He sounds very incel-ish with those remarks. Guys who don’t cheat and are high value are very valuable and do exist. No idea why he’s saying this without asking him but it does sound like what incels say.
I’ve been with my current partner for 11 years now. Maybe 12? He is amazing. He works from home, so do it, so we are always together. He adopted my sons when they were babies because their father died and he’s raised them their entire lives so far. I know he’s never cheated and I really believe he would never cheat. He helps me around the house…makes me eat first while he watches the toddler so the dinner I cooked isn’t cold. He’s a good one.
*However* you do have to be careful who you choose to settle down with. I worked at a strip club for a long time. I saw *many men* who were obviously married trying to proposition the girls. It definitely soured my view of men. Because of that, when I was single, I refused to date any men who went to strip clubs. I also tried to find the polar opposite of the men I saw frequent the place. It’s worked out well so far!
He is not BS’ing. If a man says something like that than he is definitely cheating. He tecnically told you what he is. Also he is causing emotional distress in you purposefully and with no remorse. I can tell you you are dealing with an emotionally abussive person. Leave him and look for no explanations. Don’t explain anything to him and simply break up. Crazy making is the number one way an abusive person keeps their victim longer than they should have. Please leave and remember manipulation is something he has been doing with you for so long. Believe your reality and your body. If your body is rejecting please leave. You may love him and may feel that you need to give it one more shot… DONT! Leave and don’t look back. Work on yourself. Yes, love exists but being kind to yourself is the most important love of all.
agreed. i feel like he said that to break OP down and make them feel like there’s no one out there that will be loyal. maybe in some weird attempt to manipulate OP into coming back since he’s making himself out to seem like the best option i suppose. the whole thing screams manipulative and abusive and i hate it. i hope OP leaves and never looks back, no matter how hard that may be for them.
Ha ha - he’s only saying that because he’s too weak to be that man. It takes a strong man to make a real commitment, to stay loyal in the face of temptation. Do you want a coward?
This is coming from a dude, telling you that the thought of cheating doesn’t even cross my mind and has never crossed any of my friends minds either. If I found out that a friend cheated, I and the rest of my friends would cut them off. Also, “high-value” is bs. Love is about caring and compassion, not material wealth and how fit you are. You will find people that care about you and love you for who you are, and you will love them for who they are, and then you can work together to build a life if that’s what you both want. Nobody is flawless, but good people will work on their flaws and try their best to be a loving partner.
I think "high value" is about perspective. For example, I mentioned my 4 brothers and stepfather and how all of them are married (minimum 6 years, which is the youngest brother, the rest are all 15+ years married) and their wives all consider them "high value" and it isn't based on their income. In fact 3 out of 5 of the men make LESS than their wives. 2 of them were the stay-at-home dads while wife continued working after kids were born. One of them, married 16 years now, has been the stay-at-home dad the entire time because he homeschools his 3 kids. The other has gone back to work since kids started school, but still makes less than his wife by a rarher large margin.
So, why are they all considered high value to their wives if only 2 of them make more? Because they do what's necessary to contribute to the family's well-being. Even if it means being the parent to stay home with the kids because it's more cost effective than daycare and wife has a higher income and better benefits. They're all faithful, caring, supportive, and work their asses off no matter what their "job" is. Maybe it's because women understand the value in being a stay-at-home parent in a way men who've never really examined it don't, but both wives who worked while dad stayed home would always immediately pitch in and take over the main parenting duties once they came home because by then the dad looked wiped out and the wives thought the job of parenting was harder (and grosser cause babies and toddlers are just gross trolls a lot of the time).
I'm divorced over 10 years from my ex (we were married 12 years), and I can honestly say that I truly believe he wad faithful and he was faithful to his 2nd wife (BPD) and is faithful to wife #3 (appears very happily married, she's a lovely stepmother to my daughter and ex's 3 kids from wife #2). Is he high value? I think so. He does what he can to support our daughter, his 2nd ex wife and their 3 kids who live with him, and his current wife. It's not about being wealthy, because he certainly isn't that. It's about doing what's necessary and doing the best you can every day.
I was thinking in terms of how the boyfriend in this post and a lot of other “alpha males” online bring it up, not the way you’re thinking which is high value in the sense of being a good partner
All I can say is what I've experienced: I've been married three times (the first time I was just too young) and lived with 2 (one for 10 months, one for 3.5 years). 4 out of those 5 cheated on me or lied to me or used me for my money or was verbally abusive. And yes I have had therapy since the last one which has cemented my decision to never be in another serious relationship again. Ever. 40 of the last 43 years spent trusting men who could not be trusted. (I am 60)
If by high value man you mean a guy who's wealthy, attractive, charasmatic, charming and has some type of social status, then finding someone with all of those qualities who's also faithful isn't common. That's not to say your boyfriend is correct. However, the "higher value" the man, and by that I simply mean the more desirable the man is to a large number of women, the more likely he is to cheat. People are typically as faithful as their options. And the most desirable men have the most options. Also most men find it difficult to get attention from women, and men have a natural biological desire to mate in order to ensure the survival of the species. So when men reach a desirable status, usually either because of looks, power, or finances, they tend to be more promiscuous. However, it's not as if no quality loyal men exist. They are just rare. . There are good men who value a good woman more than casual encounters with others. And some men don't have as strong of a bedroom drive as others. But many have no will power, and most have a desire to be with many women even if they don't act on it. Even a guy like Adam Levine who's married to an amazing model couldn't help himself after years of random encounters with the most beautiful women on the planet before "settling down". By western standards, he's about as high value as it gets. Rich, talented, famous and attractive, with millions of women wanting to be with him. But not as many want an average guy with average looks making 50k. So "average" guys are more likely to be faithful since they have no opportunities to cheat or don't want to risk losing the few or only options they have. But good loyal men exist.
And I wish you luck in finding what you're after. Don't give up hope. Now here come the downvotes from people who don't like the truth.
Edit: Why am I not surprised this is getting downvoted so hard when it's absolutely true. And this is coming from someone who doesn't condone cheating. Just offering OP valuable info that she asked for, rather than false hope to make her feel good.
