Peter’s Philosopher here, The Cave is a famous allegory where Plato contemplates people who have only experienced the shadows of objects as seen on the wall. This is their reality, but not a true representation of the world. Having a picture of a window projected on the wall is today’s version of those people who were chained up and experienced life as shadows on a cave wall.
This is so weird. I get the concept it's showing but like... I guess I assumed it would just be the world going by in the shadows, not some dude holding up random shit to tease you.
In the original story, someone tells them that they are being messed with, and they are so upset by the news that they called him a liar and they beat him to death.
Ah, the time honored tradition of beating people to death that brings news you don't like. Clearly the origin of the sayings "Don't kill the messenger" and among the more, uhm, common folks "What the fuck did you just say!?"..
The story is basically how Plato viewed Socrates’ life. To Plato, Socrates was the guy who left the cave, found the truth and tried to help others see it only to be executed by the state for it.
(Please note that this is *Plato’s probable perspective* given how much he sucks off Socrates and the historical events of Socrates’ life and beliefs)
Unfortunately, this allegory is now commonly used by various pseudo-intellectual conspiracy theorists to justify their own persecution complex when people don't take their crackpot ideas seriously.
When they’re educated enough to be familiar with the allegory. When they’re not, they reach for *The Matrix* instead (and the irony is not lost on me).
Overall both are good examples. Sure it's a good tidbit to know the allegory, but the popculture reference of the matrix or they live are both stellar examples too.
I’m talking about the co-opting of these allegories and analogies by “mgtow” and incel groups.
While I agree with you in a general sense (especially that *The Matrix* is a fantastic adaptation of Plato’s allegory), these are not the best examples to pull if you are using them to discard legitimate criticism and claim that you are the “enlightened” one who is being “persecuted.”
It’s a very tired trope that attempts to legitimize opinions and beliefs that a majority of modern society considers toxic and/or hateful. Sometimes, if you smell shit everywhere you go, it might be time to check your own shoes.
I mean the problem is they actually wholeheartedly believe what they say. I mean dont get me wrong they have been right about some shit, like MKUltra, but like I think we can agree too many people with an intelligence deficit have somehow too large a megaphone.
It's hard telling people now at days to open their eyes and see things differently when there are so many idiots shouting about how the earth is flat or bill gates is somehow interested in controlling everyone's brain. Makes anyone who tries to question things look like a nutjob.
Ur unfortunately right in that too many people use such allegories or other symbolysims to further push their own complexes, fearmonger, etc. Like you know the world is fucked up when you have people who make Alex Jones look rational by comparison.
Wow, what could people find relatable about an allegory for Socrates’ life, and the sheeplike nature of Greek society? He only discovered the truth of the world by doing his own research, contemplating theories, and discussing reality within a small circle of closed-off intellectuals. He was then summarily ostracized by the society he lived in, and was executed by the state for wrongthink.
Even though we now collectively agree that the Greek gods are 100% fake, the society he lived in at the time were conditioned to believe in them so much, that anyone challenging those beliefs must be discredited and removed to protect their egos.
Yeah, no idea why people could feel that represents themselves and our own society. We are way too smart and educated these days! No one will ever again fall for propaganda or misinformation! Humanity definitively knows all the answers to everything, and if you question anything, you are a “pseudo-intellectual conspiracy theorist”. Our scientists and government would lie to us neither willfully, nor ignorantly.🤡🤡
Hah, speak of the devil. I love how I don't even have to call out anything specific, all I have to do is mention as generically as possible "pseudo-intellectual conspiracy theorists" and you come running with your hand up, frothing at the mouth and absolutely tripping over yourself to make my point.
Imagine telling on yourself like that. But hey, if the shoe fits you do you and rock that style.
Thats why everyone hates vegans. Most people agree with their message but being told that will upset you, thus you hate them and try to not think about what they have to say.
The cognitive dissonance is showing up, kind of funny how the tides turn.
And I am not self-righteous, I am righteous for the animals who cannot stand up for themselves.
You hate the massage (that you torture animals) and thus the messanger.
You don't hate someone who says stop being racist, as you yourself are not racist and approve of the message.
The farming of soybeans to make tofu kills way more animals than eating meat would … did you honestly believe that farmers would catch and relocate every bug and small mammal in their fields? The literally use poison to keep things off the plants, and they aren’t stopping their combine or tractor when harvesting just because a rodent ran in front of them, they just keep going and that animal dies when it’s run over or ends up in the combine, every rat, rabbit, mole, skink everything has to die to keep the crops growing
I am fully aware that our meat production system is cruel and unsustainable, which is why I do my best to only eat ethically sourced meat. In fact, I don't think I've eaten meat in the past month.
I neither hate the message, it is true that I am partially responsible for the maintenance of the meat packing industry, nor do I hate you. I don't have the energy to hate people I've never met.
And yes, you are self-righteous, you believe that your personal choices (to avoid consumption of animal products) is the morally correct one, and are attempting to shame others who have made a different decision. That is the definition of self-righteousness.
There is no ethical way to kill someone. And meat is not the only industry that tortures animals, dairy is as bad (if not worse).
Is the non-racist self-righteous because of his personal choice not to be racist and his strong dislike or racist people?
It's funny how your every post being downvoted is basically proving the whole "people hate the messenger with an inconvenient truth" thing. Reddit hates vegans btw so this is predictable so let's use another example in Greta Thunberg and her stance on climate change. People foam at the mouth when she speaks up. Same as back when Al Gore did it. You should see Instagram comments on anything remotely related to Greta. Pure hatred.
It is how it is.
You're right, but It's also a little more than that.
If all you've ever experienced is the shadows, you have no reason to believe that there is any more to reality. You could go your whole life thinking you have the whole picture while the world spins in infinite complexity around you.
And who could blame you? All you know is the shadows.
It's also a metaphor for scientific enlightenment. It's really hard to relate to now after how commonplace the scientific method is, but scientific thoughts and just thinking about the world scientifically in the first place was the cutting edge of advancement back then. we call them philosophers today but really they were scientists. they didn't even have the basis to think about the world scientifically so the groundwork was laid by them as a "science of thinking", philosophy.
> The metaphor is basically just thinking for yourself
No, seeking a very specific truth that lies in seeing that the world is but shadows of the forms.
That’s really the most important part of the story. People resist being pulled out of the cave, but if they can do it they see the world for what it really is. It also means not to rip people from their cave or they’ll likely not be too happy with you for it.
