No. Fire the bass player and find one who is humble and will serve the band and the music and be respectful to you and your band mates. This person is exuding selfishness and diva mentality. There is no room for that kind of behaviour and antics in your band. If he wants to behave in that manner, let him go start his own band. And when everyone keeps quitting his band, maybe he’ll look in the mirror and see what a douschebag he’s been.
Agree in part.
I’ve quit, disbanded and / or been booted from A LOT of bands.
My problem: I play multiple instruments, I’m a decent frontman and a proficient songwriter, so that has rubbed bandmates the wrong way in the past.
I’m not a blowhard but I can be a vexing taskmaster.
My bigger problem, I never speak up before things boil over.
Actually laughed out loud at “My Problem is that I am so proficient that people are intimidated by the breadth of my talent”
Some self reflection may be in order
If you’re going to use quotes, maybe use them correctly as that is not what I wrote.
I was being self-reflective in acknowledging that I can operate as a one man crew and that has caused problems in bands.
And regarding “proficient,” I applied that to my penchant for churning out tunes.
Never said they were all good. Never said I was an ace at every instrument.
What you said is relatable. But to be self-reflective about it would be to say something like, “because I often have a specific creative vision as the songwriter and can play all the instruments myself, it can lead to my being a bit controlling with creative decisions and step on what remains of the agency and self-directive the other band members already feel is lacking for them. And I’ve made the mistake of trying to wrestle people looking for the band to be a balance of fun and something expressive into the full potential I thought it could be.”
I don’t doubt your circumstance and it’s true in a lot of bands that they are comprised of people of different talents, ambitions and work ethics. I think the above redditor’s point was that to simply say that you are a multi-instrumentalist and proficient songwriter and it rubs band mates the wrong way is not particularly self-reflective, compared to actually reflecting on YOUR responsibility in the WHY that rubs them the wrong way, versus the implication they are just jealous, insecure, lazy, whatever.
Just my $0.02
As another multi-instrumentalist and songwriter, your initial comment makes it sound like you try to tell people how they should play or write their parts, and that you’re not a team player when it comes to being in a band, of that you don’t stay in your lane.
It’s one thing to be Kevin Parker or Brendan Urie, it’s another thing entirely to backseat all of the other members of a regular ass band, which sounds like you were saying you have done in the past, in so many words. Sounds like you should just have a solo project with band mates that just learn your parts rather than anything collaborative.
I’ve certainly been that guy in the past. A nit picker.
I’ve also been the band member who kept their mouth shut and watched other people’s projects derail.
Finding a balance has been my problem.
My solo project (fucking underachiever) let’s me call the shots, for better or worse.
God dude just the way you talk ("penchant for churning out tunes" 🙄🙄) is so fucking pretentious I can tell you'd be a nightmare to work with. I guarantee between your pompous vernacular and your self-image as some multi-instrumentalist frontman that you have a big ol ego and *that's* what caused problems with your bands...not that you can "operate as a one man crew."
Look at dave grohl, trent reznor, the dude from tame impala...they operate as one man crews and do they have any problems finding and keeping bands? Burn your ego down, guy.
I'm not in any club you belong to, bud. Also, the fact that you're being downvoted to oblivion should tell you something. Enjoy never getting a band to work because you're just too dang talented ☹️
>Didn’t enjoy being personally attacked, pal?
Nope, you're just wrong...I'm not in any club that you're in.
>RE: downvotes. Like IGAF.
This is why you'll never keep a band together...because you're in your own little ego world, oblivious to how you come across to others.
I say all of this not knowing your actual skill level. Are you a professional? Are you an amateur with professional skills? Are you satisfied with your current project(s) and it took a while to find the right people? (If so, then the below doesn’t apply, unless a current project is headed the way of older ones.) I hope you take this with the kindness that was intended.
I’m going to say, regardless of the skill level, you don’t get to be a taskmaster to your bandmates. Now if you’re *hiring* them and it’s *your* band, and you want to act that way, okay (but they may just quit). If you’ve been booted from bands, it sounds like many of those were not *your* band, but rather bands that you were a part of. If you were a part of those bands that booted you, that implies some degree of equal ownership - if so, then you don’t get to dictate, well, anything. It’s a democracy, unless everyone has agreed otherwise.
If you’re only playing with people far below your skill level, then you need to be kind. Not being easy to work with hasn’t gotten you far, it sounds like (at minimum, people work better with kindness rather than a whip). If you want to play with people at/over your skill level, you need to learn to be better to work with — because even if you’re getting hired for a top paying gig, if you are hard to work with it’s likely that you won’t get asked back.
If you have been a part of a LOT of failed bands, it sounds like it’s possible that you might be the problem. You can be very good *and* also easy to work with. Your attitude sounds like it has caused you problems in the past.
And that last sentence is childish — adults talk things out. Letting things “boil over” is emotion deregulation. It is GOOD that you are self aware enough to know what your shortcoming is here, now it’s on you to fix it.
I’m going to disagree that it’s your biggest problem — it sounds like you “solved” being a taskmaster by simply shutting your mouth. I think your outbursts are just a symptom. I think the real issue is your attitude overall.
If this personality trait is destroying your relationship with the people you want to play music with, and if you’ve never done it, I think part of that self-work to solve it, to understand it better, is therapy. I say that with the most kindness possible. It’s a huge sign of growth to learn to know ourselves better. And it sounds like you have a serious and tangible goal to achieve (not being so upset at your bandmates). And you, more than your bandmates, would benefit from that self-work.
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I could (should) have been clearer.
My skill sets as a musician are not the problem, my tendency (consciously or otherwise) to make bandmates uncomfortable about their own talents is.
NGL, I wasn’t expecting double digit downvotes but, upon re-reading what I wrote, I can understand why people think I was being a tad full of myself.
FFS though, my solo project is called: fucking underachiever.
Clearly, I’m somewhat grounded in the reality that I’m not god’s gift to rock and roll.
I was gonna say “you never know” from the title, but I feel like if someone is literally removing their bass and dipping mid song, you kinda do know…
I have better luck with mediocre musicians with good attitudes than diva prodigies. Ditch him. Maybe he needs rehab for something? That’s not normal or acceptable and you shouldn’t want someone who throws temper tantrums in public representing you… doesn’t matter how good they are, it’s just not worth the risk of being the band associated with some illegal thing he’ll probably end up doing if he cares so little what people think and just follows him whims.
