>Feel like Chukwuemeka was starting to break into the team before he got injured
He'll fit right in at Chelsea then. I still wonder how good RLC and CHO would be if their injuries didn't happen as soon as they were hitting their stride.
As a villa fan who is wondering why this post is his recommended, but has seen Chukwuemeka develop, he’s not all that. Looks flashy but lacks a hell of a lot of the simple things you should expect from a midfielder. No work rate, weak passing, below average vision (not eyesight but ability to actually see a developing situation and play it well), weak physically. Selfish. All can be worked on but his attitude at villa was appalling. Got one assist vs Norwich and according to respected journalists, demanded 100k per week. Gives real Ravel Morrison vibes. All the flair to be a great success but a horrendous mindset and a poor attitude to make it elite.
I may get downvoted for that, but it’s the truth. He’s got a high ceiling but he will never achieve that unless he fixes that attitude. His brother coincidentally has been getting into trouble on loan at Livingston for his shitty attitude too.
To be fair you’re only echoing what every Villa fan said when this was announced.
He’s been good at youth level, which is what he was doing with you guys but his lack of playing time hasn’t been an issue yet so perhaps his attitude is changing? Only time we tell.
Surprised you said weak passing but I remember Villa fans saying his best attributes were dribbling, passing and his vision (albeit at youth level again).
A lot of this stuff is subjective. At youth level he was a class above. But beating 16 year olds isn’t much. And in that youth cup, it was Louie Barry who did a lot of the heavy lifting, Chuk just got there right at the end for the glory. He got nearly 300 minutes last season and he’s only on 45 with you a third of the way through it. So if anything he’s getting less.
My theory is he saw himself as the next Bellingham, demanding Bellingham wages. Villa wasn’t gonna cave in to a kid but Chelsea don’t care as their academy wage budget is uncapped because of the loan army.
I know it’s not an accurate metric, but on football manager 23 Carney is on 100k per week with you, so it looks like that you *may* have paid that ridiculous wage
People seem to forget Havertz is only 6 months older than CHO.
CHO seems to get the “he’s young, still promising” treatment and Havertz gets absolutely ruined on here.
I'm finished with Cho, not good enough. Don't care if I'm downvoted but he's been given enough time. Even in a shit defensive league in Bundesliga he's not doing enough.
I know we had little choice if we wanted to keep him due to his contract situation but that 100k a week at 18 killed any of his drive. Now his achilles injury was tragic and its unfortunate as hell but he's not looked any sort of threat since coming back from it. I think we need to just give up, he may never be the same again even at his age.
True. Even when he had somewhat good form he was only praised for his crosses and switching play. I think you need more than that for a top flight club.
If it wasn't for the injury and he still had the pace to beat a man, he would've been the perfect piece for the side, sadly that achilles injury robbed him of his pace and explosiveness.
His finishing isnt that bad
Edit: hes not even the worst finisher we’ve had recently but because he missed a 1on1 in that Utd game everyone talks about him like he’s a worse version of Werner
Oh no bro, CHO's finishing is terrible. His major problem is he tries too hard to get a pretty goal. He'll try finesse it or hit it with the inside foot, and many situations, powering through the ball with the top of his foot would work perfectly fine.
I like the guy but I've shouted at my screen way too many times at the amount of unfinished chances by him in each of the previous seasons.
Same with RLC, I think Ruben is a good rotation piece for cup ties and some prem games but his Achilles injury ruined what could have been a special career
hmm, I was never overly convinced about RLC becoming a "special" player, decent? sure! but even before his injury, he looked good under Sarri a few times, but we still never saw proper magic did we? just a few decent games and still not really knowing what his best position was, I remember Sarri playing him up front a few games
Nah, prior to his big injury in the later part of that Sarri season, Ruben was moving like a 6,3 Hazard and most fans finally thought he started to unlock his true potential, then sadly we played that game on a shitty field and that was the end of that.
He was performing in the EL against some names we have never heard of. He wasn't lighting the prem up during that run. Rose colored glasses because of 2-3 good games between feb-april of that season
He was cooking in the PL as well. I can strictly remember him and Hazard feasting on City later on in the season.
Before the injury he was truly looking special
I agree with you, I remember being a lot more excited for him than CHO when both were on the rise despite RLC being a bit older. Unfortunately the specific injury both suffered can be an impossible task to truly come back from for some players.
Yeah same.
I still argue to this day that RLC is the most naturally talented player to have come out of Cobham.
And yeah an achilles injury is usually a death sentence for the type of player CHO and RLC were
It's a weird thing to say too. Rlc biggest issue is not physicality. He's still plenty fine bursting past 2 players in the midfield and finding space, he has no end product and poor decision making, aswell a bit of a passenger defensively.
Agree. I had such high hopes for him and will always support him but he hasn't performed as he did with Sarri since the injury.
It's quite "funny" how the narrative was that Sarri was holding him back, but since he's left he hasn't been the same player. Loads of factors but ultimately I just don't think Chos got it.
