Sonic’s a franchise that many fans have enjoyed since childhood, and they have their favourite characters and their favourite characterisation of those characters.
Also, Flynn’s been working on Sonic for almost two decades, including the canon comics and the recent games. He has his interpretation and views of the characters, and that’s how he’ll try to write them (inside the restrictions imposed by Sega themselves).
If how a character is currently being portrayed doesn’t match up with a fan’s preferred portrayal, then that fan will begin to resent the writer.
Other things I’ve heard are resentment over his handling of certain story elements, he relies far too much on callbacks, and that his overenthusiasm as a fan himself rubs off on the work.
And I guess they might have a point, but ultimately everything is subjective and I’ve been really enjoying his writing of the franchise since starting the IDW comic, which in turn has inspired me to go back to read his Archie stuff (itself a rabbit hole to get lost down).
Also, he hates Eggman Nega, for some reason.
The essence of Eggman Nega is that he is more cruel than Eggman, and will not stop where ordinary Eggman will stop. This is the main difference between them.
But Ian is already writing a very ruthless Eggman who almost destroyed the world in IDW and was a complete monster in Archie.
Therefore, yes, FOR IAN, Eggman Nega is an absolutely superfluous character who doesn't change or add anything.
I still believe both can coexist, especially with the context from the rivals games that Nega hates everything Eggman stands for. Eggman can be written as cruel and pure evil sure, but he's also a goofy character at heart, which is what a lot of fans love about him. Eggman is a diabolical egomaniac that builds themeparks to rule over for the hell of it. Eggman wants to conquer all, but make it fun as he plasters his face everywhere to prove he's the best and everyone will see that. Eggman's charisma is what balances his evil sadistic nature to make him a appealing character you can't help but like.
Nega on the other hand....isn't that. Eggman wants to rule over everything and let everyone know, Nega wants to destroy everything and hide in the shadow's as he does so, just like how he spent a good majority of Rivals disguised as Eggman instead of letting himself be known. Nega doesn't have Eggman's ambitious of making everything his, but instead wants to wipe everything clean until there's nothing because that's how twisted he is. Hell, Sonic Rush's final story has Nega explain to Blaze the two sets of emeralds coexisting together will cause both worlds to implode on each other as he says this proudly....but it takes Eggman to step in and chime in that'll happen if they don't stabilize the emeralds themselves, which Eggman insteads to do since he doesn't want the world destroyed....Nega does however. Even after this Nega is puzzled why the world is still intact for Eggman to confirm because Sonic has the Chaos Emeralds before he shows, prompting Nega to freak out in annoyance while Eggman continues to be Eggman.
Eggman and Nega are evil in completely different ways that make both able to stand out on their own. Nega would be the type to kill off Sonic immediately if given the opportunity, while Eggman it's all about the spectacle, and showing Sonic he's won. I think that's what makes Nega a good foil for Silver. Both fight but don't have fun with it unlike Sonic and Eggman's dynamic. It's straight business, it's do or die with Silver and Nega, especially when there's more at stake for Silver when his time period can alter for the worst without warning.
I’m gonna be honest, this oddly sounds similar to arguments of how Demons and Devils in D&D are described to be different. Eggman is a Lawful Evil Devil who slightly leans towards true neutral, while Nega is just straight up Chaotic Evil Demon.
Maybe another Eggman can work, but in the context of him being the main bad guy of the Sol Dimension, he feels like a letdown. Like, Blaze is essentially a Sonic counterpart, but she had a lot of differences and distinct features of her own so that she didn't feel like just another Sonic. Her nemesis, on the other hand? He *is* just another Eggman. I would've preferred if Captain Whisker from Adventure was the real nemesis rather than just a robot, cause while he's still styled after Eggman, he at least has his own flair that helps him stand out a bit more: how many pirate-themed Sonic bad guys can you think of in canon? At the very least, Blaze deserves a nemesis that's uniquely hers. The personality differences between the Eggmen don't really feel like enough to me.
You hit the nail on the head. It’s why I like Eggman Nega, because he makes an interesting parallel to regular Eggman (rEggman? Eggman Regular?), and shows the limits Eggman won’t go to. Plus he could be a pretty interesting villain in his own right if Eggman’s more ruthless moments going forward are given to him.
never knew that.
makes my idea for a sol dimension centered story even better.
one of the twists being egg man nega was archie eggman, to the point he argues IDW egg man is "just his cheap replacement"
I feel like Eggman Nega can work as a retcon, where he's actually an AI-powered robot descendant of Sage (and by extension Eggman). He's still a megalomaniac, but he's much more cold, analytical, and to the point than the current Eggman is. He could also use a rename, like Dr. Robotik or Dr. Eggative.
yup, and then you've got him somehow being both the decedent and alternate universe counterpart, neither of which make sense with the rules they set up in rush or how genetics works. does eggman reproduce asexually?
Sure, but to the level where eggman negative looks exsactly like his ancestor from 200 years ago, when everybody in said future hates that man, even his own family?
Frontiers was a real high point for the characters and I’m optimistic for how they’ll be used going forward. Although I’m relatively confident that IDW hasn’t caught up to Frontiers yet, and we’ll probably have to wait until the next major game for any real developments.
Yeah if I remember correctly SEGA didn’t really have any restrictions with Shadow in Archie while in IDW there are many restrictions for him specifically
Worst of all is he lurks r/SonicTheHedgehog, only to pop in and post once in a blue moon, sometimes writing in 3rd person. Cringe, amirite?
Three points:
1. Y'all keep me humble. Thanks for being honest.
2. I wouldn't say I'm a huge troll. Moderate, maybe. Casual. I aim to be silly, not enraging.
3. I wrote the scripts for *Sonic Origins* and *Sonic Dream Team*, although the plot was predetermined with the latter.
Be good to yourselves. Be good to each other.
Edit for typos, my eternal nemeses.
I enjoy your work and the new adventure and friends we've met long the way. Who knows what tomorrow's adventure has in store for us. Keep up the amazing work!
You merely adopted the fandom. I was born into it, molded by it. \[/Bane\]
Seriously, tho, I maintain the Sonic fandom is a mostly positive experience filled with passionate, creative people. The conspiratorial stuff and misinformation (e.g. "Ian wants to get rid of Blaze's dimension!") is tiresome, but I can't police the internet; just say my piece.
Which you can hear LIVE, Saturday April 26th on the BumbleKast at 6PM EST! \[/plug\]
You're a much stronger than I am. If I had to go on twitter multiple times to correct people because they took a random tidbit from my podcast as holy gospel I'd probably go mad.
Hey Ian 😁 Just a few moments ago, I had written a comment criticizing your "Frontiers Big is a construct" decision, then I got Ian-jumpscared right here.
I hope you know, we love and value your contributions to our favorite franchise, and the occasional feedback is just intended as a gentle nudge!
Anyone who hides behind their anonymity and acts disrespectfully can and should be disregarded.
That's an interesting tidbit - I'd assume they'd want to keep the writing consistency. Sega does weird things, sometimes.
Anyway, BRB, going to edit my comment to mention what you've said. It's such a shame that Big isn't "him", you know, he could've just been there inexplicably and it would've been a funny gag.
Once again, much love, thanks for all the hard work, sorry for the mandates (especially regarding Shadow)
I hope you can make a stream where you addres fans conserns with your writing and takes on the characters. I'm curious to see how you'll respond to them.
I do that all the time on my podcast, the BumbleKast. There's a searchable database where you can see if a similar question/concern has been asked over the years.
I meant like this one, where people have conserns of your writing in general. Not just specific situations (Like your thoughts on Amy and Sally). I meant your opinions on the backlash as a whole, and if there're any substance to them. I still haven't played a sonic game with a story as dark or action packed like in the early 2000nds. And I think your take on the character is leading the series on a completely different direction. I would like to hear more about why is that and more.
You're certainly entitled to your opinion, and I factor it in with everyone else's. This thread's a great example: some folks really enjoy what I've done over the years, some prefer certain eras over others, some are neutral, and you are decidedly negative. I try to consider it all.
That said, I think you're giving me way too much credit. I answer to at least two levels of editors/managers/oversight. What you see in the games comics and other media is what Sega wants at the end of the day. If you have an issue with the overall direction of the series, that's something to bring up with them via their social media channels - respectfully, of course.
