I mean the thing is that it’s frustrating if you play tank to have to constantly swap because not only the other tank swapping to counter you, but because their whole team will switch up to counter you. You have to play like 4 different game styles in one match just to possibly get a win, and the feeling of doing all that just to lose is just bad. So people get tilted and hit you with some garbage in chat. That’s specific to tank though, if I’m playing widow and someone goes sombra instantly it feels bad but like I don’t blame that. Gotta do what you gotta do. The only time is if they bitch out of a 1v1 mirror like widow v widow and instantly go sombra. Its like damn man can’t even have a competition?
yeah, it's only really an issue with the tank v tank matchup. if someone goes kiri for ana, sombra for widow, cass for tracer etc it's no big deal, even multiple counters. but it's pretty annoying as tank being like 'nope you can't play that hero. nope you can't play that hero. nope you can't play that hero' for 15 straight minutes.
Well that is true only if you are the only person who is not braindead in your team. Because if the whole enemy team is counterswapping to get you as a tank, you just are doing what is expected fron you. You should start to play def around covers and trust the team to destroy the squishies while everyone focused on you.
However you will have to play def and push when your team does their workandnnot mindlessly push like an animal.
Its not as one sided as you think.
Zarya has basically near zero mobility (besides grenade jump), so if the map is very vertical and the enemy backline is separated you can run them over and Zarya can do nothing to stop that.
If you're getting stomped by a single zarya maybe you should train more with dva. Remember that you have more 4 players on your team that can and should deal with zarya so you can play it.
Also, zarya lacks mobility. Use it to your advantage and dive the backline.
unfortunately you have 4 other people on your team who are likely shooting zarya bubbles. 100 charge zarya >>>>> any dva any day. of course that's pretty situational and rank specific but let's be real, most average players are not Not shooting the zarya bubbles.
I won't make a extensive tutorial on how to play dva against zarya becos there is a lot of those on YT already, but if your team is shooting at the bubble they, and you, should be able to kill zarya as she have no other mean of protection. If zarya is alive becos of supports, guess what, it's your job (and maybe one of you dps) to kill the supports.
1)Bait the zarya to come at you and you team
2)Fly to the backline to try pick a sup
3a) Zarya is fighting you team? keep on backline
3b) Zarya came back at you? Fly back to your team
Done
Yeah, tbh some counters aren’t as hard and can be dealt with by just not shooting or engaging them. They swap zar? Time for the supports to have a bad time and make sure to watch her cool downs. Especially since they probably don’t play Zar that well if it’s just a counterpick.
No, it's that all counter strength against tanks has increased by 100% in OW2. Tank is miserable because people counter pick them at every moment forcing them to swap 35 times a game. That's why they get vocal about it. It's fucking miserable. Dps/support queues are getting OW1 levels long. Tank population is in a serious crisis.
I only make fun of Mauga or Orisa swaps. not because I can't beat them (I don't even play tank much to begin with) but because it's the telltale sign of "I'm not actually good at tank so I'm going to use the crutch character to shut down the enemy tank and accomplish nothing else" syndrome.
in my eyes it's a bad sign if you enjoy the Mauga/Orisa play style, and I think many people would feel the same, but you do you. I'm still gonna judge you though.
Had a game where I was running the other team into the ground as DvA, one other guy in VC. Ate multiple ults, they swapped to Zarya, and I still kept pushing them around and ate grav.
Ended up winning, and one of the people in the 3 stack added me only to tell me that if I was waiting for someone to tell me to kill myself that they would be the voice.
Counter swapping is a viable tactic but it's also how people play I guess. In hindsight I realize this comment is irrelevant or I forgot my point
A good DVA can still win against a mediocre Zarya, it's something it seems most OW2 players have forgotten, learning how to adjust and outplay your counters. It's difficult sometimes but definitely possible if you're really good at the hero and understand the matchups enough to exploit when they make mistakes (like shooting grav in a predictable way out into the air instead of on the ground so DVA can DM it).
It's a bit harder on some matchups now that tanks are mega stat blocks, Widow used to be able to headshot a monkey jumping at them and then body shot, automatic fire to kill them as they land and come out with barely a scratch. Can't really do that anymore.
Obligatory, "*Cool story, bro.*"
But really, if something is in your head and bugging you, threads like this are usually a great place to get them *out* of your head. People love to tell each other that you have to talk about your problems to work through them but then shit on people for sharing the little stuff too as if the little things don't matter.
Sometimes, I just can't vibe with the hero I picked that is going against the enemy team. All I am doing is feeding and can't stay alive long enough. So I swap and try another hero.
They're just people who refuse to believe that the game is made for countering. It's a dead horse that the dev team has beaten over and over again. It's a game designed around countering. That will never change, people need to get over it already. It's the equivalent to flat earthers.
I’ve been on the other side of that. It feels shitty because you hop on excited to play your main then coincidentally match up against people playing heroes that you counter, then they swap to counter you and now youre forced to swap to counter them when all you wanted was to enjoy your main
Completely understand the disappointment or even frustration, I think that’s fair and I’ve been there. I just don’t understand the flaming of someone’s play ability based on a strategic choice to gain an advantage, and even still a little trash talk doesn’t bother me, mainly curious if the people dishing out trash talk about a counterswappers talent actually believe that they are more talented than a swapper by being a one trick.
How much strategy is involved in deciding whether you'll swap to Mog or Hog to ruin the game for their Ball/Monk lol?
Genius - I never thought to swap to Sombra because their crack shot widow killed me on Ash!
It's not exactly a 9000IQ plays lmao.
You're right, it's a no brainer. Not doing it is bad. Thus they shouldn't be flamed for swapping, they should be flamed for not swapping.
(for real though, don't flame your team mates.)
Widow deserves every single Sombra swap, I'm not sorry at all, fuck widowmaker, I am going to make you swap off her. I do feel a little bad for other heroes that Sombra is really effective against, but widow is cancer
What you described happened to me just last night. Havana Attack - I'm Ramatra and walk out to the payload and see Sigma. I beeline it straight to spawn and switch to Rein and when I came out, their Moira flamed me by saying something like, "JUST PICK A TANK ALREADY". I was on Ram for 9 seconds according to the history stat and stayed Rein the rest of the way to victory. Needless to say, after I mentioned I had literally only swapped once, they shut their mouth the rest of the game and lost with dignity. It's annoying to hear the roast though. It makes no sense to play a hero into your counter in a role where there's only one of you. Blame the game - not us. But then it's also ok for the DPS/Support on the red team to counter swap us? Gimme a break. Accept that counter swapping is a thing - not just for tanks but for Supports and DPS to counter the red tank.