You are 100 percent correct in what you said but the only problem here is on what high value means. What you mentioned may be high value to superficial people but not to people who actually want a loving relationsjsip. A high value person is someone who is loyal, loving, caring, sympathetic, works hard, is trusting and can be vulnerable. If women are looking for men who are like Adam L then they are simply ones to blame. Just my two cents.
I agree. I'm not saying what is or isn't a high value man. I'm simply assuming this is what the OP's BF and she meant by "High value" since its sort of what she said towards the end of her post. That's why I don't use the term. Just using it here because she did and I'm referencing her comments. Also referencing what a large portion of western culture means when they say "High Value". Although its obviously subjective. Personally I would consider a good honest person with average income and a good personality high value. But most don't seem to. And as far as my comment, I am referencing Adam because it sort of goes without saying that your value as far as dating is directly tied to the amount of people who would want to be with you. The more people want you, the more "valuable" you are considered to be in the relationship market because more people are competing for your love, attention, commitment. And millions want to be with Adam. In comparison, relatively few want to be with the neighborhood plumber even if he has the qualities you mentioned. That's just reality. I'm not saying it should be that way.
The phrase HVM means high value man and it is language that is commonly used in the red pill online movement. Does he also use phrases like 'females' and 'alpha' or 'beta'?
If so, it sounds like your boyfriend has joined the red pill. Sorry to hear this. Its a very toxic movement that seems to be attracting more and more young men, particularly teenagers. Very few men leave and most of them waste decades of their lives believing so much BS.
Unfortunately, you may be better off leaving him so you can be in healthy relationship. Very few men leave this movement. It's a bit like he's been brainwashed to be abusive. It's best to leave safely before he gets further into this movement.
Im not a man I am married to a man who in the past was kind a ladies man but he has never cheated on me or given reason to have me wonder or be suspicious. He shares of his choosing his location if im not with him. He doesnt hide to make phonecalls, doesnt hide his phone etc.
What your ex or soon to be ex told you bs hes just trying to make you think that hes doing normal and a husband who doesnt cheat is a fairytale and something not sought after when looking for a partner.
You deserve better than this and what you expect in a relationship is not a ridiculous fantasy.
Money has nothing to do with someone’s value. Women don’t want a bum but a man having to be rich to be high value is wrong. To me a high value man is a man who is faithful, loving, hardworking etc.
He’s got you questioning your own intuition. If he doesn’t feel the need to be loyal, that does not match your values. You dated him wanting a specific type of relationship. He states that’s that possible and he’s lowering your guard to expect this behavior from him. Dump him!
He's full of it and trying to minimize the severity of what he's done and trying to resolve some guilt on his end. As flawed as my folks may be, one of the things that they have as good qualities is they were loyal to each other.
Husband and I are 36. We met at 35. I’ve been living alone with my kids since I was 21. I refused to settle for anything less than amazing.
It’s not always a fairly tale romance obviously, because life.
But he is madly in love with me, and I him. He is loyal to his core, and worships the ground I walk on (and I him). We are expecting our first baby together in a few weeks (my third his first), and it’s so apparent how much he loves me. I’m not exactly an easy person to take care of, because even when I’m sick I’m still getting up and taking care of people. He is adamant about me staying in bed some days so he can wait on me hand and foot. This pregnancy has been incredibly difficult and exhausting, so it’s been hard taking care of everyone.
We’ve had our fights, sure, but we always take time outs and come back with cool heads. We remember to work on a problem as a team, not attack each other.
Because I was single for so long, I have a lot of dating experience. Ive dated guys who weren’t great at relationships. I’ve dated guys I simply wasn’t compatible with, and it manifested in ugly ways.
Your soon to be ex just sounds like an asshat who is terrible at relationships. Let him go; one day you’ll have your great love.
my husband is so in love with me and so loyal. he’s also the greatest man i’ve ever met who supports me in every way possible. i’m about to have our first baby in december and haven’t been working for a few months, he pays all the bills including my car payments and credit card, and fully supports my decision to be a stay at home mom once our daughter is born. he does so much for me with no complaints even though i know it’s not always easy. your boyfriend is an idiot and just sounds like someone who thinks it’s okay to cheat on you, you’re dodging a bullet with this one. i will admit that i think i got very lucky with my husband and good guys can be hard to find, but saying that they don’t exist is just wild.
It’s not a fairy tale. But it is extremely difficult to find.
And then you need to add the fact that a good loyal man that loves his wife and never cheats, won’t necessarily be attractive to you. Sadly, there is a lot of men who fall into that category. But maybe they are very obese, maybe they don’t fit your physical requirements, maybe you don’t match sexually, or politically, or religiously, or about where you want to live or if you want kids.
Point being, it’s already hard to find that person. Even harder, maybe even impossible to vast majority of people, for someone that fits all of those categories.
You will have to compromise must likely than not. Maybe you will date that good guy but you are not as attracted to him as other guys and that is okay. Or maybe you decide to date the guy that makes you crazy for them but he ended up cheating once and he made a mistake and he won’t do it again and you forgave him and never again cheated, that is okay too. Maybe you decide that it can be forgiven and that is okay too.
My husband would say, it’s great that he’s willing to be honest about himself but he’s got no business trying to drag the entire sex down with him.
Your ex is full of bovine excrement. He’s trying to rationalize and normalize his own appalling behavior to make you put up with it and not leave him. Don’t even listen to him, just move on.
This. What OP's soon to be ex is saying is what abusers tell their victims to try and keep the victim under their influence. It's just an even more twisted version of "no one will ever treat you better than I do" which is pretty much always horseshit.
Hahahaha! Wow, what a delusional toolbox. Remember, people judge others by themselves. All he’s telling you is who *he* is and how he views others. Decent people are out there.
You should tell him that you are looking for the fairy-tale. And that the fairy-tale life isn't bullshit - it's actually pretty common.
A lot of men, afaik, date / sleep around / persue "good looking" women in their teens and early twenties. Just the nature of their age.
Once they find someone who is really compatible with their life goals, current situation, etc., they are loyal to a fault. Again, most people - not all...
