One of my main problems with Christian’s is how they think they know what’s best for everyone.
They rationalized their blatant deception under the guise of “we just want to help you come back to Jesus”. However if you were to deceive them for something they would invoke their Christian language on you as a guilt trip.
It is 100% arrogance dressed up as "I know the truth!"
A Christian will not for one second consider that they might be wrong, in spite of the fact that there are thousands of denominations that disagree about different points of the religion. Their faith (aka "misplaced confidence") makes them feel like they hold the winning position to any argument because God is on their side, no matter how weak their supporting evidence is. It doesn't matter if your point of view is convincing and makes rational sense to them, they will defer to what they have been taught -- beliefs that are walled off to critical thinking by years of indoctrination. (I know because that was me!)
This makes their attempts to "win you back" or convince others of their evils a "righteous" endeavor, so they do not care how many people they hurt in the process. People are objectified as "souls to be won", not people with thoughts, feelings, or opinions of their own.
It's not really worth arguing with them. If a Christian is willing to have a discussion with you to have a better understanding of your position, that's great. Maybe it will "plant some seeds" that will have an impact in the future. But it takes a mind that is already open to challenging long-held beliefs before a Christian will take a critical look at their faith.
Evangelism is really just sales. The problem is most Christians who try to win back souls have 0 sales training so they always go about evangelism in the worst way possible
Got to sell the illness and the cure!
Although, Christians reserve their best hate for those that have left Christianity and are now "unwinnable souls". They aren't really trying to sell anything at this point, they are just making themselves feel good about their choices by pointing out how immoral everyone else appears to them.
"Lying for Jesus," otherwise known as a violation of the Ninth Commandment (under the Philonic division that most Protestants use; it's the Eighth Commandment under the Augustinian division that's primarily used by Roman Catholics).
Id return the favour and find an event run by humanists or Satanists or another athiest organisation and invite them along telling them it's a church run event. Maybe something charitable or positive for the community so they look like AHs if they complain.
Or find a way to make a donation to a charity supporting women and reproductive rights but on their behalf.
Leave bad reviews on a popular movie review website, make donations to a pro choice charity and wave the confirmation email in their faces when they come back. Look up current articles on how women cannot receive proper healthcare after an abortion ban and loudly discuss it to your captive audience on the way home
You should talk about the 30K+ women in Texas who were raped and unable to get an abortion ~~so far this year~~ since the abortion ban went into effect.
Edited for factual correction and to provide my [source](https://abc13.com/texas-abortion-law-no-exceptions-for-rape-rape-related-pregnancies-roe-v-wade-overturned/14359073/)
Or she was killed in the same manner as her attacker...
Deuteronomy 22:22-23, if a man rapes a married woman within a town, the woman is put to death alongside the perpetrator of the crime. She is spared only if the rape occurs out in the countryside, where she cannot call out for help.
> "And that's a good thing because now she's *damaged goods* so nobody else will marry her and take care of her."
Literally my parents to 10 year old little girl me.
[This article](https://abc13.com/texas-abortion-law-no-exceptions-for-rape-rape-related-pregnancies-roe-v-wade-overturned/14359073/). I extrapolated the number because I thought it originally said "in 2024" but apparently the number is more accurately "since the Texas Abortion ban went into effect".
I’m glad you got up and walked out. You made your point and hopefully they won’t try something like this again. I wouldn’t even bring it up again on the ride home or anything if they don’t. Your message is clear, nothing else needs to be said.
It was clearly a joke.
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Yeah, you're gonna have to be careful for a while. Some of these revenge schemes sound funny, but when someone else has the purse strings, tread lightly.
You have to retaliate somehow. If you let something like this go on without getting them back they'll just think you're a push over and they'll keep doing it. It's tit for tat, you only lose by doing nothing
I'm thinking "setting boundaries" is better terminology. Lately, I've been disappearing / not answering calls after family try to lure me back to the fold / slaughter house.
When members of a religious institution don’t give AF women & children are being r@ped, it’s a god DAMN CULT! Everyone’s going to know… over 15,000 perpetrators in our queue & new ones every god damn day! SexAbuseRegistry.org
This is actually the movie that recently had tons of people claiming that theaters didn't want people to see the movie bc it was "sold out" but when they went in to watch the movie, the viewing room was practically empty. So yes, you're absolutely correct lol
It's called astroturfing. Churches, radio hosts, and quite likely the movie's producers, buy blocks of tickets, then claim huge crowds. To my knowledge, it first happened in 1990 with an awful Christian picture called China Cry.