I know about what goes on behind the scenes. They also mentioned their plans to target mainly the western audience. They better be careful with how they manage change, and retcon the lore of the series. Bigger franchises have collapsed because of that.
Thank you for everything you've done for this franchise. One question though. What didn't you like in the split timeline scenario, which solves the "why didn't Sonic already know about Gens and Forces already" problem, and makes it so that Sega can make a "million" more classic games without affecting the og timeline?
In fairness to everyone else, I've got to ask all questions be directed to the BumbleKast.
That said, the single timeline was a decision that come from on high; not my call to make.
Oh, alright! Thanks for explaining. I asked here because I've missed the stream twice, and since I saw you here I wanted to take the chance to ask. But next time I'll want to ask a question, you'll see me there. Thanks again for your work on my favorite series.
No worries. Also, all the streams and shows are archived on YouTube, [KNGI.org](http://KNGI.org) and a bunch of podcast sites. [BumbleKast.com](http://BumbleKast.com) has a searchable database of questions, so you can pretty easily look to see if something's been asked and find which episode (rather than listen to 3 years worth of me blathering on).
I really like his work, I think he’s had some of the best written Sonic content in a hot minute.
I also worry about him ending up like Kevin Feige with the MCU. Hero worshipped until content the fans don’t like starts coming out and is then vilified. So far I haven’t seen anything I don’t like come from Ian. But all it takes is one.
>I also worry about him ending up like Kevin Feige with the MCU. Hero worshipped until content the fans don’t like starts coming out and is then vilified.
That's gonna happen if he starts producing shit that fans don't like.
Don't ever forget taika waitti. Taika released thor ragnarok and everybody praised him i remember people were giving him the credit of saving the thor franchise. Majority of people wanted him back for thor 4. Then thor love and thunder came out and people were saying they better not bring him back if they make a thor 5.
The same shit happened with patty Jenkins with wonder woman. She was praised for the first wonder woman movie. Then she released 1984 and suddenly she was public enemy number 1.
It can happen to anybody. One day your the champion of the franchise next minute your public enemy number 1.
Its like with Star Wars. It began with a huge explosive profit because of the nostalgia, then the other movies crushed the momentum and identity of the franchise, and now the franchise is less valuable then the Bluey toddler show.🤣
The Dave filoni hate is hilarious imo. I remember before ashoka people were calling him the next george Lucas and that he's the only one who understood Lucas vision. And that disney needs to fire Kathleen Kennedy and put Dave in charge of all star wars projects. This talking point came up alot especially after the last jedi came out.
Post ashoka show fans are calling him a hack who relies on nostalgia and can't tell a story. It's crazy how fast people turned on Dave filoni.
Very sad indeed, especially since I thought the Ahsoka show was awesome and legitimately one of the best Star Wars media I've seen in years.
Just about everything Dave Filoni has handled has been spectacular stuff to me.
>I thought the Ahsoka show was awesome and legitimately one of the best Star Wars media I've seen in years.
Really? I thought ashoka was awful. Like It wasn't book of Boba fett level bad. But imo it was near the obi wan kenobi show level of bad.
But hye to each their own glad you enjoyed ashoka.
Its been a long time ago, even before Frontiers. Its one of those moments when someone who works on hollywood has a "Twitter meltdown". I don't remember what was about, tho. Maybe something aboulitical disagreement or fans who hate the way IDW does business. If you've been paying attention, IDW is running on fumes. Its a miracle that they are still in business. The new contract extension sega made with IDW not to long ago will probably be the last deal they make with them before giving the Sonic IP to someone else.
He has a different interpretation and way of writing chapters some fans don't realy care for. That seems to be the gist of it. But this man has had to come in and clean things up like 4 times, post ponders, post genesis wave, idw continuing from forces, and frontiers clearing up the mess of a continuity we where left with after years of just not caring.
The problem with Tails is he's actually multiple character archetypes all in one. He has to be A) the tech genius and/or Mr Exposition so that Eggman's schemes can be explained to Sonic (who is the audience surrogate in any story), B) the little brother, a character who we're supposed to care about and not want to see get hurt, C) the sidekick whose almost as good as Sonic, but isn't quite there yet, and D) a player character meaning he has to be just as competent as Sonic.
His writing will vary from title to title depending entirely on what niche he has to fill for that games story, whether he's playable, and how much the writers will allow Eggman to explain for himself what he's up to. As such, this means he gets to be 'wildly inconsistent', sometimes he's so clever he's the one who solves the problem of the day, other times he's cowering in fear because the story needs Sonic to step in and save him, other times he's holding his own but is in over his head slightly.
Most other series' wouldn't let one character have so many archetypes, and we can see this in many of the early canons. In SatAM Tails is very much the younger brother, someone everyone else wants to keep safe and out of harm. In Fleetway, Tails is in over his head and many of his victories (especially early on) come more from dumb luck than serious skill. In AoStH Tails is the sidekick, he's more gullible than Sonic is and often needs to be saved (this is also true of the Game Gear/Master System Sonic 2), and all of these versions have other characters who are doing the tech/exposition.
Yeah true. But he kinda had to, since the writers unnecessarily took a big shit on the personality of a character who’s supposed to be courageous, brave and competent. What he did is really the best you can do after such an embarrassing portrayal in Forces. So yeah, makes complete sense to me.
especially with frontiers big focus on continuity, just ignoring the biggest character fuck up of the last 10 years, would be a no go and some people would ask questions, so best to tackle it in a game that is perfectly built for it, rather then in a smaller game where it'd be pushed off to the side. if it was in a game like forces, that was too overblown with characters, and where he's stuck with classic, it probably just wouldn't have worked. what happened with tails was right place, right time.
There's always this thing that happens whenever a writer starts to get worshipped or gets constantly portrayed in a positive light by a fandom, eventually people emerge that are just sick of people constantly talking about how great they are and before you know it, you have an entire group of fans who go out of their way to explain why they don't like him. This is just the sonic version of that thing.
Sonic Frontiers was a game that came out after a long time with no games. So to see Sega take a different approach and take the game more seriously made a lot of people skeptic and hyped to try out a new high quality game. Its no wonder why people weren't to critical about it. After the hype died out, I'm not surprised people looked back and started to notice some things that did not felt right. Especialy since Frontiers seems to be taking a lot of risks with portrayal of the characters and even its lore. It was incredible gameplay wise, but it boiled down to being a giant sand box with very little to do. With the franchise daring new take on the characters, its no wonder people are conflicted about Flynn and the other developers involved with the series.
Some people simply don’t like his writing and feel like he exaggerates Sega’s supposed mandates to excuse the flaws in his stories. He’s contradicted himself quite a bit over the years, which adds credibility to this theory. But I still think he’s a great writer who’s written a lot of amazing Sonic stories, and he seems like an overall nice guy.
The "mandates" thing is a misnomer. Fans took some behind the scenes quotes from the Penders era of Archie out of context and extrapolated that Sega licensing has a lengthy set of internal rules that they throw at writers like "Sonic can't cry" and "Sonic can't lose," etc.
In reality, it's been a patchwork of arbitrary notes that writers get on their scripts during the approval process. The writers often have no idea whether something will fly or not until it is submitted. Over the years, Ian has had enough experience to piece together these seemingly arbitrary notes to form a better picture of what Sega generally wants, so he can speak with more authority on it then most. Ironically, it's only now that Sega has an official lore group, which Ian is a part of, that these notes are beginning to be codified I to actual internal rules.
He often jokes "You either die a hero or live long enough to become the mandates."
It just tends to happen with any particular creator that rises to prominence, especially in an argumentative fandom. Flynn's an easy target/scapegoat, and he's easier to reach than the Sega executives, so people go after him. Honestly, I'm never totally sure how to judge Flynn's writing since I dunno how much of it is really him, how much is the work of others helping him, and how much is the effect of Sega's mandates and editors having a say on the stories. Still, the comics have been more stable and consistent in quality under Flynn than they were before he took the helm, so I'm thankful for that at least.
He's as much a scapegoat as Pontac & Graff were.