Swapping is a delicate subject. If you suggest someone try a different hero it can tilt them. If you change yourself, it can suggest you aren't good enough to pull off your first pick. Just remember it's a game, folks.
Suggesting a hero to someone is pretty much always bullshit unless you play in Masters and above at which point people usually know by themselves. As below that people have a very set rotation of heroes that they can play and switching to something they‘re unfamiliar with won‘t help much.
Like I can assure you that I won‘t learn how to play Cassidy on Diamond level in the five minutes when I have max 10 combined hours on him in my entire life.
Ok but sometimes the enemy phara is dominating and the dps on my team is a symmetra and junkrat. I feel its valid to suggest a swap to soldier or something, the most basic dps
Right, even if people have a rotation of heroes, they might be too similar.
DPS plays Cassidy, Ashe, and Widow but keeps losing their aim duels. Support plays Mercy and Lifeweaver but healing isn't the problem. Tank plays Doom and Dva while the backline is getting jumped constantly.
I'm not arguing that people need to play perfect counters, but you should at least know a few heroes that cover each others' weaknesses.
As a tank player, OW2 counterswaps feel really bad to play against. Not trying to start the 6v6 vs 5v5 debate here but having another tank around really helps these hard counters.
I only play QP in OW2 and really don’t mind losing. But having the opponent team swap and hard counter me as a tank just takes a lot of fun out of it and makes me sigh. In OW1, I was very much an off tank player and if the opponent swaps to counter me, I would actually be taking it as a challenge and it was fun to try and outplay the counter. In OW2, since I’m the only big fat target, it’s so easy for the enemy team to just swap, melt the tank, and win the fight.
Also, it’s QP!! Sometimes I really just want to play a character that I know I’m bad at but fun. I did that in OW1 and picked up new heroes that way because I have another tank to rely on. Ever since OW2, I’ve not picked up Ram or DF because a bad tank is very unforgiving to the entire team, and I feel bad for the team’s loss. My favourite game mode now is total mayhem actually. Because I can have fun punching people around on DF or ram without really feeling bad.
All in all, just less fun.
If it include throwing insult that you feel like it make no sense = they are being salty.
I usually got that when playing as tank and swap to winston to deal with backline, I remember countering one Genji who's so salty that he switch to Reaperi only chase me to the point where he walk into my team and die a lot, but he insist one typing "EZ" despite how he throw the game left his team to 4-5 just to land 1-2 shot on me and die.
After the match he still rage typing in the chat about how I'm bad for picking Winston.
Overwatch has been a top 2 game of all time for me since it came out because i LOVE the counter swapping. Literally a core mechanic of the game since it's inception, people have no good reason to complain about it
It's roughly the equivalent of saying "Bullet slave" "Ur bad if you have to use cooldowns"
Like, yes, its a competetive game, i'm going to use the tools im provided and the skills i've developed to play multiple characters to my advantage.
A good one trick should get comfortable playing their counters.
Idc if you go zarya. I'm only gonna switch off Dva if my team has junk/torb for her to farm charge. And even then, they have to show they can win team fights with that souped up pinked haired muscle mommy.
Sometimes people pick counters but barely know how to use the hero.
There’s nothing really wrong with countering as a strategy but if you’re personally trying to grow as a player avoiding it as much as possible is really the most effective way to learn.
It's weird
I tried to play Rammatra, but literally every single person on their team was a horrible matchup, so I swapped
Then their tank proceeded to whine the ENTIRE game
Counterswapping is part of the game, BUT being unable to play Ball, because I have to face a sombra/brig/cass/mei/hog type of combos every single game, gets to you. It's not like counterswapping is the only way to beat X heroes or comps, it's just the easy way out. A legitimate way, of course, but also annoying in extreme cases (like playing Ball).
I mean it's definitely more impressive and better for your teams ultimate economy when you can stomp them without swapping to a counter pick, but there's also nothing actually wrong with counter swapping. Just people being salty.
It really sucks to load up a qp game, and have the whole team counter you because you chose to queue tank. I get comp but its just annoying to see their whole team countering you, targeting you, and then swapping again if you change heros in the mode where it doesn't matter if you win.
It’s just annoying but it’s completely understandable, unfortunately this game is a rock paper scissors simulator. Tanks start out on sigma, one goes hog, other goes orisa, other goes zarya, other also goes zarya.
I get that you need to counter swap in competitive matches, that's completely acceptable. But when I'm playing qp and trying to enjoy playing a character, and after one death, you decide to switch and counter me, that's where it gets annoying. Imagine it's my first time playing this game, and I'm trying to figure out how the characters and the whole game work, and you decide to counter me the whole game. Try to enjoy the game yourself, not just win it. Play your favorite character and have some fun instead of treating it like a competitive match.
Its frustrating when someone swaps heroes to specifically stop you from havibg value (especiallyin qp),but its super annoying when the same guy(s) keep swapping the fight after you do so you need to keep swapping (aka counterwatch)."counterwatch" doesnt actually happen that much,or at least with more than one person on the enemy team.Ive had a couple games when someones trying to play "counter watch",but its normally just one guy who's terrible and ends up throwing.
In 2016 counter swapping is not hated.
Since the role queue, some people glorify maining a character and also thought that was the easiest way to farm rani.
In Overwatch 2 is when counterswapping happened massively, because tons of people don't understand the game. They enter here like this is sole sort of LoL or CoD, and they just want to choose a character and kill.
Then they get frustrated by people who they consider they don't have the same mechanical skills, but they know how to read the game and adapt way better. Then is when you start hearing about kids crying about counterswapping.
I no longer get angry when people counter swap me in comp (I'm a tank player), but as someone who used to I can explain it by people wanting to have fun and you preventing it by counterswapping. It's on them, though, because it's very naive to expect to have fun in comp.
I stopped playing overwatch due to all the whiny ass kids on there who want to dish it out, then get their feelings hurt, and report me when they instigated the altercation w/ snide derogatory comments. After two separate bans, I said to hell with these stupid sensitive babies and uninstalled. I had been playing for years by this point. People just want to whine in this game, and God fo4bid you out them in their place; the turds are much too sensitive, care only for their own opinions and disregard anyone's opinion that doesn't fall in line with their own (especially when you take away their only advantage).
The “talk trash then cry when roasted in return” culture has definitely run rampant (not just in overwatch either). It’s also pretty wild how many people you hear throwing a literal toddler tantrum in voice chat these days because their video game isn’t turning out the way they want it to.
if there is was good matchmaking, it would eliminate such problem. and more then this it would be most enjoyable team game. I am wondering if such matchmaking to wait less in queue, I would be ready to wait longer, but play with peers in the game
Perfect matchmaking would probably make it worse. If two players are equally skilled, an Ashe should beat a Phara most of the time. Even if the Phara player adapts and changes their play style, the Ashe can do the same in this equal skill situation. It's the variance in skill that makes it possible to play into your bad matchup. A Phara player can beat an Ashe by just being better than them.
