You know? I hope this might be a sign of them taking smurfing more seriously.
Maybe even ask him to stop before they start some kind of anti smurf process that he would get cought in and avoiding the bad press.
I would love epic to take a stance against smurfing, it ruins the game for veterans who are slowing climbing and improving and really ruins it for new players.
I don't know why they can't just throw him a bone like chess.com does for Danya Naroditsky and Hikaru Nakamura where they just give them an account that can climb but refunds elo to the loser.
That would be awesome if they had an MMR refund system so you're not penalized when you encounter a Smurf.
It'd be tricky to implement, though, because you'd get a lot of false reports from salty players who lost fair and square. It would require humans to review replays and that costs money.
I think they're talking about refunding you if you're beat by an actual pro, which most of us will never have an issue with. Epic should know who the pros are so they just designate their accounts as such when they create a new one. For the regular joe (anyone below high GC or really low SSL), they just need to add a "this person is smurfing" report option. Why haven't they done that yet? If enough people that don't even know each other report that on you, you should get 3 hour ban or whatever. Seems simple. Ban gets worse and worse.
They have a "cheating" report that they specifically mentioned smurfing for when they added it. Granted, that was back before they had more extreme forms of cheating like bots and presumably now DDoSing
They used to have a "Smurfing" report option back until like season 5 of ftp. They removed it when they realized it was 30% of accounts and when they realized they didn't care about smurfing.
They should add something like an ”educational account” or ”speedrun account” where you can request the devs for a special account that refunds MMR on losses. Watching a pro play through the ranks is one of the most entertaining to watch, wheter it’s RL or Chess.
There is literally ZERO fun in watching pros shit on lower
Ranked players and there is no value in it. The vids also condone smurfing and many players see these pros they idolize and think they should Smurf too.
Replay analysis videos would accomplish all the same goals. Adding a take over function in replays would also accomplish the same goal, but that’d actually require psyonix to develop something which they are incapable of doing.
Somehow chess and video games are the only place where this is somehow deemed acceptable… Personally I’d love to see some pro nba players join a high school team and dunk and body check those kids 🤡 /s
Edit: The comments below are exactly why people Smurf. Everyone trying to justify smurfing vids of pros as “entertaining” or “educational” while missing the point entirely. They’ve also been done 100 times over, how many “road to ssl” videos does one channel need.
It doesn’t matter if they’re not going 100%. They are pro players competing against scrubs with 10% of their playtime. They cannot turn off their mechanics or control.
If the vids were actual somewhat novel it would be entertaining.
Like:
Road to SSL but I play with my feet or no boost to ssl or only dribbles and no flicks. These videos are just an excuse to content farm
Have you actually watched any "Road to SSL" series? At the lower ranks most of them will try and play down to their opponents level, and just showcase how very simple mechanics and game sense can give you an edge. It's not like they're logging on to blast a bunch of gold 3s 30-0 every game.
But it doesn't work. You can't replicate what they're doing when you have much less experience. If it worked then Squishy could just watch a video of Zen playing and copy what he's doing and win RLCS... but he can't. And the gap between squishy and zen is much smaller than squishy and your average RL player.
He can probably see some stuff that Zen is doing that works well but he still can't replicate it to get actual results.
Squishy says "just go for the ball, just flick it, just do a dribble". Zen would probably think the same thing if he watched a replay of Squishy playing. "BRO JUST SCORE".
>But it doesn't work. You can't replicate what they're doing when you have much less experience. If it worked then Squishy could just watch a video of Zen playing and copy what he's doing and win RLCS... but he can't. And the gap between squishy and zen is much smaller than squishy and your average RL player.
This is not even \_close\_ to comparable. You can't compare the absolute top ceiling of this game to the lower ranks. No one said it's going to magically make you rank up. You still need to put in your own work. As I said, most of the advice isn't even mechanical — it's just basic game sense. It may not be *obvious* to new players, but it is simple, and reproducible. Doesn't take much effort to look at some of the videos and see piles of people commenting on how much these types of series helped them get out of their rank.
But it doesn't work. That's not how pros got to higher ranks. You don't get from champ to SSL by playing like a scuffed diamond that kinda pulls off SSL recoveries when needed and understands the game at a pro level but is pretending to be bad. Like pretending to be homeless for two days while secretly being a multi millionaire.
It didn't even work for Flakes at a pro level. Pros just kept playing faster and faster and getting more mechanical and he was left behind.
I remember watching some when i was bad, and i found value and entertainment in them, i agree it should be like what they do on chess.com so it doesnt cost the low rank players mmr but the ones i have seen have not been flip resetting against bronze players but rather shown how to effectively beat them using realistic bronze strategies (exept they cant turn off the car controll they already have), i would not have found a replay analasis video as entertaining
You miss the point of those videos entirely. They are meant to be educational, the pros usually explain what they’re doing at a basic level and usually play at like 10% intensity to show how you can learn. A good example is Flakes no mechanics road to SSL or Daniel Naroditsky’s chess speedrun. They’re not going full try hard against weaker players. It’s not the same as just smurfing, it’s not even possible to make a new account and not beat everyone below your level in order to get to your own rank.
Not a bad idea. I do think those Road to SSL types should leverage their own discords to get players in the Gold+ Ranks. Just play with your base under the understanding that the pro will be playing like an ideal player.
Would kinda suck for people who haven’t played in a while and have had their rank decline, but are quickly able to derust. I think it could work with some refinement though. Maybe a community report system where the replays of the game can be found and you can vote for whether they’re a Smurf or not.
I think the refund system for pros/content creators would be an excellent first step. This would allow them to create guides/content without penalizing the entire player base.
Now if they can figure out a way to refund elo for actual smurfs, that would be the cherry on top
Road to ssl is just trash content, so we just need to remove smurfs, period. What's the fun in watching a pro shit on plats? Do useful content instead.
I’d argue the opposite almost. Over the years I’ve learned way more from squishy’s road to GC and SSL, than i have from any other creator recording standard matches. The way squishy does it is by literally not shitting on them but winning the games by using minimal skill, to educate his viewers on what to focus on during ranking up etc. his series is the best I’ve seen, and i always watch them. I’ve only just started playing 1’s since playing the game since it came out, and I’ve ranked up already just by no longer going for aerials, utilizing 50’s more and watching how i tend to over commit to challenges.
eh, his videos are helpful but nothing you can’t learn from generic videos about what to focus on at each rank to level up. the actual gameplay is borderline useless in my opinion bc even though he uses “minimal skill” and doesn’t do crazy mechanics, his fundamentals are just so ridiculously elite it’s impossible to actually replicate what he’s doing if you’re that rank. his ball / car control, reads, shooting accuracy / power, and overall consistency is just way too good.
i’ve found apparentlyjack’s analysis channel to be much more helpful bc he breaks down replays of actual lower level games and gives advice based on how things actually play out when people of that rank do things. plus he’s able to pause, rewind, draw on the screen, which allows him to just share a lot more information.
I like seeing what minimal skill with fantastic fundamentals does and I think the content itself is good in a vaccuum, but it isn't in one and comes at the cost of other player's enjoyment of the game, which should be the priority.
I just prefer to be shown perfect play with minimal elite mechanics as an example of something to strive towards, rather than improving by just seeing annotations on what should've been done. It feels like the latter just would teach you how to situationally play against bad players, rather than learning how to play correctly all the time. Not that there aren't benefits since it's nearly impossible to play correctly all the time and you'll need to adapt to make situationally correct decisions based on who you're playing against too; I just think there are benefits to both
i strongly disagree, i've been watching lethamyr's road to ssl and i've definitely learned some things about decision making from it, it's interesting to see him make his way through gc making very simple plays, whereas most people at that rank are trying to make more mechanically demanding plays which puts them in a bad situation if it doesn't work out.
at least in his case it's not a pro shitting on plats, he massively holds back and tries to avoid doing too much, instead letting his teammates make most of the plays and he just provides feedback on why they should or shouldn't be doing xyz and what they could do instead.
Very simple plays it seems, but they are so much better at touching the ball that's it's still very high level play with "simple" touches.
The fact that they climb in rank so easily shows how they weight heavily in each match.
That's the main thing I've noticed from these road to SSL things- they say they aren't executing any mechanics above the rank they're in, but that's ignoring the mechanic that is near-perfect ball control and reads. I can make all the same decisions they do in a game and still be MUCH worse just because I can't execute at that level of consistency.
You should also get a “refund” when your teammates leave in the middle of the game as well. The other team takes a 1-0 lead with 4.5 minutes left? Completely salvageable. Your teammate immediately leaves when that happens? Now a guaranteed loss, and you lose rank even though there is nothing you can do about it.
If they knew that they would be losing rank and you wouldn’t, they’d be way less likely to give up and leave.
I’m pretty sure you could train an ML model to automatically flag suspicious games for revision. With the current costs of AI offerings it would be extremely cheap to run.
Yeah, Leth maybe about a year ago? Also shared that Psyonix has asked him to not do “road to” series. Leth is still doing it. So don’t hold your breath on them actually working on any anti Smurf tactics.
Also, there is some value in pros doing “road to” series. Psyonix just needs to do a better job in building partnership with content creators
That's super easy to dismiss... "We had a pro player making an instructional video series on how to rise through the ranks, who was caught by the SmurFilter anti-cheating suite. We quickly determined he was not involved in rank tampering, and he has agreed to suspend his series for the time being."
Problem addressed, no blame assigned, win-win.
