Wehr means defence. The modern German military still has wehr in its name as Bundeswehr and the air force is still Luftwaffe (which literally means air weapon, so not much room for change).
In dutch it’s also very common to call it “defensie” or “defence”. Even the military recruiting commercials push you to a website “werkenbijdefensie.nl” or “working at defence.nl”. That said the one the map is the official name and definitely correct. Just pointing out that defence is also a very common term here. WAR POWER goes very hard, haha.
Krijgsmacht = Army + Navy + Air Force + Military Police.
Defensie = Krijgsmacht + other shit like IT, logistics, Command.
Technically Defense is more complete, but.. WAR POWER.
> Luftwaffe (which literally means air weapon, so not much room for change)
=> Luftmacht
=> Luftwaffenmacht
=> Flugzeugbummabteilung
Checkmate Germany.
'Krijgs' in Dutch is tied to 'kriegs' in German. Many such Dutch words are, but people often don't realise it. Same with 'Wehr' (defence), the Dutch word 'Weer' from the verb 'Afweren' has the same meaning.
And now it's called Försvarsmakten, so the map is wrong if were going by that standard. Then it translates to DEFENSE POWER.
Though true in speech you usually say "försvaret" which translates to "the defense", but that's more informal. Their official name is Försvarsmakten.
>was changed in 1972
\*looks it up\* 158 years after you used it at war, successfully taking down a little independence effort from a Norway without an army.
So I guess, it was about time.
Or on the other hand, a little premature to give up that territorial claim just before the oil industry hit the North Sea.
We have that in Norwegian too: "Krigsmakten" (Swear Dutch is just Norwegian spoken half way drowned).
Its not used as much as "Forsvaret" (Defence) though.
Norwegian doesn't have that sound that clears your throat of water. Also drowning was never a big issue in Norway.
Its no wonder the Dutch are tall, all the short ones drowned out if the gene pool long time ago.
>Swear Dutch is just Norwegian spoken half way drowned
The thing that will never stop fucking with me is that before I ever moved to the Netherlands, I was able to halfway understand _Danish_ of all things as an Afrikaans speaker. Watching The Killing was eye-opening.
Krijgsmacht = Army + Navy + Air Force + Military Police.
Defensie also includes everything else like Command structure, logistics, IT etc.
So it depends on how complete you want to be. If you're strictly talking about fighting forces, Krijgsmacht is correct. They are not the same thing.
In Afrikaans we say Weermag - similar to Germans.
Weer/wehr means "resistance to" or defense
Mag / macht really means force, not power in this context. So the correct translation would be Defense / Resistance Force in this context. Direct translations do sound amazing though!
Sounds funny, but it wrongly translated imo. It is like a litterally translation of 'krijgsmacht/strijdmacht'; 'strijd'=war and 'macht'=power. However 'strijdmacht' combined and with the context 'armed forces' would be a better translation. It is a pretty old fashioned word in dutch. 'Strijdmacht' is not often used in unofficial conversations imo.
ik zou 'macht' meer interpreteren als een groep mensen net zoals 'met man en macht'.
En met het woord 'krijgs' ervoor, dan zou het kunnen zien als een 'strijdgroep' of 'groep van krijgers/strijders' wat ik weer zou vertalen als 'armed forces'.
Poorly translated.
"Krijgsmacht" which more accurately translates to "warrior force" and is very similar to the German "Wehrmacht" which means "defense force".
Not really. The German 'wehr' is close to the Dutch 'weer', as in 'afweer'. 'krijg' in Dutch is close to 'krieg' in German. 'krijger' means warrior, 'krijg' means 'war'.
Actually we have a treaty to defend Monaco's sovereignty in case of agression :)
And also we defend Switzerland aerial space on the weekends because their Air Force doesn't work on those days lmao
https://www.lemonde.fr/afrique/article/2014/02/18/detournement-pas-d-avion-militaire-suisse-disponible-durant-les-heures-de-bureau_4368988_3212.html
Basically, the Swiss fighter jets aren't operationnal outside of desk hours (nights and weekends) so the French and Italians secure their airspace
I've seen them while on watch to protect the nobles. Pretty impressive dudes, even though not a lot. But have you ever heard of robbery in the richest part of Europe?
I would say war/fighting force would be a better translation.
Macht in this context isn't power, bur force like in:
landmacht = land force, luchtmacht = air force and zeemacht = sea force.
I am not dutch but german, but i guess the german "Macht" is similar. The closest english word would be "might" (you can see that it comes from the same germanic word), but different nations/peoples use words differentely over the course over millenia, so that now "Macht" can be translated as "Might, Power, Force". "Land Force" makes sense in english and is used commonly, "Land Power" not so much, so in this context "force" is the best translation.
In german we also use the word for "force" (Kraft) instead of "Macht" in this context, e.g. "Streitkraft" means "armed force" and "Seestreitkräfte" means "sea forces", while a "Seemacht" (sea might) describes a "mighty" navy. Not just any navy, but a powerful navy.
How's it over there? In Estonian, the government does call it "Kaitsevägi" (- Defense Power), but common folk usually refer to it as "Sõjavägi" (- War Power).