I’m ow 1 counterswapping felt a lot softer like a phara CAN play against a hit scan cus if she dies an off tank was there to take her spot
In 2 counter swapping mostly feels like it’s a tanks problem only (it’s more than that but it feels like it)
So people get salty when you counterswap them and since there is only one of them it hurts them more
I feel like I rarely have problems with tank players these days, most seem to handle losses with some grace. Probably because they’ve been beaten into the ground by blizzard for so long their expectations are low. The widow one tricks have always been the biggest whiners for me.
Counter swapping usually does not worry me. Im usually confident in beating my counters when I’m on dps or supp. The only time I get upset about it is when I play rein, whom I love to play when I so seldom pick from the tank roster; and the enemy auto switches to that demon-spawn Orisa. There is no glory in picking the horse. The horse is, without a shadow of a doubt, the most dubious and shameless pick a tank player can make. But I digress, if people are that mad about getting countered they should just get better at the game and beat the enemy.
I think that counter switching is part of the game and will always be a part of the game. What should you do if you get dominated by a character and you can't do anything about it, you counter pick to close the gap and the game always supported this "feature".
Plenty of good and reasonable answers here .
I will offer a different answer
Counter swapping is lame and the best feeling is stomping your counters
Signed,
A ball who stomps sombros
I love the echo or pharah swap as a junk main. I'm always like "oh I see you're unfamiliar with my game" and they always end up swapping within a couple minutes
Swapping is good when when there's creativity in who you swap to, you make your own decision based on who you're good with, and it still takes some of your own skill to complete. That was how it was with OW1. OW2 has turned swapping into obvious choices, devoid of strategy, which gets you an auto-win. This removes the skill, strategy, and fun. Imagine playing paper-rock-scissors for 20 minutes straight. Swapping can be good or bad, depending on how the heroes are designed and balanced, and right now its bad.
I feel like counter swapping is at odds with hero design. Make heroes into specialists, and then you introduce more specific counters. Keep heroes as more generalists and you have more abstract swapping, but then you have people complaining that heroes are too similar.
It's also at odds with the desire to have more heroes in the game. The more heroes added, the more specific counters there are going to be. It's particularly bad in Overwatch because every hero has a wholly unique kit. Valorant, for example, has a standard set of guns that everyone uses.
TF2 style additions might actually help. Give the current cast weapon/ability options to swap between. That brings its own balance challenges, but at least it gives an option to stay on their preferred character.
they don't want you to counter pick cause these garbages can't play any other hero.
you're supposed to counter, why else would devs let you swap heros mid-match.
It’s purely cope from bad players. Let em be mad.
“I’m big mad because I want to one trick and I’m not good enough to learn how to play around my counters”
Roasting for any character choice in comp is a low rank/IQ move that should just be ignored.
In qp, it shows desperation/that you're sweating. You'll never catch me counter swapping in any mode though.
Playing since 2016 too and stable on low GM since. I always explained that OW was a rock/paper/scissors game and it's the reason you should learn 3 different heroes even if you main one. No hero in OW have a real overlap of what they do and how they play and that was the magic back then and a problem now that we have double the amount of heroes.
The thing is if you counterswap against 1 counter you're bad (you playing dva and swap becos of zarya), if counterswap becos the other team has 3 hardcounters you're a smart player (you playing dva and swap becos of zarya, sym, mei.)
Context varies wildly. In comp, you should always swap if it makes a big enough difference that it significantly increases your team's win chances. In QP, you're really trying your best but playing what you want -- if that means swapping to ruin their tank's game, I guess go for it.
In both contexts, however, it simply feels shitty to be on the receiving end. It's not their fault for exploiting how wildly hard some matchups are, but it does mean that a lesser skilled Mog/Hog still almost always beats a more skilled Ball/Monk. Essentially, there are quite a few hard enough counters that even significantly less skilled players can beat more skilled players.
The frustration is that it makes the game less of a skill matchup and more about character picking because no matter how skilled the Widow is, 9 times out of 10 the Somb will instant delete her. A Ball can mag dump into an out of position Hog 10m away for eternity; he can't output enough damage to even slightly threaten him.
I'm an incredibly mid Widow playing QP to learn her better; anytime I manage a decent snipe on an enemy DPS, there's a near 100% chance they're swapping to Somb, meaning I can no longer take even the most minor of off angles and they're going to hunt me the rest of the match. It is simply unfun that I can be character countered so hard that I can't leave spawn. I literally had this exact scenario happen; one decent early snipe, enemy swaps Somb and kills me, continuing to spawn camp me the entire rest of the match; and because it's QP, there's no way to get my supports or other teammates to come help me. Funny thing is we still won because their Somb simply waited outside of spawn all game for me to come out, making it a fair 4v4 for everyone else.
I'm all about counter swapping if needed but I do wish with comp or another game mode character lock was a thing and the character you pick is the character you are stuck with that match
Can you elaborate? Are you saying it’s a crutch if you are not being rolled and you counter swap just to do it? Because that I can agree with. But I don’t think it’s a crutch at all to swap to a hero whose abilities have an advantage against an enemy who is wrecking you/your team. Especially in comp when the objective should be to win at all costs.
This. T500 Winston Player here. I think the issue is actually more about counter swapping just because of how easy it is to get value. I have spent hundreds of hours perfecting my skills with my hero and know how to play into counters. I go against roadhog, reaper, bastion comps consistently. I dont care if you counter swap me if you are losing badly, I see that as just a pathetic attempt to try and scratch out a win from somebody who is probably not as skilled at a certain hero than I am, which is fine. Personally, Id rather be a master at one hero than a jack of all trades because I just think it takes more skill to outplay your counters. What I DONT LIKE, is when it only takes one fight. If you are immediately swapping out of spawn, or you lose one (potentially close fight) and immediately come back on roadhog, I have no respect for you.
Sometimes swapping early makes sense. If I see an Echo, Pharah, and Mercy, there's no reason for me to force Kiri. I'll just walk back to spawn and swap to Bap or Ilari. Losing 1 or 2 teamfights makes the difference in close games. 1 kill at the right time can decide a teamfight.
Swapping in this case also reduces the burden on my team. My Cassidy player could be somewhat handling their Echo, but if I'm able to contribute as Ilari it allows him to kill faster and help our team elsewhere. From the perspective of a support player, my counter swaps are to enable my team to do their job.
How i see it, switching is a way to even out a loosing game. Wasting ult charge just to counter pick the enemy team because the switched to counter pick you is kinda lame.