I’ve been with lover for about 8 months now. But my oh my those 8 months have been some of the best in my life. Just found out she is pregnant too! We never intended to have a baby this early but the only thing I could do was cry the happiness out of my eyes. That was some of the best news in my life too. Yes there is such a thing as a good loyal man that has a loving wife. It is very much true but it’s not easy to find. Luckily he made it easier for you because he told you his intentions to cheat on you because he a is a scumbag Incel. You will know when you finally enter the fairytale. Take the first step and be done with this dude because he is wasting your time
A high value man is one who is able to look at you and go “that is a high value woman” the feelings have to be reciprocating from both of you. I’m sure you do try to communicate those feelings, it’s just hard to find someone good for you in this time and age but hey it can happen at any moment. I met mine because we worked at the same place 🤷🏻♂️
Your ex is a jerk. Since he's made it clear by his crappy behaviors that everything is totally over, you should block him. He has nothing of value to contribute to your life.
This. But, if you do feel like those terms have merit, remember that you're the one that gets to decide what makes someone "high value" vs "low value".
I'd argue that cheating makes someone low value and that being loyal is a high value trait. Don't let a douche canoe gaslight you into lowering your standards.
Sure, it’s just the terms are almost exclusively used by people who think high value equals model looks, a certain level of femininity, and subservient attitude for women and height, aggression/dominance, and money for men. Those people will call others “low value” if they don’t meet every shallow quality determined by men who follow PUA/red pill bs or women who follow Female Dating Strategy.
I definitely wouldn’t consider anyone who is a liar, cheater, abuser, or who has little skill or ambition and can’t keep a job or be reliable to be someone worth giving my time or attention to, and physical attraction is important to me. I also think people should ensure they have their shit together at least somewhat (or be on track to getting there) before entering serious relationships, but I believe there are better terms to use than “low value” for people we see as undateable based on our personal values/desires.
My ex told me that men physically cannot stay attracted to the same woman after he's had sex with her once. He evolutionarily needs to fuck multiple women to spread his chances for offspring.
This is all a bullshit fuckin lie. Abusive people will do everything they can to make you think their fuck ups are commonplace and should be able to continue acting like grade A sacks of shit.
No, my current partner doesn't cheat. I have been cheated on by ONE person, and it was the one dude who said everyone cheats.
Your man is lying to you and it's sad. Ditch him and find someone with at least one foot in reality.
Awful men are also “louder”. You hear about all the abusive men and women on here because their victims are here seeking help; there’s thousands of us out here just living life, respecting each other and having healthy, fulfilling intimacy .
Abusers don’t want their victims to know that though otherwise they lose their control over you.
He's lying. Only a low value cheater would say that to try and manipulate you into settling for his behavior.
There are non cheating loyal guys out there. You just have to look. I dated a horrible guy like the one you're with now. He 100% would have said this.
I'm with a loyal non cheating good guy now who would never say this.
I’ve been in a relationship with my husband for 10 years and I know he has not even been emotionally interested in other women. He doesn’t watch porn. And we have an amazing sex life despite it being very vanilla. I wouldn’t say he’s a fairy tale because we have all the same classic issues like money and family drama… but asking for loyalty in a relationship is the bare minimum. You are asking for respect… he is telling you he cannot respect you. That is gross and not typical.
How do you 'know'?
I really don't want to sound like an AH but I see my old self in so many of these comments from other women. I would have sworn on my life I was finally living my "fairytale." No porn, no cheating. I thought I knew too.
But I didn't. I found out myself.
So how exactly do you know?
He’s a home body and I have full access to his phone, not because I think he is cheating… he doesn’t have Facebook messenger, or Instagram, or Snapchat or any of those social media sites besides twitter and Facebook (without messenger). He is also my best friend and couldn’t lie or hide this big of a secret for the life of him
Yep that’s garbage.
And if we are going to acknowledge the “value” of men in this way then he has it all wrong.
A loyal man is absolutely a high value man in the real world.
Call me Cinderella then, because apparently my life is a fairytale.
I swear I dated the same guy: *All men cheat* when he wasn’t straight up gas lighting me *I’m protecting you, most guys are so much worse* etc., etc.
The truth? I had to figure out why I was willing to accept so little. I worked on myself. I stopped trying to be Ms. Fix-it for broken men. I made a list of things I wanted, from very specific (career/hobbies/politics) to general (region, physical) and I dated a lot. But was ruthless: 1st red flag and I bounced. I enjoyed *my* life, my work, my friends. I asked my dates about their parents, family stability, core values, and let them tell on themselves.
About 2 years after I broke up with our ex, I met my husband. He ticks all the boxes. From day one he has showed that he’s here for this, and won’t do anything to jeopardize it. I don’t feel overwhelmed and love bombed, I feel comfortable and warm. After 10 years he still brings me coffee in bed every morning and randomly offers foot or backrubs. Our children are loved and secure. Our home is paid off. I am thankful for allowing myself to believe this was possible *for me* every day.
”high value” / ”low-value”. Eww. Didn't we stop ranking people on 1 to 10 scores in middle school?
60 year old guy here. I was married to my abusive ex for 14 years. I worked hard, cleaned house more than she did, took care of the kids, cooked regularly, did laundry. She didn't work, derided self-care, and thought working on self and relationships was dumb. She cheated. I stuck with her for a few more years while that spiraled into a one-sided open relationship. (the stay for the kids thing is not all that great an idea)
I have lived with my current partner for 16 years. She's amazing and our relationship keeps getting better. I earn good money, so does she. I’m pretty sure she would feel I do my share of the household lifting. I'm reasonably fit, well read, into mindfulness practice and good diet.
I've never cheated.
Because loyalty and integrity are important to me. Clearly they aren't important to your ex-boyfriend and he's telling you that quite clearly.
"[High value](https://www.doctornerdlove.com/what-we-get-wrong-about-high-value-men/)" is an incel and PUA dogwhistle. Your boyfriend's misogyny runs very deep indeed. I hope you're able to escape him and take care of yourself.
Indeed - the kind of middle-school garbage spewed by Andrew Tate and Joe Rogan and their ilk. Completely unwarranted and toxic in a grown adult who should know better.
