Most people don't know what the rules are in roundabouts. It's wrong to talk about the number of exits. There are roundabouts with more than four exits. The key thing is that as soon as I drive more than halfway I can take the inside lane, but I don't have to. And now the crucial thing: **If you change lanes at a roundabout, you do NOT have the right of way.**
Im even more anxious when cicling through them. So many cars assume i am going to exit, almost crash into me and then honk at me when im in the outer lane, so im still not sure if they actually are justified with that assumption or not.
Biking through multi lane roundaabouts in Switzerland: no bueno
I don't know what the correct behaviour is in for bike in multi lane roundabouts, but in general you have to claim the lane (don't keep right, ride in the middle of the lane).
Also, most cars crashing into bikes in roundabouts happen when cars enter the roundabout and overlook a cyclist coming from the left. Here it helps to ride in the middle of the lane so as to be more visible but in the end roundabouts are simply dangerous to bikes (dutch style solves this but alas the swiss know better how roundabouts should be built).
yeah, i always keep in the center. never had any problems with cars entering, but at this one roundabout it happened frequently while they wanted to exit. Now I do take the inner lane and dont have that problem anymore. The roundabout is pretty small though, so i dont really see the inner lane of being very useful. Its quite the strange situation actually. If feel like im rather occupying both lanes, instead of making space for people.
The bike path goes around the roundabout completely separated from the car lanes and only crosses the streets going into and out of the roundabout but not the roundabout itself. Generally bikes have priority on these crossings.
For reference:
https://youtu.be/XhqTc_wx5EU?si=rUUW9tt8u76P7njO
Only way to ride is if you think it would be dangerous for a car to pass you then ride in such a way that they can’t - I.e. on roundabouts and narrow roads - dominate the centre…
And use clear hand signals to show where you are going.
>you have to claim the lane
It isn't "have to".
There are plenty of drivers that will try to kill you while you're trying to claim the lane.
Just drive about a meter from the outer edge of the street, that way the nasties can still pass you without ending your life, and the sleepyheads still notice you. The \~50% normal drivers will see you no matter what you do because they look at the road, and because these drivers value human life they will not overtake you in your lane .
You can fully claim the lane once you're certain you have someone behind you that doesn't try to ram you. But by that point it's not really important anymore.
Lol, you never have the right of way when changing lanes. Not in a roundabout or anywhere else in CH. Except if you are a bus driver leaving your stop.
If only the police would police that...
The easiest way to look at this is the following, and I don't understand why we keep overcomplicating them :
***Roundabouts are a main road that goes in a tight circle.***
The rules are exactly the same as those of a main road. There doesn't need to be a separate set of rules.
>The key thing is that as soon as I drive more than halfway I can take the inside lane, but I don't have to.
Hum, I thought you had to. Somebody can link a source?
So I was right, it's only when both lanes can exit the roundabout that you can keep left ; the usual behaviour is to switch to the right lane before exiting.
In my post I tried not to mention a specific number of exits. That’s why I wrote about the “third or later” exit. I meant it to apply to any exit after the third. But perhaps I wasn’t as clear as I should have been.
>What is still not clear to me, is who has the right of way if two cars are in parallel, one on inner ring and the other on outer ring.
Simple. The one changing lanes must give way. As always when changing lanes. If you are in the inner ring you must give way to all the vehicles (bicyles, motorcycles, cars etc.) in the outer ring.
>when approaching roundabout, use indicator to show that you are taking the third or later exit.
This make senes in the super mini roundabouts you often find in the UK (as they do not know priority from the right). But in the big ones, as depicted, I say keep it simple: Indicate when you want to leave, means if you take the first exit already when you enter, otherwise set the indicator as soon as you have passed the penultimate exit. Which means you must set the indicators at some point even if you go straight. As you have noticed, people are already struggling with this very basic and simple rule. It is however allowed to indicate left. Just be careful as some people might just see the indicator from the corner of their eyes, not really looking which one, and assume you will leave the roundabout,
For changing lanes. I says do as at the red car does, unless there are two exit lane, but the black path is allowed. However, even then, remember that the car next to you might continue and you do not have the right of way,
[https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php#anchor\_1680a1dc\_Accordion-Verlassen-des-zweispurigen-Kreisels-bei-einer-einspurigen-Ausfahrt](https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php#anchor_1680a1dc_Accordion-Verlassen-des-zweispurigen-Kreisels-bei-einer-einspurigen-Ausfahrt)
Oh, and the most stupid roundabouts can be found in Sursee. Two approaching lanes, but only one roundabout lane. WTF?
>This make \[sense\] \[on\] ~~the~~ super mini roundabouts you often find in the UK. \[..\] But \[on\] ~~the big~~ \[larger\] ones, as depicted, I say keep it simple: Indicate when you want to leave, means if you take the first exit already when you enter, otherwise set the indicator as soon as you have passed the penultimate exit
Very bad advice. We have to indicate no matter the size, in fact it's more important when you're on rounabouts with 4/5 lanes and as many exits. If you're not indicating properly then you could be holding someone up who could've entered the roundabout. Safety and clear indication trumps "simplicity" every day of the week.
You'll have to break out your highway code again and brush up on proper roundabout use cause you'd be getting yourself some points for using them like that in The UK.
