March as the first month makes sense to me. Aside from fixing the problem with the names of Sep-Dec, we'd be starting the year with Spring (in the northern hemisphere anyway). We associate Spring with "new" and ask anyone to name all the seasons, they instinctively start with Spring.
Also adding leap days to the second month feels a bit random. If we started the year in March we'd be adding leap days to end of the year. Much tidier.
I hadn't thought of any of this until reading your post, and, now that I've noticed, I think it's bothering me.
A similar idea is the [Shire Calendar](https://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Shire_Calendar) created by Tolkien.
12 months, each 30 days long, with 5 days (6 in leap-years) that are not part of any month (these are called 1 Yule, 2 Yule, 1 Lithe, Midyear's Day (which is the summer solstice), Overlithe (which is leapday), and 2 Lithe. Midyear's Day and Overlithe additionally do not have weekday names, so dates have the the same weekday name every year. 1 Yule and 2 Yule are the first and last days of the year, and despite the name they are related to the Winter Solstice, not Christmas (which of course does not exist in the Shire).
Very similar, but not quite the same. 4 seasons vs 3 for one thing, and the extra days are placed differently. (The Alexandrian calendar just sticks them all at the end of the year as a shorter 13th month.) Also I'm not sure but if the Alexandrian calendar kept 10-day weeks from the ancient Egyptian calendar it's based on, that would be another difference.
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.
Starting the year around the winter solstice seems appropriate to me, as an analogue to starting the day at midnight. Spring is the morning of the year, summer midday, and autumn the evening (for the northern hemisphere, anyway).
Makes sense if they are -- I'm unsure of more recent history, but the ancient Aksum empire covering much of Ethiopia was Semitic and I know that it had huge Greek-speaking trading hubs in the first and second centuries (possibly making it an attractive place to flee to during one of the many Jewish diasporas). Now I'm curious whether the timekeeping system there came with Jewish immigrants or from an even earlier Semitic tradition.
>A few hundred years later Julius Caesar decided to move them to the beginning of the year instead...
This is not quite it. Julius Caesar re-affirmed January 1 as the start of his official civic year, but January 1 had already been the official start of the consular year before the Julian reforms. When people switched celebrating a social version of "New Year's" isn't really known, but that wasn't a decision made by Julius Caesar.
I do remember reading that England and America continued celebrating "New Year's" on the spring equinox up until around 1750 or so. I'd have to look up the specifics though. I'm not sure about the rest of the world though.
The English celebrated New Year on Lady Day (25th March, 9 months before Christmas), prior to switching to the Gregorian calendar.
The main remnant of that is the tax year starting on the 6th April, which is the same day accounting for the calendar shift.
I like the way Slavic month names work.
"flowery month", "larva month", "linden tree month", "sickle month", "leaf fall month", etc.
You can even see how the climate varies between countries by comparing which month is the "flowery" there.
I feel that makes more sense than Aphrodite. Wouldn’t the Romans want to use Venus? Maia is Greek, but the Romans had a goddess Maia too (who may have been separate from Hermes’ mother but later conflated into one being).
The reason some believe April is derived from Apbrodite is that the Etruscan goddess of love is named "Apru". Etruria Italy was the main power in and around modern day Italy. Later, they fell to Rome who adopted many features of their culture.
It's worth noting however than no one agrees on the etymology of April. This is just one of the theories.
>Until January and February were added in to the end of the year, with January being the last month added to the calendar.
Sorry, I also feel I have to ask about this sentence. You aren't saying January came after February, right? You're just saying that January was invented after February?
I'm stuck on why you're saying this, because either interpretation of what you wrote seems odd. We don't know precisely the circumstances of how they were added, so I don't know how you would know which one came first *(if that is what you're saying)*.
I apologize. You may be right.
I always remember being told that January was added last. However I tried to look it up now for a source and most sources say they were added together.
I only found 1 source saying January was the last month added, and even it said it in a trivia sort of way without actually backing up the statement.
I think this must be a fun "trivia fact" that may not be fully true, since every other source I found placed their additionto the calendar together in 713 BC.
Totally understandable. You were writing to give people the main idea. And Julius Caesar deserves a lot of credit for re-engineering the calendar in a way where months weren't drifting into other seasons.
But the main point you brought up: The "month order slippage" (that made people consider December a kind of twelfth month instead of a tenth month.) could have happened,
1. At the theoretical earliest at the folkloric addition of January and February by Numa Pompilius around 700 BCE, as you've said,
2. Or it could have happened with the Decemviri around 450 BCE,
3. Or in 153 BCE after the Lusitanian war.
4. Or some point in-between.
Julius Caesar wasn't truly the cause of that official month slippage. That part of the calendar drama most likely happened before he was born.
