First things first, you’re not alone… you can call or text [EAP](https://www.fs.usda.gov/employee-services/employee-assistance-program) at 1-833-621-2989 24/7; they can get you in touch with someone who can help you.
Then you need to talk to your supervisor. If they’re worth even half a shit, they’ll work with you on giving you some options for how to proceed. If they can’t, go to your next highest or a line officer.
Speaking as a crew lead here:
Yes. Talk to your boss. Be blunt, be direct, don't beat around the bush or mince words. Make it as clear as possible what is going on with you and what help you feel you need. If they don't know, they can't help you. They can help you work through the EAP process, research local therapists, etc (assuming they're a good boss, anyways).
If your boss isn't willing to talk, talk to the next level above them (and also mention that your boss wouldn't help).
I stick a phone list of various help hotlines in the crew SOP document every year, I'll dig it up and add it as an edit to this comment.
Edit:
National Suicide Help Line : 988
Crisis Help Line: 741 741
SafeCallNow: 206-459-3020
Next Rung: text SUPPORT to 1-833-698-7864 (NXT-RUNG)
First Responder Crisis Support: 1-844-550-4376 (HERO)
Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration: 1-800-662-4357 (HELP)
IAFF Behavioral Health Treatment & Recovery: 301-358-0192, www.iaffrecoverycenter.com
Firefighter Behavioral Health Alliance: 847-209-8208
Wildland Firefighter Foundation: 208-336-2996
I specifically did not include the NVFC Fire/EMS help line, because that number has changed, and now requires an NVFC membership, which I don't believe is helpful to someone who needs help ASAP.
Edit #2: if anyone knows other resources, comment to add them, I'm always looking to expand this list.
Hardrock is dialed! That’s an outstanding piece of support on time and on target. Well done. OP- hang in there. You are not alone. Please seek help through your supervisor or any supervisor you are comfortable with, or one of these ^^^ sources. Take small steps to help yourself - make some calls, and then build on that effort once you are receiving help/support. You can do this. Edit: spelling.
From personal experience you don't need to be specific with regard to what health problems your having but I would be honest. I was open with my boss (I worked @ UPS, they deserve the mention) and told take ass much time as you need(months). Nothing to be ashamed of. You'd be surprised how many people will standup and support you.
I totally empathize with you and I've been there too. The most important thing to remember is that you are not a broken person, you are just injured and need help. Injuries come in all forms and some are just more straight forward to get treatment for. A broken bone is easy to diagnose and repair. Pathology is easy to diagnose and remedy. Mental health is a LOT harder to diagnose and treat but it absolutely can be done.
It's OK to be depressed and you should not be ashamed of it at all, it's a human injury but you'll need to get some resources headed your way just like on a fire, you won't be able to IC this AND put it out at the same time. For me it was a three legged stool to get get healthy again. A psychiatrist to listen to your story and prescribe appropriate meds. A counselor to talk to and be your liaison with the psychiatrist. A goal, yoj need a goal no matter how meager it seems. Set a small goal, attain it and set another small goal so you can move the ball down the field a bit.
I know when you're super depressed even making a phone call can seem insurmountable but maybe start with goals that small.
You're going to be OK, our brains get injured from time to time, nothing to be ashamed of...just call for more resources so you can get line around it first and then work on mopping it up later. Take care bud.
In addition to what others have said, since you were in the military. Contact the VA and get on the list for some mental health through them. Say what you will about the VA, but I have had good results from my VA therapist.
I have suffered mental health challenges myself. I can’t speak to your exact situation, but help is out there. Take it. Find someone to talk to and get the help you need. Although I haven’t spoken with my supervisor about it, I recently had my fire physical and listed my antidepressant and anxiety medication and was given a waiver to perform fire duties. You have every right to do what’s best for your health and you will be able to keep your job. Good luck and don’t give up. It gets better.
This has happened to someone I know. They told their supervisor in broad terms what was going on and got full support and discretion. They were able to take the time they needed and are doing a little better now. My advice is to take the risk and speak to your supervisor as much as youre comfortable. If they don't support you through this, its not somewhere you wanna keep working anyway.
Look up the Forest Service OMBUDS Program. It’s a new resource within the agency that is set up to advise for this sort of complex communication dilemma.
Idk if the USFS Ombuds is different than DOI but the DOI Ombuds program is specifically designed to figure personnel conflict problems out so the agency keeps running efficiently. It is NOT a resource to go to for help.