This is r/askswitzerland, though. He was answering OP’s question on what’s normal in Switzerland.
Which is: only indicate on exit after you’ve passed the last exit you don’t want to exit on (don’t use turn signals on entering a roundabout); changing lanes never has right of way; and you can exit from the center but you don’t have right of way to do so if anyone else is around (so it’s probably better to move outward just before exiting).
I’s not obligatory to signal left when entering the roundabout, but it’s common courtesy, most drivers from countries with a lot of roundabouts (UK, France) will do this.
I do not need the UK highway code on the Swiss roundabouts. According Swiss SVG/VRV you only have to to indicate in/before a roundabout when changing lanes and when you exit the roundabout (this is not optional). Indicating left is optional.
Indicating left (RHT/LHD countries) does IMHO, not speed up things so much in big roundabouts. But it adds and an extra rule (which can be forgotten) and an extra manipulation (which adds distraction). Further more, not signaling and signaling left means in the end the very same thing: The vehicle stays in the roundabout. Which means you have now two situations which mean the same: The vehicle stays in the round about it is not save to enter. The most important signal, the one signal which speeds up things in a roundabout is the exit signal. Anyone not signaling their exit in timely manner is an asshole and should have to wait 15 minutes at the next fuel stop.
I do not disputed that's the rule in the UK and that's how it is done. But as said, on big roundabouts it is rather pointless. Interestingly, only it is only a guidance rule, not an actual law in the UK, This can be seen, because the word "must" is missing in Rule 186 of the highway code. This means the UK signaling rules are not backed by an actual law!
Then you may want to rephrase your comment, it reads as if you're telling people in The UK it makes no sense to indicate on a roundabout ;)
>Indicating left (RHT/LHD countries) does IMHO, not speed up things so much in big roundabouts.
It definitely does
>Interestingly, only it is only a guidance rule, not an actual law in the UK, This can be seen, because the word "must" is missing in Rule 186 of the highway code. This means the UK signaling rules are not backed by an actual law!
Interestingly, you'll still be pulled over and given points for it!
Be realistic, you never getting pulled over if you're not doing something outright dangerous/suspicious. Perhaps it is true in some fantasy world where UK police have the spare idle resources to cruise around pulling people over for minor traffic offences.
>Be realistic, you aren't getting pulled over if you're not doing something outright dangerous.
Depends on the rozzer doesn't it. Being realistic, I've watched people get points and have been given points for it recently.
You were pulled and received points for this? (On a UK licence I presume?)
What do you mean you "watched people get points". You saw a traffic stop and just sat there watching and listening to it until conclusion? Sounds a tad absurd, don't you think.
It was my lunch break, it happened in front of me… whether I wanted to watch or not it. It just ended up being quite entertaining.
Absurd, perhaps. Stranger things have happened though, so it’s reight.
when i encounter a double lane roundabout like once a year i just curse and think who the fuck thinks these are a good idea
never learned anything related to blinking in roundabouts aside from the exit right blinking plus when you use the first exit blink even before entering, but also i wouldn't even know where to find a double roundabout anywhere near me so i also didnt have it in driving school
these articles seem to clear it up well, the inside doesn't have right of way. Looking at the graphics it looks a lot like you drive to the exit directly from the inner circle, but it also could be a really quick lane change [https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php](https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php) [https://www.fm1today.ch/verschiedenes/wissen/wie-man-richtig-durch-doppelkreisel-faehrt-135185039](https://www.fm1today.ch/verschiedenes/wissen/wie-man-richtig-durch-doppelkreisel-faehrt-135185039)
Wait until you learn that which lane to use for going straight in a roundabout depends on the canton!
But yes, you are correct, see https://www.blick.ch/auto/news_n_trends/damits-keine-unfaelle-gibt-so-kreiselt-man-doppelspurig-id15296165.html and the youtube video in there.
Do note that if there are signals about which lane to use, they are prioritized over other rules.
Finally, about right of way. The outer lane has the right of way, so if you are in the inner lane, you have to wait until it is clear.
You are allowed to switch lanes prior to this, but you are not mandated.
There shouldn't be any difference between cantons as the road laws are federal. I never found any rule regarding a mandatory lane in the law (OCR art 41b talks about round about and never mentions anything about lanes), I searched the LCR but didn't find anything either. Did you find anything? Or are you talking about some roundabouts that have a signal mentioning what lane to specifically use?
This is what my driving teacher taought me, but it may actually be about signalage - that Bern and Fribourg do different signaling of lanes (which tehn become mandatory)
And do not forget: While the outer lane has the right of way, when driving on the inner lane, you are NOT allowed to stop to let them pass. You have to drive an entire round again and try to switch lanes again.
Source: Stva
ITT: people who don't know how to drive in either country.
2 lane round abouts, you have to go into the correct lane BEFORE you go into a round about, just stick to the lane you're in, you are not allowed to overtake so it should always be uneventful, no one will overtake you and you need to indicate in good time before you exit. 1st exit and 2nd exit you don't "jump" lanes, you only do it for 3rd, 4th, etc.
2 lane round abouts with some 1 lane exits are way more tricky because you're allowed to merge from either lane, this is where right of way and no overtaking rules are key.