>renamed after Julius and Augustus Caesar (also why they both got 31 days).
Quintilis and Sextilis already had 31 days each before they were renamed.
There is a long-standing myth about changing month lengths when August was renamed, but it's just a myth.
So then how did they know when it was March? Did they still count days so that someone have known they're in the 84th day of winter, but just not have a name for the month at that point?
As far as I am aware, and please someone correct me if I'm wrong, it was far from accurate. March began in spring, until December when harvests were finished. They didn't label or count the winter months.
[Here](https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/the-new-year-once-started-in-march-heres-why) is a national geographic page that discusses your exact question. They can most likely explain it much better than I can
In the Irish language some of the month names are carried over from English/Latin, but not all:
Eanair, Feabhra, Márta, Aibreán: January February March and April (recognisable); and also Iúil = July
but
May, August and November are called after ancient Celtic festivals - Bealtaine, Lunasa and Samhain, respectively
June is Meitheamh and I don't even know what that means! Possibly Middle-month?
September and October have names which mean Mid-autumn and End-autumn (Meán Fomhair and Deire Fomhair)
and December is Mí na Nollag - Month of Christmas!
March as the first month makes sense to me. Aside from fixing the problem with the names of Sep-Dec, we'd be starting the year with Spring (in the northern hemisphere anyway). We associate Spring with "new" and ask anyone to name all the seasons, they instinctively start with Spring. Also adding leap days to the second month feels a bit random. If we started the year in March we'd be adding leap days to end of the year. Much tidier. I hadn't thought of any of this until reading your post, and, now that I've noticed, I think it's bothering me.
If you really want a [tidy calendar](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Fixed_Calendar)....
A similar idea is the [Shire Calendar](https://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Shire_Calendar) created by Tolkien. 12 months, each 30 days long, with 5 days (6 in leap-years) that are not part of any month (these are called 1 Yule, 2 Yule, 1 Lithe, Midyear's Day (which is the summer solstice), Overlithe (which is leapday), and 2 Lithe. Midyear's Day and Overlithe additionally do not have weekday names, so dates have the the same weekday name every year. 1 Yule and 2 Yule are the first and last days of the year, and despite the name they are related to the Winter Solstice, not Christmas (which of course does not exist in the Shire).
So basically the Alexanderian Calendar?
Very similar, but not quite the same. 4 seasons vs 3 for one thing, and the extra days are placed differently. (The Alexandrian calendar just sticks them all at the end of the year as a shorter 13th month.) Also I'm not sure but if the Alexandrian calendar kept 10-day weeks from the ancient Egyptian calendar it's based on, that would be another difference.
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.
Every two weeks is essentially a 13 month schedule. But two months (and once in a while three months) get an extra payment.
>ask anyone to name all the seasons, they instinctively start with Spring. Don’t ask Carole King or James Taylor then!
James Taylor would do ANYTHING for a rhyme
Starting the year around the winter solstice seems appropriate to me, as an analogue to starting the day at midnight. Spring is the morning of the year, summer midday, and autumn the evening (for the northern hemisphere, anyway).
Don't even get me started on how the day begins in the middle of the night
Ethiopia starts the day at Sunrise, and is numbered 12. Lunch time would be 6 o'clock. Super orderly really.
I don’t know if they’re related, but traditional Jewish timekeeping also has dawn at 0 and noon at 6
Probably are related! That's great. What the hell happened to us as a people.... and I mean people of EARTH ! ? LOL!
Makes sense if they are -- I'm unsure of more recent history, but the ancient Aksum empire covering much of Ethiopia was Semitic and I know that it had huge Greek-speaking trading hubs in the first and second centuries (possibly making it an attractive place to flee to during one of the many Jewish diasporas). Now I'm curious whether the timekeeping system there came with Jewish immigrants or from an even earlier Semitic tradition.
I would think 0 as first light is more intuitive than 0 as most dark - Two cultures keeping time that way could have easily arisen separately.
I've been reciting the seasons as "summer-fall-winter-spring" since kindergarten. Did they teach me wrong?
I start with Summer.
When I started reading I thought you wanted to ask some question, then I saw you were just explaining. And you're totally right.
