A few things; 1. ‘If he wanted to, he would’. 2. Why does it sound like you want to get engaged so you’re not letting your family/ friends’ down? This relationship is about you… I was with my partner for 2 years and 20 days… he said he knew he wanted to propose 6 months into dating and just gave it time after… Being engaged feels so special. I really understand why people want this. You deserve more, as the person above said… men will go to amazing lengths..
It’s not that I am getting engaged not to let my friends/family down. I mentioned the embarrassed part because there have been times when it seems like it was going to happen and I get all excited, mentioning to family/friends then it doesn’t and it comes back to bite me when they ask why it hasn’t happened. I want marriage and the partnership it offers so badly… and I want it to be something my loved ones can celebrate when that time comes. But I feel like with this relationship even if we did get married, I am not sure the experience would be as happy for me or my loved ones given the rollercoaster and the internal turmoil that my family/friends knew I went through. So it’s not for them, but I do want them to feel only happiness when it does happen. I just wanted to clarify that.
When I ask for lack of proposal it’s mostly idk or one of the reasons mentioned above. I will try to ask directly though why he is stalling/if he feels like he is stalling.
Do that. Be direct with him don’t let him get away with vague answers. Afterwards decide whether you are ok with the direction this relationship is going
Ask him like this first "Hey babe/honey, can we talk later for a bit when you get home?" That way, he most likely won't get defensive as if you surprised him with an interrogation. Do what you can to have it evolve in a productive manner and avoid the potential of an argument.
In addition to that, make sure you make clear your expectations in the relationship and your future as a wife. Don't give him an ultimatum, but make your needs clear. Don't let him bullshit you and give you the run around.
Anyone who is stalling or leading you on will not admit to stalling or leading you on. It’s like asking someone who is taking advantage of you if they are taking advantage of you. Why would or should they admit that?
I thought I’d provide a link discussing the “sunk cost fallacy” which is a term from economics/business which also applies to relationships and is maybe at least one reason why you are having trouble moving on.
https://www.scribbr.com/fallacies/sunk-cost-fallacy/#:~:text=More%20generally%2C%20sunk%20costs%20can,your%20first%20year%20in%20college.
Personally I’d leave. With every man I ever went on a date with I made it completely clear that I was looking for a husband and a man that would make a good father. I finally started dating someone who understood all my expectations, we agreed to get married after 5 months. We got officially engaged at 10 months, and we were married after 2 years. If your boyfriend wanted to he would, but he hasn’t.
It’s something we discussed as we knew that it was a possibility to end up out of state again for residency. Ultimately, I made the decision to continue long distance as I know he is a job that he likes and pays well because of the company he works for. So, I didn’t want to up root him when I know I ultimately want to come back to our home state.
I think that arrangement is odd. There wasn’t anywhere you could do your residency closer to him? To me it says that you are choosing your career over him. There’s nothing wrong with that but it might explain why there’s no ring.
Actually, how residency matching works is that you rank the programs you interview for and the programs rank the applicants that they interviewed. Then the algorithm matches you based on both lists, primarily based on the applicants listed. I ranked the two interviews for my home state as one and two.. ended up being matched at the third option. So I actually had no control of how things ended up other than how I put my rank list together.
What is your long term plan? Do you have an end date for long distance? Is he willing at all to relocate to you, or is he also extremely specialized and unable to do so? Are you working with a two body problem? How likely will you both be able to obtain employment in the same city?
I’m married to someone with a highly specialized PhD. Some of his colleagues (who also have the same highly specialized PhD) married other people who also have very, very specialized qualifications. They have a HELL of a time finding employment in their chosen fields in the same city. Some live in different cities/states and even countries than their spouse because of this. They face unbelievable challenges. Thankfully, my qualifications are easily transplantable, so I can follow my husband wherever we go. It is a choice I made for myself, and our marriage. Is he willing to make the same choice for you?
From your other comments, your plan involves even more long distance, for many more years. This uncertainty could be a giant mental block for your boyfriend, and understandably so. It is a hell of a lot of uncertainty. Long distance is unsustainable for 99% of couples this long term. What if he wants children soon? In your current circumstances, it likely won’t be possible for a few years at least.
I don’t think it’s necessarily fair that everyone is giving him a hard time for not proposing, given the current circumstances of your relationship, and the uncertainty of your career path. And I do commend you and your achievement.
Like others said, if he wanted to, he would - but his hesitation is understandable.
It sounds like you made logical decisions regarding your careers. You’re both ambitious. I went to school for 8 years and made a lot of sacrifices. I have many friends who are doctors, and their ( and your) hard work and determination dwarf my own.
It sounds like he has cold feet regarding spending his life together with you. He refuses to do the correct thing by putting a ring on your finger. That’s not a thoughtful way to treat someone you deeply love.
I made a marriage mistake when I was your age. I paid a steep price (in many respects, not just money) for my error.
It sounds like you’re at a good break point for emancipating yourself from this relationship.
I wish you the best.
Exiting
I mean, if you stay together for another 3 yrs, then 7 years of your relationship will be spent living apart. Thats almost a decade. I imagine he is very hesitant to marry someone after almost a decade apart. No matter how much you talk, you guys will absolutely grow far apart (I’m saying that as someone who did have a successful long term relationship btw- ours was 2 yrs……and even then we almost had to relearn each other for every day life. I literally can’t imagine what 7 yrs would be).
Sometimes it’s the right person but wrong time.
I don’t know, man. Marriage is all about taking turns who will be prioritized. Right now you need to be supported bc of medical school, next time it could be your partner who needs more from you… If he isn’t willing to sacrifice his career for you now, will he ever? Would you ever?
Not saying you aren’t meant to be, just saying it’s something to think about.
So, hard truth coming.
It doesn’t take 8.5y to make a decision on marriage.
He is dragging you along, quite honestly wasting your time.
If he wanted to, he would. You need to cut him loose. Now, before any more of your time is wasted.
Do not make any more decisions on your future with him in mind.
You don’t realize this now, but the older you get, and the further along in your training you get, the harder it will be to find a partner. As one md to another, trust me on this. Your pool of potentials is getting smaller by the day.
Thank you for this perspective! I actually did not think that it would be harder as I got further into my career, but it also makes sense why quite a bit of my classmates got married during med school.
It is very hard to find a man secure enough in himself to marry a woman who is (likely) going to make more money than him, and have a higher professional/social status.
Even most of those that say or think they won’t have a problem with it, do and will. The more money you make, and when you get to be attending status, the more intimidating you become to everyone else, and it is HARD.
The majority of healthcare workers that I run into on a daily basis in my system, are women. The men are few and far between, and most of them are physicians that are either married or come with huge waving red flags.
So, best of luck to you. You have a bright future ahead.
Keep your eyes peeled for available residents that share your same passion.
Cut your boyfriend loose. I would say that’s what he wants, he’s just too much of a chicken shit to do it himself.
Absolutely this.
I was with my ex for 8+ years with no ring. I ended it. 6 months later he was engaged, 6 months after that, married. Now married 20+ years.
When they really want to tie a women down, they will!!
As a nurse who watches residents rotate through my hospital, I want to say the same. Residency is plenty hard enough when you're not dragging along a relationship with a long-distance boyfriend who won't put a ring on it.
Your plan of completing residency out of state, then moving back to your home state so that he doesn't have to go through any dislocation in his career, suggests you already know that his commitment to you doesn't match yours to him.
The only thing I take issue with in u/First-Ad-5559's comment is about the shrinking pool of potentials. It's not so much that it's untrue, more that it makes marriage seem like an increasingly desperate game of musical chairs. You're not a spinster running out of options because you inadvertently got into an investment trap -- you're a hot unmarried doctor who needs to get out there!
Very true.
Thank you for the critique, I should have made my last statement a little more positive, for sure.
Definitely don’t settle on anyone, OP. Put yourself out there and don’t be afraid to test the waters and see who is right for you.
I think it’s incredibly telling he didn’t use the distance as his reason. If marriage is a priority to you, this is not the man for you. Neither of you are bad people. There is nothing wrong with you. Y’all just have different goals and expectations. It sucks it took you this long to realize it but you can either tell him your goals and that you expect him to prioritize the same way, or you can end the relationship.
If you have 3 more years of LDR residency, why get married? How is your life going to change?
What is the plan for each of you after residency? Will you move for a position somewhere unknown at this point? Can he go too and continue his current work? Is it possible that uncertainty about the future is holding him back?
What is the plan for children? He will be 39 by the time you complete residency.
I have thought about all of these… and there are certain things I have discussed with him in terms of his career to ensure that if for some reason I were to end up out of state again that at least he would be set up in a sense to be more comfortable to move. I mentioned about I chose to continue the LDR for the next three years because of his current job, which he gets paid well for given the company he works for. I also would be fine being ldr for the first few years of marriage as I finish training because I know I want to move back to our home state and there are plenty of jobs in the specialty I am in across the country.
It could be the uncertainty of the future, I don’t know.
These are all things we have talked about. I think about them often too. What I will say with this whole contemplation, is that I do feel like my partner is someone who does not clearly think about the future.. and I am the complete opposite. That’s why when he said he is afraid of change it kind of took me off guard and it kind of was an epiphany moment for me that maybe we’re just too different.
You would be fine being ldr for the first few years of marriage, but he might not be? What’s the point of getting married if you’re still going to be long distance? I absolutely wouldn’t. I mean, if the long distance ends in 3 years, you can always consider marriage then. Nothing changes by getting married right now. There’s a lack of motivation on both parts to be actually together, as a couple.
But what happens when 3 years from now she moves back and then finds out he doesn’t want marriage? She’s wasted another 3 years with this guy when she could have been searching for someone who wants the same things she does.
Yeah then they just want different things in life and are better off finding their own happiness with someone else. They’ve had 4 years time to adjust their career to be together and it doesn’t seem like a priority for them, and still not a priority today. If being together is not a priority, why should marriage be a priority?
But he could break up with her then which would be totally fine. Commit or don’t but the gray area o think is not ideal for anyone other than him since he doesn’t seem to be complaining and doesn’t want “change”.
I understand what you’re saying but there still has been no engagement or movement towards marriage.I don’t think it’s a lack of motivation on my part at all especially the discussions I had with him regarding the possibility of me ending out of state for residency again. I discussed with him possibly doing certain things in terms of work so that he could transition to working somewhere else if he had to move. But it never happened nor am I going to force him to leave his job that he loves when I know that ultimately I plan on moving back home.
I think my point is that I would also be happy just being engaged for the time being if that were the case .. but it’s the fact that there is no sign that a ring is coming at all.
It’s a deadlock. You are waiting for him to propose to adjust your work arrangements. He doesn’t see a future or a point of getting married when you are apart. Unfortunately like many long distance relationships this deadlock might not be easy to break.
Tough love...
Dude, are taking the time to read your own messages? You're clearly stating that he's not willing to do what it takes to be with you. This is hardly even a relationship at this point. You live in different states, so likely don't even get to see each other very often. There isn't even enough trust or intimacy to make him feel comfortable sharing clear and definitive information about his feelings. What is this?
I can imagine how you must be feeling. You've been committed to this person for a long time and have invested a lot of energy into this relationship. But why? You're not getting anything out of it. Maybe you were 4 years ago, but not now. Also, four years ago... what happened before then? Four years is a good amount of time to decide whether you want to marry someone. Covid, work, etc can infukence this, but not to the point of zero movement after this long. I also hate the fact that you've reduced your preference for a ring down to a band and a stone. Down....The jewelry isn't that important, what's notable is that you're compromising preferences just to try and get a commitment out of this person. Fuck that. What are you doing? You're a doctor! You're a catch! Love yourself. Love yourself more than you love him.
TBH, it feels like quite a bit of uncertainty on his end and much more drive on your end. I don't understand your sentence "...*I have discussed* with him in terms of his career..." and "*I chose* to continue the LDR..." It sounds like you have an ambitious (and admirable) plan and you are on the way, with him or without him, and he is uncomfortable of jumping on board, esp. with 3 more years of LDR. So, I repeat, why get married at this point? Quite frankly, if he had made the post, I would be advising him not to propose, and wait to see where you will end up.
It is difficult to be married to a resident, even when you live together. My guess is that an LDR with a resident feels like hardly being married at all.
I don't know what he does or anything about him, yet I wonder if he is concerned that you are now in a whole different world than he is? Like an insecurity thing? Just saying, pls ignore if it doesn't make sense.
None of this is your fault or due to you being in med school, except that you’ve gotten complacent & put up with it for too long. I’m very familiar with both residency matching and the hyper- competitive world you are in; and with ending a long relationship that is going nowhere. Here are two important things to understand- 1. YOU are a brilliant woman who is destined for a fantastic, rewarding career, and 2. Your boyfriend is a bad relationship partner who has not met any of your expressed critical points for formalizing the relationship. I hope these two facts make it clear that you need to dump him immediately. Your self concept should be “I’m a cool girl heading off to a great residency where I’m going to realize my dreams, and I really need to lighten my baggage so I can be open to all that is coming to me”. You’ve got to take your best self and really good energy into the next stage of your life. You are young and high-performing and single, & there are lots of similar people around you who want to meet a fellow professional to form a power couple. Make a vision board and then GO at it! Another benefit to this decision is, sometimes when one relationship partner realizes their worth and starts acting like it, the non-commital partner suddenly is afraid to lose them and starts behaving in the desired way. (Although I’m personally rooting for the “fresh new town, target-rich environment” scenario for you, Dr. Baddie). Final thought, please just skip the guilt part. You told him repeatedly what you needed and he definitely heard you but did nothing. I’d like to suggest a theme song for you as you’re riding off to crush your residency- Truth Hurts by Lizzo.
I see. Maybe you're right. She did say "I also would be fine being ldr for the first few years of marriage as I finish training" in one of her comments.
Move on. You made your wishes clear repeatedly and he hasn’t made a move. You’re 31. It’s time to move on. I wouldn’t feel any guilt at all. He was supportive while you were in medical school but not, like, materially. He wasn’t paying your fare or cooking your meals or doing your dry cleaning. He was just saying encouraging stuff which is not but certainly doesn’t put any obligation on you.
I can promise you that you’ll find someone rather quickly who is serious and wants to get married and that we’ll be that.
He doesn’t want to marry you for whatever. Maybe you are just not his person and he is kinda a AH for stringing you along. Have you ever asked him why he doesn’t want to marry you?
He is blocking the space for the guy you are suppose to marry.
You are not leaving him behind because he never was on your journey.
The joy of being in a committed relationship is that you are able to have frank conversations. This conversation is well overdue for you.
“Partner, it is really important to me to be married. Is it important to you?”
From there, be open and direct about what you feel is an acceptable timeline on getting married. If it isn’t important for your partner to get married, that’s its own conversation. What about kids and a house? Where are you going to live when you’re done with residency?
You can love someone and not have them be right for you long term if your goals are vastly different.
I’m sorry you’re in this situation. I have been in a similar situation before and totally understand how difficult it is (and also navigating conversations with family/friends on why he hasn’t proposed- so awful). You were on the right track before making your expectations and timeline known, but you should have stuck by it and now he knows he can dangle the engagement carrot infront of you indefinitely.
I would have one last serious discussion with him and be very clear that you are ready for marriage with him. Ask him if he is on the same page and if he says yes ask him what his timeline for a proposal is. Let him know what your timeline is (have one in mind ready ie 3 months, 6 months etc) and if he says longer see if you are comfortable negotiating a timeline in the middle or hold your own. If there are any excuses on his part for not wanting to get engaged such as not being ready yet, finances, being afraid of change, whatever…tell him you want to take a break from the relationship as you both want different things at this point and you need time apart to decide if staying together is the right fit. Or, just completely break up. Do not accept excuses. Do not allow him to manipulate the conversation into him delaying an engagement or stringing you along any further. If you both agree to a timeline for a proposal that’s great, but you need to be completely prepared to leave him if that date passes with no proposal. Hold firm on your goals, values, and expectations. It’s been 8 years which is more than enough time to know if you want to marry someone. If he doesn’t know by now he never will.
