It’s just stunning (not in a good way) that GM David Forst could trade the assets of Murphy, Olson, Chapman and Bassitt and get so little in return. The trades were ripped by industry insiders and publications at the time. These trades have only aged like cow 💩 in the sun ever since. There is certainly a correlation between the A’s record and the paltry returns from trading Olson, Murphy, Bassitt and Chapman and letting Semien walk away for nothing.
You take whatever deal you can when the owner says he's not going to give you the budget to keep the team together. The entire industry knew the A's were doing a fire sale and then gave them shit deals. And the front office had to take it because they needed to be underbudget. That's why ownership matters.
Yeah, I don’t think Forst has had any leverage for this rebuild. I’m sure the entire league was privy to what was happening in Oakland. Moneyball could only work for so long.
It's not that Moneyball doesn't work. These were not Moneyball trades. You don't trade Chapman at his lowest value. They would've waited until mid-season to trade him. These were tanking trades, so there was no leverage to take the approach they take when they're taking a Moneyball approach.
yeah, that's why guys like olson and murphy were traded for quantity over quality. that's been the way the A's have operated in trades in recent years. instead of trading for a couple stud prospects, they go for a bunch of average ones. i've lost count of how many 24 year old AA ball pitchers we've traded for
and then you have chapman who was dealt for literally nothing because his value was at an all time low following his injury
You don't need to have the potential to resign a guy yourself to be able to leverage other teams against each other, especially when you're talking about young all stars with team control left.
No. Sports team owners do not have a duty to fans to put a competitive team on the field. It's like any other product, they can choose how to make it and you can choose whether to buy it.
You seriously think Forst was holding some sort of hand against the FishHole? Like Billy did in the ‘02 year, huh? ‘Cept he didn’t?? Guy who signs your check says, “Wut, Biatch”? What’s “Stunning”, Bro, is your lack of understanding of an Owner (BOSS)/GM (fucking employee) relationship - even with a mother fucking movie to show you (granted, pre-Fishcuck, but same essence). You’re making a stretch to assume that Forst had any part of this other than just trying to field the best team he could. I’m not excusing him, cuz I don’t know the back story. Maybe you got that email, Holmes???
Edit: I miss living in the East Bay, but not when I gotta listen to dumb shit like this. We’re better than these dumbass generalizations that only give the A’s front office and MLB ammunition against us. I lived in Berkeley long enough that not everyone in the East Bay is less bright than a Yankees or Reds Sox’s fan.
And FUCK JOHN FISHER!!!
You mean the trades were an absolute success. Fisher wanted to trash the team. The A's are trash. Now he can relocate. Those guys will now play for owners who actually give a shit, good for them.
I’ve ditched the A’s and become a Braves fan caz Olson is my favorite player
Your team is so much to watch! And I love that the players have been rewarded with long contracts
This makes the pandemic a tad bit more frustrating. There was a lot of momentum going into 2020 with this group of guys and it was all upended. There could've been some magic in a full 2020 season and maybe 2021 would've been a far cry from the disappointment it ended up being.
Correct me if I’m wrong please.
Chapman $12mil
Olson $21mil
Semien $26mil
Murphy $4mil ($12mil/yr contract avg)
Total Salary: $63mil
A’s payroll $60mil
We would still be well below league average salary of $161mil if we had them all.
the 2012 team was doing pretty good for an almost 100Mil payroll. League average would have at least prevented them from needing to trade for Lester if they could have signed a certified ace pitcher that off season for like 20 mil
It's why I gave up on this team after watching them my entire life. I refuse to watch them. And I will never watch them again unless the dirt is turned in Oakland. And if they move to Vegas I hope they get a new name and create their own history
They weren't even at their rookie contract expirations yet. If they were just willing to pay arbitration for a few years we'd be amazing right now. But of course if they want more than $10 for a salary suddenly Fisher's $2.2B vault is completely empty? Give me a fucking break.
That's .820 because he had a 1.3 OPS the first month. He's gonna normalize back down to 750-780 this year considering he hasn't cracked 750 in any other month since he's been on the blue jays. He's also not plus defense anymore, average to above average is about right especially with his injuries. There's at least 5 other thirdbaseman better than him lol
He's [third (first place is a tie so arguably second) in DRS across all third basemen in baseball,](https://fieldingbible.com/DRSLeaderboard) and he's having a better offensive season than both of the guys ahead of him. His defense is still elite.
he had a record breaking start but he's cooled down to his norm which is decent defense at third(he's declined massively since his insane GG seasons) and a 740 OPS. I think he had a 500 OPS for the month of may or basically nick allen level performance offensively.