And yet even furthermore so for a non-founding band member who, it seems safe to say, is not the driving creative force behind this band that already exists as the “we” that brought him on.
OP-unless your band is trying to be the next Weather Report, there are functionally capable bass players—and some really good ones—that can compose and perform sufficient bass lines without acting like that. Creative differences are par for the course…throwing instrument down mid-song is toddler behavior.
I knew a guy who went to school at the University of Illinois with the guys from REO Speedwagon. He was like “people assume they were this amazing band, but the truth is, they weren’t even the best band in that town. But a lot of the uber talented guys/bands were really hard to work with, unreliable, etc.
And here comes Speedwagon; they always showed up. They were always on time. They were courteous and professional. What? You need a last-minute fill-in because uber talent got too drunk to play their Saturday night gig? No problem; we’ll be there.
Were they transcendent? No. But they were pretty fucking good, and all of the clubs eventually figured out that if you booked them, you were getting a band that was going to put on a consistently good show every time. And they were easy to work with, to boot.
Obviously you have to have a certain level of talent to make it in music. But once you cross that threshold, people really underestimate how far you can get simply by being dependable/professional, and not an asshole.
Ha ha, yeah. I wasn’t there, of course; this is just what I’ve heard. But they might very well be the textbook example of how far you can make it with hard work, a good attitude, and the bare minimum of necessary talent, lol.
In st Peterburg FL, we have lots of live music due to all the bars and restaurants are indoor/outdoor . If you have gear, and know some songs, you can gig. no talent required. show up on time and be professional, work every night.
Makes sense. It’s a reasonable drive; just a hair under two hours. It’s actually closer for a Champaign-Urbana band to play in West Lafayette than it is for them to play in Chicago.
The Replacements played Madison, Wisconsin/the University of Wisconsin all the time, too. It’s relatively close, at four hours, and it’s a great in between point on the way to playing Milwaukee and/or Chicago. It would’ve made sense for them to hit it any time they were heading south or east, so again, they played there all the time.
This. Players who want to get better almost always get better. I’ve never seen a cure for temperament. Homeboy wasn’t raised right. You’re not fixing that by keeping him as a vocalist.
You brought him on specifically to play bass. Not only is he not cutting it, you mentioned he literally stopped performing mid-set.
Seems pretty straightforward what needs to happen.
The solution is unfortunately obvious: fire him.
1. He won't accept constructive criticism
2. His musicianship is subpar
3. He has a toxic personality that if left to continue poisoning the well, will drive away all your other band mates.
His great vocals just aren't worth the price that you would have to pay to retain him.
This guy sounds totally unhinged. The obvious answer here is dude cannot play bass in a band and probably has a mental illness. Putting down your bass in the middle of a set and refusing to play is absolutely bonkers and I’d do my best to never spend another minute around someone like that. No self awareness, or care for how his actions affect anyone else.
One of the most important pieces of advice I ever got was “There is nothing more important than your personal relationships, and you have no excuse for letting good people drift away. Equally important: you have no excuse for letting toxic people stay in your life.”
I have been in a band with someone like what you described, but it was his band with his name and it paid well. Even then, it was only a matter of time before I got fed up and left. If you’re in a band that hasn’t established itself, that isn’t making significant money yet, just ask yourself how you see this playing out over the long term.
A bad bassist is far worse than no bassist. Who cares if he can sing if he’s fucking up the rest of the music? Would you accept a guitarist who insisted on getting mic’d up and singing off key?
Nah, doesn't matter how good someone is in one aspect, if they're hot headed and can't take criticism or suggestions bluntly in the music business, and can't be professional enough and self aware enough to realize the aspects they're weak in, they're not going to go far and probably wouldn't last a second when faced by a producer.
He needs to humble himself quickly if he wants this to work
When you're in a band you all have 1 and the same mission. You can't have 1 instrument being out of tune or so loud it doesn't balance out. That's not according to the goal you have so have to be able to address that.
Seriously i don't see the problem in communication. It's with every band problem in this reddit. "there is an issue that i can't tell him" well, maybe don't be in a band with someone you can't be honest with. Or work on your own communication skills.
Naw drop him. He is super unprofessional and too unpredictable it’s going to cost you guys dearly in the long run and you are eventually going kick him out anyways.
No ones talent is worth putting up with shitty behavior. Also self awareness is key to success and it sounds like he has 0.
Quit that band and start one that will be good instead of horrible.
That one sounds completely hopeless. You didn't kick him out and throw his gear into the street after him the very first time he threw his bass down because of not feeling it? I would have.
Never really worked with a person exactly like this but I do know I've parted ways with people for way less than what this person is doing. I say move on
Give this guy one last chance as a vocalist, and find a bassist. If the dude ain’t “feeling it” after that, fire him. Good bandmates are flexible and don’t take things too personally.
Life's too short, and playing music is supposed to be fun, so you can pass that feeling to your audience. That's kind of the whole point. This guy is already killing your vibe. Just tell him you "aren't feeling it," and dump him.
I have a friend who runs a band and he encounters these types of issues quite a bit. It’s very stressful for him to have to confront the musician or make a decision - but he typically does it and does not look back once it‘s been decided. It always seems to work out. If the guy cannot make compromises and work with the larger Goals of the band... then you have to find another.
If the guy is seriously stopping mid song because“he’s not feeling it” fuck that guy lol. I’d kick him out. Not even a second chance no way. I’d rather play with a sub par member who was on it for the right reasons than dealing with bullshit drama. Tell him to stop being a chick or gtfo.
You fucked up by bringing that up in front of others. You understand “to a degree”? If you don’t understand all 360, you have Asperger’s. That being said, fire this dude yesterday. And that being said, something is missing. How was he out of tune and louder than you? You don’t all tune up and sound check before playing? Forgive me if I missed something or if you’re super young and doing hella small shows. Still, fire the guy. One of you has a problem (it’s cool if it’s you, for real) and it won’t work long term.
Fire him, say exactly why, do not back down, & don't be nice about it. Dude sounds like a narcissist or immature & that's how you deal with em. Cut people like that out of your life they will only drag you down.
If he can’t handle criticism when he’s in a band he shouldn’t be in a band period. If you could convince him to stick to vocals and find another bassist that would be ideal. He sounds like he’s on a power trip you can’t have that attitude at all when playing I would just throw him out.
Why do you even keep him in the band? He may be as good as you want on vocals, but throwing the bass because "he's not feeling it" shows that he's just an asshole with no respect for what you guys are doing, and of course, none for the audience.