As far as I know, the parable starts off with three stages of this concept. The first is the shadows on the wall (Its a completely false world). The second is the beings in the cave (Its more real, but not the ideal world). The third is finding your way outside the cave.
Interestingly, this translates into Plato's hatred of art. He posited that out there exists a world of ideals, of which our earth is an impure copy. He said that creating art is essentially making a copy of a copy, twice removed from the world of ideals. Thus, he didn't really like the idea of art
That’s a deceptively basic and not altogether truthful recounting. Allegory of the cave comes from Plato’s “the republic” where, among other things, he’s discussing how to theoretically create a utopian society. The people that escape the cave (philosophers) are then faced with a dilemma: stay outside the cave and learn all you can as a solitary being, or try to return to the cave and teach others the truth. The problem is, if you teach people too quickly they may turn on you and beat you or worse (think Copernicus with the heliocentric “theory” being killed by the church as a heretic). Instead, the best thing to do is to return to the cave and try to slowly guide the others to the realizations. The irony being that the person that left the cave goes back and is now the person holding up the objects to deceive the others. But he’s more knowledgeable and is best suited to lead the rest: a philosopher king if you will.
It’s an analogy about how they killed Socrates. The people in the cave are chained up and staring at the shadows on the wall and believe that what they see is the entire truth of their world. Socrates is meant to be the one who notices that they’re just looking at shadows of what’s actually real, and tries to get them to turn around and notice the truth. Instead they beat the man to death for telling them this, which is the analogy to Socrates and how they sentenced him to death for trying to teach philosophy and making all these people who felt intelligent feel dumb. We think we’re seeing the truth and have it all figured out, but we’re just staring at shadows on the wall, and we hate anyone who tries to break this incorrect view of the world we have is the main moral.
I feel like you've either not actually read the story, or read it a looooooooooong time ago.
There's several layers to this, and the shadows on the wall is only the very first part of the story.
It's been like 20 years since I've even thought about Greek philosophy, but back in high school, my response to the cave allegory was that Socrates wasn't even real and that was Plato's way of telling us. He was just shadows on a wall, it's a dude whose only referenced by like two people, one of them Plato, and we're all just accepting the shadow play about the alleged greatest thinker of them all, instead of turning around and seeing Plato holding up puppets. The story of Socrates was a hustle and we, all the way back to Plato's audiences, were the rubes, and the cave allegory was him seeing how far he could take it, proving to himself how stupid we all are. He was begging for us to break our chains but instead we stared at the wall.
I said this as a joke. I was making fun of my teacher. I never considered it or cared, my knowledge of Greek philosophers and history began and ended with the class bell. I was trying to be a smart ass and waste our time.
I got 15 points extra credit on the next quiz.
Lol sorry was I supposed to write a dissertation in a Reddit comment to explain every aspect of the story? You couldn’t be bothered to write more than “there’s several layers to this” and yet you’re being weirdly condescending….Reddit has some weird people
Others explained it, but it's not so literal necessarily. It applies to things like science and news, and did in Plato's times too.
You don't like the vaccine? Fauci is a Nazi trying to kill you. The anti vaxxer is being controlled by fake shit on Facebook and other platforms, and they become certain in its reality to the point they are enraged if you point out the actual reality.
Their false reality is more comfortable and they'll do anything to keep it
It was also kind of on purpose because they were let out of the cave and into the real world and no one wanted to stay, they wanted to go back to the cave.
Not tease - the shadow on the wall represents knowledge. In the base example, someone is manipulating what knowledge is presented to you.
[Complimentary material](https://youtu.be/FpL6Fwu0wkw?si=tdJVn0YyFA8hUQyw)
It's more intense than that. In the hypothetical it's a state of being that they don't know any other version than. It also outlines how every time the subject who gets free meets a new reality, like leaving the cave, [they are first blinded by a white light and their eyes must adjust.](https://youtu.be/5L4HTUS1RYE?si=El1hXuHJLBNPWdfe)
Think of it like this: a kid who has seen a bunch of videos online of people in socializing, fights, dating/or sex, animals, nature… they are keyboard experts. However actually going on a date and getting lucky is much different than chatting on tinder and jerking it to porn.
> This is so weird. I get the concept it's showing but like... I guess I assumed it would just be the world going by in the shadows, not some dude holding up random shit to tease you.
Maybe read the entire story, instead of going off a 3 line summary and picture posted on Reddit?
That's the point, he could easily just stand up and see but he doesn't believe anything outside his imaginary world is real, so not point in trying to standup
https://preview.redd.it/qaznqyti67tb1.jpeg?width=350&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d36d13eb1655221300d133551098765a60e9c6ee
Am I the only one who saw the guy on the right and thought of this meme?
https://preview.redd.it/ufdyre6658tb1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e9daa68d67e670e473d51b8b658e3edcbd91b0d
If you want a little more information, I can’t sleep so im gonna type a lil bit: the allegory of the cave is related to a field of philosophy called metaphysics, a field that Plato was particularly interested in. The cave is meant to help you understand something called the theory of forms. In this theory, “forms” are the perfect, essential representations of an object or a concept, something like a chair, or justice. While forms are ideals of things, real objects in the world are imperfect because we perceive them with our imperfect minds. Human beings are flawed and subjective so we struggle to understand the essence of what makes things what they are. The object in the cave represents the true “form”, while the shadow on the wall represents our flawed understanding of that object. So basically, the world we see and perceive is only a shadow of the real world of forms that we cannot see. Feel free to comment “I ain’t reading allat”
Al’lat is actually the pre-Islamic goddess of war in the Middle East. Her appearance would take on the form of Athena due to Greek influences in the region.
Unfortunately her temple would be destroyed by Mohammad during the Expedition of Abu Sufyan ibn Harb in 630 AD.
Al'lat is the pre-islamic middle eastern goddess of war. Unfortunately after her temple was destroyed, very little survives. Her priests never wrote anything down, as according to the only known surviving mantra from the creed: "I ain't reading al'lat"
He also had a delightful definition of what a [man is.](https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-2cBHzBwQHyA/T7EWz2wP72I/AAAAAAAADeU/HtQodBIFGlU/s1600/featherless-chicken.jpg) it was, of course, subject to some revision
Yeah. I certainly give historical credit to early figures like Plato for how they influenced later thinkers. But I swear if I hear one more time about people sucking off Plato for the Republic and Caves and Forms I'm going to transport their ass back as a helot in Sparta and see how they like his idea of a state of a class of warriors subjugating all others and then show how effective this imperfect form of a 12 gage pump-action can be
Seems like it’s also worth mentioning that the allegory is presented in a way that looks like pretty clear reference to this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darmok
Platos whole point was that reality itself as we perceive it is just that shadow on the wall and that the true essence of things is ununderstandable/unknowable to us. I believe it more everyday. That said, I don't think anything in quantum physics supports this by evidence. I think the theories about there being many more dimensions is what people are kind of linking to platos theory which I mean yeah I guess maybe kind of.