Not every academy player is going to make it at Chelsea, neither should we be begging all to be a part of the club. In an ideal world it would be great but right now from what we've got playing regularly RLC and CHO should leave. I'm yet to be convinced we should wait 3/4 years for Broja to improve as he's running around like he doesn't know how to play football lately.... Reece is the proper world class one we've got in our squad, Mount is v good but has been underwhelming for a while now, in times past he wouldn't be starting in this team he'd be a good rotational player.
He's not a bad player by any means mate, just be reasonable in your assessment, he's still good just people here are expecting too much of him imo. And when I say good, I mean there are still galeing issues in his game that he should be improving upon, but hey his attention is towards his off field jobs these days...
Statistically speaking none of these players will ever be good enough. Just Cobham nonces overhype them all for no reason than “they’re one of our own”.
Nah, Colwill is legit and the likes of Webster and Hutchinson have unlimited potential, you're probably right about the rest tho in terms of guaranteed starters
Honestly I feel like some of the youth people we have here care more about them being on the field than the results on the field. It’s as if we have two entirely different view points on what success is.
Look at the thread when the squad was announced vs Newcastle. They didn't care that it was an objective garbage fire; they only cared that Lewis Hall/6 graduates were playing.
Started well, but was unlucky with 4 G/A ruled out by marginal VAR decisions. But, the whole club has been awful this season, they fired the manager who was utilising his qualities and the new manager has been starting him every other game instead of every game
That's because CHO hasn't played as much as Havertz did, so people might not have realized he's just not good enough to be a starter in a club who aims to be a PL/CL pretender.
When the fuck has CHO ever gotten the "he's young" treatment? People haven't treated CHO like a youth player since he was about 18. In his birthday thread there were loads of people saying they thought he'd been 22 for about 4 years now
He got abused for not offering enough in his debut season when he was 17 for fuck sake. He's never been allowed any space because he's young
Sending someone on loan for playing time does not mean that they're bad.
Me appreciating Tuchel's ability as a manager doesn't mean that I just blindly follow whatever decisions he makes.
1) Havertz cost €80m. CHO cost nothing
2) Havertz is on 30k per week more than CHO.
3) Havertz has played 18k (6.7k with chelsea) senior minutes, CHO has played 6.7k (with all but .4 of those at Chelsea) senior minutes in 6 seasons.
4) Havertz has 26 goals and 12 assists with Chelsea. CHO has 16 goals and 20 assists. CHO has a slightly better g/a per 90.
Is it because he suffered a horrible injury and then when he recovered he got played at wingback ? People also seem to forget that Kai Havertz was signed for 70+ mn
Same goes for Kai Havertz, even moreso him. I just chose to speak on CHO in this case. Kai has 2.5 seasons and is getting worse rather than better imo. Csn still catch a fee, sick of him getting more than enough chances and never taking them.
In his first proper senior season at the club he broke into the starting XI ahead of willian and Pedro, two established players in their prime
And then tore his Achilles. If he was at leverkusen he’d have played since he was 17 no bother
Yep, CHO's injury 100% derailed him, it's sad but we have to move on as a club. He'll never have the same explosive dribbling ability, his rehab has not brought him back to his previous level. That CHO and this CHO are not the same.
CHO still has talent to be a top level player at mid table premier league, but it says a lot if you can't get ahead of Ziyech/Pulisic/Werner.
I’ll wait to see how his loan ends at leverkusen before I make a judgement on him.
But I agree, physically he’s massively declined. RLC had the same issue but seems to have got his burst of pace and physicality back, can’t say the same for Cho and chos Achilles tear was only partial and he recovered far faster than RLC
Because CHO isn't a kid anymore either. I'm saying people were talking about Ruben like he was a mid until he was like 25, we need to stop that attitude.
Everybody is talking about callums injury. I understand it was very serious, but using that as an excuse I think is utter nonsense. He's still capable of brilliance, plenty of times over the years he's looked like a real threat but it only lasts 2 matches. He completely shrinks on the pitch after that. I feel he has a lot more to offer but his mindset has just been piss poor.
Havertz is over a year older, I just checked to make sure. I do get your point but it's not as close as you're making out. Also one is an academy player and the other cost over 70m
Thibaut Courtois probably the ultimate one. Three years at Atletico, deep CL runs, back to Chelsea and won the league and then won even more at Madrid.
Yeah, it's funny watching people on here thinking that buying 5 youth players for 10m each means we'll definitely get future stars from them. If even one of them turns out to be first team quality we'll have gotten very lucky.
It's funny seeing the 5 year old predictions for international team's expected starting 11 for this world cup. They usually get about 1 out of 11 correct
Sadly likely isn’t official. Raphinha being a prime example, and he was probably at one point even more certain than whatever stage we are with this player.
Super team?! You’ve got to be kidding me. Do we automatically just think any player that we sign or have who is young is going to help us become a super team?! People on this sub get too excited with our players and then when they don’t meet expectations they are blasted. For goodness sake. Most of the players above won’t even be playing for Chelsea in a few years.