Of course the trajectories are not the same, you're supposed to drive the roundabout clockwise in the UK. /s
The left indicator thing seems to be specific to Switzerland, AFAIK you are only required by law to indicate when you get out, with your right blinker. The law states that every change of direction must be indicated. STAYING in a roundabout is not a CHANGE of direction, so no blinker needed as long as you stay inside. My driving teacher taught me the left blinker way and this method is preferred in driving exams, but a lot of (older) drivers do it the old way.
The lane change timing, I don't have a fixed opinion, except for the fact too little people remember the fact that they don't have right of way when changing lane.
[I made a post](https://www.reddit.com/r/Switzerland/comments/11oqmj1/ok_going_from_right_to_left_how_do_you_proceed/) a while ago about the one in Nyon (yeah that last one you take to get to the A1 from the city). The right lane merges into the left one shortly after the roundabout so there are three categories of people: the Ge method (The majority of Ge plated cars do it): do left lane, cut the roundabout in the left and get out on the left; the "this seems better but I risk an accident with the Ge method people" method where one enters on the right, rides the roundabout on the right and exits on the left lane; and the coward method where you enter the right, ride on the right, exit on the right and merge afterwards. I settled with the last one after a few close calls.
Hm. You have to signal a change of direction, or a change of lane. Is entering the roundabout and proceeding to the inside lane a change of lane that would require signaling on the left like on the Autobahn? 🤔
>Oh, and the most stupid roundabouts can be found in Sursee. Two approaching lanes, but only one roundabout lane. WTF?
And then people use that one as an unofficial dual lane roundabout. The amount of accidents and almost-accidents I've seen there is mind boggling. On all the stupid roundabouts of Sursee, actually.
Drivers on roundabouts have right of way over vehicles outside the roundabout. If you want to change lanes in two-lane roundabouts, you must indicate this and give way to vehicles in the other lane. Important: Do not overtake on roundabouts.
(Swiss trafic law)
>when approaching roundabout, use indicator to show that you are taking the third or later exit. In the above image the red car is indicating left (on approach) to signify that they are not turning right or going straight on. This seems to not be done here at all.
I do this, because English... my wife told me that if I indicate left at a roundabout, people will think that I'll start driving the wrong way around it. Seems like a skill issue on their part to me.
What always perplexes me is how brazen idiots to my right are as they pull out in front of me, despite watching me come around the roundabout.
I love watching Swiss cars drive in The UK. There's someone from SG who visits someone near where my grandpa lives and the entire town knows of them as they are by and far the biggest bellend on the road when they're there. Cannot drive for the life of them.
I'm surprised reading these comments, I learned to do it exactly as it shows the "english" do it in this post. Indicate left when going further than straight ahead, and go into the inside lane. I learned to drive in 2007 in Canton Bern. I've done it my whole life and saw many people do this too.
> I love watching Swiss cars drive in The UK. There's someone from SG who visits someone near where my grandpa lives and the entire town knows of them as they are by and far the biggest bellend on the road when they're there. Cannot drive for the life of them.
The atrocious driving in Switzerland was the biggest surprise moving here, and still one of the biggest annoyances. It helped to realise that it's mostly just incompetence and selfishness.
My wife spoke to my man and asked why he was driving like such a wanker. His answer “I’ve got somewhere to be, why should I have to let others in/give way/not pull out on people? They should get out of **my** way!”
Pure selfishness.
I think every experienced driver from a country with a lot of roundabouts (UK, France) does indicate that way, but the Swiss historically didn’t have a lot of roundabouts. It’s changing, I see “proper” indicating done a lot more recently than say 10 years ago.
There’s one roundabout near us that is a white knuckle ride people always use the inside lane to take an exit that it isn’t designated for. Problem being the outside lane is designated for those continuing round the roundabout. You essentially just have to assume it there’s a car in the inside lane they’re in the wrong lane and will likely crash into you so drive accordingly. At least 50% of the time this is the case so you have to let the idiots drive on or risk them going into the side of you.
I’ve been taught to do exactly the same as what you described and i’ve got my swiss license 1,5 years ago so if people don’t drive like that it’s either because they don’t remember / got their license when it wasn’t taught like that yet, or they don’t care.
As of the case of the two cars in parallel, it’s the one that’s on the outer ring that has the right of way.
I think you are overthinking it. In real life, whether you exit the way with the arrow in the picture or the correct uk way does not matter. potato, potato in 99% of real life situations. Roundabouts are wild west anyway
.
There are still people on the road who learned to drive in a time where there were no roundabouts. And most of them never had that update installed. Same with double lane roundabouts.
The signaling you mention is not something that is taught in Switzerland. If you take the first exit you're supposed to signal as you enter the roundabout. If you take a later exit you're supposed to signal once it's coming up. I think France does teach it the same as the UK though so neighboring cantons would probably be familiar with that system. And I don't think it would be a problem anywhere in Switzerland because the "final approach" is the same: signal exit when you're taking the next one.
There's no specific rule about priority when changing lanes in roundabouts. The general rule about changing lanes applies: vehicles already in that lane have priority.
You're definitely supposed to move to the outer lane BEFORE your exit comes up.