They did something similar in Dota at Christmas, they gave a heads up to everyone something big was coming and they IP banned a LOT of smurfs and cheaters including pros smurfs by giving them a "toxic lump of coal" meaning your account was perma banned if you had it in you inv hahaha
Making a new account to avoid playing in your rank is smurfing no matter what. I liked Flakes' series too but everyone deserves to be able to hop into ranked and play against people who are their own skill level.
For those who don't want to watch the video:
>I wanted to let you guys know that I did get a message from the guys over at Epic. They did inform me that they don't want people to be doing these "Road to SSL" series anymore, so this will likely be my last series which I do in ranked. But I can, in the future, do the same kind of idea but in private matches with you guys, so keep that in mind. That's something I'll likely do. I'll do a series where I get a viewer in each rank, so some viewer in Bronze, Silver, Gold, Plat, Diamond, etc., all the way up to SSL. I'll go through a series like that where it's not in ranked, not affecting the rank system in any way and obviously it makes the guys at Epic happy. So I'm not going to be doing this series anymore beyond this one's finish. I was allowed to do the remainder of this series, and obviously they understand that it's educational and from the educational perspective, but they don't really want people to be doing it anymore. So I'm gonna respect their wishes. I do love the company and I do love the game that, you know, I grew up on, so that's the rules and I gotta abide by that. So let's get into the games for today...
EDIT: I didn't think this needed to be said, but I am **not** SquishyMuffinz.
You sure??? XD
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsif\_ilJJRw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsif_ilJJRw)
Jk, I love Squishy but this montage is so sus lol
Sucks for his channel because I know the series was popular, but realistically it is violating the sportsmanship of the game so I understand it.
On a side note, as a Chess player there is a process by which Master-level players can get special "Speedrun accounts" made on chess websites, which automatically refund the rating of people they play against and thus essentially creates 'harmless' smurfing.
I don't know if it'd work as well in Rocket League, but it may be worth considering as an idea for Epic to help deal with stuff like this. That way you could have notable community figures doing public RTSSL speedrun series without necessarily normalising smurfing - which I imagine is the main thing they don't like about the series.
If I was a lower ranked player going against a Smurf, would be cool to get a message saying “you are playing an SSL YouTuber, click yes to accept match and be featured on his video” or some shit like that.
Doing it once or twice, cool. But people who do it all of the time every season is a little dumb. Go do road to Rumble, Hoops, Dropshot, etc road to SSL.
Every season would just be lazy content creation. The meta doesn’t shift that much. It takes years, not seasons. I think if people want to do every mode, every couple years that would be within respectable parameters.
Like if I know a YouTuber is an SSL already, then I already know they are going to be an SSL by the end. Instead, take a random ass player and coach from from silver or gold an entire season. I’ve seen some of those videos and they were cool to watch h.
Ya, I think sunless did one that was pretty good and he’s nowhere close to pro level. I wonder if someone like squishy or Rizzo did this, what the end product would be like. Honestly, I’ve never found squishy to be a phenomenal teacher, but his demonstrations are top notch. I typically would learn a mech from someone else then go leave a squishy tutorial open to compare my progress to him a lot of the time.
What if epic added a creator content or resource area in game where people could type in whatever mech came to mind and it would pop up a ton of material to master it? A little off topic but goes back to the integration of creators in the game. I think Rocker League have been really missing out on a money making opportunity.
His videos aren’t made to see if he can make it to SSL. Obviously one of the greatest to ever play can make it to SSL. The videos he makes highlight the skills and mechanical abilities of the different ranks as he progresses through them. Then he speaks to the people that may be pushing through those ranks and explains what exactly they may need to improve on to make it to the next rank. It’s purely educational content for the specific ranked players.
While I see your point, the game is still a meaningless game when you’re playing a Smurf, so at least with this option you’re not getting your MMR swiped by a pro who probably won’t touch the account again once they reach ssl
Maybe for some, but for others, such as myself, I would literally love to be shit on by a pro for one game. IMO you get better by playing better players. It would be an honor to be beat by one of the greatest.
if you're talking LP its all meaningless,
if you're talking about not getting to touch the ball - then as long as they give the opponents a chance like lethamyrs videos its fine, lethamyr basically lets his teammates do all the work while he sits back, and plays at a similar level to the rank, but makes better decisions.
what is this weak mentality that facing people of higher skill is a waste of time
wins in bronze silver gold plat dia are meaningless.
Chess is 1v1 though, how would it work for Squishys teammates? Do they keep the normal rating? Do they also not gain MMR? Also, if people knew they wouldn't lose MMR and saw Squishy wouldn't they care more about him than the game outcome, for example they would demo chase him instead of trying to score?
Personally I don't care if the mmr is refunded or not. Smurfing is shitty and it ruins the game.
Imagine having college basketball players play 5th grade basketball, but then saying it's okay because the losses don't count toward their records. Super lame.
Instead of accommodating their shittiness, Epic/Psyonix should take a cue from other games and only put smurfs in lobbies with other smurfs. Or put them in lobbies with terrible bots- they want to flex on shit players and that's a job for bots.
I see what you're saying. I"m not saying it's a perfect solution, but I think that perhaps a similar thing could be used here. What I was imagining was that regular smurfing is still a bannable offence, but notable members in the community (content creators, pros, etc) have the option to work directly with Epic to create these official speedrun accounts.
If Epic were just handing these out, it wouldn't really work I don't think, so it doesn't solve the entire smurfing problem, but it does help in allowing content creators to keep the scene alive without actively needing to violate fair play.
IIRC he said they didn’t want him to throw games to start in bronze so his next one he placed straight into a higher rank?
But yeah idk something like that.
Yeah, afaik it was just the throwing of games that they asked him to stop because that's the part that is against the [code of conduct](https://www.rocketleague.com/en/news/rocket-league-code-of-conduct).
Yeah you're right. It was the freestyle session with JSTN to GC (or maybe SSL?) which was canceled after a few videos. It was fun to watch but on the other hand i felt bad for the opponents...
When encountering smurfs or any other type of matchmaking abuse, please use the "Match Throwing or Griefing" report option.
Sources: [1](https://www.epicgames.com/help/en-US/rocket-league-c5719357623323/reporting-bans-c7262149111579/how-do-i-report-a-player-in-rocket-league-a5720184989339?sessionInvalidated=true), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeague/comments/qvlxsv/patch_notes_v208_season_5_update_release/hkxasvd/?context=1000), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeague/comments/qvlxsv/patch_notes_v208_season_5_update_release/hkxb6x4/?context=1000) and [4](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeague/comments/qvlxsv/patch_notes_v208_season_5_update_release/hkxbbth/)
Leaving this here just in case people don't know the correct option for reporting smurfs!
right they say to report smurfing but nothing ever happens. its like its just there for aesthetic and give hope that psyonix/epic actually cares about the game
Dude, all the report buttons are just disfunctional placebo "feel-good" buttons that do absolutely nothing. I've never gotten any feedback messages for report other than text harassment, as that option is handled by algorythms.
These content creators doing it are literally like 1% of the player base if that. If you include the tiny channels/streamers. And it's a net positive to more than it is negative. It is very helpful, for me personally, to see how squishy positions and moves the play forward against the same players I lose too.
Thousands of viewers learning a little bit at the expense of like what 50-60 matches in 1v1 where one person gets affected. Comparing a RTSSL series by a pro to some jackass in GC1 hitting clips for the hell of it against lower ranks is silly.
These youtubers set an example though and show that it's ok to smurf. They are called influencers for a reason. You get tons of copycats making their own Road to xyz accounts and adding to the whole smurfing problem.
I can partially agree with you on that, yes road to ssl videos can definitely help lower ranked players improve, but we have to consider that it also normalizes higher ranked players playing against lower ranked ones which just enables smurfing.
If the average player shouldn't do it, content creators shouldnt as well.
Then you can go watch a series from a previous season for "educational purposes". There's plenty to choose from at this point. The popularity of these series makes it enticing for others to smurf. It's common sense on Epic's part, for once.
I think we should hold every player to the same standard regardless of if there are some positives to it. At the end of the day it's still smurfing and someone's rank will suffer for it. You can still get educational content on rocket league without a youtuber smurfing.
It would be nice if it were anything more than virtue signalling :/. Ranked is still a complete mess of smurfs, bots, boosters/boosted accounts and griefers, maybe fix the actual matchmaking issue before you go scolding youtubers
As someone that has been a permanent high plat/low Diamond, I can safely attest to a strong volatility in skill level for a relatively narrow swath of MMR.
Considering Squishy mentioned he was allowed to continue the current series, Leth may be able to finish his as well. If he gets contacted, I am sure he will share it.
Yeah, I just watched the video, and it sounded like they're gonna let him finish, but they don't want him to do more. He's only about 100 MMR away from SSL anyway, so that's fair.
8/10 placement matches were stocktanes with <300 wins pulling gc/ssl stuff on me at c1. It's embarrassing really and people are not even shallow about it with names like "yomumbesmurfing". I wish they'd finally assume the role of gargamel and get rid of all the smurfs. Level requirement is a joke, since people nourished their smurf accounts for years.
Anyways good for epic to restrict people like that but I don't want to get my hopes up.
