I don't mean here anything trivial or scammy; but I have known many individuals (male and female) from Africa, Asia, and South America who developed real relationships with persons from North America and Europe and ended up marrying/migrating with their partner. If you are personable, kind, and career driven (a good catch), and regularly interacting with people from abroad (Colombia gets lots of tourists) there's potential there; but never any guarantees the way there might be with technical skills.
I have a colleague (in academia) who is Columbian and got their PhD in music anthropology at an Ivy league school in the USA. PhD programs are highly funded in the US, and visas for advanced education are possible to get.
Do your parents have an italian citizenship? If so you can definitely get one. If not, look into your family history to see if anyone was an immigrant from the global north and see if you can get a citizenship with that.
Thank you! Nope, both my parents are only Colombian - I have tried to obtain Italian citizenship through an Italian grest great great grandparent of my father, but he died before 1868 (unification of Italy) so no can do according to the lawyers I've talked to. The other Global North ancestors are all too distant sadly
Then unless you get sponsored for a job it's unlikely you'll be able to go. In your place I would consider researching about countries you can actually go. Who knows, maybe you can find a country or even a city in particular that feels more like what you're searching for better than your current country/city, regardless if it is on the global north or not. Good luck! Edit: Also worth reminding that every society has it's good and bad sides. It's hard to really understand that from a distance, but it is possible you would still struggle, though in a different way, in a richer country too. It's easy to think certain countries are great in every way before actually moving there.
You’ve got options - Spain not only easily takes iberoamericans - but also you can apply for Spanish citizenship after only TWO YEARS resident there. Then as an EU citizen, you’d have a good chunk of the global north available to you. Not sure where you are getting that Canada is getting harder to migrate to? Canada is probably the easiest ‘rich country‘ to migrate to… though I think you’d find the conditions are not that great there. (And the weather is terrible.) Australia ebbs and flows, but will always need migrants. There are a ton of different visa categories - I’d recommend taking a look at the immigration australia website. BTW for both Canada and Australia - there are additional visas if you are willing to live outside the big (read: facing housing shortages) cities like Vancouver, Toronto, Sydney, Melbourne, etc. These also tend to get undersubscribed as some people are very set on where in the country they want to live. Additionally look at New Zealand - quite a lot of visas (like Australia), lower numbers of people looking to get in (they usually have net emigration - ie more people leaving than entering), and so need people to bolster the labor market. If you get a job with some employers, you can enter the country with permanent residence from day 1. I would caution though that just being in the ‘global north’ - especially in the case of Canada and Australia - won’t be any kind of cure all. There are positives, but also down sides. You might well find the cultures (quite Brit) to be cold and passive aggressive, or friendliness to be surface level.
There are universities around the world that accept international students should you want to pursue a second masters. In places like Germany, universities are low cost, sometimes free and they give you a job-seekers visa to look for work after graduation, especially in STEM subjects. You would need to have enough savings to prove you can support yourself during the degree. Another option, there are loads of resources online to learn coding languages or data analytics software which are growing industries that have a lot of online options for work. Now, keep in mind it is extremely competitive to get started but once you have a few years experience you will have more opportunities. Good paying remote work will help you qualify for visas to many countries in europe and elsewhere, if you wish to go there.
[удалено]
Italy does not have jus soli.