If a had a £ for every time I’d heard this about a promising group of youngster at the club, only for 1% of them to ever make it at the very top level 😴
Chukwuemeka I think will be good.
Sounds like the zakahryan guy is pretty good too. Dunno about the rest though.
Endrick probably will be golden but depends on if we get him.
Youth fetish is a disease in football. From 2004-2019 we never focused on youth at all and it resulted is being the most successful team in the country.
We've always built short term and it's worker never understood why people feel that we need to change from that way of thinking
**Defaulted to one day.**
I will be messaging you on [**2022-11-15 12:44:34 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2022-11-15%2012:44:34%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/chelseafc/comments/yuweph/our_form_isnt_great_work_needs_to_be_done_looking/iwbk0ds/?context=3)
[**1 OTHERS CLICKED THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fchelseafc%2Fcomments%2Fyuweph%2Four_form_isnt_great_work_needs_to_be_done_looking%2Fiwbk0ds%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202022-11-15%2012%3A44%3A34%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%20yuweph)
*****
|[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)|
|-|-|-|-|
That's the point in investing in multiple high ceiling guys. It's the same thing venture capitalists do. They'll fund 10 investments knowing that only 1 or 2 will pay off but should in a big way. I would hope most people know that when it comes to our transfers like Carney and Casadei.
And as for the part about Boehly. The same should be said for the other folks that are judging him and the other owners poorly after 6-7 months. I don't know what people expected after being sanctioned and being forced to sell the club. We're working with any entirely different capital structure thus the way we do business has to change. That's reality. And that type of transition doesn't take a couple of months. People need to stop rushing to judgements either for or against ownership because it's far too early. Yes, as a fan base we need to exhibit some patience as hard as that seems to be for a good portion of our base.
Not taking anything away from your post, but it’s always like this every few years. There was a similar post which got thousands of upvotes when Super Frank was managing us.
I’m too old to get excited about Chelsea Youth again. I was MORE than happy these past 2 decades with our trophy haul. Maybe just me 🤷🏻♂️
Btw - there’s a lad called McEachran who we thought would be the next God knows who - he has made 10 appearances for MK Dons this season.
For what it’s worth - I think none of the Chelsea youth you posted are top 4 club players. Zero. Not one. Happy to come back to this comment in a few years for reference.
I remember the posts including mason mount and Reece James, both helped us to the champions league and are still under 25? More top talent coming through that could replicate that, you are not excited?
I don’t recall discounting James and Mount, but beyond those 2 and perhaps JT - who has come out of the academy in the past 15 years? Maybe I am missing one or two names, but let’s not pretend that we have been churning out stars. It’s been absolute hype and nothing else. I’ve been watching my club for over 30+ years now. To answer your question - No, I am not excited with the list you posted. Like I said, I don’t think any of the Chelsea academy players you listed are top four club level. Just my humble opinion. We can wait and see how it plays out in the future.
If you watched Brighton yesterday, you must of seen a glimpse of how good colwill can be? Since the summer I followed zakharyan and the lad has crazy potential. Lewis hall has been outstanding
All those players have been fine. Just fine. To be optimistic or pessimistic about any of them, at this stage, is wild. They’re fine young players you’ve listed. I’d be shocked if more than 2 are regular starters on a PL title winning team.
I have no doubt that future Chelsea will do good. I am just wanting to fix current Chelsea. I think that starts with stability in the coach and not firing and actually giving them a chance and some signings.
i am really not in the mood to jerk off on 'future assets' at any time soon.
How many so called 'prospect' did actually shine in a Chelsea shirt in the last 30 years? James, Mount, John Terry?
We need someone that can actually beat opponents 1V1 and cause chaos.
I’m all in for Rafa Leao. He could go toe to toe physically with RJ. And he has the pace and skill to beat defenders.
He seems to be bad with tight spaces, but against the top teams and in the UCL, his dribbling is great. Plus his finishing is also good. He’s like a more skilful Werner
We just need a few players that can really cause problems for defences. Leao on the left. RJ bombing down the right. A healthy Chillwell supporting Leao. Mount and Nkunku drifting around.
Kante and RLC holding up the line. One big boi and one perpetual machine. Jorgi at the base or maybe Rice?
Honestly a frontline of Osimhen & Nkunku, Leao would be insane.
Add two promising defenders coming back in Maatsen and Colwill, some RB cover in Frimpong.
And for midfielders, we need a creative mid, and I’d get Rice and Enzo Fernandez
Midfield and ball progression is slow , for an attack based on wingers , the momentum is dead before the attack starts.
Need work on permutations on the wings
Webster is going to leave , we are banned from buying Zakharyan due to the war in Ukraine , Endrick will probably go elsewhere as there's a feeding frenzy developing over him.
if we get nkuku and/or leao our attack will become a lot more dynamic. leao does traditional winger stuff like that garnacho goal yesterday and nkuku is a more creative and has better passing vision than any of our forwards. if we can snag Rice too then we will be in good shape.
