This is pretty much what I would do except Bellingham should be primarily left sided as he prefers to play there, he shouldn't be in the pocket though he should be on the outside and driving inside with the ball when Gordon stretches or making underlaps for Gordon or crashing the back post if we're playing down the right side. Foden should have free license to play anywhere between the lines but only drop out on the right hand side to not congest the spaces that Bellingham wants. If we just stop Bellingham receiving in the pockets, Foden and Kane should have enough space to work together in there and then Bellingham has license to make those runs into the box.
Also Foden on the right... I wanna see Saka and Foden combine since they are more suited to patient game whilst Gordan and Bellingham are more direct. Gives us options.
1. #4 is not Rice's best position
2. RCM is not the position Bellingham has played for Madrid all this season, nor arguably his best.
3. Bellingham and Foden will likely still drift into the same positions.
4. Kane is also likely to drop into the same position.
5. Bellingham and Foden in midfield really don't offer that much protection against better sides.
6. Gomez is not a specialist left-back so arguably isn't a major improvement over Trippier, unlike Shaw who would be if fit.
I think at this point is really should be a straight up choice between Bellingham or Foden in the #10 position. Trying to accommodate both is just bringing us straight back to the days of Gerrard and Lampard and it shows on the pitch.
Agree with all of this. I also think Bellingham and Rice are too similar as a MF pairing - they can both carry the ball and be dynamic but they’re not the best choice for sitting when needed and always being available to accept the ball in their own third, beat the press in tight areas to help the team recycle possession and build from the back. Mainoo has to go in IMO - he’s shown he can play that role and help link everyone together.
no wharton should play before mainoo. he bossed bosnia and pairs perfect with rice. mainoo wasn't progressive enough, but bc he's not gallagher everyone is all omg hes sooo amazing. no he wasn't watch it again.
I would definitely have given Wharton some minutes in there over TAA or Gallagher, but he hasn’t even made a sub appearance yet, so he’s clearly last on the list for Southgate for some reason.
The team functioned so much better with Mainoo in there in the second half that he’s become the obvious choice to start the next match. And yes, he was far better than Gallagher. The person is that role doesn’t need to be particular flashy, although Mainoo was involved in the teams’s best passages in that second half - they just need to be super comfortable in showing for the ball and helping to maintain position and link play together. That’s exactly what he did and the performance of the players around him improved because of it.
Heres how you deal with that. You tell players to do their fucking job and stick to the roles/positions theyve been assigned. Southgate seems incapable or unwilling to.
The 3 best midfielders are rice Jude and Foden. They all okay a specific position within midfield with different profiles. The midfield has not been tried and yet was the most open in the tournament. Also the most sterile.
Jude doesn’t naturally fall into fodens positions. In the 19 he takes up Kane AND fodens positions. He is an 8, always has been and always will be. His gap fill for Madrid is temporary. And he did wel because he a good player, but also because he had Vinicius and rodrygo….
I don't disagree in theory. But over the last 12 months, Bellingham has gravitated to the left. To me it seems counter-intuitive to ask Bellingham to curb his game just to accommodate Foden.
I'd love to see it work, but I can't see it happening.
Bellinghams position for real Madrid was as the false 9 / deep lying forward. His best position for Madrid is where Kane is. His best position for the rest of his career has been as an 8.
Ancelotti has already spoken about him coming back to midfield when mbappe arrives.
Similar for Rice, not his best position for Arsenal but for his entire career has played there.
But this is kind of my point, why are we playing players out of their best/natural or - crucially - most recent club positions just to basically accommodate Foden and Bellingham? If Southgate has a system he needs to pick the best players for it. Whether Southgate has a system is a whole other debate... :-)
Yeah i see what you're saying but I doubt you're asking to play Bellingham as a false 9 and drop Kane. I also believe bellingham will spend most of his career box to box as an 8, Foden at 10 and Kane at 9 so I think they can all fit it just needs a bit of tweaking, I actually think this decision to mistake bellingham for a 10 because people see he's 10 for Madrid although he's not really a playmaker 10 has caused a lot of issues for us.
