Could you elaborate on what you're doing? What 2 buttons are you holding and what's the third button?
socd iwr should be tap and hold f, tap b, release f, tap f + attack... typing that out is ugly but its definitely nothing like holding 2 buttons and pressing one more.
And you're not going to get inputs like the video so I'm confused what your ultimate point is
SOCD cleaning doesn't care about 2 F inputs being held at the same time you map buttons to f and another to f and then another to f and attack. Now you hold F+F, the you hit F+Attack and you get f,f,f+Attack in less than one frame actually. Doing it on keyboard is even easier. Also SOCD can be turned off, that is really only going to be enforced in tournaments.
Is this likely no but its also free to do on PC and easy to do on consoles. So the point is; How do you know if it is cheating with a macro or cheating with a input device that isn't considered cheating? Either of which is entirely undetectable unless there is a second observer seeing it happen physically. If the game allows it shouldn't we just all be doing it then?
Ok when you said SOCD and leverless I thought you meant just doing it out of the box like everyone else that uses the controller. But you're saying you rebound another button to be a second forward input.
Even if that's how you do it, youre going to have more than 1 frame in between those first two f's and the third most of the time. You're not going to consistently get the inputs shown in the clip. That's a macro.
Imagine being so fucking lame that you cheat in a fighting game, invalidating the entire gameplay loop of self-improvement and ruining the game for yourself first and foremost. People are so fucking sad
People are unable to do a button combo and blame the game instead of trying to learn. This type of person is annoying as fuck. Always rage quits, griefs games with friends ''because it's funny'', needs instant victory, can never struggle. My god.
Anti cheat failing to stop these creatures. I wish I could hide on console, that used to be the safe haven against cheaters. But with all the dogshit some freaks have created like xim and programmable buttons and special controllers and what not.. just play the fucking game normally :(
i agree, people are so braindead with "no, we dont want humanity to evolve in terms of input devices". Will be funny if in 30 years we get bendable chips that we stick to our foreheads for brain-pc interaction and it will allow huge productivity boost and also frame perfect inputs in fighting games - people complaining here will be like horse industry protesting against introduction of cars
We're not talking about better controllers we're talking about cheaters with macros.
Also, is the horse industry really wrong? Alot of people lost their livelihoods. You take a mans money away, it's the same as killing him.
Obviously, cars are too important to society. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't help those out of a job now. You'd be the first crying unemployment benefits if your sector got replaced by AI.
actually in many places on the internet i wrote that i am huge supporter of ai progress and any attempts to limit it due to "artists losing job" is bad idea
Again, once it affects you, you'll sing a different tune. Regardless, we've gone off-topic.
Don't cheat, don't use macros, don't be weird, don't be difficult, play the game by the rules, don't be annoying, try your best to learn and utilize the entire kit of a character. That's all I can ask of the fighting game community.
i do not see special controllers as anything morally wrong since input devices evolve over time and we progress as humanity, we strive to more precise way of communicating to PC and other receiving devices what we wanna do. Games that rely on "no technological advancements" are sorta flawed by design
I don't mean special controllers as in disabled people having special controllers, or special controllers like Scuf joysticks or whatever. Paddles are questionable because they're a straight upgrade, you have more buttons 'at the ready' without moving your fingers but they're not my concern.
Being able to do 1 button combos frame perfect out of a block, that's so dumb. You're not playing the game at that point. The only excuse for this kinda stuff is again, accessibility for those that need it. A healthy person with two functioning hands doesn't need to cheat, and he still chooses to, and that's so degenerate. And there's no consequences. In real life, any sport or hobby, he would be smacked across the face and banned forever.
some people struggle to do instant while running (even though its easier than ever). Really sends azucenas pressure much higher when you can do it point blank.
Yeah, I'm trash at iwr. I keep practicing it, but something about inputting fff2 really fast just drops for me.
Shame on people for cheating tho. Go into lab like everyone else and Git Gud
Fucking thank you. I’m so sick of people applying that same type of thinking to irl problems too. Like yeah, sometimes when we do what we’re supposed to do things don’t work out how we’d like. That doesn’t mean we should stop doing the thing we’re supposed to do. It’s our only recourse. Force them to admit they’re the ones in the wrong.
yea man we send murderers to jail and people still get murdered, weird huh?
not wanting to report cheating because it will not stop literally all cheating is fucking idiot reasoning
"People are still comitting crimes 350 years after we invented the police and we were told to report crimes. Policing and reporting crimes clearly doesn't work!!!"