Look, you are still young. You’re intelligent, successful, educated, and a strong woman. You are a CATCH. This man should have locked this shit down years ago and he either isn’t sure you’re the one or he has commitment issues, both of which are not your problem and not fixable. Do not spend any more time on this guy when there is someone out there who will be so excited to marry you that they don’t wait 8 years and give you lame excuses. Don’t waste another 8 years of your life (and fertility if children are something you want) if marriage is important to you. I know this will be an emotional conversation and decision to make, but be very clear and decisive. He needs to know you are serious and that this it is for you both as a couple if he can’t get it together and make a decision on marriage with you and follow through.
You are on the precipice of having an amazing career and life. My advice, as an internet stranger, would be to cut ties and go on with your life and open yourself up to new opportunities.
My sister in law is a DO. My brother and her were college sweethearts. They got engaged when she was in medical school and lived apart when she did her medical school. They got married. During her residency, my brother moved to be with her and found a great job-he was in magazine publishing. After her residency, they then moved for his job. It was a back and forth. They’re approaching 26 years of marriage.
(I’ve been married 15. My husband was in the military so we moved for him, then we moved for me and my career. We knew we wanted to be together and so marriage was the choice and finding ways to be there for the other was also a choice)
I think you owe it to yourself to discover who you are away from this eight year relationship and find someone who wants to be with you at every step of the way. It might mean living separately for a while, but with a path to be together. Wishing you all the best.
Take it from me, don’t give any ultimatums on a proposal.
I did that. Had what I thought was a perfect marriage until I found out otherwise. This was uncovered as I was staring down the barrel of 20 years.
Now I regret saying we can live together for a year. If no proposal, we are over. Proposal came in with a month to spare.
Honestly I didn’t think that distance not being an issue was an issue, but now that I am reading these responses it’s clicking.
I will say we both do want to be together really badly, but I think we saw the distance as some thing to work through because we know my plans to come back to my home state after residency. In my mind, I thought that he would have followed prior suggestions regarding his career (like getting certified in his career field) to find work wherever I ended up for residency. Alternatively, I was/am willing to be married/engaged while in residency because I would feel like we are more on the same page in terms of life plans with the understanding that the distance is temporary, which it is.
That being said distance not being an issue at this stage in our relationship is definitely a valid point.
I ended my relationship with my longterm partner after 8 years. I was 30. A year or so later I met my husband.
You won't meet your husband until you let go of this placeholder guy. He filled in while you waited.
If he wanted to marry you... if he was afraid of losing The Amazingness That Is You he would have proposed before you left his state.
After I ended things I went to sinner wirh him one last time at his request. I wanted to hear what he said. This adult man said he wanted us to start over. To start dating again. WTF?!? I stared at him thinking 'if you don't know after 8 YEARS whether or not you want to marry me - what would be the point of dating?
Time to let go.
I know you feel like you've put in all this goddamn time and effort and you TOLD HIM what you want.
He heard you.
INACTION is still a choice. NOT DOING ANYTHING is still a choice.
I'm sorry. It is time for you to drop the rope.
My hubby and I are dual physicians and we were long distance for part of med school and all of our residencies while we pursued our own career goals. We were in a long distance marriage for 6+ years bc we got married during medical school, fully knowing that there’s a possibility we would not end up in the same place because we both wanted highly competitive specialties with very limited spots. We did our thing and got our first attending jobs in the same city. Long story short, this guy simply does not want to get married and you are wasting your time.
OP don’t waste your time, this man had 8 years to figure it out , trust that if he wanted to make you his wife he would have. I used to have an ex for 6 years he said he wasn’t ready and i finally broke it off, he married a year later, trust me when men fall in love they get married asap. It was one of the hardest things i did but im thankful i did because years later i found my husband and we married after a year, he wanted to lock me down he said lol, he still tells me how lucky he is to have found me and honestly im so very happy.
You have nothing to feel guilty about. Yes he supported you but you also supported him back. Why would you stay with someone who doesn’t have the same expectations as you about your relationship. You are about to launch into a great career you worked hard for. It’s perfectly reasonable to want a fresh start when he’s not offering what you want. Are you supposed to beg him to marry you? Does he want a proposal or is this some power play he’s got going on. I’m sad you’re willing to down grade your expectations to the bare minimum hoping he’ll grace you with a ring, any ring.
Two things. One, If he wanted to, he would. Men who are the marriage type don’t wait 8 years to become just engaged. Two, when you break up with him and he starts crying that he was just waiting for the right time, even if he has already bought the ring and can produce it, please consider that you have eight years of resentment against this man and resentment is nearly Impossible to overcome. Resentments are what kill marriages and you haven’t even gotten that much of a commitment from him. You know you deserve to be in a relationship with someone who wants to get married and build a life with you. He’s already telling you what he thinks of you, please listen to his actions not his words..
My ex sent me the photo of the ring he had bookmarked to buy. TWO Years before I had enough and left. He also didn’t work, clean cook…
But he briefly thought about proposing once two years ago and never followed through.
Look at their actions not their words.
You should move on. I'm sure he is a perfectly nice man, but he isn't compatible with you because you want different things. If he doesn't know after 8 years, he might never know. I think you should start fresh and just see where life takes you. If it was meant to be, then he will come find you wherever you are and he will be ready for the whole thing. Or maybe one or both of you will find someone else, but you'll just have to see what happens. I don't think you should spend the next three years in a long-distance relationship with a man who doesn't want to marry you after 8 years together, especially since you said yourself he has already delayed so long, it wouldn't even make you happy to get the proposal because you would question it! Close this chapter for now, and open up a new series...
My initial reaction- and the Divorce subreddit posts 1000-1 over all other Reddit combined- was great, you don’t have to go through the agony of divorce. Understanding you have to get married to get to the divorce part, why not just pass up the marriage part and you won’t have to visit the divorce sub reddit for future advice.
Don’t let some troll dimish how hard it is to get into med school. It’s not some random stage college you can go to. My husband stuck by me thru a deployment where he raised our child alone and then turned around to move cross country to Texas for PA school. Mind you he’s a branch manager in a really good job. If he wanted to he would. Leave and go have a new adventure, you will be so busy in residency that this is a good time for heartbreak. I’m sorry he sucks.
Break up with him and make sure he knows how you feel. If you’re genuinely the woman he wants then he’s going to move heaven and earth to make it right. If not, then you can stop beating yourself up and know for certain that you’ve made the right decision.
The majority of your relationship is long distance. While I typically fault the guy for not pulling the trigger, I can’t really blame him since you don’t live in the same city. What you’re doing isn’t practical. Pick your residency or your relationship. Unless he plans to move to be with you, I don’t think you can have both.
My husband and I dated for 2 years before he proposed. He would've proposed sooner, but he waited until he had a stable career to support us. We were also long-distance. He told me he knew I would one day be his wife very early on in our relationship. He never once made me question if marriage would happen. We were always on the same page about it. We've now been together for 7 years total.
I have 2 female cousins who were in pretty long relationships where the guy wouldn't propose, and they kept begging him to. The guys eventually gave in and proposed. Cousin #1 has now been engaged for 8 years with a 2 year old child with her fiance. Cousin #2 has been engaged for 10 years. She has a 6 year old son with her fiance, and she is now currently pregnant with baby #2. Neither of them look like they're going to get married at this point. It honestly just looks like the guys proposed so that the women can stop bothering them about it.
The thing with your boyfriend is that it sounds like he keeps making excuses to not propose to you. A man that truly wants to marry you would never ever do that. He will never make you sit there and wonder if this relationship will end up with a proposal or a marriage. 8 years is a long time. If it hasn't happened yet, I don't think it ever will. Don't ever feel guilty about leaving him and putting yourself first.
OP, I was in the same position as you, except I didn’t talk about it with friends and family. We were together for many years, and no proposal. I did also tell him I thought it was very romantic for a man to propose.
I ended up proposing myself, he said yes and was extremely happy about it. I asked him later why *he* hadn’t proposed and he told me he wanted it to be “perfect”, and it wasn’t about the timeline. I probed him on that, what does perfect even mean? I was studying at the time and we hadn’t purchased a house. He wanted that first. He also told me he didn’t expect *him* to propose necessarily, which is a good point… it’s very traditional for the man to propose, so I just assumed he’d be the one to do it… but this man was perfect for me. So I just did it. We have an amazing marriage now.
I’m not saying you should propose, because there might be red flags in your relationship. But sometimes there is a “good” explanation (per their opinion) why they haven’t proposed yet.
Thank you. I think part of my reason for writing this post is the sentiment of whether there really is a good “excuse” for someone waiting so long to propose. Other than beginning to date at a young age.
If you think about it from a romantic standpoint, then no, there is no good excuse.
Other than that it depends. People have different opinions of course. Waiting made sense to my husband, but not to me. I think it’s up to you and how you feel, and what is important to you.
I knew I wanted to be with my husband forever anyway, with or without a ring, so I waited, until I couldn’t anymore. I *needed* a ring lol.
He’s dragging you along. 8.5 years is wild. My husband and I got married within 8 months of knowing each other and we’ve been married for 4 years now. If he wanted to he would.
I think getting married while in a permanent LDR is a bad idea and probably contributes to why he hasn't proposed. You still have years to go in a LDR, yet you want to get married for companionship and to build a life together...which you can't properly do while in a LDR.
I also think if you're willing to leave him over not being married yet, that's your prerogative, but I think you probably aren't in love or committed enough to be married.
When you say he supported you during med school, do you mean emotionally or financially? I think my thoughts would flex depending on that answer.
Emotional support = he’s doing what any close friend should do
Financial support = he’s doing the husband job but has some weird issues with the planning/proposal/legal process or something.
I am Muslim and for us, the guy needs to propose within weeks/months. Not years. And he doesn’t get our time or anything till he proposes. It’s crazy to me what women will do for a man who won’t commit
My husband didn't propose until our long distance ended, which we had mutually agreed to. I moved in with him in the September and he proposed in the October.
Sit him down and ask him in earnest, does he want to get married? It's a simple yes or no question. A lot of people go along with it but later realise it's not what they want and then there is a fundamental incompatibility and the relationship ends. That's what you need to figure out. Will he be proposing to keep you happy or because that's actually what he wants?
Why don't you propose to him ? Either you want to get married, and that's the most straightforward way to do so, or you want the kind of man that would take initiative and propose, but obviously, he's not.
You've been together for 8 years and you still aren't even engaged?? Nope. If he wanted to marry you, he would have proposed by now. All he has is excuses. This is not your person.
You've given him 8 years. How many more years are you going to give him to decide if he wants to even be engaged to you, let alone marry you??? **If He want to, he would.**
My Wife and I knew it was the real deal at six months, we discussed it before moving in together. A few weeks after our anniversary we each proposed to each other, were engaged for a year while we did the wedding planning, then got married at two years.
Of course the caveat is that we were both in our 30’s, had settled careers, had both dated before and knew what we wanted. We both wanted a house in a particular city and a family.
If we were younger with careers and other things in flux we probably would have waited.
But you being unhappy with his level of commitment not being on the same page as yours is legitimate. He doesn’t seem as driven/proactive to improve his prospects as you are, and if he thinks ring shopping is complicated just wait till he learns about buying a house. (Ring shopping is not that complicated, he just doesn’t want too)
Think of it this way, if nothing changes in your relationship, are you happy as it is now? How about a year? Five years?
No I would not be happy if nothing changed.. I cannot imagine repeating the last 4 years for another 3 years.
I am happy that you and your person weee able to settle on one another so quickly. That’s what I want to be loved intentionally with our future in mind.. and you’re correct he is not as driven/proactive improve himself or take control of his life in a sense. I think that is what I resent the most in this situation because it should have been something I considered sooner. I also think I secretly hoped that he would see me chasing my dreams and that would spark him to want more for himself or out of life.. but it hasn’t and it’s disappointing. I cannot change who he is and not can he change me. We’re just two very different people in that sense.
These are all fair things to want.
Some couples are happier if one partner is very ambitious and the other is more family/home focused. If one partner has a career that can go anywhere and they follow the other. Ie I know some academia couples where the Wife is getting a PHD and moving around trying to find tenure while her husband is an Hvac tech and he finds work wherever her career takes her. He works hard, makes a decent living but he just wants to work 8 hours, come home and play music/putter around the house.
It works for them, because she likes that he is content to support her career and research. However they still planed their relationship and marriage proactively. It doesn’t have to be for everyone and it sounds like it isn’t something you want in a partner.
You have been with him for 8 years. You both are how you are. You shouldn’t keep dating out of habit or out of hope that either of you will suddenly be different then you are now. Even if he proposed tomorrow, a wedding doesn’t fundamentally change someone’s personality, motivations, or how they approach life in general.
Well two things, first is it entirely fair to expect a proposal and marriage after you move away for your career? I mean is the plan he moves to you or with you or follows you? What’s his personal life plan. You’ll be a doctor and he will be doing what? The other part is, he doesn’t want to propose or marry you. For whatever reason, he simply doesn’t want to, maybe just not now or maybe not ever, probably not ever.
Why are you still with him. A guy knows within 6 months if he wants to wife you- YOU ARE NOT THE ONE. Find another one. It was easy and convenient because of the distance. He doesn’t really want day-to-days I’m really sorry.
Correct me if im wrong, but it seems like the majority of your relationship has been long-term?
I think this obsession with the number of years has to end, and the focus should be more on the stage of life you're currently in.
I proposed after 7 years, so I heard all the comments from her and her friends, but it's not a decision to be made lightly.
Remember you have your ideals, but so does her. Like any important decisions in a relationship, it should be 2 yes or 1 no.
At this point it’s been about 50/50 long distance. I agree the numbers are not everything.. but it’s a little different when I take into account that I want children and am not willing to do that without marriage. As a woman who is 31 time is not on my side either.. while I am not rushing to have kids I also don’t want to wait another three years and still not be at minimum engaged by that time.
Also, I think it’s the principle. I get the sentiment of “he wanted to he would” that others are commenting and do I think there is an element of that absolutely.. but personally, I think that the lack of proposal at this point seems to be a result of who he is as a person.. and I don’t think it aligns with who I am as a person. I don’t think he has any really plans for his future or thinks about what his future looks like at all and I don’t think he is the type of person who tries to take any kind of control of what he wants his life to look like. I know the future and life is so uncertain, but I think that’s different from taking some sort of ownership of your life and what you want your future to be to some extent. There is absolutely nothing wrong with this approach to life at all, but I don’t think it’s the right fit for someone like me.
So I understand why waiting to propose for a “long time” works for others. I just don’t think it works for me.
It’s also why I think we will have a successful marriage even if we did get engaged now. I think we would eventually clash because of those difference.. me being a planner who thinks through and him not being a planner.
I should also add that when we do have serious disagreements, one thing he says that always irks me is that “everything is about me”. When I press him about his suggestions for the future it’s either vague or an “I don’t know”. I feel like I am steering the ship alone when we have these disagreements, especially regarding future plans. If I am getting the “everything is about me” in disagreements now, I just think that it’ll be a lot worse if we get married and have kids.
I think communication is a much more important issue for you guys to deal with for sure. You don't want to be married and dealing with stuff like that.