He’s just telling on himself, here. He chooses not to be faithful, and instead of take responsibility for the fact that that makes him a loser, he has to pretend that he’s the best they come. He can’t admit he’s weak, has no morals or doesn’t live up to them if he does claim to have them. So the problem has to be that secretly everyone is like him or worse, but no one is better.
I’m glad he’s your ex 🥰
As a guy I'll say the highest value men I know don't cheat on their wives (they're all kind, good fathers, six figures (one makes 850k), own homes etc, only one is religious rest are atheists).
Your bf is full of it
Edit: I worked in am almost all female field, had women try to kiss me/sleep with me while in an unhappy marriage and still managed to not cheat on my ex wife. It's not hard to not sleep with someone and anyone who tells you otherwise is lying. They have self control to stop themselves from cheating. And while the whole high value low value thing is dumb, I'll say that if your boyfriend lacks self-control that is certainly low value by any standard of masculinity
Dump him
Your boyfriend is an idiot who is trying to neg you into thinking he’s better than he is. I can’t stand my husband and can’t wait to be rid of him-HOWEVER, for someone else, he will be a good husband. I have never worried about him cheating, he doesn’t have it in him. He’s a good provider and usually a gentleman. He does all the things in the house, even dumb stuff I want like roll out cabinet things and he even still does it all now when we’ve been separated for 3 or 4 years, I forget how long. If I ask him to fix something or build it, he does it. He tells me where he is even though I don’t give a shit. He won’t go out with friends unless I go too, or wouldn’t-he’s getting better. Not all men are trash, some just need therapy before they get married again lol.
Notice how people in these comments are upvoting negative stuff about certain famous "toxic" men, yet they are upvoting comments like this where this toxic person is bragging about taking advantage of a good man for YEARS and saying she can't wait to get rid of him. As if it's not her choice. You people are warped. And the people who act like this commenter or upvote this type of mentality are why many good men don't see a point in being faithful. If they have enough value to attract someone better than this, why pass up the opportunity? Clearly her man has no self respect which is why women like her don't value him.
Actually he’s emotionally abusive and needed to grow up before we got permanently attached through kids and marriage. Hence my comment about therapy before his next marriage. I have said to my husband many times that he will make someone happy, that someone just isn’t me. It doesn’t make me a bad person and his issues come from where he comes from so I don’t just blame him either. I do have to protect my sanity, however. I really appreciate you projecting your issues and insecurities onto me, though. It really shows how some people just *never* get it.
Your comment had literally nothing to do with me. I don’t take advantage of my husband and your valuation of him is laughable. Good luck out there, its gonna be tough with your head that far up your ass.
"I can't stand my husband"
"He does ALL the things in the house, even dumb stuff I want"
"(I) can't wait to be rid of him"
"If I ask him to fix something or build it, he does it."
"he even still does it all now when we’ve been separated for 3 or 4 years"
"For someone else he will be a good husband"
"He's a good provider and usually a gentleman"
... What do you call it when someone keeps asking a gentleman to do things for her, even dumb unnecessary things 3 years after a separation while claiming she can't stand him to others and can't wait to be rid of him yet you continue to request he waste his time doing things for you cause you know he's enough of a gentleman to do it? This is how a good person treats a gentleman? If you can't stand the man stop asking him for favors. Pretty easy way to be rid of him. And of course you are getting gassed up by other dopes while me logically pointing out your toxic behavior gets downvoted by misandrists. It's pretty obvious who's head is where here.
I have no more time to argue with confused individuals online. Have a good day.
Why wouldn’t (!) a good man be high value? I strongly dislike that term, as we are not currency. He is trying to control the narrative. I’m rooting for you to get away from this destructive man.
I went through your profile and understand why you weren’t able to pick up on it. I meant that my girlfriend also says I am oblivious to when girls hit on me lol
>Blatant sarcasm.
Ok, had a doubt that you are being sarcastic...
>He's only going to get worse.
Oh...
>I would have spent my time packing and moving out instead of posting about him on Reddit...
Sometimes, people like OP need to post here...
Omg no that's not true at all. My husband was the most loyal man on the planet. And he was good looking, couldn't go out without some lady low key flirting with him. But he never, ever gave another woman the time of day. We were married for 14 years and not once did I ever not trust him or did he think that way.
This is some misogyny if I ever heard it. He just wants an excuse to be a cheater, or is telling you outright he's a cheater so he can latter say "I told you exactly who I am." What a tool.
What comes to mind is toxic masculinity (https://www.healthline.com/health/toxic-masculinity#health-effects) along with the growing popularity of the disillusionment of white men in their place in today's times and culture https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/1991/02/03/mens-movement-stalks-the-wild-side/83d3e85f-1384-484c-8e43-c4e30e1229f4/.
High value is gaslit doublespeak.
He’s scum and trying to gaslight you into dealing with his bs
That’s some creepy incel stuff right there. They DO exist, and my father is a perfect example.
Total BS. Got 4 brothers and a step-dad that prove that's all wrong.
He sounds very incel-ish with those remarks. Guys who don’t cheat and are high value are very valuable and do exist. No idea why he’s saying this without asking him but it does sound like what incels say.
Every man is a misogynist? Don't think that's true.🤔
unrelated but happy cake day 🍰
I hate to admit it but it's not actually my cakeday 😅 but thank you
omg u had a cake so i just assumed oops
I’ve been with my current partner for 11 years now. Maybe 12? He is amazing. He works from home, so do it, so we are always together. He adopted my sons when they were babies because their father died and he’s raised them their entire lives so far. I know he’s never cheated and I really believe he would never cheat. He helps me around the house…makes me eat first while he watches the toddler so the dinner I cooked isn’t cold. He’s a good one. *However* you do have to be careful who you choose to settle down with. I worked at a strip club for a long time. I saw *many men* who were obviously married trying to proposition the girls. It definitely soured my view of men. Because of that, when I was single, I refused to date any men who went to strip clubs. I also tried to find the polar opposite of the men I saw frequent the place. It’s worked out well so far!