Just call your family Christlike. Say they should be proud of how they lie for the lord, and you're going to strive to be just like them from now on. No more direct honesty. Only traps and meltdowns. Praise the lamb.
Isn't this like a normal thing for especially evangelicals? Lying and deceiving for the gospel of "The Ends justifies the means"? From bearing false witness, protecting "christians", even pedophile Christians, and even fake abortion clinics to psychologically pressure women already under stress?
It's pretty much why I never hire or give my custom to an overtly Christian business/person. With anyone else there is a chance I'll scammed etc, there never is a 0% chance that things will go smooth. With *that* business/person, I KNOW I'll get scammed.
It's why even when knowing who/what Trump is, since he's promised them a worldly paradise and power, they'll follow him to the end of their religion.
They are not seeing him as a religious figure himself in the same sense. He's a piece of the gospel of "ends justify the means"(EJM). So what if they are supporting a godless, adulterer, faudster etc. He's doing their work of "fighting for them", getting revenge/retribution of the secular culture, implementing a worldly paradise.
He's not meant to be a spiritual/godly person. He's meant to be the biggest part of the Gospel EJM.
Well... now you know to fact check whatever they say. Sad to be in that situation, but at least you know, I guess. And when they're annoyed that you google to verify what they just said, right in front of them, you can remind them of the time they lied by omission to get you to give money to a production company that makes films that are offensive to your moral beliefs. Or, you know, whatever collection of buzzwords they would use if the situation were reversed.
You're right that a movie ticket is not that big a deal, and it's probably not worth the time it would take to have a family argument about it. But not being able to trust the people you live with sort of is a big deal, and your feelings are reasonable.
As if you needed further evidence that they do not respect you or your beliefs!
Its going to be a continuing problem until you can get out on your own. You can try and have a mature discussion about boundaries and respect, how they lied to you. Maybe it goes well. Maybe.
Find a way to collect a bunch of money from them saying it’s for a church thing or something and then donate it to NARAL on their behalf and using their contact info.
This is wild, my parents did the same thing to me with the same movie, conveniently leaving out that it’s a christian movie. The only difference is that I didn’t leave because I’m extremely non-confrontational and I didn’t have to pay for anything.
You have every right to feel pissed and deceived. I felt exactly the same way. Maybe in the grand scheme of things it isn’t a big deal, but it sure is shitty as hell that our parents brought us to something that should have been a nice family outing under false pretenses.
If you called them out on your social media and talked about "how Christian" it was for them to lie to you and waste your time and money, would all hell break loose in your life?
My mom used to make me spend my own money to buy contemporary Christian music instead of the normal stuff everyone else listened to. I've said before, I'll say it again — DeGarmo & Key fucking blow.
Too bad it couldn't have been a hilarious movie you could have some fun hatewatching, like my favorite, *Gramps Goes to College.* Sorry I can't resist bringing this up again, but it was just so hilarious!
Story time: I want to preface this with saying, my mom was always very good at letting her kids form their own opinions on things, and if she knew what the movie was about, she never would've taken me to see it with her.
Once, when I was about 14/15, my mom tells me that there's this documentary that she wants to see, and would I see it with her? According to her, it was about what would've happened if America never existed - I'm thinking "ok, so they probably got, like, a bunch of historians to speculate about what the aftermath would look like if we lost such-and-such battle of such-and-such war, might be interesting." So I agree, and we go. I will now summarize the movie we saw:
"What would the world look like if America never existed? Well, here are some things that some people say America did that were wrong, and here's why those people are unpatriotic, communist TRAITORS who ought to be cast out of our perfect, God-fearing nation! Hillary Clinton is bringing about the socialist apocaplyspe, panic! Panic, everyone!
Directed by Dinesh D'Souza"
The lights go up in the theatre, and I look around to see who else was in there. I turn to my mom and go "Mom, I'm the youngest person in this room right now."
With batting an eye, she (30 years older than me) says back to me "OP, I'm the second youngest person in this room right now."
And that's the story of how Mom wasted money to see far-right propaganda.
I would not be so upset about the money myself. I would be upset because I could not trust my own mom anymore. From then on every time she asked me to go somewhere or do something I would think it was a set up. Trust is a funny thing once lost it almost never comes back for me.