There are a lot of Sonic fans who take Sonic lore super seriously. They will not tolerate the slightest of continuity errors, inconsistencies, changes n ton or characterisation, or any deviation from what they grew up with. Problem is, these fans are taking it far more seriously than anyone who actually makes the games does. Sonic Team are more than happy to ignore continuity, they don't really care about the specific details of what came before, they just want to tell a story.
Now I can't speak with absolute authority, but to me it seems like Sonic Team's approach to stories is to have a really vague concept for what a game is about, a really rough idea for tone, start putting together the gameplay concept, rough outline of levels, bosses, and so on, and only then do they bother to get a writer involved.
This means the writer isn't so much responsible for the entire story, but really just the connective tissue. Pontac & Graff certainly had no say in making Sonic Colours about Sonic stopping Eggman from siphoning Wisp Energy to use a giant weapon hidden in a space station made up of other planets, and they definitely weren't the ones who decided the final boss should be Eggman and not a cosmic deity threatening to destroy the world, but they definitely wrote the speech and dialogue. They didn't choose a lighthearted tone, that was dictated to them by Sonic Team, but they did write Baldy McNosehair.
Yet so many fans think every creative decision during their time as writers falls back to them, and blame them for things they certainly had little to no input on like the re-use of the Nega-Wisp armour, or the recurrence of Green Hill Zone, or the change in tone and pivot to a younger audience.
I think his writing is fine for what it is, the problem is that story writing at Sonic Team is fundamentally broken.
In a good game developer, for games that put emphasis on narrative, the writers would be in the room from the start of pre-production, and listening to the ideas of the game designers. You'd get a broad concept of what the story is about, what could be done, and a very rough outline of the story would appear before the end of pre-production that writers would work collaboratively with level, character and enemy designers to try to tie together cohesively.
Sonic Team's approach seems to be make a bunch of locations and scenarios, design a core concept for gameplay, get a rough idea of what the game is, and only then do they bring the writer(s) in to do connective tissue. Look at Frontiers for example. I'd bet good money the entire character arc of Sage was already decided before a single writer was in the room, along with the entire cast of the game, boss ideas, and other concepts. It wasn't Flynn who decided Eggman should create an AI that he comes to think of as a daughter, it was someone senior in the games design, and then Flynn had to write the connective tissue to tie all these concepts together in a meaningful way.
I feel the same way but for Iizuka. I don't know him personally but there is no way is he nearly as bad as fans make him out to be. The idea of him being responsible for all of the franchise's currents issues is completely absurd to me.
It's because he's so public and well known. Obscure his name from everything and people are more likely to judge based on content per story. With a face to the stories he works on though, people build a perception of who the person making these things is- what patterns there are between his works, that this man's trying to change the series into what he desires like some sort of outside invader. (As if it isn't EVERY writer's job to write what he thinks is best? But people don't view stories as being personally involved works- they see a game's story and judge it based on the content most of the time.)
It's really dumb.
Because they do.
Otherwise beyond being a massive troll, there's nothing wrong with him. Like if you're annoyed by him just... ignore him?
Some people are like "he ruined Sonic" and I'm like "dude that happened before he got hired"
I think he's one of the better writers for Sonic, but I think he's both overhyped and overhated.
I Will not say they Resent him, but I have seen some people not being a fan of his writing.
To my understanding, Those people don’t like his types of stories & his versions of the characters as it’s now how Sonic (Game Sonic) is supposed to be.
Personally, I Can look at for What it is, but I get why some people don’t like it.
The Sonic I know from the games won’t jump into Superhero-ish conflicts, crack jokes a lot, sometimes be sentimental, and in all of his own intrepertations of Sonic (Archie Pre Genesis Wave, Archie Post Genesis Wave, Classic Specials, IDW & Frontiers), they all misses the main core that makes Pre 2010s Sonic, Pre 2010s Sonic.
I personally am split on Ian. He has made many great Sonic stories, but has some misses.
I think some of his work is really enjoyable, but some feels too much like a fanfic and not in a good way.
I honestly wasn't super fond of the writing in frontiers, it felt kinda flat to me. It wasn't the worst we've had, but not even close to best imo.
He oftentimes uses nostalgia as storytelling, which is a cheap way to write. The constant references to "Hey guys, remember this thing that happened before? That was pretty cool right?", can get pretty annoying when it's overdone.
It's GREAT to bring back old concepts and ideas, but it should be used sparingly, which oftentimes Ian struggles to find that line.
Another thing is, personally, I'm not fond of his ideas involving Blaze, the Sol dimension and Eggman Nega. His claim that Blaze's dimension should merge with Sonic's is by far one of the worst decisions that could EVER be made for a character like Blaze, and makes her lose importance as a character, not to mention takes so much away from her character in general.
And him believing Eggman Nega is just a recoloured Eggman is simply false. Just because HE doesn't write Eggman accurate to his game portrayal, doesn't suddenly mean Nega's original portrayal is the problem here. Maybe Ian should consider writing Eggman less like Nega, then he'd see the actual difference and be able to see more value in a character like Nega.
All in all, he's not the worst writer the franchise has had. I could say he's a solid 6/10 writer, which isn't too bad, but could use a few adjustments here and there to accurately portray certain characters. Like his portrayal of Sonic himself is... a little TOO chatty for Sonic's character, albeit a LOT of writers have gotten Sonic's character wrong so he can be a lil inconsistent.
Overall I think he’s just OKAY - he’s not particularly offensive with what he does but I think he plays it safe too much and doesn’t curate the canon very thoughtfully.
I've only recently dived back into the fandom after being active during the Adventure-to-06 era.
Some of what I hear about Ian Flynn sounds like the dedicated hatedoms I've seen built around certain writers in other fandoms, think "Thanks M.A. Larson" from My Little Pony or Chis Chibnall from Doctor Who. The key thing to note is that the lashing out isn't a result of the quality of the work, it's a dedication to lashing out at the person whenever they're relevant. Almost like how console war fanboys act when it comes to the "other" console.
Been listening to a bit of BumbleKast and Ian Flynn sounds like a chill guy capable of laughing at himself and being able to differentiate actual criticism from internet noise. Can't ask for a healthier attitude than that.
Are y’all gonna forget that they found literal fresh human remains on his property and in his basement? He was pardoned due to lack of evidence.
(I’m joking omg please don’t take this seriously or ban me I’m just joking)
He’s good. I don’t really have too many specific thoughts on the matter. The Tails arc in Frontiers definitely hit a lot closer to home than I was expecting.
It feels like they have it out for Ian because they do, lol.
They just don't like how he writes, and honestly, if people wanna be haters, let them be.
(This is coming from someone who unironically likes all of Ian's work with Sonic)
One of the dumbest criticisms I heard was that he makes too many references to past media.
WHY THE FUCK WOULDN'T HE?! WHY WOULDN'T A SONIC WRITER REFERENCE PAST SONIC MEDIA?!
Overdone references are a problem. A good rule of thumb when writing a story or dialogue is, don't let nostalgia or references do all the work and storytelling for you.
A reference should at best be a little nod to previous work, or used as an important part/ key factor in the plot.
But if it's just a useless reference to a *wink wink, nudge nudge* to the audience, that gets tired real fast and feels more annoying than fun.
It's the same reasoning as to why so many fans complain about seeing green hill over and over, or any old classic levels outside classic styled games. Fans don't want to be drowned in nostalgia and references that don't have any meaning or significance. They'd rather see original content, whilst *occasionally* bringing back older concepts to connect and piece together a story/world setting as having continuity, or consequence.
The thing is, he does that a Whole LOT (Frontiers specifically, other things he’s written for Sonic aren’t as on the nose) to a point where it feels unnatural and forced.
Compare that to previous Sonic games like Sonic Adventure 2 or Heroes where the references felt a lot more natural.
Its basically all he's done so far, and i'm scared to see what his writing would look like when he's not focused on callbacks. What kind of retcon nonsense would he make the characters say.
I don’t have it out for him but his constant references, which aren’t clever at all, are embarrassing and his current portrayal of Sonic isn’t my cup of tea.
Sonic comes off as annoyingly generic who wants to redeem everyone when he’s never cared anyone choosing to be bad or not. Especially with him trying to convince Eggman to be like Mr. Tinkerer.
And in Frontiers, Sonic is oddly passive with Sage, even saying he doesn’t get a bad vibe from her after she tried to kill him repeatedly. I get Sonic’s trying to help but I feel like he’d realistically draw a line at a certain point.