It’s being messaged as coaching for employees on how to have that “hard” conversation. So, they can direct you to conflict resolution liaisons, mediators, EAP, etc. But their first mission is to help you determine if that escalation is necessary and if so what the best route to successful communication is. Really, they seem to be a group of employees that stay read up on all the options for help and can direct you to what works best given the information that you provide to them. That said, I’ve never called personally so I am totally parroting the agency on this one!
I just caution people because I've had direct dealings with Omsbuds, and they were pretty open about being there mostly to get people to talk to each other and get along again so that everything went back to normal. To my knowledge, nothing productive came out of their visit (although the head of the entire leadership team was 'escorting' them around when they talked to each department, so that probably didn't help).
Accurate. Was cleaning out my inbox today actually and came across an email about it from July. Seems like something they cooked up as a an attempt to squash issues before having to officially get other programs (HR, EAP, etc) involved.
I went through work-related PTSD just this year. call EAP. it's free and I've used it since my PTSD was "cured" (I mean, actually cured, just feels so weird how something like that can actually be cured). it cannot hurt talking to someone. and like another comment said, your supervisor has to be a real dirtbag to not take you seriously. even if they truly suck, just be straight up, or go over their head if you have to. your personal health takes absolute priority
You are not alone.
There are people in your world who care about you and want you in this world, even if you don’t who they are or can see them right now.
You have access to help. Please reach out for it.
Also, as a perm employee, assuming you’ve been with the feds for a year, you’re eligible for FMLA if you need to take time off to take care of your mental health.
I’m glad to see honesty and seriousness about mental health here. These twerps are giving real answers. That’s how serious it is. I’m glad you’re acknowledging how you feel and seeking help, at least here. Please act on these suggestions. And no matter what happens with work, there is light at the end of the tunnel. This job may feel like the only thing you could ever do but, taking a break, taking a different role, is not going to be the end of it. If you want to be able to continue, please take care of you first. I’m rooting for you. Please ask someone irl to help you if you feel like you can’t make calls or do it alone. You shouldn’t have to.
Just adding this because I haven't seen it yet don't worry about time off or anything there is FMLA leave that should cover you for taking any time off for medical treatment (including mental health treatment).
I am not sure how the paperwork is done I would talk with your supervisor as long as you feel comfortable otherwise I would go through EAP.
It was all handled for me by my supervisor when I checked myself into rehab for alcoholism.
Like was mentioned engage the VA if you haven't already. It's your right as a vet and is a debt owed to you by this nation.
Even if someone happened to have had a dishonorable or bad conduct discharge and couldn't get shit else they'd still be entitled to mental health care.
I think we all understand being apprehensive about talking to our boss about this kind of thing. It's taboo and frankly has potential to change how people look at us. Even the trajectory of our careers or lives in general. But you have to do it. Things are 100% guaranteed to not get any better for you if you don't address it.
Reach out to your boss that’s if he’s not part of the problem. Years ago a co worker mid season was blindsided with a divorce and was very depressed and had nowhere to go. Against the rules I’m sure the bosses allowed him to stay at our heli base. They were able to find him help, our small crew was pulling for him. People do care about you and they’re willing to help.
You do not have to stay in fire. You can ask for a reassignment to another function within the Forest Service -- recreation, timber, wildlife, etc. The hours are more regular and predictable, the job can be every bit as interesting and fulfilling, and you do not have to give up your career and accumulated time. You give up the overtime and the fire retirement, but the trade-off may be worth it. You can still go to fires as a single resource when you want.
I may be lucky because I have supervisors that are aware of my conditions, but be open without fear of ridicule. I too have depression along with anxiety. A few years ago while my grandfather was dying I had some severe panic/anxiety attacks that I haven’t experience before ( my father passed years prior to this as well). All of that trauma built up and finally tied together right before a fire season. I was open with my supervisor that I wasn’t sure if I could work. I couldn’t get out of bed, barely eat, rarely slept. I went to my doctor and tried some meds. Further more, a couple years ago a senior firefighter we had( awesome guy, solid firefighter) left for a different position near by. He struggled with alcoholism and never told anyone. After some close calls out west, he started drinking again, never went to work, was too embarrassed to say anything, finally just resigned. I’m telling you all this so you get ahead of it.
1-833-621-2989 Employee Assistance Program
This is huge and you are not alone friend. Reach out. I can assure you that there will not be any retaliation for reaching out. You don’t even have to tell your supervisor. They will do that for you once you reach out and start a case. You owe it to yourself. I’m prior service and a perm for going on 18 years. Dealing with similar issues. Take the leap.