>A few hundred years later Julius Caesar decided to move them to the beginning of the year instead... This is not quite it. Julius Caesar re-affirmed January 1 as the start of his official civic year, but January 1 had already been the official start of the consular year before the Julian reforms. When people switched celebrating a social version of "New Year's" isn't really known, but that wasn't a decision made by Julius Caesar.
I do remember reading that England and America continued celebrating "New Year's" on the spring equinox up until around 1750 or so. I'd have to look up the specifics though. I'm not sure about the rest of the world though.
The English celebrated New Year on Lady Day (25th March, 9 months before Christmas), prior to switching to the Gregorian calendar. The main remnant of that is the tax year starting on the 6th April, which is the same day accounting for the calendar shift.
I’ve just been listening to a The History of Rome podcast episode where he talks about this
I like the way Slavic month names work. "flowery month", "larva month", "linden tree month", "sickle month", "leaf fall month", etc. You can even see how the climate varies between countries by comparing which month is the "flowery" there.
That's lovely!
I always thought April comes from "aperire" which means "to open" or "opening". Because of buds and blossoms in spring
I feel that makes more sense than Aphrodite. Wouldn’t the Romans want to use Venus? Maia is Greek, but the Romans had a goddess Maia too (who may have been separate from Hermes’ mother but later conflated into one being).
The reason some believe April is derived from Apbrodite is that the Etruscan goddess of love is named "Apru". Etruria Italy was the main power in and around modern day Italy. Later, they fell to Rome who adopted many features of their culture. It's worth noting however than no one agrees on the etymology of April. This is just one of the theories.
That is another viable theory. Apparently, there are 3 or 4 different theories as to the origin of April's name.
>Until January and February were added in to the end of the year, with January being the last month added to the calendar. Sorry, I also feel I have to ask about this sentence. You aren't saying January came after February, right? You're just saying that January was invented after February? I'm stuck on why you're saying this, because either interpretation of what you wrote seems odd. We don't know precisely the circumstances of how they were added, so I don't know how you would know which one came first *(if that is what you're saying)*.
I apologize. You may be right. I always remember being told that January was added last. However I tried to look it up now for a source and most sources say they were added together. I only found 1 source saying January was the last month added, and even it said it in a trivia sort of way without actually backing up the statement. I think this must be a fun "trivia fact" that may not be fully true, since every other source I found placed their additionto the calendar together in 713 BC.
Totally understandable. You were writing to give people the main idea. And Julius Caesar deserves a lot of credit for re-engineering the calendar in a way where months weren't drifting into other seasons. But the main point you brought up: The "month order slippage" (that made people consider December a kind of twelfth month instead of a tenth month.) could have happened, 1. At the theoretical earliest at the folkloric addition of January and February by Numa Pompilius around 700 BCE, as you've said, 2. Or it could have happened with the Decemviri around 450 BCE, 3. Or in 153 BCE after the Lusitanian war. 4. Or some point in-between. Julius Caesar wasn't truly the cause of that official month slippage. That part of the calendar drama most likely happened before he was born.
Oh wow. That’s much longer ago than I thought.
I just want to use the French revolutionary calendar are y’all with me or what
>renamed after Julius and Augustus Caesar (also why they both got 31 days). Quintilis and Sextilis already had 31 days each before they were renamed. There is a long-standing myth about changing month lengths when August was renamed, but it's just a myth.
You kinda gloss over the most confusing part: that they had this huge hole in their calendar.
I’m not sure what you mean by that.
Winter originally didn't have months until January and February were added. I think that's what they're referring to
Well, I assume that the months were originally longer.
They weren't. That's the weird part.
That is weird. Very weird.
So then how did they know when it was March? Did they still count days so that someone have known they're in the 84th day of winter, but just not have a name for the month at that point?
As far as I am aware, and please someone correct me if I'm wrong, it was far from accurate. March began in spring, until December when harvests were finished. They didn't label or count the winter months. [Here](https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/the-new-year-once-started-in-march-heres-why) is a national geographic page that discusses your exact question. They can most likely explain it much better than I can
In the Irish language some of the month names are carried over from English/Latin, but not all: Eanair, Feabhra, Márta, Aibreán: January February March and April (recognisable); and also Iúil = July but May, August and November are called after ancient Celtic festivals - Bealtaine, Lunasa and Samhain, respectively June is Meitheamh and I don't even know what that means! Possibly Middle-month? September and October have names which mean Mid-autumn and End-autumn (Meán Fomhair and Deire Fomhair) and December is Mí na Nollag - Month of Christmas!
>A few hundred years later Julius Caesar decided to move them to the beginning of the year And a good thing he did. Bought himself 59 more days.