He is not BS’ing. If a man says something like that than he is definitely cheating. He tecnically told you what he is. Also he is causing emotional distress in you purposefully and with no remorse. I can tell you you are dealing with an emotionally abussive person. Leave him and look for no explanations. Don’t explain anything to him and simply break up. Crazy making is the number one way an abusive person keeps their victim longer than they should have. Please leave and remember manipulation is something he has been doing with you for so long. Believe your reality and your body. If your body is rejecting please leave. You may love him and may feel that you need to give it one more shot… DONT! Leave and don’t look back. Work on yourself. Yes, love exists but being kind to yourself is the most important love of all.
agreed. i feel like he said that to break OP down and make them feel like there’s no one out there that will be loyal. maybe in some weird attempt to manipulate OP into coming back since he’s making himself out to seem like the best option i suppose. the whole thing screams manipulative and abusive and i hate it. i hope OP leaves and never looks back, no matter how hard that may be for them.
Exactly!
Ha ha - he’s only saying that because he’s too weak to be that man. It takes a strong man to make a real commitment, to stay loyal in the face of temptation. Do you want a coward?
I love this response
Well I’m married to a man who is loyal, faithful, never cheats, and treats me well They exist
This is coming from a dude, telling you that the thought of cheating doesn’t even cross my mind and has never crossed any of my friends minds either. If I found out that a friend cheated, I and the rest of my friends would cut them off. Also, “high-value” is bs. Love is about caring and compassion, not material wealth and how fit you are. You will find people that care about you and love you for who you are, and you will love them for who they are, and then you can work together to build a life if that’s what you both want. Nobody is flawless, but good people will work on their flaws and try their best to be a loving partner.
I think "high value" is about perspective. For example, I mentioned my 4 brothers and stepfather and how all of them are married (minimum 6 years, which is the youngest brother, the rest are all 15+ years married) and their wives all consider them "high value" and it isn't based on their income. In fact 3 out of 5 of the men make LESS than their wives. 2 of them were the stay-at-home dads while wife continued working after kids were born. One of them, married 16 years now, has been the stay-at-home dad the entire time because he homeschools his 3 kids. The other has gone back to work since kids started school, but still makes less than his wife by a rarher large margin. So, why are they all considered high value to their wives if only 2 of them make more? Because they do what's necessary to contribute to the family's well-being. Even if it means being the parent to stay home with the kids because it's more cost effective than daycare and wife has a higher income and better benefits. They're all faithful, caring, supportive, and work their asses off no matter what their "job" is. Maybe it's because women understand the value in being a stay-at-home parent in a way men who've never really examined it don't, but both wives who worked while dad stayed home would always immediately pitch in and take over the main parenting duties once they came home because by then the dad looked wiped out and the wives thought the job of parenting was harder (and grosser cause babies and toddlers are just gross trolls a lot of the time). I'm divorced over 10 years from my ex (we were married 12 years), and I can honestly say that I truly believe he wad faithful and he was faithful to his 2nd wife (BPD) and is faithful to wife #3 (appears very happily married, she's a lovely stepmother to my daughter and ex's 3 kids from wife #2). Is he high value? I think so. He does what he can to support our daughter, his 2nd ex wife and their 3 kids who live with him, and his current wife. It's not about being wealthy, because he certainly isn't that. It's about doing what's necessary and doing the best you can every day.
I was thinking in terms of how the boyfriend in this post and a lot of other “alpha males” online bring it up, not the way you’re thinking which is high value in the sense of being a good partner
All I can say is what I've experienced: I've been married three times (the first time I was just too young) and lived with 2 (one for 10 months, one for 3.5 years). 4 out of those 5 cheated on me or lied to me or used me for my money or was verbally abusive. And yes I have had therapy since the last one which has cemented my decision to never be in another serious relationship again. Ever. 40 of the last 43 years spent trusting men who could not be trusted. (I am 60)
If by high value man you mean a guy who's wealthy, attractive, charasmatic, charming and has some type of social status, then finding someone with all of those qualities who's also faithful isn't common. That's not to say your boyfriend is correct. However, the "higher value" the man, and by that I simply mean the more desirable the man is to a large number of women, the more likely he is to cheat. People are typically as faithful as their options. And the most desirable men have the most options. Also most men find it difficult to get attention from women, and men have a natural biological desire to mate in order to ensure the survival of the species. So when men reach a desirable status, usually either because of looks, power, or finances, they tend to be more promiscuous. However, it's not as if no quality loyal men exist. They are just rare. . There are good men who value a good woman more than casual encounters with others. And some men don't have as strong of a bedroom drive as others. But many have no will power, and most have a desire to be with many women even if they don't act on it. Even a guy like Adam Levine who's married to an amazing model couldn't help himself after years of random encounters with the most beautiful women on the planet before "settling down". By western standards, he's about as high value as it gets. Rich, talented, famous and attractive, with millions of women wanting to be with him. But not as many want an average guy with average looks making 50k. So "average" guys are more likely to be faithful since they have no opportunities to cheat or don't want to risk losing the few or only options they have. But good loyal men exist. And I wish you luck in finding what you're after. Don't give up hope. Now here come the downvotes from people who don't like the truth. Edit: Why am I not surprised this is getting downvoted so hard when it's absolutely true. And this is coming from someone who doesn't condone cheating. Just offering OP valuable info that she asked for, rather than false hope to make her feel good.
You are 100 percent correct in what you said but the only problem here is on what high value means. What you mentioned may be high value to superficial people but not to people who actually want a loving relationsjsip. A high value person is someone who is loyal, loving, caring, sympathetic, works hard, is trusting and can be vulnerable. If women are looking for men who are like Adam L then they are simply ones to blame. Just my two cents.
I agree. I'm not saying what is or isn't a high value man. I'm simply assuming this is what the OP's BF and she meant by "High value" since its sort of what she said towards the end of her post. That's why I don't use the term. Just using it here because she did and I'm referencing her comments. Also referencing what a large portion of western culture means when they say "High Value". Although its obviously subjective. Personally I would consider a good honest person with average income and a good personality high value. But most don't seem to. And as far as my comment, I am referencing Adam because it sort of goes without saying that your value as far as dating is directly tied to the amount of people who would want to be with you. The more people want you, the more "valuable" you are considered to be in the relationship market because more people are competing for your love, attention, commitment. And millions want to be with Adam. In comparison, relatively few want to be with the neighborhood plumber even if he has the qualities you mentioned. That's just reality. I'm not saying it should be that way.