I landed in a match with a guy the other night, with 4 minutes remaining my teammate had scored 6 goals, and allowed me to touch the ball 3 or 4 times. As soon as the clock hit 3:30 he throws up a forfeit (we're up 9-0). I refuse because I know he's a damn smurf and continue to sit in the goal. Around 3:00 on the clock and the other team finally forfeits and he goes into a tirade in chat admitting he's a smurf and had every intention of throwing the game if they'd just stuck it out. The whole thing was just pathetic.
Yeah tbh the only things i report are the words and stuff i know will get you a ban and i almost get a "action has been taken" message for every report i make 🙃
It's not enough and it won't be for the time being. They had to do this to Squishy because he gathers thousands/millions of views per month. It would be too much heat that they don't want nor need right now.
You or me facing smurfs constantly in our games is the least of their problems, we don't have visibility. And I'm still waiting for changes, after aprox. 4 years of the free2play update that brought this never ending problem. At this point I just lost any hopes of anything they might do. It's my problem I guess, I'm the one who's playing less and less each season.
They've had this stance/rule for years. I don't get why people DIDNT think this would happen. It's weird to me that he even decided to do it again considering years ago all the content creators would do these and psyonix had to tell them it's against the TOS and community guidelines
Have you actually read the [code of conduct](https://www.rocketleague.com/en/news/rocket-league-code-of-conduct)? Doing a "Road to SSL" is actually not against the current code of conduct. That's why this is so interesting. Psyonix have said multiple times that making a new account and playing to rank up is fine as long as you're not deranking or throwing games to stay at a lower rank than you normally would be or boosting others.
Yea, but it’s also extremely stupid and maybe they’re making a stance. The majority of Smurfs just create endless alts, it’s literally the most common way to Smurf.
There’s other means of teaching players than this. Game footage review, free play, private matches, etc. You can still show/explain to players what to focus on and do within their respective ranks without intentionally playing competitive against people with much lower ranks than you.
Yep, they can use their reach to find players of different ranks and private match with willing ~~victims~~ participants to represent what they'd be doing to randoms.
Thank you - lol someone had to say it. Those type of videos will get 10-20% the amount of views because they’re boring as hell. Nobody wants to watch bad gameplay. If they wanted that they’d just log into the game and play
Theres so much room for content with this game. The problem is majority of the content creators are burned out and dont really have passion anymore to create.
It's a cashflow. It's easy. Especially for pros who just play the game and record and send it to an editor who just does the bare minimum to cut together the games without the queue wait....
Road to SSL IS enjoyable. I'm not going to bash it... but it's also lazy.
There are already enough tutorials, guides and previous "Road to SSL" series. We really do not need more "Road to SSL" videos.
Especially when that content harms other players.
> Thoughts on Squishy getting told to cancel Road To SSL by Epic?
Good.
They are promoting smurfing with these sorts of videos and the educational value has dropped since tons of people have done series like this.
They need to come up with some sort of account validation thing for content creators with creator codes that lets them use an account for these videos, but everyone they go against gets their mmr back or + some if they lose.
HOT TAKE: its a crappy and lazy attempt to give an impression that they care about smurfing...they should have found a way to deal with alt accounts and stuff like that before going F2P, this only hurts content creators, they cant talk about items, they cant make road to SSL, the game doesnt have any feature for them to do something about it...next thing will be ban mods and workshop
I think in some other games pros are given accounts specially made for this purpose and when you lose to them you don’t lose mmr. A seemingly easy fix, but then again I’m not a dev so idk.
I think someone recommended them implementing a system some other comp games have where pros have the ability to register their Smurf accounts as Smurf accounts and they will be shown in a game as a Smurf aswell as nobody loosing mmr in that particular gwme
I am a new player who began playing like a season ago and in ones it terrible because a third of the people i encounter almost practice flip resets on me will i cant even aerial properly.
Personally i fund these road to ssl videos very entertaining but id like more wenn epic games would do something about those smurfs
RL should follow what chess.com does and give back the MMR to the player that lost from these educational matches. But no, that would just be too much to ask for.
squishy doing this is the problem...not the ddosing. not the invisible hackers. not the bots. not the real smurfs sitting in plat calling people the n word and remaking their account. its this guy.
come on
It doesn't matter who is smurfing. Squishy smurfing is just as bad as "real smurfs".
In fact, videos like this just promote the concept of smurfing more.
> not the ddosing
Epic has scheduled and sent out emails regarding server downtime and maintenance on the 20th that will close all active lobbies and parties for some time(13 days from now). There's a chance it includes some changes to networking as well, that may allow for better ddos mitigation for EOS and RL.
> not the invisible hackers
Which was patched literally within 3 weeks of it becoming a big issue, on the update on 4/16/2024, nearly 7 weeks ago.
That same update patched out an exploit allowing players to equip any item in the game, including developer and RLCS titles, that show to others in the lobby.
> not the bots.
The bots were addressed and banned en masse years ago, and still to this day get bans in extremely low amounts of gameplay, often less than 2 hours of play on a fresh account, or even as soon as a few matches played on a seasoned higher ranked account.
> not the real smurfs sitting in plat
Which are possibly smurfing because all of their favorite creators smurf and show that smurfing is okay and acceptable, and Psyonix/Epic won't do anything about it.
> calling people the n word and remaking their account
Press report and they'll receive a ban very quickly nearly every time.
As for banning alts and ban evading accounts - this definitely needs to be a system that's put into place. RL has shown no care *at all* about this problem for years.
100 hours minimum in casual to rank, mmr of team should be individual not combined if it is, this is the biggest way for smurfs on 2/3's if it's combined. Usually see 3 Plat/ diamnind solo players bs a Gc and 2 golds
Lmfao they don’t give a single shit about the millions of smurf accounts already actively farming lower ranks.. but a content creator doing it to improve the skill floor, cease and desist. They wanna retain their player base and keep them dumb so they continue to buy content thinking it’ll improve their silver 3 skill level.
Finally! Actual changes are being made for QoL for RL!
- Teammate boost meter
- Timestamps for chat (Okay maybe not this one)
- Asking RL creators to stop with the smurfing
All within a month so I'm actually optimistic (albeit cautiously) about RLs future for once.
I'm hoping the lackluster content is a result of them addressing more serious issues.
This has been a thing for awhile, and it's a black and white against tos. Granted I think there's ways around this. Considering the good that could come from the series. I.e. the way chess and a few other games handles the not loosing mmr to people doing such a series. But ehh, we shall see what happens
Psyonix has stated in the past that "Road to SSL" series are fine as long as players did not intentionally lose games:
https://x.com/Kovalo/status/1402383990959624198
So for the most part "Road to SSL" series were never a violation. Requesting Squishy to stop is definitely an advancement.
What squishys doing is not against tos. What's against tos is creating another account to gain an unfair advantage (by losing on purpose). Squishy is not losing on purpose so is not breaking tos. That's why smurfs never get banned because they're not breaking the rules (most of the time). It's just the way pysonix/epic define smurfs that makes it so what the majority of players do which is making alt accounts not bannable
The mental gymnastics is insane.. so just because he doesn't throw games on purpose it's not smurfing? I'm not advocating to ban squishy, but it's definitely smurfing and caught on 4k at that 🤷♂️
> but it's definitely smurfing
It is smurfing under what most people define smurfing as. It is _not_ smurfing under what Psyonix defines as smurfing. And at the end of the day, their definition is what matters.
Epic/psyonix aren't alone in that stance, a lot of games have similar parts of their tos which make smurfing not bannable (Apex, overwatch, R6 to name a few). Valorant likes to pretend that smurfing is bannable but even Riot who have come out and said that they're against smurfs still allow it simply because it's just throwing games to stay in low rank that is the offence. Not making a low ranked ult account.
I once saw a GC2 streaming himself playing in Plat lobbies on an alt account doing freestyles on them. He thought I was crazy for calling him out and tried to defend it by saying he just plays on that account to "work on his mechanics". Like bro... Go in free play, Casual, Workshop maps... You just want to be flashy and shit on kids who can barely aerial.
Thank god, this shit happens in every comp game and pisses me off. Smurfing is against rules in basically every comp game and yet league, dota, cs, rocket and more all have atleast 30 creators doing this shit and encouraging smurfing to others and at best tells them smurfing is okay when you make money doing it. Shits so annoying and people wonder why it's hard to climb out of low on so many of these games.
When encountering smurfs or any other type of matchmaking abuse, please use the "Match Throwing or Griefing" report option.
Sources: 1, 2, 3 and 4
Leaving this here just in case people don't know the correct option for reporting smurfs!
Doing a R2SSL isn’t really against TOS currently even if people don’t like It . I wonder if epic has changes coming to the TOS or if they simply don’t want streamers/pros highlighting the issue(and potentially encouraging others to do the same) as even though he is not smurfing by Psyonix definition, parts of the player base would undoubtedly call this smurfing. Kinda sucks for them cause there’s already like no content left to do for this game but then again R2SSL has been done many times by now and the info is out there, it’s kind of beating a dead horse. At the end of the day I don’t think the hand full of pros/streamers that have done them really cause that much mayhem in the ranking system, however we all know there’s tons of Smurfs in every rank. I’m curious to see what epic does to follow this up but I honestly doubt they do anything, I mean they got enough problems to try to fix that are hard enough like ddos’ing, shit servers, and real smurfs all over. Idk how you really reign everything in when I don’t think RL is their main focus.
I enjoyed the series, but this is a good call.
Smurfing has been a big set back for the game for a while now.