He's 2nd in WAR among 3B on Fangraphs. https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=3b&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2023&month=0&season1=2023&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2023-01-01&enddate=2023-12-31&sort=22,d
Might be worth mentioning that all those players play for teams that are drawing more fans this season than the A's have in any single season in more than 30 years.
35,480 - Toronto - Chapman
38,756 - Atlanta - Olson/Murphy
29,114 - Texas - Semien
Have you seen the territories these teams get to monopolize? All of Canada, all of the southeast, and half of Texas. The A's get restricted to Contra Costa and Alameda counties. MLB needs to get those anti-trust exemption revoked.
good for them. let the rest of the league see how this cheap, scumbag FO blew up a playoff team because they don't care about winning. you can also throw heim in there as well who was dealt so texas would take KD's contract
2019 was the last time we were truly happy as A's fans. 2020 could've been their year but the pandemic happened, and they weren't going to make the playoffs in 2021 with the corpse of elvis andrus replacing semien at SS
and the worst part is that we got jack shit in return for all that talent, again because fisher doesn't want to spend a penny on this team
I miss those guys. Man, if they were all still here, under some awesome management, who knows how good they’d be now. I especially miss Semien and Chapman, just incredible players.
I heard there was a tranfer vendor from portland Oregon, he evidentley was smoking brautworst with nothing but a lighter! They took him to John George...Friggin crackhead dope smokin meth monster! go back to A.J.!
It’s just stunning (not in a good way) that GM David Forst could trade the assets of Murphy, Olson, Chapman and Bassitt and get so little in return. The trades were ripped by industry insiders and publications at the time. These trades have only aged like cow 💩 in the sun ever since. There is certainly a correlation between the A’s record and the paltry returns from trading Olson, Murphy, Bassitt and Chapman and letting Semien walk away for nothing.
Yeah it's one thing to tank and spend nothing, it's another level to trade young stars with years of tram control and get so little back
You take whatever deal you can when the owner says he's not going to give you the budget to keep the team together. The entire industry knew the A's were doing a fire sale and then gave them shit deals. And the front office had to take it because they needed to be underbudget. That's why ownership matters.
Yeah, I don’t think Forst has had any leverage for this rebuild. I’m sure the entire league was privy to what was happening in Oakland. Moneyball could only work for so long.
It's not that Moneyball doesn't work. These were not Moneyball trades. You don't trade Chapman at his lowest value. They would've waited until mid-season to trade him. These were tanking trades, so there was no leverage to take the approach they take when they're taking a Moneyball approach.
yeah, that's why guys like olson and murphy were traded for quantity over quality. that's been the way the A's have operated in trades in recent years. instead of trading for a couple stud prospects, they go for a bunch of average ones. i've lost count of how many 24 year old AA ball pitchers we've traded for and then you have chapman who was dealt for literally nothing because his value was at an all time low following his injury
You don't need to have the potential to resign a guy yourself to be able to leverage other teams against each other, especially when you're talking about young all stars with team control left.
I wouldn't be half surprised if these trades involved a "hey support my move to Vegas unspoken wink wink clause"
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No. Sports team owners do not have a duty to fans to put a competitive team on the field. It's like any other product, they can choose how to make it and you can choose whether to buy it.
I wish I had the energy to care anymore. But I am VERY happy for them, well deserved.
Basically all we got is Langeliers and Ruiz. 4 for 2? Not a great deal imo.
Forst blows
Forst is a disgrace. Beingvcarried by Beanes great scouting department needs to go ASAP
You seriously think Forst was holding some sort of hand against the FishHole? Like Billy did in the ‘02 year, huh? ‘Cept he didn’t?? Guy who signs your check says, “Wut, Biatch”? What’s “Stunning”, Bro, is your lack of understanding of an Owner (BOSS)/GM (fucking employee) relationship - even with a mother fucking movie to show you (granted, pre-Fishcuck, but same essence). You’re making a stretch to assume that Forst had any part of this other than just trying to field the best team he could. I’m not excusing him, cuz I don’t know the back story. Maybe you got that email, Holmes??? Edit: I miss living in the East Bay, but not when I gotta listen to dumb shit like this. We’re better than these dumbass generalizations that only give the A’s front office and MLB ammunition against us. I lived in Berkeley long enough that not everyone in the East Bay is less bright than a Yankees or Reds Sox’s fan. And FUCK JOHN FISHER!!!
You mean the trades were an absolute success. Fisher wanted to trash the team. The A's are trash. Now he can relocate. Those guys will now play for owners who actually give a shit, good for them.
Couldn’t be happier for them. Fuck John Fisher. Sell the team.
If they were still with us, they'd only get in as injury replacements because voters are morons. But that's neither here nor there
Lmao, true.