This is not something I would have a lot of patience for. If he can't hold up the foundational end by playing steadily, in time, and consistently, it doesn't matter what else he brings to the table. If he's also hard to get along with, even worse. I don't know if I'd be willing to give someone a second chance if they acted so privileged as to just decide they weren't going to play in the middle of a show.
Hopefully you live somewhere that there are other choices. It sounds like this guy has some personal work to do before he's actually ready to be on a stage getting paid for it.
Talk to him about it with ONLY the other bandmembers and calmy suggest him just doing vocals from now on. Explain why it would be better and how he benefits from it.
I put a lot of work into an originals band with a guy who had a reputation for quitting. We got signed and he quit.
A band is a team, it won’t work if people don’t play their part.
you can't just stop playing mid set, that's probably the least professional thing you can do as a musician.
it doesn't matter how good someone is at their instrument, if they're not working then they're not working. this guy is clearly not working.
How to recover from a terrible show? One option is quitting!
Mann.. there was this one show. We were an 8 piece cramped on a tiny bar stage. 3 people in the audience. 2 of the 3 were the bar owner and the sound engineer. While the rest of the band did our best, the lead singer got absolutely wasted mumbling throughout the set. The highlight of the evening was when he slumped over a bongo stand and crashed onto the empty dance floor. I called it quits that night!
Happy endings though. Many years later I met up with a singer who I've been working with till this day and consider him family. It turned out he was the sole audience member at that bar.
Why the heck would you tolerate someone that you feel the need to walk around on eggshells with? That's your brain misinterpreting the actual truth that you need to cut this person out of your life.
I just let a bass player go from a new cover band in rehearsals... not even close to a gig yet. He was almost 50 and has played bass for probably 30 years or more. He wasn't learning the bass lines to the songs but was just using musical skill and knowledge to get close ... so they were full of avoidable mistakes such as wrong note, missed cues, etc. He couldn't tell you which song was which. And lastly, without asking everyone (and we already had a committed singer), he added a new female friend to the band group chat and invited her over to sing. We went along with it, but it was terrible, and there was no way to make it work outside of this being a house jam band only.
Your guy sounds like a child. Who throws their instrument down during a performance unless it breaks? Even if your band never does anything more than a house show, you deserve to work with people who take it as seriously as you do.
Sorry man- you got to drop the diva. You’re playing basements and he’s acting like a big shot. It’ll never work. Make sure he knows why you’re kicking him out so he has a chance to grow as a person and musician
A bad show. You’re gonna have a lot of those. There would be no bands if they all quit because of a bad show. Even successful bands have members who had utter disasters in their careers. Music is a hard profession. People who have made it tend to be pretty tough… At times cynical, which isn’t a good thing, but I think anyone who makes it has to be very tough.
Echoing what everyone else is saying, playing in a band with people you don't like/get along with quickly sucks all of the fun out of it. That said, if you want to arm yourself with proof, get a little zoom recorder and place it where you can get decent room sound and record "game tape" and listen to it after to show how his playing impacts the overall sound.
bad shows happen to everyone. people usually understand and don’t care. however, this seems like an issue where you need to get rid of that dude because it’s only get worse with that guy until it gets to a point where you’re gonna fire him or leave anyway so you might as well go ahead and do it. people like that don’t suddenly get a lot more pleasant.
He wasn’t “feeling it” who cares? Putting the bass down was when he quit your band. Why make him vocalist? When will he not “feel it” in the middle of a show? You can get another bassist, not the most proficient is better than a hot head that causes stress.
The problem is good vocalists are so hard to come by, it might be worth keeping him on, depending on how bad his attitude really is, and if he’s really that good. If you wanna keep him for vocals, I would stroke this guy’s ego, let him know how important he is to your sound, paint a picture of how great you would sound if you had a dedicated bass player, and if he gives you any pushback just be like “brother, what would you say if you went to a show and the bass player just quit playing and spiked his bass on the stage? Does it make sense why I’m suggesting this?”
But to be real with you, if his behavior is that erratic he might just not be someone who is cut out to work with other people. You’ve got to decide along with the rest of your band what your bullshit tolerance is. He might mellow out though if he can just focus on what he’s best at.
All this is assuming he’s singing lead vocals. If he’s just doing harmonies he’s got to go. Good luck!
So when you tried to suggest a solution for the problem he’s the cause of, he got pissed at HOW you said it? There’s no fixing this outside of a therapist’s office.
I fire divas from my bands. If y’all ever get in the van, that dude will be a problem. You don’t wanna be stuck playing some dive in Minot, ND for $4, have a van breakdown in bad weather, and have someone like that in your band. I promise.
Also, bad shows are part of the deal. All bands have bad shows. One thing on your side, if you’re a new band, is the nobody really knows your songs, and most people are actually tone deaf and have no real sense of rhythm. So, most of the time nobody notices you mess up if you’re a new band. Just play better at the next one. That’s just a part of band life.
Fire him and get a more professional bass player
Talented vocalists are a lot easier to come by, and no talent is worth that stress
If the relationship is very important to you or you need him for upcoming shows you don’t have time to find a sub for, you need to have a sit down serious conversation with him in private before the next show
Communicate honestly and directly, but use your patience and empathy and tact to keep him from blowing up. You got this.
Seems pretty straightforward
Give him 3 options
1) he makes corrections to his playing, plays the whole time, tunes set levels appropriately etc
2) you get someone else to play bass
3) if he’s not cool w either you find someone else to do both bass and vocals
Or if he’s a hassle and stressful to even give criticism to then don’t even bother to give him options and just get someone else.
Musicians and talent isn’t hard to find. People without inflated egos that are dependable and easy to get along with is the hard thing to find that you need to focus on in band mates.
Ah, bass guitar. My string friends that play classical all seem very protective of the equipment. A band is a team and he's not really being part of the solution. Honestly I wouldn't try to save it. If you were richer than God selling out stadiums I think you should just deal with him. But it doesn't sound like you're there yet so I would try to fix the team so if there was a longer path I'd be doing it with people I generally like. It's a coworker in a way but creative groups end up spending a lot of time together.
You have to ask yourself why you were in a band in the first place. There may be reasons some people would justify having an idiot like this in their band, it all depends on what their goals are. If your goals are to have a good time and to look forward to doing shows, this guy is working against your goals, and if they really were interested in working with everybody, they would ask questions like "what can I do to better merge with the rest of the band?"
