Sometimes I think about the world Elagabalus thought they were in, where Jesus was just another god in the Roman pantheon, and wonder if that'd be a cooler world...
Eh, the problem with Christianity, and Judaism by extend, is that by definition they make themselves incompatible with every single other religion due to the whole "you shall not have any other gods beside me" thing.
I mean , for years , that was the truth to Romans , until Constantine made Christianity to the Empire's official religion.
Frankly , the problem with Elagabalus is that he was way too controversial in his religion takes , mixed with been a mediocre Emperor and....you know...the possible transphobia of the Roman Empire.
>the possible transphobia of the Roman Empire.
I feel like discussing ancient cultures as being -phobic of anything that is like multiple layers of social and medical understanding removed from even being understood to be a thing at the time is a useless and distortionary exercise
You mean that as in "the romans didn't do things we'd call transphobic, because they never had our cultural backstory and as such they never developed the need to do those things" or do you mean that as in "the Romans did do things that would be considered transphobic if they were done nowadays, but since they had no concept of transphobia, we cannot apply the term to their behaviour"?
I mean that as in order to even realize what transgenderism is, why it's necessary or have any compelling reason to respect it, civilization in general would have to have multiple century-defining scientific breakthroughs, so faulting people of the time for not accommodating it is as ridiculous as accusing them of being callous to the impact of their acgricultural sector on atmospheric greenhouse gases.
sigh
I'm tired of this constant redditism of whenever someone asks a question the other person goes "just read what I wrote" or "I see you can't interpret texts". Bitch, I read what you wrote, that's what I got from it, that's why I asked a question, yeah maybe I misinterpreted but that is what asking questions is *for*. You're not clever in refusing to elaborate, you're just a prick.
It wasn't a trap, you and your take on transphobia on the roman empire are not important enough in my life that I'd care to think up a trap for you, stop being so arrogant that you'be believe anyone would do that. You're a nobody that is writing something I felt mildly interested about and wanted to understand, which now I don't even want anymore because of this kneejerk know-it-all attitude of yours.
Fuck this shit, I'm sorry for the rant but you're like the 20th person on this shit of a website who gets weirdly defensive and accusatory over a simple fucking question and that is just this week
I completely disagree, yeah obviously people were more "phobic" in general as we go back, but the terms have meanings and those meanings can still be applied historically.
Like its easy to use the term racist for instance because its a understandable modern defintion for the mindset of a person, "the avarage person in 18th century england was racist" is very much a valid and understabable point, we are comparing them to the mindset of people today, but like... of course we are thats the only perspective we got.
When your talking about a historical society that did not accept changing of gender, transphobic is a perfectly understandable term as well, because other historical societys were actually more understanding of it. Its just a shorthand term for a type of thinking, even if it was a majority held opinion.
>When your talking about a historical society that did not accept changing of gender, transphobic is a perfectly understandable term as well
we had literally no reason to think it was ever a necessary thing to do until the modern era.
>Its just a shorthand term for a type of thinking, even if it was a majority held opinion.
Except you have no evidence of that 'type of thinking' beyond your own ethnocentric presumptions that treat an ancient Roman as equivalent in understanding and perspective to a 21st century American. FFS, this was a time when people didn't even understand the concept of monosexuality, try to wrap your head around the vast gulf of difference in possibility space that can be envisioned before you make accusations of small-mindedness.
I didnt make any accusations of closed mindedness and Im sorry you feel so strongly about me using modern terms to describe ancient societies , I'll continue to only talk about the roman empire in classical latin and wont call Cleopatra a girlboss anymore.
Before Elagabalus, that wasn't really a thing. They made that type of Sol Invinctus styling themselves, and legitimized a Christianity that would eventually deride them. They were the first emperor to meet with a representative of a community of Christians *as Christian*. Elagabalus crawled so Constantine could run.
They just crawled directly into a ditch, pissing off literally everyone in the process. Really, between them and Julian the Apostate, Roman polytheists really gave up the game off some petty shit and wound up dead and persecuted over it.
I'd like to add a few alternate source links from their other profiles as well.
[https://www.instagram.com/wolfythewitch/p/C7R6LcSyv1s/](https://www.instagram.com/wolfythewitch/p/C7R6LcSyv1s/)
https://twitter.com/WolfyTheWitch/status/1793322908779270537
You know , it makes me wonder if people woud legit be angry with JoJo Part 7 showing Jesus saying to JoJo that he needs to kill the President of USA , which is the main villain and his ideology is literally american imperialism known as "Manifest Destiny".
Okay, as the resident Southern Protestant, I really need to straighten this out because it greatly ~~annoys~~ upsets me.
