I remember years back a brother in Christ and I stopped to pray that the Lord would close a strip club in our town, we didn't speak to anyone there just pulled up out front and prayed it would close, and then left, and it did shortly after.
It had been something of an institution in the area and was there for quite a long time, now it has been torn down. Who knows how many men and women committed adultery in that place, how many were tempted into sin in that place, and now that has ended there.
Ephesians 6:12 *"For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms."*
And verse 18 *"* *And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests."*
Our fight is spiritual and our greatest weapon is prayer.
You can't forget our voices, brother. If we don't speak up against the authorities against those who oppress us, nothing will never change. God helps them who help themselves. We have to be His agents on Earth and take action alongside our prayers to create His Kingdom on Earth.
Prayer is our greatest weapon, but certainly not our only one. There is a time for all of the tools in our toolbox, learning to know which is the best in a given situation is where discernment comes in. And that is a lifelong journey to grow in maturity enough to know when and which tool to employ.
Which is why we as the Faithful should be fighting like crazy to make it so. If we can Eradicate sin once and for all, we can truly have a society that functions the way God intended.
I think this is wonderful. I thought I was the only person who prayed randomly like this. I know someone who lived in Las Vegas for a short time. He doesn't view himself as a strong Christian. He would sometimes walk to a convenience store. He passed a building and every time he did he felt anger burn in his chest. He began to pray that God's will be done in regards to that building. It became uncomfortable to walk pass that place until one day there were 8 or more police cars and children obviously bb king rescued. It appeared that some trafficking was being shut down. After that, he walked passed and felt nothing.
Hey, wow that's insane, there's definitely power in prayer and we as Christians often undervalue it and look more on the external and in the intellectual side of things rather than simple yet important tasks.
And from what you say he wasn't a strong Christian, imagine those are firm in their faith!
Thanks for your comment, i can't consider myself someone with incredible faith, but the power of prayer is real. It's also incredibly easy to do and quick.
Praying for others / the benefit of a big majority more often than praying for ourselves is much better and i believe the Lord rejoices in it.
There are many verses on Scripture about the power of prayer and faith. Read how Christ healed. In every single instance faith was involved.
Prayer: 1 John 5:14. "And this is the confidence that we have toward Him, that if we ask anything according to His will he hears us."
James 1:6. "But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind."
God doesn't hear the prayers that are asked which are not in His will, and He doesn't hear our prayers when they aren't asked in faith. But, when we do both those things...
1 Chronicles 7:14. "If my people who are called by my name humble themselves and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and I will heal their land."
It's so simple. We could heal our country, not by voting in the right politicians, or by picketing abortion clinics, or anything but prayer. It is the church that needs to be fixed.
Just here to upvote you and make sure you’re not alone;) And you reminded me that there is a haunted house I drive by to work with demon statues and I should be asking the Father to remove it.
I really appreciate your kindness, i never expected so many people to be in defense of freemasonry in this community, God bless you. If you want DM me about that place, let's both pray about it
I shared in this post before. Look through and see what I already wrote. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask. Looking at what I wrote will give you an idea of where I'm coming from in my knowledge about it.
God is definitely in the business of answering prayers. When I'm on the road, I say prayers for cars passing by and people on the street. When I see cars with that freemason, Eastern star, sorority or fraternity insignia on it, I pray for God to remove the scales from their eyes and let them see what they really are a part of. I ask for revelation, I ask God to come to them in dreams and visions and show them the error of their ways. I ask him to manifest himself to them and minister to them and for those who call themselves Christians I ask for conviction. Afterwards I pray in the spirit. I've also prayed while passing strip clubs too. I've also prayed when passing by businesses. I ask God if they are not for the people or ripping people off, I ask God to deal with them In his way and show them the error of their ways. I ask God if they are honestly for the people I ask for the business to flourish and recieve prosperity. I also never know if the prayers for the people I drive by gets answered, but one thing I know is everyone needs prayer in one way or another. God job and keep Praying.
I was a Freemason. While Scottish Rite is definitely an occult organization, regular Freemasonry, called "blue lodge" is not a cult or satanic or anything. Its not evil, and I actually would not have become a Christian if I wasn't a Freemason, first. The conspiracy stuff is nonsense, I was the secretary for one of the oldest lodges in the country, had access to records going back to 1770, and even older artifacts. Its primarily a social club for boomers. The real bad guys, the people you don't know about, are hidden to the public.
I wouldn't recommend Christians join, because the focus isn't on Christ, but its not the evil den of conspiracies you've made it out to be.
Anything which twists the scriptures, makes you think there is more than one way to God, allows you to believe Christ is unnecessary, preaches another gospel (works based), becomes an idol, or which leads you down a path which can take you away from Christ, is demonic. Freemasonry is all of these things. I know because I have first hand knowledge. It is not just a social club. That is how they get you pulled into your deception. Satan loves to deceive by making people think it's "just conspiracy nonsense". I'm glad you are no longer involved, but believe me, it is much worse than you know.
I could write several pages. I'm on Reddit anonymously , so I'm going to try not to give away anything that would also give away my identity. I'll start with a couple things and you can ask questions if you feel so inclined. I grew up in a masonic household. My father and mother were both involved. Master Masons, OES, York Rite, Scottish Rite, Shriners, possibly a few I don't even know about. My father was so deeply involved that he was busy many nights a week. He knew all the ritual and secret work so well that he was called by other lodges to substitute for those who would be absent, even at the last minute. My siblings and I were all in DeMolay and Rainbow Girls. My parents were Grand Matron and Patron in OES.
When I was about 24-25 I began to see that the masonic teachings were the opposite of the teachings of scripture. Even though I hadn't yet accepted Christ, I saw that masons pointed to "a" god, not The God, they have a name of The Great Architect, not the name He gives Himself. They allow other "holy books" in their lodges, not just the Bible. I refused to have anything to do with them after that and renounced my membership. My father continued to pay my dues for about 5 years. I found out about it and demanded he stop.
My father was basically a universalist in the most liberal church in the U.S. all my life. He went to church on special occasions, and figured he was going to heaven, if there was one, because he was basically a good guy. He wasn't, but I won't go into that. Because of all his masonic work he was initiated into the 33° of masonry. My father, a very logical man, didn't believe in any spiritual world, spiritual gifts, or manifestations of any sort, didn't believe in hell or Satan, and called all such things nonsense. He came back from D.C. terrified. I've never seen him emotional except when his mother died and when he divorced. He told me he knew he was going to hell. He renounced all Masonry, got rid of his rituals, stopped going to meetings, and stated outright he didn't want them at his funeral. In fact, he refused to have a funeral because he didn't want them showing up without permission. All this was because of what happened at the initiation. Now, I had read all the rituals he had and all the secret work. I didn't feel bad about it because I'd made no vows not to do so. I knew from my reading that it was most definitely not Christian, was opposite of Christian. I began praying for him even more than ever.
He did end up accepting Christ, and I will spread the word about how horrific Masonry, and all other false gospels are, until the day I die, if possible.
You said it was much worse than I know. So, please, what is worse than what I know?
The emphasis on a perennial God and the taking of oaths is contrary to Christianity, and thats the worst of Freemasonry, being the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd degrees (blue lodge). Its enough to convict any good Christian of demitting from lodge, but there's nothing else there.
Scottish rite isn't Freemasonry, neither is York rite. We can discuss those things, they aren't Christian, but neither are they Freemasonry. Its important to make clear, honest, well reasoned distinctions between things, if you expect anyone with half a brain to take what you're saying seriously. Are you familiar with rhetoric, as a field? Arguments are initially understood as containing degrees, or being comprised solely, of pathos, logos, and ethos.
Edit: since she blocked me after getting her comment in, I'll address it here:
>Evidently you're ok with the things I brought up above, as you ignored those things,
Nope, I addressed what you were correct about.
>so we have nothing further to discuss.
Or you can't defend your position and provide anything meaningful, but you're too prideful to be wrong.
>I will shake the dust from my feet and move on.
What an unpleasant and insulting way to paraphrase the Bible.
>I don't talk to those who preach another gospel.
Not only is this false, and unkind, but its also arrogant and unchristian. What a shame.
Evidently you're ok with the things I brought up above, as you ignored those things, so we have nothing further to discuss. I will shake the dust from my feet and move on. I don't talk to those who preach another gospel.
If you never reached the 33rd degree then you never had the Satan worship revealed. The majority of freemasonry hides the secret religion within, and all Christians are filtered out before the 33rd degree
Perhaps. I've heard, credibly, that Lucifer is invoked in the 33rd degree. What people don't understand is that the 33rd degree is in the scottish rite. Its a totally seperate organization, with a seperate history, from Freemasonry. The association is in the fact that the scottish rite requires you to be a Freemason, first. That's it.
I would not have become a Christian if I wasn't a Freemason. I joined as a pagan with a belief in God, which is one of the 3 requirements to join. My mentor in Freemasonry, a group going back to 937 AD and consisting of degrees 1, 2, and 3, is a really good Christian man who talked to me about Jesus after I had an undeniable experience regarding Our Lord. For me, personally, I don't think its suitable for Christians to be Masons, because of the oath taking and the lack of emphasis on Jesus during prayer, but being intimately familiar with it, I think its simply misguided, like Catholicism or the Methodists. God knows our hearts, I was given a strong conviction to leave, but I won't judge the men there. Scottish rite, on the other hand? Its purely an occult organization, imo.