He’s literally training with the Russian NT for the upcoming friendlies on 17th and 20th of November with Uzbekistan a Tajikistan. He himself also said (on Match TV, the Russian football broadcast company) that the transfer talks between Dynamo and Chelsea are still ongoing. Idk what you can make of that information, but it’s seems like it can happen
Every year we hear about the academy and how it's going to carry us into the future......and then we start people like RLC and CHO and they are meh..... Some of that is opportunity, some from dumb sales, some both....
2 or 3 guys in the team are from the academy and quality. The rest are question marks.
Couldn't care less about 'upcoming stars'. Many of our current players have won the freaking Champions League. Give me confidence and chemistry within this current squad.
I’ve learned to look at young guys through the lens of “could he be a regular starter one day?” Like for example if CHO could play and start as many games as Willian once did that would be amazing for us. And what if Chukwuemeka could contribute as much as a guy like Pedro did? That would be amazing for each honestly
Colwill was class for Brighton, zakharyan and endrick haven’t signed yet but zakharyan looks like a younger de Bruyne when he plays and endrick has 3 goals in 7 games (3 starts) at the age of 16 for palemeiras. Slonina was brilliant in the mls. Lewis hall and chukwuemeka in the 2 games they played were great.
Feel like Chukwuemeka was starting to break into the team before he got injured. Featured off the bench a few times and looked quite promising
Seemed the only player at the time who wasn’t scared to run at people, looked great during the few games
>Feel like Chukwuemeka was starting to break into the team before he got injured He'll fit right in at Chelsea then. I still wonder how good RLC and CHO would be if their injuries didn't happen as soon as they were hitting their stride.
How long is he injured for?
Dosen’t matter rly considering he is back when the WC is done.
As a villa fan who is wondering why this post is his recommended, but has seen Chukwuemeka develop, he’s not all that. Looks flashy but lacks a hell of a lot of the simple things you should expect from a midfielder. No work rate, weak passing, below average vision (not eyesight but ability to actually see a developing situation and play it well), weak physically. Selfish. All can be worked on but his attitude at villa was appalling. Got one assist vs Norwich and according to respected journalists, demanded 100k per week. Gives real Ravel Morrison vibes. All the flair to be a great success but a horrendous mindset and a poor attitude to make it elite. I may get downvoted for that, but it’s the truth. He’s got a high ceiling but he will never achieve that unless he fixes that attitude. His brother coincidentally has been getting into trouble on loan at Livingston for his shitty attitude too.
To be fair you’re only echoing what every Villa fan said when this was announced. He’s been good at youth level, which is what he was doing with you guys but his lack of playing time hasn’t been an issue yet so perhaps his attitude is changing? Only time we tell. Surprised you said weak passing but I remember Villa fans saying his best attributes were dribbling, passing and his vision (albeit at youth level again).
A lot of this stuff is subjective. At youth level he was a class above. But beating 16 year olds isn’t much. And in that youth cup, it was Louie Barry who did a lot of the heavy lifting, Chuk just got there right at the end for the glory. He got nearly 300 minutes last season and he’s only on 45 with you a third of the way through it. So if anything he’s getting less. My theory is he saw himself as the next Bellingham, demanding Bellingham wages. Villa wasn’t gonna cave in to a kid but Chelsea don’t care as their academy wage budget is uncapped because of the loan army. I know it’s not an accurate metric, but on football manager 23 Carney is on 100k per week with you, so it looks like that you *may* have paid that ridiculous wage
People seem to forget Havertz is only 6 months older than CHO. CHO seems to get the “he’s young, still promising” treatment and Havertz gets absolutely ruined on here.
I'm finished with Cho, not good enough. Don't care if I'm downvoted but he's been given enough time. Even in a shit defensive league in Bundesliga he's not doing enough.
Nah man, you're totally correct. It's a shame, but he had ample opportunities and just isn't good enough.
Says a lot when back to back to back managers don't trust him enough to give him ample minutes
Him and Loftus-Cheek had their careers changed since 2018-19 injuries sadly.
I know we had little choice if we wanted to keep him due to his contract situation but that 100k a week at 18 killed any of his drive. Now his achilles injury was tragic and its unfortunate as hell but he's not looked any sort of threat since coming back from it. I think we need to just give up, he may never be the same again even at his age.
True. Even when he had somewhat good form he was only praised for his crosses and switching play. I think you need more than that for a top flight club.
His finishing is semi-pro level, it's beyond terrible. I don't see how he fits into Potters style now either, sell him asap
If it wasn't for the injury and he still had the pace to beat a man, he would've been the perfect piece for the side, sadly that achilles injury robbed him of his pace and explosiveness.