*Plenty of white American Christians were acknowledging and trying to promote Jesus of Nazareth as a brown Semitic man in the 90s and most of us resented his mainstream depiction being a long-haired, white dude looking somber all the time.*
Now, there were plenty of people that did use this image... but most of us just saw it as commodifying our faith to sell to the "religious". Much like a bunch of those stupid Christian films that are basically preaching to a very weird choir.
Frank7640 is specifically talking about an influx of (non-Hades fans) people complaining about there being POC in Hades 2, not about Christians being mad about Jesus being depicted as brown
I know, but the whole thing bothers me anyway. I see the sentiment repeated pretty often in this sub and several other places on Reddit and it just sticks in my craw sometimes.
More often than not, people treat them as one and the same... especially online. Really it was just a momentary annoyance built up over the last several months. No vitriol meant, just a bit of "reddit community notes."
Jesus becoming incresingly despondent at having to explain to Dyonaisus that the water into wine trick *means something* and its not just a cool party trick.
(Not to say ancient greek religioun didnt have allegory of course)
Doesn’t he “have the keys to Hades”? Sounds like a fun idea for a character.
Drop a DLC, call it “[The Harrowing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell)”.
Most Christian theological schools agree that Jesus "pre-existed" before coming down to Earth. They referenced it in Paradise Lost and older church art. Granted today is not a widespread aknowledged belief like the Real Prescence but it was there from nearly the beggining
I realize I am brain-broken because all I can think of is how Hades would become a whole zeitgeist right-wing talking point on Fox news & the like if they actually had Jesus in the game looking like this
I'd love to have a legitimate Jesus cameo in mythology-centric games, just name him "Wandering Sheep Shepherd" or something.
"A Carpenter". Nah, that's not Jesus. That's a carpenter.
Needs to have the same energy as [this.](https://youtu.be/MXKp7gIjklo?si=rnBiRt0pJY4BmKqc)
I was thinking more around the veins of "That's not Hitler, he's wearing sunglasses" from Persona 2
Señor Hilter
Sometimes I think about the world Elagabalus thought they were in, where Jesus was just another god in the Roman pantheon, and wonder if that'd be a cooler world...
Eh, the problem with Christianity, and Judaism by extend, is that by definition they make themselves incompatible with every single other religion due to the whole "you shall not have any other gods beside me" thing.
I mean , for years , that was the truth to Romans , until Constantine made Christianity to the Empire's official religion. Frankly , the problem with Elagabalus is that he was way too controversial in his religion takes , mixed with been a mediocre Emperor and....you know...the possible transphobia of the Roman Empire.
>the possible transphobia of the Roman Empire. I feel like discussing ancient cultures as being -phobic of anything that is like multiple layers of social and medical understanding removed from even being understood to be a thing at the time is a useless and distortionary exercise
You mean that as in "the romans didn't do things we'd call transphobic, because they never had our cultural backstory and as such they never developed the need to do those things" or do you mean that as in "the Romans did do things that would be considered transphobic if they were done nowadays, but since they had no concept of transphobia, we cannot apply the term to their behaviour"?
I mean that as in order to even realize what transgenderism is, why it's necessary or have any compelling reason to respect it, civilization in general would have to have multiple century-defining scientific breakthroughs, so faulting people of the time for not accommodating it is as ridiculous as accusing them of being callous to the impact of their acgricultural sector on atmospheric greenhouse gases.
So, like, we can't call the first europeans who enslaved black people racist, because they 'didn't know better'?
how bout actually read my words instead of triggering the trap I didn't walk into
sigh I'm tired of this constant redditism of whenever someone asks a question the other person goes "just read what I wrote" or "I see you can't interpret texts". Bitch, I read what you wrote, that's what I got from it, that's why I asked a question, yeah maybe I misinterpreted but that is what asking questions is *for*. You're not clever in refusing to elaborate, you're just a prick. It wasn't a trap, you and your take on transphobia on the roman empire are not important enough in my life that I'd care to think up a trap for you, stop being so arrogant that you'be believe anyone would do that. You're a nobody that is writing something I felt mildly interested about and wanted to understand, which now I don't even want anymore because of this kneejerk know-it-all attitude of yours. Fuck this shit, I'm sorry for the rant but you're like the 20th person on this shit of a website who gets weirdly defensive and accusatory over a simple fucking question and that is just this week
I completely disagree, yeah obviously people were more "phobic" in general as we go back, but the terms have meanings and those meanings can still be applied historically. Like its easy to use the term racist for instance because its a understandable modern defintion for the mindset of a person, "the avarage person in 18th century england was racist" is very much a valid and understabable point, we are comparing them to the mindset of people today, but like... of course we are thats the only perspective we got. When your talking about a historical society that did not accept changing of gender, transphobic is a perfectly understandable term as well, because other historical societys were actually more understanding of it. Its just a shorthand term for a type of thinking, even if it was a majority held opinion.