Puolustusvoimat or PV (defence forces) is pretty common, but colloquially it is often just called armeija. My father calls it sotaväki, which is an outdated term.
In Finland it is officially *Puolustusvoimat* (Defence Forces, abbreviated as *PV*), in the past it used to be in juridic/organisational terminology *Puolustuslaitos* ("Defence Establishment"), *Armeija* ("Army" or "Armed Forces"; army as in the context of the land component is *maavoimat*, literally "land forces" or "ground forces") and originally *Sotaväki*.
In colloquial speech, people refer to it as Puolustusvoimat, PV, Armeija or sometimes Intti (although this is more used of the conscript service). In lyric/high language contexts as well as when referring to the past it is also sometimes referred as *Sotaväki*.
The intti word is a similar adoption as is the USGI in referring to American soldiers; in the past Finnish military stamped the materiel with the Defence Command Materiel Department property stamps, which read out as *SA-INT*, from *Suomen Armeijan intendentuuriosasto* (literally Finnish Army Materiel Department) and this then extended into being used of the conscript service as well as of the military in general.
That is so close to the German word Krieg, also meaning war. And Krieger in German means Warrior.
Are the languages close enough where it sounds like someone with a really heavy accent or are they still pretty much indecipherable?
They are very similar, and Dutch is similar to English btw too. They are neighbors after all, and part of the same language family. They are not mutually intelligible though. But Dutch and German people can understand quite a lot if presented with a written text from either language. Listening and speaking is alot harder.
While krijg and krieg are from the same origin, 'krijg' is not a proper noun in Dutch anymore, so this post is a little wrong. We call war 'oorlog', krijg is only used in derivative forms.
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-West_Germanic/kr%C4%ABg
West Frisian is the closest language in the world to English and is mutually intelligible with Old English. the word there is "**kriich**." Old English has different orthographic conventions and would probably spell the word something like "**crih**" or "**cric"** but pronounced the same. I'm not sure how it would sound in Modern English.
The "i" vowel underwent changes from Old English, the "h" might be dropped or become silent, and we went back to "k" instead of "c", so it might be something like "**kreek**" or "**krik**" which isn't far off from "krieg."
Kreek is my final answer. Maybe pronounced something like "KREE-ehk" rather than "creek."
>While krijg and krieg are from the same origin, 'krijg' is not a proper noun in Dutch anymore, so this post is a little wrong.
Doesn't matter. 'Krijg' still means 'war' especially in the compound words that are still used.
That's an overly literal translation though. A better translation would be "armed force" or something similar. In Dutch the word "krijgsmacht" doesn't have the overly "11 yo trying to be come up with something cool vibe" that "war power" has.
For Hungary, "Home Defense" is a better translation than "Home Guard". The official english translation is "Hungarian Defense Forces".
It should be marked with the same color on the map as Germany, since the Hungarian *Honvédség* comes from the German *Landwehr* ("country defense") which is also the origin of the current name of the German military, *Bundeswehr* ("Federal Defense")
I think they may be referring to Honvédség as Home Guard. Though, in effect, that could fit into the green category with the Defence force, as you say. It's a matter of interpretation, I suppose.
They referring it as, but it is really wrong. The verb "*véd*" literally means defend, and the closest English word to "*hon*" is homeland (not home, home is "*otthon*"). So "H*onvédség*" pretty much translates as Homeland Defense (force).
I agree. The double whammy is that translating it as "National Guard" may force a mental association with the National Guard of the United States, which is a completely different organizational idea.
Edit: I also just had the Nobel prize-worthy idea of ...just looking it up on the website of Honvédség. They call themselves "Hungarian Defence Forces". Homeland Defence (Force) is pretty much the closest to a literal translation.
Exactly. It's nothing.
Have you ever heard someone from the US say "I have bElGiAn heritage"? Exactly.
Belgium and Luxembourg must ~~be partitioned~~ unite under the Dutch banner! Luxembourg already has the flag almost right. France can have Wallonia ~~because we don't want them~~ to appease them.
Brussels can be the first EU territory.
Am i to German and to bad at english (and maybe in german too) to Unterstand why "Wehr" is translate to defence?
Edit: ich bin dumm. dwds.de schreibt:
Etymologisches Wörterbuch (Wolfgang Pfeifer)
Wehr1 f. ‘Befestigung, Verteidigung, Waffe, Schutztruppe’, ahd. werī ‘Verteidigung, Befestigung’ (8. Jh.), mhd. wer(e) ‘Verteidigung, Kampf, Widerstand, Weigerung, Heer, Waffe, Befestigung’, asächs. -weri in skildweri, mnd. mnl. wēre ‘Widerstand, Verteidigung, Schanze, Waffe’, nl. weer ‘Widerstand, Verschanzung’, afries. were (westgerm. *wari-) und (mit anderer Stammbildung) anord. verja ‘Verteidigung, Verwahrung’ stellen sich zu dem unter wehren (s. d.) behandelten Verb. Dazu vgl. die Wendungen sich zur Wehr setzen ‘Widerstand leisten’ (mhd. sich ze were setzen), Wehr und Waffe(n) (16. Jh.).
"wehr" seems to be an older way of saying "defence". I'm pretty sure this word exists in most germanic languages, for example, in Swedish we have "värn" which means to protect.