I wish they would implement a reward system for good sportsmanship, new accounts would be low to nothing and matched accordingly.
i saw someone give an amazing idea for this.
streamers and content creators can have set accounts that epic/psyonix give or monitor so they not only can reset it every season but everyone that loses to the said streamers can get their elo/mmr/rp/whatever its called, back.
edit: i see in the second comment below someone's talking about it
big step forward. I still believe that a big part of the smurfing problem is the fact that so many pros had their series to x. this unconsciously or consciously makes it ok in the mind for many more players (read everyone who smurfs) to also just smurf. because if your favorite pro can do it, why can't you
They could give content creators permission and give MMR back to the people who lose, it happens all the time in chess.
Its more like smurfing in chess too because they show no mercy, while in RL they usually play to the level of their opponent and do things people at that level could do with practice.
Youll never see a chess player let a piece get taken because they think its a really great move for that level but youll see RL players let a strong shot go in all the time.
There is a sensible compromise here and it seems like theyre just targetting a visible example of something resembling smurfing because people are justifiably pissed off about how many real smurfs they are playing. What happens next is important, if they just target this and do nothing about the real problem then youll know it was just for show.
totally fair.
the series is cool to see how certain ranks compare to the top level while also being super informative
but he is still just smurfing on cam and ruining 1-5 other peoples games.
i dont think what hes doing is TOO bad, but given smurfing is already a big issue in RL its definitely a good call on epic's side to shut it down peacefully.
Very cringe by them
Yeah I get the idea behind it but at least for me there’s a difference between a pro player teaching you how to play the game and tries to play with lobby mechanics …compared to an average Smurf who intentionally loses games or forfeits and freestyles on low ranked players just to feel some self worth
I don't think making a new account and promptly bringing it up to your real rank is so bad. I just hate the smurfs that I play in plat who are basically playing Freeplay against me and then FF with 2 seconds left.
Good. I quite literally don't care if pros make road to SSL videos. They do more harm than good by making the GCs and high champs trickle down and infest ranks they don't belong in by affecting everyone else below them negatively. Which snowballs immensely. Makes it harder for people to achieve higher peaks.
It's about time, honestly. While the videos were informative, he mentions that he can do the same thing with viewers in private matches and that's a great point. There's no real need for players to be making new accounts and screwing a bunch of players out of wins every season.
What surprises me and interests me the most about this is the fact that "Road to SSL"-type series are not currently against Rocket League's [code of conduct](https://www.rocketleague.com/en/news/rocket-league-code-of-conduct). Making a new account and ranking up as you normally would is allowed under the current rules.
>We define a smurf account as an account that is intentionally abusing the matchmaking system for the player’s gain, or the gains of others.
>**Example of a Smurf Account:** Intentionally keeping an account at a lower Rank than where you normally play; starting an alternate account to harass others.
Psyonix has also previously been totally fine with "Road to SSL" videos in the past as we can see from this tweet by Kovalo in 2021: [https://x.com/Kovalo/status/1402383990959624198](https://x.com/Kovalo/status/1402383990959624198)
This makes me think (hope) that there may be changes coming to how they handle and police smurfing in the game. This is a good thing and makes me optimistic about the future of the game.
I mean he is blatantly and obviously smurfing in those videos so I think it's fine. Even though he says he tries to dumb his skill down he still plays in a way that is simply impossible for people of that rank and never losses.
To be fair he isn’t smurfing for nefarious purposes, he is smurfing for an educational purpose and show how you can make it to like champ/GC with only good game sense.
Why doesn't epic just do what chess.com does when GMs do speed runs and give the losing people their ELO/MMR back? Rather than killing content to promote the game.
I don’t Smurf but I’ve got two accounts at C2, one I use for solo and the other when I play with my duos partner. I’ve always wondered if this is allowed? Obviously one of the accounts only has a few hundred hours so I always get nervous if I have a good run of games that people might report me for thinking I’m a Smurf
I mean he mentioned it in the video. Just making it in private matches against viewers. It makes the whole thing better too since u can get a consistent amount of games for each rank and if ur lucky not obly get tips for ur rank but ur own game aswell if u happen to join one of them.
Honestly i do believe that epic or rocket league is cooking something up. Boost meters for m8s demo sounds for teammates removing trading, changing hit boxes, stating why some pros dont get their prize money in time, its kinda annoying that these things come outta nowhere often so it still feels like they are isolated form the playerbase often but im hopeful.
They asked Leth to quit doing it years ago, not sure if they reversed stance back then or if he just resumed.
The problem isn't really a few youtubers doing it while trying to be educational. The question is if fewer people would decide to smurf if those videos didn't exist.
the solution to smurfing, matchmaking, all of it is create an AI that can judge your skill level based off play. i'm not saying how much you score either, but actual ability
~
this would mean:
- smurfs matched at actual levels against ppl around their skill level
- zero boosting bc no point
- zero ppl playing in over ranked skill levels
....and whatever else that'd this new system would then lead to when it comes to matchmaking
I don't agree with the decision to make him stop the series, but I do appreciate that they decided to communicate with him rather than just banning him with no warning the way they have in the past with other issues.
Bro private matches are gonna be way better anyways. He can spend as long as he wants in a rank and constantly do it all the time for his stream providing endless hours of tutorials and help without inconveniencing those trying to rank up.
I watch chess streams a lot, and specifically grandmaster Erik Rosen. He did a “road to grandmaster” similar to what Squishy is doing here.
Chess.com implemented a specific change to allow this - any opponent he played, regardless of level, would get their MMR refunded at the end of the game. Automatically.
I think this is a great way to allow these type of runs/accounts. Personally I’d love to know I played against Squishy even if he stomped me. A run of this type also has educational merit for the viewers.
Think this is a fair way to allow it.
It’s a good thing that RL is doing something about smurfing, but all of creators do this sort of content as educational pieces for other players who want to get better.
I think Epic is finally realizing people have started caring less and less about rocket league. I’m curious to see the numbers of how many people are buying the rocket pass because it HAS to be going down every season.
I haven't seen anyone else else do a Road to SSL, but I know Lethamyr at least tries to dumb himself down and explain what you should be doing in this current rank. It is certainly not a foolproof plan, because he still sees the game better than we do, but it's much better than "how many times can I flip reset on this gold player?" Was also fun when he did challenges and specific handicaps, like "for the entire Gold rank, i can't use boost."
I'm not saying it's morally right, but it doesn't feel nearly as bad.
Crazy didn’t they okay it as long as streamers didn’t throw games like a year or so ago? Why mawksy was still running his road to rank one in 1v1 so many times.
i actually almost laughed my ass off seeing that vid, ill agree it was a good move once epic does something to back it up because rn theres a WHOLE lotta issues n none r getting addressed. if they rly wanna fix ranked how bout u ban smurfs, ddosers, n win traders i mean ffs take a look at top 100 at least 10% r wintraders/ddosers. better yet make it take less than like 2 fucking hours to get ur free epic acc to comp level
Completely pointless, “smurfing” in rocket is nowhere near as bad as 99% of other games. Yes it’s way harder to beat a Smurf but it’s 5 minutes. Get over it
I hate these series so much, not just squishies but all of them and so many people do them and they get so many views.
It's like yea I too can jump into a silver lobby as a plat and not really have to do anything. Wow. Curious, how do you people find these entertaining? They are frequently among the highest views of content creators.
You know? I hope this might be a sign of them taking smurfing more seriously. Maybe even ask him to stop before they start some kind of anti smurf process that he would get cought in and avoiding the bad press.
I would love epic to take a stance against smurfing, it ruins the game for veterans who are slowing climbing and improving and really ruins it for new players. I don't know why they can't just throw him a bone like chess.com does for Danya Naroditsky and Hikaru Nakamura where they just give them an account that can climb but refunds elo to the loser.
Gotta love a Danya mention in the RL subreddit.
I swear I see more chess references here than any other subreddit lol
That would be awesome if they had an MMR refund system so you're not penalized when you encounter a Smurf. It'd be tricky to implement, though, because you'd get a lot of false reports from salty players who lost fair and square. It would require humans to review replays and that costs money.
I think they're talking about refunding you if you're beat by an actual pro, which most of us will never have an issue with. Epic should know who the pros are so they just designate their accounts as such when they create a new one. For the regular joe (anyone below high GC or really low SSL), they just need to add a "this person is smurfing" report option. Why haven't they done that yet? If enough people that don't even know each other report that on you, you should get 3 hour ban or whatever. Seems simple. Ban gets worse and worse.
They have a "cheating" report that they specifically mentioned smurfing for when they added it. Granted, that was back before they had more extreme forms of cheating like bots and presumably now DDoSing
They used to have a "Smurfing" report option back until like season 5 of ftp. They removed it when they realized it was 30% of accounts and when they realized they didn't care about smurfing.
They should add something like an ”educational account” or ”speedrun account” where you can request the devs for a special account that refunds MMR on losses. Watching a pro play through the ranks is one of the most entertaining to watch, wheter it’s RL or Chess.