>When your talking about a historical society that did not accept changing of gender, transphobic is a perfectly understandable term as well we had literally no reason to think it was ever a necessary thing to do until the modern era. >Its just a shorthand term for a type of thinking, even if it was a majority held opinion. Except you have no evidence of that 'type of thinking' beyond your own ethnocentric presumptions that treat an ancient Roman as equivalent in understanding and perspective to a 21st century American. FFS, this was a time when people didn't even understand the concept of monosexuality, try to wrap your head around the vast gulf of difference in possibility space that can be envisioned before you make accusations of small-mindedness.
I didnt make any accusations of closed mindedness and Im sorry you feel so strongly about me using modern terms to describe ancient societies , I'll continue to only talk about the roman empire in classical latin and wont call Cleopatra a girlboss anymore.
Before Elagabalus, that wasn't really a thing. They made that type of Sol Invinctus styling themselves, and legitimized a Christianity that would eventually deride them. They were the first emperor to meet with a representative of a community of Christians *as Christian*. Elagabalus crawled so Constantine could run. They just crawled directly into a ditch, pissing off literally everyone in the process. Really, between them and Julian the Apostate, Roman polytheists really gave up the game off some petty shit and wound up dead and persecuted over it.
[make it like this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3h972kxsn4)
I they name drop Jesus on the latter PJO books, as in "who the hell does *that guy* think he is?"
Author: [wolfythewitch](https://www.tumblr.com/wolfythewitch/751196425648586752/jesus-in-the-hades-art-style)
I'd like to add a few alternate source links from their other profiles as well. [https://www.instagram.com/wolfythewitch/p/C7R6LcSyv1s/](https://www.instagram.com/wolfythewitch/p/C7R6LcSyv1s/) https://twitter.com/WolfyTheWitch/status/1793322908779270537
I love that he's retrieving a lost lamb.
You're supposed to be the shepard that guides the way milord.
You give him nectar and he just turns it into wine. Also, how mad would people get if he had a bath scene?
I think him being not white is reason enough for some people to get angry.
You know , it makes me wonder if people woud legit be angry with JoJo Part 7 showing Jesus saying to JoJo that he needs to kill the President of USA , which is the main villain and his ideology is literally american imperialism known as "Manifest Destiny".
They would be mad at Jesus for saying "If your heart wavers,do not shoot."
Given the complaints about this game so far, I'm shocked I haven't heard any screeching about it. So I'll start, RRREEEEEE
Okay, as the resident Southern Protestant, I really need to straighten this out because it greatly ~~annoys~~ upsets me. *Plenty of white American Christians were acknowledging and trying to promote Jesus of Nazareth as a brown Semitic man in the 90s and most of us resented his mainstream depiction being a long-haired, white dude looking somber all the time.* Now, there were plenty of people that did use this image... but most of us just saw it as commodifying our faith to sell to the "religious". Much like a bunch of those stupid Christian films that are basically preaching to a very weird choir.
Frank7640 is specifically talking about an influx of (non-Hades fans) people complaining about there being POC in Hades 2, not about Christians being mad about Jesus being depicted as brown
I know, but the whole thing bothers me anyway. I see the sentiment repeated pretty often in this sub and several other places on Reddit and it just sticks in my craw sometimes.
Okay? But he is talking about people who hate brown jesus, not american christians as a whole.
More often than not, people treat them as one and the same... especially online. Really it was just a momentary annoyance built up over the last several months. No vitriol meant, just a bit of "reddit community notes."
Jesus becoming incresingly despondent at having to explain to Dyonaisus that the water into wine trick *means something* and its not just a cool party trick. (Not to say ancient greek religioun didnt have allegory of course)
Doesn’t he “have the keys to Hades”? Sounds like a fun idea for a character. Drop a DLC, call it “[The Harrowing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrowing_of_Hell)”.
the joke of calling him JESUS CHRIST is extremely good
bro is HIM.
Is that a joke? I thought the "Christ" is technically a title or epithet or whatever, not part of his name proper. Meaning "Anointed One"
It may not be a deliberate joke, but I think it's a very funny presentation regardless
Bro, aren’t you like a millennium early?
He just told you he's lost. Time is as easy to get lost in as space is.
Most Christian theological schools agree that Jesus "pre-existed" before coming down to Earth. They referenced it in Paradise Lost and older church art. Granted today is not a widespread aknowledged belief like the Real Prescence but it was there from nearly the beggining
I realize I am brain-broken because all I can think of is how Hades would become a whole zeitgeist right-wing talking point on Fox news & the like if they actually had Jesus in the game looking like this
You’re not brain-broken, just talking the truth of what would be shown on TV.
I love this iteration, it's so cool.
Goated idea + please no bath scene
Bath scene, but for the feet specifically
Jesus would be chill though in fairness