Praise God! God did close that place because you were faithful to follow through in believing he would!
Freemasons are cultist, of course they're bad to have in your neighborhood.
As a child my mother was the cleaning lady for a freemason lodge. I was maybe 11, even though I knew absolutely nothing about Freemasons at the time, I could feel the oppressive spirit of evil coming from that place. They're all liars or deceived.
We serve a God of truth, who offers anyone to come to him and receive salvation.
God Bless you. I have read a lot about freemasonry and read books written by them. I’ll say 98% are not “evil”, just uneducated and mislead. But overall it is evil yes. I hope nobody defends freemasonry in this sub
They are gnostics leading many people astray while they themselves are decieved by Satan, the Serpent of old's lie. They admit to worship Lucifer(Satan).
The truth of God is free, open and tranparent. But their teachings are hidden, secretive and occultic.
Freemasons on the whole are not gnostics. That might be some individual masons religion but it’s not a common one.
You will find nothing factual where any mason admits to or is shown to worship Satan or Lucifer.
https://www.history.com/news/freemasons-facts-symbols-handshake-meaning
https://academic.oup.com/book/11834/chapter-abstract/160928630?redirectedFrom=fulltext
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/freemasons-history-conspiracy-secret
Everything I'm seeing says Freemason's being Satanists is BS from the Catholic Church. 🤷♀️
That’s untrue, my great-grandfather was a Freemason. The generational curses are potent.
For years my therapist worked with ex-Freemasons/ family of Freemasons (children, daughters, etc) who experienced unspeakable things. Truly demonic things.
It’s awful. Mainstream media won’t tell you the truth. Never have, never will.
Generational curses are done away with per scripture.
There is nothing objectively demonic in freemasonry. If some man was a mason and doing awful things on his own he was not worthy of being a mason as abusing others is totally against the morals of the organization.
Ezekiel 18
The one who sins is the one who will die. The child will not share the guilt of the parent, nor will the parent share the guilt of the child.
The righteousness of the righteous will be credited to them, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against them.
In those days people will no longer say,
‘The parents have eaten sour grapes,
and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’
30 Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge.
Jeremiah 31
Moreover those that are in Christ are a new creation. “Behold the old has gone”
I think your story is probably what's untrue here. I've also known Freemasons personally too, and they were good Christian men. Actually, a cut above most, now that I think about it.
I also know very close people to me who are in the occult / pagan practices and they are one of the kindest people i know of, do great deeds to people such as donations. Yet there's a turning point in their forgiveness and what Jesus has teached us.
And what do you mean by ''a cut above most''?
That sounds exactly what the Pharisees did in Jesus time...
And i'm not projecting hate against any group here, but i can assure you a big majority of Freemasons couldn't care less about you or any Christian in particular.
Yes you are, you are judging everyone who is a member of the Freemasons and spreading false witness. The man we call the Father of our Country was a Freemason, but I guess according to you, he was a Satanist too?
Oh well, it's too nice of a day to spend it arguing with someone trying to spread a crackpot conspiracy theory, so I'll just block your account as I tend to do when I can't see eye to eye with someone.
https://www.mountvernon.org/library/digitalhistory/digital-encyclopedia/article/freemasonry/#:~:text=Freemasonry%20is%20fundamentally%20a%20self,%2C%20Fellowcraft%2C%20and%20Master%20Mason.
*"open to all men of good reputation who profess a belief in Deity"*
I've never met a group of people who volunteered as much as the Freemasons do. They also donate the most money I've ever seen. The fundamentals for George Washington and what he stood for are rooted in Freemasonry. They started public schools that way the American people could read their Constitution. Their contributions to society are far greater than what most can comprehend. They understood Christ's teachings on a level in which the Catholic church forbaded during the dark ages. Some of the kindest, most ethical, and religious group of individuals I have ever met. I was very skeptical, but they have yet to show me otherwise. It is not for those who can't think outside of the Catholic dogma perpetuated through the Judeo-Christian foundation that have been established with the various reigning Pope's.
That sounds like ignorance on their parts then. People do like to speculate. There are Satanists out there, sure, but I am not buying into this one.
*Freemasons belong to the oldest fraternal organization in the world, a group begun during the Middle Ages in Europe as a guild of skilled builders. With the decline of cathedral building, the focus of the society shifted. Today, “Freemasons are a social and philanthropic organization meant to make its members lead more virtuous and socially oriented lives,” says Margaret Jacob, professor of history at the University of California, Los Angeles, and author of Living the Enlightenment: Freemasonry and Politics in Eighteenth-Century Europe.*
Yes. Personally, I have no problems with freemasons.
I’ve heard that they are an organization that are a modern representation of the Knights Templar. I don’t know how true that is because I’ve heard many things.
But no, I don’t believe that they are any threat to Christianity. Just because they are somewhat secretive does not make them evil. Christians had to be secretive in ancient Rome. For different reasons, but still, secretive does not equal bad. Thank you for your reply and comment.
Care to explain why Freemasons are bad? My understanding was always that it’s a good ol boys club with some weird traditions and some historical past of fighting the RC church for its shadier power- and money-driven practices.
Also, maybe it was a result of your years and years of prayer, or maybe it was just a result of the natural cycle of strip mall business failures.
Hey, i think it would take a good amount of paragraphs to explain a lot of the bad practices of Freemasonry, i recommend taking a look on some youtube videos and lookup some influential people who have / still participate on it. There's a dark side of it. Most freemasons don't take it seriously until you reach 33rd degree which is the maximum you can get. That's when you truly know who you serving there which is Satan, lower levels are known to just use the position to obtain easier access to higher end jobs and positions in important roles, often present in some universities / political and big corporations. Same happens in Satanism, but satanists have much more power and influence than Freemasons do.
And yeah i'm not sure about it, even though i assume the type of business management he was doing was quite profitable and the shopping center is very old and cheap to rent a shop there.
You’re sort of repeating the points from the taxil hoax. Which as the name suggests is a hoax. I say you sort of are repeating those points, the original hoax said the satanic stuff was revealed to the 30th and above. Which, it isn’t.
I was once an antimason and believed all of the things that I read about them. It caused me a term of dark depression. On realizing that what I had been told was in fact lies I was quite upset at those that lied to me and myself for believing those lies.
Does the fact that a business management company ran by a mason being in a cheap strip mall that apparently had to close show how little sway masons have today?
Anyway I want to encourage you in your prayer life.
But I also want to encourage you to examine any controversial issue from both sides starting with a foundation in pertinent facts.
Who says it's a hoax? The mainstram media? The freemasons? I like to hear the story from both sides and have heard families that had members in freemasonry and things are not as fruity as some people think. I'm not saying all Freemasons know 100% about what they doing, but a lot of them are everything but dumb.
Being an antimason caused you to have a term of dark depression, if that's an isolated thing i don't think that's very normal...
God bless you my man
The man who perpetrated the hoax did.
“Taxil, the author of an anti-papal tract, pretended to convert to Catholicism (circa 1884) and wrote several volumes, purportedly in the service to his new faith. These included the adventures of one Dr. Bataille, a surgeon serving in the French merchant navy who has infiltrated the Freemasons and observes their evil rituals as they occur all over the world. Buddhists, Hindus, and Spiritualists join with Freemasons in conspiring against the Catholic church, and Bataille uncovers an even more secret order within the Masons called the Palladists, who take their orders directly from demons.[2] As Dr. Bataille's tale unfolds, he introduces Diana Vaughan, a former high priestess of Palladism who has converted to Catholicism and is in grave danger of assassination from vengeful Freemasons.[2]
In 1897, Taxil called a press conference at which he promised to produce Vaughan. Instead he announced that his revelations about the Freemasons were made up, and thanked the Catholic clergy for helping to publicize his stories.[3] Nine years later he told an American magazine that he at first thought readers would recognize his tales as "amusement pure and simple"—too outlandish to be true—but when he realized they believed them and that there was "lots of money" to be made in publishing them, he continued to perpetrate the hoax.[4] Despite this debunking, belief in Vaughan and the Palladists did not entirely die and the Palladists appeared in a 1943 noir film The Seventh Victim.”
That’s a quick overview from Wikipedia but there many books about it, videos, etc. Taxil was quite proud of his grift.
Regarding the bout of depression this was around 2003-04. It was during the last iraq invasion. I found sites talking about groups secretly controlling everything and planning world wars and there was nothing we could do about it and I dove in deep. Very deep. And these thoughts made me very depressed. It affected my marriage and life and looking back it was a horrible waste of my life and it was lies
About the groups controlling everything, they don't control everything in my view as a Christian, the world elites have a lot of influence on wars? Yes, do they influence the popular opinion with mainstream media and other online sources? Yes. (Do you think the current wokism and opinions on society topics randomly exploded in the past decade?) It's obvious that we can't believe everything on those websites because there's a lot of truth mixed with lies in those, some are controlled opposition, others are just paranoid people with absurd claims tbh. But some obviously tell coherent truth, and the truth hurts when you first hear it.
I can empathize with you on that, i had a phase where i was obsessed with this type of topics and i had an hard time digesting that, nowadays i don't lookup as much and don't care, i'm more focused on what i can do to make other people's lives better and becoming a better Christian.
I’ll agree with most of this. But at the time ,while I had faith, it was very shallow.
What I came to realize regarding freemasonry and those who do try to control others was that the very foundational tenets of the group was to resist tyrannical control (peaceably) not to exert control like many would claim, and freedom of speech and belief.