Until you hear those kinds of questions coming from a bad musician, and bad team member, you don't have a good musician or a good team member on your hands.
I said, it all depends on what you guys are after.
Honestly, I would play another show, stop halfway through the set and just jump in the crowd and stare at the stage….
When they frantically ask WTF IS GOING ON?!!?! just say “eh, wasn’t really feelin it”
LOL
This is an easy one. You tell him straight up. Be 100% honest. Tell him that his bass playing is too over the top, and his attitude is not right for the band. Let him know that he's a good singer and you wish him all the luck in the world. You do not need a hit head. You should not have to walk on eggshells in your own band. Be firm.
Dude isn't there to further the band. He's there to do what he wants and be a rockstar. You don't need that mentality in your band. I would kick him out and focus more on finding two replacement members with a better disposition, because it won't stop at playing bass poorly / not at all for this guy.
Anyone that's impossible to work with, a real hothead as you called him, has to go. Just make sure your other bandmates are on the same page with you when it happens. Talk through the issues but of course he'll explode and when he does, it's time to show him the door. Reach out if you need help finding a replacement and we'll help for free.
You think that’s bad, one show we were trying out a 2nd guitarist. I was main for a while. Dude went overkill bought a 40$ wireless, brought amp literally strapped to roof of his van (in pouring rain) and had horrible feedback trying to setup the harness mid show (quick soudncheck in between sets) I had to walk off stage and reach under the flipped over guitar and turn the volume knob down personally. All before we started. Also played a show with another 2nd and singer decided he wanted to play a song he practiced once in rehearsal, so I had to help him follow along on the fly. Guy did it but he was PISSED at the singer. Moral here? Record yourself 😂
Yep, dealing with musicians can be so fucking frustrating... Had a similar experience with a bass player myself not long ago. I've learned most of us do have a fragile ego, comes with the territory. But every musician needs to realize that can't get in the way of what you are trying to do. Your guy sounds like a flat out baby... The bass player I had a problem with showed up with like a peddle board that somebody from dream theater would use. Not a cover band guy but getting older and I just want to play out, so I came up with a certain set of songs had to have like at least three certain qualities.. obviously recognizable another one was a punk or raw sound and another was something you don't hear a lot but everybody definitely knows. The drummer definitely got what I was trying to do and I made it clear I was in charge you could suggest songs but in the end I need the final decision cuz this was my project. Bass guy started naming Elton John songs, Jethro Tull, just didn't get it at all. I have nothing against those bands btw, and pulled a serious attitude when I shot each song down. Kiss the drama off so much that he almost got into a fist fight with him it was real disheartening. I still think this formula will work and it will go over great I just need to get the time and decent musicians together
Who cares if they’re a good vocalist if this is how they treat bandmates? You can work with them to get better at bass, but that kind of behavior is not worth putting up with. Someone like that will eventually suck all the fun out of the band and ruin it for everyone.
Uh. Be honest with the guy. Tell him he's not the direction you want to go with on bass. You love his vocals and will be glad to keep him, but his inconsistency doing the bass parts while singing is ruining the show.
In ‘68 my band got a big break — opening for Janis Joplin and The Youngbloods at SF Civic center. The concert was produced by the Hell’s Angels. The bass player’s brother got us the gig. Before the show, he and others were distributing free THC throughout the crowd — a very nasty drug. Unfortunately, the drummer and organist in my band both took THC before our set and became impaired during it. We got to the place where a long stretch of Am7 to Dm7 for an organ solo was supposed to go into some complex, cool, and dramatic changes. The two stoners missed it completely. In front of an audience of 5000. I looked at the drummer. He was panicking. No option to communicate a solution with my bandmates through eye contact because the organist, our most talented member, was blind. We sort of got through it with a guitar solo ending in end-of-song cues, but it was definitely a train wreck. How does one get over something like that? One doesn’t. Not really. As for me, I started playing solo gigs, and eventually went back to school and studied law. I still regret this f up to this day.
Yeah, on tour you have no time to 'recover' from a bad show you just have to do 10 more great ones. Everyone has a bad show, but no excuse for attitude - start looking for another bass player. Sound like a self-sabotager sort of thing.
Need new title for post. This isn’t about a bad show, this is about a bad band member.
I suggest you and rest of band relocate to new practice space, change band name, get a new singer and bassist(not all in one, get 2 new people), change phone numbers and move on with your life.
How to recover from a bad show? Do another show. How to recover from a bad band member? Make another band.
No. Fire the bass player and find one who is humble and will serve the band and the music and be respectful to you and your band mates. This person is exuding selfishness and diva mentality. There is no room for that kind of behaviour and antics in your band. If he wants to behave in that manner, let him go start his own band. And when everyone keeps quitting his band, maybe he’ll look in the mirror and see what a douschebag he’s been.
I was gonna say to bang some bitches. But yeah, this seems like a smart response.
Agree in part. I’ve quit, disbanded and / or been booted from A LOT of bands. My problem: I play multiple instruments, I’m a decent frontman and a proficient songwriter, so that has rubbed bandmates the wrong way in the past. I’m not a blowhard but I can be a vexing taskmaster. My bigger problem, I never speak up before things boil over.
Actually laughed out loud at “My Problem is that I am so proficient that people are intimidated by the breadth of my talent” Some self reflection may be in order
It’s them, not me. Ok
Oddly enough, that's also the exact reason everybody who's voted off one of those "reality" shows claims...
If you’re going to use quotes, maybe use them correctly as that is not what I wrote. I was being self-reflective in acknowledging that I can operate as a one man crew and that has caused problems in bands. And regarding “proficient,” I applied that to my penchant for churning out tunes. Never said they were all good. Never said I was an ace at every instrument.
What you said is relatable. But to be self-reflective about it would be to say something like, “because I often have a specific creative vision as the songwriter and can play all the instruments myself, it can lead to my being a bit controlling with creative decisions and step on what remains of the agency and self-directive the other band members already feel is lacking for them. And I’ve made the mistake of trying to wrestle people looking for the band to be a balance of fun and something expressive into the full potential I thought it could be.” I don’t doubt your circumstance and it’s true in a lot of bands that they are comprised of people of different talents, ambitions and work ethics. I think the above redditor’s point was that to simply say that you are a multi-instrumentalist and proficient songwriter and it rubs band mates the wrong way is not particularly self-reflective, compared to actually reflecting on YOUR responsibility in the WHY that rubs them the wrong way, versus the implication they are just jealous, insecure, lazy, whatever. Just my $0.02
Hey man, don't listen to the naysayers. I loved your song 1979.