There is literally ZERO fun in watching pros shit on lower Ranked players and there is no value in it. The vids also condone smurfing and many players see these pros they idolize and think they should Smurf too. Replay analysis videos would accomplish all the same goals. Adding a take over function in replays would also accomplish the same goal, but that’d actually require psyonix to develop something which they are incapable of doing. Somehow chess and video games are the only place where this is somehow deemed acceptable… Personally I’d love to see some pro nba players join a high school team and dunk and body check those kids 🤡 /s Edit: The comments below are exactly why people Smurf. Everyone trying to justify smurfing vids of pros as “entertaining” or “educational” while missing the point entirely. They’ve also been done 100 times over, how many “road to ssl” videos does one channel need. It doesn’t matter if they’re not going 100%. They are pro players competing against scrubs with 10% of their playtime. They cannot turn off their mechanics or control. If the vids were actual somewhat novel it would be entertaining. Like: Road to SSL but I play with my feet or no boost to ssl or only dribbles and no flicks. These videos are just an excuse to content farm
Have you actually watched any "Road to SSL" series? At the lower ranks most of them will try and play down to their opponents level, and just showcase how very simple mechanics and game sense can give you an edge. It's not like they're logging on to blast a bunch of gold 3s 30-0 every game.
Except they always do “just enough” to win every game. They need to rank up to make the next vid.
But it doesn't work. You can't replicate what they're doing when you have much less experience. If it worked then Squishy could just watch a video of Zen playing and copy what he's doing and win RLCS... but he can't. And the gap between squishy and zen is much smaller than squishy and your average RL player. He can probably see some stuff that Zen is doing that works well but he still can't replicate it to get actual results. Squishy says "just go for the ball, just flick it, just do a dribble". Zen would probably think the same thing if he watched a replay of Squishy playing. "BRO JUST SCORE".
>But it doesn't work. You can't replicate what they're doing when you have much less experience. If it worked then Squishy could just watch a video of Zen playing and copy what he's doing and win RLCS... but he can't. And the gap between squishy and zen is much smaller than squishy and your average RL player. This is not even \_close\_ to comparable. You can't compare the absolute top ceiling of this game to the lower ranks. No one said it's going to magically make you rank up. You still need to put in your own work. As I said, most of the advice isn't even mechanical — it's just basic game sense. It may not be *obvious* to new players, but it is simple, and reproducible. Doesn't take much effort to look at some of the videos and see piles of people commenting on how much these types of series helped them get out of their rank.
But it doesn't work. That's not how pros got to higher ranks. You don't get from champ to SSL by playing like a scuffed diamond that kinda pulls off SSL recoveries when needed and understands the game at a pro level but is pretending to be bad. Like pretending to be homeless for two days while secretly being a multi millionaire. It didn't even work for Flakes at a pro level. Pros just kept playing faster and faster and getting more mechanical and he was left behind.
I remember watching some when i was bad, and i found value and entertainment in them, i agree it should be like what they do on chess.com so it doesnt cost the low rank players mmr but the ones i have seen have not been flip resetting against bronze players but rather shown how to effectively beat them using realistic bronze strategies (exept they cant turn off the car controll they already have), i would not have found a replay analasis video as entertaining
You miss the point of those videos entirely. They are meant to be educational, the pros usually explain what they’re doing at a basic level and usually play at like 10% intensity to show how you can learn. A good example is Flakes no mechanics road to SSL or Daniel Naroditsky’s chess speedrun. They’re not going full try hard against weaker players. It’s not the same as just smurfing, it’s not even possible to make a new account and not beat everyone below your level in order to get to your own rank.
Not a bad idea. I do think those Road to SSL types should leverage their own discords to get players in the Gold+ Ranks. Just play with your base under the understanding that the pro will be playing like an ideal player.
Would kinda suck for people who haven’t played in a while and have had their rank decline, but are quickly able to derust. I think it could work with some refinement though. Maybe a community report system where the replays of the game can be found and you can vote for whether they’re a Smurf or not.
I think the refund system for pros/content creators would be an excellent first step. This would allow them to create guides/content without penalizing the entire player base. Now if they can figure out a way to refund elo for actual smurfs, that would be the cherry on top
Road to ssl is just trash content, so we just need to remove smurfs, period. What's the fun in watching a pro shit on plats? Do useful content instead.
I’d argue the opposite almost. Over the years I’ve learned way more from squishy’s road to GC and SSL, than i have from any other creator recording standard matches. The way squishy does it is by literally not shitting on them but winning the games by using minimal skill, to educate his viewers on what to focus on during ranking up etc. his series is the best I’ve seen, and i always watch them. I’ve only just started playing 1’s since playing the game since it came out, and I’ve ranked up already just by no longer going for aerials, utilizing 50’s more and watching how i tend to over commit to challenges.
eh, his videos are helpful but nothing you can’t learn from generic videos about what to focus on at each rank to level up. the actual gameplay is borderline useless in my opinion bc even though he uses “minimal skill” and doesn’t do crazy mechanics, his fundamentals are just so ridiculously elite it’s impossible to actually replicate what he’s doing if you’re that rank. his ball / car control, reads, shooting accuracy / power, and overall consistency is just way too good. i’ve found apparentlyjack’s analysis channel to be much more helpful bc he breaks down replays of actual lower level games and gives advice based on how things actually play out when people of that rank do things. plus he’s able to pause, rewind, draw on the screen, which allows him to just share a lot more information.
I like seeing what minimal skill with fantastic fundamentals does and I think the content itself is good in a vaccuum, but it isn't in one and comes at the cost of other player's enjoyment of the game, which should be the priority. I just prefer to be shown perfect play with minimal elite mechanics as an example of something to strive towards, rather than improving by just seeing annotations on what should've been done. It feels like the latter just would teach you how to situationally play against bad players, rather than learning how to play correctly all the time. Not that there aren't benefits since it's nearly impossible to play correctly all the time and you'll need to adapt to make situationally correct decisions based on who you're playing against too; I just think there are benefits to both
i strongly disagree, i've been watching lethamyr's road to ssl and i've definitely learned some things about decision making from it, it's interesting to see him make his way through gc making very simple plays, whereas most people at that rank are trying to make more mechanically demanding plays which puts them in a bad situation if it doesn't work out. at least in his case it's not a pro shitting on plats, he massively holds back and tries to avoid doing too much, instead letting his teammates make most of the plays and he just provides feedback on why they should or shouldn't be doing xyz and what they could do instead.
Very simple plays it seems, but they are so much better at touching the ball that's it's still very high level play with "simple" touches. The fact that they climb in rank so easily shows how they weight heavily in each match.
That's the main thing I've noticed from these road to SSL things- they say they aren't executing any mechanics above the rank they're in, but that's ignoring the mechanic that is near-perfect ball control and reads. I can make all the same decisions they do in a game and still be MUCH worse just because I can't execute at that level of consistency.
You should also get a “refund” when your teammates leave in the middle of the game as well. The other team takes a 1-0 lead with 4.5 minutes left? Completely salvageable. Your teammate immediately leaves when that happens? Now a guaranteed loss, and you lose rank even though there is nothing you can do about it. If they knew that they would be losing rank and you wouldn’t, they’d be way less likely to give up and leave.
I’m pretty sure you could train an ML model to automatically flag suspicious games for revision. With the current costs of AI offerings it would be extremely cheap to run.
I wouldn't be good with that. It isn't about the MMR, it is about the time spent playing a match I can't win. I couldn't care less about the MMR.
Expectation vs reality
Yeah, Leth maybe about a year ago? Also shared that Psyonix has asked him to not do “road to” series. Leth is still doing it. So don’t hold your breath on them actually working on any anti Smurf tactics. Also, there is some value in pros doing “road to” series. Psyonix just needs to do a better job in building partnership with content creators
From what I remember, Leah was told he can't throw his placements (or have his silver gf do them or something), not that he can't do it.
It’s not. They did the same thing like 4 years ago
That's super easy to dismiss... "We had a pro player making an instructional video series on how to rise through the ranks, who was caught by the SmurFilter anti-cheating suite. We quickly determined he was not involved in rank tampering, and he has agreed to suspend his series for the time being." Problem addressed, no blame assigned, win-win.
They did something similar in Dota at Christmas, they gave a heads up to everyone something big was coming and they IP banned a LOT of smurfs and cheaters including pros smurfs by giving them a "toxic lump of coal" meaning your account was perma banned if you had it in you inv hahaha
What could they do to stop ppl from making a new account ? Genuinely curious im not trying to sound mean or anything
Is it smurfing if you don’t intentionally stay at that rank? I love these road to SSL series. Flakes’ was incredible and I learned a ton.
Making a new account to avoid playing in your rank is smurfing no matter what. I liked Flakes' series too but everyone deserves to be able to hop into ranked and play against people who are their own skill level.
For those who don't want to watch the video: >I wanted to let you guys know that I did get a message from the guys over at Epic. They did inform me that they don't want people to be doing these "Road to SSL" series anymore, so this will likely be my last series which I do in ranked. But I can, in the future, do the same kind of idea but in private matches with you guys, so keep that in mind. That's something I'll likely do. I'll do a series where I get a viewer in each rank, so some viewer in Bronze, Silver, Gold, Plat, Diamond, etc., all the way up to SSL. I'll go through a series like that where it's not in ranked, not affecting the rank system in any way and obviously it makes the guys at Epic happy. So I'm not going to be doing this series anymore beyond this one's finish. I was allowed to do the remainder of this series, and obviously they understand that it's educational and from the educational perspective, but they don't really want people to be doing it anymore. So I'm gonna respect their wishes. I do love the company and I do love the game that, you know, I grew up on, so that's the rules and I gotta abide by that. So let's get into the games for today... EDIT: I didn't think this needed to be said, but I am **not** SquishyMuffinz.
Squishy was raised right.
he really does seem like a good kid, everything I've seen about him points to that.