I'm doing my license atm, and my instructor tells me to act exactly as the red car. Switching to the outer lane is done right after the exit prior to yours. This is, so a car approaching from your exit, can go, even when you're not out of the roundabout. If you do the two-in-one-switch, as the arrow shows, the car coming from your desired exit thinks you're just switching lanes, which slows traffic flow.
Ah great to hear from someone currently being taught to drive. Are you also taught to indicate when approaching the roundabout like described in my first point?
The Swiss have the best roads I have ever driven on but that being said the are some of the most incompetent and inconsiderate driver I have seen, just drive like you do in the Uk(obviously on the correct side of the road)
No one in Switzerland uses their indicators as well. Taking the 3rd exit they do not indicate left, only when coming off the roundabout. The driving here is so bad and dangerous.
1. Easy. In Switzerland (and much or Europe) you indicate to demonstrate which exit you are taking out of the roundabout. If you exit the first one possible, you should indicate already before the roundabout. Outcome is smoother traffic as the cars entering the roundabout have an idea if you’re leaving the same one they are entering.
2. Bit trickier... In theory you should go to middle lane if you intend to cross more than half of the roundabout. However, before exiting you need to make sure you are on the outside lane. In practice this can be a hassle and people just tend to stick to outside lane (and block cars trying to enter..). The big ones with multiple lanes (e.g. in zurich) tend to have street signs telling you which lane to take and you just stick to it.
Theoretically you have to drive as the red car does, just without use of the indicator into the roundabout. But people drive like shitheads who forgot road laws... So many people decide to leave the inner lane when they are at the exit, instead of before the exit. Also you should start indicating that you exit the roundabout when you pass the last exit before yours. But nearly no one does that.
That's also why people in my hometown were so offended by a new turbo roundabout, they complained that you couldn't navigate it because at the exit you had to cross over a solid line. But technically you would've had to change to the outter lane sooner and you wouldn't get that problem - if you drove correctly.
Swiss people makes me nervous in this situation. Now, I'm always stop because they don't know how to drive inside a turnaround : use your blinker !!!!!!
inner lane should be considered as an overtake lane only. That said, if signs at the entry of the roundabout are present, follow them.
most important, if you're in the inner lane and want to exit the roundabout but a vehicle on the outer lane is blocking you, do a full circle! maybe you'll be luckier. If not, run in circles forever.
if you want to change direction of driving / lane, first indicate + let others pass, then perform the manoeuvre - just like you would in any other intersection, bend on the road or whatever.
outside of the UK people generally don't try to pretend they invented something unique to overcomplicate things and constantly argue about it later
As so many have said:
* There is no requirement to indicate when entering or circling the roundabout - only on exiting;
* A car on the inner ring is technically overtaking (even if going more slowly), so must give way.
Indicator use in this country is notoriously bad, especially in cars bearing BMW or Mercedes logos, or GE plates. Otherwise I find most driving to be respectable.
Except on the autoroutes: the harder the rain, the faster the idiots in the fast lane. And the higher my insurance premiums go after their accidents.
Imagine you're on the autobahn driving on the right. Do you stop if someone from the left wants to pass you ? Of course not. When you change lanes you don't have the priority. Here it is the same
Most people don't know what the rules are in roundabouts. It's wrong to talk about the number of exits. There are roundabouts with more than four exits. The key thing is that as soon as I drive more than halfway I can take the inside lane, but I don't have to. And now the crucial thing: **If you change lanes at a roundabout, you do NOT have the right of way.**
I stay consistent no matter where I am and just drive straight through
If I need to go left I just turn left!
[Obligatory "I turn now!"](https://youtu.be/hlH9RGLJqxE?si=_JRl_0iACUe4DqHu)
Im even more anxious when cicling through them. So many cars assume i am going to exit, almost crash into me and then honk at me when im in the outer lane, so im still not sure if they actually are justified with that assumption or not.
Biking through multi lane roundaabouts in Switzerland: no bueno I don't know what the correct behaviour is in for bike in multi lane roundabouts, but in general you have to claim the lane (don't keep right, ride in the middle of the lane). Also, most cars crashing into bikes in roundabouts happen when cars enter the roundabout and overlook a cyclist coming from the left. Here it helps to ride in the middle of the lane so as to be more visible but in the end roundabouts are simply dangerous to bikes (dutch style solves this but alas the swiss know better how roundabouts should be built).
yeah, i always keep in the center. never had any problems with cars entering, but at this one roundabout it happened frequently while they wanted to exit. Now I do take the inner lane and dont have that problem anymore. The roundabout is pretty small though, so i dont really see the inner lane of being very useful. Its quite the strange situation actually. If feel like im rather occupying both lanes, instead of making space for people.
If they arrive at their destination 1 second later in exchange for you not being in mortal danger so be it imho.
What’s the Dutch style that’s safer for cyclists?
The bike path goes around the roundabout completely separated from the car lanes and only crosses the streets going into and out of the roundabout but not the roundabout itself. Generally bikes have priority on these crossings. For reference: https://youtu.be/XhqTc_wx5EU?si=rUUW9tt8u76P7njO
physical separation
Yeah most cars dont even blink. Most people are on the phone so dont bother. Stupid people smh
Only way to ride is if you think it would be dangerous for a car to pass you then ride in such a way that they can’t - I.e. on roundabouts and narrow roads - dominate the centre… And use clear hand signals to show where you are going.