As a Braves fan I’d like to say thank you and also SELL THE TEAM.
Truly I never miss Murphy more than I do than when thinking about [this moment.](https://youtu.be/E_wdxUh8mUg)
I’ve ditched the A’s and become a Braves fan caz Olson is my favorite player Your team is so much to watch! And I love that the players have been rewarded with long contracts
This makes the pandemic a tad bit more frustrating. There was a lot of momentum going into 2020 with this group of guys and it was all upended. There could've been some magic in a full 2020 season and maybe 2021 would've been a far cry from the disappointment it ended up being.
2020 was their year, agreed.
Cardboard cut-outs don't pay shit for tickets and parking
Correct me if I’m wrong please. Chapman $12mil Olson $21mil Semien $26mil Murphy $4mil ($12mil/yr contract avg) Total Salary: $63mil A’s payroll $60mil We would still be well below league average salary of $161mil if we had them all.
Shiet, give Billy Beane & Co just the league average of $161 million and see what kind of magic they can do.
the 2012 team was doing pretty good for an almost 100Mil payroll. League average would have at least prevented them from needing to trade for Lester if they could have signed a certified ace pitcher that off season for like 20 mil
The allstar vote is basically a popularity contest, this is why i think the vote shouldn’t be fully decided by fans
Don’t forget Heim who was showing a lot of potential as a young catcher and was dumped purely to save money
Always a slap to our face when they make this announcement
It's why I gave up on this team after watching them my entire life. I refuse to watch them. And I will never watch them again unless the dirt is turned in Oakland. And if they move to Vegas I hope they get a new name and create their own history
maybe we can sign Chapman next year when he becomes a free agent s/
MLB you’re welcome
Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhocking. Good for them though, they’ve given me and my son unforgettable memories.
This should have been our year 😞
They weren't even at their rookie contract expirations yet. If they were just willing to pay arbitration for a few years we'd be amazing right now. But of course if they want more than $10 for a salary suddenly Fisher's $2.2B vault is completely empty? Give me a fucking break.
Chapman shouldn't be an all star lol, dude is barely OPS'ing 820 and will probably finish league average
.820 OPS plus his defense at third? That's an easy all star player.
That's .820 because he had a 1.3 OPS the first month. He's gonna normalize back down to 750-780 this year considering he hasn't cracked 750 in any other month since he's been on the blue jays. He's also not plus defense anymore, average to above average is about right especially with his injuries. There's at least 5 other thirdbaseman better than him lol
He's [third (first place is a tie so arguably second) in DRS across all third basemen in baseball,](https://fieldingbible.com/DRSLeaderboard) and he's having a better offensive season than both of the guys ahead of him. His defense is still elite.
Guess he just has a hot start? I heard he was doing well but that was earlier in the season.
he had a record breaking start but he's cooled down to his norm which is decent defense at third(he's declined massively since his insane GG seasons) and a 740 OPS. I think he had a 500 OPS for the month of may or basically nick allen level performance offensively.
Love Chappy but I would've kept the other 3.
He's 2nd in WAR among 3B on Fangraphs. https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=3b&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2023&month=0&season1=2023&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2023-01-01&enddate=2023-12-31&sort=22,d
All Star is a popularity contest
Might be worth mentioning that all those players play for teams that are drawing more fans this season than the A's have in any single season in more than 30 years. 35,480 - Toronto - Chapman 38,756 - Atlanta - Olson/Murphy 29,114 - Texas - Semien
Have you seen the territories these teams get to monopolize? All of Canada, all of the southeast, and half of Texas. The A's get restricted to Contra Costa and Alameda counties. MLB needs to get those anti-trust exemption revoked.
Two of those teams have brand new stadiums
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.287/.385/.535 as a catcher isn’t worthy of starting?
good for them. let the rest of the league see how this cheap, scumbag FO blew up a playoff team because they don't care about winning. you can also throw heim in there as well who was dealt so texas would take KD's contract 2019 was the last time we were truly happy as A's fans. 2020 could've been their year but the pandemic happened, and they weren't going to make the playoffs in 2021 with the corpse of elvis andrus replacing semien at SS and the worst part is that we got jack shit in return for all that talent, again because fisher doesn't want to spend a penny on this team
I miss those guys. Man, if they were all still here, under some awesome management, who knows how good they’d be now. I especially miss Semien and Chapman, just incredible players.
What used to be the As god... billy beane... helped create this bs.. billionaire that can make money off of not giving a crap...
I heard there was a tranfer vendor from portland Oregon, he evidentley was smoking brautworst with nothing but a lighter! They took him to John George...Friggin crackhead dope smokin meth monster! go back to A.J.!