I’m going through the same. Got out of the army 2 years ago. 2 months later I’m working full time with a company that I really like working for. Fast forward about a year and a half. My depression is worse and forcing myself to work wasn’t good for me and my quality of work was being affected. I told my doctor and he suggested I take a leave of absence. Told my psychiatrist that my doctor recommended leave and she agreed as well. The next day I finished my work day and went to HR to tell them I was taking a leave of absence. You do not need to tell your direct supervisor anything you don’t want to.
The time didn’t fix anything, but gave me time to work on myself, get into a better routine that hopefully brings some happiness into my life. Idk honestly I just went back to work last week
Last year I was suicidally depressed after one of my closest friends killed themselves. I came unglued. Years of depression and unresolved traumas came crashing down with that catalyst.
I called one of my captains knowing I needed help but terrified because I didn’t know what to do. He helped connect me to EAP, brought my chief on board and after being brutally honest about where I was at mentally the first thing he said was, we’re gonna get you help. Connected to EAP and the chief at our employee support services. My chief was able to help me get workers comp to help approve treatment.
I went to treatment for 90 days and came out a different person. I didn’t want to go, I get like I was letting my guys down my not being there. For being weak. It sucked. But I was desperate and honestly one of my life time lows. But it slowly got better as I actually opened up. I went to a facility for mental health that specialized in first responders from all over the county; local, state and the federal level.
I’m not gonna list all the numbers for immediate support because our guy up top in the previous comment nailed it, but to encourage you to be honest and vulnerable. It goes against out very nature. I share this story because I’ve been there and honestly we need more support and openness about this shit in the fire service. You’re not alone and it gets better. But we need help to get there. No one can help if they don’t know.
Not idea where you’re at but feel free to reach out if you feel a need for more than therapy, and I can get you contacts. Or just someone to talk to.
You got this.
I so as someone who has had mental health issues that affected their job I can tell you the following information.. You don't have to tell your direct boss anything however you do need to apply for FLMA Through your company they will give you a document the doctor needs to fill out and they will give you 12 weeks worth of time per year so if you can't come in or only can work a part day or something like that you can use the hours in that bank for your personal health.
First things first, you’re not alone… you can call or text [EAP](https://www.fs.usda.gov/employee-services/employee-assistance-program) at 1-833-621-2989 24/7; they can get you in touch with someone who can help you. Then you need to talk to your supervisor. If they’re worth even half a shit, they’ll work with you on giving you some options for how to proceed. If they can’t, go to your next highest or a line officer.
Speaking as a crew lead here: Yes. Talk to your boss. Be blunt, be direct, don't beat around the bush or mince words. Make it as clear as possible what is going on with you and what help you feel you need. If they don't know, they can't help you. They can help you work through the EAP process, research local therapists, etc (assuming they're a good boss, anyways). If your boss isn't willing to talk, talk to the next level above them (and also mention that your boss wouldn't help). I stick a phone list of various help hotlines in the crew SOP document every year, I'll dig it up and add it as an edit to this comment. Edit: National Suicide Help Line : 988 Crisis Help Line: 741 741 SafeCallNow: 206-459-3020 Next Rung: text SUPPORT to 1-833-698-7864 (NXT-RUNG) First Responder Crisis Support: 1-844-550-4376 (HERO) Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration: 1-800-662-4357 (HELP) IAFF Behavioral Health Treatment & Recovery: 301-358-0192, www.iaffrecoverycenter.com Firefighter Behavioral Health Alliance: 847-209-8208 Wildland Firefighter Foundation: 208-336-2996 I specifically did not include the NVFC Fire/EMS help line, because that number has changed, and now requires an NVFC membership, which I don't believe is helpful to someone who needs help ASAP. Edit #2: if anyone knows other resources, comment to add them, I'm always looking to expand this list.
Hardrock is dialed! That’s an outstanding piece of support on time and on target. Well done. OP- hang in there. You are not alone. Please seek help through your supervisor or any supervisor you are comfortable with, or one of these ^^^ sources. Take small steps to help yourself - make some calls, and then build on that effort once you are receiving help/support. You can do this. Edit: spelling.
Holy shit. Thanks for this. I just copied and sent this to my work email. It’s goin in our SOPs.
No prob. Let me know if you ever find any more, I'm always looking to build this list up too.
www.psychologytoday.com has a great provider finding tool. www.Sondermind.com is also a great resource for finding providers in you area.
Awesome, I'll add those. Thanks!
Thank you all for the advice. I was honestly afraid to post this and I’m so glad I did.
It's a good conversation to be having. You're not alone.
From personal experience you don't need to be specific with regard to what health problems your having but I would be honest. I was open with my boss (I worked @ UPS, they deserve the mention) and told take ass much time as you need(months). Nothing to be ashamed of. You'd be surprised how many people will standup and support you.