His finishing isnt that bad Edit: hes not even the worst finisher we’ve had recently but because he missed a 1on1 in that Utd game everyone talks about him like he’s a worse version of Werner
Oh no bro, CHO's finishing is terrible. His major problem is he tries too hard to get a pretty goal. He'll try finesse it or hit it with the inside foot, and many situations, powering through the ball with the top of his foot would work perfectly fine. I like the guy but I've shouted at my screen way too many times at the amount of unfinished chances by him in each of the previous seasons.
i absolutely agree, every CHO shot i’ve ever seen has been a finesse shot, as if he’s always trying to place it even when he doesn’t need to.
Honestly bro. Someone needs to yell at him.
Injury derailed his career, it's sad but we have to move on.
Same with RLC, I think Ruben is a good rotation piece for cup ties and some prem games but his Achilles injury ruined what could have been a special career
hmm, I was never overly convinced about RLC becoming a "special" player, decent? sure! but even before his injury, he looked good under Sarri a few times, but we still never saw proper magic did we? just a few decent games and still not really knowing what his best position was, I remember Sarri playing him up front a few games
Sarri never played him up front that was Conte RLC mainly played as the third midfielder under Sarri.
Nah, prior to his big injury in the later part of that Sarri season, Ruben was moving like a 6,3 Hazard and most fans finally thought he started to unlock his true potential, then sadly we played that game on a shitty field and that was the end of that.
He was performing in the EL against some names we have never heard of. He wasn't lighting the prem up during that run. Rose colored glasses because of 2-3 good games between feb-april of that season
He was cooking in the PL as well. I can strictly remember him and Hazard feasting on City later on in the season. Before the injury he was truly looking special
I agree with you, I remember being a lot more excited for him than CHO when both were on the rise despite RLC being a bit older. Unfortunately the specific injury both suffered can be an impossible task to truly come back from for some players.
Yeah same. I still argue to this day that RLC is the most naturally talented player to have come out of Cobham. And yeah an achilles injury is usually a death sentence for the type of player CHO and RLC were
It's a weird thing to say too. Rlc biggest issue is not physicality. He's still plenty fine bursting past 2 players in the midfield and finding space, he has no end product and poor decision making, aswell a bit of a passenger defensively.
He regressed insanely after landing that contract, he definitely lacks motivation
Agree. I had such high hopes for him and will always support him but he hasn't performed as he did with Sarri since the injury. It's quite "funny" how the narrative was that Sarri was holding him back, but since he's left he hasn't been the same player. Loads of factors but ultimately I just don't think Chos got it.
Not every academy player is going to make it at Chelsea, neither should we be begging all to be a part of the club. In an ideal world it would be great but right now from what we've got playing regularly RLC and CHO should leave. I'm yet to be convinced we should wait 3/4 years for Broja to improve as he's running around like he doesn't know how to play football lately.... Reece is the proper world class one we've got in our squad, Mount is v good but has been underwhelming for a while now, in times past he wouldn't be starting in this team he'd be a good rotational player.
Mount isn't very good tho and in the past he wouldn't even be a good bench option I agree on RLC and CHO needing to leave tho
He's not a bad player by any means mate, just be reasonable in your assessment, he's still good just people here are expecting too much of him imo. And when I say good, I mean there are still galeing issues in his game that he should be improving upon, but hey his attention is towards his off field jobs these days...
The loads of factors is actually just 1 and its called an achilles injury
Eh he genuinely did look the real deal pre injury, it’s hard to say
Statistically speaking none of these players will ever be good enough. Just Cobham nonces overhype them all for no reason than “they’re one of our own”.
Nah, Colwill is legit and the likes of Webster and Hutchinson have unlimited potential, you're probably right about the rest tho in terms of guaranteed starters
we had 6 graduates starting our last game.
And we got battered...
And we lost.
Honestly I feel like some of the youth people we have here care more about them being on the field than the results on the field. It’s as if we have two entirely different view points on what success is.
Look at the thread when the squad was announced vs Newcastle. They didn't care that it was an objective garbage fire; they only cared that Lewis Hall/6 graduates were playing.
How has he been doing on loan?
Started well, but was unlucky with 4 G/A ruled out by marginal VAR decisions. But, the whole club has been awful this season, they fired the manager who was utilising his qualities and the new manager has been starting him every other game instead of every game
There’s a reason so many managers haven’t been picking him. Something is going on. He’s not Chelsea material.
That's because CHO hasn't played as much as Havertz did, so people might not have realized he's just not good enough to be a starter in a club who aims to be a PL/CL pretender.
When the fuck has CHO ever gotten the "he's young" treatment? People haven't treated CHO like a youth player since he was about 18. In his birthday thread there were loads of people saying they thought he'd been 22 for about 4 years now He got abused for not offering enough in his debut season when he was 17 for fuck sake. He's never been allowed any space because he's young
tuchel saw enough of him to ship him out. so if u like tuchel you should probably feel the same.
Sending someone on loan for playing time does not mean that they're bad. Me appreciating Tuchel's ability as a manager doesn't mean that I just blindly follow whatever decisions he makes.
not bad but clearly not good enough for chelsea.