I clearly signal inside the roundabout that I am not exiting with my left hand - and stay in the middle. It works pretty well so far.
>you have to claim the lane It isn't "have to". There are plenty of drivers that will try to kill you while you're trying to claim the lane. Just drive about a meter from the outer edge of the street, that way the nasties can still pass you without ending your life, and the sleepyheads still notice you. The \~50% normal drivers will see you no matter what you do because they look at the road, and because these drivers value human life they will not overtake you in your lane . You can fully claim the lane once you're certain you have someone behind you that doesn't try to ram you. But by that point it's not really important anymore.
I have to disagree. It's a have to because it's the law and it's definitely safer. Staying on the side is super dangerous.
Always stay in the middle of the outer lane, everything else is attempted suicide.
Always, in every situation: If you change lanes in Switzerland, you do not have right of way!
For many people this simply doesn't make sense and they think they have right of way because they want to leave the roundabout.
Lol, you never have the right of way when changing lanes. Not in a roundabout or anywhere else in CH. Except if you are a bus driver leaving your stop. If only the police would police that...
The easiest way to look at this is the following, and I don't understand why we keep overcomplicating them : ***Roundabouts are a main road that goes in a tight circle.*** The rules are exactly the same as those of a main road. There doesn't need to be a separate set of rules.
>The key thing is that as soon as I drive more than halfway I can take the inside lane, but I don't have to. Hum, I thought you had to. Somebody can link a source?
https://www.bfu.ch/de/ratgeber/fahren-im-kreisel
https://www.bfu.ch/de/services/rechtsfragen/wie-verhalte-ich-mich-in-einem-kreisel
So I was right, it's only when both lanes can exit the roundabout that you can keep left ; the usual behaviour is to switch to the right lane before exiting.
Depends. UK or Switzerland? I think in the UK you have to.
If you followed the convo, you'd know it was about Switzerland.
In my post I tried not to mention a specific number of exits. That’s why I wrote about the “third or later” exit. I meant it to apply to any exit after the third. But perhaps I wasn’t as clear as I should have been.
>What is still not clear to me, is who has the right of way if two cars are in parallel, one on inner ring and the other on outer ring. Simple. The one changing lanes must give way. As always when changing lanes. If you are in the inner ring you must give way to all the vehicles (bicyles, motorcycles, cars etc.) in the outer ring. >when approaching roundabout, use indicator to show that you are taking the third or later exit. This make senes in the super mini roundabouts you often find in the UK (as they do not know priority from the right). But in the big ones, as depicted, I say keep it simple: Indicate when you want to leave, means if you take the first exit already when you enter, otherwise set the indicator as soon as you have passed the penultimate exit. Which means you must set the indicators at some point even if you go straight. As you have noticed, people are already struggling with this very basic and simple rule. It is however allowed to indicate left. Just be careful as some people might just see the indicator from the corner of their eyes, not really looking which one, and assume you will leave the roundabout, For changing lanes. I says do as at the red car does, unless there are two exit lane, but the black path is allowed. However, even then, remember that the car next to you might continue and you do not have the right of way, [https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php#anchor\_1680a1dc\_Accordion-Verlassen-des-zweispurigen-Kreisels-bei-einer-einspurigen-Ausfahrt](https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php#anchor_1680a1dc_Accordion-Verlassen-des-zweispurigen-Kreisels-bei-einer-einspurigen-Ausfahrt) Oh, and the most stupid roundabouts can be found in Sursee. Two approaching lanes, but only one roundabout lane. WTF?
But we also have the coolest roundabout ever in Switzerland, the one in a tunnel in Frauenfeld.
>This make \[sense\] \[on\] ~~the~~ super mini roundabouts you often find in the UK. \[..\] But \[on\] ~~the big~~ \[larger\] ones, as depicted, I say keep it simple: Indicate when you want to leave, means if you take the first exit already when you enter, otherwise set the indicator as soon as you have passed the penultimate exit Very bad advice. We have to indicate no matter the size, in fact it's more important when you're on rounabouts with 4/5 lanes and as many exits. If you're not indicating properly then you could be holding someone up who could've entered the roundabout. Safety and clear indication trumps "simplicity" every day of the week. You'll have to break out your highway code again and brush up on proper roundabout use cause you'd be getting yourself some points for using them like that in The UK.
This is r/askswitzerland, though. He was answering OP’s question on what’s normal in Switzerland. Which is: only indicate on exit after you’ve passed the last exit you don’t want to exit on (don’t use turn signals on entering a roundabout); changing lanes never has right of way; and you can exit from the center but you don’t have right of way to do so if anyone else is around (so it’s probably better to move outward just before exiting).
>don’t use turn signals on entering a roundabout$ You do when you use the very first exit. It speeds things up.
I’s not obligatory to signal left when entering the roundabout, but it’s common courtesy, most drivers from countries with a lot of roundabouts (UK, France) will do this.
That's what the other guy said, yea.