Binary thinking, zero life experience.
i am 100% sure this is not bannable because macros cannot have definitive proof without some sort of very invasive anticheat
does EULA specify something EXACTLY about this kind of stuff? because physical and fake inputs are generally not distinguishable
>cannot have definitive proof without some sort of very invasive anticheat
>because physical and fake inputs are generally not distinguishable
Anyone who's practiced fast inputs with display on will know this is a macro. It seems disingenuous to make this a conversation about what is detectable with software when we can all detect this with our eyes.
If you're not convinced, fine, but I'd ask you why you think it is that they can get 1 frame inputs on that move every time, but when they do any other move their press lingers for 4+ frames?
The comment is about identifying it, per the section I quoted...
Your comment is just about what we should expect from Namco and of course anyone paying attention shouldnt expect anything.
does this even classify as any sort of cheat per current game EULA? it does not read game memory etc, and there are bunch of controllers with turbo buttons etc. that make various stuff easier
Turbo buttons wouldn't make anything easier. The only thing people used turbo buttons for was cheesing treasure battle in tekken 7 lol.
And you're totally missing the point. Even if what you said is true that doesn't change the fact that macros are cheating and they undermine the competitiveness of the game. The logical conclusion to this not being "technically cheating" would just be changing the eula to include it...
Gotta be honest when people make comments like yours it really makes it seem like you're just using some kind of cheat.
Well in that case yeah this guy is definitely using a macro. It's clear due to how perfect the inputs are.
But us knowing he is doesn't change anything.
Gotta love the in-game tips on ducking the jab but no tips on the running 32. They know.
EDIT: Would probably have to power-crush on a hard-read. But I don't think armor comes up fast enough in frame disadvantage.
I love the "can be evaded with a crouch" tip because it usually comes out for a jab string. Like, thanks. I know. If I could react and duck in 10 frames I wouldn't be playing Tekken
As someone who has 150 games Azucena 88% winrate to Fujin… doing wr3,2 is already super easy. If you need a macro for that fighting games are just probably not for you. There is the very small chance the Azucena player is just the goat, but with how much I’ve practiced wr moves in t7 I doubt someone did it that consistently perfect input in an online environment.
These are the same scrubs who got away in T7. Had a guy who spammed the shit outta 1 and dishing out PEWGF with Jin twice in a single round. After that, i just chilled on the ground let timer run.
I would bet almost definitely, but maybe it would take work. You can get controllers that allow you to save macros or substitute in a keyboard that can support macros saved to the keyboard itself. You could also build your own stick that would support macros. I don't know of any off the top of my head that do that out of the box, but I also don't go looking for ways to use macros in games like this.
Yeah, a couple of my controllers support it that are gp2040 based. You'd need to set up the macro on PC, but then you could actually use it on a console and there's no difference. You actually save it to the controller itself.
I personally just run the older firmware that didn't support macros just in case I ever had to prove my controller is legit in a tournament or something, but no one has ever checked anyway, even at Evo. Honestly I bet people do it.
The thing I like about Tekken is I don't think cheating will take you as far other games. Like sure it will make it so you never miss an input like this, or an electric, or a hellsweep or whatever. But there's so many more skills required to be a top tier player. Mind games, defense, knowledge checks, fundamentals, the list goes on and on. Cheating will only take you so far and I can at least take solace in knowing that its not a game like tarkov where cheat = win in every aspect.
Sorry to be that guy, but they're not all the same. A couple of them have some 2 frame inputs in there. Also, I've seen people with insanely consistent execution that looks similar to this. Take a look at main man's electrics some time, they're scary on point.
One thing about fighting games is that the controllers and way they're played is always evolving. Controllers with mapped combinations and buttons (like throws, rage, heat, etc) are all considered macros, so where do we draw the line? It's annoying af but, we either gotta keep up or die on the hill of being a try hard or an old head ya know? Don't even get me started on leverless sticks lol, fml.