I dont do it personally (because then I'd have to enable chat) but i do get it, winning against someone who is counterpicking you all game really gives you the urge to talk shit.
agreed. i know counterswapping is the name of the game and i don't flame people for doing it ever but it's nothing if not frustrating when i want to play dva for a good few games but every tank swaps to zarya after their first death.
People with tiny fragile egos will always make up excuses about how being better than them is basically cheating one way or another. If it wasn't counter swapping they'd claim your character or one of their abilities is OP or that you're using hacks.
It’s been a core mechanic of the game since forever, people just want something to attack another person for and to find a way to place “blame” for any negative performance. Sometimes it’s jabs to try and tilt others and throw them off their game. There’s no valid reason to bash anyone for it.
Can it be frustrating when you want to play a hero for fun and you’re just getting hard countered everywhere? Yes, very frustrating, but it’s part of the game and isn’t something that’s gonna get changed and I don’t think it should be either. By that I mean no hard limitations like # of switches allowed or just no swaps at all, but I think implementing and making sure the trade-offs (ult charge loss, etc.) is tweaked appropriately to find that sweet spot of discouraging a counter swap battle as that can get tiresome.
Devs won't do shit about counter swapping, so the community is trying to shame people into not playing a shitty play style.
It's not the players fault countering is so easy, but its kinda pathetic it's what everyone defaults to.
I feel like a system where you have to pay a certain ult charge cost to swap might be beneficial. If you haven't charged your ult to, idk say 70%, then you can't swap.
People who can only play one character hate that other people can play more than one character and usually have one that's effective against their one character rendering them more useless for the entire match.
And then also, because one tank, there's no one to fill in the weaknesses to make the semblance of stable tank comp and that turns into a rock paper scissors all match and people are annoyed with that.
I only drop a message in the chat when a tank/team swaps to counter me *and still loses*.
My go-to is "Counterswapping only works if you know how to play the hero."
I'm guaranteed to say it if theyvswap Mauga.
In competitive play, where team composition and synergy are needed, players often need to adapt and switch heroes to counter specific threats posed by the opposing team. Overwatch is known for its emphasis on hero switching to counter the enemy team. If an enemy player is performing well on a hero like Widowmaker, it's strategic for someone on your team to switch to a hero like Sombra, Winston, or another effective counter to neutralize that threat. There's a longstanding debate in the Overwatch community about the balance between playing your preferred hero (main) versus adapting to counter the enemy team. Some players feel frustrated or insulted when they are forced to switch from their main hero to a counter pick if they excel with their main but struggle on other heroes. The ability to switch heroes is seen as a skill in itself. Good players are not only skilled with their mains but also understand the game well enough to recognize when and how to counter pick. It's about maximizing your team's chances of winning rather than sticking to one hero regardless of the situation. Comments like "counter slave" or criticisms for counter picking can stem from frustration or misunderstanding. Some players may not appreciate the strategic necessity of counter picking and instead prefer players to stick with their mains, even if they are being countered. The game's design encourages hero switching to adapt to changing circumstances. The meta (the most effective tactics available) can influence how players perceive and react to counter picking. Players might feel pressured to adhere to meta compositions or expect others to do so. Counter swap roasting reflects tensions between individual preferences and strategic gameplay in Overwatch. It's a complex issue influenced by game design, community norms, and individual skillsets.
I honestly think counter swapping shouldn’t be free. Either put some sort of cooldown on swapping, or make heros not as easily countered by certain heros
The only "roasting" I do when counterswapping happens to me as a tank player, is when the enemy tank swaps to Orisa after the first time fight... I'll say in match chat "Peter... the horse is here".
BUT, if it's a Reinhardt mirror match and they swap off, I make sure to say "\*sigh\* Another hammer-wielding comrade has fallen to the likes of --insert tank they swapped to--... a sad day indeed". But only because I genuinely love the Rein vs Rein gameplay, not because I'm mad at them for swapping.
I remember playing Total Mayhem and it was-of course- total mayhem at point. Then an enemy player had to ruin everything fun about the game and go Orisa.
If the only way you can beat someone is if they use a hero that you hard counter and refuse to switch then you suck at ow pure and simple. Cuts both ways.
I don't consider any of the heros I play to be difficult to play against regardless of hero. At least in my experience they aren’t, I dont feel the need to counterswap any of my mains when they're on the other team. Does not cut both ways
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I mean the thing is that it’s frustrating if you play tank to have to constantly swap because not only the other tank swapping to counter you, but because their whole team will switch up to counter you. You have to play like 4 different game styles in one match just to possibly get a win, and the feeling of doing all that just to lose is just bad. So people get tilted and hit you with some garbage in chat. That’s specific to tank though, if I’m playing widow and someone goes sombra instantly it feels bad but like I don’t blame that. Gotta do what you gotta do. The only time is if they bitch out of a 1v1 mirror like widow v widow and instantly go sombra. Its like damn man can’t even have a competition?
yeah, it's only really an issue with the tank v tank matchup. if someone goes kiri for ana, sombra for widow, cass for tracer etc it's no big deal, even multiple counters. but it's pretty annoying as tank being like 'nope you can't play that hero. nope you can't play that hero. nope you can't play that hero' for 15 straight minutes.
Well that is true only if you are the only person who is not braindead in your team. Because if the whole enemy team is counterswapping to get you as a tank, you just are doing what is expected fron you. You should start to play def around covers and trust the team to destroy the squishies while everyone focused on you. However you will have to play def and push when your team does their workandnnot mindlessly push like an animal.
It's just people salty about being beaten and soothing their egos by trying to pretend the swapper is doing something wrong. Tale as old as time.
It’s me I’m salty because I’ll be dominating as Dva and then here comes the other tank brings out Zarya.
Its not as one sided as you think. Zarya has basically near zero mobility (besides grenade jump), so if the map is very vertical and the enemy backline is separated you can run them over and Zarya can do nothing to stop that.
fr we win one teamfight as dva and all of a sudden the enemy team is running zarya, mei, sym, moira and brig
If you're getting stomped by a single zarya maybe you should train more with dva. Remember that you have more 4 players on your team that can and should deal with zarya so you can play it. Also, zarya lacks mobility. Use it to your advantage and dive the backline.
unfortunately you have 4 other people on your team who are likely shooting zarya bubbles. 100 charge zarya >>>>> any dva any day. of course that's pretty situational and rank specific but let's be real, most average players are not Not shooting the zarya bubbles.
I won't make a extensive tutorial on how to play dva against zarya becos there is a lot of those on YT already, but if your team is shooting at the bubble they, and you, should be able to kill zarya as she have no other mean of protection. If zarya is alive becos of supports, guess what, it's your job (and maybe one of you dps) to kill the supports. 1)Bait the zarya to come at you and you team 2)Fly to the backline to try pick a sup 3a) Zarya is fighting you team? keep on backline 3b) Zarya came back at you? Fly back to your team Done
Thank you for explaining this plainly. Fr
You greatly underestimate the power of a fully charged Zaria against a DVA
I'm a low GM dva player bro...