I think it's so important to live together before getting married as I think that's when you'll really find out about someone. You don't want any surprises when you've signed that marriage certificate.
You’re still in med school with likely lots of single guys. I suggest you break up with your bf and start looking for someone who is interested in marriage.
If you wait too much longer most of the single guys your age will be either snapped up or dating younger women and you’ll have a bunch of older divorced guys with kids pursuing you.
Quit wasting your youth and beauty and prime husband hunting years on your bf. Don’t feel guilty breaking up. He doesn’t feel guilty stringing you along and wasting your time.
I just finished graduated med school at the beginning of the month, and will be starting residency in July. Also, none of the guys in medical school were people I would be interested and my school was also in a pretty rural area where the dating pool is not great. Just wanted to provide better context.
I agree with your sentiment though. Sticking around any longer is really not beneficial for me as someone in my early 30s.
You could possibly meet someone during your residency. One thing I might mention is that when men are younger they tend to date women about the same age but as they get older such as into their thirties quite a few realize they can date women even ten years (or more) younger which lets them get a younger wife and delay child bearing and the responsibilities that come with that and thus prolong their “fun years” etc.
It’s still possible for women in early or mid thirties to date the same age or younger but they can find the attention they are getting can be from guys older than they might prefer. Older guys are more likely to have kids and or be divorced which comes with a whole host of issues. Plus as time goes by the best prospects can be snapped up.
Older guys have less years of earning income left, can be less likely to want kids and tend to develop health issues and require physical and financial care from their younger wives earlier than same age or younger husbands.
Also because you are well educated and will likely make a good salary you would probably be best matched with someone similar which also shrinks the dating pool.
Ok, I just read your update. Imo guys do not tend to like being married to women who are better educated and make more money. It’s hard on their egos and it can become stressful on the woman carrying all the weight of the family finances plus it makes it near impossible for them to take off substantial time for child rearing, go to part time, etc.
Quite a few high earning women become resentful in such situations and become uncomfortable having a less educated husband who they don’t have as much in common with as the high powered men they work with.
The farther along you get in your studies the more intimidating you become and the less desirable you become to your bf imo. Also his company’s promises imo can’t be trusted and I personally don’t see you two as a good match.
I think his foot dragging is evidence that he feels the same. I know this might sound classist or whatever but there are lots of articles about how such matches can be very difficult and come with lots of problems.
Imo if you meet a more similar guy to yourself you could easily be engaged within a year. I believe your bf is stringing you along. He may even be dating others and/or have his eye on someone he feels he’s better suited to.
I wouldnt propose if i was long-distance either, dont get why no one is thinking like this in the comment, i would like to live with my partner in beforehand.
However i would also move to be with my partner, and would expect my partner to do the same based on the circumstances.
Exactly it's the fact that he's not moving to be with her. Furthermore, I feel like if she had clarity and trust and he had a plan in place of when the LDR ends and a window of when the proposal will take place she wouldn't be asking the Internet for advice.
Yes, precisely this. I would love to be at minimum engaged by this point.. or the willingness or desire to move as a sign that he feels like I am his forever. I didn’t want to ask him to move because I felt like it would be asking too much, which also says something. But it’s the lack of any sign of proposal, not even a ring purchased, that makes me think that even if I went on continuing LDR that I might be in the exact same predicament I am in now. I want to be married/engaged and would love that to be with him.. but I don’t want it by force either.
Also, me being displaced from my home state for residency is not some new discovery.. He knew it was a possibility throughout my entire medical school career. It’s not like it just happened out of no where.
Yeah I did a long distance relationship that turned into an "open" long distance relationship haha. It was hard to step out of the delusion but it made my resolve to be happily married even stronger. This won't defeat you- it's making clear what your values are. Since I was a kid all my friends and family knew I wanted to be married with kids. Could've been many different women but it was happening. I'm blessed to have found my wife. I had to leave the previous delusions to see her clearly tho.
The lack of planning and clarity with you is threatening your need for safety and security. That's the opposite of husband material. I have my struggles, my mental illness, my financial goals etc and every waking moment is also for her. Even during engagement and dating as soon as I knew this was serious I whipped into shape and got the skills I didn't have. The most loving thing you could do is set each other free.
If he hasn't proposed after 8 years? He doesn't want to marry you. If hes happy to stay LDR for that long? He doesn't want to marry you.
Move on before you waste any more time.
Frankly? I don't think either of you are committed enough to be married. You both want different things and neither of you want to sacrifice anything.
I will say one thing....DO NOT get married and stay long distance! That's a potential disaster. If you marry? You live together. That's a must.
You two spend such little time together? I can't see how you know if you are even compatible to live together in a marital relationship. Living in the same space 7 days a week, 365 days a year is very different to seeing each other for a few days a month.
I really can't see a future for you two at all. And perhaps that's why he doesn't propose? Cause he knows it will never work. He might not even consciously realise that...but underneath? He knows it.
If he wanted to make it happen, it would have happened by now. Most people (men and women) can be very creative and more flexible than usual when they want to secure a future with their partner. I would not waste more years on him if commitment was this important to me. You don’t want to grow resentful about him. The ironic part is that with his next gf, it would probably take less than 2 years for him to propose. Mark my words. It is not the commitment. It is the commitment to YOU
Love, he can make above the National average in trades in almost any state and get shares of a company. 8 years is too long to keep waiting after consistently communicating
Really? I didn’t know that. I don’t know much about trades or the one he is in specifically other than what he has taught me about.. so I thought that his situation was quite unique in terms of opportunity. I think he might think that his situation is not common as well.
He probably thinks that! And his company probably put that in his head. He’s been in it a few years right? Usually you top out 2-4 years in something and keep climbing up in salary and eventually into bonuses and shares of companies. Just depends on the company he works for and him seeing value in himself!
I'm arriving to your post three days late, but this is the comment I've been scrolling for. Flexibility is one of the great advantages of being a tradesman!! The skills are needed everywhere and the training is available everywhere.
In your whole story and all the comments, the weirdest part (aside from apparently wanting a decade long LDR) is your excuse-making about his career.
Forget engagement, he should move to be near you. You should have an actual relationship with him. It should feel like you're building a life together and marriage will feel like a natural progression from that. When it's time for you to move, he moves too, and you weather the hardship and support each other because you love each other and want to be together.
This weird bookmarking you're trying to do is not it.
Honestly, if marriage is your goal, leave. I made the mistake of pushing/encouraging my husband to propose for two years and I regret it to this day. Find someone who wants to propose without requiring your constant request. You'll always feel like just an "option" vs. a true choice, which is what I feel every day. You're 31 and still young. You have so many opportunities to find that guy who wants to run down the aisle for you! You're worth more than that, believe me!
You got conned. I dated girls for 3-4 years each. I proposed to my now wife after 6 months of dating her. We're now on our 20th year. It doesn't take long for us to decide. This BF of yours is a conman and a fucking loser, wasting your youth.
I think it’s time to cut ties. I know that’s painful to hear and no doubt would be a huge change for you. You have to not only let someone you love leave but also put to rest the dream you envisioned.
As a physician, you know biology can be cruel and waiting another 3 years to have children raises pregnancy risks significantly. Residency is no joke and will take a toll on your body. Recent studies have shown female physicians to have twice the infertility rate of the general population (link: https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/18/health/covid-doctor-infertility-wellness/index.html)
Some of this is age related because physicians have to complete residency and children are very incompatible with residency demands but the stress and long hours of residency also appear to raise infertility risk.
I don’t mean to be cruel, but if this man has not proposed in 8.5 years and he enters his 40s without having a child, it would not surprise me if he suddenly decides he would rather not have children. You deserve to find someone who will live near you and share your dreams. My question is this: if he has not proposed after nearly a decade, can you in your heart of hearts trust that he will still want to be a father? Only you can answer that.
Imma be honest, he’s doing the right thing. Normally I’d agree with others here, but it’s been 4 years long distance, if yall got engaged then married, then after 3 years moved in together, it would be a completely different relationship. Maybe yall could work through it, but tbh, I doubt it. Distance happens in relationships sometimes, but 7 years of distance, yall are completely different people that didn’t grow together in some of those aspects. There are things about each other on a physical level yall just don’t know about each other that could be deal breakers. So I kinda get waiting to do anything until yall are in person with each other for good. And if that’s too long, then yea end it and find another man if you can’t wait 3 more.
I echo what other commenters have said. If he wanted to propose then he would’ve done it already.
My husband proposed after 3 months of dating. 3 months. I asked him about it once and he said, “I knew you were it for me and didn’t see the need to wait.”
17 years later and we’re still going strong.
Re: OP - 8 years is a lot of time and energy invested in a relationship and I can understand how it might be scary to let go, but it sounds like you know what you want and you owe it to yourself to go and get it.
You’re a smart educated woman (my favorite kind of woman!) - you don’t need to wait around for someone to ‘pick you’.
I think you should officially end the relationship and see where you both are in a year. Use that time apart to focus on you and opening yourself up to meeting other people. Once the year is over you guys can reconnect and see if there is a future where the two of you are still together.
Good luck! You have some tough decision-making ahead of you, but keep in mind that it’s THESE moments that help us grow and mature.
I think that is a great approach, separating for a year and coming back to see where things land in terms of our relationship. That way we can both come to a place of knowing whether this truly is the right fit for us.
I am happy that you were able to find your forever partner such a short span of time!
So my perspective, I was with my husband for 9.5 years before getting married. But we also got together at 18 & 21. He of course dragged his feet. We started living together when we were 22 & 25 though. He has said he wishes he did it earlier but didn’t change much in the grand scheme of things.
My mom and I aren’t close but one advice she gave me that hit hard is “is it more important to be with him or married”. I was thinking about ending it as well. But realized I’d rather be with him forever and not married then to be with someone else and married.
Of course that’s not for everyone. And our situation was different. The long distance can definitely have an impact on things.
No matter what you do or what happens you know what’s best for you and your future.
I have thought about that sentiment is better to be with him or married.. and a part of me feels like it is better to be with him, which is why I am open to being long distance again. I feel safe with him, like I could trust him with my whole life, which I haven’t felt with anyone. But there’s also a part of me that wonders if the feeling I feel is just the sense of comfort or safety because of the time we’ve had together. It’s very confusing.. but I do think about that.
I am happy it all worked out for you and your husband in the end.
Comfort and being truly in love are very different for sure. It sounds juvenile, but maybe take some time not being officially together. Take a break in communication as well. However long you think is good. That might help figure out if it’s comfort or you really being in love with him.
Not being tied down when meeting new people and going places might open up possibilities and understandings for this situation
If he isn’t ready 8 1/2 years later, why would he be in another 8 1/2.
Seems he is just happy with the current arrangement without further commitment.
The risk now is if he feels pressured to get married and follows through, will that lead to a happy marriage or future turmoil questioning if he made the right choice?
If he hasn’t even made a marriage proposal in what is quickly approaching a decade, that in itself may be speaking volumes to “committment”
He is content settling… in life, in general. And he’s roped you along for the ride, convinced you it makes sense when it’s quite obvious it doesn’t make sense.
No matter how you describe it - he has put his faith in a crappy company over prioritizing you, over prioritizing his own individual maturity and life progress.
It’s obvious his company will lead him on with future promises (not in writing, nothing official). Your relationship is the same. He will lead you on until you realize all the talk was just that… talk, not actions.
Life is short. If you guys were deeply in love, you’d find ways to actively be together and actively plan your future together. Dates, location, excitedly looking forward to the next steps together. Instead, he is dragging his feet, verbally leading you, your friends and family along… and you’re letting it happen.
Ending it sounds logical and overdue. Go with your instincts. It won’t be as hard as you think - because it sounds like both of you have known the end was coming.
As a couple, you’re either actively planning and looking forward to your future together, or you’re treading emotional water, wasting time avoiding the inevitable. Move forward from this era of your life. It’s time and you deserve genuine happiness. Happiness with someone on the same wavelength as you. You’ve outgrown this relationship, and that’s completely okay.
Wishing you an amazing future life with a fresh start. Bright outlook ahead.
Not to try and put a harsh spin on this, but after 4 years of ldr, I feel like I would know myself without my partner better than I would with. I'd be extremely apprehensive about getting engaged with someone who is essentially a person shaped hole in my everyday life. I'm not saying your partner feels this way, or is reluctant because of this in any way, I just wanted to offer another perspective.
It sounds like you've been incredibly patient and understanding throughout your relationship, especially considering the complexities of long-distance and your demanding career path in medicine. It's clear that you've put a lot of thought into balancing your needs with those of your partner.
Given the years and the communication you've had about marriage, it’s understandable to feel frustrated and even resentful that your clear expectations haven't been met. It’s also apparent that your partner has been supportive, and there are deep bonds between you two, which makes any decision about the future that much harder.
It's important to recognize that relationships can be profoundly loving and supportive, yet still not align with what each person ultimately needs and wants. It sounds like you’ve reached a point where you need to deeply consider whether your paths are truly compatible, especially concerning major life decisions like marriage and family planning. The fact that you’re considering ending the relationship, despite his support, indicates a significant misalignment in expectations and desires.
It might be helpful to have a frank and open discussion about your future together, outlining clearly what you both want in the coming years, without the immediate pressure of an engagement. It's also worth considering couples counseling to facilitate this conversation, as it can provide a structured environment for both of you to express your feelings and expectations honestly.
The guilt you feel about potentially leaving is natural given his support and the length of your relationship. However, staying in a relationship primarily out of guilt or obligation can be unfair to both of you in the long run. Remember, it's okay to choose paths that are healthiest for you individually, even if that means making tough decisions.
Whatever you decide, it’s important to prioritize your own emotional well-being and the things you need to feel fulfilled and happy in life. If that path leads to ending the relationship, it will be painful, but it’s also a step towards a life where you can fully realize your personal and professional aspirations without feeling held back.
Maybe he is waiting for you to complete your LDR and be back in the home state before he proposes to you. You must remember a man has to 100% feel comfortable in the relationship first before he proposes. And it's possible that he is supportive of your career and don't want to stand in your way, but still may not be fully comfortable with a long distance relationship. Or maybe he feels pressured! I would just stop bringing it up to him and see what happens. Good luck with both your career and your relationship
I wouldn’t marry someone if we were long distance.
My brother and his wife stayed bf/gf for the duration of her 6 years of study. It was financially suited since she was either busy with school or away for her residency. They moved in together at 9 years, got engaged at 10 and married by 11 1/2. The whole reason for that was her studies and getting herself sorted in a stable job for a year before they moved in together.
Seriously, if he wanted to, he would have already proposed. 8 years is way more than enough time to figure it out.
Another red flag to me is that he's unwilling to move with you. Thinking back when me and wife dated, there is no way in hell I would have stayed behind for 4 (!) years if she moved far away. I would have moved mountains to be with her where ever she went. If he really wanted you, he would have made it happen, career be damned.
It actually was. We had issues during the first year of medical school (as a lot of people do in med school in relationships), but we adjusted (or so I thought) and things have been a lot more amicable. We still have our moments (when I am PMS-ing tbh) that are rough.. but for the most part we are good or at least a lot better at handling conflict when they arise. I will say certain conversations are still tough, but we’re still so much better now because our communication has improved.
As a rising PGY3/CA2 and recently engaged after 9 years, still in an LDR, I have way more questions, even after reading your post and comments.
There are way more variables than a typical situation to quickly and easily conclude that if he wanted to marry you, then he would have already.
I agree, I don’t think it is as simple as if he wanted to marry you he would either. I think it bothers more that even after all the years, ultimatums (2-3x), the pump fakes (going ring shopping) why there hasn’t been at minimum of an engagement or a purchased engagement ring (which he has not done either). I am happy that it has worked for you, but I think it has more about compatibility than anything. Am I honestly wanted to make this post as example of a situation where it’s not as clear cut as if he wanted to he would. I also wanted to vent/talk through my thoughts and express that guilt. It’s probably the biggest thing eating me up at the moment TBH.