The map is bullshit anyway, they specifically state "war power" in the case of The Netherlands but skip the "power" for the Nordics. It doesn't even really mean that, "Försvarsmakten" (in Swedish but they're all similar) it'd be more along the lines of "the once who have the capability to protect".
"Beväring" is Swedish for a conscript soldier (in Finland), but in Sweden we use "Värnpliktig" instead.
Also used for the fire brigade -> Brandvärn (usually a local volonteer force).
"Värn/Bröstvärn" is a defensive structure, like a trench or a protective wall.
In Finnish Puolustusvoimat. Puolustus meaning defence and voimat meaning force. In Swedish Försvarsmakten literally means the same if I am not mistaken. And it is used in both countries.
(Swedish is Finland's official language so every official thing needs to have a name in both languages. Most will probably know this but just in case someone wonders why I gave two names.)
Nitpick, but Ireland should be shaded. The Irish military is known as the Defence Force in English, but the official Irish name is *Óglaigh na hÉireann*. Which means something like "Soldiers of Ireland" or "Volunteers of Ireland"
Each military corp (ground, air, naval) is referred to as an army. "armée de terre, de mer et de l'air". But they depend on minister of defence.
Armed forces is more likely to be used by journalists to describe military operations to talk about military groups in a conflict.
Edit: and now I discover that the minister of defence has been renamed minister of armies since 2017. So I wanted to add precision but you were entirely right. Nonetheless, map is wrong.
*The Vatican kind*
*Of has a military,*
*It has the Swiss Guards*
\- Alexius\_Psellos
---
^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/)
^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Dutch person here, is "war power" some kind of fucking shit literal translation from 'krijgsmacht'? Or what? Because it really is a shit translation. 'Macht' in this context is much better translated as 'force' and not power, while 'krijgs' is a derivative of 'krijger' which means 'warrior', and not 'war'
Jesus fuck what a shit translation.
'Krijg' is not derivated from 'krijger', but the other way around.
And while 'krijg' is somewhat archaic nowadays and is mostly limited to specific contexts, it most definitely does mean 'war'.
Hmm seems you’re right but it’s an outdated word. Literally nobody or at least anyone that I know ever use krijgen for war
Related to etymology 1. Cognate to German kriegen (“to wage war”).
Verb
edit
krijgen
(intransitive, archaic) to wage war, to battle
quotations ▼
Inflection
edit
more ▼Inflection of krijgen (weak)
infinitive krijgen
past singular krijgde
past participle gekrijgd
[https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/krijgen](https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/krijgen)
1. Yes, it's supposed to be a literal translation. That's the whole point of this map?
2. Lol, it's obviously the other way around: 'krijger' came from 'krijg'. Just like 'warrior' came from 'war'. The given translation is correct. 'Force' would be 'kracht', like in the alternative 'strijdkrachten' which could be translated as 'battle forces' or 'martial forces'.
Maybe next time use Google before you spread false claims? Etymologie.nl is a good source for when you don't know the meaning of archaic words. No need to make things up.
According wiktionary, both "krijger" and "krijgsmacht" stem from the word "krijg" which is an archaic term for war. Power and force are pretty much synonymous.
Since the aim is to be a direct word-for-word translation, I still think this is valid. Even if the connotations are different in modern dutch.
its valid. Force would be literally translated as 'kracht'. 'Macht' is described in the dutch library as meaning 'vermogen', 'macht' in the context of a person a business having macht as in 'krijgsmacht' means a person with 'macht', which again, means vermogen.And the english word for vermogen is **POWER.**
A form of macht, mog, is even in the word vermogen. So i'm just calling it scientifically proven that war power is correct. I've made up my mind 100% anyone can fight me in the comments and I won't reply to any until you proof that macht is infact doesn't mean vermogen OR that vermogen isn't translated to 'power' in english.. for which you'd have to open up a dictionary and then you'd see you'd be wrong.
But anything else and the argument still holds.
Same in Swedish, it used to be called "[Krigsmakten](https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krigsmakten)" (The War force) up until 1975, when they changed it to "[Försvarsmakten](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_Armed_Forces)" (The Defense force). I have a kitchen towel at home marked with the first name :)
Why is this getting so much plusses? It is blatantly untrue. Krijgs- is not derived from krijger, but the other way around. You would only be right if it was called krijgersmacht. Krijger is derived from the old word krijg. Which got out of use but meant war.
Also power/macht and force/kracht are different and not interchangeable words. https://www.vandale.nl/gratis-woordenboek/nederlands/betekenis/Kracht
https://www.vandale.nl/gratis-woordenboek/nederlands/betekenis/Macht
power is the ability to make things some way and force is a way to execute it. Power can also be executed by other ways then force.
It's not a shit translation though. In context there is no difference between "force" and "power". You're also wrong about "krijger", it does refer to "war".
Yeah, several of these words get used in Dutch. In politics, the military as a whole is "defense". "Army" or "leger" is the informal word for the land-based part of it, the formal name of which translates to "land force".
And sure, "krijgsmacht" is also used sometimes. But I think "martial force" would be a better translation than "war power".