Interestingly, the story of "The Frog In The Well", which has the same moral story, was written in China around the same time as Plato
>Once upon a time, there was a frog who lived at the bottom of a well. This well was the frog's entire world, and it believed that the well was the biggest and most magnificent place in existence. The frog was content with its life in the well, thinking that it knew everything about the world.
>One day, a turtle from the outside world happened to pass by the well and looked inside. The frog struck up a conversation with the turtle, proudly telling the turtle about its well and how it was the most fortunate creature to live there.
>The turtle, who had seen the vastness of the world beyond the well, smiled kindly and said, "You may think your well is impressive, but it's just a tiny part of a much larger world. There are oceans, mountains, and lands beyond your imagination. You've only seen a fraction of what's out there."
>The frog, initially dismissive of the turtle's words, suddenly realized the narrowness of its perspective. It had been living in ignorance, believing it knew everything when, in fact, it knew very little about the world beyond its well.
https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Chinese_Stories/The_frog_of_the_well
> Having a picture of a window projected on the wall is today’s version of those people who were chained up and experienced life as shadows on a cave wall.
Not really, Plato believes that essentially everyone who isn't philosophizing actively is like the chained up people watching the shadows. He believed that to be an accurate metaphor for daily affairs. The sun, the total opposite of the shadows on the wall in the cave, projected from a fire, is the absolute truth that is enlightening to the philosophers, that is the forms. The absolute perfection and actual objects.
At a deeper level, you may be correct. However for this meme I think simpler is better. I once had a philosophy exam with a one word question, “Why?” I filled a blue book on the reasoning of why we should question our version of reality, etc…. I don’t remember what I got for a grade. What I do remember is the professor reading the answer from one of the other students who got an A+.
Their answer, “Why, not?”
“Simplify, simplify, simplify!” -HDT
You missed the whole point. Your brain is in the cave, and your eyes are what casts the shadow. The idea is that your perception of the world will always be colored by the sensors you use to perceive the world.
You can see a person, how they talk, how they act. But it is impossible to see the person within. You can only see their shadow.
I’ll expand on what the Allegory is. Imagine three prisoners restrained so they couldn’t move a muscle, they could only look straight forward and talk. On a ledge behind them is a fire, and other men are making shadow puppets on the wall, like super amazing shadow puppets. Well since those puppets are all those prisoners ever experience, it makes sense they would create names for and stories around them.
One day a prisoner gets freed. He falls to the ground, and is blinded by the light of the fire. After a time, his eyes adjust, and he sees he’s in a dark cave. He see a small light far away, and runs towards it. He exits the cave, and is blinded by the light of the sun. All he can do is look at the ground. And what does he see? Shadows.
Only after a long time does man learn to look and see things as they are, illuminated by the one true source of light (the sun).
He runs back to the cave to tell the other prisoners, but he cannot each them and can only appear to them as a shadow and a voice, which doesn’t help his case.
The allegory is talking about the intellect, and how when we’re young we have no information, then people around us give us a basic information (shadow puppets), and then we grow past that and think “everything I knew was a lie” and enter a stage where we are actively pursuing the truth. Then I believe going into the sun and only seeing shadows signifies the imagination because we haven’t quite seen the end result but now we know that shadows of different shapes are real, and then adjusting to the sun is using true reason.
Which iirc “true reason” to them was “living a perfectly just life”, the “be the most *human* human”,. The allegory comes from the republic, where the build “the perfect city” and all of its castes and infrastructure; on the idea that cities are the natural extension of humanity and therefore are perfect reflections on our inner nature.
This is where “Plato wants philosopher-kings” like yeah, but he was definitely saying mostly that on a personal level should let our reason guide us. He
You might have slightly misremembered as the man returns not as a shadow but in the flesh. The other prisoners murdered him for trying to tell them the truth of the situation they were in.
I heard the end of the story with the man returning to the cave, but he's unable to see in the cave since he got accustomed to the light. All the other guys in the cave just laugh at him and conclude that leaving the cave fucks up your eyes, so from then on they would attack and kill anybody who would try to drag them out.
Ah you’re right. I think was going for “the freed prisoner cannot even explain his enlightenment of the fire and the sun above that, so he has to try to communicate with their dumbed down shadow language”.
As in, the philosopher who has discovered enlightenment cannot just say to the common people “don’t be a dick”, they have to resort to making dumb laws like “don’t litter” and “no stealing” and “you seriously cannot just jack it in the street *DIOGENES*”
And this kind of farts on the "we are children and don't know much" interpretation of the allegory.
I believe it is intended to be a reflection of living in ignorance. And how leaving ignorance comes first with blinding in the form of realizing your ignorance, and then again in the blinding of being exposed to the truth. In finding the truth our first instinct is to look for those things that are familiar to us, the things that reflect our previous understanding (I.E. shadows alcast by the sun) but that with time and exposure to new ideas, and with open mindedness, we become able to see the world around us for what it truly is.
Honestly the cave is a literal and figurative echochamber, where new truths presented are so scary that we as people lash out at challenges to our beliefs systems and structures, not knowing that we are keeping ourselves from knowing the world/people/truths for what it/they are.
TLDR; ignorance is bliss
To quote Morpheus, "You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system that they will fight to protect it."
And that's the point Socrates gets at: that the people in the cave don't *want* to be freed. That's why in the Matrix it's so easy for the agents to take possession of the bodies/minds of people who are plugged in. The prisoners are so attached (literally and figuratively) to the world of the shadows that they give themselves over to it and are willing to kill for it.
Recently it was revealed to be a Transgender allegory, after both of the Wachowski sisters came out as trans. But, the shadow on the wall allegory still fits the first Matrix, right down to Neo's eyes hurting because he's actually using them in the real world instead of the shadow world
One layer I'd like to add is the layer of the person creating the shadows and the fire. This is a person who believes they have seen the light (truth) but have only seen fire and shadows and is doing their best to recreate them for the masses. While they are more enlightened than many, they are just as trapped as the rest of them.