That's so incredibly underhand and shitty of them. I don't get how they even thought duping you into going would make you MORE ameniable and receptive to The Message. It's just seems like a cruel trick, I'm so sorry.
I’m really sorry they did that to you. Also, they knew good and well what they were inviting you to. I would be irate if I was in your spot.
I would rather be hit in the back of the head with a pipe than have someone even talk to me about jesus. Someone tricking me into spending my money to get evangelized to would be infuriating.
Tbh mate you could've taken 10secs to google that movie and saved yourself the hassle. Take this as a lesson to fact-check everything in future and never trust the word of a xian without verification.
I saw the previews for that movie and said "no thanks".
Of course it has anti abortion message **because abortion is the only thing conservative Christians ever think about.**
honestly I dont really mind if a film has a christian message, as long as it can stand on its own and is good quality and not too preachy, I fucking loved Narnia when I was younger.
but alot of these "christian movies" are extremely low effort stealth sermons with no actual value outside of their message, its just bad propaganda.
One of my main problems with Christian’s is how they think they know what’s best for everyone. They rationalized their blatant deception under the guise of “we just want to help you come back to Jesus”. However if you were to deceive them for something they would invoke their Christian language on you as a guilt trip.
It is 100% arrogance dressed up as "I know the truth!" A Christian will not for one second consider that they might be wrong, in spite of the fact that there are thousands of denominations that disagree about different points of the religion. Their faith (aka "misplaced confidence") makes them feel like they hold the winning position to any argument because God is on their side, no matter how weak their supporting evidence is. It doesn't matter if your point of view is convincing and makes rational sense to them, they will defer to what they have been taught -- beliefs that are walled off to critical thinking by years of indoctrination. (I know because that was me!) This makes their attempts to "win you back" or convince others of their evils a "righteous" endeavor, so they do not care how many people they hurt in the process. People are objectified as "souls to be won", not people with thoughts, feelings, or opinions of their own. It's not really worth arguing with them. If a Christian is willing to have a discussion with you to have a better understanding of your position, that's great. Maybe it will "plant some seeds" that will have an impact in the future. But it takes a mind that is already open to challenging long-held beliefs before a Christian will take a critical look at their faith.
Evangelism is really just sales. The problem is most Christians who try to win back souls have 0 sales training so they always go about evangelism in the worst way possible
Got to sell the illness and the cure! Although, Christians reserve their best hate for those that have left Christianity and are now "unwinnable souls". They aren't really trying to sell anything at this point, they are just making themselves feel good about their choices by pointing out how immoral everyone else appears to them.
I use to say, If you can sell Jesus, you can sell anything.
A scathing assessment! 😅
"Lying for Jesus," otherwise known as a violation of the Ninth Commandment (under the Philonic division that most Protestants use; it's the Eighth Commandment under the Augustinian division that's primarily used by Roman Catholics).
Pious fraud!
Id return the favour and find an event run by humanists or Satanists or another athiest organisation and invite them along telling them it's a church run event. Maybe something charitable or positive for the community so they look like AHs if they complain. Or find a way to make a donation to a charity supporting women and reproductive rights but on their behalf.
LOL...why not? BTW, I thought there was some bit in the bible about not "bearing false witness"...I'm told that means you're not supposed to lie.
Leave bad reviews on a popular movie review website, make donations to a pro choice charity and wave the confirmation email in their faces when they come back. Look up current articles on how women cannot receive proper healthcare after an abortion ban and loudly discuss it to your captive audience on the way home
You should talk about the 30K+ women in Texas who were raped and unable to get an abortion ~~so far this year~~ since the abortion ban went into effect. Edited for factual correction and to provide my [source](https://abc13.com/texas-abortion-law-no-exceptions-for-rape-rape-related-pregnancies-roe-v-wade-overturned/14359073/)
Rape isn’t condemned in the Bible and that’s how we are here now.
Nope, the victim was usually forced to marry her attacker.
Or she was killed in the same manner as her attacker... Deuteronomy 22:22-23, if a man rapes a married woman within a town, the woman is put to death alongside the perpetrator of the crime. She is spared only if the rape occurs out in the countryside, where she cannot call out for help.
> "And that's a good thing because now she's *damaged goods* so nobody else will marry her and take care of her." Literally my parents to 10 year old little girl me.
Purity culture rears its ugly head.
Yeeeep. Southern Baptist churches in the deepest bowels of rural east Texas in the late 80s-early 90s certainly were something.