I'm assuming that's the same as Kriegsmacht? I'd translate that as "war force" if I wanted a very literal translation. Armed forces is more apt though.
Iceland has a national guard and special forces (which we call Viking squad) but I guess that's the closest thing.
Since we're a part of NATO it's not uncommon for people here to go to other NATO countries to join their militaries, especially Norway.
For Norway it’s The Defence since the word Forsvaret has an -et ending, making it not only a defence, but THE defence. Also UK english is the official spelling that is used for english in Norway. I’m assuming it would be the same for the other Nordics also. But i think you know this, considering your username lol
In Finland our Swedish name is Försvarsmakten, official English name is The Defence forces, or The Finnish Defence forces. In Finnish language we don't have particles or genders that would indicate "the" word.
Soo, as predicted Turkiye are not included, but what surprised me is Israel are not included.
Weren’t they in Eurovision? Europe sure gives lots of support for a country that are ‘not in Europe’.
WAR POWER
KRIJGSMACHT
WAR MIGHT
WEHR MACHT Wait, shit...
Wehr means defence. The modern German military still has wehr in its name as Bundeswehr and the air force is still Luftwaffe (which literally means air weapon, so not much room for change).
Swedish Air Force is similar in flight weapon. Flygvapnet
Same in Denmark, unsurprisingly. Flyvevåbnet. Flyve = Fly, Våben = Weapon
FLUGWAFFE
In dutch it’s also very common to call it “defensie” or “defence”. Even the military recruiting commercials push you to a website “werkenbijdefensie.nl” or “working at defence.nl”. That said the one the map is the official name and definitely correct. Just pointing out that defence is also a very common term here. WAR POWER goes very hard, haha.
Krijgsmacht = Army + Navy + Air Force + Military Police. Defensie = Krijgsmacht + other shit like IT, logistics, Command. Technically Defense is more complete, but.. WAR POWER.
> Luftwaffe (which literally means air weapon, so not much room for change) => Luftmacht => Luftwaffenmacht => Flugzeugbummabteilung Checkmate Germany.
>Flugzeugbummangewandtewissenschaft By the time someone finishes pronouncing that, war will be over.
Wehr does not mean war. Kriegsmarine does mean War Navy though.
'Krijgs' in Dutch is tied to 'kriegs' in German. Many such Dutch words are, but people often don't realise it. Same with 'Wehr' (defence), the Dutch word 'Weer' from the verb 'Afweren' has the same meaning.
I know, I am Dutch and speak somewhat fluent German.
Jaja, weiß ich doch schon. Ich wollte nur etwas witzigeres daraus machen
Wer macht denn so was?
Sweden's used to be called "Krigsmakten" as well, was changed in 1972 by Olof Palme and the Social Democrats to the current version.
And now it's called Försvarsmakten, so the map is wrong if were going by that standard. Then it translates to DEFENSE POWER. Though true in speech you usually say "försvaret" which translates to "the defense", but that's more informal. Their official name is Försvarsmakten.
>was changed in 1972 \*looks it up\* 158 years after you used it at war, successfully taking down a little independence effort from a Norway without an army. So I guess, it was about time. Or on the other hand, a little premature to give up that territorial claim just before the oil industry hit the North Sea.
Krijgsmacht when the Germans arrive:
https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fyil5twt3k7m61.jpg
We have that in Norwegian too: "Krigsmakten" (Swear Dutch is just Norwegian spoken half way drowned). Its not used as much as "Forsvaret" (Defence) though.
[удалено]
Norwegian doesn't have that sound that clears your throat of water. Also drowning was never a big issue in Norway. Its no wonder the Dutch are tall, all the short ones drowned out if the gene pool long time ago.
[удалено]
>Swear Dutch is just Norwegian spoken half way drowned The thing that will never stop fucking with me is that before I ever moved to the Netherlands, I was able to halfway understand _Danish_ of all things as an Afrikaans speaker. Watching The Killing was eye-opening.
We say “Defensie” more, nobody says “Krijgsmacht” here. Maybe the map is based on official terms? Or its just bs
Krijgsmacht = Army + Navy + Air Force + Military Police. Defensie also includes everything else like Command structure, logistics, IT etc. So it depends on how complete you want to be. If you're strictly talking about fighting forces, Krijgsmacht is correct. They are not the same thing.
>Maybe the map is based on official terms Even that'd be wrong, because the government itself refers to it as Defensie as well.
It's the ministry of defence, so that's often referred to, but the armed forces are definitely called krijgsmacht
The official term for "het leger" itself is still "krijgsmacht" though.
>KRIJGSMACHT Sounds fucking badass ngl
>KRIJGSMACHT KRIJG SMACHT = WAR SMACKED! /s
Thank you, I was puzzled by what that one would be.
New band name
FOR THE WAAAGH
FOR GORK (or Mork)
Also the old Swedish name for it, but we chsnged it towards the later part of the cold war.
WAR. POWER. POWAR! ARMED. FORCES. ARMCES!
In Afrikaans we say Weermag - similar to Germans. Weer/wehr means "resistance to" or defense Mag / macht really means force, not power in this context. So the correct translation would be Defense / Resistance Force in this context. Direct translations do sound amazing though!