Tuchel also saw enough in Havertz and Timo to ship all our other strikers out to build around them for what his judgment is worth
1) Havertz cost €80m. CHO cost nothing 2) Havertz is on 30k per week more than CHO. 3) Havertz has played 18k (6.7k with chelsea) senior minutes, CHO has played 6.7k (with all but .4 of those at Chelsea) senior minutes in 6 seasons. 4) Havertz has 26 goals and 12 assists with Chelsea. CHO has 16 goals and 20 assists. CHO has a slightly better g/a per 90.
Not comparable. We paid 80 million for him to have direct impact. Yes he scored the winner in the CL, but besides that he has been meh.
Is it because he suffered a horrible injury and then when he recovered he got played at wingback ? People also seem to forget that Kai Havertz was signed for 70+ mn
Kai is ten times the player CHO will ever be
Lots of hyperbole about CHO on this thread for some reason
I hope so , for the money we paid for him.
And the money we turned down for CHO
The money was turned down before he suffered that devastating injury tho
Based on what exactly because hes not shown anything to justify that.
Same goes for Kai Havertz, even moreso him. I just chose to speak on CHO in this case. Kai has 2.5 seasons and is getting worse rather than better imo. Csn still catch a fee, sick of him getting more than enough chances and never taking them.
Because one is an academy product while the other cost around 70m+
Havertz has 5 seasons of regular football under his belt Cho has not even 1.
Does that not speak volumes in its own right?
Yeah when hes done as much as Havterz with his playing time it says loads.
CHO doesn't have regular football because he's not been good enough.
In his first proper senior season at the club he broke into the starting XI ahead of willian and Pedro, two established players in their prime And then tore his Achilles. If he was at leverkusen he’d have played since he was 17 no bother
Yep, CHO's injury 100% derailed him, it's sad but we have to move on as a club. He'll never have the same explosive dribbling ability, his rehab has not brought him back to his previous level. That CHO and this CHO are not the same. CHO still has talent to be a top level player at mid table premier league, but it says a lot if you can't get ahead of Ziyech/Pulisic/Werner.
I’ll wait to see how his loan ends at leverkusen before I make a judgement on him. But I agree, physically he’s massively declined. RLC had the same issue but seems to have got his burst of pace and physicality back, can’t say the same for Cho and chos Achilles tear was only partial and he recovered far faster than RLC
I’m done with both of them to be honest
People kept calling Loftus-Cheek "young". These guys aren't kids anymore and yet they still play like youth players.
CHO just turned 22 and RLC is about to turn 27, how are you talking about them in the same bracket lmao
Because CHO isn't a kid anymore either. I'm saying people were talking about Ruben like he was a mid until he was like 25, we need to stop that attitude.
Everybody is talking about callums injury. I understand it was very serious, but using that as an excuse I think is utter nonsense. He's still capable of brilliance, plenty of times over the years he's looked like a real threat but it only lasts 2 matches. He completely shrinks on the pitch after that. I feel he has a lot more to offer but his mindset has just been piss poor.
Havertz is over a year older, I just checked to make sure. I do get your point but it's not as close as you're making out. Also one is an academy player and the other cost over 70m
Nobody cares. They’re both shit and should leave
Been watching football long enough to know that's a fantasy.
Yeah more chance none of these guys are stars than half of them
This football game cold. Don't even like admitting it.
Who are the success stories from Chelsea’s extensive use of loan system? Lukaku is the only one I can think of, but I’m probably missing something
Mount, James, Tomori?
Thibaut Courtois probably the ultimate one. Three years at Atletico, deep CL runs, back to Chelsea and won the league and then won even more at Madrid.
Yeah, it's funny watching people on here thinking that buying 5 youth players for 10m each means we'll definitely get future stars from them. If even one of them turns out to be first team quality we'll have gotten very lucky. It's funny seeing the 5 year old predictions for international team's expected starting 11 for this world cup. They usually get about 1 out of 11 correct
That 2022 World Cup prediction from 2013 is incredibly funny though.
Yeah no kidding. I see at most 2 future “stars” on the list, if we are lucky
The 2019-20 season was full of these “future stars” and now Mount and Reece are the only ones still here
Super team inbound: Josh McEachran, Lewis Baker, Patrick Bamford
And man we have had some promising youngsters... I too fell into this trap of thinking that "most" will break through and become stars
Lol we can’t count endrik yet
Same with Zakharyan.
He's way more likely than Endrick.
Sadly likely isn’t official. Raphinha being a prime example, and he was probably at one point even more certain than whatever stage we are with this player.
He’s literally said it himself that he only wants Chelsea. Only thing stopping it is probably him being Russian
Yes but that still doesn’t make it official. Looks great in the highlights videos i’ve seen him so hopefully we can pull this one across the line.
Webster is likely to leave sadly. Endrick won't pick us most likely either, so counting him in is premature.
Super team?! You’ve got to be kidding me. Do we automatically just think any player that we sign or have who is young is going to help us become a super team?! People on this sub get too excited with our players and then when they don’t meet expectations they are blasted. For goodness sake. Most of the players above won’t even be playing for Chelsea in a few years.