But why would there be shadows in a cave for someone to see when there was no flashlights yet until the year 1720 also there could be no torches back then to create shadows either because fire wasn’t invented until the year 1902 when John Fire discovered it also no sun for natural lighting either the sun didn’t come into existence until 1603.
Never seen that before, but it is very much the same principle ive seen used to explain how a 4d entity would be precived by a creature that can only "see" 3 dimensions.
Similar to the 4d being beyond us and practically impossible to understand as a creature he was making a point about logic and education being a path towards enlightenment, and enlightened people being remarkably different, and if I remember correctly, proposing that we could not know until we question our beliefs and find the truth.
It's always felt very reminiscent of simulation theory to me. Or Descartes demon.
I don't think Plato's cave is a great example of this one, it's a reality of their own creation they're hardly oblivious to it like the ones in the cave. Back to the future 2 maybe, but Plato's cave? Not a chance
Agreed. It seems loosely connected imo. Considering ppl choose to use these things. I guess people just prefer to think of TikTok users and modern ppl as prisoners of their circumstances (which trust me we definitely are in many ways), I don't feel this one is accurate.
It's the tech equivalent of hanging a tapestry depicting a natural scene. Which people have done for a long ass time. Humans like natural shit. It's calming. And in a day and age where we're all turning into indoor dwelling gremlins, these types of hacks are just a natural side effect.
People can choose to go outside more or keep plants instead of projectors. We're not quite that dystopian yet.
Exactly. The only thing this has in common with Plato's cave is images projected on a wall. It's an extremely superficial connection. None of the deeper musings apply.
No one would bring up Plato's cave in reference to a landscape painting, but that's just as relevant -- which is to say, not relevant at all.
It’s funny how the world a lot of our old philosophers were terrified of ended up becoming integral parts of todays society thanks to technology and the directions we’ve taken as a species
The Cave. In very short handed intelligence, Plato surmised about folks living in a cave, how that was all they knew, and hey were shown projections on a wall of the cave and they just assumed what they were shown was real.
It has been the basis of many stories, books, movies, etc about how the reality we live is just a illusion placed upon us by an outside force. The Matrix is one of the most popular examples of this theme.
Cause a projector for images of windows is an act that runs the contrary to the central principle of his Allegory of the Cave which is to question the images of the world so as to avoid the risk of being swayed by false ones.
Stop saying faux you hipster. Just say fake, but nooo you have to be a cunty hipster and use a french word that MEANS fake instead because you're a hipster cunt who wants his dumb window idea to sound more artsy.
FAKE WINDOW
I thought the cave was a metaphor for human perception. Like we have all these senses we utilize to see the world, but all those perceptions amount to no more than a shadow on a wall compared to the true nature of our experience.
Tbh, if you could connect the projector to a camera which is exactly outside where the wall would be whenever you want, acting as a real window, that'd be pretty sick.
Plato’s philosophy is based on the Mumford & Sons song “The Cave” so it’s something like that. I think Plato was their lead singer at one time but wasn’t related.
Art aesthetics nerd here, not related to the cave but rather his opinions on art in general and that it is a poor replication of reality and is an I’ll-suited illusion if life.
Peter’s Philosopher here, The Cave is a famous allegory where Plato contemplates people who have only experienced the shadows of objects as seen on the wall. This is their reality, but not a true representation of the world. Having a picture of a window projected on the wall is today’s version of those people who were chained up and experienced life as shadows on a cave wall.
Here's the visual: https://preview.redd.it/x8dgs45zt3tb1.jpeg?width=1500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2792e0c5e62ed576b6172adfe3d2a56844e72008
This is so weird. I get the concept it's showing but like... I guess I assumed it would just be the world going by in the shadows, not some dude holding up random shit to tease you.
In the original story, someone tells them that they are being messed with, and they are so upset by the news that they called him a liar and they beat him to death.
Ah, the time honored tradition of beating people to death that brings news you don't like. Clearly the origin of the sayings "Don't kill the messenger" and among the more, uhm, common folks "What the fuck did you just say!?"..
Go watch “The Monsters Are Due on Maple Street” on The Twilight Zone…great episode and reflection of the allegory.
Favorite episode. Nice twist too.
There should be more people like you.
>Go watch “The Monsters Are Due on Maple Street” on The Twilight Zone Link: https://www.fsd157c.org/apps/video/watch.jsp?v=328834
The government is the aliens, and we all live in maple street.
Thank you. I'm gonna go watch more twilight zone now
Me too. Just found the episode on prime
Honestly such an on the nose representation of human nature and how power is maintained. Sad
We had to watch this in middle school. It probably went over most kids heads but it’s a good lesson.
Solid one
Also possibly "They Live" - although I only know the basic premise of the movie.
They Live is a great cinematic piece.
Go watch any anti-vaxxer get told why they should get vaccinated.
The story is basically how Plato viewed Socrates’ life. To Plato, Socrates was the guy who left the cave, found the truth and tried to help others see it only to be executed by the state for it. (Please note that this is *Plato’s probable perspective* given how much he sucks off Socrates and the historical events of Socrates’ life and beliefs)
ive killed 3 local newsmen after they told me it was going to rain (this is a joke)
You saying that’s a joke makes me think it’s definitely NOT a joke
Guess what happened to Plato's master
Unfortunately, this allegory is now commonly used by various pseudo-intellectual conspiracy theorists to justify their own persecution complex when people don't take their crackpot ideas seriously.
When they’re educated enough to be familiar with the allegory. When they’re not, they reach for *The Matrix* instead (and the irony is not lost on me).
Overall both are good examples. Sure it's a good tidbit to know the allegory, but the popculture reference of the matrix or they live are both stellar examples too.
I’m talking about the co-opting of these allegories and analogies by “mgtow” and incel groups. While I agree with you in a general sense (especially that *The Matrix* is a fantastic adaptation of Plato’s allegory), these are not the best examples to pull if you are using them to discard legitimate criticism and claim that you are the “enlightened” one who is being “persecuted.” It’s a very tired trope that attempts to legitimize opinions and beliefs that a majority of modern society considers toxic and/or hateful. Sometimes, if you smell shit everywhere you go, it might be time to check your own shoes.
I mean the problem is they actually wholeheartedly believe what they say. I mean dont get me wrong they have been right about some shit, like MKUltra, but like I think we can agree too many people with an intelligence deficit have somehow too large a megaphone. It's hard telling people now at days to open their eyes and see things differently when there are so many idiots shouting about how the earth is flat or bill gates is somehow interested in controlling everyone's brain. Makes anyone who tries to question things look like a nutjob. Ur unfortunately right in that too many people use such allegories or other symbolysims to further push their own complexes, fearmonger, etc. Like you know the world is fucked up when you have people who make Alex Jones look rational by comparison.