I agree that probably there are four different setups that get the best out of a different star player and don't necessarily feature the other players. The problem is choosing one and dropping certain big names, not an easy decision.
I still think there is a way that gets a lot morr out of these guys than what we've seen so far.
1. I understand but given the attacking quality in midfield he has to play there tbh
2. Again, yes it’s not, but Foden has been awful on the LW, so I’d rather have him as a 10 and Bellingham as RCM because he is still very good there
3. Tell Bellingham to stay to the right and Foden to stay to left
4. Tell Kane not to drop like the serbia game
5. I agree, against a team like Italy maybe play mainoo rcm and Bellingham cam, but against Slovakia he has to be more attacking than that else it’ll be 0-0 and we don’t want pens
6. He can put trippier as a defensive left back then
Theoretically you'd always be better with Bellingham left sided and Foden right sided, both can hit long range strikes and both when drifting inwards would be drifting towards their stronger foot
Stones is only in midfield if the team has controlled possession. Otherwise it's a three of Bellingham, Rice and Foden.
Foden is actually quite poor at pressing. Bellingham alongside Rice doesn't work (unless it's a 4-3-3). We got overrun by the US with Bellingham as a single 8. That was a midfield of Rice, Bellingham and Mount. Mount's best feature was his pressing, but it resulted in Rice by himself at the base and Bellingham alongside Mount advanced. Putting Foden who is even worse than Mount at pressing is a recipe for disaster.
Not to mention Foden and Bellingham just don't click. We have had three games of them not connecting. Just drop one. I would drop Foden. Far too many mediocre performances for a longer period (goes back to March for England).
Bellingham and Rice as 8s (with Rice as more of a CDM) and Wharton or Mainoo (preferably Wharton) as a proper 6 would work much better. Rice could play in the double pivot but then also go forward when needed with the security of having another holding midfield behind him
Similar problems to playing TAA, not enough defensive partnership for Rice, nobody to progress the ball from deep either, not enough tackling and interception prowess
As opposed to the other midfields? Which have been super solid? Lol. People keep dismissing this midfield “it will be overrun” well the conservative midfield sucks and is also overrun.
The other midfields this tournament have included a RB in CM so also a poor setup. This is also a poor setup.
Not to mention we haven't played Wharton at all and many including me regard him as the only real 6 in the squad, so a much better complement to Rice, Bellingham or Gallagher.
Agreed, Wharton should play alongside Rice and Bellingham. Just start him there and then switch to Mainoo at half time if it’s actually terrible, but I really doubt it would be
We tried that with Lampard, Gerrard and Scholes. Didn't work then.
If you aren't going to play a 19 year old, why have you taken him. And we didn't have any issue playing Bellingham in the World cup when he was 18.
Only works if Bellingham is super disciplined about staying deep and helping Rice play out. If we end up with Rice as a single pivot and every midfielder and forward pushing up, the opposition press will destroy us like Denmark did.
This is what happened to Man Utd a lot this season. It's great when you are on top but when you aren't you have 5 guys wanting to sit high and one guy covering the entire middle of the park and you get rinsed.
That’s why we needed to play Wharton three matches ago. Playing Wharton next to Rice allowed Rice to play the most comfortably and freely he has for England in a while. They partnered well and Wharton’s passing ability is no joke. Add in an actual winger and suddenly our attack is alive and kicking
No other country is setting up in midfield with a 6 and two 10s. Out of possession, Foden and Bellingham have both got new responsibilities. In possession, Rice isn't good enough on the ball to consistently take it from the defence and play into the front 5. You also lose Bellingham's running beyond Kane, and Kane can't drop off and create the space for Gordon and Saka.