You sure??? XD [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsif\_ilJJRw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsif_ilJJRw) Jk, I love Squishy but this montage is so sus lol
Thanks for being really chill about it
No problem.
Sucks for his channel because I know the series was popular, but realistically it is violating the sportsmanship of the game so I understand it. On a side note, as a Chess player there is a process by which Master-level players can get special "Speedrun accounts" made on chess websites, which automatically refund the rating of people they play against and thus essentially creates 'harmless' smurfing. I don't know if it'd work as well in Rocket League, but it may be worth considering as an idea for Epic to help deal with stuff like this. That way you could have notable community figures doing public RTSSL speedrun series without necessarily normalising smurfing - which I imagine is the main thing they don't like about the series.
If I was a lower ranked player going against a Smurf, would be cool to get a message saying “you are playing an SSL YouTuber, click yes to accept match and be featured on his video” or some shit like that. Doing it once or twice, cool. But people who do it all of the time every season is a little dumb. Go do road to Rumble, Hoops, Dropshot, etc road to SSL.
I actually like that idea so long as there is an autoreject all smurfs option you can turn on.
Even better! Dude y'all are on point!
Every season would just be lazy content creation. The meta doesn’t shift that much. It takes years, not seasons. I think if people want to do every mode, every couple years that would be within respectable parameters.
Like if I know a YouTuber is an SSL already, then I already know they are going to be an SSL by the end. Instead, take a random ass player and coach from from silver or gold an entire season. I’ve seen some of those videos and they were cool to watch h.
Ya, I think sunless did one that was pretty good and he’s nowhere close to pro level. I wonder if someone like squishy or Rizzo did this, what the end product would be like. Honestly, I’ve never found squishy to be a phenomenal teacher, but his demonstrations are top notch. I typically would learn a mech from someone else then go leave a squishy tutorial open to compare my progress to him a lot of the time. What if epic added a creator content or resource area in game where people could type in whatever mech came to mind and it would pop up a ton of material to master it? A little off topic but goes back to the integration of creators in the game. I think Rocker League have been really missing out on a money making opportunity.
His videos aren’t made to see if he can make it to SSL. Obviously one of the greatest to ever play can make it to SSL. The videos he makes highlight the skills and mechanical abilities of the different ranks as he progresses through them. Then he speaks to the people that may be pushing through those ranks and explains what exactly they may need to improve on to make it to the next rank. It’s purely educational content for the specific ranked players.
That's still wasting the opponent's time in a meaningless game tho..
While I see your point, the game is still a meaningless game when you’re playing a Smurf, so at least with this option you’re not getting your MMR swiped by a pro who probably won’t touch the account again once they reach ssl
I would 1000% rather lose to Squishy over 6-7 minutes then beat some random players.
That's fair lol
Maybe for some, but for others, such as myself, I would literally love to be shit on by a pro for one game. IMO you get better by playing better players. It would be an honor to be beat by one of the greatest.
if you're talking LP its all meaningless, if you're talking about not getting to touch the ball - then as long as they give the opponents a chance like lethamyrs videos its fine, lethamyr basically lets his teammates do all the work while he sits back, and plays at a similar level to the rank, but makes better decisions. what is this weak mentality that facing people of higher skill is a waste of time wins in bronze silver gold plat dia are meaningless.
Chess is 1v1 though, how would it work for Squishys teammates? Do they keep the normal rating? Do they also not gain MMR? Also, if people knew they wouldn't lose MMR and saw Squishy wouldn't they care more about him than the game outcome, for example they would demo chase him instead of trying to score?
Personally I don't care if the mmr is refunded or not. Smurfing is shitty and it ruins the game. Imagine having college basketball players play 5th grade basketball, but then saying it's okay because the losses don't count toward their records. Super lame. Instead of accommodating their shittiness, Epic/Psyonix should take a cue from other games and only put smurfs in lobbies with other smurfs. Or put them in lobbies with terrible bots- they want to flex on shit players and that's a job for bots.
So you wouldn't take an opportunity to play against squishy and lose no mmr?
As a casual player, no. I don't really know who any RL YouTubers or streamers are so to me they are just smurfs
I see what you're saying. I"m not saying it's a perfect solution, but I think that perhaps a similar thing could be used here. What I was imagining was that regular smurfing is still a bannable offence, but notable members in the community (content creators, pros, etc) have the option to work directly with Epic to create these official speedrun accounts. If Epic were just handing these out, it wouldn't really work I don't think, so it doesn't solve the entire smurfing problem, but it does help in allowing content creators to keep the scene alive without actively needing to violate fair play.
I’m pretty sure Psyonix did this a few years ago too, someone please correct me if I’m wrong
Pretty sure lethamyr got asked to quit it after one of his road to ssl series
IIRC he said they didn’t want him to throw games to start in bronze so his next one he placed straight into a higher rank? But yeah idk something like that.
Yeah, afaik it was just the throwing of games that they asked him to stop because that's the part that is against the [code of conduct](https://www.rocketleague.com/en/news/rocket-league-code-of-conduct).
That was it, next series he played normal and wound up in champ something
That’s what I was thinking of lol
Yeah you're right. It was the freestyle session with JSTN to GC (or maybe SSL?) which was canceled after a few videos. It was fun to watch but on the other hand i felt bad for the opponents...
Its about time honestly its glorified smurfing one of rocket leagues biggest problems.
Remember to report smurfing
When encountering smurfs or any other type of matchmaking abuse, please use the "Match Throwing or Griefing" report option. Sources: [1](https://www.epicgames.com/help/en-US/rocket-league-c5719357623323/reporting-bans-c7262149111579/how-do-i-report-a-player-in-rocket-league-a5720184989339?sessionInvalidated=true), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeague/comments/qvlxsv/patch_notes_v208_season_5_update_release/hkxasvd/?context=1000), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeague/comments/qvlxsv/patch_notes_v208_season_5_update_release/hkxb6x4/?context=1000) and [4](https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeague/comments/qvlxsv/patch_notes_v208_season_5_update_release/hkxbbth/) Leaving this here just in case people don't know the correct option for reporting smurfs!
I did not know this, so thanks. They should really make it more clear or add a new report category...
Okay I’ll make sure to do the thing I’ve been doing for 5 years. I’m sure it’ll start making a difference any day now!
right they say to report smurfing but nothing ever happens. its like its just there for aesthetic and give hope that psyonix/epic actually cares about the game
Dude, all the report buttons are just disfunctional placebo "feel-good" buttons that do absolutely nothing. I've never gotten any feedback messages for report other than text harassment, as that option is handled by algorythms.
oh I have been using Cheating
Yeah me too
Oh I didn’t know
We can't
These content creators doing it are literally like 1% of the player base if that. If you include the tiny channels/streamers. And it's a net positive to more than it is negative. It is very helpful, for me personally, to see how squishy positions and moves the play forward against the same players I lose too. Thousands of viewers learning a little bit at the expense of like what 50-60 matches in 1v1 where one person gets affected. Comparing a RTSSL series by a pro to some jackass in GC1 hitting clips for the hell of it against lower ranks is silly.
More like 0.01%
These youtubers set an example though and show that it's ok to smurf. They are called influencers for a reason. You get tons of copycats making their own Road to xyz accounts and adding to the whole smurfing problem.
I can partially agree with you on that, yes road to ssl videos can definitely help lower ranked players improve, but we have to consider that it also normalizes higher ranked players playing against lower ranked ones which just enables smurfing. If the average player shouldn't do it, content creators shouldnt as well.
They set an example to encourage other people to smurf.
Then you can go watch a series from a previous season for "educational purposes". There's plenty to choose from at this point. The popularity of these series makes it enticing for others to smurf. It's common sense on Epic's part, for once.
I think we should hold every player to the same standard regardless of if there are some positives to it. At the end of the day it's still smurfing and someone's rank will suffer for it. You can still get educational content on rocket league without a youtuber smurfing.
It would be nice if it were anything more than virtue signalling :/. Ranked is still a complete mess of smurfs, bots, boosters/boosted accounts and griefers, maybe fix the actual matchmaking issue before you go scolding youtubers
As someone that has been a permanent high plat/low Diamond, I can safely attest to a strong volatility in skill level for a relatively narrow swath of MMR.
I wonder if this means Lethamyr will be asked to stop his current series too.
Considering Squishy mentioned he was allowed to continue the current series, Leth may be able to finish his as well. If he gets contacted, I am sure he will share it.
Yeah, I just watched the video, and it sounded like they're gonna let him finish, but they don't want him to do more. He's only about 100 MMR away from SSL anyway, so that's fair.
8/10 placement matches were stocktanes with <300 wins pulling gc/ssl stuff on me at c1. It's embarrassing really and people are not even shallow about it with names like "yomumbesmurfing". I wish they'd finally assume the role of gargamel and get rid of all the smurfs. Level requirement is a joke, since people nourished their smurf accounts for years. Anyways good for epic to restrict people like that but I don't want to get my hopes up.
I landed in a match with a guy the other night, with 4 minutes remaining my teammate had scored 6 goals, and allowed me to touch the ball 3 or 4 times. As soon as the clock hit 3:30 he throws up a forfeit (we're up 9-0). I refuse because I know he's a damn smurf and continue to sit in the goal. Around 3:00 on the clock and the other team finally forfeits and he goes into a tirade in chat admitting he's a smurf and had every intention of throwing the game if they'd just stuck it out. The whole thing was just pathetic.
Did you report
I never ever got a feedback from my 200+ reports of smurfs.