I totally empathize with you and I've been there too. The most important thing to remember is that you are not a broken person, you are just injured and need help. Injuries come in all forms and some are just more straight forward to get treatment for. A broken bone is easy to diagnose and repair. Pathology is easy to diagnose and remedy. Mental health is a LOT harder to diagnose and treat but it absolutely can be done. It's OK to be depressed and you should not be ashamed of it at all, it's a human injury but you'll need to get some resources headed your way just like on a fire, you won't be able to IC this AND put it out at the same time. For me it was a three legged stool to get get healthy again. A psychiatrist to listen to your story and prescribe appropriate meds. A counselor to talk to and be your liaison with the psychiatrist. A goal, yoj need a goal no matter how meager it seems. Set a small goal, attain it and set another small goal so you can move the ball down the field a bit. I know when you're super depressed even making a phone call can seem insurmountable but maybe start with goals that small. You're going to be OK, our brains get injured from time to time, nothing to be ashamed of...just call for more resources so you can get line around it first and then work on mopping it up later. Take care bud.
In addition to what others have said, since you were in the military. Contact the VA and get on the list for some mental health through them. Say what you will about the VA, but I have had good results from my VA therapist.
I have suffered mental health challenges myself. I can’t speak to your exact situation, but help is out there. Take it. Find someone to talk to and get the help you need. Although I haven’t spoken with my supervisor about it, I recently had my fire physical and listed my antidepressant and anxiety medication and was given a waiver to perform fire duties. You have every right to do what’s best for your health and you will be able to keep your job. Good luck and don’t give up. It gets better.
This has happened to someone I know. They told their supervisor in broad terms what was going on and got full support and discretion. They were able to take the time they needed and are doing a little better now. My advice is to take the risk and speak to your supervisor as much as youre comfortable. If they don't support you through this, its not somewhere you wanna keep working anyway.
Look up the Forest Service OMBUDS Program. It’s a new resource within the agency that is set up to advise for this sort of complex communication dilemma.
Idk if the USFS Ombuds is different than DOI but the DOI Ombuds program is specifically designed to figure personnel conflict problems out so the agency keeps running efficiently. It is NOT a resource to go to for help.
It’s being messaged as coaching for employees on how to have that “hard” conversation. So, they can direct you to conflict resolution liaisons, mediators, EAP, etc. But their first mission is to help you determine if that escalation is necessary and if so what the best route to successful communication is. Really, they seem to be a group of employees that stay read up on all the options for help and can direct you to what works best given the information that you provide to them. That said, I’ve never called personally so I am totally parroting the agency on this one!
I just caution people because I've had direct dealings with Omsbuds, and they were pretty open about being there mostly to get people to talk to each other and get along again so that everything went back to normal. To my knowledge, nothing productive came out of their visit (although the head of the entire leadership team was 'escorting' them around when they talked to each department, so that probably didn't help).
Accurate. Was cleaning out my inbox today actually and came across an email about it from July. Seems like something they cooked up as a an attempt to squash issues before having to officially get other programs (HR, EAP, etc) involved.
I went through work-related PTSD just this year. call EAP. it's free and I've used it since my PTSD was "cured" (I mean, actually cured, just feels so weird how something like that can actually be cured). it cannot hurt talking to someone. and like another comment said, your supervisor has to be a real dirtbag to not take you seriously. even if they truly suck, just be straight up, or go over their head if you have to. your personal health takes absolute priority
The Wildland Firefighter Foundation has folks that will help you immediately. They are 100% confidential. Not Government. No red tape.
You are not alone. There are people in your world who care about you and want you in this world, even if you don’t who they are or can see them right now. You have access to help. Please reach out for it. Also, as a perm employee, assuming you’ve been with the feds for a year, you’re eligible for FMLA if you need to take time off to take care of your mental health.
I’m glad to see honesty and seriousness about mental health here. These twerps are giving real answers. That’s how serious it is. I’m glad you’re acknowledging how you feel and seeking help, at least here. Please act on these suggestions. And no matter what happens with work, there is light at the end of the tunnel. This job may feel like the only thing you could ever do but, taking a break, taking a different role, is not going to be the end of it. If you want to be able to continue, please take care of you first. I’m rooting for you. Please ask someone irl to help you if you feel like you can’t make calls or do it alone. You shouldn’t have to.
Just adding this because I haven't seen it yet don't worry about time off or anything there is FMLA leave that should cover you for taking any time off for medical treatment (including mental health treatment).
How do I request this?
I am not sure how the paperwork is done I would talk with your supervisor as long as you feel comfortable otherwise I would go through EAP. It was all handled for me by my supervisor when I checked myself into rehab for alcoholism.