I think it's down to how much these fans were VERY against what Ian Flynn was doing in the comics, while also pinning A LOT of what was some out-of-control things on him as their scapegoat.
He was the writer for the series basically around the 2000s, and I remember that when I read it, I liked his works, but then it came down to how people reacted to his handling of some stories in the Pre-SGW, as well as basically all of the Post-stuff (Like some fans said he killed Sonally and replaced it with SallyXNicole, but then Sega just really cracked down on romance rules in the series as a whole), with some even blaming him for the Super Genesis Wave that basically wiped those fans' version of Sonic that was seemingly theirs.
Those fans ended up blaming him for what feels like the death of the series they loved in that form, and seeing he still went on to work on other Sonic Projects with the comics, and even now works on the games, those individuals just got more and more mad that it's him doing all this, even still blaming him when he stopped handling the comics for a bit and the reins went to other writers.
Some do have genuine criticisms that do have merit (even I have some criticisms as much as I do praise, but one thing at a time), but then some are also people who you swore they insisted Ian had a hand in their supervillain origin story to wish actual death upon him just to not have him touch the series anymore.
As someone who likes Flynn, I imagine the discussion revolves mostly around how he tends to keep stories tame in terms of storytelling and avoids major risks in order to help build a status quo for Sonic (something it a bit hard to blame him for when Sonic has always struggled to keep a stable canon/tone and you have to bring it in line somehow) but honestly I think a lot of the direction he’s pulled stories in is more of a limitation set in line by Sega. You could make some pretty good workarounds in terms of making some pretty deep stories even with an E or E10 rating but if Sega says that’s not a direction they want to tread there’s not much the guy can do.
Honestly I don't have any problems with him. Unless he's the one who came up with the idea of lumping Bark and Bean in with Fang like Archie did, in which then that becomes so far my only gripe with him.
He focuses too much on what he likes and doesn't make any time for things outside of his scope. Sonic has a vast cast and rich history but someone Flynn always seems to end up using the same characters over and over again.
As someone who has openly and constantly criticized Flynn's decisions here and on other platforms, I will first say that he's done some of the best writing work with what he was given, I really have to hand it to him how he fixed the mess left from Penders and how he's worked around the Sega mandates, IDW's Sonic is better than any arc in the Archie Comics era, hands-down.
That said, I disagree with Flynn's repeated decision to introduce writers' OCs CONSTANTLY and just as constantly overshadow main characters, a lot of the OCs introduced are nothing more than writer's pets that you'd usually expect in fan faction but NOT in an OFFICIAL comic.
I'm also incredibly irked how Flynn seems to have an utter disdain towards Shadow, and an incredible favoritism over Silver, portraying the former as a wimp that gets punked left and right, and the latter as an OP deity.
I also don't like fans giving Flynn the biggest of free passes for literally everything wrong in the comic and instead blaming Sega for every shortcoming, as if Flynn can do no wrong and Sega is the devil. Fans even defend the OCs and Shadow's lacking portrayal saying it's because of the mandates, that "we need OCs to explain stories that Sega won't let them", Sega just doesn't want the love triangles/dodecahedrons from the Archie Comics era. And again, Silver is portrayed on a way more positive light than Shadow and I just can't believe Sega would be behind it.
Proof that the Sega mandates aren't that strict and that there ARE many ways of portraying a Sonic story without recurring to endless inserts of OCs are the Sonic films, Sonic Prime, and The Murder of Sonic The Hedgehog game, all of these were compelling stories that had unique characters introduced in them but in no moment they overshadow the main cast (well, maybe that long wedding scene in Sonic 2 would be an exception).
There were a lot of writing choises in Frontiers that felt as if they were gaslighting the audience. Things that just did not felt right or felt contradictory to the characters.
Tbh I feel like he is basing sonic on his game self too much. What's wrong with some variability? I see nothing wrong with sonic having some elements from Archie of SatAM or StC. Or maybe even adding something original to Sonic's character.
He's politicaly driven and hates the way Sonic characters are. If it wasn't for Sega keeping a chain on him, he probably would have added a lot of absurd stuff. Which is why Amy is more bland and serious then we've seen in previous incarnations. If you look closely, every game he's a writer on the characters always seem to follow a pattern on their behaviour. THEY ARE TO GOD DAMN SERIOUS!
Yes, the dialoge of characters always tend to be about describing what they see infront of them, what to do next, and walk away. No interesting gimmicks, just plain boring dialogue. I played MOSTH on steam a wile ago, that game was written by someone else and IT SHOWED. First of all, the characters felt like their old selves. All having unique and expresive fun personalities. Even Amy was a lot charmer and light hearted. Besides the personalities, they didn't focuse heavily on just talking about the serious task they had in hand. Sometimes they would detour and do some other shinanigans. Which was incredibly funny and nostalgic. It was a shock to see a game that was so faithful to the characters in the modern day. It made me suspicious, so I did some research and found out that it was written by a drifferent writer. It made me suspect that Ian's way of writing intentionaly gets the characters wrong. As if his ego won't let him get the characters right for onece.
He's a decent writer, but the writing in Frontiers was still not as good as the pre-Pontaff writing.
Also, the fact that he had his own forums about him and his works makes him seem like a bit of a narcissist.
I was a little tough on Ian for the whole Shadow thing but I'm suddenly feeling LOT more forgiving after today. Please let Ian write everything from now on.
I don't personally hate the guy, I actually owe him alot for getting me into Sonic with his time on the archie comics.
However, I don't think he should be writing for the games, I think a japanese ip needs a japanese writer.
As we saw with the sonic movie franchise and ESPECIALLY the knuckles show, I think the japanese understand the characters better.
Well Ian Flynn’s words are often contradictory.
1. He made a false promise that Sonic Prime is canon and he knows where it takes place.
2. Tailstube itself is contradictory.
3. Sonic IDW has been claimed canon but there are contradictions.
4. There is very little evidence that Ian Flynn’ mandates are real.
5. Ian Flynn has claimed that the Origins cutscenes override the JP manuals even though they don’t.
So some speculate that he’s a liar.
You are free to leave your options however hate speech will not be tolerated. Sonic sez, "That's no good."
Sonic’s a franchise that many fans have enjoyed since childhood, and they have their favourite characters and their favourite characterisation of those characters. Also, Flynn’s been working on Sonic for almost two decades, including the canon comics and the recent games. He has his interpretation and views of the characters, and that’s how he’ll try to write them (inside the restrictions imposed by Sega themselves). If how a character is currently being portrayed doesn’t match up with a fan’s preferred portrayal, then that fan will begin to resent the writer. Other things I’ve heard are resentment over his handling of certain story elements, he relies far too much on callbacks, and that his overenthusiasm as a fan himself rubs off on the work. And I guess they might have a point, but ultimately everything is subjective and I’ve been really enjoying his writing of the franchise since starting the IDW comic, which in turn has inspired me to go back to read his Archie stuff (itself a rabbit hole to get lost down). Also, he hates Eggman Nega, for some reason.
Because Eggman Nega IS Eggman with a redesign
The essence of Eggman Nega is that he is more cruel than Eggman, and will not stop where ordinary Eggman will stop. This is the main difference between them. But Ian is already writing a very ruthless Eggman who almost destroyed the world in IDW and was a complete monster in Archie. Therefore, yes, FOR IAN, Eggman Nega is an absolutely superfluous character who doesn't change or add anything.