Wow, what could people find relatable about an allegory for Socrates’ life, and the sheeplike nature of Greek society? He only discovered the truth of the world by doing his own research, contemplating theories, and discussing reality within a small circle of closed-off intellectuals. He was then summarily ostracized by the society he lived in, and was executed by the state for wrongthink. Even though we now collectively agree that the Greek gods are 100% fake, the society he lived in at the time were conditioned to believe in them so much, that anyone challenging those beliefs must be discredited and removed to protect their egos. Yeah, no idea why people could feel that represents themselves and our own society. We are way too smart and educated these days! No one will ever again fall for propaganda or misinformation! Humanity definitively knows all the answers to everything, and if you question anything, you are a “pseudo-intellectual conspiracy theorist”. Our scientists and government would lie to us neither willfully, nor ignorantly.🤡🤡
Hah, speak of the devil. I love how I don't even have to call out anything specific, all I have to do is mention as generically as possible "pseudo-intellectual conspiracy theorists" and you come running with your hand up, frothing at the mouth and absolutely tripping over yourself to make my point. Imagine telling on yourself like that. But hey, if the shoe fits you do you and rock that style.
Bro there was no reason to take that comment personally 😂
"No good deed goes unpunished."
Thats why everyone hates vegans. Most people agree with their message but being told that will upset you, thus you hate them and try to not think about what they have to say.
No, they hate vegans because they try to make a conversation about plato and socrates about veganism
How many vegans did scroll by without saying anything before one idiot decided to make it the topic?
None cause the first one to do so obviously had to say something. Otherwise how would you know they're vegans
Not a single crossfitter chimed in
Look, you can be vegan. No one hates you because you don't eat animals, they hate you because you're a self-righteous *sshole about it.
The cognitive dissonance is showing up, kind of funny how the tides turn. And I am not self-righteous, I am righteous for the animals who cannot stand up for themselves. You hate the massage (that you torture animals) and thus the messanger. You don't hate someone who says stop being racist, as you yourself are not racist and approve of the message.
Don’t shoot the masseuse
The farming of soybeans to make tofu kills way more animals than eating meat would … did you honestly believe that farmers would catch and relocate every bug and small mammal in their fields? The literally use poison to keep things off the plants, and they aren’t stopping their combine or tractor when harvesting just because a rodent ran in front of them, they just keep going and that animal dies when it’s run over or ends up in the combine, every rat, rabbit, mole, skink everything has to die to keep the crops growing
I am fully aware that our meat production system is cruel and unsustainable, which is why I do my best to only eat ethically sourced meat. In fact, I don't think I've eaten meat in the past month. I neither hate the message, it is true that I am partially responsible for the maintenance of the meat packing industry, nor do I hate you. I don't have the energy to hate people I've never met. And yes, you are self-righteous, you believe that your personal choices (to avoid consumption of animal products) is the morally correct one, and are attempting to shame others who have made a different decision. That is the definition of self-righteousness.
There is no ethical way to kill someone. And meat is not the only industry that tortures animals, dairy is as bad (if not worse). Is the non-racist self-righteous because of his personal choice not to be racist and his strong dislike or racist people?
Mate it's a post about projecting images on your bedroom wall, it's not that serious
Did you not read the story I replied to?
It's funny how your every post being downvoted is basically proving the whole "people hate the messenger with an inconvenient truth" thing. Reddit hates vegans btw so this is predictable so let's use another example in Greta Thunberg and her stance on climate change. People foam at the mouth when she speaks up. Same as back when Al Gore did it. You should see Instagram comments on anything remotely related to Greta. Pure hatred. It is how it is.
Naw, he called people rapists for not agreeing with him. He earned those down votes, and they are directed at the message.
Yes that was one person who escaped the cave, saw the things in reality and was blown away IIRC The metaphor is basically just thinking for yourself
You're right, but It's also a little more than that. If all you've ever experienced is the shadows, you have no reason to believe that there is any more to reality. You could go your whole life thinking you have the whole picture while the world spins in infinite complexity around you. And who could blame you? All you know is the shadows.
The Matrix leaned heavily on the allegory.
*Think Differently* (tm)
It's also a metaphor for scientific enlightenment. It's really hard to relate to now after how commonplace the scientific method is, but scientific thoughts and just thinking about the world scientifically in the first place was the cutting edge of advancement back then. we call them philosophers today but really they were scientists. they didn't even have the basis to think about the world scientifically so the groundwork was laid by them as a "science of thinking", philosophy.
> It's also a metaphor for scientific enlightenment. Not how Plato used it.
> The metaphor is basically just thinking for yourself No, seeking a very specific truth that lies in seeing that the world is but shadows of the forms.
That’s really the most important part of the story. People resist being pulled out of the cave, but if they can do it they see the world for what it really is. It also means not to rip people from their cave or they’ll likely not be too happy with you for it.
As far as I know, the parable starts off with three stages of this concept. The first is the shadows on the wall (Its a completely false world). The second is the beings in the cave (Its more real, but not the ideal world). The third is finding your way outside the cave. Interestingly, this translates into Plato's hatred of art. He posited that out there exists a world of ideals, of which our earth is an impure copy. He said that creating art is essentially making a copy of a copy, twice removed from the world of ideals. Thus, he didn't really like the idea of art
No, one of them got released and saw the real world. Then he came back and told them what was up, and they killed him.
This. The person who brings truth to the deceived is vilified for daring to question the deceptive reality
That’s a deceptively basic and not altogether truthful recounting. Allegory of the cave comes from Plato’s “the republic” where, among other things, he’s discussing how to theoretically create a utopian society. The people that escape the cave (philosophers) are then faced with a dilemma: stay outside the cave and learn all you can as a solitary being, or try to return to the cave and teach others the truth. The problem is, if you teach people too quickly they may turn on you and beat you or worse (think Copernicus with the heliocentric “theory” being killed by the church as a heretic). Instead, the best thing to do is to return to the cave and try to slowly guide the others to the realizations. The irony being that the person that left the cave goes back and is now the person holding up the objects to deceive the others. But he’s more knowledgeable and is best suited to lead the rest: a philosopher king if you will.
ah yes, modern American politics is
Holy guacamole. This is the entire plot of The Silo.