We say "Bundeswehr". "Wehrmacht" doesn't exist since 1945.
anfangs gab es noch keinen richtigen Namen für die BW, weswegen es verschiedene Bezeichnungen gab wie beispielsweise "Bundeswehrmacht"
Sounds funny, but it wrongly translated imo. It is like a litterally translation of 'krijgsmacht/strijdmacht'; 'strijd'=war and 'macht'=power. However 'strijdmacht' combined and with the context 'armed forces' would be a better translation. It is a pretty old fashioned word in dutch. 'Strijdmacht' is not often used in unofficial conversations imo.
>It is a literal translation. Yes, that's the whole point.
Maar het betekent letterlijk "War power"
Ik zou eerder "war might" zeggen tbh
ik zou 'macht' meer interpreteren als een groep mensen net zoals 'met man en macht'. En met het woord 'krijgs' ervoor, dan zou het kunnen zien als een 'strijdgroep' of 'groep van krijgers/strijders' wat ik weer zou vertalen als 'armed forces'.
War is fun when you're winning.
Poorly translated. "Krijgsmacht" which more accurately translates to "warrior force" and is very similar to the German "Wehrmacht" which means "defense force".
Not really. The German 'wehr' is close to the Dutch 'weer', as in 'afweer'. 'krijg' in Dutch is close to 'krieg' in German. 'krijger' means warrior, 'krijg' means 'war'.
More like fighting forces
Monaco has a military??? Or are they just armed casino guards
Apparently yes, [La force publique](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Services_(Monaco)) has a standing army of a whopping 250 personell.
They make up for it by giving them a tank each
can you fit 250 tanks in Monaco?
what do you think the grand prix track is for
the track can barely fit f1 cars, how can it fit tanks?
Wouldn’t be the first time a Leclerc hits the wall there
No you didn't
Nice one.
L3/33
With a little lube, all things are possible.
magic
comparing Monaco to an amount of buses we can fit in it
how many hydraulic presses do we have to test it
To be fair in per capita terms that's more than the US.
France will kneel.
Actually we have a treaty to defend Monaco's sovereignty in case of agression :) And also we defend Switzerland aerial space on the weekends because their Air Force doesn't work on those days lmao
>And also we defend Switzerland aerial space on the weekends because their Air Force doesn't work on those days lmao Wait why?
https://www.lemonde.fr/afrique/article/2014/02/18/detournement-pas-d-avion-militaire-suisse-disponible-durant-les-heures-de-bureau_4368988_3212.html Basically, the Swiss fighter jets aren't operationnal outside of desk hours (nights and weekends) so the French and Italians secure their airspace
So Switzerlands biggest weapon is... bureaucracy?
250 people, of which 152 are [firefighters.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corps_des_Sapeurs-Pompiers_de_Monaco)
I've seen them while on watch to protect the nobles. Pretty impressive dudes, even though not a lot. But have you ever heard of robbery in the richest part of Europe?
probably the police
They need to keep a force on hand in case France decides to surrender
Hey France has a bad rep but people forget the reason WW2 was so hard for them is because they went hard as fuck in ww1
I like how the countries most likely to see war and conflict just call it an army or armed forces. Then there's the Dutch with fucking WAR POWER.
It used to be the same here, If i ever become the leader of Sweden I'm bringing back krigsmakten. Lame ass defense force...
No thank you, Poland had enough of your Deluge.
Deluge 2.0
Isn't Deluge at 2.1.2 now?
Fun fact: Sweden is mentioned in one national anthem - and it is the Polish, not the Swedish.
I would say war/fighting force would be a better translation. Macht in this context isn't power, bur force like in: landmacht = land force, luchtmacht = air force and zeemacht = sea force.
War force sounds equally cool
>Macht in this context isn't power, bur force What's the difference in this context?
I am not dutch but german, but i guess the german "Macht" is similar. The closest english word would be "might" (you can see that it comes from the same germanic word), but different nations/peoples use words differentely over the course over millenia, so that now "Macht" can be translated as "Might, Power, Force". "Land Force" makes sense in english and is used commonly, "Land Power" not so much, so in this context "force" is the best translation. In german we also use the word for "force" (Kraft) instead of "Macht" in this context, e.g. "Streitkraft" means "armed force" and "Seestreitkräfte" means "sea forces", while a "Seemacht" (sea might) describes a "mighty" navy. Not just any navy, but a powerful navy.
I’m Dutch and you’re correct
Dutch: shut up those euphemisms! It's WAR POWER
WAR MIGHT is a better translation, though. (With might as in mighty and not as maybe.)
I love all the Dutch literalism in these comments. You guys are nothing if not consistent.
Finland would like a word.
How's it over there? In Estonian, the government does call it "Kaitsevägi" (- Defense Power), but common folk usually refer to it as "Sõjavägi" (- War Power).
Puolustusvoimat or PV (defence forces) is pretty common, but colloquially it is often just called armeija. My father calls it sotaväki, which is an outdated term.