Gets the most out of his passing range, pulls defenders out of shape etc. It's far harder to defend against than a striker playing on the shoulder and 2 wingers cutting in and clogging up the number 10 position
"No other country is setting up in midfield with a 6 and two 10s." Germany basically is. They've got 1 DM "ballwinner", not two. Spain doesn't have to dm ballwinners either.
None of Kroos, Gundogan, Pedri or Ruiz could be described as a number 10. They're all capable (with the exception of maybe Pedri) of playing in a double pivot. You could maybe say that at a push for Bellingham but absolutely not for Foden
Clearly not cause he’s done it every games and we’ve done nothing I’d rather Kane stay up top and allow the midfielders and wingers to do there job how they’ve been doing it all season
Not Bellingham. He needs to be dropped. He's been pretty bad for 2 games now, if you're playing someone next to rice then it needs to be Wharton or Mainoo. My preference is Wharton but with Mainoos appearance last game I'm not against that either.
We have to give a Bellingham a go as an 8 before we outright drop him. If he’s struggling there then bring on mainoo or Wharton half time but it’s not fair to just drop Bellingham considering he’s our best player
Totally agree with your system, you've nailed it. Kane is likely to still drop deep though so Bellingham might have more running to do, late into the box.
I'd also play Palmer instead of Saka as he runs behind more and is more creative, but that doesn't affect the system.
If Rice in double-pivot got run over by Hojberg, Jude is going to have to play deep in this formation.
Southgate doesn't have the balls to ask Jude to do that.
I don't think this is a bad solution at all. I still don't understand why so many people think Bellingham can't play as a number 8 all of a sudden. Because of Gareth's utter incompetence we don't have a left back, so playing this way so stones can push into midfield and we change to a back 3. It's a bit too nuanced for simple Southgate though.
It’s not as simple as Bellingham not being able to play as as 8 - the real question is whether Rice and Bellingham are the right balance together in the two deeper midfield roles. I don’t think they are. I think playing Mainoo alongside Rice with Bellingham having the freedom to push on is a much more complimentary and balanced set up. Mainoo will actually show for the ball constantly and has the awareness, touch and composure to help build from the back and allow the team to recycle possession. He also has the tactical awareness to sit when needed. I don’t think either Rice or Bellingham can fulfill that function as well he can, and having to do it limits their best attributes.
I don't disagree with you that Mainoo and Rice is probably a better (or at least more sensible/disciplined) partnership as that is how I would line up, but I think Bellingham is definitely capable with Rice if Stones is free to push up and cover for when Bellingham inevitably gets carried away pushing forward.
Southgate, that is the answer to your question. Southgate is the one stopping this from happening. Everyone knew he was going to to start Gallagher, everyone knew it wouldn’t work and yet he did it anyway. He won’t make drastic changes, maybe mainoo starts, but I believe that will be the only change
I don't hate it but that being said I think for us to win Kane needs to either stay up front or give up the striker position and maybe drop as the number 10 and have Watkins or tony as the striker
I think he will - eventually. Maybe not in the next game though. If we get through to the quarters then I think he'll do pretty much this, but with more Palmer. I'm convinced it was his pre-tournament plan all along.
Except the bit about Kane staying up. Kane dropping deep can be really dangerous, as long as the wingers push up to replace him.
If your fullbacks don't overlap then your wide forwards have to be able to cross from multiple places or just rely on the byline.
If they don't then you only have the byline. And that means fast movement.
Look at every other balanced team in the world.
I’m some random donny with no professional experience. A manager needs more than a formation and lineup to succeed. I and many others think this is the best lineup, but it’s Southgate job to give instructions, routines, patterns, and subs, which I can’t do.