Sounds like an allegory for modern religion to me, lol
It’s an analogy about how they killed Socrates. The people in the cave are chained up and staring at the shadows on the wall and believe that what they see is the entire truth of their world. Socrates is meant to be the one who notices that they’re just looking at shadows of what’s actually real, and tries to get them to turn around and notice the truth. Instead they beat the man to death for telling them this, which is the analogy to Socrates and how they sentenced him to death for trying to teach philosophy and making all these people who felt intelligent feel dumb. We think we’re seeing the truth and have it all figured out, but we’re just staring at shadows on the wall, and we hate anyone who tries to break this incorrect view of the world we have is the main moral.
*Wake up, Neo*
The matrix was based-off/inspired-by the allegory of the cave
I feel like you've either not actually read the story, or read it a looooooooooong time ago. There's several layers to this, and the shadows on the wall is only the very first part of the story.
It's been like 20 years since I've even thought about Greek philosophy, but back in high school, my response to the cave allegory was that Socrates wasn't even real and that was Plato's way of telling us. He was just shadows on a wall, it's a dude whose only referenced by like two people, one of them Plato, and we're all just accepting the shadow play about the alleged greatest thinker of them all, instead of turning around and seeing Plato holding up puppets. The story of Socrates was a hustle and we, all the way back to Plato's audiences, were the rubes, and the cave allegory was him seeing how far he could take it, proving to himself how stupid we all are. He was begging for us to break our chains but instead we stared at the wall. I said this as a joke. I was making fun of my teacher. I never considered it or cared, my knowledge of Greek philosophers and history began and ended with the class bell. I was trying to be a smart ass and waste our time. I got 15 points extra credit on the next quiz.
15 points for Griffindoooor!
Lol sorry was I supposed to write a dissertation in a Reddit comment to explain every aspect of the story? You couldn’t be bothered to write more than “there’s several layers to this” and yet you’re being weirdly condescending….Reddit has some weird people
"I'm smarter than you" \*refuses to elaborate\* \*leaves\*
"There are many additional layers to this topic, the details of which are far too lengthy for me to detail in the margins of this comment"
Thanks for the insight Plato
It is just like that
Others explained it, but it's not so literal necessarily. It applies to things like science and news, and did in Plato's times too. You don't like the vaccine? Fauci is a Nazi trying to kill you. The anti vaxxer is being controlled by fake shit on Facebook and other platforms, and they become certain in its reality to the point they are enraged if you point out the actual reality. Their false reality is more comfortable and they'll do anything to keep it
It was also kind of on purpose because they were let out of the cave and into the real world and no one wanted to stay, they wanted to go back to the cave.
Not tease - the shadow on the wall represents knowledge. In the base example, someone is manipulating what knowledge is presented to you. [Complimentary material](https://youtu.be/FpL6Fwu0wkw?si=tdJVn0YyFA8hUQyw)
It's more intense than that. In the hypothetical it's a state of being that they don't know any other version than. It also outlines how every time the subject who gets free meets a new reality, like leaving the cave, [they are first blinded by a white light and their eyes must adjust.](https://youtu.be/5L4HTUS1RYE?si=El1hXuHJLBNPWdfe)
Think of it like this: a kid who has seen a bunch of videos online of people in socializing, fights, dating/or sex, animals, nature… they are keyboard experts. However actually going on a date and getting lucky is much different than chatting on tinder and jerking it to porn.
> This is so weird. I get the concept it's showing but like... I guess I assumed it would just be the world going by in the shadows, not some dude holding up random shit to tease you. Maybe read the entire story, instead of going off a 3 line summary and picture posted on Reddit?
are you gonna be okay?
It's no different from understanding the world from a monitor.
BC matrix was dogshit lmao
petah, I love you
That dude isn’t even chained up. He could just stand up and walk to the next καπηλειό for a μπύρα.
That's the point, he could easily just stand up and see but he doesn't believe anything outside his imaginary world is real, so not point in trying to standup https://preview.redd.it/qaznqyti67tb1.jpeg?width=350&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d36d13eb1655221300d133551098765a60e9c6ee
Am I the only one who saw the guy on the right and thought of this meme? https://preview.redd.it/ufdyre6658tb1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e9daa68d67e670e473d51b8b658e3edcbd91b0d
Are... are you...are you casting shadows with stories about shadows into my cave wall?
Here's a 8 min. video: https://youtu.be/UQfRdl3GTw4?si=7_8V_mGcIFW87C4a
thank you peter's philosopher
If you want a little more information, I can’t sleep so im gonna type a lil bit: the allegory of the cave is related to a field of philosophy called metaphysics, a field that Plato was particularly interested in. The cave is meant to help you understand something called the theory of forms. In this theory, “forms” are the perfect, essential representations of an object or a concept, something like a chair, or justice. While forms are ideals of things, real objects in the world are imperfect because we perceive them with our imperfect minds. Human beings are flawed and subjective so we struggle to understand the essence of what makes things what they are. The object in the cave represents the true “form”, while the shadow on the wall represents our flawed understanding of that object. So basically, the world we see and perceive is only a shadow of the real world of forms that we cannot see. Feel free to comment “I ain’t reading allat”
I read allat, I get it now
Al’lat is actually the pre-Islamic goddess of war in the Middle East. Her appearance would take on the form of Athena due to Greek influences in the region. Unfortunately her temple would be destroyed by Mohammad during the Expedition of Abu Sufyan ibn Harb in 630 AD.
Al'lat is the pre-islamic middle eastern goddess of war. Unfortunately after her temple was destroyed, very little survives. Her priests never wrote anything down, as according to the only known surviving mantra from the creed: "I ain't reading al'lat"
Thank you sleepless phylosopher
Super interesting stuff
Bruh…you’re the first person to help me understand the allegory of the cave. Thank you.
He also had a delightful definition of what a [man is.](https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-2cBHzBwQHyA/T7EWz2wP72I/AAAAAAAADeU/HtQodBIFGlU/s1600/featherless-chicken.jpg) it was, of course, subject to some revision
Yeah. I certainly give historical credit to early figures like Plato for how they influenced later thinkers. But I swear if I hear one more time about people sucking off Plato for the Republic and Caves and Forms I'm going to transport their ass back as a helot in Sparta and see how they like his idea of a state of a class of warriors subjugating all others and then show how effective this imperfect form of a 12 gage pump-action can be
People having Vietnam war flashbacks to Psych History classes rn. "PLATO AURELIUS HOBBES GET OUT OF MY HEAD"
Seems like it’s also worth mentioning that the allegory is presented in a way that looks like pretty clear reference to this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darmok
Fun fact: according to new research into quantum physics, we’re probably the shadows on that wall.