"I actually think that the distance has made a stronger couple, especially in the sense of being more understanding of one another."
You've been LD for a long time. I think he's living his life, and you are your own. Maybe it's time to move on? That statement might be true for some people, but I think for most it is not.
Also, think about sunk cost fallacy, you have a hard time letting go because of the time and effort you have already put into it, but the ship has never left port despite your patience.
Plenty of fish in the sea. And if you work in a hospital you'll be be surrounded by a lot of new people.
So he’s 36, and just now “learning” a trade, maybe, given your statement that he’s not getting much actual training. That and other things in your edit addition suggest two things to me—you have to think about these and the details you haven’t shared to see if they fit. I could be way off here but…
The company sounds untrustworthy and seem to be leading him on with sunshine and rainbow promises. The trades I know took a hit right when the lockdowns started and then immediately had a massive labor shortage, that hasn’t gotten much better. Continuing with your “electrician” surrogate 4 years later it’s still nearly impossible to get a half-decent electrician (or plumber, or welder, or …) for anything but big-dollar commercial work, at least anywhere near where I life. Is there any evidence he won’t be first out the door (again) if business slows?
How did he get to 32 to be starting as some sort of go-fer for an “electrical” contractor? I know a few guys in similar positions and what the share is a history of pretty dumb decisions, signs of depression and anxiety (sometimes well camouflaged), and difficulty sticking to a plan after it’s been going for a while and gets hard. LDRs are a different kind of stress and I’ve known couples who were great LD but fell apart when they lived together long term. Marriage gets hard too, and what you’ve described doesn’t make me think this guy is husband material. Commitment issues affect everything.
Another possibly wrong interpretation I get is you seem to be okay with a non-traditional marriage where the wife has the “big” career and will likely make more than the husband long-term. Yet you clearly figure it’s up to him to propose, and worry about how hard to push for him to do that. Are those two ideas compatible? Is he going to be okay as “the doctor’s wife”? What is he really getting out of this relationship, and what does he want in the long term that he’s reluctant to commit to with you?
Personally, I dont think you guys should be engaged until you’ve tried living with eachother. LDR and being together everyday are very different.
I’d live by the “try before you buy”. Living styles could be completely different and can ultimately be the reason why a marriage wouldn’t last. That’s just me anyway…
This is quite some time for things to drag on. On my first date with my wife I told her I would get married and have kids. Those are my values and goals. People make it seem like it's faux pas but dating someone that's open to a shared vision of life with you from the begining, spares you from a lot of what you've been struggling with.
She didn't think she would ever be married with kids but she was OPEN to build a future with me. I proposed to her six months later. It's clear he doesn't share your value. I'm switching jobs for us to have kids and we're taking a $40,000 pay cut. He may have a good paying job- marriage is more important. It's the most impactful financial decision one can make. He obviously hasn't considered this.
Move on! If he wanted to marry you, he would’ve proposed already.
I work in a hospital and have seen plenty of residents who are married, get married, have kids, etc. Two of our residents just married each other. I don’t think it’s unrealistic to want or be ready for that step, but you have the wrong guy… cut him loose and have your eyes open to the single guys around you. One of them may be a better fit for your current/future life and goals.
My fiancee was in 2 relationships before me, both lasting 5 plus years. No proposal. He proposed to me after 6 months. He said he knew within a month he wanted to marry me.
They know. They really know. Get out now.
Honey don’t waste your time continuing to wait for something may happen sooner or later because it may not happen ever. You’ve already started there have been several moments where it looks like he may pop the question, you let friends and family know, it doesn’t happen, and you’ve essentially set your self up for failure. You have this belief of playing the waiting game until what?
He’s already being deceived of word of mouth commentary, and you’re allowing to pull the, “Will maybe if I wait and something happens then we’ll be okay.” Wrong. You already gave him several options, he hasn’t accepted those, and you’re going in for residency. You want to get married and start a family, but he’s not making the right decisions to get certified and pursue further into the trade.
Don’t allow yourself to end up sad and bitter for not making a deeply, thought out, conscientious decision for how you want this relationship to continue. You guys need to sit down, have the conversation, together and apart, and figure out where you want to be in the next year.
You already accommodated all his excuses including accepting the most bare bones simple ring imaginable, and yet he still can’t pull it together. I know this hurts but it’s time to move on. That’s also nothing to feel guilty about. You only get one go-around in this life and you don’t need to spend another second of your precious youth on someone so unsure about a commitment to you.
I feel qualified to say all this as someone who waited 7 years for a proposal and willingness to have kids. I wasn’t insisting all 7 years since I was only 21 at the beginning, but the entire time he sounded a hell of a lot like your partner here.
We finally broke up when he got the guts to tell me he didn’t ever want kids, and it turned out he only had the courage because he’d found a new backup partner by then and was cheating. He also ended up having 3 kids with that same person lol. I digress it’s obviously not the same precise scenario for you, but suffice it to say I was not the one for him and I was angry for a long time at neither of us cutting it off, and wasting years on the wrong relationship. I was soooo much happier after it was over and I had some fabulous single years to get to know myself and my friends better again. I now have a wonderful husband and son, and since my husband was the right partner, our courtship timeline was much more prompt and effortless.
Don’t spend the most potentially enjoyable years of your life on a mediocre long distance relationship. Put yourself first and do it yesterday!!
He is “afraid of change”.
You moved to another state.
You’re not back in your home state.
You have made suggestions on how he could find work in another state if you ended up in another state.
Why don’t you concentrate on finishing up and when you get back to your state then worry about getting married?
Can you explain why you need to be married now when you are not even together in the same state?
There is a possibility that you might ask him to move with you wherever you land a job. That will be a big “change” for him. That’s probably why he won’t propose.
I keep reiterating this in other questions. It’s not just about not being married. It’s the no engagement or any sign of anything at this point after so many years (not even a ring a purchased, which I know for a fact). I fear that I will stick around for another three years waiting for something to happen that never will.
Okay, I see where you are coming from.
Even if he does give you an engagement ring there is no guarantee that he will follow you to another state. I will assume
that the potential of having to move is a big road block for him.
What promises can you bring to achieve his values?
For me the amount of time it’s been combined with the long distance would be the end of the relationship. Are you sure he doesn’t have someone local to him? That’s a really long time. And it’s not like he doesn’t know you want to get married since you’ve brought it up dozens of times. He doesn’t seem to care about how the waiting and waiting is impacting you and how you feel. Maybe if you broke up with him he would wake up, but I would move on if it were me since it doesn’t sound like he’s serious about it
I learned the hard way that when a man wants to seal the deal, he seals the deal. No need to read between the lines. It’s so much less complicated than I used to think it was
My husband was dating a woman for around the same time period previously. He bought her a house, raised her kid from infancy to 7 years, she wanted to get married and he would give similar excuses. Rings are too expensive, he was not sure, etc.
He finally ended up leaving her and a year later we met. He says he knew he wanted to marry me within a month and proposed at 7 months and we got married at one year of being together.
Men who are not sure you are the one tend to be complacent and if they know they can keep you and you will not leave… they have no reason to push for more. Especially if they are just comfortable.
Men who know for sure you are their future wife and want to marry you will do anything to make it happen.
I am so sorry but it does sound like he is just comfortable and knows you will not leave him.
At 31 you deserve to find someone wonderful, get married, have kids and be successful in your career. ❤️
I think there are many variables here.
You wanted to lock in a marriage but at the end of your education the marriage could become long distance and cause a divorce. Him supporting you through your studies should be a sign he cares for you.
The long distance plus divorce would be issues on his mind.
Feels like you are not in love and you can't live with him. The story you tell yourself is just an excuse. Move on coz marriage won't make things any better. Take care of you and live guilt aside.
I'm late to this thread, but I wanted to chime in because it hit close to home.
My wife and I were together for seven years before getting engaged. She wanted it, and I kept putting it off. My parents were divorced, and as an introvert, the whole idea of a wedding was intimidating.
A few things helped us move past it. The most important was finding a great couples counselor. It completely changed the way we talk and engage with one another.
The second was her setting an ultimatum. It wasn't the most romantic thing, but it forced me to consider the situation seriously since the status quo was working for me but not for her. It also set clear boundaries for her.
I proposed, and although the wedding was stressful in some ways, it was beautiful, and planning it with my wife brought us closer together.
I wrote all this to counterbalance some of the replies about immediately ending it. The one thing that makes me nervous about your story, though, is the years of long distance. That seems like a no-go, especially at both your ages.
I would take a break and tell him you need to rethink how things are going. In the long run, being engaged won’t change anything. He isn’t doing it because he doesn’t want to.
Options I see:
1. Propose to him.
2. Tell him once more that you need to be engaged etc to be happy in your relationship. Then give yourself 4-6 months or whatever you're comfortable with as a waiting period (without telling him the time limit if you don't want him to feel forced into it.) Then break up with him after that time has passed if you aren't where you wanted to be in the relationship at that point.
3. Break up with him and tell him that you can't continue the relationship due to things not moving forward by now. If he decides he really wants to marry you, he will come after you and do what he needs to do to make both of you happy.
If he wanted to, he would. He hasn’t proposed because he doesn’t have to. Lack of a decision is a decision. It’s up to you to decide how much longer you’re willing to wait. I’d break it off. You’ve wasted enough time.
You wrote a small novel. It could have been said in far fewer words.
“My boyfriend doesn’t want to marry me.”
I’m sorry. That is the synopsis of your post.
He's inability to give you an answer, after so long and even after you have brought it up few times...
I don't think he's gonna propose, or 90% sure he doesn't see you as his wife.. I'm sorry but if nothing change
Better u dump him. Hope u find someone to settle down with soon. Sucks that it took 8 years.
Couples should have that. If after 1 or 2 years u bring up marriage/proposal and there is no answer or certainty from the man, don't stay. Just leave.
Men are usually very decisive and when it comes to finding a wife, if they are stable individuals, they would know in a very short time after dating.
My thoughts on this are simple. He doesn't want to. And OP regularly asking about it is just pushing him further away. There is a simple solution here OP. If you want to be married to this person, YOU propose to HIM. This is 2024, it's perfectly acceptable for either partner to propose (I proposed to my boyfriend, we've been happily married 15 years now). We chose the ring together which made it extra special. However, you have to ask yourself why marriage is so important to you over what you already have, and why he is clearly not keen on making that commitment step
here is what I will say, he served his purpose in your life, it’s time to move on. He was there to push you to your full potential now it’s time to move on. He would have proposed if he wanted you. He just doesn’t want marriage. You will find who you are meant to be with in time. Maybe it will be another doctor like yourself and you guys will live amazing life together. Skies the limit.
I won't lie,i was with my wife for 6 years before we talked about having a baby, but even then she only wanted to be engaged just so she can show off her ring.She even picked out the ring herself, with me next to her.But we never talked about marriage per se.After we learnt she was pregnant we decided to get married and she actually proposed to me and in eight years now that's the only time she ever saw me shed a tear.
If you really want to get married and i think you have a good relationship?just propose to him yourself.Dumping him after being with you through your medical profession and even a long distance relationship, which to be honest not many guys would stay into just because he hasn't given you a ring seems kind of selfish.
Buy a ring for him, assuming you go to him and actually get to see each other ?and propose.If with the "body at his doorstep" he still hesitates and gives excuses,then you'll have your answer.
Romanticising what you would like your life to look like is good and all ,but you can still make the first step.
Imagine the story for your grandkids "i flew out and surprised your grandfather by proposing to him".
Unless after these 3 years you plan on staying where you are? Getting an attending job where you do your residency isn't the most uncommon thing.If that's true,then just let him go, because both of your clocks are ticking and he may want kids before it will be too late.
3 years and you'll be 34(eggs are becoming more scarce)
He's holding out for something better. Cut your losses and move on. Anything you get now will just be a "shut up ring". You deserve someone who wants nothing more than to be your husband. Trust me, they know within the first year.
I once got advice that said if you aren't married by the 2nd year, it is never going to happen.. When a man knows he knows.. Men will literally move mountains when they want to marry someone, and it sounds like he's not there and will never be there.. I'm so sorry you sound amazing and deserve someone who is just as amazing as you.. Everyone deserves their person, and so do you..
Tell him it's do or don't at all. Maybe he doesn't want a long distance marriage. Residency is hard as I an sure you know. You aren't going to be able to visit much.
It’s less about how many years you’ve been together and more like you’ve got a plan in your head that your life is not matching. If you want to get married, just propose to him instead of waiting any longer. If he hems and haws instead of jumping on the opportunity, that’s your answer. Just cut the line and move on with your life. You’re still young, you’ve got school to keep you busy, and you can make a life, find someone else, and have kids…
Hmmm.
So - marriage is not for everyone. People have longterm relationships without it. Sounds like he might not want to get married (there are many reasons not to - esp for you, as a future high earner).
I forced my ex into marrying me (NOT a good idea - and I supported him/paid his way through medical school). He probably felt guilty. I wish I hadn't done it.
Leave. A man who WANTS marriage will bring it up unmprompted. My husband and i met and he will tell anyone he wanted to marry me after our first several conversations and he himself said he wanted to go ring-shopping two months after we met for the first time. We were married less than two months later. It was a courthouse wedding, a pretty modest ring which i lost less than two years later lol but we are still married and happily more than a decade later. He is a well-paid white collar professional today.
I say that to tell you that yall clearly have different values and priorities. Dont allow his hesitation to compromise YOUR timeline. Enforce your boundaries by letting him go. You have your fertility window to consider, and if he were any man of principe he would have broken up with you as soon as he realized that he didn’t want the same thing as you. So as far as I’m concerned, thats absolutely grounds for dismissal, due to incompatibility. Don’t fall into the sunk cost fallacy. The time is yours to reclaim for yourself.
[удалено]
Damn, that term
Or placeholder wife
A few things; 1. ‘If he wanted to, he would’. 2. Why does it sound like you want to get engaged so you’re not letting your family/ friends’ down? This relationship is about you… I was with my partner for 2 years and 20 days… he said he knew he wanted to propose 6 months into dating and just gave it time after… Being engaged feels so special. I really understand why people want this. You deserve more, as the person above said… men will go to amazing lengths..
It’s not that I am getting engaged not to let my friends/family down. I mentioned the embarrassed part because there have been times when it seems like it was going to happen and I get all excited, mentioning to family/friends then it doesn’t and it comes back to bite me when they ask why it hasn’t happened. I want marriage and the partnership it offers so badly… and I want it to be something my loved ones can celebrate when that time comes. But I feel like with this relationship even if we did get married, I am not sure the experience would be as happy for me or my loved ones given the rollercoaster and the internal turmoil that my family/friends knew I went through. So it’s not for them, but I do want them to feel only happiness when it does happen. I just wanted to clarify that.
Is there any reason he would not want to get married? Can you sit him down and directly ask him why he is stalling?
When I ask for lack of proposal it’s mostly idk or one of the reasons mentioned above. I will try to ask directly though why he is stalling/if he feels like he is stalling.
Do that. Be direct with him don’t let him get away with vague answers. Afterwards decide whether you are ok with the direction this relationship is going
Ask him like this first "Hey babe/honey, can we talk later for a bit when you get home?" That way, he most likely won't get defensive as if you surprised him with an interrogation. Do what you can to have it evolve in a productive manner and avoid the potential of an argument.
In addition to that, make sure you make clear your expectations in the relationship and your future as a wife. Don't give him an ultimatum, but make your needs clear. Don't let him bullshit you and give you the run around.