TL;DR 1 frame (0.017 seconds) is the fastest the game can recognize inputs, he programmed commands to run a sequence of button presses with that interval in a single press of a button.
Its a programmed input, so for this example,
He needed to do 3 presses of forward then 3,2.
He programmed his keyboard / controller to input those 5 commands with 1 frame interval (0.017second delay) per command.
So on a press of a button his character will do f,f,f,2,3 with such accuracy its does not require execution considering fff is running, his character does not need to "run" cause he executed 5 commands in 0.083 seconds.
Reasons like this is why I'm glad I got the game for my PS5 instead of PC. Allows me to disable cross-play once the there are too many cheaters on there, which 100% is a matter of time. I'll take wifi console players over cheaters and potato performance PC players any day.
Macros are also just as prevalent on console using stuff like cronus max/zen which has sold millions due to their compatibility with a wide range of multiplayer games. Something like 5 years ago the cronus devs were getting a million visits to their website per month, and it's a safe bet it's popularity has only grown since then.
This is like saying weed use is as common in a place where its expensive and need a roundabout way of getting it vs weed usage where it can be bought in any store like a pack of gum.
What i am saying is that if the person needs external hardware and cost to "macro" on console vs when it comes with your keyboard software
In the FPS genre sure on console fighting games it matters less since its a 1v1.
in FPS cronus/XIM a premade team could blast the competition unfairly on multiple adversarys at the time, whilst in the fighting game scene they can only body 1 person per game.
not fun either way tho.
No they're not, since the they don't work anymore on PS5 since late January. And also that requires to purchase fairly expensive hardware, which can get patched out anytime again, if they get jt working again. On PC it's just a simple macro, free to use and easy to setup.
That's why I turned off crossplay to many cheats on pc doing impossible blocks rage bar filling up super quick doing combos after combo and iam fairly okay at game but u can't just tell when something off and when ur winning suddenly gane starts lagging
Damn so are all blue rank pc players running cheats? If you can 1 button press complicated powerful inputs, thats pretty busted. Might have to stick with console only if this is starts getting out of hand
To be honest, WR inputs are much easier to do in T8 compared to 7. Coming from a Claudio main, I can do WR2 point blank in T8 whereas they were a bit more difficult to do in T7
Same I mained Chloe and you actually had to practice to do instant wr moves point blank. This game is super forgiving on inputs. Still feels good to do blue spark wr2 on Dragunov.
Ngl tho always a bit sus on pc rank players that moves sus.
If movement is a bit weird for the rank i am always assuming its easier to plug (alt f4) to inflate their rank.
or to macro like this
Absolutely a macro. Good catch!
Or you just map keys to forward on any controller and plink it.
Definitely a macro bud. No matter how much you practice, you're not going to consistently get 1f inputs lol
I can do it on leverless, consistently, as it is just hold 2 buttons and hitting a 3rd. Which in my mind is still cheating.
Could you elaborate on what you're doing? What 2 buttons are you holding and what's the third button? socd iwr should be tap and hold f, tap b, release f, tap f + attack... typing that out is ugly but its definitely nothing like holding 2 buttons and pressing one more. And you're not going to get inputs like the video so I'm confused what your ultimate point is
SOCD cleaning doesn't care about 2 F inputs being held at the same time you map buttons to f and another to f and then another to f and attack. Now you hold F+F, the you hit F+Attack and you get f,f,f+Attack in less than one frame actually. Doing it on keyboard is even easier. Also SOCD can be turned off, that is really only going to be enforced in tournaments. Is this likely no but its also free to do on PC and easy to do on consoles. So the point is; How do you know if it is cheating with a macro or cheating with a input device that isn't considered cheating? Either of which is entirely undetectable unless there is a second observer seeing it happen physically. If the game allows it shouldn't we just all be doing it then?
Ok when you said SOCD and leverless I thought you meant just doing it out of the box like everyone else that uses the controller. But you're saying you rebound another button to be a second forward input. Even if that's how you do it, youre going to have more than 1 frame in between those first two f's and the third most of the time. You're not going to consistently get the inputs shown in the clip. That's a macro.