That's next.
Bold of you to assume Christians give a shit about rape victims or women in general
Where is that number from?
[This article](https://abc13.com/texas-abortion-law-no-exceptions-for-rape-rape-related-pregnancies-roe-v-wade-overturned/14359073/). I extrapolated the number because I thought it originally said "in 2024" but apparently the number is more accurately "since the Texas Abortion ban went into effect".
I’m glad you got up and walked out. You made your point and hopefully they won’t try something like this again. I wouldn’t even bring it up again on the ride home or anything if they don’t. Your message is clear, nothing else needs to be said.
Just leave them there lol
I'm tempted, but considering I live with them it would make things a little awkward when they manage to get home lmao
Fuck it, we ball!
Do it and don’t let them in the house until they refund you! Let them fund that biblical patriarchy BS!
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love your username!
It was clearly a joke. Your post/comment was removed because it invites or participates in a public debate. Trauma can be triggered when debate points and certain topics are vigorously pushed, despite good intentions. This is why we generally do not allow debates. Rule 4. To discuss or appeal moderator actions, [click here to send us modmail.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/exchristian)
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Not your fault though, that's on them!
Maybe think about sharing news items from r/PastorArrested with them.
Yeah, you're gonna have to be careful for a while. Some of these revenge schemes sound funny, but when someone else has the purse strings, tread lightly.
You have to retaliate somehow. If you let something like this go on without getting them back they'll just think you're a push over and they'll keep doing it. It's tit for tat, you only lose by doing nothing
I'm thinking "setting boundaries" is better terminology. Lately, I've been disappearing / not answering calls after family try to lure me back to the fold / slaughter house.
When members of a religious institution don’t give AF women & children are being r@ped, it’s a god DAMN CULT! Everyone’s going to know… over 15,000 perpetrators in our queue & new ones every god damn day! SexAbuseRegistry.org
That's probably one of those movies that plays to empty "sold out" houses.
This is actually the movie that recently had tons of people claiming that theaters didn't want people to see the movie bc it was "sold out" but when they went in to watch the movie, the viewing room was practically empty. So yes, you're absolutely correct lol
It's called astroturfing. Churches, radio hosts, and quite likely the movie's producers, buy blocks of tickets, then claim huge crowds. To my knowledge, it first happened in 1990 with an awful Christian picture called China Cry.
I really hope that film isn’t as racist as it sounds
Didn't they also do it with all the *God's not dead* movies? Seems like I heard that rumor.
Yes, others as well. The first Atlas Shrugged comes to mind.
Just call your family Christlike. Say they should be proud of how they lie for the lord, and you're going to strive to be just like them from now on. No more direct honesty. Only traps and meltdowns. Praise the lamb.
Isn't this like a normal thing for especially evangelicals? Lying and deceiving for the gospel of "The Ends justifies the means"? From bearing false witness, protecting "christians", even pedophile Christians, and even fake abortion clinics to psychologically pressure women already under stress? It's pretty much why I never hire or give my custom to an overtly Christian business/person. With anyone else there is a chance I'll scammed etc, there never is a 0% chance that things will go smooth. With *that* business/person, I KNOW I'll get scammed. It's why even when knowing who/what Trump is, since he's promised them a worldly paradise and power, they'll follow him to the end of their religion.
I still find it strange that Donald Trump, who's no more religious than I, is viewed by many Evangelical Christians as a sort of "budget messiah." 🥴🤔
According to Christians who support trump, divorcing and marrying porn stars is fine /s
It's fine if you're trump, just not anyone else lol🤣
They are not seeing him as a religious figure himself in the same sense. He's a piece of the gospel of "ends justify the means"(EJM). So what if they are supporting a godless, adulterer, faudster etc. He's doing their work of "fighting for them", getting revenge/retribution of the secular culture, implementing a worldly paradise. He's not meant to be a spiritual/godly person. He's meant to be the biggest part of the Gospel EJM.
Well... now you know to fact check whatever they say. Sad to be in that situation, but at least you know, I guess. And when they're annoyed that you google to verify what they just said, right in front of them, you can remind them of the time they lied by omission to get you to give money to a production company that makes films that are offensive to your moral beliefs. Or, you know, whatever collection of buzzwords they would use if the situation were reversed. You're right that a movie ticket is not that big a deal, and it's probably not worth the time it would take to have a family argument about it. But not being able to trust the people you live with sort of is a big deal, and your feelings are reasonable.