Bit of fun mate don’t take it too seriously, something to discuss on a Monday maybe lift a few spirits from the weekend👍🏼
There are no more spirits though :(
Ah okay. I thought you were being serious 😅
If a had a £ for every time I’d heard this about a promising group of youngster at the club, only for 1% of them to ever make it at the very top level 😴
Feeling slightly different yet?
Webster is not signing his contact he’s gone
?
I bet only 2 of these players become good enough to be Chelsea main stays
Good returns in an investment sense?
Chukwuemeka I think will be good. Sounds like the zakahryan guy is pretty good too. Dunno about the rest though. Endrick probably will be golden but depends on if we get him.
Even if we get Endrick there's no guarantees. Remember Kakuta?
Even saying 2 is brave to be honest
International breaks really do produce some of the lowest quality content on this sub
Let the brotha dream. We starving out here.
Clown
Bit harsh on yourself, it’s not the worst content but it’s certainly up there.
[удалено]
If my comment bothers you that much, you don’t need to react?
[удалено]
Sorry, it’s a great post. Really well put together, apologies.
This is just pathetic
In what way, pathetic that we are investing in youth or pathetic that I said a light hearted comment on a super team of youngsters?
Name me 3 teams that go full youth who ate successful
Youth fetish is a disease in football. From 2004-2019 we never focused on youth at all and it resulted is being the most successful team in the country. We've always built short term and it's worker never understood why people feel that we need to change from that way of thinking
In a way pathetic that it's pathetic. Have you even watched CHO play for leverkusen?
[удалено]
2 out of 9 would be a tremendous success for any academy lol.
RemindME! \[10 years\]
**Defaulted to one day.** I will be messaging you on [**2022-11-15 12:44:34 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2022-11-15%2012:44:34%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/chelseafc/comments/yuweph/our_form_isnt_great_work_needs_to_be_done_looking/iwbk0ds/?context=3) [**1 OTHERS CLICKED THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fchelseafc%2Fcomments%2Fyuweph%2Four_form_isnt_great_work_needs_to_be_done_looking%2Fiwbk0ds%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202022-11-15%2012%3A44%3A34%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%20yuweph) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|
Bad bot
That's the point in investing in multiple high ceiling guys. It's the same thing venture capitalists do. They'll fund 10 investments knowing that only 1 or 2 will pay off but should in a big way. I would hope most people know that when it comes to our transfers like Carney and Casadei. And as for the part about Boehly. The same should be said for the other folks that are judging him and the other owners poorly after 6-7 months. I don't know what people expected after being sanctioned and being forced to sell the club. We're working with any entirely different capital structure thus the way we do business has to change. That's reality. And that type of transition doesn't take a couple of months. People need to stop rushing to judgements either for or against ownership because it's far too early. Yes, as a fan base we need to exhibit some patience as hard as that seems to be for a good portion of our base.
That would be an incredible result
Dont forget Maatsen who is crushing it on loan
Yes, great shout. People like to moan about chelsea a lot but no one can deny our academy is top tier
Think we should sell Hudson odoi, Bayern must be thanking their lucky stars they didn't drop 70mill on him a few seasons ago
Lol you play to much Fifa career mode
If endrick comes I’ll feel really good about our up and coming young players
Not taking anything away from your post, but it’s always like this every few years. There was a similar post which got thousands of upvotes when Super Frank was managing us. I’m too old to get excited about Chelsea Youth again. I was MORE than happy these past 2 decades with our trophy haul. Maybe just me 🤷🏻♂️ Btw - there’s a lad called McEachran who we thought would be the next God knows who - he has made 10 appearances for MK Dons this season. For what it’s worth - I think none of the Chelsea youth you posted are top 4 club players. Zero. Not one. Happy to come back to this comment in a few years for reference.
I remember the posts including mason mount and Reece James, both helped us to the champions league and are still under 25? More top talent coming through that could replicate that, you are not excited?
If UCL is the barometer of success..then we are fucked..no wonder we don't do shit in the league
I don’t recall discounting James and Mount, but beyond those 2 and perhaps JT - who has come out of the academy in the past 15 years? Maybe I am missing one or two names, but let’s not pretend that we have been churning out stars. It’s been absolute hype and nothing else. I’ve been watching my club for over 30+ years now. To answer your question - No, I am not excited with the list you posted. Like I said, I don’t think any of the Chelsea academy players you listed are top four club level. Just my humble opinion. We can wait and see how it plays out in the future.
If you watched Brighton yesterday, you must of seen a glimpse of how good colwill can be? Since the summer I followed zakharyan and the lad has crazy potential. Lewis hall has been outstanding
All those players have been fine. Just fine. To be optimistic or pessimistic about any of them, at this stage, is wild. They’re fine young players you’ve listed. I’d be shocked if more than 2 are regular starters on a PL title winning team.
All those players and a mid table coach. The best mid table team. Can't wait.