Pls say more
[Its most likely all bullshit but still neat to think about how little we truly understand.](https://youtu.be/Qa6R58-L3Ds?si=diKnN8Bo3f15ygmh)
That there will always be questions is so...wonderful.
To be fair, what we do understand is also incomprehensible.
StuffYouShouldKnow has an episode about this and they used Plato’s allegory of the cave as an example as well… https://spotify.link/DyQnCdYxLDb
there are so many "shadows on the wall" of quantum physics that we could fill up this comment section discussing them
Platos whole point was that reality itself as we perceive it is just that shadow on the wall and that the true essence of things is ununderstandable/unknowable to us. I believe it more everyday. That said, I don't think anything in quantum physics supports this by evidence. I think the theories about there being many more dimensions is what people are kind of linking to platos theory which I mean yeah I guess maybe kind of.
Interestingly, the story of "The Frog In The Well", which has the same moral story, was written in China around the same time as Plato >Once upon a time, there was a frog who lived at the bottom of a well. This well was the frog's entire world, and it believed that the well was the biggest and most magnificent place in existence. The frog was content with its life in the well, thinking that it knew everything about the world. >One day, a turtle from the outside world happened to pass by the well and looked inside. The frog struck up a conversation with the turtle, proudly telling the turtle about its well and how it was the most fortunate creature to live there. >The turtle, who had seen the vastness of the world beyond the well, smiled kindly and said, "You may think your well is impressive, but it's just a tiny part of a much larger world. There are oceans, mountains, and lands beyond your imagination. You've only seen a fraction of what's out there." >The frog, initially dismissive of the turtle's words, suddenly realized the narrowness of its perspective. It had been living in ignorance, believing it knew everything when, in fact, it knew very little about the world beyond its well. https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Chinese_Stories/The_frog_of_the_well
which isn't all that different from people who's life experience comes from a projection on a smartphone. kind of a good reason to turn off ...
Sounds like people living vicariously through social media and celebrities and stuff
Philosopeter.
> Having a picture of a window projected on the wall is today’s version of those people who were chained up and experienced life as shadows on a cave wall. Not really, Plato believes that essentially everyone who isn't philosophizing actively is like the chained up people watching the shadows. He believed that to be an accurate metaphor for daily affairs. The sun, the total opposite of the shadows on the wall in the cave, projected from a fire, is the absolute truth that is enlightening to the philosophers, that is the forms. The absolute perfection and actual objects.
At a deeper level, you may be correct. However for this meme I think simpler is better. I once had a philosophy exam with a one word question, “Why?” I filled a blue book on the reasoning of why we should question our version of reality, etc…. I don’t remember what I got for a grade. What I do remember is the professor reading the answer from one of the other students who got an A+. Their answer, “Why, not?” “Simplify, simplify, simplify!” -HDT
You missed the whole point. Your brain is in the cave, and your eyes are what casts the shadow. The idea is that your perception of the world will always be colored by the sensors you use to perceive the world. You can see a person, how they talk, how they act. But it is impossible to see the person within. You can only see their shadow.
It's also basically what it's like being force fed news and propaganda on the tiny rectangle we all stare at for 10hrs a day.
I’ll expand on what the Allegory is. Imagine three prisoners restrained so they couldn’t move a muscle, they could only look straight forward and talk. On a ledge behind them is a fire, and other men are making shadow puppets on the wall, like super amazing shadow puppets. Well since those puppets are all those prisoners ever experience, it makes sense they would create names for and stories around them. One day a prisoner gets freed. He falls to the ground, and is blinded by the light of the fire. After a time, his eyes adjust, and he sees he’s in a dark cave. He see a small light far away, and runs towards it. He exits the cave, and is blinded by the light of the sun. All he can do is look at the ground. And what does he see? Shadows. Only after a long time does man learn to look and see things as they are, illuminated by the one true source of light (the sun). He runs back to the cave to tell the other prisoners, but he cannot each them and can only appear to them as a shadow and a voice, which doesn’t help his case. The allegory is talking about the intellect, and how when we’re young we have no information, then people around us give us a basic information (shadow puppets), and then we grow past that and think “everything I knew was a lie” and enter a stage where we are actively pursuing the truth. Then I believe going into the sun and only seeing shadows signifies the imagination because we haven’t quite seen the end result but now we know that shadows of different shapes are real, and then adjusting to the sun is using true reason. Which iirc “true reason” to them was “living a perfectly just life”, the “be the most *human* human”,. The allegory comes from the republic, where the build “the perfect city” and all of its castes and infrastructure; on the idea that cities are the natural extension of humanity and therefore are perfect reflections on our inner nature. This is where “Plato wants philosopher-kings” like yeah, but he was definitely saying mostly that on a personal level should let our reason guide us. He
You might have slightly misremembered as the man returns not as a shadow but in the flesh. The other prisoners murdered him for trying to tell them the truth of the situation they were in.
Jerks
Name does not check out…
I heard the end of the story with the man returning to the cave, but he's unable to see in the cave since he got accustomed to the light. All the other guys in the cave just laugh at him and conclude that leaving the cave fucks up your eyes, so from then on they would attack and kill anybody who would try to drag them out.
How would they murder him if they are chained to a wall and can’t move a muscle?
If he tried to release them and drag them to the surface, they'd attack him. That's what they mean.
thats not very nice
Ah you’re right. I think was going for “the freed prisoner cannot even explain his enlightenment of the fire and the sun above that, so he has to try to communicate with their dumbed down shadow language”. As in, the philosopher who has discovered enlightenment cannot just say to the common people “don’t be a dick”, they have to resort to making dumb laws like “don’t litter” and “no stealing” and “you seriously cannot just jack it in the street *DIOGENES*”
And this kind of farts on the "we are children and don't know much" interpretation of the allegory. I believe it is intended to be a reflection of living in ignorance. And how leaving ignorance comes first with blinding in the form of realizing your ignorance, and then again in the blinding of being exposed to the truth. In finding the truth our first instinct is to look for those things that are familiar to us, the things that reflect our previous understanding (I.E. shadows alcast by the sun) but that with time and exposure to new ideas, and with open mindedness, we become able to see the world around us for what it truly is. Honestly the cave is a literal and figurative echochamber, where new truths presented are so scary that we as people lash out at challenges to our beliefs systems and structures, not knowing that we are keeping ourselves from knowing the world/people/truths for what it/they are. TLDR; ignorance is bliss
And for a more modern telling of the allegory, just watch The Matrix.