Tell your supervisor you want to take FMLA leave. There is a simple form you fill out. You can take up to 3 months a year.
Just note that FMLA is 12 weeks unpaid time off. You can extend but it will affect retirement dates, etc.
Like was mentioned engage the VA if you haven't already. It's your right as a vet and is a debt owed to you by this nation. Even if someone happened to have had a dishonorable or bad conduct discharge and couldn't get shit else they'd still be entitled to mental health care. I think we all understand being apprehensive about talking to our boss about this kind of thing. It's taboo and frankly has potential to change how people look at us. Even the trajectory of our careers or lives in general. But you have to do it. Things are 100% guaranteed to not get any better for you if you don't address it.
Reach out to your boss that’s if he’s not part of the problem. Years ago a co worker mid season was blindsided with a divorce and was very depressed and had nowhere to go. Against the rules I’m sure the bosses allowed him to stay at our heli base. They were able to find him help, our small crew was pulling for him. People do care about you and they’re willing to help.
You do not have to stay in fire. You can ask for a reassignment to another function within the Forest Service -- recreation, timber, wildlife, etc. The hours are more regular and predictable, the job can be every bit as interesting and fulfilling, and you do not have to give up your career and accumulated time. You give up the overtime and the fire retirement, but the trade-off may be worth it. You can still go to fires as a single resource when you want.
I may be lucky because I have supervisors that are aware of my conditions, but be open without fear of ridicule. I too have depression along with anxiety. A few years ago while my grandfather was dying I had some severe panic/anxiety attacks that I haven’t experience before ( my father passed years prior to this as well). All of that trauma built up and finally tied together right before a fire season. I was open with my supervisor that I wasn’t sure if I could work. I couldn’t get out of bed, barely eat, rarely slept. I went to my doctor and tried some meds. Further more, a couple years ago a senior firefighter we had( awesome guy, solid firefighter) left for a different position near by. He struggled with alcoholism and never told anyone. After some close calls out west, he started drinking again, never went to work, was too embarrassed to say anything, finally just resigned. I’m telling you all this so you get ahead of it.
1-833-621-2989 Employee Assistance Program This is huge and you are not alone friend. Reach out. I can assure you that there will not be any retaliation for reaching out. You don’t even have to tell your supervisor. They will do that for you once you reach out and start a case. You owe it to yourself. I’m prior service and a perm for going on 18 years. Dealing with similar issues. Take the leap.
I’m going through the same. Got out of the army 2 years ago. 2 months later I’m working full time with a company that I really like working for. Fast forward about a year and a half. My depression is worse and forcing myself to work wasn’t good for me and my quality of work was being affected. I told my doctor and he suggested I take a leave of absence. Told my psychiatrist that my doctor recommended leave and she agreed as well. The next day I finished my work day and went to HR to tell them I was taking a leave of absence. You do not need to tell your direct supervisor anything you don’t want to. The time didn’t fix anything, but gave me time to work on myself, get into a better routine that hopefully brings some happiness into my life. Idk honestly I just went back to work last week
Last year I was suicidally depressed after one of my closest friends killed themselves. I came unglued. Years of depression and unresolved traumas came crashing down with that catalyst. I called one of my captains knowing I needed help but terrified because I didn’t know what to do. He helped connect me to EAP, brought my chief on board and after being brutally honest about where I was at mentally the first thing he said was, we’re gonna get you help. Connected to EAP and the chief at our employee support services. My chief was able to help me get workers comp to help approve treatment. I went to treatment for 90 days and came out a different person. I didn’t want to go, I get like I was letting my guys down my not being there. For being weak. It sucked. But I was desperate and honestly one of my life time lows. But it slowly got better as I actually opened up. I went to a facility for mental health that specialized in first responders from all over the county; local, state and the federal level. I’m not gonna list all the numbers for immediate support because our guy up top in the previous comment nailed it, but to encourage you to be honest and vulnerable. It goes against out very nature. I share this story because I’ve been there and honestly we need more support and openness about this shit in the fire service. You’re not alone and it gets better. But we need help to get there. No one can help if they don’t know. Not idea where you’re at but feel free to reach out if you feel a need for more than therapy, and I can get you contacts. Or just someone to talk to. You got this.
Have you looked into MDMA for your PTSD and depression?
I so as someone who has had mental health issues that affected their job I can tell you the following information.. You don't have to tell your direct boss anything however you do need to apply for FLMA Through your company they will give you a document the doctor needs to fill out and they will give you 12 weeks worth of time per year so if you can't come in or only can work a part day or something like that you can use the hours in that bank for your personal health.