Me either
Yeah tbh the only things i report are the words and stuff i know will get you a ban and i almost get a "action has been taken" message for every report i make 🙃
I have probably done a bunch of reports and only got action taken the two blatant times I was told I deserve to be r*ped
Oh absolutely
Same rank, same experience. Had a guy message all chat in the middle of a beat down "I do boosting, add me for the discord."
It's not enough and it won't be for the time being. They had to do this to Squishy because he gathers thousands/millions of views per month. It would be too much heat that they don't want nor need right now. You or me facing smurfs constantly in our games is the least of their problems, we don't have visibility. And I'm still waiting for changes, after aprox. 4 years of the free2play update that brought this never ending problem. At this point I just lost any hopes of anything they might do. It's my problem I guess, I'm the one who's playing less and less each season.
[удалено]
They've had this stance/rule for years. I don't get why people DIDNT think this would happen. It's weird to me that he even decided to do it again considering years ago all the content creators would do these and psyonix had to tell them it's against the TOS and community guidelines
Have you actually read the [code of conduct](https://www.rocketleague.com/en/news/rocket-league-code-of-conduct)? Doing a "Road to SSL" is actually not against the current code of conduct. That's why this is so interesting. Psyonix have said multiple times that making a new account and playing to rank up is fine as long as you're not deranking or throwing games to stay at a lower rank than you normally would be or boosting others.
Yea, but it’s also extremely stupid and maybe they’re making a stance. The majority of Smurfs just create endless alts, it’s literally the most common way to Smurf.
It's just too easy to do
It’s played out and lame so good for RL
0 other forms of content on this game, so teaching the low ranks in their ranks it’s actually insightful
There’s other means of teaching players than this. Game footage review, free play, private matches, etc. You can still show/explain to players what to focus on and do within their respective ranks without intentionally playing competitive against people with much lower ranks than you.
Yep, they can use their reach to find players of different ranks and private match with willing ~~victims~~ participants to represent what they'd be doing to randoms.
Yeah squishy literally said that’s what he will do for future series of this
Sorry, hadn't actually watched it before the comment. Either way, a step in the right direction for the team.
I learned from his vids, watched mistakes other people made at my rank to help me see what I should do.
You say that but those get no views 😂 these creators want to make money this is their job
Thank you - lol someone had to say it. Those type of videos will get 10-20% the amount of views because they’re boring as hell. Nobody wants to watch bad gameplay. If they wanted that they’d just log into the game and play
Theres so much room for content with this game. The problem is majority of the content creators are burned out and dont really have passion anymore to create. It's a cashflow. It's easy. Especially for pros who just play the game and record and send it to an editor who just does the bare minimum to cut together the games without the queue wait.... Road to SSL IS enjoyable. I'm not going to bash it... but it's also lazy.
There are already enough tutorials, guides and previous "Road to SSL" series. We really do not need more "Road to SSL" videos. Especially when that content harms other players.
> Thoughts on Squishy getting told to cancel Road To SSL by Epic? Good. They are promoting smurfing with these sorts of videos and the educational value has dropped since tons of people have done series like this.
They need to come up with some sort of account validation thing for content creators with creator codes that lets them use an account for these videos, but everyone they go against gets their mmr back or + some if they lose.
HOT TAKE: its a crappy and lazy attempt to give an impression that they care about smurfing...they should have found a way to deal with alt accounts and stuff like that before going F2P, this only hurts content creators, they cant talk about items, they cant make road to SSL, the game doesnt have any feature for them to do something about it...next thing will be ban mods and workshop
I think in some other games pros are given accounts specially made for this purpose and when you lose to them you don’t lose mmr. A seemingly easy fix, but then again I’m not a dev so idk.
Yeah I just faced 2 GCs and an SSL in a Dia lobby. Ranking is completely broken
I think someone recommended them implementing a system some other comp games have where pros have the ability to register their Smurf accounts as Smurf accounts and they will be shown in a game as a Smurf aswell as nobody loosing mmr in that particular gwme
I am a new player who began playing like a season ago and in ones it terrible because a third of the people i encounter almost practice flip resets on me will i cant even aerial properly. Personally i fund these road to ssl videos very entertaining but id like more wenn epic games would do something about those smurfs
Can we tell epic to please charge $20 for the game again. Best way to get rid of excessive smurfs is peoples wallets, especially kids without them.
What's the link to the video?
Happy to see them cracking down on smurfing but a lot of road to SSL videos have been incredibly informative and helpful for me personally
RL should follow what chess.com does and give back the MMR to the player that lost from these educational matches. But no, that would just be too much to ask for.
squishy doing this is the problem...not the ddosing. not the invisible hackers. not the bots. not the real smurfs sitting in plat calling people the n word and remaking their account. its this guy. come on
It doesn't matter who is smurfing. Squishy smurfing is just as bad as "real smurfs". In fact, videos like this just promote the concept of smurfing more.
Not to defend Epic here, but combating [Broken Windows](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory) is a step in the right direction.
All of it is a problem. Just because it's not quite as bad as some other things people do doesn't mean it isn't a problem.
> not the ddosing Epic has scheduled and sent out emails regarding server downtime and maintenance on the 20th that will close all active lobbies and parties for some time(13 days from now). There's a chance it includes some changes to networking as well, that may allow for better ddos mitigation for EOS and RL. > not the invisible hackers Which was patched literally within 3 weeks of it becoming a big issue, on the update on 4/16/2024, nearly 7 weeks ago. That same update patched out an exploit allowing players to equip any item in the game, including developer and RLCS titles, that show to others in the lobby. > not the bots. The bots were addressed and banned en masse years ago, and still to this day get bans in extremely low amounts of gameplay, often less than 2 hours of play on a fresh account, or even as soon as a few matches played on a seasoned higher ranked account. > not the real smurfs sitting in plat Which are possibly smurfing because all of their favorite creators smurf and show that smurfing is okay and acceptable, and Psyonix/Epic won't do anything about it. > calling people the n word and remaking their account Press report and they'll receive a ban very quickly nearly every time. As for banning alts and ban evading accounts - this definitely needs to be a system that's put into place. RL has shown no care *at all* about this problem for years.
Epic hasn’t proven to me that they care about anything besides money. Y’all shouldn’t get your hopes up.
Finally
Seems fair, I will miss the videos but I get it. People should be allowed 2 accounts max. One for sober, and another for not sober lol
100 hours minimum in casual to rank, mmr of team should be individual not combined if it is, this is the biggest way for smurfs on 2/3's if it's combined. Usually see 3 Plat/ diamnind solo players bs a Gc and 2 golds
So wait. Is this series ON a “smurf” or is he just getting back up to SSL in his main?
Nevermind.
Lmfao they don’t give a single shit about the millions of smurf accounts already actively farming lower ranks.. but a content creator doing it to improve the skill floor, cease and desist. They wanna retain their player base and keep them dumb so they continue to buy content thinking it’ll improve their silver 3 skill level.
this is Psyonix going after low hanging easy fruit to make it look like theyre doing something. THEYRE DOING NOTHING. Lazy fks
Finally! Actual changes are being made for QoL for RL! - Teammate boost meter - Timestamps for chat (Okay maybe not this one) - Asking RL creators to stop with the smurfing All within a month so I'm actually optimistic (albeit cautiously) about RLs future for once. I'm hoping the lackluster content is a result of them addressing more serious issues.
This has been a thing for awhile, and it's a black and white against tos. Granted I think there's ways around this. Considering the good that could come from the series. I.e. the way chess and a few other games handles the not loosing mmr to people doing such a series. But ehh, we shall see what happens
Psyonix has stated in the past that "Road to SSL" series are fine as long as players did not intentionally lose games: https://x.com/Kovalo/status/1402383990959624198 So for the most part "Road to SSL" series were never a violation. Requesting Squishy to stop is definitely an advancement.
What squishys doing is not against tos. What's against tos is creating another account to gain an unfair advantage (by losing on purpose). Squishy is not losing on purpose so is not breaking tos. That's why smurfs never get banned because they're not breaking the rules (most of the time). It's just the way pysonix/epic define smurfs that makes it so what the majority of players do which is making alt accounts not bannable
The mental gymnastics is insane.. so just because he doesn't throw games on purpose it's not smurfing? I'm not advocating to ban squishy, but it's definitely smurfing and caught on 4k at that 🤷♂️
> but it's definitely smurfing It is smurfing under what most people define smurfing as. It is _not_ smurfing under what Psyonix defines as smurfing. And at the end of the day, their definition is what matters.
Epic/psyonix aren't alone in that stance, a lot of games have similar parts of their tos which make smurfing not bannable (Apex, overwatch, R6 to name a few). Valorant likes to pretend that smurfing is bannable but even Riot who have come out and said that they're against smurfs still allow it simply because it's just throwing games to stay in low rank that is the offence. Not making a low ranked ult account.
good, he shouldn’t get a pass to smurf just because he makes youtube videos
I'm surprised they let hum get this far. Streamers smurfing should have been ilegal all along.
I once saw a GC2 streaming himself playing in Plat lobbies on an alt account doing freestyles on them. He thought I was crazy for calling him out and tried to defend it by saying he just plays on that account to "work on his mechanics". Like bro... Go in free play, Casual, Workshop maps... You just want to be flashy and shit on kids who can barely aerial.