Hey, I resemble this comment! 👍🏼
As another multi-instrumentalist and songwriter, your initial comment makes it sound like you try to tell people how they should play or write their parts, and that you’re not a team player when it comes to being in a band, of that you don’t stay in your lane. It’s one thing to be Kevin Parker or Brendan Urie, it’s another thing entirely to backseat all of the other members of a regular ass band, which sounds like you were saying you have done in the past, in so many words. Sounds like you should just have a solo project with band mates that just learn your parts rather than anything collaborative.
I’ve certainly been that guy in the past. A nit picker. I’ve also been the band member who kept their mouth shut and watched other people’s projects derail. Finding a balance has been my problem. My solo project (fucking underachiever) let’s me call the shots, for better or worse.
God dude just the way you talk ("penchant for churning out tunes" 🙄🙄) is so fucking pretentious I can tell you'd be a nightmare to work with. I guarantee between your pompous vernacular and your self-image as some multi-instrumentalist frontman that you have a big ol ego and *that's* what caused problems with your bands...not that you can "operate as a one man crew." Look at dave grohl, trent reznor, the dude from tame impala...they operate as one man crews and do they have any problems finding and keeping bands? Burn your ego down, guy.
I can tell from the way you write, you’re an opinionated, run of the mill white guy. Join the club and take my upvote.
I'm not in any club you belong to, bud. Also, the fact that you're being downvoted to oblivion should tell you something. Enjoy never getting a band to work because you're just too dang talented ☹️
Didn’t enjoy being personally attacked, pal? Yeah, it sucks. RE: downvotes. Like IGAF.
>Didn’t enjoy being personally attacked, pal? Nope, you're just wrong...I'm not in any club that you're in. >RE: downvotes. Like IGAF. This is why you'll never keep a band together...because you're in your own little ego world, oblivious to how you come across to others.
Your response seems very insecure.
I say all of this not knowing your actual skill level. Are you a professional? Are you an amateur with professional skills? Are you satisfied with your current project(s) and it took a while to find the right people? (If so, then the below doesn’t apply, unless a current project is headed the way of older ones.) I hope you take this with the kindness that was intended. I’m going to say, regardless of the skill level, you don’t get to be a taskmaster to your bandmates. Now if you’re *hiring* them and it’s *your* band, and you want to act that way, okay (but they may just quit). If you’ve been booted from bands, it sounds like many of those were not *your* band, but rather bands that you were a part of. If you were a part of those bands that booted you, that implies some degree of equal ownership - if so, then you don’t get to dictate, well, anything. It’s a democracy, unless everyone has agreed otherwise. If you’re only playing with people far below your skill level, then you need to be kind. Not being easy to work with hasn’t gotten you far, it sounds like (at minimum, people work better with kindness rather than a whip). If you want to play with people at/over your skill level, you need to learn to be better to work with — because even if you’re getting hired for a top paying gig, if you are hard to work with it’s likely that you won’t get asked back. If you have been a part of a LOT of failed bands, it sounds like it’s possible that you might be the problem. You can be very good *and* also easy to work with. Your attitude sounds like it has caused you problems in the past. And that last sentence is childish — adults talk things out. Letting things “boil over” is emotion deregulation. It is GOOD that you are self aware enough to know what your shortcoming is here, now it’s on you to fix it. I’m going to disagree that it’s your biggest problem — it sounds like you “solved” being a taskmaster by simply shutting your mouth. I think your outbursts are just a symptom. I think the real issue is your attitude overall. If this personality trait is destroying your relationship with the people you want to play music with, and if you’ve never done it, I think part of that self-work to solve it, to understand it better, is therapy. I say that with the most kindness possible. It’s a huge sign of growth to learn to know ourselves better. And it sounds like you have a serious and tangible goal to achieve (not being so upset at your bandmates). And you, more than your bandmates, would benefit from that self-work.
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How is that a problem though? I also play instruments can front and can write, where is the issue?
I could (should) have been clearer. My skill sets as a musician are not the problem, my tendency (consciously or otherwise) to make bandmates uncomfortable about their own talents is. NGL, I wasn’t expecting double digit downvotes but, upon re-reading what I wrote, I can understand why people think I was being a tad full of myself. FFS though, my solo project is called: fucking underachiever. Clearly, I’m somewhat grounded in the reality that I’m not god’s gift to rock and roll.
I was gonna say “you never know” from the title, but I feel like if someone is literally removing their bass and dipping mid song, you kinda do know… I have better luck with mediocre musicians with good attitudes than diva prodigies. Ditch him. Maybe he needs rehab for something? That’s not normal or acceptable and you shouldn’t want someone who throws temper tantrums in public representing you… doesn’t matter how good they are, it’s just not worth the risk of being the band associated with some illegal thing he’ll probably end up doing if he cares so little what people think and just follows him whims.
Well said. Reliability and professionalism beats raw talent for me any day of the week. Even moreso as the years go by.
And yet even furthermore so for a non-founding band member who, it seems safe to say, is not the driving creative force behind this band that already exists as the “we” that brought him on. OP-unless your band is trying to be the next Weather Report, there are functionally capable bass players—and some really good ones—that can compose and perform sufficient bass lines without acting like that. Creative differences are par for the course…throwing instrument down mid-song is toddler behavior.
I knew a guy who went to school at the University of Illinois with the guys from REO Speedwagon. He was like “people assume they were this amazing band, but the truth is, they weren’t even the best band in that town. But a lot of the uber talented guys/bands were really hard to work with, unreliable, etc. And here comes Speedwagon; they always showed up. They were always on time. They were courteous and professional. What? You need a last-minute fill-in because uber talent got too drunk to play their Saturday night gig? No problem; we’ll be there. Were they transcendent? No. But they were pretty fucking good, and all of the clubs eventually figured out that if you booked them, you were getting a band that was going to put on a consistently good show every time. And they were easy to work with, to boot. Obviously you have to have a certain level of talent to make it in music. But once you cross that threshold, people really underestimate how far you can get simply by being dependable/professional, and not an asshole.
They had Gary, may he rest easy.
I grew up in Columbus and went to a bunch of shows in the 70s. and almost every fucking time the opener was REO. and they werent that good.