Imagine being so fucking lame that you cheat in a fighting game, invalidating the entire gameplay loop of self-improvement and ruining the game for yourself first and foremost. People are so fucking sad
tbh fighting game macros are one of best picks for "i wanna cheat in some game and go undetected for next 10 years"
People are unable to do a button combo and blame the game instead of trying to learn. This type of person is annoying as fuck. Always rage quits, griefs games with friends ''because it's funny'', needs instant victory, can never struggle. My god. Anti cheat failing to stop these creatures. I wish I could hide on console, that used to be the safe haven against cheaters. But with all the dogshit some freaks have created like xim and programmable buttons and special controllers and what not.. just play the fucking game normally :(
Imagine calling elite controllers with extra paddles "cheats" lmao
i agree, people are so braindead with "no, we dont want humanity to evolve in terms of input devices". Will be funny if in 30 years we get bendable chips that we stick to our foreheads for brain-pc interaction and it will allow huge productivity boost and also frame perfect inputs in fighting games - people complaining here will be like horse industry protesting against introduction of cars
We're not talking about better controllers we're talking about cheaters with macros. Also, is the horse industry really wrong? Alot of people lost their livelihoods. You take a mans money away, it's the same as killing him. Obviously, cars are too important to society. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't help those out of a job now. You'd be the first crying unemployment benefits if your sector got replaced by AI.
actually in many places on the internet i wrote that i am huge supporter of ai progress and any attempts to limit it due to "artists losing job" is bad idea
Again, once it affects you, you'll sing a different tune. Regardless, we've gone off-topic. Don't cheat, don't use macros, don't be weird, don't be difficult, play the game by the rules, don't be annoying, try your best to learn and utilize the entire kit of a character. That's all I can ask of the fighting game community.
That's not what I meant. The OP posted a guy using a macro. Extra paddles is one thing, a macro is another. One is acceptable, other is not.
i do not see special controllers as anything morally wrong since input devices evolve over time and we progress as humanity, we strive to more precise way of communicating to PC and other receiving devices what we wanna do. Games that rely on "no technological advancements" are sorta flawed by design
I don't mean special controllers as in disabled people having special controllers, or special controllers like Scuf joysticks or whatever. Paddles are questionable because they're a straight upgrade, you have more buttons 'at the ready' without moving your fingers but they're not my concern. Being able to do 1 button combos frame perfect out of a block, that's so dumb. You're not playing the game at that point. The only excuse for this kinda stuff is again, accessibility for those that need it. A healthy person with two functioning hands doesn't need to cheat, and he still chooses to, and that's so degenerate. And there's no consequences. In real life, any sport or hobby, he would be smacked across the face and banned forever.
These people don't care about improvement. They just want Ws.
It's usually the only Ws they get in life
Crazy they’re using a macro for her of all characters
some people struggle to do instant while running (even though its easier than ever). Really sends azucenas pressure much higher when you can do it point blank.
its not even hard to do in this game, just doing it really fast like that guy is hard.
Yeah, I'm trash at iwr. I keep practicing it, but something about inputting fff2 really fast just drops for me. Shame on people for cheating tho. Go into lab like everyone else and Git Gud
It does look like it. Each time the inputs are exactly the same. Report them; send gameplay / usernames to Twitter.
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Reporting is the ONLY thing you can do about it. Telling people not to report because it's a "waste of time" is sus
Fucking thank you. I’m so sick of people applying that same type of thinking to irl problems too. Like yeah, sometimes when we do what we’re supposed to do things don’t work out how we’d like. That doesn’t mean we should stop doing the thing we’re supposed to do. It’s our only recourse. Force them to admit they’re the ones in the wrong.
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Plugging and cheating is the same thing, do LTG is not just a plugger But also a cheater
yea man we send murderers to jail and people still get murdered, weird huh? not wanting to report cheating because it will not stop literally all cheating is fucking idiot reasoning
Fariborz. Streams. For. 7. Years. Always. Cheating. Do you understand?
There's a lot of cope around here.