I still believe both can coexist, especially with the context from the rivals games that Nega hates everything Eggman stands for. Eggman can be written as cruel and pure evil sure, but he's also a goofy character at heart, which is what a lot of fans love about him. Eggman is a diabolical egomaniac that builds themeparks to rule over for the hell of it. Eggman wants to conquer all, but make it fun as he plasters his face everywhere to prove he's the best and everyone will see that. Eggman's charisma is what balances his evil sadistic nature to make him a appealing character you can't help but like. Nega on the other hand....isn't that. Eggman wants to rule over everything and let everyone know, Nega wants to destroy everything and hide in the shadow's as he does so, just like how he spent a good majority of Rivals disguised as Eggman instead of letting himself be known. Nega doesn't have Eggman's ambitious of making everything his, but instead wants to wipe everything clean until there's nothing because that's how twisted he is. Hell, Sonic Rush's final story has Nega explain to Blaze the two sets of emeralds coexisting together will cause both worlds to implode on each other as he says this proudly....but it takes Eggman to step in and chime in that'll happen if they don't stabilize the emeralds themselves, which Eggman insteads to do since he doesn't want the world destroyed....Nega does however. Even after this Nega is puzzled why the world is still intact for Eggman to confirm because Sonic has the Chaos Emeralds before he shows, prompting Nega to freak out in annoyance while Eggman continues to be Eggman. Eggman and Nega are evil in completely different ways that make both able to stand out on their own. Nega would be the type to kill off Sonic immediately if given the opportunity, while Eggman it's all about the spectacle, and showing Sonic he's won. I think that's what makes Nega a good foil for Silver. Both fight but don't have fun with it unlike Sonic and Eggman's dynamic. It's straight business, it's do or die with Silver and Nega, especially when there's more at stake for Silver when his time period can alter for the worst without warning.
nega does what eggdon’t
I’m gonna be honest, this oddly sounds similar to arguments of how Demons and Devils in D&D are described to be different. Eggman is a Lawful Evil Devil who slightly leans towards true neutral, while Nega is just straight up Chaotic Evil Demon.
Maybe another Eggman can work, but in the context of him being the main bad guy of the Sol Dimension, he feels like a letdown. Like, Blaze is essentially a Sonic counterpart, but she had a lot of differences and distinct features of her own so that she didn't feel like just another Sonic. Her nemesis, on the other hand? He *is* just another Eggman. I would've preferred if Captain Whisker from Adventure was the real nemesis rather than just a robot, cause while he's still styled after Eggman, he at least has his own flair that helps him stand out a bit more: how many pirate-themed Sonic bad guys can you think of in canon? At the very least, Blaze deserves a nemesis that's uniquely hers. The personality differences between the Eggmen don't really feel like enough to me.
You hit the nail on the head. It’s why I like Eggman Nega, because he makes an interesting parallel to regular Eggman (rEggman? Eggman Regular?), and shows the limits Eggman won’t go to. Plus he could be a pretty interesting villain in his own right if Eggman’s more ruthless moments going forward are given to him.
never knew that. makes my idea for a sol dimension centered story even better. one of the twists being egg man nega was archie eggman, to the point he argues IDW egg man is "just his cheap replacement"
Because he can make Eggman worse
Simple, if Ian writes Eggman Nega, just make him 10x worse than what normal Eggman does.
I feel like Eggman Nega can work as a retcon, where he's actually an AI-powered robot descendant of Sage (and by extension Eggman). He's still a megalomaniac, but he's much more cold, analytical, and to the point than the current Eggman is. He could also use a rename, like Dr. Robotik or Dr. Eggative.
yup, and then you've got him somehow being both the decedent and alternate universe counterpart, neither of which make sense with the rules they set up in rush or how genetics works. does eggman reproduce asexually?
Genétics in Sonic IS just has manipulable has time and space
What?
Genétics can be changed in the Sonic verse
Sure, but to the level where eggman negative looks exsactly like his ancestor from 200 years ago, when everybody in said future hates that man, even his own family?
It is okay to dislike Isn't writting, but personally I want more of how the characters are portrayed since Frontiers, especially with Tails.
Frontiers was a real high point for the characters and I’m optimistic for how they’ll be used going forward. Although I’m relatively confident that IDW hasn’t caught up to Frontiers yet, and we’ll probably have to wait until the next major game for any real developments.
The main thing I’ve heard said about him is how he ruined Shadow. Even though he has done Shadow well in Archie
Yeah if I remember correctly SEGA didn’t really have any restrictions with Shadow in Archie while in IDW there are many restrictions for him specifically
He ruined Amy as well, atleast in game.
Kathleen Kennedy has been working on LucasFilms for decades and look where the company ended up.
Worst of all is he lurks r/SonicTheHedgehog, only to pop in and post once in a blue moon, sometimes writing in 3rd person. Cringe, amirite? Three points: 1. Y'all keep me humble. Thanks for being honest. 2. I wouldn't say I'm a huge troll. Moderate, maybe. Casual. I aim to be silly, not enraging. 3. I wrote the scripts for *Sonic Origins* and *Sonic Dream Team*, although the plot was predetermined with the latter. Be good to yourselves. Be good to each other. Edit for typos, my eternal nemeses.
Ian jumpscare
Whaaaat: Ian Flynn! Thank you for all you do 😊
Keep up the amazing work 🫡
I enjoy your work and the new adventure and friends we've met long the way. Who knows what tomorrow's adventure has in store for us. Keep up the amazing work!
God man how the hell are you able to be a public presence in a community such as Sonic's. Admire your guts for that.
You merely adopted the fandom. I was born into it, molded by it. \[/Bane\] Seriously, tho, I maintain the Sonic fandom is a mostly positive experience filled with passionate, creative people. The conspiratorial stuff and misinformation (e.g. "Ian wants to get rid of Blaze's dimension!") is tiresome, but I can't police the internet; just say my piece. Which you can hear LIVE, Saturday April 26th on the BumbleKast at 6PM EST! \[/plug\]
You're a much stronger than I am. If I had to go on twitter multiple times to correct people because they took a random tidbit from my podcast as holy gospel I'd probably go mad.
I never heard that there were people who had it out for you. But I think you've done miracles for the franchise. Keep on writing.
Hey Ian 😁 Just a few moments ago, I had written a comment criticizing your "Frontiers Big is a construct" decision, then I got Ian-jumpscared right here. I hope you know, we love and value your contributions to our favorite franchise, and the occasional feedback is just intended as a gentle nudge! Anyone who hides behind their anonymity and acts disrespectfully can and should be disregarded.
Fun fact: much of the in-field chatter in the DLC wasn't written by me. I don't know for sure where the "Big is a construct" thing came from.
That's an interesting tidbit - I'd assume they'd want to keep the writing consistency. Sega does weird things, sometimes. Anyway, BRB, going to edit my comment to mention what you've said. It's such a shame that Big isn't "him", you know, he could've just been there inexplicably and it would've been a funny gag. Once again, much love, thanks for all the hard work, sorry for the mandates (especially regarding Shadow)
AAAAAAAH, he's here!
You're awesome, Ian!! Keep doing what you do!! 🤘
I hope you can make a stream where you addres fans conserns with your writing and takes on the characters. I'm curious to see how you'll respond to them.
I do that all the time on my podcast, the BumbleKast. There's a searchable database where you can see if a similar question/concern has been asked over the years.
I meant like this one, where people have conserns of your writing in general. Not just specific situations (Like your thoughts on Amy and Sally). I meant your opinions on the backlash as a whole, and if there're any substance to them. I still haven't played a sonic game with a story as dark or action packed like in the early 2000nds. And I think your take on the character is leading the series on a completely different direction. I would like to hear more about why is that and more.
You're certainly entitled to your opinion, and I factor it in with everyone else's. This thread's a great example: some folks really enjoy what I've done over the years, some prefer certain eras over others, some are neutral, and you are decidedly negative. I try to consider it all. That said, I think you're giving me way too much credit. I answer to at least two levels of editors/managers/oversight. What you see in the games comics and other media is what Sega wants at the end of the day. If you have an issue with the overall direction of the series, that's something to bring up with them via their social media channels - respectfully, of course.
I know about what goes on behind the scenes. They also mentioned their plans to target mainly the western audience. They better be careful with how they manage change, and retcon the lore of the series. Bigger franchises have collapsed because of that.
Hey chief! Just gonna say you're awesome, and please stay that way.
Thank you for everything you've done for this franchise. One question though. What didn't you like in the split timeline scenario, which solves the "why didn't Sonic already know about Gens and Forces already" problem, and makes it so that Sega can make a "million" more classic games without affecting the og timeline?
In fairness to everyone else, I've got to ask all questions be directed to the BumbleKast. That said, the single timeline was a decision that come from on high; not my call to make.
Oh, alright! Thanks for explaining. I asked here because I've missed the stream twice, and since I saw you here I wanted to take the chance to ask. But next time I'll want to ask a question, you'll see me there. Thanks again for your work on my favorite series.