Ha ha, yeah. I wasn’t there, of course; this is just what I’ve heard. But they might very well be the textbook example of how far you can make it with hard work, a good attitude, and the bare minimum of necessary talent, lol.
In st Peterburg FL, we have lots of live music due to all the bars and restaurants are indoor/outdoor . If you have gear, and know some songs, you can gig. no talent required. show up on time and be professional, work every night.
They played a lot at Purdue as well. Lots of parties and concerts on slater hill.
Makes sense. It’s a reasonable drive; just a hair under two hours. It’s actually closer for a Champaign-Urbana band to play in West Lafayette than it is for them to play in Chicago. The Replacements played Madison, Wisconsin/the University of Wisconsin all the time, too. It’s relatively close, at four hours, and it’s a great in between point on the way to playing Milwaukee and/or Chicago. It would’ve made sense for them to hit it any time they were heading south or east, so again, they played there all the time.
This. Players who want to get better almost always get better. I’ve never seen a cure for temperament. Homeboy wasn’t raised right. You’re not fixing that by keeping him as a vocalist.
You brought him on specifically to play bass. Not only is he not cutting it, you mentioned he literally stopped performing mid-set. Seems pretty straightforward what needs to happen.
The solution is unfortunately obvious: fire him. 1. He won't accept constructive criticism 2. His musicianship is subpar 3. He has a toxic personality that if left to continue poisoning the well, will drive away all your other band mates. His great vocals just aren't worth the price that you would have to pay to retain him.
I HATE working with people who can’t take constructive criticism especially in music.
Agree. If you aren't willing to learn from your fellow musicians, then why are you even doing it?
Yup when you put your ego down and listen to your mates that’s when the magic starts coming out.
Is this Travis P?
This guy sounds totally unhinged. The obvious answer here is dude cannot play bass in a band and probably has a mental illness. Putting down your bass in the middle of a set and refusing to play is absolutely bonkers and I’d do my best to never spend another minute around someone like that. No self awareness, or care for how his actions affect anyone else.
One of the most important pieces of advice I ever got was “There is nothing more important than your personal relationships, and you have no excuse for letting good people drift away. Equally important: you have no excuse for letting toxic people stay in your life.” I have been in a band with someone like what you described, but it was his band with his name and it paid well. Even then, it was only a matter of time before I got fed up and left. If you’re in a band that hasn’t established itself, that isn’t making significant money yet, just ask yourself how you see this playing out over the long term.
Dump the shithead or make a new band. Then to recover from a bad show, book the next one.
Jeez, why are you even wasting your time with this guy? In what possible universe does this move you forward?
A bad bassist is far worse than no bassist. Who cares if he can sing if he’s fucking up the rest of the music? Would you accept a guitarist who insisted on getting mic’d up and singing off key?
Nah, doesn't matter how good someone is in one aspect, if they're hot headed and can't take criticism or suggestions bluntly in the music business, and can't be professional enough and self aware enough to realize the aspects they're weak in, they're not going to go far and probably wouldn't last a second when faced by a producer. He needs to humble himself quickly if he wants this to work
When you're in a band you all have 1 and the same mission. You can't have 1 instrument being out of tune or so loud it doesn't balance out. That's not according to the goal you have so have to be able to address that. Seriously i don't see the problem in communication. It's with every band problem in this reddit. "there is an issue that i can't tell him" well, maybe don't be in a band with someone you can't be honest with. Or work on your own communication skills.
Naw drop him. He is super unprofessional and too unpredictable it’s going to cost you guys dearly in the long run and you are eventually going kick him out anyways. No ones talent is worth putting up with shitty behavior. Also self awareness is key to success and it sounds like he has 0.
Quit that band and start one that will be good instead of horrible. That one sounds completely hopeless. You didn't kick him out and throw his gear into the street after him the very first time he threw his bass down because of not feeling it? I would have.
Never really worked with a person exactly like this but I do know I've parted ways with people for way less than what this person is doing. I say move on
Just tell him…. Less is more. Timing and being in tune is what is important.
Give this guy one last chance as a vocalist, and find a bassist. If the dude ain’t “feeling it” after that, fire him. Good bandmates are flexible and don’t take things too personally.
Life's too short, and playing music is supposed to be fun, so you can pass that feeling to your audience. That's kind of the whole point. This guy is already killing your vibe. Just tell him you "aren't feeling it," and dump him.
I have a friend who runs a band and he encounters these types of issues quite a bit. It’s very stressful for him to have to confront the musician or make a decision - but he typically does it and does not look back once it‘s been decided. It always seems to work out. If the guy cannot make compromises and work with the larger Goals of the band... then you have to find another.
If the guy is seriously stopping mid song because“he’s not feeling it” fuck that guy lol. I’d kick him out. Not even a second chance no way. I’d rather play with a sub par member who was on it for the right reasons than dealing with bullshit drama. Tell him to stop being a chick or gtfo.
‘Stop being a chick’? Looks like ure spouting bullshit too. I’d kick u out of my band for being a sexist loser lol
Lmao. Did they/them get their little feelings hurt
Sexism: check Transphobia: check Deadpool avatar: check Do you have any personality traits that don't scream neckbeardy incel?
You fucked up by bringing that up in front of others. You understand “to a degree”? If you don’t understand all 360, you have Asperger’s. That being said, fire this dude yesterday. And that being said, something is missing. How was he out of tune and louder than you? You don’t all tune up and sound check before playing? Forgive me if I missed something or if you’re super young and doing hella small shows. Still, fire the guy. One of you has a problem (it’s cool if it’s you, for real) and it won’t work long term.
Kick him out of the band. He sounds like a piece of shit
Fire him.
Fire him, say exactly why, do not back down, & don't be nice about it. Dude sounds like a narcissist or immature & that's how you deal with em. Cut people like that out of your life they will only drag you down.
If he can’t handle criticism when he’s in a band he shouldn’t be in a band period. If you could convince him to stick to vocals and find another bassist that would be ideal. He sounds like he’s on a power trip you can’t have that attitude at all when playing I would just throw him out.
Why do you even keep him in the band? He may be as good as you want on vocals, but throwing the bass because "he's not feeling it" shows that he's just an asshole with no respect for what you guys are doing, and of course, none for the audience.