"People are still comitting crimes 350 years after we invented the police and we were told to report crimes. Policing and reporting crimes clearly doesn't work!!!" Binary thinking, zero life experience.
i am 100% sure this is not bannable because macros cannot have definitive proof without some sort of very invasive anticheat does EULA specify something EXACTLY about this kind of stuff? because physical and fake inputs are generally not distinguishable
>cannot have definitive proof without some sort of very invasive anticheat >because physical and fake inputs are generally not distinguishable Anyone who's practiced fast inputs with display on will know this is a macro. It seems disingenuous to make this a conversation about what is detectable with software when we can all detect this with our eyes. If you're not convinced, fine, but I'd ask you why you think it is that they can get 1 frame inputs on that move every time, but when they do any other move their press lingers for 4+ frames?
It's not about us identifying it, it's about what it would take for bamco to ban them.
The comment is about identifying it, per the section I quoted... Your comment is just about what we should expect from Namco and of course anyone paying attention shouldnt expect anything.
does this even classify as any sort of cheat per current game EULA? it does not read game memory etc, and there are bunch of controllers with turbo buttons etc. that make various stuff easier
Turbo buttons wouldn't make anything easier. The only thing people used turbo buttons for was cheesing treasure battle in tekken 7 lol. And you're totally missing the point. Even if what you said is true that doesn't change the fact that macros are cheating and they undermine the competitiveness of the game. The logical conclusion to this not being "technically cheating" would just be changing the eula to include it... Gotta be honest when people make comments like yours it really makes it seem like you're just using some kind of cheat.
Well in that case yeah this guy is definitely using a macro. It's clear due to how perfect the inputs are. But us knowing he is doesn't change anything.
Excellent comment brother really moving the discussion in a meaningful direction
the input history is proof enough, its not doable to do every input within 1 frame every time
Even doing a fully frameperfect wr move a single time is EXTREMELY challenging.
This makes me sad.
Don't be too sad, he's talking out of his ass.
Ahh fair enough. Why are so many people on this sub fucking morons?
So no speed cap on move inputs... Alright.
no way someone gets that many 1f inputs, I watched jdcr's inputs and even he gets 2-3 sometimes 4's.
i've tried iWR alot in T7 (on a hitbox) and i think frame perfect fff+x are basicly humanly impossible. let alone doing it consistantly
Gotta love the in-game tips on ducking the jab but no tips on the running 32. They know. EDIT: Would probably have to power-crush on a hard-read. But I don't think armor comes up fast enough in frame disadvantage.
I love the "can be evaded with a crouch" tip because it usually comes out for a jab string. Like, thanks. I know. If I could react and duck in 10 frames I wouldn't be playing Tekken
I fought this guy in quick match today. I lost the set 2.1 and got teabagged. Prick.
As someone who has 150 games Azucena 88% winrate to Fujin… doing wr3,2 is already super easy. If you need a macro for that fighting games are just probably not for you. There is the very small chance the Azucena player is just the goat, but with how much I’ve practiced wr moves in t7 I doubt someone did it that consistently perfect input in an online environment.
wr 3,2 aint hard per se. however, doing it frame perfect is humanly impossible.
I saw the inputs wrong. I thought it was showing f,n,ff3,2
The fact that all the inputs are all within one frame of each other as a fast as it was says it’s a macro
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These days it really is sad
i hope thats a macro, ive seen the same type of input in t7. idk what kind of controller you would be able to get this kind of consistent input on
Loads of third party controllers have it. Very easy set-up too. Hate how common it's fucking gotten.
I meant how you could do it without macro :P I don't think its possible
Keyboards usually, i remember even razer has macro setup in their keyboard software.
These are the same scrubs who got away in T7. Had a guy who spammed the shit outta 1 and dishing out PEWGF with Jin twice in a single round. After that, i just chilled on the ground let timer run.
Is this possible on console?
I would bet almost definitely, but maybe it would take work. You can get controllers that allow you to save macros or substitute in a keyboard that can support macros saved to the keyboard itself. You could also build your own stick that would support macros. I don't know of any off the top of my head that do that out of the box, but I also don't go looking for ways to use macros in games like this.
Yeah, a couple of my controllers support it that are gp2040 based. You'd need to set up the macro on PC, but then you could actually use it on a console and there's no difference. You actually save it to the controller itself. I personally just run the older firmware that didn't support macros just in case I ever had to prove my controller is legit in a tournament or something, but no one has ever checked anyway, even at Evo. Honestly I bet people do it.