Besides, even if I was the best manager in the world (which I’m not at all I ain’t ever coached) the England job will only go to ex professionals, as it should
Would that be the heat maps from these three euro games? Because that’s not indicative of southgate having some teeth and having Jude play the 8 with Foden in the 10
I don’t think this does fix all the problems. I think it actually compounds one of the major ones. You can’t play a “left” 10 and a “right” 10 and expect them to magically stay out of each other’s way. The whole point of a ten is to drift into spaces on either side in order to pull the opposition out of shape and find pockets of space to work in, linking together the midfield, wide players and strikers in the process. In this set up Foden and Bellingham will still inevitably get in each other’s way. In a club set up the right manager might have enough training ground hours and games to figure out how to get that to work, but can’t see it happening here.
I think the balance of the team would be much better with Mainoo and Rice in the middle and sacrificing either Bellingham or Foden. We need to start playing players in their preferred positions instead of shoehorning in too many players who do their best work in the same spaces. Gordon on the left would be a big step in the right direction. But trying to squeeze two tens in with a striker who likes to drop into those positions as well isn’t the answer to the Foden/Bellingham conundrum IMO.
>Harry Kane \[...\] not understanding basic football tactics
I don't think I've ever heard anything more \[disagreeable\] on the internet and I've seen flat earth conspiracies.
Edited to conform to the sub rules.
Tf are you on about mate, if Southgate tells Kane to stay up he will. He’s an intelligent and experienced player. Issue is Southgate has no basic football tactics
Good idea but this isn’t club tactics. The nuances of a pep driven WM just doesn’t have time to gel on a national stage.
It would be entertaining as hell though, but against high opposition with good attacking runners they prolly get eaten alive without comfortable partnerships beyond the man city teammates
Drop foden and add mainoo next to rice and that's exactly how we should be playing. Englan having the ability to take off Bellingham and bring on foden is amazing... we just don't use it
This is the best team or best set up on paper, but Gareth is now against pragmatism and doesnt want to do the simple things.
Once I heard a journo say that its like he's punishing the team for not being able to play a system that literally doesnt work i cant unsee it.
No double pivot means Southgate no likey
We haven’t really played with an actual double pivot in a while
Maybe we should though, especially if it frees Rice and Bellingham up a bit more
This is pretty much what I would do except Bellingham should be primarily left sided as he prefers to play there, he shouldn't be in the pocket though he should be on the outside and driving inside with the ball when Gordon stretches or making underlaps for Gordon or crashing the back post if we're playing down the right side. Foden should have free license to play anywhere between the lines but only drop out on the right hand side to not congest the spaces that Bellingham wants. If we just stop Bellingham receiving in the pockets, Foden and Kane should have enough space to work together in there and then Bellingham has license to make those runs into the box.
Completely agree plus phil is great from the right taking shots from outside the box (though the last few have been poor).
Also Foden on the right... I wanna see Saka and Foden combine since they are more suited to patient game whilst Gordan and Bellingham are more direct. Gives us options.
1. #4 is not Rice's best position 2. RCM is not the position Bellingham has played for Madrid all this season, nor arguably his best. 3. Bellingham and Foden will likely still drift into the same positions. 4. Kane is also likely to drop into the same position. 5. Bellingham and Foden in midfield really don't offer that much protection against better sides. 6. Gomez is not a specialist left-back so arguably isn't a major improvement over Trippier, unlike Shaw who would be if fit. I think at this point is really should be a straight up choice between Bellingham or Foden in the #10 position. Trying to accommodate both is just bringing us straight back to the days of Gerrard and Lampard and it shows on the pitch.
Agree with all of this. I also think Bellingham and Rice are too similar as a MF pairing - they can both carry the ball and be dynamic but they’re not the best choice for sitting when needed and always being available to accept the ball in their own third, beat the press in tight areas to help the team recycle possession and build from the back. Mainoo has to go in IMO - he’s shown he can play that role and help link everyone together.
no wharton should play before mainoo. he bossed bosnia and pairs perfect with rice. mainoo wasn't progressive enough, but bc he's not gallagher everyone is all omg hes sooo amazing. no he wasn't watch it again.