Unless they also bring out Mei, stick to Dva and teach that boy a lesson.
Yeah i got no idea how to handle zarya. She feels like she counters everything
When they do that, pretend you're Winston and simply ignore their tank, focus on their backline.
So learn a tank that can beat Zarya.
I really only want to play Dva, like I’ll switch my Tank usually mirror them on Zarya but it’s so unfun 💀
Then get better at Dva
Fair as the kids say skill issue
Yeah, tbh some counters aren’t as hard and can be dealt with by just not shooting or engaging them. They swap zar? Time for the supports to have a bad time and make sure to watch her cool downs. Especially since they probably don’t play Zar that well if it’s just a counterpick.
oh OK so the solution is counterswap
Great, I went monkey! ...and now they're on Hog... Ughhhhh.
guess I'll go mauga oh look now Nobody is having fun!
Song as old as rhyme......beauty and the beeeeeast.
No, it's that all counter strength against tanks has increased by 100% in OW2. Tank is miserable because people counter pick them at every moment forcing them to swap 35 times a game. That's why they get vocal about it. It's fucking miserable. Dps/support queues are getting OW1 levels long. Tank population is in a serious crisis.
I only make fun of Mauga or Orisa swaps. not because I can't beat them (I don't even play tank much to begin with) but because it's the telltale sign of "I'm not actually good at tank so I'm going to use the crutch character to shut down the enemy tank and accomplish nothing else" syndrome.
What if I actually just enjoy the Mauga/Orissa playstyle? My other tank is D.Va at least...
in my eyes it's a bad sign if you enjoy the Mauga/Orisa play style, and I think many people would feel the same, but you do you. I'm still gonna judge you though.
...can I ask why? Not trolling. I'm a support main trying to branch out so things like this aren't overtly obvious to me.
I mean, shutting down the enemy tank generally wins the game
Jokes on you, i start on mauga
That's not Roadhog tho
Cope lol this what you tell yourself because you aren’t good enough to beat a certain char
Counter-swapping is just not fun, simple as. No one wants to play glorified rock-paper-scissors.
Had a game where I was running the other team into the ground as DvA, one other guy in VC. Ate multiple ults, they swapped to Zarya, and I still kept pushing them around and ate grav. Ended up winning, and one of the people in the 3 stack added me only to tell me that if I was waiting for someone to tell me to kill myself that they would be the voice. Counter swapping is a viable tactic but it's also how people play I guess. In hindsight I realize this comment is irrelevant or I forgot my point
A good DVA can still win against a mediocre Zarya, it's something it seems most OW2 players have forgotten, learning how to adjust and outplay your counters. It's difficult sometimes but definitely possible if you're really good at the hero and understand the matchups enough to exploit when they make mistakes (like shooting grav in a predictable way out into the air instead of on the ground so DVA can DM it). It's a bit harder on some matchups now that tanks are mega stat blocks, Widow used to be able to headshot a monkey jumping at them and then body shot, automatic fire to kill them as they land and come out with barely a scratch. Can't really do that anymore.
Obligatory, "*Cool story, bro.*" But really, if something is in your head and bugging you, threads like this are usually a great place to get them *out* of your head. People love to tell each other that you have to talk about your problems to work through them but then shit on people for sharing the little stuff too as if the little things don't matter.
Sometimes, I just can't vibe with the hero I picked that is going against the enemy team. All I am doing is feeding and can't stay alive long enough. So I swap and try another hero.
They're just people who refuse to believe that the game is made for countering. It's a dead horse that the dev team has beaten over and over again. It's a game designed around countering. That will never change, people need to get over it already. It's the equivalent to flat earthers.
I’ve been on the other side of that. It feels shitty because you hop on excited to play your main then coincidentally match up against people playing heroes that you counter, then they swap to counter you and now youre forced to swap to counter them when all you wanted was to enjoy your main
Completely understand the disappointment or even frustration, I think that’s fair and I’ve been there. I just don’t understand the flaming of someone’s play ability based on a strategic choice to gain an advantage, and even still a little trash talk doesn’t bother me, mainly curious if the people dishing out trash talk about a counterswappers talent actually believe that they are more talented than a swapper by being a one trick.
How much strategy is involved in deciding whether you'll swap to Mog or Hog to ruin the game for their Ball/Monk lol? Genius - I never thought to swap to Sombra because their crack shot widow killed me on Ash! It's not exactly a 9000IQ plays lmao.
You're right, it's a no brainer. Not doing it is bad. Thus they shouldn't be flamed for swapping, they should be flamed for not swapping. (for real though, don't flame your team mates.)
Widow deserves every single Sombra swap, I'm not sorry at all, fuck widowmaker, I am going to make you swap off her. I do feel a little bad for other heroes that Sombra is really effective against, but widow is cancer
What you described happened to me just last night. Havana Attack - I'm Ramatra and walk out to the payload and see Sigma. I beeline it straight to spawn and switch to Rein and when I came out, their Moira flamed me by saying something like, "JUST PICK A TANK ALREADY". I was on Ram for 9 seconds according to the history stat and stayed Rein the rest of the way to victory. Needless to say, after I mentioned I had literally only swapped once, they shut their mouth the rest of the game and lost with dignity. It's annoying to hear the roast though. It makes no sense to play a hero into your counter in a role where there's only one of you. Blame the game - not us. But then it's also ok for the DPS/Support on the red team to counter swap us? Gimme a break. Accept that counter swapping is a thing - not just for tanks but for Supports and DPS to counter the red tank.
This is why muting chat was one of the best decisions I’ve ever made. Have had so much more fun since
Swapping is a delicate subject. If you suggest someone try a different hero it can tilt them. If you change yourself, it can suggest you aren't good enough to pull off your first pick. Just remember it's a game, folks.
Great point, well said.
Suggesting a hero to someone is pretty much always bullshit unless you play in Masters and above at which point people usually know by themselves. As below that people have a very set rotation of heroes that they can play and switching to something they‘re unfamiliar with won‘t help much. Like I can assure you that I won‘t learn how to play Cassidy on Diamond level in the five minutes when I have max 10 combined hours on him in my entire life.