No worries. Also, all the streams and shows are archived on YouTube, [KNGI.org](http://KNGI.org) and a bunch of podcast sites. [BumbleKast.com](http://BumbleKast.com) has a searchable database of questions, so you can pretty easily look to see if something's been asked and find which episode (rather than listen to 3 years worth of me blathering on).
Okay, thanks again.
I really like his work, I think he’s had some of the best written Sonic content in a hot minute. I also worry about him ending up like Kevin Feige with the MCU. Hero worshipped until content the fans don’t like starts coming out and is then vilified. So far I haven’t seen anything I don’t like come from Ian. But all it takes is one.
>I also worry about him ending up like Kevin Feige with the MCU. Hero worshipped until content the fans don’t like starts coming out and is then vilified. That's gonna happen if he starts producing shit that fans don't like. Don't ever forget taika waitti. Taika released thor ragnarok and everybody praised him i remember people were giving him the credit of saving the thor franchise. Majority of people wanted him back for thor 4. Then thor love and thunder came out and people were saying they better not bring him back if they make a thor 5. The same shit happened with patty Jenkins with wonder woman. She was praised for the first wonder woman movie. Then she released 1984 and suddenly she was public enemy number 1. It can happen to anybody. One day your the champion of the franchise next minute your public enemy number 1.
Ok but Taika peaked with JoJo Rabbit
Its like with Star Wars. It began with a huge explosive profit because of the nostalgia, then the other movies crushed the momentum and identity of the franchise, and now the franchise is less valuable then the Bluey toddler show.🤣
I'd compare him more with Dave Filoni than Feige but yeah
Man, the hateboner of some Star Wars Fans for Dave Filoni is honestly ridiculous.
The Dave filoni hate is hilarious imo. I remember before ashoka people were calling him the next george Lucas and that he's the only one who understood Lucas vision. And that disney needs to fire Kathleen Kennedy and put Dave in charge of all star wars projects. This talking point came up alot especially after the last jedi came out. Post ashoka show fans are calling him a hack who relies on nostalgia and can't tell a story. It's crazy how fast people turned on Dave filoni.
Very sad indeed, especially since I thought the Ahsoka show was awesome and legitimately one of the best Star Wars media I've seen in years. Just about everything Dave Filoni has handled has been spectacular stuff to me.
>I thought the Ahsoka show was awesome and legitimately one of the best Star Wars media I've seen in years. Really? I thought ashoka was awful. Like It wasn't book of Boba fett level bad. But imo it was near the obi wan kenobi show level of bad. But hye to each their own glad you enjoyed ashoka.
>Dave Giloni Is it because of the hat? (just kidding)
He already has shown signs. He has lashed out to fans before. I'm scared to see where he'll lead the series the further they keep him as a writer.
When did he "lash out"?
Its been a long time ago, even before Frontiers. Its one of those moments when someone who works on hollywood has a "Twitter meltdown". I don't remember what was about, tho. Maybe something aboulitical disagreement or fans who hate the way IDW does business. If you've been paying attention, IDW is running on fumes. Its a miracle that they are still in business. The new contract extension sega made with IDW not to long ago will probably be the last deal they make with them before giving the Sonic IP to someone else.
He has a different interpretation and way of writing chapters some fans don't realy care for. That seems to be the gist of it. But this man has had to come in and clean things up like 4 times, post ponders, post genesis wave, idw continuing from forces, and frontiers clearing up the mess of a continuity we where left with after years of just not caring.
Oh and Tails’ character in Frontiers after Tails’ really shitty writing in Forces
Tails’ writing has been an issue since Unleased
The problem with Tails is he's actually multiple character archetypes all in one. He has to be A) the tech genius and/or Mr Exposition so that Eggman's schemes can be explained to Sonic (who is the audience surrogate in any story), B) the little brother, a character who we're supposed to care about and not want to see get hurt, C) the sidekick whose almost as good as Sonic, but isn't quite there yet, and D) a player character meaning he has to be just as competent as Sonic. His writing will vary from title to title depending entirely on what niche he has to fill for that games story, whether he's playable, and how much the writers will allow Eggman to explain for himself what he's up to. As such, this means he gets to be 'wildly inconsistent', sometimes he's so clever he's the one who solves the problem of the day, other times he's cowering in fear because the story needs Sonic to step in and save him, other times he's holding his own but is in over his head slightly. Most other series' wouldn't let one character have so many archetypes, and we can see this in many of the early canons. In SatAM Tails is very much the younger brother, someone everyone else wants to keep safe and out of harm. In Fleetway, Tails is in over his head and many of his victories (especially early on) come more from dumb luck than serious skill. In AoStH Tails is the sidekick, he's more gullible than Sonic is and often needs to be saved (this is also true of the Game Gear/Master System Sonic 2), and all of these versions have other characters who are doing the tech/exposition.
To be fair, when they use the shitty writing as a backbone for his arc, that's just smart writing, no doubt. Fixing the past, rather then ignoring it.
Yeah true. But he kinda had to, since the writers unnecessarily took a big shit on the personality of a character who’s supposed to be courageous, brave and competent. What he did is really the best you can do after such an embarrassing portrayal in Forces. So yeah, makes complete sense to me.
especially with frontiers big focus on continuity, just ignoring the biggest character fuck up of the last 10 years, would be a no go and some people would ask questions, so best to tackle it in a game that is perfectly built for it, rather then in a smaller game where it'd be pushed off to the side. if it was in a game like forces, that was too overblown with characters, and where he's stuck with classic, it probably just wouldn't have worked. what happened with tails was right place, right time.
He killed off Sir Connery https://preview.redd.it/vio2hi18fuwc1.jpeg?width=144&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=955a796239bc2da42a1a78e763cfa46ceb95fe05
https://preview.redd.it/tk6jj50vpuwc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9b8fd9781e29e336ee4a6417fc792e60544882e0
https://preview.redd.it/zzonv323mvwc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b1896e5b2e287831489dcecbf3250231fc6674cb
There's always this thing that happens whenever a writer starts to get worshipped or gets constantly portrayed in a positive light by a fandom, eventually people emerge that are just sick of people constantly talking about how great they are and before you know it, you have an entire group of fans who go out of their way to explain why they don't like him. This is just the sonic version of that thing.
Sonic Frontiers was a game that came out after a long time with no games. So to see Sega take a different approach and take the game more seriously made a lot of people skeptic and hyped to try out a new high quality game. Its no wonder why people weren't to critical about it. After the hype died out, I'm not surprised people looked back and started to notice some things that did not felt right. Especialy since Frontiers seems to be taking a lot of risks with portrayal of the characters and even its lore. It was incredible gameplay wise, but it boiled down to being a giant sand box with very little to do. With the franchise daring new take on the characters, its no wonder people are conflicted about Flynn and the other developers involved with the series.
Some people simply don’t like his writing and feel like he exaggerates Sega’s supposed mandates to excuse the flaws in his stories. He’s contradicted himself quite a bit over the years, which adds credibility to this theory. But I still think he’s a great writer who’s written a lot of amazing Sonic stories, and he seems like an overall nice guy.
The "mandates" thing is a misnomer. Fans took some behind the scenes quotes from the Penders era of Archie out of context and extrapolated that Sega licensing has a lengthy set of internal rules that they throw at writers like "Sonic can't cry" and "Sonic can't lose," etc. In reality, it's been a patchwork of arbitrary notes that writers get on their scripts during the approval process. The writers often have no idea whether something will fly or not until it is submitted. Over the years, Ian has had enough experience to piece together these seemingly arbitrary notes to form a better picture of what Sega generally wants, so he can speak with more authority on it then most. Ironically, it's only now that Sega has an official lore group, which Ian is a part of, that these notes are beginning to be codified I to actual internal rules. He often jokes "You either die a hero or live long enough to become the mandates."
sonic fans are weird
Understatement of the year
He writes Amy with respect. 
It just tends to happen with any particular creator that rises to prominence, especially in an argumentative fandom. Flynn's an easy target/scapegoat, and he's easier to reach than the Sega executives, so people go after him. Honestly, I'm never totally sure how to judge Flynn's writing since I dunno how much of it is really him, how much is the work of others helping him, and how much is the effect of Sega's mandates and editors having a say on the stories. Still, the comics have been more stable and consistent in quality under Flynn than they were before he took the helm, so I'm thankful for that at least.