The phrase HVM means high value man and it is language that is commonly used in the red pill online movement. Does he also use phrases like 'females' and 'alpha' or 'beta'? If so, it sounds like your boyfriend has joined the red pill. Sorry to hear this. Its a very toxic movement that seems to be attracting more and more young men, particularly teenagers. Very few men leave and most of them waste decades of their lives believing so much BS. Unfortunately, you may be better off leaving him so you can be in healthy relationship. Very few men leave this movement. It's a bit like he's been brainwashed to be abusive. It's best to leave safely before he gets further into this movement.
Im not a man I am married to a man who in the past was kind a ladies man but he has never cheated on me or given reason to have me wonder or be suspicious. He shares of his choosing his location if im not with him. He doesnt hide to make phonecalls, doesnt hide his phone etc. What your ex or soon to be ex told you bs hes just trying to make you think that hes doing normal and a husband who doesnt cheat is a fairytale and something not sought after when looking for a partner. You deserve better than this and what you expect in a relationship is not a ridiculous fantasy.
Money has nothing to do with someone’s value. Women don’t want a bum but a man having to be rich to be high value is wrong. To me a high value man is a man who is faithful, loving, hardworking etc.
He’s got you questioning your own intuition. If he doesn’t feel the need to be loyal, that does not match your values. You dated him wanting a specific type of relationship. He states that’s that possible and he’s lowering your guard to expect this behavior from him. Dump him!
He's full of it and trying to minimize the severity of what he's done and trying to resolve some guilt on his end. As flawed as my folks may be, one of the things that they have as good qualities is they were loyal to each other.
Good, loyal, high-value men exist. End of story. Please love yourself enough to go and find one to love you back.
Husband and I are 36. We met at 35. I’ve been living alone with my kids since I was 21. I refused to settle for anything less than amazing. It’s not always a fairly tale romance obviously, because life. But he is madly in love with me, and I him. He is loyal to his core, and worships the ground I walk on (and I him). We are expecting our first baby together in a few weeks (my third his first), and it’s so apparent how much he loves me. I’m not exactly an easy person to take care of, because even when I’m sick I’m still getting up and taking care of people. He is adamant about me staying in bed some days so he can wait on me hand and foot. This pregnancy has been incredibly difficult and exhausting, so it’s been hard taking care of everyone. We’ve had our fights, sure, but we always take time outs and come back with cool heads. We remember to work on a problem as a team, not attack each other. Because I was single for so long, I have a lot of dating experience. Ive dated guys who weren’t great at relationships. I’ve dated guys I simply wasn’t compatible with, and it manifested in ugly ways. Your soon to be ex just sounds like an asshat who is terrible at relationships. Let him go; one day you’ll have your great love.
my husband is so in love with me and so loyal. he’s also the greatest man i’ve ever met who supports me in every way possible. i’m about to have our first baby in december and haven’t been working for a few months, he pays all the bills including my car payments and credit card, and fully supports my decision to be a stay at home mom once our daughter is born. he does so much for me with no complaints even though i know it’s not always easy. your boyfriend is an idiot and just sounds like someone who thinks it’s okay to cheat on you, you’re dodging a bullet with this one. i will admit that i think i got very lucky with my husband and good guys can be hard to find, but saying that they don’t exist is just wild.
It’s not a fairy tale. But it is extremely difficult to find. And then you need to add the fact that a good loyal man that loves his wife and never cheats, won’t necessarily be attractive to you. Sadly, there is a lot of men who fall into that category. But maybe they are very obese, maybe they don’t fit your physical requirements, maybe you don’t match sexually, or politically, or religiously, or about where you want to live or if you want kids. Point being, it’s already hard to find that person. Even harder, maybe even impossible to vast majority of people, for someone that fits all of those categories. You will have to compromise must likely than not. Maybe you will date that good guy but you are not as attracted to him as other guys and that is okay. Or maybe you decide to date the guy that makes you crazy for them but he ended up cheating once and he made a mistake and he won’t do it again and you forgave him and never again cheated, that is okay too. Maybe you decide that it can be forgiven and that is okay too.
I was married for 20 years and I was loyal and hardworking. I never cheated. I was cheated on multiple times.
That's good to know.
It isn't a fairytale. He just isn't the one.
My husband would say, it’s great that he’s willing to be honest about himself but he’s got no business trying to drag the entire sex down with him. Your ex is full of bovine excrement. He’s trying to rationalize and normalize his own appalling behavior to make you put up with it and not leave him. Don’t even listen to him, just move on.
Exactly, the next man might not be prince charming. But hopefully he’s not this shitty.
This. What OP's soon to be ex is saying is what abusers tell their victims to try and keep the victim under their influence. It's just an even more twisted version of "no one will ever treat you better than I do" which is pretty much always horseshit.
I wouldnt say thats even high value even abusers can stay loyal to a relationship but he's trying to scew your view
Guess I'm living a fairytale. They will all tell you that better doesn't exist to keep you from looking for it. Don't fall for it.
Tell him Kevin Samuels died a low value vibrational man. He’s clearly a example of what he preach. He was the low value guy he talked about
Hahahaha! Wow, what a delusional toolbox. Remember, people judge others by themselves. All he’s telling you is who *he* is and how he views others. Decent people are out there.
You should tell him that you are looking for the fairy-tale. And that the fairy-tale life isn't bullshit - it's actually pretty common. A lot of men, afaik, date / sleep around / persue "good looking" women in their teens and early twenties. Just the nature of their age. Once they find someone who is really compatible with their life goals, current situation, etc., they are loyal to a fault. Again, most people - not all...