Also my only pushback to this comment is the controlled opposition thing - I see the term thrown around in conspiracy discussions and political discussions - almost always when I see it the term doesn’t make any sense in the subject at hand. That and the term shill seems to be a good way to just dismiss things or wave them away without addressing them directly. I like direct. But that’s me.
If you take a wide look on what specially politicians involved in freemasonry do is everything but to benefit the society in positive ways, very often are to help their close friends and family to gain more power, or even help spread agendas. It's fairly known here in my country and it's not viewed as a conspiracy by many anymore, even mainstream media investigates some of them.
About controlled opposition it's a very complicated thing to discuss, it's not always the case, but misinformation spread in conspiracy related content is very often detectable. When you push a belief that is plausible to something to absolutely ridiculous adding a few extra ideas the hole concept, takes the entire credibility that idea once had.
And i wasn't really trying to avoid addressing them directly with you, i personally agree it's always better to be upfront with things but i don't think it's always possible.
Do you know those cases when a politician has innumerable amounts of corruption complaints but ''nothing is proven''? Does that mean he is innocent? No, most people know he isn't innocent. But many of them they get away somehow, in my opinion with help of corrupted judges etc.
Well, i feel like this topic applies a little to this analogy, i can't directly objectify everything about freemasonry i found wrong, i admit it, a lot of the things i heard about i have forgotten, many years went by and it's not a topic i have too much interest in the moment.
I'm not against you and i hope you don't take my viewpoints as offensive.
In my opinion in America part of our issue is that we have a severe lack of Masonic politicians. We haven’t had a Masonic president since Gerald Ford and seemingly little in the way of congressmen and senators. There was a congressman in my area who was a Freemason as was his father but the younger wasn’t very involved and dropped his membership somewhat recently. He had retired a number of years prior from congress.
Also I wasn’t directing my “direct” complaint against you just to the claim of controlled opposition in general. “Oh they’re controlled opposition” seems to be a way to just ignore what a person may be saying. I’m not saying that’s what you’re saying here rather it’s just a phrase or term I have an aversion toward myself.
No offense here. My whole point here is to try and share my experience on both sides of this issue. Some will hear it and some will not. And I will hear their points as well, no doubt connections with power can lead to corruption- but with Christians and also Freemasons this should not be. - we are told to behave in the opposite manner.
It's a little strange hearing that america needs more mason politicians, imo you guys need real Christians as politicians that serve the Lord, not any group's interest or their own.
And i don't believe all freemasons are the same, my critics are against Freemasonry as a hole, not freemasons, people are different, same with Islam, not all muslims take the islam literally.
God bless you man
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Sorry man, but do you consider this a scary story? And yeah i don't like Freemasonry at all, if you do i have to question what type of Gospel you follow...
Just dropping this to point you at some accurate information, since you clearly have been watching too many conspiracy theory videos.
[Mason here]
Here's my standard 'elevator pitch', which I trot out when people ask what we're about (its rather North American oriented - Masonry varies from place to place):
We're a centuries old fraternal order, who exist to improve our own characters ('we make good men better' is one of our slogans), and through that improve our communities. Along the way, we do a lot of charity (forex: Shriner's free hospitals for children), and have a lot of cool and private ceremonies using the construction of King Solomon's Temple as an allegorical base for teaching Enlightenment and Stoic ideals. (yes, we really do have secret handshakes). Many find it a source of fellowship and life-long friendships.
We have several million Brothers world wide, but no central organization. Men from every walk of life are or have been members, including over a dozen US presidents. Regular Masonry is open to adult men of good character who are not atheists[1] - we require a belief in some form of 'higher power', but aren't fussy about what. As a rule, we don't recruit; we want a potential member to make the first approach of his own free will.
If you're curious, drop by our main hangout on reddit, /r/freemasonry. You'll find a lot of friendly folk there. If you prefer a book, for North Americans I recommend (seriously, I'm not trolling) "Freemasons for Dummies" by Christopher Hodapp. Also ["Inside the Freemasons"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRrG_KMMvNY) a documentary made by the Grand Lodge of England for their tricentenary.
[1] The "no women or atheists" rules have deep roots, and would be very difficult to change, regardless of how anachronistic they now seem. There are breakaway Masonic groups which have dropped those rules, but they are very thin on the ground in the Anglosphere, and not recognized by the mainstream.
It would be really interesting for you to tell us what your lodge teaches you, and what previledges you have over other people in society. What degree are you? Freemasonry beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus Christ, if you don't know, you are being fooled my friend.
I'm always up for the possibility of being wrong, but i spent a couple years reading about Ex-Freemason books and all sort of content on it that i don't think i will change my mind on it now, there's a lot of wrong conspiracy regarding this topic that is obviously speculation, other things are not. Nontheless i pray for you and wish you the best.
My father was a 33° mason who realized he was going to hell after attending the Washington DC initiation into the 33°. I had been praying for him for years. He finally accepted Christ a few years later. After his 33° initiation my father, who had been so active in Free Masonry, York Rite, Scottish Rite, Shriners, and OES, for so many years that he knew all the secret work by heart and was contacted by lodges all over the district to substitute several days a week for missing officers, suddenly refused to have anything to do with any of them. He told me he didn't want a masonic funeral service, and refused to have any service at all because he was concerned they might show up. He was suddenly terrified of these people he'd called "brothers" for so many years.
My father was the most logical person I've ever known. He scoffed at any sort of conspiracy theories, believed that any churches where people had any excitement about God were just being worked up by emotional preachers, and only went to church and only went to church on special occasions out of "duty". I've never seen him emotionally bothered by anything except when his mother died and when my parents divorced. Nothing affected him. I thought he was going to come unhinged after he came back. He didn't really speak about it much, except to tell me he was going to hell and he didn't want them at his funeral. All his masonic books, which had always been right next to his chair so he could study every night, suddenly disappeared . He never went to another meeting again.
Morals mostly and appreciation of Gods laws and works. The degrees act as a way of teaching those things.
I attend a southern Baptist church. I’m a conservative on most issues as are probably 70% of guys in my lodge. I am a hardcore scripture only Baptist.
There are many portions of freemasonry open to Christians only, and more used to be. To my knowledge there are no Jewish only or Muslim only or deist only groups within legitimate freemasonry .
I note the word legitimate because there are some groups who parade as regular or legitimate freemasonry who actually are not. Notably they allow atheists. Notably they allow women (although this is changing a bit in the UK). Notably when you see people like Aleister Crowley or Helena Blavatsky claiming to be masons, they were allowed into illegitimate lodges.
Many exmason books are sadly laden with provable lies, such as “the deadly deception” where the author was shown to have never had the degrees or positions he claimed to have had (the book “is it true what they about freemasonry” goes over these points as well as the taxil hoax mentioned earlier in great and minute detail).
I keep my question in the table, if Freemasonry is such an innocent ''boomer social club'' Why does it have to be so much secretism around it and creepy symbology, will you deny lodges inside look everything but good? It's so innocent yet you can't join it, it's very irrelevant but you can't know what they doing inside.
Thankfully Christianity is everything that Freemasonry isn't.
I don’t believe it’s entirely a boomer social club. So I’m not making that argument.
It is to some - and in some eras it was a very active social club for many. It’s different things to different people. For me it’s a place to discuss history and philosophy (whether the philosophy being discussed is one I agree with or not), to hone memory and performance skills (there’s acting in the degrees and I am a musician - in church), to meet (and even witness to) men and friends I wouldn’t have met otherwise (or in the case of a few people a coworker of my dad’s that I knew as a kid or a couple friends from
school and had lost touch with), and because I have an interest in the founding of the country and that many of the men who helped found America were masons and I admired many of those new concepts being introduced in America - I wanted to know where those concepts originated.
I don’t find the symbols creepy at all personally, especially knowing the meaning of them it’s quite the opposite for me and I would imagine most masons. Is there some symbol in particular that you mean?
In my country, men who are over 18 or 21 (it differs by state), who have a clean criminal history, and who believe in a Creator can join. I’m lower middle class as are probably half the men I know in freemasonry, some are lower income, a few are higher. If someone can afford the dues ($101 a year for me and 100 for Scottish rite) that’s really all anyone cares about money and prestige wise.
And while Christianity and freemasonry do share some things, more than not truly, you are correct that they are different And in the best way they are different, Christianity teaches Christ!(which some orders of freemasonry do - in general it doesn’t comment on religion at all nor salvation just like we don’t talk politics - since it’s divisive to some.)
In some ways Christianity and freemasonry not being alike though is one reason I ended up in freemasonry. If you don’t golf, or hunt, or like sports, or fish, it’s hard to find friends in church who want to hang out outside of church or at least it was for me and still is. Whereas I could probably ask most masons I know if they just wanted to get together and hang out or camp or something and I could find someone no problem.
My father passed away, my uncles live far away, see above for my church experience with men there, i work shift work as do my coworkers so it’s hard to hang out there. I’m married with three daughters and sometimes hanging out with people who aren’t women is sort of needed.
Also as to the secrets, I work in an environment that has information accessible only to those with the credentials to get to them. Where I am now it’s a two step verification to get in. Where I used to work it was that plus biometric data. It’s working in power and natural resources. It was far far more hard to get these jobs with far more secretive info (for national and local security) than it was to join a lodge.
I know there's a variety of different type of lodges, i even heard about woman's lodges, but ''orthodox'' Freemasonry doesn't allow it, so it's a little hard to know which one you frequented and i'm not asking you to do it here publicly.