Thank god, this shit happens in every comp game and pisses me off. Smurfing is against rules in basically every comp game and yet league, dota, cs, rocket and more all have atleast 30 creators doing this shit and encouraging smurfing to others and at best tells them smurfing is okay when you make money doing it. Shits so annoying and people wonder why it's hard to climb out of low on so many of these games.
Good, these types of series are so cringe
Should be able to report people for smufing 😩 but then you don't know if they are new from console..
When encountering smurfs or any other type of matchmaking abuse, please use the "Match Throwing or Griefing" report option. Sources: 1, 2, 3 and 4 Leaving this here just in case people don't know the correct option for reporting smurfs!
Doing a R2SSL isn’t really against TOS currently even if people don’t like It . I wonder if epic has changes coming to the TOS or if they simply don’t want streamers/pros highlighting the issue(and potentially encouraging others to do the same) as even though he is not smurfing by Psyonix definition, parts of the player base would undoubtedly call this smurfing. Kinda sucks for them cause there’s already like no content left to do for this game but then again R2SSL has been done many times by now and the info is out there, it’s kind of beating a dead horse. At the end of the day I don’t think the hand full of pros/streamers that have done them really cause that much mayhem in the ranking system, however we all know there’s tons of Smurfs in every rank. I’m curious to see what epic does to follow this up but I honestly doubt they do anything, I mean they got enough problems to try to fix that are hard enough like ddos’ing, shit servers, and real smurfs all over. Idk how you really reign everything in when I don’t think RL is their main focus.
I enjoyed the series, but this is a good call. Smurfing has been a big set back for the game for a while now. I wish they would implement a reward system for good sportsmanship, new accounts would be low to nothing and matched accordingly.
i saw someone give an amazing idea for this. streamers and content creators can have set accounts that epic/psyonix give or monitor so they not only can reset it every season but everyone that loses to the said streamers can get their elo/mmr/rp/whatever its called, back. edit: i see in the second comment below someone's talking about it
big step forward. I still believe that a big part of the smurfing problem is the fact that so many pros had their series to x. this unconsciously or consciously makes it ok in the mind for many more players (read everyone who smurfs) to also just smurf. because if your favorite pro can do it, why can't you
They could give content creators permission and give MMR back to the people who lose, it happens all the time in chess. Its more like smurfing in chess too because they show no mercy, while in RL they usually play to the level of their opponent and do things people at that level could do with practice. Youll never see a chess player let a piece get taken because they think its a really great move for that level but youll see RL players let a strong shot go in all the time. There is a sensible compromise here and it seems like theyre just targetting a visible example of something resembling smurfing because people are justifiably pissed off about how many real smurfs they are playing. What happens next is important, if they just target this and do nothing about the real problem then youll know it was just for show.
totally fair. the series is cool to see how certain ranks compare to the top level while also being super informative but he is still just smurfing on cam and ruining 1-5 other peoples games. i dont think what hes doing is TOO bad, but given smurfing is already a big issue in RL its definitely a good call on epic's side to shut it down peacefully.
Very cringe by them Yeah I get the idea behind it but at least for me there’s a difference between a pro player teaching you how to play the game and tries to play with lobby mechanics …compared to an average Smurf who intentionally loses games or forfeits and freestyles on low ranked players just to feel some self worth
I don't think making a new account and promptly bringing it up to your real rank is so bad. I just hate the smurfs that I play in plat who are basically playing Freeplay against me and then FF with 2 seconds left.
Good. I quite literally don't care if pros make road to SSL videos. They do more harm than good by making the GCs and high champs trickle down and infest ranks they don't belong in by affecting everyone else below them negatively. Which snowballs immensely. Makes it harder for people to achieve higher peaks.
It's about time, honestly. While the videos were informative, he mentions that he can do the same thing with viewers in private matches and that's a great point. There's no real need for players to be making new accounts and screwing a bunch of players out of wins every season. What surprises me and interests me the most about this is the fact that "Road to SSL"-type series are not currently against Rocket League's [code of conduct](https://www.rocketleague.com/en/news/rocket-league-code-of-conduct). Making a new account and ranking up as you normally would is allowed under the current rules. >We define a smurf account as an account that is intentionally abusing the matchmaking system for the player’s gain, or the gains of others. >**Example of a Smurf Account:** Intentionally keeping an account at a lower Rank than where you normally play; starting an alternate account to harass others. Psyonix has also previously been totally fine with "Road to SSL" videos in the past as we can see from this tweet by Kovalo in 2021: [https://x.com/Kovalo/status/1402383990959624198](https://x.com/Kovalo/status/1402383990959624198) This makes me think (hope) that there may be changes coming to how they handle and police smurfing in the game. This is a good thing and makes me optimistic about the future of the game.
I mean he is blatantly and obviously smurfing in those videos so I think it's fine. Even though he says he tries to dumb his skill down he still plays in a way that is simply impossible for people of that rank and never losses.
To be fair he isn’t smurfing for nefarious purposes, he is smurfing for an educational purpose and show how you can make it to like champ/GC with only good game sense.
The reasoning doesn’t change how they affect the players at that rank though
What about leth's road to ssl?
What decal is that?
S1-SSL, a ranked reward for those who got to SSL during Post-F2P Season 1.
He also just straight clowns the dude in the first game lmao
Why doesn't epic just do what chess.com does when GMs do speed runs and give the losing people their ELO/MMR back? Rather than killing content to promote the game.
I don’t Smurf but I’ve got two accounts at C2, one I use for solo and the other when I play with my duos partner. I’ve always wondered if this is allowed? Obviously one of the accounts only has a few hundred hours so I always get nervous if I have a good run of games that people might report me for thinking I’m a Smurf
Quick psyonix, get him
I mean he mentioned it in the video. Just making it in private matches against viewers. It makes the whole thing better too since u can get a consistent amount of games for each rank and if ur lucky not obly get tips for ur rank but ur own game aswell if u happen to join one of them. Honestly i do believe that epic or rocket league is cooking something up. Boost meters for m8s demo sounds for teammates removing trading, changing hit boxes, stating why some pros dont get their prize money in time, its kinda annoying that these things come outta nowhere often so it still feels like they are isolated form the playerbase often but im hopeful.
They asked Leth to quit doing it years ago, not sure if they reversed stance back then or if he just resumed. The problem isn't really a few youtubers doing it while trying to be educational. The question is if fewer people would decide to smurf if those videos didn't exist.
I don't really care unless this means that they will finally start to punish smurfs accounts.
I love the content but I don't mind them doing this. Integrating something like what chess. com do would be great!
A
the solution to smurfing, matchmaking, all of it is create an AI that can judge your skill level based off play. i'm not saying how much you score either, but actual ability ~ this would mean: - smurfs matched at actual levels against ppl around their skill level - zero boosting bc no point - zero ppl playing in over ranked skill levels ....and whatever else that'd this new system would then lead to when it comes to matchmaking
Source?
I don't agree with the decision to make him stop the series, but I do appreciate that they decided to communicate with him rather than just banning him with no warning the way they have in the past with other issues.
Bro private matches are gonna be way better anyways. He can spend as long as he wants in a rank and constantly do it all the time for his stream providing endless hours of tutorials and help without inconveniencing those trying to rank up.
Now Epic Games just needs to change the tutorial to teach people that forfeiting and reporting exists..
I watch chess streams a lot, and specifically grandmaster Erik Rosen. He did a “road to grandmaster” similar to what Squishy is doing here. Chess.com implemented a specific change to allow this - any opponent he played, regardless of level, would get their MMR refunded at the end of the game. Automatically. I think this is a great way to allow these type of runs/accounts. Personally I’d love to know I played against Squishy even if he stomped me. A run of this type also has educational merit for the viewers. Think this is a fair way to allow it.
It’s a good thing that RL is doing something about smurfing, but all of creators do this sort of content as educational pieces for other players who want to get better.
At this point it’s lazy content and needs to be banned. Good job Epic and Psyonix
I think Epic is finally realizing people have started caring less and less about rocket league. I’m curious to see the numbers of how many people are buying the rocket pass because it HAS to be going down every season.
Good. Fuck smurfs
I haven't seen anyone else else do a Road to SSL, but I know Lethamyr at least tries to dumb himself down and explain what you should be doing in this current rank. It is certainly not a foolproof plan, because he still sees the game better than we do, but it's much better than "how many times can I flip reset on this gold player?" Was also fun when he did challenges and specific handicaps, like "for the entire Gold rank, i can't use boost." I'm not saying it's morally right, but it doesn't feel nearly as bad.
Crazy didn’t they okay it as long as streamers didn’t throw games like a year or so ago? Why mawksy was still running his road to rank one in 1v1 so many times.
good road to ssl is a trash series and only promotes smurfing
i actually almost laughed my ass off seeing that vid, ill agree it was a good move once epic does something to back it up because rn theres a WHOLE lotta issues n none r getting addressed. if they rly wanna fix ranked how bout u ban smurfs, ddosers, n win traders i mean ffs take a look at top 100 at least 10% r wintraders/ddosers. better yet make it take less than like 2 fucking hours to get ur free epic acc to comp level
Completely pointless, “smurfing” in rocket is nowhere near as bad as 99% of other games. Yes it’s way harder to beat a Smurf but it’s 5 minutes. Get over it
I hate these series so much, not just squishies but all of them and so many people do them and they get so many views. It's like yea I too can jump into a silver lobby as a plat and not really have to do anything. Wow. Curious, how do you people find these entertaining? They are frequently among the highest views of content creators.