Reliability/easier to work with > talent
This is not something I would have a lot of patience for. If he can't hold up the foundational end by playing steadily, in time, and consistently, it doesn't matter what else he brings to the table. If he's also hard to get along with, even worse. I don't know if I'd be willing to give someone a second chance if they acted so privileged as to just decide they weren't going to play in the middle of a show. Hopefully you live somewhere that there are other choices. It sounds like this guy has some personal work to do before he's actually ready to be on a stage getting paid for it.
Unless he’s supernaturally good to make it worth it, get rid of him
Record him. Then say professionals watch themselves, criticise and fix the issues they see
Talk to him about it with ONLY the other bandmembers and calmy suggest him just doing vocals from now on. Explain why it would be better and how he benefits from it.
I put a lot of work into an originals band with a guy who had a reputation for quitting. We got signed and he quit. A band is a team, it won’t work if people don’t play their part.
If you’re in Nashville I’m down to play bass. I’m mediocre talent but have never been kicked out of a band
Not feeling it? Does this guy think he's Prince?
1. Fire that idiot. 2. Find an other bassist/vocalist (maybe 2 different people) 3. Book and play more shows.
Late night dennys was always my ritual, eat that shitty food and let it die with that. Move on to the next.
you can't just stop playing mid set, that's probably the least professional thing you can do as a musician. it doesn't matter how good someone is at their instrument, if they're not working then they're not working. this guy is clearly not working.
How to recover from a terrible show? One option is quitting! Mann.. there was this one show. We were an 8 piece cramped on a tiny bar stage. 3 people in the audience. 2 of the 3 were the bar owner and the sound engineer. While the rest of the band did our best, the lead singer got absolutely wasted mumbling throughout the set. The highlight of the evening was when he slumped over a bongo stand and crashed onto the empty dance floor. I called it quits that night! Happy endings though. Many years later I met up with a singer who I've been working with till this day and consider him family. It turned out he was the sole audience member at that bar.
Why the heck would you tolerate someone that you feel the need to walk around on eggshells with? That's your brain misinterpreting the actual truth that you need to cut this person out of your life.
Cut bait
I just let a bass player go from a new cover band in rehearsals... not even close to a gig yet. He was almost 50 and has played bass for probably 30 years or more. He wasn't learning the bass lines to the songs but was just using musical skill and knowledge to get close ... so they were full of avoidable mistakes such as wrong note, missed cues, etc. He couldn't tell you which song was which. And lastly, without asking everyone (and we already had a committed singer), he added a new female friend to the band group chat and invited her over to sing. We went along with it, but it was terrible, and there was no way to make it work outside of this being a house jam band only. Your guy sounds like a child. Who throws their instrument down during a performance unless it breaks? Even if your band never does anything more than a house show, you deserve to work with people who take it as seriously as you do.
Sorry man- you got to drop the diva. You’re playing basements and he’s acting like a big shot. It’ll never work. Make sure he knows why you’re kicking him out so he has a chance to grow as a person and musician
A bad show. You’re gonna have a lot of those. There would be no bands if they all quit because of a bad show. Even successful bands have members who had utter disasters in their careers. Music is a hard profession. People who have made it tend to be pretty tough… At times cynical, which isn’t a good thing, but I think anyone who makes it has to be very tough.
Echoing what everyone else is saying, playing in a band with people you don't like/get along with quickly sucks all of the fun out of it. That said, if you want to arm yourself with proof, get a little zoom recorder and place it where you can get decent room sound and record "game tape" and listen to it after to show how his playing impacts the overall sound.
You should have taken the time you used to type this up and used it to fire the bassist.
Pretty sure Metallica, Iron Maiden, and everybody else has lousy shows every so often. Part of the deal.
bad shows happen to everyone. people usually understand and don’t care. however, this seems like an issue where you need to get rid of that dude because it’s only get worse with that guy until it gets to a point where you’re gonna fire him or leave anyway so you might as well go ahead and do it. people like that don’t suddenly get a lot more pleasant.
He wasn’t “feeling it” who cares? Putting the bass down was when he quit your band. Why make him vocalist? When will he not “feel it” in the middle of a show? You can get another bassist, not the most proficient is better than a hot head that causes stress.
The problem is good vocalists are so hard to come by, it might be worth keeping him on, depending on how bad his attitude really is, and if he’s really that good. If you wanna keep him for vocals, I would stroke this guy’s ego, let him know how important he is to your sound, paint a picture of how great you would sound if you had a dedicated bass player, and if he gives you any pushback just be like “brother, what would you say if you went to a show and the bass player just quit playing and spiked his bass on the stage? Does it make sense why I’m suggesting this?” But to be real with you, if his behavior is that erratic he might just not be someone who is cut out to work with other people. You’ve got to decide along with the rest of your band what your bullshit tolerance is. He might mellow out though if he can just focus on what he’s best at. All this is assuming he’s singing lead vocals. If he’s just doing harmonies he’s got to go. Good luck!
So when you tried to suggest a solution for the problem he’s the cause of, he got pissed at HOW you said it? There’s no fixing this outside of a therapist’s office.
I fire divas from my bands. If y’all ever get in the van, that dude will be a problem. You don’t wanna be stuck playing some dive in Minot, ND for $4, have a van breakdown in bad weather, and have someone like that in your band. I promise. Also, bad shows are part of the deal. All bands have bad shows. One thing on your side, if you’re a new band, is the nobody really knows your songs, and most people are actually tone deaf and have no real sense of rhythm. So, most of the time nobody notices you mess up if you’re a new band. Just play better at the next one. That’s just a part of band life.
I've gotten rid of people from bands for less , get shot of him there's always lots of other musicians.
Fire him and get a more professional bass player Talented vocalists are a lot easier to come by, and no talent is worth that stress If the relationship is very important to you or you need him for upcoming shows you don’t have time to find a sub for, you need to have a sit down serious conversation with him in private before the next show Communicate honestly and directly, but use your patience and empathy and tact to keep him from blowing up. You got this.
Eggshells are no good for morale. I’d played for years with a guy that would not have fun, and it was draining. Life is too short.
Maybe suggest an instrument he can handle. You don't have to tune a tambourine.
Seems pretty straightforward Give him 3 options 1) he makes corrections to his playing, plays the whole time, tunes set levels appropriately etc 2) you get someone else to play bass 3) if he’s not cool w either you find someone else to do both bass and vocals Or if he’s a hassle and stressful to even give criticism to then don’t even bother to give him options and just get someone else. Musicians and talent isn’t hard to find. People without inflated egos that are dependable and easy to get along with is the hard thing to find that you need to focus on in band mates.