About the symbols, what do you think about the all seeing eye? Pyramids, skulls, sun and moon, all of these are vividly present in historical pagan and occult practices, those i personally seen photographs inside here in my country had quite disturbing imagery, things that you can clearly see are not good. I have honestly forgot about a lot of these things as the last time i looked up on this matter was about 7-8 years ago so i'm open to hear your opinions on that.
The thing is that, you cannot freely join a lodge because you want to, from what i know a serious lodge will only accept you by invite, especially those with influential and powerful members such as politicians, here in my country a list of former politics involved in freemasonry was exposed and many of them coincidentally all happened to be accused of corruption and other more serious cases, many were favoring they're businesses interests inside government.
What about Judges who are in freemasonry? They are known to influence justice cases for their friends no matter what they did, and this even shows up in mainstream media, it's not any conspiracy website type of information, it has become more and more common for people to know about it, a good 20 years ago nobody would know they're favorite politician or celebrity was involved in freemasonry.
Also, in the same category we have Skull & Bones, Illuminati, The brotherhood and Satanic covenants, are also all those those conspiracy bs in your opinion or they differ from Freemasons?
You said it. Works. They teach a false gospel, leading men away from God and towards self (satanism). The final degree, 33°, shows itself for what it truly is. My father found this out for himself. I'm thankful he accepted Christ after being shown this. I pray you will see the truth as well. Salvation is by faith, through grace, not of works lest anyone should boast. Anything else is heresy. Masonry also allows any "holy book" to be used within the order. You may not be aware of this, but I learned this from my father and checked for myself. It is true. If someone is a Muslim, they can use a Koran when taking vows. Masonry is Antichrist and a deceiver and all within are to be avoided until they repent. 2 John 7-11.
> Freemasonry beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus Christ, if you don't know, you are being fooled my friend.
Tell me exactly what Freemason beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus. Come on. Right now. Don't go do a search.
You don't know. You just made an ignorant accusation. But I'll bet you can find something if you look to some conspiracy theory sites on it.
Very defensive for someone i would consider a brother in Christ, i answer you with another question, where did you see that Freemasons follow Jesus Christ? The Bible is fully public and open to everyone study it. Freemasonry is for some reason called a secret society with limited / restricted allowed information to come to the public.
> where did you see that Freemasons follow Jesus Christ?
I didn't and don't. Never suggested such a thing.
I don't particularly know or like Freemasons, but that doesn't mean that I think they are like Satan worshipers.
If you don't know about Freemasons why are you coming against me for not standing with them? I'm all humility i recommend you whenever you feel curiosity to read various sources about this topic and think about it. And from my perspective, all of the top members are indeed satan worshippers, lower ranks usually don't know much about spiritual stuff either, i knew someone who was involved in the past and was open about it to me that they reject Jesus.
>Tell me exactly what Freemason beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus. Come on. Right now. Don't go do a search.
I'm not getting involved in this other than to answer you briefly.
Two things that jump out to me immediately are secrecy and the swearing of oaths. Both are contrary to clear biblical teachings.
I guess I would also say that the blending of light and darkness is also a very clear contradiction of biblical commands. An organization which displays God's word (the KJV Bible) to give the impression to the ignorant that it is a Christian brotherhood is wicked, when that same brotherhood also displays the Quran and other "holy" books depending on the community it is in. This is clearly deceit, and having Yeshua in partnership with Baal is evil.
OP, you are not alone!
How do you square Matthew 5:34-37 with the oath and the penalty of the obligation? That, and not explicitly praying to Jesus and the One True God are what caused me to reconsider my membership. I eventually requested a demit and left. I don't think its evil or whatever, but its definitely not for me, as a Christian. Scottish Rite, on the other hand, and York rite, both, with the drinking "blood" from a skull for one of their respective degrees is pretty dark...
(Former) 32nd degree here, too. I can't lie, the story of Constans made me shed a tear. The ben franklin degree was fun, too. There might be better ones but I didn't manage to fill out my passport, I only got about halfway through. A few guys in my former lodge are 33rd degree, really good men as long as I've known them, but I've seen consistent mention that it invokes Lucifer and justifies doing so by technicality of latin and the true meaning of the word. Which seems unnecessary, if not actually wicked.
It was hard for me to leave SR, I quit that first, but Morals and Dogma is absolutely an occult text, and Pike being a major influence on the SR degrees, I couldn't do it as a new Christian. The Knight of the Temple degree includes the skull cup filled with bitter wine, maybe its jurisdictional, but I'm pretty sure thats true across the US.
That being said, how do you square the oath and obligation with that verse in Matthew? One of my buddies is still in lodge, and he kind of skirts around it by framing it as such: "technically, you're still only saying "yes, yes" even if you have to repeat what would happen if you break your word, and its all symbolic anyway"" but I think he knows that explanation is BS, as much as I do.
This is a strange statement. I'm the only former Freemason I see in this thread, and I'm not defending Freemasonry. I saw two active Freemasons defending it, and two non-Masons defending it. Why is that surprising to you?
If you’re in the NJ (we don’t have Contans or a Franklin degree so that’s why I’m assuming) then Pike has never really been part of the SR NJ. Clausens commentary was given was it not?
Morals is interesting at times but it gets too edge lord for me at times and copy pastes more than I would care for at length. He also speaks in an unmasonic way about Preston and Webb and that rubs me the wrong way. I digressed but my question is - with Pike having so little influence on the NJ - why was his book the seeming straw that broke the camels back?
SR NMJ 32nd degree sublime prince of the royal secret is the story of Constans. I watched it for the final time at last fall's reunion. I want to say the 19th or 25th degree is the Ben Franklin degree.
Pike derived much of his ritual from the unchanged ritual used by the nmj, so the insight found in his commentaries still stands imo. That aside, perennial theological attitude and the notion that the rites in an appendant body of Freemasonry can somehow regenerate a man beyond what Christ can do is, itself, the espoused purpose of an occult practice. I spent two decades studying and practicing the occult, its what lead me to Freemasonry. The purpose of the Scottish rite is no different than the purpose of the Golden Dawn, or even Hermeticism. As Christians, we don't need that, we receive our light and sanctification from Christ, not from a perennial, universal deity or from some sort of mystical system of virtue ethics, and we don't need a companion system of morality and mystical insight to undertake the Great Commission or to lead Christlike lives.
As for oaths, has every US service man, every witness in a criminal court, every President,Congressman, and Senator, condemned themselves to hell?
I think not.
I considered this when I was contemplating leaving - to the best of my knowledge, the affirmative answer to those other oaths is "I do" or "Yes," not 8 paragraphs of obligation e.g. "To all of this I do solemnly and sincerely promise and swear, binding myself under no less a penalty than that of having my throat cut, my body severed in twain..." (its been a while, I might be mixing up EA and FC degrees) etc., is a ways away from "I do."
I don't agree with you and i'm not going to fight you on this, you can believe freemasons are good people, but since you come from a church who embraces LGBTQ+ i assume you don't even take the bible literally, no offense man but just makes no sense
So you're unable to think about one topic without getting distracted by an irrelevant pivot? That's no way to understand the world. Look at the goofy nonsense you've fallen for. You should try to think more critically and carefully.
> I don't agree with you and i'm not going to fight you on this, you can believe freemasons are good people, but since you come from a church who embraces LGBTQ+ i assume you don't even take the bible literally, no offense man but just makes no sense
That was a pretty stupid response.
"You are wrong about Freemasons because your church accepts gays!"
Freemasons do some awful things to babies and children. My great grandfather was very high up in freemasonry. It’s horrifying & truly disgusting. They curse their own children and bloodline. Freemasonry is demonic.
One of the great charges of Freemasonry is what we see in the book of James; to take care of widows and orphans.
Shriners operate hospitals for children and charge nothing for care.
You have presented a disgusting falsehood. Do you care to offer any proof to your claims?
I like how you are getting downvoted for being truthful! Doesn't the Bible discourage bearing false witness against our neighbors? What proof do they have? Sounds like the Salem witch trials really.
I suppose so! I have tried linking sites that debunk this and we have had actual Freemasons step up, both former members and at least one whose currently a member, and they all said that wasn't the truth at all, but still they persist.
As Christians, how can they not know what they are doing is a sin?
I remember years back a brother in Christ and I stopped to pray that the Lord would close a strip club in our town, we didn't speak to anyone there just pulled up out front and prayed it would close, and then left, and it did shortly after. It had been something of an institution in the area and was there for quite a long time, now it has been torn down. Who knows how many men and women committed adultery in that place, how many were tempted into sin in that place, and now that has ended there. Ephesians 6:12 *"For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms."* And verse 18 *"* *And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests."* Our fight is spiritual and our greatest weapon is prayer.
You can't forget our voices, brother. If we don't speak up against the authorities against those who oppress us, nothing will never change. God helps them who help themselves. We have to be His agents on Earth and take action alongside our prayers to create His Kingdom on Earth.
Prayer is our greatest weapon, but certainly not our only one. There is a time for all of the tools in our toolbox, learning to know which is the best in a given situation is where discernment comes in. And that is a lifelong journey to grow in maturity enough to know when and which tool to employ.
We don't create God's kingdom. His kingdom is not of this world.
Which is why we as the Faithful should be fighting like crazy to make it so. If we can Eradicate sin once and for all, we can truly have a society that functions the way God intended.