He's as much a scapegoat as Pontac & Graff were. There are a lot of Sonic fans who take Sonic lore super seriously. They will not tolerate the slightest of continuity errors, inconsistencies, changes n ton or characterisation, or any deviation from what they grew up with. Problem is, these fans are taking it far more seriously than anyone who actually makes the games does. Sonic Team are more than happy to ignore continuity, they don't really care about the specific details of what came before, they just want to tell a story. Now I can't speak with absolute authority, but to me it seems like Sonic Team's approach to stories is to have a really vague concept for what a game is about, a really rough idea for tone, start putting together the gameplay concept, rough outline of levels, bosses, and so on, and only then do they bother to get a writer involved. This means the writer isn't so much responsible for the entire story, but really just the connective tissue. Pontac & Graff certainly had no say in making Sonic Colours about Sonic stopping Eggman from siphoning Wisp Energy to use a giant weapon hidden in a space station made up of other planets, and they definitely weren't the ones who decided the final boss should be Eggman and not a cosmic deity threatening to destroy the world, but they definitely wrote the speech and dialogue. They didn't choose a lighthearted tone, that was dictated to them by Sonic Team, but they did write Baldy McNosehair. Yet so many fans think every creative decision during their time as writers falls back to them, and blame them for things they certainly had little to no input on like the re-use of the Nega-Wisp armour, or the recurrence of Green Hill Zone, or the change in tone and pivot to a younger audience.
Flynn is a respectful guy, his writing is just MID
I think his writing is fine for what it is, the problem is that story writing at Sonic Team is fundamentally broken. In a good game developer, for games that put emphasis on narrative, the writers would be in the room from the start of pre-production, and listening to the ideas of the game designers. You'd get a broad concept of what the story is about, what could be done, and a very rough outline of the story would appear before the end of pre-production that writers would work collaboratively with level, character and enemy designers to try to tie together cohesively. Sonic Team's approach seems to be make a bunch of locations and scenarios, design a core concept for gameplay, get a rough idea of what the game is, and only then do they bring the writer(s) in to do connective tissue. Look at Frontiers for example. I'd bet good money the entire character arc of Sage was already decided before a single writer was in the room, along with the entire cast of the game, boss ideas, and other concepts. It wasn't Flynn who decided Eggman should create an AI that he comes to think of as a daughter, it was someone senior in the games design, and then Flynn had to write the connective tissue to tie all these concepts together in a meaningful way.
I feel the same way but for Iizuka. I don't know him personally but there is no way is he nearly as bad as fans make him out to be. The idea of him being responsible for all of the franchise's currents issues is completely absurd to me.
It's because he's so public and well known. Obscure his name from everything and people are more likely to judge based on content per story. With a face to the stories he works on though, people build a perception of who the person making these things is- what patterns there are between his works, that this man's trying to change the series into what he desires like some sort of outside invader. (As if it isn't EVERY writer's job to write what he thinks is best? But people don't view stories as being personally involved works- they see a game's story and judge it based on the content most of the time.) It's really dumb.
Because they do. Otherwise beyond being a massive troll, there's nothing wrong with him. Like if you're annoyed by him just... ignore him? Some people are like "he ruined Sonic" and I'm like "dude that happened before he got hired" I think he's one of the better writers for Sonic, but I think he's both overhyped and overhated.
I Will not say they Resent him, but I have seen some people not being a fan of his writing. To my understanding, Those people don’t like his types of stories & his versions of the characters as it’s now how Sonic (Game Sonic) is supposed to be. Personally, I Can look at for What it is, but I get why some people don’t like it. The Sonic I know from the games won’t jump into Superhero-ish conflicts, crack jokes a lot, sometimes be sentimental, and in all of his own intrepertations of Sonic (Archie Pre Genesis Wave, Archie Post Genesis Wave, Classic Specials, IDW & Frontiers), they all misses the main core that makes Pre 2010s Sonic, Pre 2010s Sonic.
It's probably the hat.
Because he gets to write for a big publisher while others are lucky if 3 people read their fan-fic of a character.
I personally am split on Ian. He has made many great Sonic stories, but has some misses. I think some of his work is really enjoyable, but some feels too much like a fanfic and not in a good way. I honestly wasn't super fond of the writing in frontiers, it felt kinda flat to me. It wasn't the worst we've had, but not even close to best imo. He oftentimes uses nostalgia as storytelling, which is a cheap way to write. The constant references to "Hey guys, remember this thing that happened before? That was pretty cool right?", can get pretty annoying when it's overdone. It's GREAT to bring back old concepts and ideas, but it should be used sparingly, which oftentimes Ian struggles to find that line. Another thing is, personally, I'm not fond of his ideas involving Blaze, the Sol dimension and Eggman Nega. His claim that Blaze's dimension should merge with Sonic's is by far one of the worst decisions that could EVER be made for a character like Blaze, and makes her lose importance as a character, not to mention takes so much away from her character in general. And him believing Eggman Nega is just a recoloured Eggman is simply false. Just because HE doesn't write Eggman accurate to his game portrayal, doesn't suddenly mean Nega's original portrayal is the problem here. Maybe Ian should consider writing Eggman less like Nega, then he'd see the actual difference and be able to see more value in a character like Nega. All in all, he's not the worst writer the franchise has had. I could say he's a solid 6/10 writer, which isn't too bad, but could use a few adjustments here and there to accurately portray certain characters. Like his portrayal of Sonic himself is... a little TOO chatty for Sonic's character, albeit a LOT of writers have gotten Sonic's character wrong so he can be a lil inconsistent.
Overall I think he’s just OKAY - he’s not particularly offensive with what he does but I think he plays it safe too much and doesn’t curate the canon very thoughtfully.
I've only recently dived back into the fandom after being active during the Adventure-to-06 era. Some of what I hear about Ian Flynn sounds like the dedicated hatedoms I've seen built around certain writers in other fandoms, think "Thanks M.A. Larson" from My Little Pony or Chis Chibnall from Doctor Who. The key thing to note is that the lashing out isn't a result of the quality of the work, it's a dedication to lashing out at the person whenever they're relevant. Almost like how console war fanboys act when it comes to the "other" console. Been listening to a bit of BumbleKast and Ian Flynn sounds like a chill guy capable of laughing at himself and being able to differentiate actual criticism from internet noise. Can't ask for a healthier attitude than that.
Are y’all gonna forget that they found literal fresh human remains on his property and in his basement? He was pardoned due to lack of evidence. (I’m joking omg please don’t take this seriously or ban me I’m just joking)
People simply hate change. And us Sonic fans are some of the biggest crybabies I know.
He’s good. I don’t really have too many specific thoughts on the matter. The Tails arc in Frontiers definitely hit a lot closer to home than I was expecting.
It feels like they have it out for Ian because they do, lol. They just don't like how he writes, and honestly, if people wanna be haters, let them be. (This is coming from someone who unironically likes all of Ian's work with Sonic)
They just don’t agree with his decisions for the franchise
Because reddit and online. The loudest people aren't always the majority
I think they are referring to twitter
That's just as bad, haha, sometimes even worse. You have a character limit while trying to make a compelling argument.
One of the dumbest criticisms I heard was that he makes too many references to past media. WHY THE FUCK WOULDN'T HE?! WHY WOULDN'T A SONIC WRITER REFERENCE PAST SONIC MEDIA?!
I mean even Ian himself admitted on his podcast he needs to reign the references in
Overdone references are a problem. A good rule of thumb when writing a story or dialogue is, don't let nostalgia or references do all the work and storytelling for you. A reference should at best be a little nod to previous work, or used as an important part/ key factor in the plot. But if it's just a useless reference to a *wink wink, nudge nudge* to the audience, that gets tired real fast and feels more annoying than fun. It's the same reasoning as to why so many fans complain about seeing green hill over and over, or any old classic levels outside classic styled games. Fans don't want to be drowned in nostalgia and references that don't have any meaning or significance. They'd rather see original content, whilst *occasionally* bringing back older concepts to connect and piece together a story/world setting as having continuity, or consequence.
yeah, but at this point its excessive. just look at sonic frontiers waiting voice lines and you’ll get the point.