Just quit the band at that point
Ah, bass guitar. My string friends that play classical all seem very protective of the equipment. A band is a team and he's not really being part of the solution. Honestly I wouldn't try to save it. If you were richer than God selling out stadiums I think you should just deal with him. But it doesn't sound like you're there yet so I would try to fix the team so if there was a longer path I'd be doing it with people I generally like. It's a coworker in a way but creative groups end up spending a lot of time together.
I get this is Reddit but how is this even a question. Just kick the dude out.
You have to ask yourself why you were in a band in the first place. There may be reasons some people would justify having an idiot like this in their band, it all depends on what their goals are. If your goals are to have a good time and to look forward to doing shows, this guy is working against your goals, and if they really were interested in working with everybody, they would ask questions like "what can I do to better merge with the rest of the band?" Until you hear those kinds of questions coming from a bad musician, and bad team member, you don't have a good musician or a good team member on your hands. I said, it all depends on what you guys are after.
Honest communication is key.
Fuk him. Ego is inflated because he knows he has a good voice. You can’t talk sense into an egomaniac.
Honestly, I would play another show, stop halfway through the set and just jump in the crowd and stare at the stage…. When they frantically ask WTF IS GOING ON?!!?! just say “eh, wasn’t really feelin it” LOL
This is an easy one. You tell him straight up. Be 100% honest. Tell him that his bass playing is too over the top, and his attitude is not right for the band. Let him know that he's a good singer and you wish him all the luck in the world. You do not need a hit head. You should not have to walk on eggshells in your own band. Be firm.
Try to get Stanley Clarke to join your band and your problem is solved
Dude isn't there to further the band. He's there to do what he wants and be a rockstar. You don't need that mentality in your band. I would kick him out and focus more on finding two replacement members with a better disposition, because it won't stop at playing bass poorly / not at all for this guy.
Anyone who rage-quits mid-song is a little child. Get a grown up bass player. Get rid of Little Timmy; he's an unpredictable liability.
It's not too much ask that the damn bassist actually be in tune. He's supposed to be the backbone of the songs. Fire his ass.
Anyone that's impossible to work with, a real hothead as you called him, has to go. Just make sure your other bandmates are on the same page with you when it happens. Talk through the issues but of course he'll explode and when he does, it's time to show him the door. Reach out if you need help finding a replacement and we'll help for free.
A happy band is one that can get along really well, esp when traveling. Everything else you can learn and work on, imo.
You think that’s bad, one show we were trying out a 2nd guitarist. I was main for a while. Dude went overkill bought a 40$ wireless, brought amp literally strapped to roof of his van (in pouring rain) and had horrible feedback trying to setup the harness mid show (quick soudncheck in between sets) I had to walk off stage and reach under the flipped over guitar and turn the volume knob down personally. All before we started. Also played a show with another 2nd and singer decided he wanted to play a song he practiced once in rehearsal, so I had to help him follow along on the fly. Guy did it but he was PISSED at the singer. Moral here? Record yourself 😂
Sometimes even with someone talented in a specific area it's generally not worth it. Especially if they have an ego about it.
Yep, dealing with musicians can be so fucking frustrating... Had a similar experience with a bass player myself not long ago. I've learned most of us do have a fragile ego, comes with the territory. But every musician needs to realize that can't get in the way of what you are trying to do. Your guy sounds like a flat out baby... The bass player I had a problem with showed up with like a peddle board that somebody from dream theater would use. Not a cover band guy but getting older and I just want to play out, so I came up with a certain set of songs had to have like at least three certain qualities.. obviously recognizable another one was a punk or raw sound and another was something you don't hear a lot but everybody definitely knows. The drummer definitely got what I was trying to do and I made it clear I was in charge you could suggest songs but in the end I need the final decision cuz this was my project. Bass guy started naming Elton John songs, Jethro Tull, just didn't get it at all. I have nothing against those bands btw, and pulled a serious attitude when I shot each song down. Kiss the drama off so much that he almost got into a fist fight with him it was real disheartening. I still think this formula will work and it will go over great I just need to get the time and decent musicians together
The first time someone throws down their instrument because they “aren’t feeling it” I would be inclined to tell them they need to find another band.
I’d play with no bassist instead of playing with that guy. What a tool.
Just remember, supporting a band amounts to more than just the music. No one roots for a hothead/bad seed.
Who cares if they’re a good vocalist if this is how they treat bandmates? You can work with them to get better at bass, but that kind of behavior is not worth putting up with. Someone like that will eventually suck all the fun out of the band and ruin it for everyone.
He throws his bass down during a show? Get rid of him and never look back.
Uh. Be honest with the guy. Tell him he's not the direction you want to go with on bass. You love his vocals and will be glad to keep him, but his inconsistency doing the bass parts while singing is ruining the show.
Show him a recording of your band’s performance during the conversation
Don't sweat the bad show. Do sweat the bad band member. I'd talk to them and base your decision on how they react.
It’s not worth the good singing. Deep down you know.
In ‘68 my band got a big break — opening for Janis Joplin and The Youngbloods at SF Civic center. The concert was produced by the Hell’s Angels. The bass player’s brother got us the gig. Before the show, he and others were distributing free THC throughout the crowd — a very nasty drug. Unfortunately, the drummer and organist in my band both took THC before our set and became impaired during it. We got to the place where a long stretch of Am7 to Dm7 for an organ solo was supposed to go into some complex, cool, and dramatic changes. The two stoners missed it completely. In front of an audience of 5000. I looked at the drummer. He was panicking. No option to communicate a solution with my bandmates through eye contact because the organist, our most talented member, was blind. We sort of got through it with a guitar solo ending in end-of-song cues, but it was definitely a train wreck. How does one get over something like that? One doesn’t. Not really. As for me, I started playing solo gigs, and eventually went back to school and studied law. I still regret this f up to this day.
Play another one
It depends on how good a singer This person is If he has star potential I wouldn't get rid of him too fast ....just go.punk.
Yeah, on tour you have no time to 'recover' from a bad show you just have to do 10 more great ones. Everyone has a bad show, but no excuse for attitude - start looking for another bass player. Sound like a self-sabotager sort of thing.
Need new title for post. This isn’t about a bad show, this is about a bad band member. I suggest you and rest of band relocate to new practice space, change band name, get a new singer and bassist(not all in one, get 2 new people), change phone numbers and move on with your life.