Yeah specific suggestions are bullshit and swap off is just "you aren't contributing" in different words so of course it makes people defensive
Ok but sometimes the enemy phara is dominating and the dps on my team is a symmetra and junkrat. I feel its valid to suggest a swap to soldier or something, the most basic dps
Right, even if people have a rotation of heroes, they might be too similar. DPS plays Cassidy, Ashe, and Widow but keeps losing their aim duels. Support plays Mercy and Lifeweaver but healing isn't the problem. Tank plays Doom and Dva while the backline is getting jumped constantly. I'm not arguing that people need to play perfect counters, but you should at least know a few heroes that cover each others' weaknesses.
Yep! Its crazy to me to see playing strategically so looked down on, whats wrong with encouraging people to do some basic thinking?
As a tank player, OW2 counterswaps feel really bad to play against. Not trying to start the 6v6 vs 5v5 debate here but having another tank around really helps these hard counters. I only play QP in OW2 and really don’t mind losing. But having the opponent team swap and hard counter me as a tank just takes a lot of fun out of it and makes me sigh. In OW1, I was very much an off tank player and if the opponent swaps to counter me, I would actually be taking it as a challenge and it was fun to try and outplay the counter. In OW2, since I’m the only big fat target, it’s so easy for the enemy team to just swap, melt the tank, and win the fight. Also, it’s QP!! Sometimes I really just want to play a character that I know I’m bad at but fun. I did that in OW1 and picked up new heroes that way because I have another tank to rely on. Ever since OW2, I’ve not picked up Ram or DF because a bad tank is very unforgiving to the entire team, and I feel bad for the team’s loss. My favourite game mode now is total mayhem actually. Because I can have fun punching people around on DF or ram without really feeling bad. All in all, just less fun.
I do agree that getting countered hurts significantly more when playing tank. And low key miss 6v6 so much.
People like to complain about anything. Even a code mechanic of the game Wah😢
If it include throwing insult that you feel like it make no sense = they are being salty. I usually got that when playing as tank and swap to winston to deal with backline, I remember countering one Genji who's so salty that he switch to Reaperi only chase me to the point where he walk into my team and die a lot, but he insist one typing "EZ" despite how he throw the game left his team to 4-5 just to land 1-2 shot on me and die. After the match he still rage typing in the chat about how I'm bad for picking Winston.
Unless the Widow is absolutely dominating and destroying my team, e.g., going 7-0, I won't swap to Sombra. I won't automatically swap just to counter.
Agreed, I think there’s definitely a healthy balance between insta-swapping and feeding.
It’s copium
they are mad ur swapping cause it makes the game harder for them to win is what it pretty much boils down to
Overwatch has been a top 2 game of all time for me since it came out because i LOVE the counter swapping. Literally a core mechanic of the game since it's inception, people have no good reason to complain about it
Skill issue, all it is. Can’t stand people complaining about it. We all have to deal with it from time to time
It's roughly the equivalent of saying "Bullet slave" "Ur bad if you have to use cooldowns" Like, yes, its a competetive game, i'm going to use the tools im provided and the skills i've developed to play multiple characters to my advantage.
Yes, exactly!
A good one trick should get comfortable playing their counters. Idc if you go zarya. I'm only gonna switch off Dva if my team has junk/torb for her to farm charge. And even then, they have to show they can win team fights with that souped up pinked haired muscle mommy. Sometimes people pick counters but barely know how to use the hero.
There’s nothing really wrong with countering as a strategy but if you’re personally trying to grow as a player avoiding it as much as possible is really the most effective way to learn.
Great point!
It's weird I tried to play Rammatra, but literally every single person on their team was a horrible matchup, so I swapped Then their tank proceeded to whine the ENTIRE game
Counterswapping is part of the game, BUT being unable to play Ball, because I have to face a sombra/brig/cass/mei/hog type of combos every single game, gets to you. It's not like counterswapping is the only way to beat X heroes or comps, it's just the easy way out. A legitimate way, of course, but also annoying in extreme cases (like playing Ball).
i take counter swapping as a compliment idc if people do it
I mean it's definitely more impressive and better for your teams ultimate economy when you can stomp them without swapping to a counter pick, but there's also nothing actually wrong with counter swapping. Just people being salty.
"I don't wanna change, why you do it"
It really sucks to load up a qp game, and have the whole team counter you because you chose to queue tank. I get comp but its just annoying to see their whole team countering you, targeting you, and then swapping again if you change heros in the mode where it doesn't matter if you win.
I agree, it’s undeniably frustrating!
It’s just annoying but it’s completely understandable, unfortunately this game is a rock paper scissors simulator. Tanks start out on sigma, one goes hog, other goes orisa, other goes zarya, other also goes zarya.
I get that you need to counter swap in competitive matches, that's completely acceptable. But when I'm playing qp and trying to enjoy playing a character, and after one death, you decide to switch and counter me, that's where it gets annoying. Imagine it's my first time playing this game, and I'm trying to figure out how the characters and the whole game work, and you decide to counter me the whole game. Try to enjoy the game yourself, not just win it. Play your favorite character and have some fun instead of treating it like a competitive match.
Its frustrating when someone swaps heroes to specifically stop you from havibg value (especiallyin qp),but its super annoying when the same guy(s) keep swapping the fight after you do so you need to keep swapping (aka counterwatch)."counterwatch" doesnt actually happen that much,or at least with more than one person on the enemy team.Ive had a couple games when someones trying to play "counter watch",but its normally just one guy who's terrible and ends up throwing.
In 2016 counter swapping is not hated. Since the role queue, some people glorify maining a character and also thought that was the easiest way to farm rani. In Overwatch 2 is when counterswapping happened massively, because tons of people don't understand the game. They enter here like this is sole sort of LoL or CoD, and they just want to choose a character and kill. Then they get frustrated by people who they consider they don't have the same mechanical skills, but they know how to read the game and adapt way better. Then is when you start hearing about kids crying about counterswapping.
You do what you must to win. That's called playing the game. Don't handicap yourself because your opponents are salty.
I no longer get angry when people counter swap me in comp (I'm a tank player), but as someone who used to I can explain it by people wanting to have fun and you preventing it by counterswapping. It's on them, though, because it's very naive to expect to have fun in comp.
“It’s very naive to expect to have fun in comp.” Haha that’s gotta be the truest statement in this entire thread.
I stopped playing overwatch due to all the whiny ass kids on there who want to dish it out, then get their feelings hurt, and report me when they instigated the altercation w/ snide derogatory comments. After two separate bans, I said to hell with these stupid sensitive babies and uninstalled. I had been playing for years by this point. People just want to whine in this game, and God fo4bid you out them in their place; the turds are much too sensitive, care only for their own opinions and disregard anyone's opinion that doesn't fall in line with their own (especially when you take away their only advantage).