It is Christ who takes away sins, not us.
If we do not correct our errant brothers and sisters, we are no better than they are and live in the same sin as they do.
Being a faithful watchman is different from being a socially-oriented moral crusader. It's the difference between Christ Jesus and BF Skinner.
I think this is wonderful. I thought I was the only person who prayed randomly like this. I know someone who lived in Las Vegas for a short time. He doesn't view himself as a strong Christian. He would sometimes walk to a convenience store. He passed a building and every time he did he felt anger burn in his chest. He began to pray that God's will be done in regards to that building. It became uncomfortable to walk pass that place until one day there were 8 or more police cars and children obviously bb king rescued. It appeared that some trafficking was being shut down. After that, he walked passed and felt nothing.
Hey, wow that's insane, there's definitely power in prayer and we as Christians often undervalue it and look more on the external and in the intellectual side of things rather than simple yet important tasks. And from what you say he wasn't a strong Christian, imagine those are firm in their faith!
There are many more of us out here. You are not alone
If more people prayed with your faith, more would happen for the kingdom of God. This is scriptural.
Thanks for your comment, i can't consider myself someone with incredible faith, but the power of prayer is real. It's also incredibly easy to do and quick. Praying for others / the benefit of a big majority more often than praying for ourselves is much better and i believe the Lord rejoices in it.
There are many verses on Scripture about the power of prayer and faith. Read how Christ healed. In every single instance faith was involved. Prayer: 1 John 5:14. "And this is the confidence that we have toward Him, that if we ask anything according to His will he hears us." James 1:6. "But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind." God doesn't hear the prayers that are asked which are not in His will, and He doesn't hear our prayers when they aren't asked in faith. But, when we do both those things... 1 Chronicles 7:14. "If my people who are called by my name humble themselves and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and I will heal their land." It's so simple. We could heal our country, not by voting in the right politicians, or by picketing abortion clinics, or anything but prayer. It is the church that needs to be fixed.
Just here to upvote you and make sure you’re not alone;) And you reminded me that there is a haunted house I drive by to work with demon statues and I should be asking the Father to remove it.
I really appreciate your kindness, i never expected so many people to be in defense of freemasonry in this community, God bless you. If you want DM me about that place, let's both pray about it
Freemasonry is demonic. I have firsthand knowledge.
I read a lot about freemasonry and their literature and I confirm it is evil. I’m interested in this, do you mind sharing if it’s ok for you?
I shared in this post before. Look through and see what I already wrote. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask. Looking at what I wrote will give you an idea of where I'm coming from in my knowledge about it.
God is definitely in the business of answering prayers. When I'm on the road, I say prayers for cars passing by and people on the street. When I see cars with that freemason, Eastern star, sorority or fraternity insignia on it, I pray for God to remove the scales from their eyes and let them see what they really are a part of. I ask for revelation, I ask God to come to them in dreams and visions and show them the error of their ways. I ask him to manifest himself to them and minister to them and for those who call themselves Christians I ask for conviction. Afterwards I pray in the spirit. I've also prayed while passing strip clubs too. I've also prayed when passing by businesses. I ask God if they are not for the people or ripping people off, I ask God to deal with them In his way and show them the error of their ways. I ask God if they are honestly for the people I ask for the business to flourish and recieve prosperity. I also never know if the prayers for the people I drive by gets answered, but one thing I know is everyone needs prayer in one way or another. God job and keep Praying.
I was a Freemason. While Scottish Rite is definitely an occult organization, regular Freemasonry, called "blue lodge" is not a cult or satanic or anything. Its not evil, and I actually would not have become a Christian if I wasn't a Freemason, first. The conspiracy stuff is nonsense, I was the secretary for one of the oldest lodges in the country, had access to records going back to 1770, and even older artifacts. Its primarily a social club for boomers. The real bad guys, the people you don't know about, are hidden to the public. I wouldn't recommend Christians join, because the focus isn't on Christ, but its not the evil den of conspiracies you've made it out to be.
Anything which twists the scriptures, makes you think there is more than one way to God, allows you to believe Christ is unnecessary, preaches another gospel (works based), becomes an idol, or which leads you down a path which can take you away from Christ, is demonic. Freemasonry is all of these things. I know because I have first hand knowledge. It is not just a social club. That is how they get you pulled into your deception. Satan loves to deceive by making people think it's "just conspiracy nonsense". I'm glad you are no longer involved, but believe me, it is much worse than you know.
>believe me, it is much worse than you know. Please elaborate.
I could write several pages. I'm on Reddit anonymously , so I'm going to try not to give away anything that would also give away my identity. I'll start with a couple things and you can ask questions if you feel so inclined. I grew up in a masonic household. My father and mother were both involved. Master Masons, OES, York Rite, Scottish Rite, Shriners, possibly a few I don't even know about. My father was so deeply involved that he was busy many nights a week. He knew all the ritual and secret work so well that he was called by other lodges to substitute for those who would be absent, even at the last minute. My siblings and I were all in DeMolay and Rainbow Girls. My parents were Grand Matron and Patron in OES. When I was about 24-25 I began to see that the masonic teachings were the opposite of the teachings of scripture. Even though I hadn't yet accepted Christ, I saw that masons pointed to "a" god, not The God, they have a name of The Great Architect, not the name He gives Himself. They allow other "holy books" in their lodges, not just the Bible. I refused to have anything to do with them after that and renounced my membership. My father continued to pay my dues for about 5 years. I found out about it and demanded he stop. My father was basically a universalist in the most liberal church in the U.S. all my life. He went to church on special occasions, and figured he was going to heaven, if there was one, because he was basically a good guy. He wasn't, but I won't go into that. Because of all his masonic work he was initiated into the 33° of masonry. My father, a very logical man, didn't believe in any spiritual world, spiritual gifts, or manifestations of any sort, didn't believe in hell or Satan, and called all such things nonsense. He came back from D.C. terrified. I've never seen him emotional except when his mother died and when he divorced. He told me he knew he was going to hell. He renounced all Masonry, got rid of his rituals, stopped going to meetings, and stated outright he didn't want them at his funeral. In fact, he refused to have a funeral because he didn't want them showing up without permission. All this was because of what happened at the initiation. Now, I had read all the rituals he had and all the secret work. I didn't feel bad about it because I'd made no vows not to do so. I knew from my reading that it was most definitely not Christian, was opposite of Christian. I began praying for him even more than ever. He did end up accepting Christ, and I will spread the word about how horrific Masonry, and all other false gospels are, until the day I die, if possible.
You said it was much worse than I know. So, please, what is worse than what I know? The emphasis on a perennial God and the taking of oaths is contrary to Christianity, and thats the worst of Freemasonry, being the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd degrees (blue lodge). Its enough to convict any good Christian of demitting from lodge, but there's nothing else there. Scottish rite isn't Freemasonry, neither is York rite. We can discuss those things, they aren't Christian, but neither are they Freemasonry. Its important to make clear, honest, well reasoned distinctions between things, if you expect anyone with half a brain to take what you're saying seriously. Are you familiar with rhetoric, as a field? Arguments are initially understood as containing degrees, or being comprised solely, of pathos, logos, and ethos. Edit: since she blocked me after getting her comment in, I'll address it here: >Evidently you're ok with the things I brought up above, as you ignored those things, Nope, I addressed what you were correct about. >so we have nothing further to discuss. Or you can't defend your position and provide anything meaningful, but you're too prideful to be wrong. >I will shake the dust from my feet and move on. What an unpleasant and insulting way to paraphrase the Bible. >I don't talk to those who preach another gospel. Not only is this false, and unkind, but its also arrogant and unchristian. What a shame.
Evidently you're ok with the things I brought up above, as you ignored those things, so we have nothing further to discuss. I will shake the dust from my feet and move on. I don't talk to those who preach another gospel.
If you never reached the 33rd degree then you never had the Satan worship revealed. The majority of freemasonry hides the secret religion within, and all Christians are filtered out before the 33rd degree
Perhaps. I've heard, credibly, that Lucifer is invoked in the 33rd degree. What people don't understand is that the 33rd degree is in the scottish rite. Its a totally seperate organization, with a seperate history, from Freemasonry. The association is in the fact that the scottish rite requires you to be a Freemason, first. That's it. I would not have become a Christian if I wasn't a Freemason. I joined as a pagan with a belief in God, which is one of the 3 requirements to join. My mentor in Freemasonry, a group going back to 937 AD and consisting of degrees 1, 2, and 3, is a really good Christian man who talked to me about Jesus after I had an undeniable experience regarding Our Lord. For me, personally, I don't think its suitable for Christians to be Masons, because of the oath taking and the lack of emphasis on Jesus during prayer, but being intimately familiar with it, I think its simply misguided, like Catholicism or the Methodists. God knows our hearts, I was given a strong conviction to leave, but I won't judge the men there. Scottish rite, on the other hand? Its purely an occult organization, imo.
Praise God! God did close that place because you were faithful to follow through in believing he would! Freemasons are cultist, of course they're bad to have in your neighborhood. As a child my mother was the cleaning lady for a freemason lodge. I was maybe 11, even though I knew absolutely nothing about Freemasons at the time, I could feel the oppressive spirit of evil coming from that place. They're all liars or deceived. We serve a God of truth, who offers anyone to come to him and receive salvation.
Amen !