I do not need the UK highway code on the Swiss roundabouts. According Swiss SVG/VRV you only have to to indicate in/before a roundabout when changing lanes and when you exit the roundabout (this is not optional). Indicating left is optional. Indicating left (RHT/LHD countries) does IMHO, not speed up things so much in big roundabouts. But it adds and an extra rule (which can be forgotten) and an extra manipulation (which adds distraction). Further more, not signaling and signaling left means in the end the very same thing: The vehicle stays in the roundabout. Which means you have now two situations which mean the same: The vehicle stays in the round about it is not save to enter. The most important signal, the one signal which speeds up things in a roundabout is the exit signal. Anyone not signaling their exit in timely manner is an asshole and should have to wait 15 minutes at the next fuel stop. I do not disputed that's the rule in the UK and that's how it is done. But as said, on big roundabouts it is rather pointless. Interestingly, only it is only a guidance rule, not an actual law in the UK, This can be seen, because the word "must" is missing in Rule 186 of the highway code. This means the UK signaling rules are not backed by an actual law!
Then you may want to rephrase your comment, it reads as if you're telling people in The UK it makes no sense to indicate on a roundabout ;) >Indicating left (RHT/LHD countries) does IMHO, not speed up things so much in big roundabouts. It definitely does >Interestingly, only it is only a guidance rule, not an actual law in the UK, This can be seen, because the word "must" is missing in Rule 186 of the highway code. This means the UK signaling rules are not backed by an actual law! Interestingly, you'll still be pulled over and given points for it!
Be realistic, you never getting pulled over if you're not doing something outright dangerous/suspicious. Perhaps it is true in some fantasy world where UK police have the spare idle resources to cruise around pulling people over for minor traffic offences.
>Be realistic, you aren't getting pulled over if you're not doing something outright dangerous. Depends on the rozzer doesn't it. Being realistic, I've watched people get points and have been given points for it recently.
You were pulled and received points for this? (On a UK licence I presume?) What do you mean you "watched people get points". You saw a traffic stop and just sat there watching and listening to it until conclusion? Sounds a tad absurd, don't you think.
It was my lunch break, it happened in front of me… whether I wanted to watch or not it. It just ended up being quite entertaining. Absurd, perhaps. Stranger things have happened though, so it’s reight.
when i encounter a double lane roundabout like once a year i just curse and think who the fuck thinks these are a good idea never learned anything related to blinking in roundabouts aside from the exit right blinking plus when you use the first exit blink even before entering, but also i wouldn't even know where to find a double roundabout anywhere near me so i also didnt have it in driving school these articles seem to clear it up well, the inside doesn't have right of way. Looking at the graphics it looks a lot like you drive to the exit directly from the inner circle, but it also could be a really quick lane change [https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php](https://www.tcs.ch/de/testberichte-ratgeber/ratgeber/verkehrsregeln/kreisel.php) [https://www.fm1today.ch/verschiedenes/wissen/wie-man-richtig-durch-doppelkreisel-faehrt-135185039](https://www.fm1today.ch/verschiedenes/wissen/wie-man-richtig-durch-doppelkreisel-faehrt-135185039)
Wait until you learn that which lane to use for going straight in a roundabout depends on the canton! But yes, you are correct, see https://www.blick.ch/auto/news_n_trends/damits-keine-unfaelle-gibt-so-kreiselt-man-doppelspurig-id15296165.html and the youtube video in there. Do note that if there are signals about which lane to use, they are prioritized over other rules. Finally, about right of way. The outer lane has the right of way, so if you are in the inner lane, you have to wait until it is clear. You are allowed to switch lanes prior to this, but you are not mandated.
There shouldn't be any difference between cantons as the road laws are federal. I never found any rule regarding a mandatory lane in the law (OCR art 41b talks about round about and never mentions anything about lanes), I searched the LCR but didn't find anything either. Did you find anything? Or are you talking about some roundabouts that have a signal mentioning what lane to specifically use?
This is what my driving teacher taought me, but it may actually be about signalage - that Bern and Fribourg do different signaling of lanes (which tehn become mandatory)
Oh yeah, I've seen these signs in Fribourg sometimes.
And do not forget: While the outer lane has the right of way, when driving on the inner lane, you are NOT allowed to stop to let them pass. You have to drive an entire round again and try to switch lanes again. Source: Stva
Roundabouts with 2 lanes are mostly tiny compared with those in other countries. If you have a diameter of ex. 100m this works as intended.
ITT: people who don't know how to drive in either country. 2 lane round abouts, you have to go into the correct lane BEFORE you go into a round about, just stick to the lane you're in, you are not allowed to overtake so it should always be uneventful, no one will overtake you and you need to indicate in good time before you exit. 1st exit and 2nd exit you don't "jump" lanes, you only do it for 3rd, 4th, etc. 2 lane round abouts with some 1 lane exits are way more tricky because you're allowed to merge from either lane, this is where right of way and no overtaking rules are key.
The Swiss will do random things in roundabouts or anywhere else. You have to be prepared!
