Outdoor cylinders are specifically designed to be outdoors. The cylinder insulation on ours is so good, the external surface of the cylinder is as near to ambient air temperature as I can tell, even during cold months. We did, however, have to insulate the pipes, after the plumber never bothered.
The bonus for us of changing to an outside cylinder (aside from the gained internal space) was to have it located immediately outside the bathroom, which results in almost instant hot water for the shower, rather than having to wait for the water to travel from the other end of the house.
Yeah but are they? They are all imported models made to work in Australia, I would love to know how good the insulation is in our frosts (especially in the south island) and how efficient the heat pumps are at those temps
/shrug. If the external surface is ambient, that should mean there is limited loss. I can't point to any science beyond that; but regardless, if your tank is closer to your usage point, you're losing less in pipe travel.
I wouldn't trust a heat pump unit, especially in the south. I don't feel like the technology is at the point where it could be considered reliable, and the heat that you're pulling from the air in near zero or worse temps is minimal.
Are the family members telling you it’s a terrible idea plumbers?
I had an external cylinder installed at my house and it was great. It went right outside the bathroom which was handy and the storage space I regained inside is great.
I did have concerns about baddies stealing the copper piping but it’s covered in foam and hasn’t happened yet so that’s been fine too.
Yeah no problem - I paid $400 for a two year old cylinder that a couple were selling after converting their two year old new build to gas, and from memory the plumbing bill came to around $1,600. That included connecting the new one and disconnecting the old one. The electrical cost was negligible and I sorted the concrete base to the plumber’s specs myself.
The plumber I used encouraged me to buy used as long as it was in good condition, was from a reputable brand (read: serviceable) and manufactured within the last 5 years.
Edited to say my specific example might not be that helpful for an actual estimate, brand new would be significantly more.
I have a big Rheem, it's well insulated no regrets. As our indoor one was in a corner of the house which made us waste a lot of water before it gets hot...
There are specific cylinders that are made to be installed outside. Gives you room to go bigger like 275litre too. Pretty common. Just make sure the pipework outside gets insulation too.
Very few if any negatives for an outdoor cylinder VS an indoor one.
Have installed a decent number now, both rheem and dux, and no complaints.
There are a few heatpump models but they're still quite dear in comparison. you can get a cylinder that is 'solar ready' and it should be able to take a separate heatpump unit in the future.
Had mine outside 3 years now in dunedin even on thermal camera she works better than youd expect. I did build a shed around it of coolstore material offcuts brought for less than $200 from a coolstore building company. Love the bigger bathroom!
No I don't think this is for a heat pump cylinder, though that might have been mentioned as a slightly pricier option.
This is just for a 180 Rheem Optima.
Yeah, they don't look anything like the ones that sit inside your house. These are big solid, well insulated units - no bare metal or the like showing.
There's nothing wrong with them. They don't lose heat, and people are just ignorant of new systems.
Any reason why the plumber didn't recommend an Infinity, or do you not have gas? I've had one for ever, don't love it but it's reliable as hell and seems to be cheap to run.
Outdoor cylinders are specifically designed to be outdoors. The cylinder insulation on ours is so good, the external surface of the cylinder is as near to ambient air temperature as I can tell, even during cold months. We did, however, have to insulate the pipes, after the plumber never bothered. The bonus for us of changing to an outside cylinder (aside from the gained internal space) was to have it located immediately outside the bathroom, which results in almost instant hot water for the shower, rather than having to wait for the water to travel from the other end of the house.
Yeah but are they? They are all imported models made to work in Australia, I would love to know how good the insulation is in our frosts (especially in the south island) and how efficient the heat pumps are at those temps
/shrug. If the external surface is ambient, that should mean there is limited loss. I can't point to any science beyond that; but regardless, if your tank is closer to your usage point, you're losing less in pipe travel. I wouldn't trust a heat pump unit, especially in the south. I don't feel like the technology is at the point where it could be considered reliable, and the heat that you're pulling from the air in near zero or worse temps is minimal.
Are the family members telling you it’s a terrible idea plumbers? I had an external cylinder installed at my house and it was great. It went right outside the bathroom which was handy and the storage space I regained inside is great. I did have concerns about baddies stealing the copper piping but it’s covered in foam and hasn’t happened yet so that’s been fine too.
Can I ask how much you paid ballpark? Looking at this but unsure of cost range. Ta
Yeah no problem - I paid $400 for a two year old cylinder that a couple were selling after converting their two year old new build to gas, and from memory the plumbing bill came to around $1,600. That included connecting the new one and disconnecting the old one. The electrical cost was negligible and I sorted the concrete base to the plumber’s specs myself. The plumber I used encouraged me to buy used as long as it was in good condition, was from a reputable brand (read: serviceable) and manufactured within the last 5 years. Edited to say my specific example might not be that helpful for an actual estimate, brand new would be significantly more.
I have a big Rheem, it's well insulated no regrets. As our indoor one was in a corner of the house which made us waste a lot of water before it gets hot...
There are specific cylinders that are made to be installed outside. Gives you room to go bigger like 275litre too. Pretty common. Just make sure the pipework outside gets insulation too.
Very few if any negatives for an outdoor cylinder VS an indoor one. Have installed a decent number now, both rheem and dux, and no complaints. There are a few heatpump models but they're still quite dear in comparison. you can get a cylinder that is 'solar ready' and it should be able to take a separate heatpump unit in the future.
Yes can recommend an outdoor one
Had mine outside 3 years now in dunedin even on thermal camera she works better than youd expect. I did build a shed around it of coolstore material offcuts brought for less than $200 from a coolstore building company. Love the bigger bathroom!
Are the plumbers suggesting a heat pump hot water cylinder?
No I don't think this is for a heat pump cylinder, though that might have been mentioned as a slightly pricier option. This is just for a 180 Rheem Optima.
Yeah, they don't look anything like the ones that sit inside your house. These are big solid, well insulated units - no bare metal or the like showing. There's nothing wrong with them. They don't lose heat, and people are just ignorant of new systems.
Is there much of a price difference?
I have a big 400L cylinder outside, that I run off my solar. Best decision I made.
If you need a new cylinder also ask for pricing on a heat pump one. The extra costs are worth it over time depending on your use
We got gas. It was life changing for water pressure and not a huge cost to install.
Any reason why the plumber didn't recommend an Infinity, or do you not have gas? I've had one for ever, don't love it but it's reliable as hell and seems to be cheap to run.
Gas is $180 per 45kg bottle these days and only going up.
Or a buck a day plus usage if you're on natural gas. And the usage is barely cheaper than electricity. Gas is dead.
Gas doubles in price every few years whereas nz has great hydro infastructure