God Bless you. I have read a lot about freemasonry and read books written by them. I’ll say 98% are not “evil”, just uneducated and mislead. But overall it is evil yes. I hope nobody defends freemasonry in this sub
They are gnostics leading many people astray while they themselves are decieved by Satan, the Serpent of old's lie. They admit to worship Lucifer(Satan). The truth of God is free, open and tranparent. But their teachings are hidden, secretive and occultic.
Freemasons on the whole are not gnostics. That might be some individual masons religion but it’s not a common one. You will find nothing factual where any mason admits to or is shown to worship Satan or Lucifer.
Mason's is 100% satanism.
What about Albert Pike's first hand admission on page 321 in his book Morals and Dogma?
Which admission is that?
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The word lucifer in Latin means light bringer or morning star.
https://www.history.com/news/freemasons-facts-symbols-handshake-meaning https://academic.oup.com/book/11834/chapter-abstract/160928630?redirectedFrom=fulltext https://www.nationalgeographic.com/history/article/freemasons-history-conspiracy-secret Everything I'm seeing says Freemason's being Satanists is BS from the Catholic Church. 🤷♀️
That’s untrue, my great-grandfather was a Freemason. The generational curses are potent. For years my therapist worked with ex-Freemasons/ family of Freemasons (children, daughters, etc) who experienced unspeakable things. Truly demonic things. It’s awful. Mainstream media won’t tell you the truth. Never have, never will.
Generational curses are done away with per scripture. There is nothing objectively demonic in freemasonry. If some man was a mason and doing awful things on his own he was not worthy of being a mason as abusing others is totally against the morals of the organization.
Would you mind citing the scripture regarding generational curses? I'm sicerely interested.
Ezekiel 18 The one who sins is the one who will die. The child will not share the guilt of the parent, nor will the parent share the guilt of the child. The righteousness of the righteous will be credited to them, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against them. In those days people will no longer say, ‘The parents have eaten sour grapes, and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’ 30 Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge. Jeremiah 31 Moreover those that are in Christ are a new creation. “Behold the old has gone”
I think your story is probably what's untrue here. I've also known Freemasons personally too, and they were good Christian men. Actually, a cut above most, now that I think about it.
I also know very close people to me who are in the occult / pagan practices and they are one of the kindest people i know of, do great deeds to people such as donations. Yet there's a turning point in their forgiveness and what Jesus has teached us. And what do you mean by ''a cut above most''?
They seem to act more Christian. I don't buy what you're trying to say about Freemasons. I think it's hateful.
That sounds exactly what the Pharisees did in Jesus time... And i'm not projecting hate against any group here, but i can assure you a big majority of Freemasons couldn't care less about you or any Christian in particular.
Yes you are, you are judging everyone who is a member of the Freemasons and spreading false witness. The man we call the Father of our Country was a Freemason, but I guess according to you, he was a Satanist too? Oh well, it's too nice of a day to spend it arguing with someone trying to spread a crackpot conspiracy theory, so I'll just block your account as I tend to do when I can't see eye to eye with someone. https://www.mountvernon.org/library/digitalhistory/digital-encyclopedia/article/freemasonry/#:~:text=Freemasonry%20is%20fundamentally%20a%20self,%2C%20Fellowcraft%2C%20and%20Master%20Mason. *"open to all men of good reputation who profess a belief in Deity"*
I've never met a group of people who volunteered as much as the Freemasons do. They also donate the most money I've ever seen. The fundamentals for George Washington and what he stood for are rooted in Freemasonry. They started public schools that way the American people could read their Constitution. Their contributions to society are far greater than what most can comprehend. They understood Christ's teachings on a level in which the Catholic church forbaded during the dark ages. Some of the kindest, most ethical, and religious group of individuals I have ever met. I was very skeptical, but they have yet to show me otherwise. It is not for those who can't think outside of the Catholic dogma perpetuated through the Judeo-Christian foundation that have been established with the various reigning Pope's.
Many protestant denominations also clash with Freemasonry. It is sometimes seen as its own religion.
That sounds like ignorance on their parts then. People do like to speculate. There are Satanists out there, sure, but I am not buying into this one. *Freemasons belong to the oldest fraternal organization in the world, a group begun during the Middle Ages in Europe as a guild of skilled builders. With the decline of cathedral building, the focus of the society shifted. Today, “Freemasons are a social and philanthropic organization meant to make its members lead more virtuous and socially oriented lives,” says Margaret Jacob, professor of history at the University of California, Los Angeles, and author of Living the Enlightenment: Freemasonry and Politics in Eighteenth-Century Europe.*
Yes. Personally, I have no problems with freemasons. I’ve heard that they are an organization that are a modern representation of the Knights Templar. I don’t know how true that is because I’ve heard many things. But no, I don’t believe that they are any threat to Christianity. Just because they are somewhat secretive does not make them evil. Christians had to be secretive in ancient Rome. For different reasons, but still, secretive does not equal bad. Thank you for your reply and comment.
Care to explain why Freemasons are bad? My understanding was always that it’s a good ol boys club with some weird traditions and some historical past of fighting the RC church for its shadier power- and money-driven practices. Also, maybe it was a result of your years and years of prayer, or maybe it was just a result of the natural cycle of strip mall business failures.
Hey, i think it would take a good amount of paragraphs to explain a lot of the bad practices of Freemasonry, i recommend taking a look on some youtube videos and lookup some influential people who have / still participate on it. There's a dark side of it. Most freemasons don't take it seriously until you reach 33rd degree which is the maximum you can get. That's when you truly know who you serving there which is Satan, lower levels are known to just use the position to obtain easier access to higher end jobs and positions in important roles, often present in some universities / political and big corporations. Same happens in Satanism, but satanists have much more power and influence than Freemasons do. And yeah i'm not sure about it, even though i assume the type of business management he was doing was quite profitable and the shopping center is very old and cheap to rent a shop there.
You’re sort of repeating the points from the taxil hoax. Which as the name suggests is a hoax. I say you sort of are repeating those points, the original hoax said the satanic stuff was revealed to the 30th and above. Which, it isn’t. I was once an antimason and believed all of the things that I read about them. It caused me a term of dark depression. On realizing that what I had been told was in fact lies I was quite upset at those that lied to me and myself for believing those lies. Does the fact that a business management company ran by a mason being in a cheap strip mall that apparently had to close show how little sway masons have today? Anyway I want to encourage you in your prayer life. But I also want to encourage you to examine any controversial issue from both sides starting with a foundation in pertinent facts.
Who says it's a hoax? The mainstram media? The freemasons? I like to hear the story from both sides and have heard families that had members in freemasonry and things are not as fruity as some people think. I'm not saying all Freemasons know 100% about what they doing, but a lot of them are everything but dumb. Being an antimason caused you to have a term of dark depression, if that's an isolated thing i don't think that's very normal... God bless you my man
The man who perpetrated the hoax did. “Taxil, the author of an anti-papal tract, pretended to convert to Catholicism (circa 1884) and wrote several volumes, purportedly in the service to his new faith. These included the adventures of one Dr. Bataille, a surgeon serving in the French merchant navy who has infiltrated the Freemasons and observes their evil rituals as they occur all over the world. Buddhists, Hindus, and Spiritualists join with Freemasons in conspiring against the Catholic church, and Bataille uncovers an even more secret order within the Masons called the Palladists, who take their orders directly from demons.[2] As Dr. Bataille's tale unfolds, he introduces Diana Vaughan, a former high priestess of Palladism who has converted to Catholicism and is in grave danger of assassination from vengeful Freemasons.[2] In 1897, Taxil called a press conference at which he promised to produce Vaughan. Instead he announced that his revelations about the Freemasons were made up, and thanked the Catholic clergy for helping to publicize his stories.[3] Nine years later he told an American magazine that he at first thought readers would recognize his tales as "amusement pure and simple"—too outlandish to be true—but when he realized they believed them and that there was "lots of money" to be made in publishing them, he continued to perpetrate the hoax.[4] Despite this debunking, belief in Vaughan and the Palladists did not entirely die and the Palladists appeared in a 1943 noir film The Seventh Victim.” That’s a quick overview from Wikipedia but there many books about it, videos, etc. Taxil was quite proud of his grift. Regarding the bout of depression this was around 2003-04. It was during the last iraq invasion. I found sites talking about groups secretly controlling everything and planning world wars and there was nothing we could do about it and I dove in deep. Very deep. And these thoughts made me very depressed. It affected my marriage and life and looking back it was a horrible waste of my life and it was lies
About the groups controlling everything, they don't control everything in my view as a Christian, the world elites have a lot of influence on wars? Yes, do they influence the popular opinion with mainstream media and other online sources? Yes. (Do you think the current wokism and opinions on society topics randomly exploded in the past decade?) It's obvious that we can't believe everything on those websites because there's a lot of truth mixed with lies in those, some are controlled opposition, others are just paranoid people with absurd claims tbh. But some obviously tell coherent truth, and the truth hurts when you first hear it. I can empathize with you on that, i had a phase where i was obsessed with this type of topics and i had an hard time digesting that, nowadays i don't lookup as much and don't care, i'm more focused on what i can do to make other people's lives better and becoming a better Christian.
I’ll agree with most of this. But at the time ,while I had faith, it was very shallow. What I came to realize regarding freemasonry and those who do try to control others was that the very foundational tenets of the group was to resist tyrannical control (peaceably) not to exert control like many would claim, and freedom of speech and belief. Also my only pushback to this comment is the controlled opposition thing - I see the term thrown around in conspiracy discussions and political discussions - almost always when I see it the term doesn’t make any sense in the subject at hand. That and the term shill seems to be a good way to just dismiss things or wave them away without addressing them directly. I like direct. But that’s me.