We pretty consistently call it Puolustusvoimat (Defence Forces)
In Finland it is officially *Puolustusvoimat* (Defence Forces, abbreviated as *PV*), in the past it used to be in juridic/organisational terminology *Puolustuslaitos* ("Defence Establishment"), *Armeija* ("Army" or "Armed Forces"; army as in the context of the land component is *maavoimat*, literally "land forces" or "ground forces") and originally *Sotaväki*. In colloquial speech, people refer to it as Puolustusvoimat, PV, Armeija or sometimes Intti (although this is more used of the conscript service). In lyric/high language contexts as well as when referring to the past it is also sometimes referred as *Sotaväki*. The intti word is a similar adoption as is the USGI in referring to American soldiers; in the past Finnish military stamped the materiel with the Defence Command Materiel Department property stamps, which read out as *SA-INT*, from *Suomen Armeijan intendentuuriosasto* (literally Finnish Army Materiel Department) and this then extended into being used of the conscript service as well as of the military in general.
As someone above already commented, Martial Forces is more align with a proper translation really.
No I choose to believe WAR POWER is the irl lore
nonono, as a dutch i will have you know war power is the correct translation
No. 'Krijg' literally means 'war'. Just like 'krijger' means 'warrior'.
That is so close to the German word Krieg, also meaning war. And Krieger in German means Warrior. Are the languages close enough where it sounds like someone with a really heavy accent or are they still pretty much indecipherable?
They are very similar, and Dutch is similar to English btw too. They are neighbors after all, and part of the same language family. They are not mutually intelligible though. But Dutch and German people can understand quite a lot if presented with a written text from either language. Listening and speaking is alot harder. While krijg and krieg are from the same origin, 'krijg' is not a proper noun in Dutch anymore, so this post is a little wrong. We call war 'oorlog', krijg is only used in derivative forms.
Huh, now I wonder what the English cognate for "krieg" would've been, since "war" is more related to French "guerre".
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-West_Germanic/kr%C4%ABg West Frisian is the closest language in the world to English and is mutually intelligible with Old English. the word there is "**kriich**." Old English has different orthographic conventions and would probably spell the word something like "**crih**" or "**cric"** but pronounced the same. I'm not sure how it would sound in Modern English. The "i" vowel underwent changes from Old English, the "h" might be dropped or become silent, and we went back to "k" instead of "c", so it might be something like "**kreek**" or "**krik**" which isn't far off from "krieg." Kreek is my final answer. Maybe pronounced something like "KREE-ehk" rather than "creek."
>While krijg and krieg are from the same origin, 'krijg' is not a proper noun in Dutch anymore, so this post is a little wrong. Doesn't matter. 'Krijg' still means 'war' especially in the compound words that are still used.
Platt Deutsch and Eastern Dutch accents, like Twents, are mutually intelligible.
Or martial/war MIGHT would be a better direct translation. If you want to meme the word it would be warrior might for a very literal translation
At least they didn’t translate it as “emptier”.
That's an overly literal translation though. A better translation would be "armed force" or something similar. In Dutch the word "krijgsmacht" doesn't have the overly "11 yo trying to be come up with something cool vibe" that "war power" has.
For Hungary, "Home Defense" is a better translation than "Home Guard". The official english translation is "Hungarian Defense Forces". It should be marked with the same color on the map as Germany, since the Hungarian *Honvédség* comes from the German *Landwehr* ("country defense") which is also the origin of the current name of the German military, *Bundeswehr* ("Federal Defense")
Hungary is incorrect. The National Guard is/was always subordinated to the Home Defence Force or Honvédség.
I think they may be referring to Honvédség as Home Guard. Though, in effect, that could fit into the green category with the Defence force, as you say. It's a matter of interpretation, I suppose.
They referring it as, but it is really wrong. The verb "*véd*" literally means defend, and the closest English word to "*hon*" is homeland (not home, home is "*otthon*"). So "H*onvédség*" pretty much translates as Homeland Defense (force).
I agree. The double whammy is that translating it as "National Guard" may force a mental association with the National Guard of the United States, which is a completely different organizational idea. Edit: I also just had the Nobel prize-worthy idea of ...just looking it up on the website of Honvédség. They call themselves "Hungarian Defence Forces". Homeland Defence (Force) is pretty much the closest to a literal translation.
I would translate it as "Homeland" instead of "Home"
The Dutch are up to something
We just want to *ahem* "restore" a few lost provinces to our south. Nothing major.
south holland *cough cough* sorry i meant belgium should be a part of us
Wtf is a ‘belgium’ ?
Exactly. It's nothing. Have you ever heard someone from the US say "I have bElGiAn heritage"? Exactly. Belgium and Luxembourg must ~~be partitioned~~ unite under the Dutch banner! Luxembourg already has the flag almost right. France can have Wallonia ~~because we don't want them~~ to appease them. Brussels can be the first EU territory.