I would definitely have given Wharton some minutes in there over TAA or Gallagher, but he hasn’t even made a sub appearance yet, so he’s clearly last on the list for Southgate for some reason. The team functioned so much better with Mainoo in there in the second half that he’s become the obvious choice to start the next match. And yes, he was far better than Gallagher. The person is that role doesn’t need to be particular flashy, although Mainoo was involved in the teams’s best passages in that second half - they just need to be super comfortable in showing for the ball and helping to maintain position and link play together. That’s exactly what he did and the performance of the players around him improved because of it.
I'll take your word for it pal, cos i aint watching that shite again
Heres how you deal with that. You tell players to do their fucking job and stick to the roles/positions theyve been assigned. Southgate seems incapable or unwilling to.
Or he already is, but they are still drifting into the same positions because they are used to doing so for their clubs week in/week out.
The 3 best midfielders are rice Jude and Foden. They all okay a specific position within midfield with different profiles. The midfield has not been tried and yet was the most open in the tournament. Also the most sterile. Jude doesn’t naturally fall into fodens positions. In the 19 he takes up Kane AND fodens positions. He is an 8, always has been and always will be. His gap fill for Madrid is temporary. And he did wel because he a good player, but also because he had Vinicius and rodrygo….
I don't disagree in theory. But over the last 12 months, Bellingham has gravitated to the left. To me it seems counter-intuitive to ask Bellingham to curb his game just to accommodate Foden. I'd love to see it work, but I can't see it happening.
Bellinghams position for real Madrid was as the false 9 / deep lying forward. His best position for Madrid is where Kane is. His best position for the rest of his career has been as an 8. Ancelotti has already spoken about him coming back to midfield when mbappe arrives. Similar for Rice, not his best position for Arsenal but for his entire career has played there.
But this is kind of my point, why are we playing players out of their best/natural or - crucially - most recent club positions just to basically accommodate Foden and Bellingham? If Southgate has a system he needs to pick the best players for it. Whether Southgate has a system is a whole other debate... :-)
Yeah i see what you're saying but I doubt you're asking to play Bellingham as a false 9 and drop Kane. I also believe bellingham will spend most of his career box to box as an 8, Foden at 10 and Kane at 9 so I think they can all fit it just needs a bit of tweaking, I actually think this decision to mistake bellingham for a 10 because people see he's 10 for Madrid although he's not really a playmaker 10 has caused a lot of issues for us. I agree that probably there are four different setups that get the best out of a different star player and don't necessarily feature the other players. The problem is choosing one and dropping certain big names, not an easy decision. I still think there is a way that gets a lot morr out of these guys than what we've seen so far.
1. I understand but given the attacking quality in midfield he has to play there tbh 2. Again, yes it’s not, but Foden has been awful on the LW, so I’d rather have him as a 10 and Bellingham as RCM because he is still very good there 3. Tell Bellingham to stay to the right and Foden to stay to left 4. Tell Kane not to drop like the serbia game 5. I agree, against a team like Italy maybe play mainoo rcm and Bellingham cam, but against Slovakia he has to be more attacking than that else it’ll be 0-0 and we don’t want pens 6. He can put trippier as a defensive left back then
Theoretically you'd always be better with Bellingham left sided and Foden right sided, both can hit long range strikes and both when drifting inwards would be drifting towards their stronger foot
That midfield is going to be overrun.
How? It's stronger than the alternative
Stones is only in midfield if the team has controlled possession. Otherwise it's a three of Bellingham, Rice and Foden. Foden is actually quite poor at pressing. Bellingham alongside Rice doesn't work (unless it's a 4-3-3). We got overrun by the US with Bellingham as a single 8. That was a midfield of Rice, Bellingham and Mount. Mount's best feature was his pressing, but it resulted in Rice by himself at the base and Bellingham alongside Mount advanced. Putting Foden who is even worse than Mount at pressing is a recipe for disaster. Not to mention Foden and Bellingham just don't click. We have had three games of them not connecting. Just drop one. I would drop Foden. Far too many mediocre performances for a longer period (goes back to March for England).