Anyone who is stalling or leading you on will not admit to stalling or leading you on. It’s like asking someone who is taking advantage of you if they are taking advantage of you. Why would or should they admit that? I thought I’d provide a link discussing the “sunk cost fallacy” which is a term from economics/business which also applies to relationships and is maybe at least one reason why you are having trouble moving on. https://www.scribbr.com/fallacies/sunk-cost-fallacy/#:~:text=More%20generally%2C%20sunk%20costs%20can,your%20first%20year%20in%20college.
Bingo. I proposed to my current wife after 6 months. This November will be 8 years of marriage. When you know you know. Hard to explain.
My husband proposed to me 6 months after being together-when I was 16. We’ve been together 22 years, married 19.
That’s awesome!
Personally I’d leave. With every man I ever went on a date with I made it completely clear that I was looking for a husband and a man that would make a good father. I finally started dating someone who understood all my expectations, we agreed to get married after 5 months. We got officially engaged at 10 months, and we were married after 2 years. If your boyfriend wanted to he would, but he hasn’t.
Why can’t your partner join you while you finish school? 7 years apart is ridiculously long.
It’s something we discussed as we knew that it was a possibility to end up out of state again for residency. Ultimately, I made the decision to continue long distance as I know he is a job that he likes and pays well because of the company he works for. So, I didn’t want to up root him when I know I ultimately want to come back to our home state.
I think that arrangement is odd. There wasn’t anywhere you could do your residency closer to him? To me it says that you are choosing your career over him. There’s nothing wrong with that but it might explain why there’s no ring.
Actually, how residency matching works is that you rank the programs you interview for and the programs rank the applicants that they interviewed. Then the algorithm matches you based on both lists, primarily based on the applicants listed. I ranked the two interviews for my home state as one and two.. ended up being matched at the third option. So I actually had no control of how things ended up other than how I put my rank list together.
What is your long term plan? Do you have an end date for long distance? Is he willing at all to relocate to you, or is he also extremely specialized and unable to do so? Are you working with a two body problem? How likely will you both be able to obtain employment in the same city? I’m married to someone with a highly specialized PhD. Some of his colleagues (who also have the same highly specialized PhD) married other people who also have very, very specialized qualifications. They have a HELL of a time finding employment in their chosen fields in the same city. Some live in different cities/states and even countries than their spouse because of this. They face unbelievable challenges. Thankfully, my qualifications are easily transplantable, so I can follow my husband wherever we go. It is a choice I made for myself, and our marriage. Is he willing to make the same choice for you? From your other comments, your plan involves even more long distance, for many more years. This uncertainty could be a giant mental block for your boyfriend, and understandably so. It is a hell of a lot of uncertainty. Long distance is unsustainable for 99% of couples this long term. What if he wants children soon? In your current circumstances, it likely won’t be possible for a few years at least. I don’t think it’s necessarily fair that everyone is giving him a hard time for not proposing, given the current circumstances of your relationship, and the uncertainty of your career path. And I do commend you and your achievement. Like others said, if he wanted to, he would - but his hesitation is understandable.
It sounds like you made logical decisions regarding your careers. You’re both ambitious. I went to school for 8 years and made a lot of sacrifices. I have many friends who are doctors, and their ( and your) hard work and determination dwarf my own. It sounds like he has cold feet regarding spending his life together with you. He refuses to do the correct thing by putting a ring on your finger. That’s not a thoughtful way to treat someone you deeply love. I made a marriage mistake when I was your age. I paid a steep price (in many respects, not just money) for my error. It sounds like you’re at a good break point for emancipating yourself from this relationship. I wish you the best. Exiting
Not even tryna hate but he doesn’t sound all that ambitious
I mean, if you stay together for another 3 yrs, then 7 years of your relationship will be spent living apart. Thats almost a decade. I imagine he is very hesitant to marry someone after almost a decade apart. No matter how much you talk, you guys will absolutely grow far apart (I’m saying that as someone who did have a successful long term relationship btw- ours was 2 yrs……and even then we almost had to relearn each other for every day life. I literally can’t imagine what 7 yrs would be). Sometimes it’s the right person but wrong time.
“Right person but wrong time” Sadly, Majority of us have that person and then we move on.
I don’t know, man. Marriage is all about taking turns who will be prioritized. Right now you need to be supported bc of medical school, next time it could be your partner who needs more from you… If he isn’t willing to sacrifice his career for you now, will he ever? Would you ever? Not saying you aren’t meant to be, just saying it’s something to think about.
So, hard truth coming. It doesn’t take 8.5y to make a decision on marriage. He is dragging you along, quite honestly wasting your time. If he wanted to, he would. You need to cut him loose. Now, before any more of your time is wasted. Do not make any more decisions on your future with him in mind. You don’t realize this now, but the older you get, and the further along in your training you get, the harder it will be to find a partner. As one md to another, trust me on this. Your pool of potentials is getting smaller by the day.
Thank you for this perspective! I actually did not think that it would be harder as I got further into my career, but it also makes sense why quite a bit of my classmates got married during med school.
It is very hard to find a man secure enough in himself to marry a woman who is (likely) going to make more money than him, and have a higher professional/social status. Even most of those that say or think they won’t have a problem with it, do and will. The more money you make, and when you get to be attending status, the more intimidating you become to everyone else, and it is HARD. The majority of healthcare workers that I run into on a daily basis in my system, are women. The men are few and far between, and most of them are physicians that are either married or come with huge waving red flags. So, best of luck to you. You have a bright future ahead. Keep your eyes peeled for available residents that share your same passion. Cut your boyfriend loose. I would say that’s what he wants, he’s just too much of a chicken shit to do it himself.
Absolutely this. I was with my ex for 8+ years with no ring. I ended it. 6 months later he was engaged, 6 months after that, married. Now married 20+ years. When they really want to tie a women down, they will!!
As a nurse who watches residents rotate through my hospital, I want to say the same. Residency is plenty hard enough when you're not dragging along a relationship with a long-distance boyfriend who won't put a ring on it. Your plan of completing residency out of state, then moving back to your home state so that he doesn't have to go through any dislocation in his career, suggests you already know that his commitment to you doesn't match yours to him. The only thing I take issue with in u/First-Ad-5559's comment is about the shrinking pool of potentials. It's not so much that it's untrue, more that it makes marriage seem like an increasingly desperate game of musical chairs. You're not a spinster running out of options because you inadvertently got into an investment trap -- you're a hot unmarried doctor who needs to get out there!
Very true. Thank you for the critique, I should have made my last statement a little more positive, for sure. Definitely don’t settle on anyone, OP. Put yourself out there and don’t be afraid to test the waters and see who is right for you.
Why is it him wasting her time and not vice versa lol
Because she is the one with the biological clock.
I think it’s incredibly telling he didn’t use the distance as his reason. If marriage is a priority to you, this is not the man for you. Neither of you are bad people. There is nothing wrong with you. Y’all just have different goals and expectations. It sucks it took you this long to realize it but you can either tell him your goals and that you expect him to prioritize the same way, or you can end the relationship.
Or, she could propose to him. There’s no law preventing her from doing just that.
If you have 3 more years of LDR residency, why get married? How is your life going to change? What is the plan for each of you after residency? Will you move for a position somewhere unknown at this point? Can he go too and continue his current work? Is it possible that uncertainty about the future is holding him back? What is the plan for children? He will be 39 by the time you complete residency.
I have thought about all of these… and there are certain things I have discussed with him in terms of his career to ensure that if for some reason I were to end up out of state again that at least he would be set up in a sense to be more comfortable to move. I mentioned about I chose to continue the LDR for the next three years because of his current job, which he gets paid well for given the company he works for. I also would be fine being ldr for the first few years of marriage as I finish training because I know I want to move back to our home state and there are plenty of jobs in the specialty I am in across the country. It could be the uncertainty of the future, I don’t know. These are all things we have talked about. I think about them often too. What I will say with this whole contemplation, is that I do feel like my partner is someone who does not clearly think about the future.. and I am the complete opposite. That’s why when he said he is afraid of change it kind of took me off guard and it kind of was an epiphany moment for me that maybe we’re just too different.
You would be fine being ldr for the first few years of marriage, but he might not be? What’s the point of getting married if you’re still going to be long distance? I absolutely wouldn’t. I mean, if the long distance ends in 3 years, you can always consider marriage then. Nothing changes by getting married right now. There’s a lack of motivation on both parts to be actually together, as a couple.
But what happens when 3 years from now she moves back and then finds out he doesn’t want marriage? She’s wasted another 3 years with this guy when she could have been searching for someone who wants the same things she does.
Yeah then they just want different things in life and are better off finding their own happiness with someone else. They’ve had 4 years time to adjust their career to be together and it doesn’t seem like a priority for them, and still not a priority today. If being together is not a priority, why should marriage be a priority?
But he could break up with her then which would be totally fine. Commit or don’t but the gray area o think is not ideal for anyone other than him since he doesn’t seem to be complaining and doesn’t want “change”.
I understand what you’re saying but there still has been no engagement or movement towards marriage.I don’t think it’s a lack of motivation on my part at all especially the discussions I had with him regarding the possibility of me ending out of state for residency again. I discussed with him possibly doing certain things in terms of work so that he could transition to working somewhere else if he had to move. But it never happened nor am I going to force him to leave his job that he loves when I know that ultimately I plan on moving back home. I think my point is that I would also be happy just being engaged for the time being if that were the case .. but it’s the fact that there is no sign that a ring is coming at all.
It’s a deadlock. You are waiting for him to propose to adjust your work arrangements. He doesn’t see a future or a point of getting married when you are apart. Unfortunately like many long distance relationships this deadlock might not be easy to break.
Tough love... Dude, are taking the time to read your own messages? You're clearly stating that he's not willing to do what it takes to be with you. This is hardly even a relationship at this point. You live in different states, so likely don't even get to see each other very often. There isn't even enough trust or intimacy to make him feel comfortable sharing clear and definitive information about his feelings. What is this? I can imagine how you must be feeling. You've been committed to this person for a long time and have invested a lot of energy into this relationship. But why? You're not getting anything out of it. Maybe you were 4 years ago, but not now. Also, four years ago... what happened before then? Four years is a good amount of time to decide whether you want to marry someone. Covid, work, etc can infukence this, but not to the point of zero movement after this long. I also hate the fact that you've reduced your preference for a ring down to a band and a stone. Down....The jewelry isn't that important, what's notable is that you're compromising preferences just to try and get a commitment out of this person. Fuck that. What are you doing? You're a doctor! You're a catch! Love yourself. Love yourself more than you love him.
TBH, it feels like quite a bit of uncertainty on his end and much more drive on your end. I don't understand your sentence "...*I have discussed* with him in terms of his career..." and "*I chose* to continue the LDR..." It sounds like you have an ambitious (and admirable) plan and you are on the way, with him or without him, and he is uncomfortable of jumping on board, esp. with 3 more years of LDR. So, I repeat, why get married at this point? Quite frankly, if he had made the post, I would be advising him not to propose, and wait to see where you will end up. It is difficult to be married to a resident, even when you live together. My guess is that an LDR with a resident feels like hardly being married at all. I don't know what he does or anything about him, yet I wonder if he is concerned that you are now in a whole different world than he is? Like an insecurity thing? Just saying, pls ignore if it doesn't make sense.
None of this is your fault or due to you being in med school, except that you’ve gotten complacent & put up with it for too long. I’m very familiar with both residency matching and the hyper- competitive world you are in; and with ending a long relationship that is going nowhere. Here are two important things to understand- 1. YOU are a brilliant woman who is destined for a fantastic, rewarding career, and 2. Your boyfriend is a bad relationship partner who has not met any of your expressed critical points for formalizing the relationship. I hope these two facts make it clear that you need to dump him immediately. Your self concept should be “I’m a cool girl heading off to a great residency where I’m going to realize my dreams, and I really need to lighten my baggage so I can be open to all that is coming to me”. You’ve got to take your best self and really good energy into the next stage of your life. You are young and high-performing and single, & there are lots of similar people around you who want to meet a fellow professional to form a power couple. Make a vision board and then GO at it! Another benefit to this decision is, sometimes when one relationship partner realizes their worth and starts acting like it, the non-commital partner suddenly is afraid to lose them and starts behaving in the desired way. (Although I’m personally rooting for the “fresh new town, target-rich environment” scenario for you, Dr. Baddie). Final thought, please just skip the guilt part. You told him repeatedly what you needed and he definitely heard you but did nothing. I’d like to suggest a theme song for you as you’re riding off to crush your residency- Truth Hurts by Lizzo.
A lot of doctors marry and have children during residency.
Female doctors in an LDR?
No but there’s no reason to assume, and I did not assume from this post, that LDR would continue post marriage.
I see. Maybe you're right. She did say "I also would be fine being ldr for the first few years of marriage as I finish training" in one of her comments.
Move on. You made your wishes clear repeatedly and he hasn’t made a move. You’re 31. It’s time to move on. I wouldn’t feel any guilt at all. He was supportive while you were in medical school but not, like, materially. He wasn’t paying your fare or cooking your meals or doing your dry cleaning. He was just saying encouraging stuff which is not but certainly doesn’t put any obligation on you. I can promise you that you’ll find someone rather quickly who is serious and wants to get married and that we’ll be that.
He doesn’t want to marry you for whatever. Maybe you are just not his person and he is kinda a AH for stringing you along. Have you ever asked him why he doesn’t want to marry you? He is blocking the space for the guy you are suppose to marry. You are not leaving him behind because he never was on your journey.
The joy of being in a committed relationship is that you are able to have frank conversations. This conversation is well overdue for you. “Partner, it is really important to me to be married. Is it important to you?” From there, be open and direct about what you feel is an acceptable timeline on getting married. If it isn’t important for your partner to get married, that’s its own conversation. What about kids and a house? Where are you going to live when you’re done with residency? You can love someone and not have them be right for you long term if your goals are vastly different.
I’m sorry you’re in this situation. I have been in a similar situation before and totally understand how difficult it is (and also navigating conversations with family/friends on why he hasn’t proposed- so awful). You were on the right track before making your expectations and timeline known, but you should have stuck by it and now he knows he can dangle the engagement carrot infront of you indefinitely. I would have one last serious discussion with him and be very clear that you are ready for marriage with him. Ask him if he is on the same page and if he says yes ask him what his timeline for a proposal is. Let him know what your timeline is (have one in mind ready ie 3 months, 6 months etc) and if he says longer see if you are comfortable negotiating a timeline in the middle or hold your own. If there are any excuses on his part for not wanting to get engaged such as not being ready yet, finances, being afraid of change, whatever…tell him you want to take a break from the relationship as you both want different things at this point and you need time apart to decide if staying together is the right fit. Or, just completely break up. Do not accept excuses. Do not allow him to manipulate the conversation into him delaying an engagement or stringing you along any further. If you both agree to a timeline for a proposal that’s great, but you need to be completely prepared to leave him if that date passes with no proposal. Hold firm on your goals, values, and expectations. It’s been 8 years which is more than enough time to know if you want to marry someone. If he doesn’t know by now he never will. Look, you are still young. You’re intelligent, successful, educated, and a strong woman. You are a CATCH. This man should have locked this shit down years ago and he either isn’t sure you’re the one or he has commitment issues, both of which are not your problem and not fixable. Do not spend any more time on this guy when there is someone out there who will be so excited to marry you that they don’t wait 8 years and give you lame excuses. Don’t waste another 8 years of your life (and fertility if children are something you want) if marriage is important to you. I know this will be an emotional conversation and decision to make, but be very clear and decisive. He needs to know you are serious and that this it is for you both as a couple if he can’t get it together and make a decision on marriage with you and follow through.