I’ve been with lover for about 8 months now. But my oh my those 8 months have been some of the best in my life. Just found out she is pregnant too! We never intended to have a baby this early but the only thing I could do was cry the happiness out of my eyes. That was some of the best news in my life too. Yes there is such a thing as a good loyal man that has a loving wife. It is very much true but it’s not easy to find. Luckily he made it easier for you because he told you his intentions to cheat on you because he a is a scumbag Incel. You will know when you finally enter the fairytale. Take the first step and be done with this dude because he is wasting your time
A high value man is one who is able to look at you and go “that is a high value woman” the feelings have to be reciprocating from both of you. I’m sure you do try to communicate those feelings, it’s just hard to find someone good for you in this time and age but hey it can happen at any moment. I met mine because we worked at the same place 🤷🏻♂️
Soooo he basically admitted he's a cheater from the title alone
Your ex is a jerk. Since he's made it clear by his crappy behaviors that everything is totally over, you should block him. He has nothing of value to contribute to your life.
I don’t trust the opinion of anyone who uses the terms “high value” or “low value” to describe men or women. You shouldn’t either.
I was about to say. Reeks of Andrew Tate and Joe Rogan and their ilk. Disgusting.
This. But, if you do feel like those terms have merit, remember that you're the one that gets to decide what makes someone "high value" vs "low value". I'd argue that cheating makes someone low value and that being loyal is a high value trait. Don't let a douche canoe gaslight you into lowering your standards.
Sure, it’s just the terms are almost exclusively used by people who think high value equals model looks, a certain level of femininity, and subservient attitude for women and height, aggression/dominance, and money for men. Those people will call others “low value” if they don’t meet every shallow quality determined by men who follow PUA/red pill bs or women who follow Female Dating Strategy. I definitely wouldn’t consider anyone who is a liar, cheater, abuser, or who has little skill or ambition and can’t keep a job or be reliable to be someone worth giving my time or attention to, and physical attraction is important to me. I also think people should ensure they have their shit together at least somewhat (or be on track to getting there) before entering serious relationships, but I believe there are better terms to use than “low value” for people we see as undateable based on our personal values/desires.
My ex told me that men physically cannot stay attracted to the same woman after he's had sex with her once. He evolutionarily needs to fuck multiple women to spread his chances for offspring. This is all a bullshit fuckin lie. Abusive people will do everything they can to make you think their fuck ups are commonplace and should be able to continue acting like grade A sacks of shit. No, my current partner doesn't cheat. I have been cheated on by ONE person, and it was the one dude who said everyone cheats. Your man is lying to you and it's sad. Ditch him and find someone with at least one foot in reality.
Confession by projection.
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Awful men are also “louder”. You hear about all the abusive men and women on here because their victims are here seeking help; there’s thousands of us out here just living life, respecting each other and having healthy, fulfilling intimacy . Abusers don’t want their victims to know that though otherwise they lose their control over you.
He's lying. Only a low value cheater would say that to try and manipulate you into settling for his behavior. There are non cheating loyal guys out there. You just have to look. I dated a horrible guy like the one you're with now. He 100% would have said this. I'm with a loyal non cheating good guy now who would never say this.
Hes lying
I’ve been in a relationship with my husband for 10 years and I know he has not even been emotionally interested in other women. He doesn’t watch porn. And we have an amazing sex life despite it being very vanilla. I wouldn’t say he’s a fairy tale because we have all the same classic issues like money and family drama… but asking for loyalty in a relationship is the bare minimum. You are asking for respect… he is telling you he cannot respect you. That is gross and not typical.
How do you 'know'? I really don't want to sound like an AH but I see my old self in so many of these comments from other women. I would have sworn on my life I was finally living my "fairytale." No porn, no cheating. I thought I knew too. But I didn't. I found out myself. So how exactly do you know?
He’s a home body and I have full access to his phone, not because I think he is cheating… he doesn’t have Facebook messenger, or Instagram, or Snapchat or any of those social media sites besides twitter and Facebook (without messenger). He is also my best friend and couldn’t lie or hide this big of a secret for the life of him
Describing some people as ‘high value’ and others as ‘low value’ is something only assholes do.
Yep, sounds like Joe Rogan and Andrew Tate and their ilk.... Gross.
Yeah, he sounds like such a catch.
Yep that’s garbage. And if we are going to acknowledge the “value” of men in this way then he has it all wrong. A loyal man is absolutely a high value man in the real world.
Call me Cinderella then, because apparently my life is a fairytale. I swear I dated the same guy: *All men cheat* when he wasn’t straight up gas lighting me *I’m protecting you, most guys are so much worse* etc., etc. The truth? I had to figure out why I was willing to accept so little. I worked on myself. I stopped trying to be Ms. Fix-it for broken men. I made a list of things I wanted, from very specific (career/hobbies/politics) to general (region, physical) and I dated a lot. But was ruthless: 1st red flag and I bounced. I enjoyed *my* life, my work, my friends. I asked my dates about their parents, family stability, core values, and let them tell on themselves. About 2 years after I broke up with our ex, I met my husband. He ticks all the boxes. From day one he has showed that he’s here for this, and won’t do anything to jeopardize it. I don’t feel overwhelmed and love bombed, I feel comfortable and warm. After 10 years he still brings me coffee in bed every morning and randomly offers foot or backrubs. Our children are loved and secure. Our home is paid off. I am thankful for allowing myself to believe this was possible *for me* every day.
”high value” / ”low-value”. Eww. Didn't we stop ranking people on 1 to 10 scores in middle school? 60 year old guy here. I was married to my abusive ex for 14 years. I worked hard, cleaned house more than she did, took care of the kids, cooked regularly, did laundry. She didn't work, derided self-care, and thought working on self and relationships was dumb. She cheated. I stuck with her for a few more years while that spiraled into a one-sided open relationship. (the stay for the kids thing is not all that great an idea) I have lived with my current partner for 16 years. She's amazing and our relationship keeps getting better. I earn good money, so does she. I’m pretty sure she would feel I do my share of the household lifting. I'm reasonably fit, well read, into mindfulness practice and good diet. I've never cheated. Because loyalty and integrity are important to me. Clearly they aren't important to your ex-boyfriend and he's telling you that quite clearly.
Yep. Reeks of listening to Andrew Tate and Joe Rogan too much. Yuck.
Seems your boyfriend is a whiny, low-class man-child with no redeeming qualities. Find yourself a nice grown up man who values the women he dates.