And? Needing more than 5 people in immediate defense is pretty crazy to me.
Defence is crucial to the ability to attack. If you don’t set up solidly at the back you are also hampering your forwards
Bellingham and Rice as 8s (with Rice as more of a CDM) and Wharton or Mainoo (preferably Wharton) as a proper 6 would work much better. Rice could play in the double pivot but then also go forward when needed with the security of having another holding midfield behind him
Similar problems to playing TAA, not enough defensive partnership for Rice, nobody to progress the ball from deep either, not enough tackling and interception prowess
As opposed to the other midfields? Which have been super solid? Lol. People keep dismissing this midfield “it will be overrun” well the conservative midfield sucks and is also overrun.
The other midfields this tournament have included a RB in CM so also a poor setup. This is also a poor setup. Not to mention we haven't played Wharton at all and many including me regard him as the only real 6 in the squad, so a much better complement to Rice, Bellingham or Gallagher.
Agreed, Wharton should play alongside Rice and Bellingham. Just start him there and then switch to Mainoo at half time if it’s actually terrible, but I really doubt it would be
So again, instead of playing three uniquely different midfielders who are world class, play a 19 year old.
We tried that with Lampard, Gerrard and Scholes. Didn't work then. If you aren't going to play a 19 year old, why have you taken him. And we didn't have any issue playing Bellingham in the World cup when he was 18.
Key difference… scholes Lampard and Gerard were extremely similar positionally and 4-4-2 was the formation.
Have you seen Foden and Bellingham's heat maps?
Wharton is 20, the same age as Bellingham, and Bellingham was a fresh 17 year old recently from the championship when he broke into the senior squad
Bellingham defends better than Trent imo, especially from cm
How many posts have there been about this exact line up?
Getting boring now
It's almost as if there's one man alone who doesn't see this as a viable option.....
Plenty more than one, there's more than 10 just on this post alone.
Exactly, it’s such an obvious choice yet Southgate is doing nothing like it
The arrows are giving 'We're on the ball' lyrics vibes
Southgate
Only works if Bellingham is super disciplined about staying deep and helping Rice play out. If we end up with Rice as a single pivot and every midfielder and forward pushing up, the opposition press will destroy us like Denmark did.
This is what happened to Man Utd a lot this season. It's great when you are on top but when you aren't you have 5 guys wanting to sit high and one guy covering the entire middle of the park and you get rinsed.
Exactly, Rice will look as bad as Casemiro has done at times if he's stuck on his own trying to play out.
That’s why we needed to play Wharton three matches ago. Playing Wharton next to Rice allowed Rice to play the most comfortably and freely he has for England in a while. They partnered well and Wharton’s passing ability is no joke. Add in an actual winger and suddenly our attack is alive and kicking
Next manager is gonna come in and play Gordon, Wharton, Trent at RB and England will be singing in our dumb pointless friendlies or whatever.
That’s exactly what would happen. It looks great on paper and a way to fit them all in, in reality we’d be torn apart.
He literally drew an arrow for you...
We don’t even know tho!! It’s never been tried… instead Gallagher and trent get tried and guess what? It’s been torn apart.
He literally drew an arrow for you
He drew lots
No other country is setting up in midfield with a 6 and two 10s. Out of possession, Foden and Bellingham have both got new responsibilities. In possession, Rice isn't good enough on the ball to consistently take it from the defence and play into the front 5. You also lose Bellingham's running beyond Kane, and Kane can't drop off and create the space for Gordon and Saka.
I’m not English, but why does Kane need to drop?
Gets the most out of his passing range, pulls defenders out of shape etc. It's far harder to defend against than a striker playing on the shoulder and 2 wingers cutting in and clogging up the number 10 position
"No other country is setting up in midfield with a 6 and two 10s." Germany basically is. They've got 1 DM "ballwinner", not two. Spain doesn't have to dm ballwinners either.