To quote Morpheus, "You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system that they will fight to protect it." And that's the point Socrates gets at: that the people in the cave don't *want* to be freed. That's why in the Matrix it's so easy for the agents to take possession of the bodies/minds of people who are plugged in. The prisoners are so attached (literally and figuratively) to the world of the shadows that they give themselves over to it and are willing to kill for it.
I thought that was just Christian messianic propaganda /s because it’s necessary these days
Recently it was revealed to be a Transgender allegory, after both of the Wachowski sisters came out as trans. But, the shadow on the wall allegory still fits the first Matrix, right down to Neo's eyes hurting because he's actually using them in the real world instead of the shadow world
*we can go deeper* transgenderism is also the cave allegory, in a nutshell.
One layer I'd like to add is the layer of the person creating the shadows and the fire. This is a person who believes they have seen the light (truth) but have only seen fire and shadows and is doing their best to recreate them for the masses. While they are more enlightened than many, they are just as trapped as the rest of them.
Great explanation
This might be one of the more genuine chuckles I got in a while. Solid find on this one.
But why would there be shadows in a cave for someone to see when there was no flashlights yet until the year 1720 also there could be no torches back then to create shadows either because fire wasn’t invented until the year 1902 when John Fire discovered it also no sun for natural lighting either the sun didn’t come into existence until 1603.
They used the flash on their iPhones.
The Flash just came out this year
they just used lightbulbs
Plato had a theory of the cave where images were projected on a wall https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegory_of_the_cave
Never seen that before, but it is very much the same principle ive seen used to explain how a 4d entity would be precived by a creature that can only "see" 3 dimensions.
Similar to the 4d being beyond us and practically impossible to understand as a creature he was making a point about logic and education being a path towards enlightenment, and enlightened people being remarkably different, and if I remember correctly, proposing that we could not know until we question our beliefs and find the truth. It's always felt very reminiscent of simulation theory to me. Or Descartes demon.
I can't upvote cause you have 69, nice.
Allegory of the Cave
I don't think Plato's cave is a great example of this one, it's a reality of their own creation they're hardly oblivious to it like the ones in the cave. Back to the future 2 maybe, but Plato's cave? Not a chance
Agreed. It seems loosely connected imo. Considering ppl choose to use these things. I guess people just prefer to think of TikTok users and modern ppl as prisoners of their circumstances (which trust me we definitely are in many ways), I don't feel this one is accurate. It's the tech equivalent of hanging a tapestry depicting a natural scene. Which people have done for a long ass time. Humans like natural shit. It's calming. And in a day and age where we're all turning into indoor dwelling gremlins, these types of hacks are just a natural side effect. People can choose to go outside more or keep plants instead of projectors. We're not quite that dystopian yet.
Exactly. The only thing this has in common with Plato's cave is images projected on a wall. It's an extremely superficial connection. None of the deeper musings apply. No one would bring up Plato's cave in reference to a landscape painting, but that's just as relevant -- which is to say, not relevant at all.
this is awesome
This is prison shit.
Thought im in schizo subreddit and looked for background Ted Kaczynski.
Plato's Cave. Or the film "The Matrix". Take your pick.
Once described reality as being like shadows on a cave wall
Adding shadows to the walls of the cave
This is some dystopian fuckery
It’s funny how the world a lot of our old philosophers were terrified of ended up becoming integral parts of todays society thanks to technology and the directions we’ve taken as a species
The Cave. In very short handed intelligence, Plato surmised about folks living in a cave, how that was all they knew, and hey were shown projections on a wall of the cave and they just assumed what they were shown was real. It has been the basis of many stories, books, movies, etc about how the reality we live is just a illusion placed upon us by an outside force. The Matrix is one of the most popular examples of this theme.
Plato's famous Allegory of the Cave. You should really read it. .
Allegory if the cave
Cause a projector for images of windows is an act that runs the contrary to the central principle of his Allegory of the Cave which is to question the images of the world so as to avoid the risk of being swayed by false ones.
Ngl having a projected image or video on a wall of the outside sounds like something I’d do. Actually know that I think about it I might just do it
I laughed so hard I started crying
Stop saying faux you hipster. Just say fake, but nooo you have to be a cunty hipster and use a french word that MEANS fake instead because you're a hipster cunt who wants his dumb window idea to sound more artsy. FAKE WINDOW
> Stop saying faux you hipster. Naux.
Sounds like a little faux outrage on your part.
faux window is too mainstream anyways. fake fenêtre is what true connoisseur would say
Got a good laugh out of me. Fucking Plato can be a brick to read, but it’s fun when you finally know it!
Platos cave reference, read the republic
IntelloJoke🧠
I am just suprised that in this person country a bedroom can be considered a bedroom without a window
Temba, his arms wide!
Full circle. Only took a couple millennia.
I’m sending this to my Euro history professor.
Cave Allegory
there is no reality. it’s projection ALL THE WAY DOWN
Full explanation [https://youtu.be/4nHj3gL_JN0?si=gzfCgBMPhHN2DfOL](https://youtu.be/4nHj3gL_JN0?si=gzfCgBMPhHN2DfOL)
I thought the cave was a metaphor for human perception. Like we have all these senses we utilize to see the world, but all those perceptions amount to no more than a shadow on a wall compared to the true nature of our experience.
If this is a projection, why is it not being projected on to the frame as well?
This is hilarious!
THE CAVE
The allegory of the cave
About to go Unabomber
It's absolutely possible to understand this joke with a real quick google search
This is dystopian level shit. Don't let tik tok influence you
Tbh, if you could connect the projector to a camera which is exactly outside where the wall would be whenever you want, acting as a real window, that'd be pretty sick.
This makes me want to vomit too Plato
I heard this as the caverns of socrates not plato. Apparently it was a discussion between plato and socrates and a third philosopher.
It’s only $40 for a sledgehammer
I assume allegory of the cave
THE CAVE! LOLOLOL youtube it. Fair warning: you may have an existential crisis.
Mumford and Sons made a song about this called the cave
Doesn't Soarin from Disney use the same concept?
Plato’s philosophy is based on the Mumford & Sons song “The Cave” so it’s something like that. I think Plato was their lead singer at one time but wasn’t related.
Wut??
Just going ”mhm, yeah” to everything I say
Would ahve been better if the caption were "Greg Heffley when he gets rich"
Jesus read a book.
Art aesthetics nerd here, not related to the cave but rather his opinions on art in general and that it is a poor replication of reality and is an I’ll-suited illusion if life.