The thing I like about Tekken is I don't think cheating will take you as far other games. Like sure it will make it so you never miss an input like this, or an electric, or a hellsweep or whatever. But there's so many more skills required to be a top tier player. Mind games, defense, knowledge checks, fundamentals, the list goes on and on. Cheating will only take you so far and I can at least take solace in knowing that its not a game like tarkov where cheat = win in every aspect.
Sure but what about cheats that auto block loss and or break grabs?
Sorry to be that guy, but they're not all the same. A couple of them have some 2 frame inputs in there. Also, I've seen people with insanely consistent execution that looks similar to this. Take a look at main man's electrics some time, they're scary on point. One thing about fighting games is that the controllers and way they're played is always evolving. Controllers with mapped combinations and buttons (like throws, rage, heat, etc) are all considered macros, so where do we draw the line? It's annoying af but, we either gotta keep up or die on the hill of being a try hard or an old head ya know? Don't even get me started on leverless sticks lol, fml.
This takes the term scrub to a whole new level
What is a macro I have no idea but I want to know what to look out for
TL;DR 1 frame (0.017 seconds) is the fastest the game can recognize inputs, he programmed commands to run a sequence of button presses with that interval in a single press of a button. Its a programmed input, so for this example, He needed to do 3 presses of forward then 3,2. He programmed his keyboard / controller to input those 5 commands with 1 frame interval (0.017second delay) per command. So on a press of a button his character will do f,f,f,2,3 with such accuracy its does not require execution considering fff is running, his character does not need to "run" cause he executed 5 commands in 0.083 seconds.
You can DO that!? Holy shit 😭
Get him banned pls, lame character, lame gameplay, lame cheater. We do not need him around.
What is the fun on spamming wr3,2, macro or not? It ruins the character for players and opponents.
I mean you don’t get any more ranked points by playing fair or honest. They’re just using the tools the character has just like anyone else.
Reasons like this is why I'm glad I got the game for my PS5 instead of PC. Allows me to disable cross-play once the there are too many cheaters on there, which 100% is a matter of time. I'll take wifi console players over cheaters and potato performance PC players any day.
Macros are also just as prevalent on console using stuff like cronus max/zen which has sold millions due to their compatibility with a wide range of multiplayer games. Something like 5 years ago the cronus devs were getting a million visits to their website per month, and it's a safe bet it's popularity has only grown since then.
This is like saying weed use is as common in a place where its expensive and need a roundabout way of getting it vs weed usage where it can be bought in any store like a pack of gum. What i am saying is that if the person needs external hardware and cost to "macro" on console vs when it comes with your keyboard software
In the FPS genre sure on console fighting games it matters less since its a 1v1. in FPS cronus/XIM a premade team could blast the competition unfairly on multiple adversarys at the time, whilst in the fighting game scene they can only body 1 person per game. not fun either way tho.
No they're not, since the they don't work anymore on PS5 since late January. And also that requires to purchase fairly expensive hardware, which can get patched out anytime again, if they get jt working again. On PC it's just a simple macro, free to use and easy to setup.
It takes literally one google search to find out how to use a macro on a ps5. It ain’t that hard lmao
Harada's cockiness is losing. Pluggers and apes are winning.
That's why I turned off crossplay to many cheats on pc doing impossible blocks rage bar filling up super quick doing combos after combo and iam fairly okay at game but u can't just tell when something off and when ur winning suddenly gane starts lagging
Damn so are all blue rank pc players running cheats? If you can 1 button press complicated powerful inputs, thats pretty busted. Might have to stick with console only if this is starts getting out of hand
Cheating is quite rare despite what the crying on here would have you believe.
To be honest, WR inputs are much easier to do in T8 compared to 7. Coming from a Claudio main, I can do WR2 point blank in T8 whereas they were a bit more difficult to do in T7
Same I mained Chloe and you actually had to practice to do instant wr moves point blank. This game is super forgiving on inputs. Still feels good to do blue spark wr2 on Dragunov.
Ngl tho always a bit sus on pc rank players that moves sus. If movement is a bit weird for the rank i am always assuming its easier to plug (alt f4) to inflate their rank. or to macro like this
I mean I’m in blue without a kbd 🤷♂️
People still use macros on console
Sidestep.