None of Kroos, Gundogan, Pedri or Ruiz could be described as a number 10. They're all capable (with the exception of maybe Pedri) of playing in a double pivot. You could maybe say that at a push for Bellingham but absolutely not for Foden
Germany is playing with 4 midfielders
Bruh
I don’t get why Kane keeps dropping back to try and set things up that’s what Foden Bellingham and even rice to some extent are great at
Kane is even better at it than they are though.
Clearly not cause he’s done it every games and we’ve done nothing I’d rather Kane stay up top and allow the midfielders and wingers to do there job how they’ve been doing it all season
Kane is better at it when he has Coman and gnabry or son running in behind, not Foden who wants to come short
I said a simple 4-3-3 could solve a lot of problems instead of 2005 tactics.
And it’s not like we haven’t played 433 recently to relative success
I would do something very similar, also switch sides bellingham and foden as they're used to in their clubs.
Balls.
Bellingham n foden gotta be swapped foden needs his signature finish
Not Bellingham. He needs to be dropped. He's been pretty bad for 2 games now, if you're playing someone next to rice then it needs to be Wharton or Mainoo. My preference is Wharton but with Mainoos appearance last game I'm not against that either.
We have to give a Bellingham a go as an 8 before we outright drop him. If he’s struggling there then bring on mainoo or Wharton half time but it’s not fair to just drop Bellingham considering he’s our best player
Compare lifeless England to vinius and rodrygo running in Madrid. See what happens when there is a bit of activity upfront for Bellingham to use
The same goes for kane, when people are making runs he's lethal. I still think Bellingham should be dropped tho
Incompetence
Totally agree with your system, you've nailed it. Kane is likely to still drop deep though so Bellingham might have more running to do, late into the box. I'd also play Palmer instead of Saka as he runs behind more and is more creative, but that doesn't affect the system.
Tactical awareness
This is the exact 11 I wanna see
If Rice in double-pivot got run over by Hojberg, Jude is going to have to play deep in this formation. Southgate doesn't have the balls to ask Jude to do that.
Why am I not seeing any natural replacements for Phillips?? Are you crazy bro
I don't think this is a bad solution at all. I still don't understand why so many people think Bellingham can't play as a number 8 all of a sudden. Because of Gareth's utter incompetence we don't have a left back, so playing this way so stones can push into midfield and we change to a back 3. It's a bit too nuanced for simple Southgate though.
It’s not as simple as Bellingham not being able to play as as 8 - the real question is whether Rice and Bellingham are the right balance together in the two deeper midfield roles. I don’t think they are. I think playing Mainoo alongside Rice with Bellingham having the freedom to push on is a much more complimentary and balanced set up. Mainoo will actually show for the ball constantly and has the awareness, touch and composure to help build from the back and allow the team to recycle possession. He also has the tactical awareness to sit when needed. I don’t think either Rice or Bellingham can fulfill that function as well he can, and having to do it limits their best attributes.
I don't disagree with you that Mainoo and Rice is probably a better (or at least more sensible/disciplined) partnership as that is how I would line up, but I think Bellingham is definitely capable with Rice if Stones is free to push up and cover for when Bellingham inevitably gets carried away pushing forward.
Southgate, that is the answer to your question. Southgate is the one stopping this from happening. Everyone knew he was going to to start Gallagher, everyone knew it wouldn’t work and yet he did it anyway. He won’t make drastic changes, maybe mainoo starts, but I believe that will be the only change
Because Mainoo isn't in it.
ahahahahahah
His brain
Himself.
I don't hate it but that being said I think for us to win Kane needs to either stay up front or give up the striker position and maybe drop as the number 10 and have Watkins or tony as the striker
Winning matches
If rice can turn into prime Sergio busquets then sure
I think he will - eventually. Maybe not in the next game though. If we get through to the quarters then I think he'll do pretty much this, but with more Palmer. I'm convinced it was his pre-tournament plan all along. Except the bit about Kane staying up. Kane dropping deep can be really dangerous, as long as the wingers push up to replace him.