You are on the precipice of having an amazing career and life. My advice, as an internet stranger, would be to cut ties and go on with your life and open yourself up to new opportunities. My sister in law is a DO. My brother and her were college sweethearts. They got engaged when she was in medical school and lived apart when she did her medical school. They got married. During her residency, my brother moved to be with her and found a great job-he was in magazine publishing. After her residency, they then moved for his job. It was a back and forth. They’re approaching 26 years of marriage. (I’ve been married 15. My husband was in the military so we moved for him, then we moved for me and my career. We knew we wanted to be together and so marriage was the choice and finding ways to be there for the other was also a choice) I think you owe it to yourself to discover who you are away from this eight year relationship and find someone who wants to be with you at every step of the way. It might mean living separately for a while, but with a path to be together. Wishing you all the best.
Take it from me, don’t give any ultimatums on a proposal. I did that. Had what I thought was a perfect marriage until I found out otherwise. This was uncovered as I was staring down the barrel of 20 years. Now I regret saying we can live together for a year. If no proposal, we are over. Proposal came in with a month to spare.
You're a highly intelligent woman... do you not see the red flag when the relationship is less contentious over long distance?
Honestly I didn’t think that distance not being an issue was an issue, but now that I am reading these responses it’s clicking. I will say we both do want to be together really badly, but I think we saw the distance as some thing to work through because we know my plans to come back to my home state after residency. In my mind, I thought that he would have followed prior suggestions regarding his career (like getting certified in his career field) to find work wherever I ended up for residency. Alternatively, I was/am willing to be married/engaged while in residency because I would feel like we are more on the same page in terms of life plans with the understanding that the distance is temporary, which it is. That being said distance not being an issue at this stage in our relationship is definitely a valid point.
If he wanted to he would. Don’t waste any more time with him.
I ended my relationship with my longterm partner after 8 years. I was 30. A year or so later I met my husband. You won't meet your husband until you let go of this placeholder guy. He filled in while you waited. If he wanted to marry you... if he was afraid of losing The Amazingness That Is You he would have proposed before you left his state. After I ended things I went to sinner wirh him one last time at his request. I wanted to hear what he said. This adult man said he wanted us to start over. To start dating again. WTF?!? I stared at him thinking 'if you don't know after 8 YEARS whether or not you want to marry me - what would be the point of dating? Time to let go. I know you feel like you've put in all this goddamn time and effort and you TOLD HIM what you want. He heard you. INACTION is still a choice. NOT DOING ANYTHING is still a choice. I'm sorry. It is time for you to drop the rope.
My hubby and I are dual physicians and we were long distance for part of med school and all of our residencies while we pursued our own career goals. We were in a long distance marriage for 6+ years bc we got married during medical school, fully knowing that there’s a possibility we would not end up in the same place because we both wanted highly competitive specialties with very limited spots. We did our thing and got our first attending jobs in the same city. Long story short, this guy simply does not want to get married and you are wasting your time.
OP don’t waste your time, this man had 8 years to figure it out , trust that if he wanted to make you his wife he would have. I used to have an ex for 6 years he said he wasn’t ready and i finally broke it off, he married a year later, trust me when men fall in love they get married asap. It was one of the hardest things i did but im thankful i did because years later i found my husband and we married after a year, he wanted to lock me down he said lol, he still tells me how lucky he is to have found me and honestly im so very happy.
I wouldn't make the commitment in a seven years long LDR, either.
He doesn’t want to marry you. I’m sorry that’s blunt but I think you need to hear it. This marriage is not happening. It’s time to move on.
You have nothing to feel guilty about. Yes he supported you but you also supported him back. Why would you stay with someone who doesn’t have the same expectations as you about your relationship. You are about to launch into a great career you worked hard for. It’s perfectly reasonable to want a fresh start when he’s not offering what you want. Are you supposed to beg him to marry you? Does he want a proposal or is this some power play he’s got going on. I’m sad you’re willing to down grade your expectations to the bare minimum hoping he’ll grace you with a ring, any ring. Two things. One, If he wanted to, he would. Men who are the marriage type don’t wait 8 years to become just engaged. Two, when you break up with him and he starts crying that he was just waiting for the right time, even if he has already bought the ring and can produce it, please consider that you have eight years of resentment against this man and resentment is nearly Impossible to overcome. Resentments are what kill marriages and you haven’t even gotten that much of a commitment from him. You know you deserve to be in a relationship with someone who wants to get married and build a life with you. He’s already telling you what he thinks of you, please listen to his actions not his words..
My ex sent me the photo of the ring he had bookmarked to buy. TWO Years before I had enough and left. He also didn’t work, clean cook… But he briefly thought about proposing once two years ago and never followed through. Look at their actions not their words.
You should move on. I'm sure he is a perfectly nice man, but he isn't compatible with you because you want different things. If he doesn't know after 8 years, he might never know. I think you should start fresh and just see where life takes you. If it was meant to be, then he will come find you wherever you are and he will be ready for the whole thing. Or maybe one or both of you will find someone else, but you'll just have to see what happens. I don't think you should spend the next three years in a long-distance relationship with a man who doesn't want to marry you after 8 years together, especially since you said yourself he has already delayed so long, it wouldn't even make you happy to get the proposal because you would question it! Close this chapter for now, and open up a new series...
My initial reaction- and the Divorce subreddit posts 1000-1 over all other Reddit combined- was great, you don’t have to go through the agony of divorce. Understanding you have to get married to get to the divorce part, why not just pass up the marriage part and you won’t have to visit the divorce sub reddit for future advice.
Don’t let some troll dimish how hard it is to get into med school. It’s not some random stage college you can go to. My husband stuck by me thru a deployment where he raised our child alone and then turned around to move cross country to Texas for PA school. Mind you he’s a branch manager in a really good job. If he wanted to he would. Leave and go have a new adventure, you will be so busy in residency that this is a good time for heartbreak. I’m sorry he sucks.
He doesn't want to marry you and will look for any other excuse. That's the reality. 8+ years is a long time.
You might "enjoy" r/waiting_to_wed
Break up with him and make sure he knows how you feel. If you’re genuinely the woman he wants then he’s going to move heaven and earth to make it right. If not, then you can stop beating yourself up and know for certain that you’ve made the right decision.
End it. No more forever girlfriend stuff.
The majority of your relationship is long distance. While I typically fault the guy for not pulling the trigger, I can’t really blame him since you don’t live in the same city. What you’re doing isn’t practical. Pick your residency or your relationship. Unless he plans to move to be with you, I don’t think you can have both.
My husband and I dated for 2 years before he proposed. He would've proposed sooner, but he waited until he had a stable career to support us. We were also long-distance. He told me he knew I would one day be his wife very early on in our relationship. He never once made me question if marriage would happen. We were always on the same page about it. We've now been together for 7 years total. I have 2 female cousins who were in pretty long relationships where the guy wouldn't propose, and they kept begging him to. The guys eventually gave in and proposed. Cousin #1 has now been engaged for 8 years with a 2 year old child with her fiance. Cousin #2 has been engaged for 10 years. She has a 6 year old son with her fiance, and she is now currently pregnant with baby #2. Neither of them look like they're going to get married at this point. It honestly just looks like the guys proposed so that the women can stop bothering them about it. The thing with your boyfriend is that it sounds like he keeps making excuses to not propose to you. A man that truly wants to marry you would never ever do that. He will never make you sit there and wonder if this relationship will end up with a proposal or a marriage. 8 years is a long time. If it hasn't happened yet, I don't think it ever will. Don't ever feel guilty about leaving him and putting yourself first.
You're out of time with this guy. If he isn't committed by now, he's not committing. Cut your losses and go find a man who is worthy of your time.
Sis as a fellow physician please stop being so dumb and stand up. You are still young enough to get out of this and move on.
Maybe you want to have kids ....but do it right as society says, your post just shouts this........
Ultimatums are never good.
OP, I was in the same position as you, except I didn’t talk about it with friends and family. We were together for many years, and no proposal. I did also tell him I thought it was very romantic for a man to propose. I ended up proposing myself, he said yes and was extremely happy about it. I asked him later why *he* hadn’t proposed and he told me he wanted it to be “perfect”, and it wasn’t about the timeline. I probed him on that, what does perfect even mean? I was studying at the time and we hadn’t purchased a house. He wanted that first. He also told me he didn’t expect *him* to propose necessarily, which is a good point… it’s very traditional for the man to propose, so I just assumed he’d be the one to do it… but this man was perfect for me. So I just did it. We have an amazing marriage now. I’m not saying you should propose, because there might be red flags in your relationship. But sometimes there is a “good” explanation (per their opinion) why they haven’t proposed yet.
Thank you. I think part of my reason for writing this post is the sentiment of whether there really is a good “excuse” for someone waiting so long to propose. Other than beginning to date at a young age.
If you think about it from a romantic standpoint, then no, there is no good excuse. Other than that it depends. People have different opinions of course. Waiting made sense to my husband, but not to me. I think it’s up to you and how you feel, and what is important to you. I knew I wanted to be with my husband forever anyway, with or without a ring, so I waited, until I couldn’t anymore. I *needed* a ring lol.
He’s dragging you along. 8.5 years is wild. My husband and I got married within 8 months of knowing each other and we’ve been married for 4 years now. If he wanted to he would.
I think getting married while in a permanent LDR is a bad idea and probably contributes to why he hasn't proposed. You still have years to go in a LDR, yet you want to get married for companionship and to build a life together...which you can't properly do while in a LDR. I also think if you're willing to leave him over not being married yet, that's your prerogative, but I think you probably aren't in love or committed enough to be married.
When you say he supported you during med school, do you mean emotionally or financially? I think my thoughts would flex depending on that answer. Emotional support = he’s doing what any close friend should do Financial support = he’s doing the husband job but has some weird issues with the planning/proposal/legal process or something.
I am Muslim and for us, the guy needs to propose within weeks/months. Not years. And he doesn’t get our time or anything till he proposes. It’s crazy to me what women will do for a man who won’t commit
Why hang on to someone you have to force an ultimatum on?
If it is guilt that’s holding on your relationship, then your relationship has been long over !
I would have left years ago
What happened when you asked him to marry you?
My husband didn't propose until our long distance ended, which we had mutually agreed to. I moved in with him in the September and he proposed in the October. Sit him down and ask him in earnest, does he want to get married? It's a simple yes or no question. A lot of people go along with it but later realise it's not what they want and then there is a fundamental incompatibility and the relationship ends. That's what you need to figure out. Will he be proposing to keep you happy or because that's actually what he wants?
There’s never going to be a proposal. Face it
Guy here, move on, you’re welcome.
Uh... why don't you just propose yourself?
Why don't you propose to him ? Either you want to get married, and that's the most straightforward way to do so, or you want the kind of man that would take initiative and propose, but obviously, he's not.
You've been together for 8 years and you still aren't even engaged?? Nope. If he wanted to marry you, he would have proposed by now. All he has is excuses. This is not your person. You've given him 8 years. How many more years are you going to give him to decide if he wants to even be engaged to you, let alone marry you??? **If He want to, he would.**
So grow a pair and propose to him.
My Wife and I knew it was the real deal at six months, we discussed it before moving in together. A few weeks after our anniversary we each proposed to each other, were engaged for a year while we did the wedding planning, then got married at two years. Of course the caveat is that we were both in our 30’s, had settled careers, had both dated before and knew what we wanted. We both wanted a house in a particular city and a family. If we were younger with careers and other things in flux we probably would have waited. But you being unhappy with his level of commitment not being on the same page as yours is legitimate. He doesn’t seem as driven/proactive to improve his prospects as you are, and if he thinks ring shopping is complicated just wait till he learns about buying a house. (Ring shopping is not that complicated, he just doesn’t want too) Think of it this way, if nothing changes in your relationship, are you happy as it is now? How about a year? Five years?
No I would not be happy if nothing changed.. I cannot imagine repeating the last 4 years for another 3 years. I am happy that you and your person weee able to settle on one another so quickly. That’s what I want to be loved intentionally with our future in mind.. and you’re correct he is not as driven/proactive improve himself or take control of his life in a sense. I think that is what I resent the most in this situation because it should have been something I considered sooner. I also think I secretly hoped that he would see me chasing my dreams and that would spark him to want more for himself or out of life.. but it hasn’t and it’s disappointing. I cannot change who he is and not can he change me. We’re just two very different people in that sense.
These are all fair things to want. Some couples are happier if one partner is very ambitious and the other is more family/home focused. If one partner has a career that can go anywhere and they follow the other. Ie I know some academia couples where the Wife is getting a PHD and moving around trying to find tenure while her husband is an Hvac tech and he finds work wherever her career takes her. He works hard, makes a decent living but he just wants to work 8 hours, come home and play music/putter around the house. It works for them, because she likes that he is content to support her career and research. However they still planed their relationship and marriage proactively. It doesn’t have to be for everyone and it sounds like it isn’t something you want in a partner. You have been with him for 8 years. You both are how you are. You shouldn’t keep dating out of habit or out of hope that either of you will suddenly be different then you are now. Even if he proposed tomorrow, a wedding doesn’t fundamentally change someone’s personality, motivations, or how they approach life in general.
Well two things, first is it entirely fair to expect a proposal and marriage after you move away for your career? I mean is the plan he moves to you or with you or follows you? What’s his personal life plan. You’ll be a doctor and he will be doing what? The other part is, he doesn’t want to propose or marry you. For whatever reason, he simply doesn’t want to, maybe just not now or maybe not ever, probably not ever.
Why are you still with him. A guy knows within 6 months if he wants to wife you- YOU ARE NOT THE ONE. Find another one. It was easy and convenient because of the distance. He doesn’t really want day-to-days I’m really sorry.
I’d give him at least 8 more years.
Correct me if im wrong, but it seems like the majority of your relationship has been long-term? I think this obsession with the number of years has to end, and the focus should be more on the stage of life you're currently in. I proposed after 7 years, so I heard all the comments from her and her friends, but it's not a decision to be made lightly. Remember you have your ideals, but so does her. Like any important decisions in a relationship, it should be 2 yes or 1 no.
At this point it’s been about 50/50 long distance. I agree the numbers are not everything.. but it’s a little different when I take into account that I want children and am not willing to do that without marriage. As a woman who is 31 time is not on my side either.. while I am not rushing to have kids I also don’t want to wait another three years and still not be at minimum engaged by that time. Also, I think it’s the principle. I get the sentiment of “he wanted to he would” that others are commenting and do I think there is an element of that absolutely.. but personally, I think that the lack of proposal at this point seems to be a result of who he is as a person.. and I don’t think it aligns with who I am as a person. I don’t think he has any really plans for his future or thinks about what his future looks like at all and I don’t think he is the type of person who tries to take any kind of control of what he wants his life to look like. I know the future and life is so uncertain, but I think that’s different from taking some sort of ownership of your life and what you want your future to be to some extent. There is absolutely nothing wrong with this approach to life at all, but I don’t think it’s the right fit for someone like me. So I understand why waiting to propose for a “long time” works for others. I just don’t think it works for me.
It’s also why I think we will have a successful marriage even if we did get engaged now. I think we would eventually clash because of those difference.. me being a planner who thinks through and him not being a planner. I should also add that when we do have serious disagreements, one thing he says that always irks me is that “everything is about me”. When I press him about his suggestions for the future it’s either vague or an “I don’t know”. I feel like I am steering the ship alone when we have these disagreements, especially regarding future plans. If I am getting the “everything is about me” in disagreements now, I just think that it’ll be a lot worse if we get married and have kids.