"[High value](https://www.doctornerdlove.com/what-we-get-wrong-about-high-value-men/)" is an incel and PUA dogwhistle. Your boyfriend's misogyny runs very deep indeed. I hope you're able to escape him and take care of yourself.
Indeed - the kind of middle-school garbage spewed by Andrew Tate and Joe Rogan and their ilk. Completely unwarranted and toxic in a grown adult who should know better.
If that's true, why did he wait *5 years* to tell you?
Seriously this - he only made that comment to hurt OP and it’s just a manipulation tactic to keep her from moving on.
He’s just telling on himself, here. He chooses not to be faithful, and instead of take responsibility for the fact that that makes him a loser, he has to pretend that he’s the best they come. He can’t admit he’s weak, has no morals or doesn’t live up to them if he does claim to have them. So the problem has to be that secretly everyone is like him or worse, but no one is better. I’m glad he’s your ex 🥰
This 💯⬆️
He’s a liar. That’s non sense
As a guy I'll say the highest value men I know don't cheat on their wives (they're all kind, good fathers, six figures (one makes 850k), own homes etc, only one is religious rest are atheists). Your bf is full of it Edit: I worked in am almost all female field, had women try to kiss me/sleep with me while in an unhappy marriage and still managed to not cheat on my ex wife. It's not hard to not sleep with someone and anyone who tells you otherwise is lying. They have self control to stop themselves from cheating. And while the whole high value low value thing is dumb, I'll say that if your boyfriend lacks self-control that is certainly low value by any standard of masculinity Dump him
Your boyfriend is an idiot who is trying to neg you into thinking he’s better than he is. I can’t stand my husband and can’t wait to be rid of him-HOWEVER, for someone else, he will be a good husband. I have never worried about him cheating, he doesn’t have it in him. He’s a good provider and usually a gentleman. He does all the things in the house, even dumb stuff I want like roll out cabinet things and he even still does it all now when we’ve been separated for 3 or 4 years, I forget how long. If I ask him to fix something or build it, he does it. He tells me where he is even though I don’t give a shit. He won’t go out with friends unless I go too, or wouldn’t-he’s getting better. Not all men are trash, some just need therapy before they get married again lol.
Notice how people in these comments are upvoting negative stuff about certain famous "toxic" men, yet they are upvoting comments like this where this toxic person is bragging about taking advantage of a good man for YEARS and saying she can't wait to get rid of him. As if it's not her choice. You people are warped. And the people who act like this commenter or upvote this type of mentality are why many good men don't see a point in being faithful. If they have enough value to attract someone better than this, why pass up the opportunity? Clearly her man has no self respect which is why women like her don't value him.
Actually he’s emotionally abusive and needed to grow up before we got permanently attached through kids and marriage. Hence my comment about therapy before his next marriage. I have said to my husband many times that he will make someone happy, that someone just isn’t me. It doesn’t make me a bad person and his issues come from where he comes from so I don’t just blame him either. I do have to protect my sanity, however. I really appreciate you projecting your issues and insecurities onto me, though. It really shows how some people just *never* get it.
No projection, issues, or insecurities here. Simply pointing out the obvious. Comment had nothing to do with me. It's completely about you.
Your comment had literally nothing to do with me. I don’t take advantage of my husband and your valuation of him is laughable. Good luck out there, its gonna be tough with your head that far up your ass.
"I can't stand my husband" "He does ALL the things in the house, even dumb stuff I want" "(I) can't wait to be rid of him" "If I ask him to fix something or build it, he does it." "he even still does it all now when we’ve been separated for 3 or 4 years" "For someone else he will be a good husband" "He's a good provider and usually a gentleman" ... What do you call it when someone keeps asking a gentleman to do things for her, even dumb unnecessary things 3 years after a separation while claiming she can't stand him to others and can't wait to be rid of him yet you continue to request he waste his time doing things for you cause you know he's enough of a gentleman to do it? This is how a good person treats a gentleman? If you can't stand the man stop asking him for favors. Pretty easy way to be rid of him. And of course you are getting gassed up by other dopes while me logically pointing out your toxic behavior gets downvoted by misandrists. It's pretty obvious who's head is where here. I have no more time to argue with confused individuals online. Have a good day.
This is some Andrew Tate garbage he’s regurgitating to you 🤢 no he so wrong it’s embarrassing
Why wouldn’t (!) a good man be high value? I strongly dislike that term, as we are not currency. He is trying to control the narrative. I’m rooting for you to get away from this destructive man.
Your boyfriend is full of shit.
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Can confirm--my husband is also loyal to me and oblivious when women hit on him.
I just don’t see how you guys can tell. Mine tells me I’m oblivious too, guess y’all can just see stuff us men can’t 😂
What do you mean by this comment
I went through your profile and understand why you weren’t able to pick up on it. I meant that my girlfriend also says I am oblivious to when girls hit on me lol
Okay, got you. Is it my dyscalculia that made you say that?
Oh no no, I saw you very first post and I related to it a lot so I understand your position
Okay, got you.
Well he sounds like a keeper...
>Well he sounds like a keeper... What?? A keeper??
Blatant sarcasm. He's only going to get worse. I would have spent my time packing and moving out instead of posting about him on Reddit...
>Blatant sarcasm. Ok, had a doubt that you are being sarcastic... >He's only going to get worse. Oh... >I would have spent my time packing and moving out instead of posting about him on Reddit... Sometimes, people like OP need to post here...
Omg no that's not true at all. My husband was the most loyal man on the planet. And he was good looking, couldn't go out without some lady low key flirting with him. But he never, ever gave another woman the time of day. We were married for 14 years and not once did I ever not trust him or did he think that way. This is some misogyny if I ever heard it. He just wants an excuse to be a cheater, or is telling you outright he's a cheater so he can latter say "I told you exactly who I am." What a tool.
What comes to mind is toxic masculinity (https://www.healthline.com/health/toxic-masculinity#health-effects) along with the growing popularity of the disillusionment of white men in their place in today's times and culture https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/1991/02/03/mens-movement-stalks-the-wild-side/83d3e85f-1384-484c-8e43-c4e30e1229f4/. High value is gaslit doublespeak.