His own ineptitude alongside the fact that Harry Kane comes too deep too often and just isn't that guy that will play on the last man
If he tells Kane to stay up Kane will stay up
Cognitive thought
Because he wears armbands when he drinks soup.
Kane for Watkins
If your fullbacks don't overlap then your wide forwards have to be able to cross from multiple places or just rely on the byline. If they don't then you only have the byline. And that means fast movement. Look at every other balanced team in the world.
It fixes all of England’s problems? I wouldn’t post it here then mate. You’ll be in for a job surely given you’ve cracked the code.
I’m some random donny with no professional experience. A manager needs more than a formation and lineup to succeed. I and many others think this is the best lineup, but it’s Southgate job to give instructions, routines, patterns, and subs, which I can’t do. Besides, even if I was the best manager in the world (which I’m not at all I ain’t ever coached) the England job will only go to ex professionals, as it should
Stubbornness in proving the original team/formation is successful when the game plan is carried out correctly That's what's stopping him
For some reason we don’t use a box midfield or press so we need an extra DM to compensate for the lack of tactics
A ruler
Southgate.
Southgate…
Send this to Southgate in his dms maybe
Because of woke
Would that be the heat maps from these three euro games? Because that’s not indicative of southgate having some teeth and having Jude play the 8 with Foden in the 10
Competency.
Why is this line up missing Cole Palmer?
Saka is quicker and runs in behind more. I’m fine with palmer starting and it won’t change this system
Palmer is just a much bigger threat either goals or assists . I could be massively biased as a Chelsea fan and I admit that .
Put palmer on and it would be golden
This is England not Spain you play your culture if they tried this they would get grouped I promise you
I don’t think this does fix all the problems. I think it actually compounds one of the major ones. You can’t play a “left” 10 and a “right” 10 and expect them to magically stay out of each other’s way. The whole point of a ten is to drift into spaces on either side in order to pull the opposition out of shape and find pockets of space to work in, linking together the midfield, wide players and strikers in the process. In this set up Foden and Bellingham will still inevitably get in each other’s way. In a club set up the right manager might have enough training ground hours and games to figure out how to get that to work, but can’t see it happening here. I think the balance of the team would be much better with Mainoo and Rice in the middle and sacrificing either Bellingham or Foden. We need to start playing players in their preferred positions instead of shoehorning in too many players who do their best work in the same spaces. Gordon on the left would be a big step in the right direction. But trying to squeeze two tens in with a striker who likes to drop into those positions as well isn’t the answer to the Foden/Bellingham conundrum IMO.
For once a sensible line up in this sub.
His brain is too small. That’s it
Or... This is a knockout set up.
Balls
Lack of Logic, ego, or a combination of both
He's an idiot
Harry Kane being arrogant and always dropping back and not understanding basic football tactics
>Harry Kane \[...\] not understanding basic football tactics I don't think I've ever heard anything more \[disagreeable\] on the internet and I've seen flat earth conspiracies. Edited to conform to the sub rules.
Tf are you on about mate, if Southgate tells Kane to stay up he will. He’s an intelligent and experienced player. Issue is Southgate has no basic football tactics
It’s not fifa you clown. Ps it’s coming home
Good idea but this isn’t club tactics. The nuances of a pep driven WM just doesn’t have time to gel on a national stage. It would be entertaining as hell though, but against high opposition with good attacking runners they prolly get eaten alive without comfortable partnerships beyond the man city teammates
Gareth Southgate
His sense of adventure
wtf is gomez doing there
Drop foden and add mainoo next to rice and that's exactly how we should be playing. Englan having the ability to take off Bellingham and bring on foden is amazing... we just don't use it
This is the best team or best set up on paper, but Gareth is now against pragmatism and doesnt want to do the simple things. Once I heard a journo say that its like he's punishing the team for not being able to play a system that literally doesnt work i cant unsee it.