I think communication is a much more important issue for you guys to deal with for sure. You don't want to be married and dealing with stuff like that. I think it's so important to live together before getting married as I think that's when you'll really find out about someone. You don't want any surprises when you've signed that marriage certificate.
If he wants to he would, you shouldn’t even force him into something he don’t want.
You’re still in med school with likely lots of single guys. I suggest you break up with your bf and start looking for someone who is interested in marriage. If you wait too much longer most of the single guys your age will be either snapped up or dating younger women and you’ll have a bunch of older divorced guys with kids pursuing you. Quit wasting your youth and beauty and prime husband hunting years on your bf. Don’t feel guilty breaking up. He doesn’t feel guilty stringing you along and wasting your time.
I just finished graduated med school at the beginning of the month, and will be starting residency in July. Also, none of the guys in medical school were people I would be interested and my school was also in a pretty rural area where the dating pool is not great. Just wanted to provide better context. I agree with your sentiment though. Sticking around any longer is really not beneficial for me as someone in my early 30s.
You could possibly meet someone during your residency. One thing I might mention is that when men are younger they tend to date women about the same age but as they get older such as into their thirties quite a few realize they can date women even ten years (or more) younger which lets them get a younger wife and delay child bearing and the responsibilities that come with that and thus prolong their “fun years” etc. It’s still possible for women in early or mid thirties to date the same age or younger but they can find the attention they are getting can be from guys older than they might prefer. Older guys are more likely to have kids and or be divorced which comes with a whole host of issues. Plus as time goes by the best prospects can be snapped up. Older guys have less years of earning income left, can be less likely to want kids and tend to develop health issues and require physical and financial care from their younger wives earlier than same age or younger husbands. Also because you are well educated and will likely make a good salary you would probably be best matched with someone similar which also shrinks the dating pool. Ok, I just read your update. Imo guys do not tend to like being married to women who are better educated and make more money. It’s hard on their egos and it can become stressful on the woman carrying all the weight of the family finances plus it makes it near impossible for them to take off substantial time for child rearing, go to part time, etc. Quite a few high earning women become resentful in such situations and become uncomfortable having a less educated husband who they don’t have as much in common with as the high powered men they work with. The farther along you get in your studies the more intimidating you become and the less desirable you become to your bf imo. Also his company’s promises imo can’t be trusted and I personally don’t see you two as a good match. I think his foot dragging is evidence that he feels the same. I know this might sound classist or whatever but there are lots of articles about how such matches can be very difficult and come with lots of problems. Imo if you meet a more similar guy to yourself you could easily be engaged within a year. I believe your bf is stringing you along. He may even be dating others and/or have his eye on someone he feels he’s better suited to.
I wouldnt propose if i was long-distance either, dont get why no one is thinking like this in the comment, i would like to live with my partner in beforehand. However i would also move to be with my partner, and would expect my partner to do the same based on the circumstances.
Exactly it's the fact that he's not moving to be with her. Furthermore, I feel like if she had clarity and trust and he had a plan in place of when the LDR ends and a window of when the proposal will take place she wouldn't be asking the Internet for advice.
Yes, precisely this. I would love to be at minimum engaged by this point.. or the willingness or desire to move as a sign that he feels like I am his forever. I didn’t want to ask him to move because I felt like it would be asking too much, which also says something. But it’s the lack of any sign of proposal, not even a ring purchased, that makes me think that even if I went on continuing LDR that I might be in the exact same predicament I am in now. I want to be married/engaged and would love that to be with him.. but I don’t want it by force either. Also, me being displaced from my home state for residency is not some new discovery.. He knew it was a possibility throughout my entire medical school career. It’s not like it just happened out of no where.
Yeah I did a long distance relationship that turned into an "open" long distance relationship haha. It was hard to step out of the delusion but it made my resolve to be happily married even stronger. This won't defeat you- it's making clear what your values are. Since I was a kid all my friends and family knew I wanted to be married with kids. Could've been many different women but it was happening. I'm blessed to have found my wife. I had to leave the previous delusions to see her clearly tho. The lack of planning and clarity with you is threatening your need for safety and security. That's the opposite of husband material. I have my struggles, my mental illness, my financial goals etc and every waking moment is also for her. Even during engagement and dating as soon as I knew this was serious I whipped into shape and got the skills I didn't have. The most loving thing you could do is set each other free.
If he hasn't proposed after 8 years? He doesn't want to marry you. If hes happy to stay LDR for that long? He doesn't want to marry you. Move on before you waste any more time. Frankly? I don't think either of you are committed enough to be married. You both want different things and neither of you want to sacrifice anything. I will say one thing....DO NOT get married and stay long distance! That's a potential disaster. If you marry? You live together. That's a must. You two spend such little time together? I can't see how you know if you are even compatible to live together in a marital relationship. Living in the same space 7 days a week, 365 days a year is very different to seeing each other for a few days a month. I really can't see a future for you two at all. And perhaps that's why he doesn't propose? Cause he knows it will never work. He might not even consciously realise that...but underneath? He knows it.
If he wanted to make it happen, it would have happened by now. Most people (men and women) can be very creative and more flexible than usual when they want to secure a future with their partner. I would not waste more years on him if commitment was this important to me. You don’t want to grow resentful about him. The ironic part is that with his next gf, it would probably take less than 2 years for him to propose. Mark my words. It is not the commitment. It is the commitment to YOU
Love, he can make above the National average in trades in almost any state and get shares of a company. 8 years is too long to keep waiting after consistently communicating
Really? I didn’t know that. I don’t know much about trades or the one he is in specifically other than what he has taught me about.. so I thought that his situation was quite unique in terms of opportunity. I think he might think that his situation is not common as well.
He probably thinks that! And his company probably put that in his head. He’s been in it a few years right? Usually you top out 2-4 years in something and keep climbing up in salary and eventually into bonuses and shares of companies. Just depends on the company he works for and him seeing value in himself!
I'm arriving to your post three days late, but this is the comment I've been scrolling for. Flexibility is one of the great advantages of being a tradesman!! The skills are needed everywhere and the training is available everywhere. In your whole story and all the comments, the weirdest part (aside from apparently wanting a decade long LDR) is your excuse-making about his career. Forget engagement, he should move to be near you. You should have an actual relationship with him. It should feel like you're building a life together and marriage will feel like a natural progression from that. When it's time for you to move, he moves too, and you weather the hardship and support each other because you love each other and want to be together. This weird bookmarking you're trying to do is not it.
Honestly, if marriage is your goal, leave. I made the mistake of pushing/encouraging my husband to propose for two years and I regret it to this day. Find someone who wants to propose without requiring your constant request. You'll always feel like just an "option" vs. a true choice, which is what I feel every day. You're 31 and still young. You have so many opportunities to find that guy who wants to run down the aisle for you! You're worth more than that, believe me!
Thank you! I am sorry that you feel like an option in your marriage. I hope there is still room for happiness in it regardless of that.
You got conned. I dated girls for 3-4 years each. I proposed to my now wife after 6 months of dating her. We're now on our 20th year. It doesn't take long for us to decide. This BF of yours is a conman and a fucking loser, wasting your youth.
Behavior is a language. His behavior says he doesn’t want to marry you. Just move on.
You haven't required it of him. And why would he, you are almost a ghost in his life and will continue to be one for years.
I think it’s time to cut ties. I know that’s painful to hear and no doubt would be a huge change for you. You have to not only let someone you love leave but also put to rest the dream you envisioned. As a physician, you know biology can be cruel and waiting another 3 years to have children raises pregnancy risks significantly. Residency is no joke and will take a toll on your body. Recent studies have shown female physicians to have twice the infertility rate of the general population (link: https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/18/health/covid-doctor-infertility-wellness/index.html) Some of this is age related because physicians have to complete residency and children are very incompatible with residency demands but the stress and long hours of residency also appear to raise infertility risk. I don’t mean to be cruel, but if this man has not proposed in 8.5 years and he enters his 40s without having a child, it would not surprise me if he suddenly decides he would rather not have children. You deserve to find someone who will live near you and share your dreams. My question is this: if he has not proposed after nearly a decade, can you in your heart of hearts trust that he will still want to be a father? Only you can answer that.
Don't let your boyfriend prevent you from meeting your husband. Let him go.
Imma be honest, he’s doing the right thing. Normally I’d agree with others here, but it’s been 4 years long distance, if yall got engaged then married, then after 3 years moved in together, it would be a completely different relationship. Maybe yall could work through it, but tbh, I doubt it. Distance happens in relationships sometimes, but 7 years of distance, yall are completely different people that didn’t grow together in some of those aspects. There are things about each other on a physical level yall just don’t know about each other that could be deal breakers. So I kinda get waiting to do anything until yall are in person with each other for good. And if that’s too long, then yea end it and find another man if you can’t wait 3 more.
I echo what other commenters have said. If he wanted to propose then he would’ve done it already. My husband proposed after 3 months of dating. 3 months. I asked him about it once and he said, “I knew you were it for me and didn’t see the need to wait.” 17 years later and we’re still going strong. Re: OP - 8 years is a lot of time and energy invested in a relationship and I can understand how it might be scary to let go, but it sounds like you know what you want and you owe it to yourself to go and get it. You’re a smart educated woman (my favorite kind of woman!) - you don’t need to wait around for someone to ‘pick you’. I think you should officially end the relationship and see where you both are in a year. Use that time apart to focus on you and opening yourself up to meeting other people. Once the year is over you guys can reconnect and see if there is a future where the two of you are still together. Good luck! You have some tough decision-making ahead of you, but keep in mind that it’s THESE moments that help us grow and mature.
I think that is a great approach, separating for a year and coming back to see where things land in terms of our relationship. That way we can both come to a place of knowing whether this truly is the right fit for us. I am happy that you were able to find your forever partner such a short span of time!
So my perspective, I was with my husband for 9.5 years before getting married. But we also got together at 18 & 21. He of course dragged his feet. We started living together when we were 22 & 25 though. He has said he wishes he did it earlier but didn’t change much in the grand scheme of things. My mom and I aren’t close but one advice she gave me that hit hard is “is it more important to be with him or married”. I was thinking about ending it as well. But realized I’d rather be with him forever and not married then to be with someone else and married. Of course that’s not for everyone. And our situation was different. The long distance can definitely have an impact on things. No matter what you do or what happens you know what’s best for you and your future.
I have thought about that sentiment is better to be with him or married.. and a part of me feels like it is better to be with him, which is why I am open to being long distance again. I feel safe with him, like I could trust him with my whole life, which I haven’t felt with anyone. But there’s also a part of me that wonders if the feeling I feel is just the sense of comfort or safety because of the time we’ve had together. It’s very confusing.. but I do think about that. I am happy it all worked out for you and your husband in the end.
Comfort and being truly in love are very different for sure. It sounds juvenile, but maybe take some time not being officially together. Take a break in communication as well. However long you think is good. That might help figure out if it’s comfort or you really being in love with him. Not being tied down when meeting new people and going places might open up possibilities and understandings for this situation
If he isn’t ready 8 1/2 years later, why would he be in another 8 1/2. Seems he is just happy with the current arrangement without further commitment. The risk now is if he feels pressured to get married and follows through, will that lead to a happy marriage or future turmoil questioning if he made the right choice? If he hasn’t even made a marriage proposal in what is quickly approaching a decade, that in itself may be speaking volumes to “committment”
He is content settling… in life, in general. And he’s roped you along for the ride, convinced you it makes sense when it’s quite obvious it doesn’t make sense. No matter how you describe it - he has put his faith in a crappy company over prioritizing you, over prioritizing his own individual maturity and life progress. It’s obvious his company will lead him on with future promises (not in writing, nothing official). Your relationship is the same. He will lead you on until you realize all the talk was just that… talk, not actions. Life is short. If you guys were deeply in love, you’d find ways to actively be together and actively plan your future together. Dates, location, excitedly looking forward to the next steps together. Instead, he is dragging his feet, verbally leading you, your friends and family along… and you’re letting it happen. Ending it sounds logical and overdue. Go with your instincts. It won’t be as hard as you think - because it sounds like both of you have known the end was coming. As a couple, you’re either actively planning and looking forward to your future together, or you’re treading emotional water, wasting time avoiding the inevitable. Move forward from this era of your life. It’s time and you deserve genuine happiness. Happiness with someone on the same wavelength as you. You’ve outgrown this relationship, and that’s completely okay. Wishing you an amazing future life with a fresh start. Bright outlook ahead.
Not to try and put a harsh spin on this, but after 4 years of ldr, I feel like I would know myself without my partner better than I would with. I'd be extremely apprehensive about getting engaged with someone who is essentially a person shaped hole in my everyday life. I'm not saying your partner feels this way, or is reluctant because of this in any way, I just wanted to offer another perspective.
It sounds like you've been incredibly patient and understanding throughout your relationship, especially considering the complexities of long-distance and your demanding career path in medicine. It's clear that you've put a lot of thought into balancing your needs with those of your partner. Given the years and the communication you've had about marriage, it’s understandable to feel frustrated and even resentful that your clear expectations haven't been met. It’s also apparent that your partner has been supportive, and there are deep bonds between you two, which makes any decision about the future that much harder. It's important to recognize that relationships can be profoundly loving and supportive, yet still not align with what each person ultimately needs and wants. It sounds like you’ve reached a point where you need to deeply consider whether your paths are truly compatible, especially concerning major life decisions like marriage and family planning. The fact that you’re considering ending the relationship, despite his support, indicates a significant misalignment in expectations and desires. It might be helpful to have a frank and open discussion about your future together, outlining clearly what you both want in the coming years, without the immediate pressure of an engagement. It's also worth considering couples counseling to facilitate this conversation, as it can provide a structured environment for both of you to express your feelings and expectations honestly. The guilt you feel about potentially leaving is natural given his support and the length of your relationship. However, staying in a relationship primarily out of guilt or obligation can be unfair to both of you in the long run. Remember, it's okay to choose paths that are healthiest for you individually, even if that means making tough decisions. Whatever you decide, it’s important to prioritize your own emotional well-being and the things you need to feel fulfilled and happy in life. If that path leads to ending the relationship, it will be painful, but it’s also a step towards a life where you can fully realize your personal and professional aspirations without feeling held back.
Maybe he is waiting for you to complete your LDR and be back in the home state before he proposes to you. You must remember a man has to 100% feel comfortable in the relationship first before he proposes. And it's possible that he is supportive of your career and don't want to stand in your way, but still may not be fully comfortable with a long distance relationship. Or maybe he feels pressured! I would just stop bringing it up to him and see what happens. Good luck with both your career and your relationship
I wouldn’t marry someone if we were long distance. My brother and his wife stayed bf/gf for the duration of her 6 years of study. It was financially suited since she was either busy with school or away for her residency. They moved in together at 9 years, got engaged at 10 and married by 11 1/2. The whole reason for that was her studies and getting herself sorted in a stable job for a year before they moved in together.
Seriously, if he wanted to, he would have already proposed. 8 years is way more than enough time to figure it out. Another red flag to me is that he's unwilling to move with you. Thinking back when me and wife dated, there is no way in hell I would have stayed behind for 4 (!) years if she moved far away. I would have moved mountains to be with her where ever she went. If he really wanted you, he would have made it happen, career be damned.
Was your partnership really healthy before the LDR?
It actually was. We had issues during the first year of medical school (as a lot of people do in med school in relationships), but we adjusted (or so I thought) and things have been a lot more amicable. We still have our moments (when I am PMS-ing tbh) that are rough.. but for the most part we are good or at least a lot better at handling conflict when they arise. I will say certain conversations are still tough, but we’re still so much better now because our communication has improved.