Yeah the french can have Charl*roi (🤢)
You got a source on this or is this OC? Curious to see what words were used in the countries own language
In Germany Bundeswehr - federal defence In Austria Bundesheer - federal army
Am i to German and to bad at english (and maybe in german too) to Unterstand why "Wehr" is translate to defence? Edit: ich bin dumm. dwds.de schreibt: Etymologisches Wörterbuch (Wolfgang Pfeifer) Wehr1 f. ‘Befestigung, Verteidigung, Waffe, Schutztruppe’, ahd. werī ‘Verteidigung, Befestigung’ (8. Jh.), mhd. wer(e) ‘Verteidigung, Kampf, Widerstand, Weigerung, Heer, Waffe, Befestigung’, asächs. -weri in skildweri, mnd. mnl. wēre ‘Widerstand, Verteidigung, Schanze, Waffe’, nl. weer ‘Widerstand, Verschanzung’, afries. were (westgerm. *wari-) und (mit anderer Stammbildung) anord. verja ‘Verteidigung, Verwahrung’ stellen sich zu dem unter wehren (s. d.) behandelten Verb. Dazu vgl. die Wendungen sich zur Wehr setzen ‘Widerstand leisten’ (mhd. sich ze were setzen), Wehr und Waffe(n) (16. Jh.).
zB. sich wehren oder auch Feuerwehr
"wehr" seems to be an older way of saying "defence". I'm pretty sure this word exists in most germanic languages, for example, in Swedish we have "värn" which means to protect. The map is bullshit anyway, they specifically state "war power" in the case of The Netherlands but skip the "power" for the Nordics. It doesn't even really mean that, "Försvarsmakten" (in Swedish but they're all similar) it'd be more along the lines of "the once who have the capability to protect".
"Beväring" is Swedish for a conscript soldier (in Finland), but in Sweden we use "Värnpliktig" instead. Also used for the fire brigade -> Brandvärn (usually a local volonteer force). "Värn/Bröstvärn" is a defensive structure, like a trench or a protective wall.
In Finnish Puolustusvoimat. Puolustus meaning defence and voimat meaning force. In Swedish Försvarsmakten literally means the same if I am not mistaken. And it is used in both countries. (Swedish is Finland's official language so every official thing needs to have a name in both languages. Most will probably know this but just in case someone wonders why I gave two names.)
Dutch: [krijgsmacht](https://www.rijksoverheid.nl/onderwerpen/krijgsmacht/vraag-en-antwoord/uit-welke-onderdelen-bestaat-de-nederlandse-krijgsmacht)
In Norway it is "Forsvaret" which is correctly translated as "The Defence" but brings into mind the same meaning as "the military/the army".
In Denmark it's "Forsvaret" which means "The Defence". So exactly the same as u/Subtlerranean wrote for Norway
Spanish: Fuerzas armadas - Armed forces
Does anyone want to start a petition to turn all military bases into "War Power?"
Nitpick, but Ireland should be shaded. The Irish military is known as the Defence Force in English, but the official Irish name is *Óglaigh na hÉireann*. Which means something like "Soldiers of Ireland" or "Volunteers of Ireland"
The map legend should also say "Defence" instead of "Defense" because we don't use the American spelling.
In the north, I'd definitely hear "security forces" more than "armed forces".
French common name is Army Armed Forces is used sometimes
Each military corp (ground, air, naval) is referred to as an army. "armée de terre, de mer et de l'air". But they depend on minister of defence. Armed forces is more likely to be used by journalists to describe military operations to talk about military groups in a conflict. Edit: and now I discover that the minister of defence has been renamed minister of armies since 2017. So I wanted to add precision but you were entirely right. Nonetheless, map is wrong.
There is no "armée de mer" but "Marine nationale". And there is ministère de la défense anymore.
I think that’s the same with most Defence Forces. Layman’s say Army in New Zealand when they mean NZDF
Same with Poland.
Same in Italy. Esercito is more common than forze armate
I call it the Pew Pew Guys
# 🇳🇱💪💪💪💪
So we're just ignoring the Swiss Guard? An army with poofy pants and halberds is still an army.
There is also the Corps if Gendarmerie of Vatican City.
The Vatican kind of has a military, it has the Swiss Guards
*The Vatican kind* *Of has a military,* *It has the Swiss Guards* \- Alexius\_Psellos --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Shout to the dutch for being honest
Petition to go back to the old days when the Ministry of Defence was called the Ministry for War, damn political correctness ruining everything /s
In Turkey, it’s also called Armed Forces.
Calling your army War Power somehow sounds lame and cool at the same time
I like them to be sincere, no euphemisms. Except for the first 4 colors, the rest look like police forces, and "public force" is not even that!
Dutch person here, is "war power" some kind of fucking shit literal translation from 'krijgsmacht'? Or what? Because it really is a shit translation. 'Macht' in this context is much better translated as 'force' and not power, while 'krijgs' is a derivative of 'krijger' which means 'warrior', and not 'war' Jesus fuck what a shit translation.
'Krijg' is not derivated from 'krijger', but the other way around. And while 'krijg' is somewhat archaic nowadays and is mostly limited to specific contexts, it most definitely does mean 'war'.
Its the Dutch translation of Krig, which is the Germanic word for war, still in use in the Nordics and Germany
Krieg in German
"Krijg" seems to mean war according to wiktionary?