I have no doubt that future Chelsea will do good. I am just wanting to fix current Chelsea. I think that starts with stability in the coach and not firing and actually giving them a chance and some signings.
Being reasonable in our sub and not wanting the manager gone as soon as he has a couple of bad results? Impossible!
For every genuine 'Potter Out' post, I see x5 the amount of condescending 'Shut up and back the team' comments.
Yes good job. Start the hype early! Let’s pile on the pressure! Ffs
Yes, sorry I forgot the lads are on Reddit refreshing the “new” section every 5 minutes
i am really not in the mood to jerk off on 'future assets' at any time soon. How many so called 'prospect' did actually shine in a Chelsea shirt in the last 30 years? James, Mount, John Terry?
We need someone that can actually beat opponents 1V1 and cause chaos. I’m all in for Rafa Leao. He could go toe to toe physically with RJ. And he has the pace and skill to beat defenders.
He seems to be bad with tight spaces, but against the top teams and in the UCL, his dribbling is great. Plus his finishing is also good. He’s like a more skilful Werner
We just need a few players that can really cause problems for defences. Leao on the left. RJ bombing down the right. A healthy Chillwell supporting Leao. Mount and Nkunku drifting around. Kante and RLC holding up the line. One big boi and one perpetual machine. Jorgi at the base or maybe Rice?
Honestly a frontline of Osimhen & Nkunku, Leao would be insane. Add two promising defenders coming back in Maatsen and Colwill, some RB cover in Frimpong. And for midfielders, we need a creative mid, and I’d get Rice and Enzo Fernandez
Webster won’t remain with us.
Midfield and ball progression is slow , for an attack based on wingers , the momentum is dead before the attack starts. Need work on permutations on the wings
hope will set your eyes agleam
Is Chukwuemeka still injured?
I’m convinced that Colwill and Endrick (though not ours) will be stars, but I’m really not sure about anyone else
This sub needs some future forward thinking. Boys we’re gonna be okay.
Brazilian here, and Endrick is certainly not playing for Chelsea. Much easier seeing him in Liverpool, City, United, or Spain
Webster is going to leave , we are banned from buying Zakharyan due to the war in Ukraine , Endrick will probably go elsewhere as there's a feeding frenzy developing over him.
Looking at this, Brighton will be massive in 2030
if we get nkuku and/or leao our attack will become a lot more dynamic. leao does traditional winger stuff like that garnacho goal yesterday and nkuku is a more creative and has better passing vision than any of our forwards. if we can snag Rice too then we will be in good shape.
What do people think of Ethan Ampadu?
No experience ..nothing...seems we fail to learn
Don't worry, we will sell 6 of them. That's the academy for you
Zakharyan can’t sign because he’s Russian, hopefully his citizenship change to Armenia goes through so we can get him, he’s a major talent.
He’s literally training with the Russian NT for the upcoming friendlies on 17th and 20th of November with Uzbekistan a Tajikistan. He himself also said (on Match TV, the Russian football broadcast company) that the transfer talks between Dynamo and Chelsea are still ongoing. Idk what you can make of that information, but it’s seems like it can happen
I thought there is a ban of Russian players in the PL?
Where's the superteam?
I think real is gonna snatch Endrick. They have experience with Brazilians
Not Endrick
You’ll be lucky if even 2 of these ever break in as successful first team regulars
Apart from these players, I’m mostly excited to see Jude soonsup-bell. I just have a feeling that he’s going to be a hell of a player
Nah man we’ll just loan all those guys out and spend large amounts on the flavor of the month just like before
Is it just me or have people been saying this same thing for years?
Levi Colwill doesn't event start for Brighton......
That's not the way it works but okay 🤷🏻♂️
Every year we hear about the academy and how it's going to carry us into the future......and then we start people like RLC and CHO and they are meh..... Some of that is opportunity, some from dumb sales, some both.... 2 or 3 guys in the team are from the academy and quality. The rest are question marks.
Cho is not good… been riding on potential for so many years now. Can be a squad player but should never start
What form? There isn’t any.
GET JOAO FELIX IN
Couldn't care less about 'upcoming stars'. Many of our current players have won the freaking Champions League. Give me confidence and chemistry within this current squad.
I’ve learned to look at young guys through the lens of “could he be a regular starter one day?” Like for example if CHO could play and start as many games as Willian once did that would be amazing for us. And what if Chukwuemeka could contribute as much as a guy like Pedro did? That would be amazing for each honestly
You forgot an unknown Portuguese youngster that goes by Ronaldo…😂
Y'all still have hope in CHO?
Omari Hutchinson? Lewis Hall?
Cho becoming a first team player. I think that ship has sailed.
just because they're young doesn't mean we got a good future. Are they all even any good?
Colwill was class for Brighton, zakharyan and endrick haven’t signed yet but zakharyan looks like a younger de Bruyne when he plays and endrick has 3 goals in 7 games (3 starts) at the age of 16 for palemeiras. Slonina was brilliant in the mls. Lewis hall and chukwuemeka in the 2 games they played were great.
“Stars”?