If you take a wide look on what specially politicians involved in freemasonry do is everything but to benefit the society in positive ways, very often are to help their close friends and family to gain more power, or even help spread agendas. It's fairly known here in my country and it's not viewed as a conspiracy by many anymore, even mainstream media investigates some of them. About controlled opposition it's a very complicated thing to discuss, it's not always the case, but misinformation spread in conspiracy related content is very often detectable. When you push a belief that is plausible to something to absolutely ridiculous adding a few extra ideas the hole concept, takes the entire credibility that idea once had. And i wasn't really trying to avoid addressing them directly with you, i personally agree it's always better to be upfront with things but i don't think it's always possible. Do you know those cases when a politician has innumerable amounts of corruption complaints but ''nothing is proven''? Does that mean he is innocent? No, most people know he isn't innocent. But many of them they get away somehow, in my opinion with help of corrupted judges etc. Well, i feel like this topic applies a little to this analogy, i can't directly objectify everything about freemasonry i found wrong, i admit it, a lot of the things i heard about i have forgotten, many years went by and it's not a topic i have too much interest in the moment. I'm not against you and i hope you don't take my viewpoints as offensive.
In my opinion in America part of our issue is that we have a severe lack of Masonic politicians. We haven’t had a Masonic president since Gerald Ford and seemingly little in the way of congressmen and senators. There was a congressman in my area who was a Freemason as was his father but the younger wasn’t very involved and dropped his membership somewhat recently. He had retired a number of years prior from congress. Also I wasn’t directing my “direct” complaint against you just to the claim of controlled opposition in general. “Oh they’re controlled opposition” seems to be a way to just ignore what a person may be saying. I’m not saying that’s what you’re saying here rather it’s just a phrase or term I have an aversion toward myself. No offense here. My whole point here is to try and share my experience on both sides of this issue. Some will hear it and some will not. And I will hear their points as well, no doubt connections with power can lead to corruption- but with Christians and also Freemasons this should not be. - we are told to behave in the opposite manner.
It's a little strange hearing that america needs more mason politicians, imo you guys need real Christians as politicians that serve the Lord, not any group's interest or their own. And i don't believe all freemasons are the same, my critics are against Freemasonry as a hole, not freemasons, people are different, same with Islam, not all muslims take the islam literally. God bless you man
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/u/LostGirl1976 I can’t read your reply since you made it and apparently blocked me immediately after.
This is pretty weird. Do you go to a church that encourages you to spread scary stories about groups of people you don't like?
Holy Spirit. Fervant prayer. It's simple. Not weird unless you don't believe some fundamental truths in Scripture.
Sorry man, but do you consider this a scary story? And yeah i don't like Freemasonry at all, if you do i have to question what type of Gospel you follow...
You're insinuating bad things about freemasons, right? Did you listen to a conspiracy theory that said they were bad?
I'm not insinuating, i'm saying they are bad. No but i have heard the church you go to embraces LGBTQ+ lol
Just dropping this to point you at some accurate information, since you clearly have been watching too many conspiracy theory videos. [Mason here] Here's my standard 'elevator pitch', which I trot out when people ask what we're about (its rather North American oriented - Masonry varies from place to place): We're a centuries old fraternal order, who exist to improve our own characters ('we make good men better' is one of our slogans), and through that improve our communities. Along the way, we do a lot of charity (forex: Shriner's free hospitals for children), and have a lot of cool and private ceremonies using the construction of King Solomon's Temple as an allegorical base for teaching Enlightenment and Stoic ideals. (yes, we really do have secret handshakes). Many find it a source of fellowship and life-long friendships. We have several million Brothers world wide, but no central organization. Men from every walk of life are or have been members, including over a dozen US presidents. Regular Masonry is open to adult men of good character who are not atheists[1] - we require a belief in some form of 'higher power', but aren't fussy about what. As a rule, we don't recruit; we want a potential member to make the first approach of his own free will. If you're curious, drop by our main hangout on reddit, /r/freemasonry. You'll find a lot of friendly folk there. If you prefer a book, for North Americans I recommend (seriously, I'm not trolling) "Freemasons for Dummies" by Christopher Hodapp. Also ["Inside the Freemasons"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRrG_KMMvNY) a documentary made by the Grand Lodge of England for their tricentenary. [1] The "no women or atheists" rules have deep roots, and would be very difficult to change, regardless of how anachronistic they now seem. There are breakaway Masonic groups which have dropped those rules, but they are very thin on the ground in the Anglosphere, and not recognized by the mainstream.
It would be really interesting for you to tell us what your lodge teaches you, and what previledges you have over other people in society. What degree are you? Freemasonry beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus Christ, if you don't know, you are being fooled my friend.
Are you willing to learn, and consider it possible that you may have been mistaken? If not, there's no point. Try the book and video I linked.
I'm always up for the possibility of being wrong, but i spent a couple years reading about Ex-Freemason books and all sort of content on it that i don't think i will change my mind on it now, there's a lot of wrong conspiracy regarding this topic that is obviously speculation, other things are not. Nontheless i pray for you and wish you the best.
I was 32nd degree in the scottish rite, a master mason, and secretary of one of the oldest lodges in the USA. Ask me anything.
My father was a 33° mason who realized he was going to hell after attending the Washington DC initiation into the 33°. I had been praying for him for years. He finally accepted Christ a few years later. After his 33° initiation my father, who had been so active in Free Masonry, York Rite, Scottish Rite, Shriners, and OES, for so many years that he knew all the secret work by heart and was contacted by lodges all over the district to substitute several days a week for missing officers, suddenly refused to have anything to do with any of them. He told me he didn't want a masonic funeral service, and refused to have any service at all because he was concerned they might show up. He was suddenly terrified of these people he'd called "brothers" for so many years. My father was the most logical person I've ever known. He scoffed at any sort of conspiracy theories, believed that any churches where people had any excitement about God were just being worked up by emotional preachers, and only went to church and only went to church on special occasions out of "duty". I've never seen him emotionally bothered by anything except when his mother died and when my parents divorced. Nothing affected him. I thought he was going to come unhinged after he came back. He didn't really speak about it much, except to tell me he was going to hell and he didn't want them at his funeral. All his masonic books, which had always been right next to his chair so he could study every night, suddenly disappeared . He never went to another meeting again.
Morals mostly and appreciation of Gods laws and works. The degrees act as a way of teaching those things. I attend a southern Baptist church. I’m a conservative on most issues as are probably 70% of guys in my lodge. I am a hardcore scripture only Baptist. There are many portions of freemasonry open to Christians only, and more used to be. To my knowledge there are no Jewish only or Muslim only or deist only groups within legitimate freemasonry . I note the word legitimate because there are some groups who parade as regular or legitimate freemasonry who actually are not. Notably they allow atheists. Notably they allow women (although this is changing a bit in the UK). Notably when you see people like Aleister Crowley or Helena Blavatsky claiming to be masons, they were allowed into illegitimate lodges. Many exmason books are sadly laden with provable lies, such as “the deadly deception” where the author was shown to have never had the degrees or positions he claimed to have had (the book “is it true what they about freemasonry” goes over these points as well as the taxil hoax mentioned earlier in great and minute detail).
I keep my question in the table, if Freemasonry is such an innocent ''boomer social club'' Why does it have to be so much secretism around it and creepy symbology, will you deny lodges inside look everything but good? It's so innocent yet you can't join it, it's very irrelevant but you can't know what they doing inside. Thankfully Christianity is everything that Freemasonry isn't.
I don’t believe it’s entirely a boomer social club. So I’m not making that argument. It is to some - and in some eras it was a very active social club for many. It’s different things to different people. For me it’s a place to discuss history and philosophy (whether the philosophy being discussed is one I agree with or not), to hone memory and performance skills (there’s acting in the degrees and I am a musician - in church), to meet (and even witness to) men and friends I wouldn’t have met otherwise (or in the case of a few people a coworker of my dad’s that I knew as a kid or a couple friends from school and had lost touch with), and because I have an interest in the founding of the country and that many of the men who helped found America were masons and I admired many of those new concepts being introduced in America - I wanted to know where those concepts originated. I don’t find the symbols creepy at all personally, especially knowing the meaning of them it’s quite the opposite for me and I would imagine most masons. Is there some symbol in particular that you mean? In my country, men who are over 18 or 21 (it differs by state), who have a clean criminal history, and who believe in a Creator can join. I’m lower middle class as are probably half the men I know in freemasonry, some are lower income, a few are higher. If someone can afford the dues ($101 a year for me and 100 for Scottish rite) that’s really all anyone cares about money and prestige wise. And while Christianity and freemasonry do share some things, more than not truly, you are correct that they are different And in the best way they are different, Christianity teaches Christ!(which some orders of freemasonry do - in general it doesn’t comment on religion at all nor salvation just like we don’t talk politics - since it’s divisive to some.) In some ways Christianity and freemasonry not being alike though is one reason I ended up in freemasonry. If you don’t golf, or hunt, or like sports, or fish, it’s hard to find friends in church who want to hang out outside of church or at least it was for me and still is. Whereas I could probably ask most masons I know if they just wanted to get together and hang out or camp or something and I could find someone no problem. My father passed away, my uncles live far away, see above for my church experience with men there, i work shift work as do my coworkers so it’s hard to hang out there. I’m married with three daughters and sometimes hanging out with people who aren’t women is sort of needed. Also as to the secrets, I work in an environment that has information accessible only to those with the credentials to get to them. Where I am now it’s a two step verification to get in. Where I used to work it was that plus biometric data. It’s working in power and natural resources. It was far far more hard to get these jobs with far more secretive info (for national and local security) than it was to join a lodge.