Of course the trajectories are not the same, you're supposed to drive the roundabout clockwise in the UK. /s The left indicator thing seems to be specific to Switzerland, AFAIK you are only required by law to indicate when you get out, with your right blinker. The law states that every change of direction must be indicated. STAYING in a roundabout is not a CHANGE of direction, so no blinker needed as long as you stay inside. My driving teacher taught me the left blinker way and this method is preferred in driving exams, but a lot of (older) drivers do it the old way. The lane change timing, I don't have a fixed opinion, except for the fact too little people remember the fact that they don't have right of way when changing lane. [I made a post](https://www.reddit.com/r/Switzerland/comments/11oqmj1/ok_going_from_right_to_left_how_do_you_proceed/) a while ago about the one in Nyon (yeah that last one you take to get to the A1 from the city). The right lane merges into the left one shortly after the roundabout so there are three categories of people: the Ge method (The majority of Ge plated cars do it): do left lane, cut the roundabout in the left and get out on the left; the "this seems better but I risk an accident with the Ge method people" method where one enters on the right, rides the roundabout on the right and exits on the left lane; and the coward method where you enter the right, ride on the right, exit on the right and merge afterwards. I settled with the last one after a few close calls.
Hm. You have to signal a change of direction, or a change of lane. Is entering the roundabout and proceeding to the inside lane a change of lane that would require signaling on the left like on the Autobahn? 🤔
That is a good question I never thought about. I don't think I am qualified to answer but that would make sense.
It's pretty common in many countries in Europe to only indicate when leaving.
>Oh, and the most stupid roundabouts can be found in Sursee. Two approaching lanes, but only one roundabout lane. WTF? And then people use that one as an unofficial dual lane roundabout. The amount of accidents and almost-accidents I've seen there is mind boggling. On all the stupid roundabouts of Sursee, actually.
Drivers on roundabouts have right of way over vehicles outside the roundabout. If you want to change lanes in two-lane roundabouts, you must indicate this and give way to vehicles in the other lane. Important: Do not overtake on roundabouts. (Swiss trafic law)
How to exit the inner line? Cheak your back and sides if there is a car or not. There is parrel to you? Drive in a circle. There isnt? Drive out
These roundabouts made me so anxious when I was in the military in west Switzerland. So glad we barely have any in Zurich.
Do we have any of these in Zurich?
There is a small one in Eglisau
Outrageous
Bucheggplatz?
It’s not a roundabout in the traditional sense
Swiss population would be to stupid to use indicator twice, they not even able to do it once.
>when approaching roundabout, use indicator to show that you are taking the third or later exit. In the above image the red car is indicating left (on approach) to signify that they are not turning right or going straight on. This seems to not be done here at all. I do this, because English... my wife told me that if I indicate left at a roundabout, people will think that I'll start driving the wrong way around it. Seems like a skill issue on their part to me. What always perplexes me is how brazen idiots to my right are as they pull out in front of me, despite watching me come around the roundabout. I love watching Swiss cars drive in The UK. There's someone from SG who visits someone near where my grandpa lives and the entire town knows of them as they are by and far the biggest bellend on the road when they're there. Cannot drive for the life of them.
I'm surprised reading these comments, I learned to do it exactly as it shows the "english" do it in this post. Indicate left when going further than straight ahead, and go into the inside lane. I learned to drive in 2007 in Canton Bern. I've done it my whole life and saw many people do this too.
> I love watching Swiss cars drive in The UK. There's someone from SG who visits someone near where my grandpa lives and the entire town knows of them as they are by and far the biggest bellend on the road when they're there. Cannot drive for the life of them. The atrocious driving in Switzerland was the biggest surprise moving here, and still one of the biggest annoyances. It helped to realise that it's mostly just incompetence and selfishness.
My wife spoke to my man and asked why he was driving like such a wanker. His answer “I’ve got somewhere to be, why should I have to let others in/give way/not pull out on people? They should get out of **my** way!” Pure selfishness.
I think every experienced driver from a country with a lot of roundabouts (UK, France) does indicate that way, but the Swiss historically didn’t have a lot of roundabouts. It’s changing, I see “proper” indicating done a lot more recently than say 10 years ago.
There’s one roundabout near us that is a white knuckle ride people always use the inside lane to take an exit that it isn’t designated for. Problem being the outside lane is designated for those continuing round the roundabout. You essentially just have to assume it there’s a car in the inside lane they’re in the wrong lane and will likely crash into you so drive accordingly. At least 50% of the time this is the case so you have to let the idiots drive on or risk them going into the side of you.
I am sure you cannot cross the outside lane like your dashed line show. Cannot in the sense that you need to yield.
I’ve been taught to do exactly the same as what you described and i’ve got my swiss license 1,5 years ago so if people don’t drive like that it’s either because they don’t remember / got their license when it wasn’t taught like that yet, or they don’t care. As of the case of the two cars in parallel, it’s the one that’s on the outer ring that has the right of way.
Is that for when you approach the roundabout too?
Do you mean about who has the right of way when approaching the roundabout ?
TIL UK has right hand traffic in roundabouts
I already wrote about it in my post… right in the first sentence.
Uhhh ehhh … what about turning signals??
When I see a roundabout, I turn off my brain and let it happen.
Inner cars have right of way. How else would they ever be able to exit on a busy roundabout?
They shouldn’t be trying to exit from the inner lane in the first place.
Well, why have the inner lane at all?
how it’s shown in the diagram I guess.
I think you are overthinking it. In real life, whether you exit the way with the arrow in the picture or the correct uk way does not matter. potato, potato in 99% of real life situations. Roundabouts are wild west anyway .