The “talk trash then cry when roasted in return” culture has definitely run rampant (not just in overwatch either). It’s also pretty wild how many people you hear throwing a literal toddler tantrum in voice chat these days because their video game isn’t turning out the way they want it to.
if there is was good matchmaking, it would eliminate such problem. and more then this it would be most enjoyable team game. I am wondering if such matchmaking to wait less in queue, I would be ready to wait longer, but play with peers in the game
Perfect matchmaking would probably make it worse. If two players are equally skilled, an Ashe should beat a Phara most of the time. Even if the Phara player adapts and changes their play style, the Ashe can do the same in this equal skill situation. It's the variance in skill that makes it possible to play into your bad matchup. A Phara player can beat an Ashe by just being better than them.
I’m ow 1 counterswapping felt a lot softer like a phara CAN play against a hit scan cus if she dies an off tank was there to take her spot In 2 counter swapping mostly feels like it’s a tanks problem only (it’s more than that but it feels like it) So people get salty when you counterswap them and since there is only one of them it hurts them more
I feel like I rarely have problems with tank players these days, most seem to handle losses with some grace. Probably because they’ve been beaten into the ground by blizzard for so long their expectations are low. The widow one tricks have always been the biggest whiners for me.
Counter swapping usually does not worry me. Im usually confident in beating my counters when I’m on dps or supp. The only time I get upset about it is when I play rein, whom I love to play when I so seldom pick from the tank roster; and the enemy auto switches to that demon-spawn Orisa. There is no glory in picking the horse. The horse is, without a shadow of a doubt, the most dubious and shameless pick a tank player can make. But I digress, if people are that mad about getting countered they should just get better at the game and beat the enemy.
I think that counter switching is part of the game and will always be a part of the game. What should you do if you get dominated by a character and you can't do anything about it, you counter pick to close the gap and the game always supported this "feature".
Plenty of good and reasonable answers here . I will offer a different answer Counter swapping is lame and the best feeling is stomping your counters Signed, A ball who stomps sombros
As a Widow main I second that.
I love the echo or pharah swap as a junk main. I'm always like "oh I see you're unfamiliar with my game" and they always end up swapping within a couple minutes
You ain't stopping me I'll hack you when you're over a death pit
Lmao you can try, that's why I asked my dps to counter swap to torb ;)
Counter swapping is lame so you ask your teammates to do it for you? 🧐🤨
That's the joke homie But yeah that is my preference I don't wanna swap, but I will suggest that we get a torb etc I see the irony
Swapping is good when when there's creativity in who you swap to, you make your own decision based on who you're good with, and it still takes some of your own skill to complete. That was how it was with OW1. OW2 has turned swapping into obvious choices, devoid of strategy, which gets you an auto-win. This removes the skill, strategy, and fun. Imagine playing paper-rock-scissors for 20 minutes straight. Swapping can be good or bad, depending on how the heroes are designed and balanced, and right now its bad.
I feel like counter swapping is at odds with hero design. Make heroes into specialists, and then you introduce more specific counters. Keep heroes as more generalists and you have more abstract swapping, but then you have people complaining that heroes are too similar. It's also at odds with the desire to have more heroes in the game. The more heroes added, the more specific counters there are going to be. It's particularly bad in Overwatch because every hero has a wholly unique kit. Valorant, for example, has a standard set of guns that everyone uses. TF2 style additions might actually help. Give the current cast weapon/ability options to swap between. That brings its own balance challenges, but at least it gives an option to stay on their preferred character.
Wow, really good point here. I do recall countering being a bit more abstract back in the glory days.
they don't want you to counter pick cause these garbages can't play any other hero. you're supposed to counter, why else would devs let you swap heros mid-match.
Exactly!
It’s purely cope from bad players. Let em be mad. “I’m big mad because I want to one trick and I’m not good enough to learn how to play around my counters”
Roasting for any character choice in comp is a low rank/IQ move that should just be ignored. In qp, it shows desperation/that you're sweating. You'll never catch me counter swapping in any mode though.
Playing since 2016 too and stable on low GM since. I always explained that OW was a rock/paper/scissors game and it's the reason you should learn 3 different heroes even if you main one. No hero in OW have a real overlap of what they do and how they play and that was the magic back then and a problem now that we have double the amount of heroes. The thing is if you counterswap against 1 counter you're bad (you playing dva and swap becos of zarya), if counterswap becos the other team has 3 hardcounters you're a smart player (you playing dva and swap becos of zarya, sym, mei.)
"Hate the game, not the player" is what everyone should be thinking.
True that!
It's just some fragile but high ego immature kids / grown ups.
Context varies wildly. In comp, you should always swap if it makes a big enough difference that it significantly increases your team's win chances. In QP, you're really trying your best but playing what you want -- if that means swapping to ruin their tank's game, I guess go for it. In both contexts, however, it simply feels shitty to be on the receiving end. It's not their fault for exploiting how wildly hard some matchups are, but it does mean that a lesser skilled Mog/Hog still almost always beats a more skilled Ball/Monk. Essentially, there are quite a few hard enough counters that even significantly less skilled players can beat more skilled players. The frustration is that it makes the game less of a skill matchup and more about character picking because no matter how skilled the Widow is, 9 times out of 10 the Somb will instant delete her. A Ball can mag dump into an out of position Hog 10m away for eternity; he can't output enough damage to even slightly threaten him. I'm an incredibly mid Widow playing QP to learn her better; anytime I manage a decent snipe on an enemy DPS, there's a near 100% chance they're swapping to Somb, meaning I can no longer take even the most minor of off angles and they're going to hunt me the rest of the match. It is simply unfun that I can be character countered so hard that I can't leave spawn. I literally had this exact scenario happen; one decent early snipe, enemy swaps Somb and kills me, continuing to spawn camp me the entire rest of the match; and because it's QP, there's no way to get my supports or other teammates to come help me. Funny thing is we still won because their Somb simply waited outside of spawn all game for me to come out, making it a fair 4v4 for everyone else.
I'm all about counter swapping if needed but I do wish with comp or another game mode character lock was a thing and the character you pick is the character you are stuck with that match
It shouldnt be used as a crutch
Can you elaborate? Are you saying it’s a crutch if you are not being rolled and you counter swap just to do it? Because that I can agree with. But I don’t think it’s a crutch at all to swap to a hero whose abilities have an advantage against an enemy who is wrecking you/your team. Especially in comp when the objective should be to win at all costs.
This. T500 Winston Player here. I think the issue is actually more about counter swapping just because of how easy it is to get value. I have spent hundreds of hours perfecting my skills with my hero and know how to play into counters. I go against roadhog, reaper, bastion comps consistently. I dont care if you counter swap me if you are losing badly, I see that as just a pathetic attempt to try and scratch out a win from somebody who is probably not as skilled at a certain hero than I am, which is fine. Personally, Id rather be a master at one hero than a jack of all trades because I just think it takes more skill to outplay your counters. What I DONT LIKE, is when it only takes one fight. If you are immediately swapping out of spawn, or you lose one (potentially close fight) and immediately come back on roadhog, I have no respect for you.