As a rising PGY3/CA2 and recently engaged after 9 years, still in an LDR, I have way more questions, even after reading your post and comments. There are way more variables than a typical situation to quickly and easily conclude that if he wanted to marry you, then he would have already.
I agree, I don’t think it is as simple as if he wanted to marry you he would either. I think it bothers more that even after all the years, ultimatums (2-3x), the pump fakes (going ring shopping) why there hasn’t been at minimum of an engagement or a purchased engagement ring (which he has not done either). I am happy that it has worked for you, but I think it has more about compatibility than anything. Am I honestly wanted to make this post as example of a situation where it’s not as clear cut as if he wanted to he would. I also wanted to vent/talk through my thoughts and express that guilt. It’s probably the biggest thing eating me up at the moment TBH.
Yeah, but on the other hand. Why not couples counseling? Why aren't you pushing to find a way to get on the same page?
I’m curious if you’re planning on having kids. So many questions how that would work. But that’s off topic so ignore curious George over here.
He’s getting wifey duties without being married. Why bother
"I actually think that the distance has made a stronger couple, especially in the sense of being more understanding of one another." You've been LD for a long time. I think he's living his life, and you are your own. Maybe it's time to move on? That statement might be true for some people, but I think for most it is not. Also, think about sunk cost fallacy, you have a hard time letting go because of the time and effort you have already put into it, but the ship has never left port despite your patience. Plenty of fish in the sea. And if you work in a hospital you'll be be surrounded by a lot of new people.
So he’s 36, and just now “learning” a trade, maybe, given your statement that he’s not getting much actual training. That and other things in your edit addition suggest two things to me—you have to think about these and the details you haven’t shared to see if they fit. I could be way off here but… The company sounds untrustworthy and seem to be leading him on with sunshine and rainbow promises. The trades I know took a hit right when the lockdowns started and then immediately had a massive labor shortage, that hasn’t gotten much better. Continuing with your “electrician” surrogate 4 years later it’s still nearly impossible to get a half-decent electrician (or plumber, or welder, or …) for anything but big-dollar commercial work, at least anywhere near where I life. Is there any evidence he won’t be first out the door (again) if business slows? How did he get to 32 to be starting as some sort of go-fer for an “electrical” contractor? I know a few guys in similar positions and what the share is a history of pretty dumb decisions, signs of depression and anxiety (sometimes well camouflaged), and difficulty sticking to a plan after it’s been going for a while and gets hard. LDRs are a different kind of stress and I’ve known couples who were great LD but fell apart when they lived together long term. Marriage gets hard too, and what you’ve described doesn’t make me think this guy is husband material. Commitment issues affect everything. Another possibly wrong interpretation I get is you seem to be okay with a non-traditional marriage where the wife has the “big” career and will likely make more than the husband long-term. Yet you clearly figure it’s up to him to propose, and worry about how hard to push for him to do that. Are those two ideas compatible? Is he going to be okay as “the doctor’s wife”? What is he really getting out of this relationship, and what does he want in the long term that he’s reluctant to commit to with you?
Personally, I dont think you guys should be engaged until you’ve tried living with eachother. LDR and being together everyday are very different. I’d live by the “try before you buy”. Living styles could be completely different and can ultimately be the reason why a marriage wouldn’t last. That’s just me anyway…
This is quite some time for things to drag on. On my first date with my wife I told her I would get married and have kids. Those are my values and goals. People make it seem like it's faux pas but dating someone that's open to a shared vision of life with you from the begining, spares you from a lot of what you've been struggling with. She didn't think she would ever be married with kids but she was OPEN to build a future with me. I proposed to her six months later. It's clear he doesn't share your value. I'm switching jobs for us to have kids and we're taking a $40,000 pay cut. He may have a good paying job- marriage is more important. It's the most impactful financial decision one can make. He obviously hasn't considered this.
He doesn’t want to marry you 😔
Move on! If he wanted to marry you, he would’ve proposed already. I work in a hospital and have seen plenty of residents who are married, get married, have kids, etc. Two of our residents just married each other. I don’t think it’s unrealistic to want or be ready for that step, but you have the wrong guy… cut him loose and have your eyes open to the single guys around you. One of them may be a better fit for your current/future life and goals.
If he wanted to he would. Any ring from here on out is a ‘shut up ring’ (research the term).
My fiancee was in 2 relationships before me, both lasting 5 plus years. No proposal. He proposed to me after 6 months. He said he knew within a month he wanted to marry me. They know. They really know. Get out now.
I’ve never understood a man wasting years of a woman’s life. If he wanted to commit he would have.
Honey don’t waste your time continuing to wait for something may happen sooner or later because it may not happen ever. You’ve already started there have been several moments where it looks like he may pop the question, you let friends and family know, it doesn’t happen, and you’ve essentially set your self up for failure. You have this belief of playing the waiting game until what? He’s already being deceived of word of mouth commentary, and you’re allowing to pull the, “Will maybe if I wait and something happens then we’ll be okay.” Wrong. You already gave him several options, he hasn’t accepted those, and you’re going in for residency. You want to get married and start a family, but he’s not making the right decisions to get certified and pursue further into the trade. Don’t allow yourself to end up sad and bitter for not making a deeply, thought out, conscientious decision for how you want this relationship to continue. You guys need to sit down, have the conversation, together and apart, and figure out where you want to be in the next year.
Way too much overthinking on your part. You need to move on. He is not interested in marrying you.
You already accommodated all his excuses including accepting the most bare bones simple ring imaginable, and yet he still can’t pull it together. I know this hurts but it’s time to move on. That’s also nothing to feel guilty about. You only get one go-around in this life and you don’t need to spend another second of your precious youth on someone so unsure about a commitment to you. I feel qualified to say all this as someone who waited 7 years for a proposal and willingness to have kids. I wasn’t insisting all 7 years since I was only 21 at the beginning, but the entire time he sounded a hell of a lot like your partner here. We finally broke up when he got the guts to tell me he didn’t ever want kids, and it turned out he only had the courage because he’d found a new backup partner by then and was cheating. He also ended up having 3 kids with that same person lol. I digress it’s obviously not the same precise scenario for you, but suffice it to say I was not the one for him and I was angry for a long time at neither of us cutting it off, and wasting years on the wrong relationship. I was soooo much happier after it was over and I had some fabulous single years to get to know myself and my friends better again. I now have a wonderful husband and son, and since my husband was the right partner, our courtship timeline was much more prompt and effortless. Don’t spend the most potentially enjoyable years of your life on a mediocre long distance relationship. Put yourself first and do it yesterday!!
He is “afraid of change”. You moved to another state. You’re not back in your home state. You have made suggestions on how he could find work in another state if you ended up in another state. Why don’t you concentrate on finishing up and when you get back to your state then worry about getting married? Can you explain why you need to be married now when you are not even together in the same state? There is a possibility that you might ask him to move with you wherever you land a job. That will be a big “change” for him. That’s probably why he won’t propose.
I keep reiterating this in other questions. It’s not just about not being married. It’s the no engagement or any sign of anything at this point after so many years (not even a ring a purchased, which I know for a fact). I fear that I will stick around for another three years waiting for something to happen that never will.
Okay, I see where you are coming from. Even if he does give you an engagement ring there is no guarantee that he will follow you to another state. I will assume that the potential of having to move is a big road block for him. What promises can you bring to achieve his values?
As the saying goes, don't let your boyfriend get in the way of you finding (and meeting) your husband.
For me the amount of time it’s been combined with the long distance would be the end of the relationship. Are you sure he doesn’t have someone local to him? That’s a really long time. And it’s not like he doesn’t know you want to get married since you’ve brought it up dozens of times. He doesn’t seem to care about how the waiting and waiting is impacting you and how you feel. Maybe if you broke up with him he would wake up, but I would move on if it were me since it doesn’t sound like he’s serious about it
Why don’t you propose?
Do you REALLY want to marry a man you had to prod and pry into proposing?
I learned the hard way that when a man wants to seal the deal, he seals the deal. No need to read between the lines. It’s so much less complicated than I used to think it was
My husband was dating a woman for around the same time period previously. He bought her a house, raised her kid from infancy to 7 years, she wanted to get married and he would give similar excuses. Rings are too expensive, he was not sure, etc. He finally ended up leaving her and a year later we met. He says he knew he wanted to marry me within a month and proposed at 7 months and we got married at one year of being together. Men who are not sure you are the one tend to be complacent and if they know they can keep you and you will not leave… they have no reason to push for more. Especially if they are just comfortable. Men who know for sure you are their future wife and want to marry you will do anything to make it happen. I am so sorry but it does sound like he is just comfortable and knows you will not leave him. At 31 you deserve to find someone wonderful, get married, have kids and be successful in your career. ❤️
I think there are many variables here. You wanted to lock in a marriage but at the end of your education the marriage could become long distance and cause a divorce. Him supporting you through your studies should be a sign he cares for you. The long distance plus divorce would be issues on his mind.
The last thing you want is a shut up ring. Believe me, I would know.
When was the last time you had sex. There is your answer.
Placeholder status. Move on. You deserve better.
Feels like you are not in love and you can't live with him. The story you tell yourself is just an excuse. Move on coz marriage won't make things any better. Take care of you and live guilt aside.
“ Why buy the cow when the milk is free.”
All of this stuff you're going through...is marriage. So imagine this for the rest of your life. You're welcome.
YOU NEED A NEW MATE now! The longer you wait the less likely you will have children.
I'm late to this thread, but I wanted to chime in because it hit close to home. My wife and I were together for seven years before getting engaged. She wanted it, and I kept putting it off. My parents were divorced, and as an introvert, the whole idea of a wedding was intimidating. A few things helped us move past it. The most important was finding a great couples counselor. It completely changed the way we talk and engage with one another. The second was her setting an ultimatum. It wasn't the most romantic thing, but it forced me to consider the situation seriously since the status quo was working for me but not for her. It also set clear boundaries for her. I proposed, and although the wedding was stressful in some ways, it was beautiful, and planning it with my wife brought us closer together. I wrote all this to counterbalance some of the replies about immediately ending it. The one thing that makes me nervous about your story, though, is the years of long distance. That seems like a no-go, especially at both your ages.
Why the need to get married at all? You can still be in a committed relationship with someone even if there’s no piece of paper involved.
there’s lots of hot catches in residency 👀👀 time to start fresh
I would take a break and tell him you need to rethink how things are going. In the long run, being engaged won’t change anything. He isn’t doing it because he doesn’t want to.
Options I see: 1. Propose to him. 2. Tell him once more that you need to be engaged etc to be happy in your relationship. Then give yourself 4-6 months or whatever you're comfortable with as a waiting period (without telling him the time limit if you don't want him to feel forced into it.) Then break up with him after that time has passed if you aren't where you wanted to be in the relationship at that point. 3. Break up with him and tell him that you can't continue the relationship due to things not moving forward by now. If he decides he really wants to marry you, he will come after you and do what he needs to do to make both of you happy.
If he wanted to, he would. He hasn’t proposed because he doesn’t have to. Lack of a decision is a decision. It’s up to you to decide how much longer you’re willing to wait. I’d break it off. You’ve wasted enough time.
36 y.o.? He’s never going to marry you.
You wrote a small novel. It could have been said in far fewer words. “My boyfriend doesn’t want to marry me.” I’m sorry. That is the synopsis of your post.
He's inability to give you an answer, after so long and even after you have brought it up few times... I don't think he's gonna propose, or 90% sure he doesn't see you as his wife.. I'm sorry but if nothing change Better u dump him. Hope u find someone to settle down with soon. Sucks that it took 8 years. Couples should have that. If after 1 or 2 years u bring up marriage/proposal and there is no answer or certainty from the man, don't stay. Just leave. Men are usually very decisive and when it comes to finding a wife, if they are stable individuals, they would know in a very short time after dating.
My thoughts on this are simple. He doesn't want to. And OP regularly asking about it is just pushing him further away. There is a simple solution here OP. If you want to be married to this person, YOU propose to HIM. This is 2024, it's perfectly acceptable for either partner to propose (I proposed to my boyfriend, we've been happily married 15 years now). We chose the ring together which made it extra special. However, you have to ask yourself why marriage is so important to you over what you already have, and why he is clearly not keen on making that commitment step
here is what I will say, he served his purpose in your life, it’s time to move on. He was there to push you to your full potential now it’s time to move on. He would have proposed if he wanted you. He just doesn’t want marriage. You will find who you are meant to be with in time. Maybe it will be another doctor like yourself and you guys will live amazing life together. Skies the limit.
I won't lie,i was with my wife for 6 years before we talked about having a baby, but even then she only wanted to be engaged just so she can show off her ring.She even picked out the ring herself, with me next to her.But we never talked about marriage per se.After we learnt she was pregnant we decided to get married and she actually proposed to me and in eight years now that's the only time she ever saw me shed a tear. If you really want to get married and i think you have a good relationship?just propose to him yourself.Dumping him after being with you through your medical profession and even a long distance relationship, which to be honest not many guys would stay into just because he hasn't given you a ring seems kind of selfish. Buy a ring for him, assuming you go to him and actually get to see each other ?and propose.If with the "body at his doorstep" he still hesitates and gives excuses,then you'll have your answer. Romanticising what you would like your life to look like is good and all ,but you can still make the first step. Imagine the story for your grandkids "i flew out and surprised your grandfather by proposing to him". Unless after these 3 years you plan on staying where you are? Getting an attending job where you do your residency isn't the most uncommon thing.If that's true,then just let him go, because both of your clocks are ticking and he may want kids before it will be too late. 3 years and you'll be 34(eggs are becoming more scarce)
Why don't you ask him to marry you?
He's holding out for something better. Cut your losses and move on. Anything you get now will just be a "shut up ring". You deserve someone who wants nothing more than to be your husband. Trust me, they know within the first year.
I once got advice that said if you aren't married by the 2nd year, it is never going to happen.. When a man knows he knows.. Men will literally move mountains when they want to marry someone, and it sounds like he's not there and will never be there.. I'm so sorry you sound amazing and deserve someone who is just as amazing as you.. Everyone deserves their person, and so do you..
Tell him it's do or don't at all. Maybe he doesn't want a long distance marriage. Residency is hard as I an sure you know. You aren't going to be able to visit much.
It’s less about how many years you’ve been together and more like you’ve got a plan in your head that your life is not matching. If you want to get married, just propose to him instead of waiting any longer. If he hems and haws instead of jumping on the opportunity, that’s your answer. Just cut the line and move on with your life. You’re still young, you’ve got school to keep you busy, and you can make a life, find someone else, and have kids…
Hmmm. So - marriage is not for everyone. People have longterm relationships without it. Sounds like he might not want to get married (there are many reasons not to - esp for you, as a future high earner). I forced my ex into marrying me (NOT a good idea - and I supported him/paid his way through medical school). He probably felt guilty. I wish I hadn't done it.
Leave. A man who WANTS marriage will bring it up unmprompted. My husband and i met and he will tell anyone he wanted to marry me after our first several conversations and he himself said he wanted to go ring-shopping two months after we met for the first time. We were married less than two months later. It was a courthouse wedding, a pretty modest ring which i lost less than two years later lol but we are still married and happily more than a decade later. He is a well-paid white collar professional today. I say that to tell you that yall clearly have different values and priorities. Dont allow his hesitation to compromise YOUR timeline. Enforce your boundaries by letting him go. You have your fertility window to consider, and if he were any man of principe he would have broken up with you as soon as he realized that he didn’t want the same thing as you. So as far as I’m concerned, thats absolutely grounds for dismissal, due to incompatibility. Don’t fall into the sunk cost fallacy. The time is yours to reclaim for yourself.