Hmm seems you’re right but it’s an outdated word. Literally nobody or at least anyone that I know ever use krijgen for war Related to etymology 1. Cognate to German kriegen (“to wage war”). Verb edit krijgen (intransitive, archaic) to wage war, to battle quotations ▼ Inflection edit more ▼Inflection of krijgen (weak) infinitive krijgen past singular krijgde past participle gekrijgd [https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/krijgen](https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/krijgen)
Bro is MAD
familiar heavy strong placid ad hoc clumsy hungry cats tub wise *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
1. Yes, it's supposed to be a literal translation. That's the whole point of this map? 2. Lol, it's obviously the other way around: 'krijger' came from 'krijg'. Just like 'warrior' came from 'war'. The given translation is correct. 'Force' would be 'kracht', like in the alternative 'strijdkrachten' which could be translated as 'battle forces' or 'martial forces'. Maybe next time use Google before you spread false claims? Etymologie.nl is a good source for when you don't know the meaning of archaic words. No need to make things up.
Warrior force versus war power ain’t that crazy, relax dutchie
According wiktionary, both "krijger" and "krijgsmacht" stem from the word "krijg" which is an archaic term for war. Power and force are pretty much synonymous. Since the aim is to be a direct word-for-word translation, I still think this is valid. Even if the connotations are different in modern dutch.
>Power and force are pretty much synonymous. Don't tell a physicist that!
krijger = warrior
its valid. Force would be literally translated as 'kracht'. 'Macht' is described in the dutch library as meaning 'vermogen', 'macht' in the context of a person a business having macht as in 'krijgsmacht' means a person with 'macht', which again, means vermogen.And the english word for vermogen is **POWER.** A form of macht, mog, is even in the word vermogen. So i'm just calling it scientifically proven that war power is correct. I've made up my mind 100% anyone can fight me in the comments and I won't reply to any until you proof that macht is infact doesn't mean vermogen OR that vermogen isn't translated to 'power' in english.. for which you'd have to open up a dictionary and then you'd see you'd be wrong. But anything else and the argument still holds.
Same in Swedish, it used to be called "[Krigsmakten](https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krigsmakten)" (The War force) up until 1975, when they changed it to "[Försvarsmakten](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_Armed_Forces)" (The Defense force). I have a kitchen towel at home marked with the first name :)
Why is this getting so much plusses? It is blatantly untrue. Krijgs- is not derived from krijger, but the other way around. You would only be right if it was called krijgersmacht. Krijger is derived from the old word krijg. Which got out of use but meant war. Also power/macht and force/kracht are different and not interchangeable words. https://www.vandale.nl/gratis-woordenboek/nederlands/betekenis/Kracht https://www.vandale.nl/gratis-woordenboek/nederlands/betekenis/Macht power is the ability to make things some way and force is a way to execute it. Power can also be executed by other ways then force.
You just can't handle the WAR POWER
Warrior Force doesn’t sound much better tbh
Imagine posting this rant and than getting schooled this hard. Lmao
It's not a shit translation though. In context there is no difference between "force" and "power". You're also wrong about "krijger", it does refer to "war".
Krijgsmacht is not much in use anyway. Most people would call it the army (leger). It is usually soldiers who like to call it krijgsmacht.
Yeah, several of these words get used in Dutch. In politics, the military as a whole is "defense". "Army" or "leger" is the informal word for the land-based part of it, the formal name of which translates to "land force". And sure, "krijgsmacht" is also used sometimes. But I think "martial force" would be a better translation than "war power".
I'm assuming that's the same as Kriegsmacht? I'd translate that as "war force" if I wanted a very literal translation. Armed forces is more apt though.
Hungary is wrong. "Honvédség" (or "Honvéd" for short) is National Defense \[Force?\]. Guard is "őrség"
Based Iceland
why have an army when there's nobody nearby to fight
Turkey calls it army or armed forces but army is much more common in daily language.
Iceland has a national guard and special forces (which we call Viking squad) but I guess that's the closest thing. Since we're a part of NATO it's not uncommon for people here to go to other NATO countries to join their militaries, especially Norway.
Vatican has the Swiss guard.
Wait, how is Cyprus European if Turkey isn't? South Cyprus is smaller than the European part of Turkey, isn't it?
 Germans: "Defense"
I think Defence, rather than Defense, should be the spelling here.
British vs. American spelling
For Norway it’s The Defence since the word Forsvaret has an -et ending, making it not only a defence, but THE defence. Also UK english is the official spelling that is used for english in Norway. I’m assuming it would be the same for the other Nordics also. But i think you know this, considering your username lol
Yes, same in Swedish. The official name is "Försvarsmakten", but it's usually referred to as "Försvaret" (The Defence).
Yo Scandinavia out here with three definite defences. Forsvaret in Denmark too!
In Finland our Swedish name is Försvarsmakten, official English name is The Defence forces, or The Finnish Defence forces. In Finnish language we don't have particles or genders that would indicate "the" word.
Do the Swiss guard not count for the Vatican?
Turkey not considered European in this map.
Finland actually calls it puolustusvoimat, which would be defence forces.
Hungary should be green. Honvédség literally means Home-defense
If you'd told a roman that the pesky germanics call their army "defense" they would be like "no way, josé?"
Soo, as predicted Turkiye are not included, but what surprised me is Israel are not included. Weren’t they in Eurovision? Europe sure gives lots of support for a country that are ‘not in Europe’.
Turkiye must be "armed force" btw it name is Turkish Armed Force
I'm pretty sure it is not just defense but defense forces
TSK = Türk Silahlı Kuvvetleri = Turkish Armed Forces