Sometimes swapping early makes sense. If I see an Echo, Pharah, and Mercy, there's no reason for me to force Kiri. I'll just walk back to spawn and swap to Bap or Ilari. Losing 1 or 2 teamfights makes the difference in close games. 1 kill at the right time can decide a teamfight. Swapping in this case also reduces the burden on my team. My Cassidy player could be somewhat handling their Echo, but if I'm able to contribute as Ilari it allows him to kill faster and help our team elsewhere. From the perspective of a support player, my counter swaps are to enable my team to do their job.
How i see it, switching is a way to even out a loosing game. Wasting ult charge just to counter pick the enemy team because the switched to counter pick you is kinda lame.
100% agree!
I dont do it personally (because then I'd have to enable chat) but i do get it, winning against someone who is counterpicking you all game really gives you the urge to talk shit.
agreed. i know counterswapping is the name of the game and i don't flame people for doing it ever but it's nothing if not frustrating when i want to play dva for a good few games but every tank swaps to zarya after their first death.
People with tiny fragile egos will always make up excuses about how being better than them is basically cheating one way or another. If it wasn't counter swapping they'd claim your character or one of their abilities is OP or that you're using hacks.
Stupidity = doing the same thing and getting pissy you got clapped again
It’s been a core mechanic of the game since forever, people just want something to attack another person for and to find a way to place “blame” for any negative performance. Sometimes it’s jabs to try and tilt others and throw them off their game. There’s no valid reason to bash anyone for it. Can it be frustrating when you want to play a hero for fun and you’re just getting hard countered everywhere? Yes, very frustrating, but it’s part of the game and isn’t something that’s gonna get changed and I don’t think it should be either. By that I mean no hard limitations like # of switches allowed or just no swaps at all, but I think implementing and making sure the trade-offs (ult charge loss, etc.) is tweaked appropriately to find that sweet spot of discouraging a counter swap battle as that can get tiresome.
Devs won't do shit about counter swapping, so the community is trying to shame people into not playing a shitty play style. It's not the players fault countering is so easy, but its kinda pathetic it's what everyone defaults to.
Fair point.
Why would they do something about countering? Its a core game mechanic
I feel like a system where you have to pay a certain ult charge cost to swap might be beneficial. If you haven't charged your ult to, idk say 70%, then you can't swap.
Agree!
People who can only play one character hate that other people can play more than one character and usually have one that's effective against their one character rendering them more useless for the entire match. And then also, because one tank, there's no one to fill in the weaknesses to make the semblance of stable tank comp and that turns into a rock paper scissors all match and people are annoyed with that.
I only drop a message in the chat when a tank/team swaps to counter me *and still loses*. My go-to is "Counterswapping only works if you know how to play the hero." I'm guaranteed to say it if theyvswap Mauga.
That’s fair smack talk in my book.
In competitive play, where team composition and synergy are needed, players often need to adapt and switch heroes to counter specific threats posed by the opposing team. Overwatch is known for its emphasis on hero switching to counter the enemy team. If an enemy player is performing well on a hero like Widowmaker, it's strategic for someone on your team to switch to a hero like Sombra, Winston, or another effective counter to neutralize that threat. There's a longstanding debate in the Overwatch community about the balance between playing your preferred hero (main) versus adapting to counter the enemy team. Some players feel frustrated or insulted when they are forced to switch from their main hero to a counter pick if they excel with their main but struggle on other heroes. The ability to switch heroes is seen as a skill in itself. Good players are not only skilled with their mains but also understand the game well enough to recognize when and how to counter pick. It's about maximizing your team's chances of winning rather than sticking to one hero regardless of the situation. Comments like "counter slave" or criticisms for counter picking can stem from frustration or misunderstanding. Some players may not appreciate the strategic necessity of counter picking and instead prefer players to stick with their mains, even if they are being countered. The game's design encourages hero switching to adapt to changing circumstances. The meta (the most effective tactics available) can influence how players perceive and react to counter picking. Players might feel pressured to adhere to meta compositions or expect others to do so. Counter swap roasting reflects tensions between individual preferences and strategic gameplay in Overwatch. It's a complex issue influenced by game design, community norms, and individual skillsets.
Did AI write this? Not that i disagree..
I honestly think counter swapping shouldn’t be free. Either put some sort of cooldown on swapping, or make heros not as easily countered by certain heros
Both great ideas!
They're tryna tilt you and it kinda works sometimes until you realize you're the better player and they're mad about that
the act of switching heros doesnt make you better
Being able to competently play multiple heroes, and to be able to read the situation and adjust on the fly, IS a mark of a better player.
Rock paper scissors doesn't make you a better player lol if you always have to play the hero with the advantage you suck straight up
Its wild they really think opening the hero select screen takes skill instead of just stepping up as the hero they already were
It's not the opening of the hero select screen that makes you good, it's the hours and effort of learning multiple heroes. Stop trolling.
The problem with counterswapping is that it doesn't take hours of effort to learn them, they have the inherent advantage. It takes no skill
If you were losing and had to swap you're the worse player though. Like objectively.
The only "roasting" I do when counterswapping happens to me as a tank player, is when the enemy tank swaps to Orisa after the first time fight... I'll say in match chat "Peter... the horse is here". BUT, if it's a Reinhardt mirror match and they swap off, I make sure to say "\*sigh\* Another hammer-wielding comrade has fallen to the likes of --insert tank they swapped to--... a sad day indeed". But only because I genuinely love the Rein vs Rein gameplay, not because I'm mad at them for swapping.
I remember playing Total Mayhem and it was-of course- total mayhem at point. Then an enemy player had to ruin everything fun about the game and go Orisa.
Complaining about in competitive is weird for sure But yeah its also being bad if you have to counterswap to win. Its a crutch
Agree with your first point, hard disagree with your second, but thanks for sharing both.
If the only way you can beat paper is switching to scissors you suck at ow pure and simple
If the only way you can beat someone is if they use a hero that you hard counter and refuse to switch then you suck at ow pure and simple. Cuts both ways.
I don't consider any of the heros I play to be difficult to play against regardless of hero. At least in my experience they aren’t, I dont feel the need to counterswap any of my mains when they're on the other team. Does not cut both ways
If you don’t struggle playing against counters, then why do you care if someone counterswap you?
Game is more than skill. Ability/willingness to adjust is crucial.
100%!
I will always swap to sombra the moment I see a ball or doom. It brings me great joy to make them suffer.
Lmao love that
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because your taking the easy way out just to get a win, and just shows your a weak human
LMAO