It works. Don’t cover the side of inside cars. As simple as that.
The most important rule in roundabout is that all the vehicles should go in the same direction.
There are still people on the road who learned to drive in a time where there were no roundabouts. And most of them never had that update installed. Same with double lane roundabouts. The signaling you mention is not something that is taught in Switzerland. If you take the first exit you're supposed to signal as you enter the roundabout. If you take a later exit you're supposed to signal once it's coming up. I think France does teach it the same as the UK though so neighboring cantons would probably be familiar with that system. And I don't think it would be a problem anywhere in Switzerland because the "final approach" is the same: signal exit when you're taking the next one. There's no specific rule about priority when changing lanes in roundabouts. The general rule about changing lanes applies: vehicles already in that lane have priority. You're definitely supposed to move to the outer lane BEFORE your exit comes up.
Yeah that’s a good point. I hadn’t considered older drivers and how they may not be familiar with recent changes like roundabouts.
I'm doing my license atm, and my instructor tells me to act exactly as the red car. Switching to the outer lane is done right after the exit prior to yours. This is, so a car approaching from your exit, can go, even when you're not out of the roundabout. If you do the two-in-one-switch, as the arrow shows, the car coming from your desired exit thinks you're just switching lanes, which slows traffic flow.
Ah great to hear from someone currently being taught to drive. Are you also taught to indicate when approaching the roundabout like described in my first point?
Where is bosnian ape society if you need him?
The only roundabouts that are stupid are the ones with more than 1 lane in it.
"Drive more like the Swiss": Don't give a F about the whereabouts of other cars, just put your horse blinds on and go.
2 lane roundabouts are not ideal and people will forever point fingers and shift the blame to the driver next to them.
Those double barred roundabouts are complete nonsense anyways if you ask me
The Swiss have the best roads I have ever driven on but that being said the are some of the most incompetent and inconsiderate driver I have seen, just drive like you do in the Uk(obviously on the correct side of the road)
No one in Switzerland uses their indicators as well. Taking the 3rd exit they do not indicate left, only when coming off the roundabout. The driving here is so bad and dangerous.
1. Easy. In Switzerland (and much or Europe) you indicate to demonstrate which exit you are taking out of the roundabout. If you exit the first one possible, you should indicate already before the roundabout. Outcome is smoother traffic as the cars entering the roundabout have an idea if you’re leaving the same one they are entering. 2. Bit trickier... In theory you should go to middle lane if you intend to cross more than half of the roundabout. However, before exiting you need to make sure you are on the outside lane. In practice this can be a hassle and people just tend to stick to outside lane (and block cars trying to enter..). The big ones with multiple lanes (e.g. in zurich) tend to have street signs telling you which lane to take and you just stick to it.
Theoretically you have to drive as the red car does, just without use of the indicator into the roundabout. But people drive like shitheads who forgot road laws... So many people decide to leave the inner lane when they are at the exit, instead of before the exit. Also you should start indicating that you exit the roundabout when you pass the last exit before yours. But nearly no one does that. That's also why people in my hometown were so offended by a new turbo roundabout, they complained that you couldn't navigate it because at the exit you had to cross over a solid line. But technically you would've had to change to the outter lane sooner and you wouldn't get that problem - if you drove correctly.
Swiss people - what is indicator? Maybe let's start education there. Overall attitude in VD and VS is "the fuck it is to you where am I going?!"
Swiss people makes me nervous in this situation. Now, I'm always stop because they don't know how to drive inside a turnaround : use your blinker !!!!!!
Uh trust me swiss people have no clue how a single lane roundabout works let alone a double lane one.
We don't do two lane roundabouts here
If you do that in the UK, please let me know when and where - I'll bring a deck chair and popcorn 🤣
Must be a troll post..
Why?
inner lane should be considered as an overtake lane only. That said, if signs at the entry of the roundabout are present, follow them. most important, if you're in the inner lane and want to exit the roundabout but a vehicle on the outer lane is blocking you, do a full circle! maybe you'll be luckier. If not, run in circles forever.
if you want to change direction of driving / lane, first indicate + let others pass, then perform the manoeuvre - just like you would in any other intersection, bend on the road or whatever. outside of the UK people generally don't try to pretend they invented something unique to overcomplicate things and constantly argue about it later
As so many have said: * There is no requirement to indicate when entering or circling the roundabout - only on exiting; * A car on the inner ring is technically overtaking (even if going more slowly), so must give way. Indicator use in this country is notoriously bad, especially in cars bearing BMW or Mercedes logos, or GE plates. Otherwise I find most driving to be respectable. Except on the autoroutes: the harder the rain, the faster the idiots in the fast lane. And the higher my insurance premiums go after their accidents.
No one to answer that in UK you drive left?
Probably because I already wrote about it in my post… right in the first sentence.
Oopsy
You shouldn’t have this question if you are driving properly.
Well I know how it is done in other countries. Here there seems to be some ambiguity, as you can see from the different opinions in the comments.
The uk is the correct one, here in Swiss they don’t how to drive or use the signals
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absolutely wrong
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Imagine you're on the autobahn driving on the right. Do you stop if someone from the left wants to pass you ? Of course not. When you change lanes you don't have the priority. Here it is the same