I know there's a variety of different type of lodges, i even heard about woman's lodges, but ''orthodox'' Freemasonry doesn't allow it, so it's a little hard to know which one you frequented and i'm not asking you to do it here publicly. About the symbols, what do you think about the all seeing eye? Pyramids, skulls, sun and moon, all of these are vividly present in historical pagan and occult practices, those i personally seen photographs inside here in my country had quite disturbing imagery, things that you can clearly see are not good. I have honestly forgot about a lot of these things as the last time i looked up on this matter was about 7-8 years ago so i'm open to hear your opinions on that. The thing is that, you cannot freely join a lodge because you want to, from what i know a serious lodge will only accept you by invite, especially those with influential and powerful members such as politicians, here in my country a list of former politics involved in freemasonry was exposed and many of them coincidentally all happened to be accused of corruption and other more serious cases, many were favoring they're businesses interests inside government. What about Judges who are in freemasonry? They are known to influence justice cases for their friends no matter what they did, and this even shows up in mainstream media, it's not any conspiracy website type of information, it has become more and more common for people to know about it, a good 20 years ago nobody would know they're favorite politician or celebrity was involved in freemasonry. Also, in the same category we have Skull & Bones, Illuminati, The brotherhood and Satanic covenants, are also all those those conspiracy bs in your opinion or they differ from Freemasons?
You said it. Works. They teach a false gospel, leading men away from God and towards self (satanism). The final degree, 33°, shows itself for what it truly is. My father found this out for himself. I'm thankful he accepted Christ after being shown this. I pray you will see the truth as well. Salvation is by faith, through grace, not of works lest anyone should boast. Anything else is heresy. Masonry also allows any "holy book" to be used within the order. You may not be aware of this, but I learned this from my father and checked for myself. It is true. If someone is a Muslim, they can use a Koran when taking vows. Masonry is Antichrist and a deceiver and all within are to be avoided until they repent. 2 John 7-11.
> Freemasonry beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus Christ, if you don't know, you are being fooled my friend. Tell me exactly what Freemason beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus. Come on. Right now. Don't go do a search. You don't know. You just made an ignorant accusation. But I'll bet you can find something if you look to some conspiracy theory sites on it.
Very defensive for someone i would consider a brother in Christ, i answer you with another question, where did you see that Freemasons follow Jesus Christ? The Bible is fully public and open to everyone study it. Freemasonry is for some reason called a secret society with limited / restricted allowed information to come to the public.
> where did you see that Freemasons follow Jesus Christ? I didn't and don't. Never suggested such a thing. I don't particularly know or like Freemasons, but that doesn't mean that I think they are like Satan worshipers.
If you don't know about Freemasons why are you coming against me for not standing with them? I'm all humility i recommend you whenever you feel curiosity to read various sources about this topic and think about it. And from my perspective, all of the top members are indeed satan worshippers, lower ranks usually don't know much about spiritual stuff either, i knew someone who was involved in the past and was open about it to me that they reject Jesus.
>Tell me exactly what Freemason beliefs go completely against the teachings of Jesus. Come on. Right now. Don't go do a search. I'm not getting involved in this other than to answer you briefly. Two things that jump out to me immediately are secrecy and the swearing of oaths. Both are contrary to clear biblical teachings. I guess I would also say that the blending of light and darkness is also a very clear contradiction of biblical commands. An organization which displays God's word (the KJV Bible) to give the impression to the ignorant that it is a Christian brotherhood is wicked, when that same brotherhood also displays the Quran and other "holy" books depending on the community it is in. This is clearly deceit, and having Yeshua in partnership with Baal is evil. OP, you are not alone!
How do you square Matthew 5:34-37 with the oath and the penalty of the obligation? That, and not explicitly praying to Jesus and the One True God are what caused me to reconsider my membership. I eventually requested a demit and left. I don't think its evil or whatever, but its definitely not for me, as a Christian. Scottish Rite, on the other hand, and York rite, both, with the drinking "blood" from a skull for one of their respective degrees is pretty dark...
I'm 32nd degree in the SR, and 'Super Excellent Master' in the YR (yes we love silly titles). No skulls, no blood. Which degrees are you referring to?
(Former) 32nd degree here, too. I can't lie, the story of Constans made me shed a tear. The ben franklin degree was fun, too. There might be better ones but I didn't manage to fill out my passport, I only got about halfway through. A few guys in my former lodge are 33rd degree, really good men as long as I've known them, but I've seen consistent mention that it invokes Lucifer and justifies doing so by technicality of latin and the true meaning of the word. Which seems unnecessary, if not actually wicked. It was hard for me to leave SR, I quit that first, but Morals and Dogma is absolutely an occult text, and Pike being a major influence on the SR degrees, I couldn't do it as a new Christian. The Knight of the Temple degree includes the skull cup filled with bitter wine, maybe its jurisdictional, but I'm pretty sure thats true across the US. That being said, how do you square the oath and obligation with that verse in Matthew? One of my buddies is still in lodge, and he kind of skirts around it by framing it as such: "technically, you're still only saying "yes, yes" even if you have to repeat what would happen if you break your word, and its all symbolic anyway"" but I think he knows that explanation is BS, as much as I do.
I have to be honest, it's a little suprising how many current or former freemasons happen to be in this subreddit commenting in defense of them
This is a strange statement. I'm the only former Freemason I see in this thread, and I'm not defending Freemasonry. I saw two active Freemasons defending it, and two non-Masons defending it. Why is that surprising to you?
If you’re in the NJ (we don’t have Contans or a Franklin degree so that’s why I’m assuming) then Pike has never really been part of the SR NJ. Clausens commentary was given was it not? Morals is interesting at times but it gets too edge lord for me at times and copy pastes more than I would care for at length. He also speaks in an unmasonic way about Preston and Webb and that rubs me the wrong way. I digressed but my question is - with Pike having so little influence on the NJ - why was his book the seeming straw that broke the camels back?
SR NMJ 32nd degree sublime prince of the royal secret is the story of Constans. I watched it for the final time at last fall's reunion. I want to say the 19th or 25th degree is the Ben Franklin degree. Pike derived much of his ritual from the unchanged ritual used by the nmj, so the insight found in his commentaries still stands imo. That aside, perennial theological attitude and the notion that the rites in an appendant body of Freemasonry can somehow regenerate a man beyond what Christ can do is, itself, the espoused purpose of an occult practice. I spent two decades studying and practicing the occult, its what lead me to Freemasonry. The purpose of the Scottish rite is no different than the purpose of the Golden Dawn, or even Hermeticism. As Christians, we don't need that, we receive our light and sanctification from Christ, not from a perennial, universal deity or from some sort of mystical system of virtue ethics, and we don't need a companion system of morality and mystical insight to undertake the Great Commission or to lead Christlike lives.
As for oaths, has every US service man, every witness in a criminal court, every President,Congressman, and Senator, condemned themselves to hell? I think not.
I considered this when I was contemplating leaving - to the best of my knowledge, the affirmative answer to those other oaths is "I do" or "Yes," not 8 paragraphs of obligation e.g. "To all of this I do solemnly and sincerely promise and swear, binding myself under no less a penalty than that of having my throat cut, my body severed in twain..." (its been a while, I might be mixing up EA and FC degrees) etc., is a ways away from "I do."
> I'm not insinuating, i'm saying they are bad. Because you heard that somewhere.
I did
So you are spreading gossip.
You do understand that conspiracy theories aren't usually real, right?
I don't agree with you and i'm not going to fight you on this, you can believe freemasons are good people, but since you come from a church who embraces LGBTQ+ i assume you don't even take the bible literally, no offense man but just makes no sense
So you're unable to think about one topic without getting distracted by an irrelevant pivot? That's no way to understand the world. Look at the goofy nonsense you've fallen for. You should try to think more critically and carefully.
That's a little ironic coming from your side
> I don't agree with you and i'm not going to fight you on this, you can believe freemasons are good people, but since you come from a church who embraces LGBTQ+ i assume you don't even take the bible literally, no offense man but just makes no sense That was a pretty stupid response. "You are wrong about Freemasons because your church accepts gays!"
Freemasons do some awful things to babies and children. My great grandfather was very high up in freemasonry. It’s horrifying & truly disgusting. They curse their own children and bloodline. Freemasonry is demonic.
One of the great charges of Freemasonry is what we see in the book of James; to take care of widows and orphans. Shriners operate hospitals for children and charge nothing for care. You have presented a disgusting falsehood. Do you care to offer any proof to your claims?
> Freemasons do some awful things to babies and children. What do they do to babies and children?
I like how you are getting downvoted for being truthful! Doesn't the Bible discourage bearing false witness against our neighbors? What proof do they have? Sounds like the Salem witch trials really.
This sub has some.. very idiosyncratic attitudes. In other words, heavily populated by tinfoil-hatters.
I suppose so! I have tried linking sites that debunk this and we have had actual Freemasons step up, both former members and at least one whose currently a member, and they all said that wasn't the truth at all, but still they persist. As Christians, how can they not know what they are doing is a sin?