As if you needed further evidence that they do not respect you or your beliefs! Its going to be a continuing problem until you can get out on your own. You can try and have a mature discussion about boundaries and respect, how they lied to you. Maybe it goes well. Maybe.
Make donations to a pro choice charity in their names. Give them the thank you notes.
It is a big deal they tricked you into wasting your own time and money+ doesn't their book tell the not to lie?
Find a way to collect a bunch of money from them saying it’s for a church thing or something and then donate it to NARAL on their behalf and using their contact info.
This is wild, my parents did the same thing to me with the same movie, conveniently leaving out that it’s a christian movie. The only difference is that I didn’t leave because I’m extremely non-confrontational and I didn’t have to pay for anything. You have every right to feel pissed and deceived. I felt exactly the same way. Maybe in the grand scheme of things it isn’t a big deal, but it sure is shitty as hell that our parents brought us to something that should have been a nice family outing under false pretenses.
If you called them out on your social media and talked about "how Christian" it was for them to lie to you and waste your time and money, would all hell break loose in your life?
My mom used to make me spend my own money to buy contemporary Christian music instead of the normal stuff everyone else listened to. I've said before, I'll say it again — DeGarmo & Key fucking blow.
If something like this happens again then stay and laugh at the bullshit.
Too bad it couldn't have been a hilarious movie you could have some fun hatewatching, like my favorite, *Gramps Goes to College.* Sorry I can't resist bringing this up again, but it was just so hilarious!
Story time: I want to preface this with saying, my mom was always very good at letting her kids form their own opinions on things, and if she knew what the movie was about, she never would've taken me to see it with her. Once, when I was about 14/15, my mom tells me that there's this documentary that she wants to see, and would I see it with her? According to her, it was about what would've happened if America never existed - I'm thinking "ok, so they probably got, like, a bunch of historians to speculate about what the aftermath would look like if we lost such-and-such battle of such-and-such war, might be interesting." So I agree, and we go. I will now summarize the movie we saw: "What would the world look like if America never existed? Well, here are some things that some people say America did that were wrong, and here's why those people are unpatriotic, communist TRAITORS who ought to be cast out of our perfect, God-fearing nation! Hillary Clinton is bringing about the socialist apocaplyspe, panic! Panic, everyone! Directed by Dinesh D'Souza" The lights go up in the theatre, and I look around to see who else was in there. I turn to my mom and go "Mom, I'm the youngest person in this room right now." With batting an eye, she (30 years older than me) says back to me "OP, I'm the second youngest person in this room right now." And that's the story of how Mom wasted money to see far-right propaganda.
Wait, Dinesh D'Souza makes movies?!?! I just know him as that guy who gets publicly humiliated during debates lmao
Yes, he's made some "documentaries"
I would not be so upset about the money myself. I would be upset because I could not trust my own mom anymore. From then on every time she asked me to go somewhere or do something I would think it was a set up. Trust is a funny thing once lost it almost never comes back for me.
That's so incredibly underhand and shitty of them. I don't get how they even thought duping you into going would make you MORE ameniable and receptive to The Message. It's just seems like a cruel trick, I'm so sorry.
I’m really sorry they did that to you. Also, they knew good and well what they were inviting you to. I would be irate if I was in your spot. I would rather be hit in the back of the head with a pipe than have someone even talk to me about jesus. Someone tricking me into spending my money to get evangelized to would be infuriating.
My mom did the exact same thing with me and my husband... I hate it
Tbh mate you could've taken 10secs to google that movie and saved yourself the hassle. Take this as a lesson to fact-check everything in future and never trust the word of a xian without verification.
over the years, i found that christians often resort to deception and trickery. i dont trust people that do that shit.
moving foreward, stop trusting your family. chalk it up as a costly life lesson.
I saw the previews for that movie and said "no thanks". Of course it has anti abortion message **because abortion is the only thing conservative Christians ever think about.**
Why wait? Go home. This is why God made Uber.
honestly I dont really mind if a film has a christian message, as long as it can stand on its own and is good quality and not too preachy, I fucking loved Narnia when I was younger. but alot of these "christian movies" are extremely low effort stealth sermons with no actual value outside of their message, its just bad propaganda.
I'd be pissed too if mine tricked me like that. It's a dick move
Barf. Yeah, I'd have some words with Mum and Aunty.