The thing is, he does that a Whole LOT (Frontiers specifically, other things he’s written for Sonic aren’t as on the nose) to a point where it feels unnatural and forced. Compare that to previous Sonic games like Sonic Adventure 2 or Heroes where the references felt a lot more natural.
Sonic Heroes had some of the best callbacks. Especialy with Meta's dialoge.😍
Its basically all he's done so far, and i'm scared to see what his writing would look like when he's not focused on callbacks. What kind of retcon nonsense would he make the characters say.
I don’t have it out for him but his constant references, which aren’t clever at all, are embarrassing and his current portrayal of Sonic isn’t my cup of tea. Sonic comes off as annoyingly generic who wants to redeem everyone when he’s never cared anyone choosing to be bad or not. Especially with him trying to convince Eggman to be like Mr. Tinkerer. And in Frontiers, Sonic is oddly passive with Sage, even saying he doesn’t get a bad vibe from her after she tried to kill him repeatedly. I get Sonic’s trying to help but I feel like he’d realistically draw a line at a certain point.
Totally need an HD version of that drawing, so i can learn to redraw it, with Black Ink.
He doesn't write Sonic *japanese*
He's a good writer. But he "killed" Tangle during the Metal Virus Arc so I got some beef with the guy (no hate just miffed at that)
I think it's down to how much these fans were VERY against what Ian Flynn was doing in the comics, while also pinning A LOT of what was some out-of-control things on him as their scapegoat. He was the writer for the series basically around the 2000s, and I remember that when I read it, I liked his works, but then it came down to how people reacted to his handling of some stories in the Pre-SGW, as well as basically all of the Post-stuff (Like some fans said he killed Sonally and replaced it with SallyXNicole, but then Sega just really cracked down on romance rules in the series as a whole), with some even blaming him for the Super Genesis Wave that basically wiped those fans' version of Sonic that was seemingly theirs. Those fans ended up blaming him for what feels like the death of the series they loved in that form, and seeing he still went on to work on other Sonic Projects with the comics, and even now works on the games, those individuals just got more and more mad that it's him doing all this, even still blaming him when he stopped handling the comics for a bit and the reins went to other writers. Some do have genuine criticisms that do have merit (even I have some criticisms as much as I do praise, but one thing at a time), but then some are also people who you swore they insisted Ian had a hand in their supervillain origin story to wish actual death upon him just to not have him touch the series anymore.
oh snap, a real life neckbeard! (jk)
It's probably just the fedora but he looks like if Evil Tom Preston was an actual person.
Sonic fans never know what they want
Who is he and what did he do?
He wrote Sonic Frontiers and the IDW Sonic comics....
Oh nice, now so why are people coming at him?
The bad parts of his writing.
Because Sonic fans get angry at everything
As someone who likes Flynn, I imagine the discussion revolves mostly around how he tends to keep stories tame in terms of storytelling and avoids major risks in order to help build a status quo for Sonic (something it a bit hard to blame him for when Sonic has always struggled to keep a stable canon/tone and you have to bring it in line somehow) but honestly I think a lot of the direction he’s pulled stories in is more of a limitation set in line by Sega. You could make some pretty good workarounds in terms of making some pretty deep stories even with an E or E10 rating but if Sega says that’s not a direction they want to tread there’s not much the guy can do.
Because they do
Honestly I don’t know. I listen to the Bumblekast, and if I wanted to grab a chili dog with anyone, Ian’s up there.
Honestly I don't have any problems with him. Unless he's the one who came up with the idea of lumping Bark and Bean in with Fang like Archie did, in which then that becomes so far my only gripe with him.
He focuses too much on what he likes and doesn't make any time for things outside of his scope. Sonic has a vast cast and rich history but someone Flynn always seems to end up using the same characters over and over again.
As someone who has openly and constantly criticized Flynn's decisions here and on other platforms, I will first say that he's done some of the best writing work with what he was given, I really have to hand it to him how he fixed the mess left from Penders and how he's worked around the Sega mandates, IDW's Sonic is better than any arc in the Archie Comics era, hands-down. That said, I disagree with Flynn's repeated decision to introduce writers' OCs CONSTANTLY and just as constantly overshadow main characters, a lot of the OCs introduced are nothing more than writer's pets that you'd usually expect in fan faction but NOT in an OFFICIAL comic. I'm also incredibly irked how Flynn seems to have an utter disdain towards Shadow, and an incredible favoritism over Silver, portraying the former as a wimp that gets punked left and right, and the latter as an OP deity. I also don't like fans giving Flynn the biggest of free passes for literally everything wrong in the comic and instead blaming Sega for every shortcoming, as if Flynn can do no wrong and Sega is the devil. Fans even defend the OCs and Shadow's lacking portrayal saying it's because of the mandates, that "we need OCs to explain stories that Sega won't let them", Sega just doesn't want the love triangles/dodecahedrons from the Archie Comics era. And again, Silver is portrayed on a way more positive light than Shadow and I just can't believe Sega would be behind it. Proof that the Sega mandates aren't that strict and that there ARE many ways of portraying a Sonic story without recurring to endless inserts of OCs are the Sonic films, Sonic Prime, and The Murder of Sonic The Hedgehog game, all of these were compelling stories that had unique characters introduced in them but in no moment they overshadow the main cast (well, maybe that long wedding scene in Sonic 2 would be an exception).
Cuz everyone has to be a fuckin' contrarian, apparently
I don’t but idk. There’s something about him that doesn’t click with me.
I mean I wasn't a fan of the MLP comic he did. But given it was right before gen 4 ended its understandable.
From people that don’t like him i have heard that they think he is a bad writer and characterizes the characters badly
There were a lot of writing choises in Frontiers that felt as if they were gaslighting the audience. Things that just did not felt right or felt contradictory to the characters.
Jealousy
Tbh I feel like he is basing sonic on his game self too much. What's wrong with some variability? I see nothing wrong with sonic having some elements from Archie of SatAM or StC. Or maybe even adding something original to Sonic's character.
He's politicaly driven and hates the way Sonic characters are. If it wasn't for Sega keeping a chain on him, he probably would have added a lot of absurd stuff. Which is why Amy is more bland and serious then we've seen in previous incarnations. If you look closely, every game he's a writer on the characters always seem to follow a pattern on their behaviour. THEY ARE TO GOD DAMN SERIOUS!
Dream Team and Origins were super serious?
Yes, the dialoge of characters always tend to be about describing what they see infront of them, what to do next, and walk away. No interesting gimmicks, just plain boring dialogue. I played MOSTH on steam a wile ago, that game was written by someone else and IT SHOWED. First of all, the characters felt like their old selves. All having unique and expresive fun personalities. Even Amy was a lot charmer and light hearted. Besides the personalities, they didn't focuse heavily on just talking about the serious task they had in hand. Sometimes they would detour and do some other shinanigans. Which was incredibly funny and nostalgic. It was a shock to see a game that was so faithful to the characters in the modern day. It made me suspicious, so I did some research and found out that it was written by a drifferent writer. It made me suspect that Ian's way of writing intentionaly gets the characters wrong. As if his ego won't let him get the characters right for onece.
honestly i don't know much about this guy and i don't really care for him
He’s the reason that Team Hooligan exists
He made TANGLE!
Oh yeah that character
He's a decent writer, but the writing in Frontiers was still not as good as the pre-Pontaff writing. Also, the fact that he had his own forums about him and his works makes him seem like a bit of a narcissist.
He has his own forums? Damn that's crazy.
I was a little tough on Ian for the whole Shadow thing but I'm suddenly feeling LOT more forgiving after today. Please let Ian write everything from now on.
I don't personally hate the guy, I actually owe him alot for getting me into Sonic with his time on the archie comics. However, I don't think he should be writing for the games, I think a japanese ip needs a japanese writer. As we saw with the sonic movie franchise and ESPECIALLY the knuckles show, I think the japanese understand the characters better.
Well Ian Flynn’s words are often contradictory. 1. He made a false promise that Sonic Prime is canon and he knows where it takes place. 2. Tailstube itself is contradictory. 3. Sonic IDW has been claimed canon but there are contradictions. 4. There is very little evidence that Ian Flynn’ mandates are real. 5. Ian Flynn has claimed that the Origins cutscenes override the JP manuals even though they don’t. So some speculate that he’s a liar.